{"id":318706,"date":"2026-10-27T05:00:00","date_gmt":"2026-10-27T09:00:00","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/%series%\/how-to-trust-god-after-loss-levi-jennie-lusko\/"},"modified":"2026-10-27T06:41:17","modified_gmt":"2026-10-27T10:41:17","slug":"how-to-trust-god-after-loss-levi-jennie-lusko","status":"publish","type":"podcast","link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/how-to-trust-god-after-loss-levi-jennie-lusko\/","title":{"rendered":"How to Trust God After Loss: Levi &#038; Jennie Lusko"},"content":{"rendered":"<p>One day, their five-year-old was part of Christmas plans. The next day &#8230; she was gone. How do you trust God after unspeakable loss\u2014when you&#8217;re grieving the only thing you begged Him not to take? Pastor and author Levi Lusko and his wife, Jennie, join Dave and Ann Wilson on FamilyLife Today to tell the story of losing their daughter Lenya\u2014and wrestling with God when faith and heartbreak occupy the same room.<\/p>\n<ul>\n<li fetchpriority=\"high\">\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>How do you trust God after loss? Pastor and author Levi Lusko and his wife, Jennie, share about losing their 5-year-old daughter\u2014and wrestling with God in the aftermath. <\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":47000,"featured_media":295627,"menu_order":0,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"closed","template":"","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","_seopress_robots_follow":"","_seopress_robots_imageindex":"","_seopress_robots_snippet":"","_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_robots_breadcrumbs":"","_seopress_robots_freeze_modified_date":"","_seopress_robots_custom_modified_date":"","_seopress_robots_canonical":"","_seopress_social_fb_title":"","_seopress_social_fb_desc":"","_seopress_social_fb_img":"","_seopress_social_fb_img_attachment_id":0,"_seopress_social_fb_img_width":0,"_seopress_social_fb_img_height":0,"_seopress_social_twitter_title":"","_seopress_social_twitter_desc":"","_seopress_social_twitter_img":"","_seopress_social_twitter_img_attachment_id":0,"_seopress_social_twitter_img_width":0,"_seopress_social_twitter_img_height":0,"_seopress_redirections_value":"","_seopress_redirections_enabled":"","_seopress_redirections_enabled_regex":"","_seopress_redirections_logged_status":"","_seopress_redirections_param":"","_seopress_redirections_type":0,"_seopress_analysis_target_kw":"","_seopress_news_disabled":"","_seopress_video_disabled":"","_seopress_video":[],"_seopress_pro_schemas_manual":[],"_seopress_pro_rich_snippets_disable_all":"","_seopress_pro_rich_snippets_disable":[],"_seopress_pro_schemas":[],"inline_featured_image":false,"_uag_custom_page_level_css":"","episode_type":"","audio_file":"https:\/\/traffic.omny.fm\/d\/clips\/cbd16f10-ac60-4f09-b4df-b15400ce35aa\/33aaac7e-3581-4e21-a3df-b154011ba58c\/030fb223-2d85-4d42-95d4-b4ea015b9ff0\/audio.mp3","podmotor_file_id":"","podmotor_episode_id":"","cover_image":"","cover_image_id":"","duration":"00:24:55","filesize":"22.85M","filesize_raw":"","date_recorded":"","explicit":"","block":""},"categories":[2096],"tags":[],"podcast_series":[11574],"cwp_profile":[9712],"series":[2101],"class_list":["post-318706","podcast","type-podcast","status-publish","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-faith","podcast_series-when-god-doesnt-stop-the-worst-levi-and-jennie-lusko","cwp_profile-levi-and-jennie-lusko","series-familylife-today"],"acf":[],"episode_featured_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/09\/FLT-Cover_1024x1024.jpg?w=1024","episode_player_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2023\/02\/image-scaled.jpg","download_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-download\/318706\/how-to-trust-god-after-loss-levi-jennie-lusko","player_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-player\/318706\/how-to-trust-god-after-loss-levi-jennie-lusko","audio_player":null,"episode_data":{"playerMode":"light","subscribeUrls":{"apple_podcasts":{"key":"apple_podcasts","url":"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303?mt=2&app=podcast","label":"Apple Podcasts","class":"apple_podcasts","icon":"apple-podcasts.png"},"google_podcasts":{"key":"google_podcasts","url":"","label":"Google Podcasts","class":"google_podcasts","icon":"google-podcasts.png"},"spotify":{"key":"spotify","url":"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm","label":"Spotify","class":"spotify","icon":"spotify.png"},"youtube":{"key":"youtube","url":"","label":"YouTube","class":"youtube","icon":"youtube.png"}},"rssFeedUrl":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/feed\/podcast\/familylife-today","embedCode":"<blockquote class=\"wp-embedded-content\" data-secret=\"t8KOqAvrl5\"><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/how-to-trust-god-after-loss-levi-jennie-lusko\/\">How to Trust God After Loss: Levi &#038; Jennie Lusko<\/a><\/blockquote><iframe sandbox=\"allow-scripts\" security=\"restricted\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/how-to-trust-god-after-loss-levi-jennie-lusko\/embed\/#?secret=t8KOqAvrl5\" width=\"500\" height=\"350\" title=\"&#8220;How to Trust God After Loss: Levi &#038; Jennie Lusko&#8221; &#8212; FamilyLife\u00ae - A Cru Ministry\" data-secret=\"t8KOqAvrl5\" frameborder=\"0\" marginwidth=\"0\" marginheight=\"0\" scrolling=\"no\" class=\"wp-embedded-content\"><\/iframe><script>\n\/*! 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Learn more at <a href=\"https:\/\/CSBible.com\">CSBible.com<\/a>.<\/li>\n<li>Follow us on all social platforms: <a href=\"https:\/\/www.facebook.com\/familylifeministry\">Facebook<\/a> | <a href=\"https:\/\/www.instagram.com\/familylife.today\/\">Instagram<\/a> | <a href=\"https:\/\/www.youtube.com\/playlist?list=PLSzse1nmlqbLhDx5FpGVDgLmxy1rmQBau\">YouTube<\/a><\/li>\n<li>Find resources from our podcast at <a href=\"https:\/\/shop.familylife.com\/product-category\/radio-resources\/\">shop.familylife.com<\/a>.<\/li>\n<li>Download <a href=\"https:\/\/www.familylife.com\/app\/\">FamilyLife's app<\/a>!<\/li>\n<li>Help others find FamilyLife. Leave a review on <a href=\"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303\">Apple Podcast<\/a> or <a href=\"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm?si=d6dfa8d2415f4750\">Spotify<\/a>.<\/li>\n<li>Check out all the FamilyLife's podcasts on the <a href=\"https:\/\/www.familylife.com\/familylife-podcast-network\/\">FamilyLife Podcast Network.<\/a><\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<\/li>\n<\/ul>\n\n"],"transcript_content":["\nFamilyLife Today\u00ae with Dave and Ann Wilson - Web Version Transcript\r\n\r\nThis content has been generated by an artificial intelligence language model. While we strive for accuracy and quality, please note that the information provided will most likely not be entirely error-free or up-to-date. We recommend independently verifying the content with the originally-released audio. This transcript is provided for your personal use and general information purposes only. References to conferences, resources, or other special promotions may be obsolete. We do not assume any responsibility or liability for the use or interpretation of this content.\r\n\r\nHow to Trust God After Loss: Levi &amp;amp; Jennie Lusko\r\n\r\nGuests:Levi and Jennie Lusko\r\n\r\nFrom the series:When God Doesn\u2019t Stop the Worst: Levi &amp;amp; Jennie Lusko \r\n\r\n(Day 2 of 3)\r\n\r\nAir date:October 27, 2026\r\n\r\nDave (00:04):\r\n\r\nAll right, I want to find out if you ever listened to my sermons. \r\n\r\nAnn (00:08):\r\n\r\nOf course I did.\r\n\r\nDave (00:09):\r\n\r\nThere's one I used\u2014\r\n\r\nAnn (00:09):\r\n\r\nI have them all memorized.\r\n\r\nDave (00:10):\r\n\r\nOkay. Let's see if you can finish this line. Trials can make you\u2014\r\n\r\nAnn (00:14):\r\n\r\nBetter or bitter.\r\n\r\nDave (00:15):\r\n\r\nOh, there you go. There's another part to it.\r\n\r\nAnn (00:17):\r\n\r\nOh.\r\n\r\nDave (00:18):\r\n\r\nTrials can make you better, bitter. See, look at that. You got half of it.\r\n\r\nAnn (00:22):\r\n\r\nOkay.\r\n\r\nDave (00:24):\r\n\r\nThe choice is yours. \r\n\r\nAnn (00:24):\r\n\r\nThe choice is yours. That's it.\r\n\r\nDave (00:32):\r\n\r\nWelcome to FamilyLife Today, where we want to help you pursue the relationships that matter most. I'm Dave Wilson.\r\n\r\nAnn (00:38):\r\n\r\nAnd I'm Ann Wilson, and you can find us at FamilyLifeToday.com. This is FamilyLife Today.\r\n\r\nDave (00:52):\r\n\r\nSo yeah, when pain or adversity enters your life, you have a choice.\r\n\r\nAnn (00:55):\r\n\r\nAnd all of us will have pain and adversity.\r\n\r\nDave (00:58):\r\n\r\nYeah. And being the Detroit Lions chaplain for 33 seasons, I knew a lot about pain and loss. Anyway, we've got a couple with us today, Levi and Jennie Lusko, who've written a book. I mean, your pastors\u2014 \r\n\r\nAnn:\r\n\r\nSeveral books. \r\n\r\nDave:\r\n\r\nYeah, several books, but pastors of Fresh Life Church in Montana and Utah and Wyoming. And who knows? There's probably other states. I probably only got half of them because God has really blessed this thing. But you wrote a book about a painful, excruciating moment in your life as you were starting Fresh Life Church. I guess you were about four or five years old in the church. \r\n\r\nAnn (01:32):\r\n\r\nAnd it's called Through the Eyes of a Lion. Welcome back to FamilyLife Today, you guys.\r\n\r\nLevi (01:36):\r\n\r\nAw, thank you so much for having us.\r\n\r\nJennie (01:38):\r\n\r\nThank you so much.\r\n\r\nLevi (01:39):\r\n\r\nAnd my family grew up in Detroit, actually. Both my mom and my dad are from Lansing. \r\n\r\nDave:\r\n\r\nReally? \r\n\r\nLevi:\r\n\r\nYeah. So he moved to Colorado later on in life, which is where I was born. And he told me my whole life, \"I'm raising you as a Broncos fan because I don't want you to have the pain and agony that I did cheering for the Detroit Lions.\" So I relate to that. \r\n\r\nAnn (01:59):\r\n\r\nA smart man.\r\n\r\nDave (02:00):\r\n\r\nWell, take us back to 2012. You're leading Fresh Life Church and it's December.\r\n\r\nLevi (02:07):\r\n\r\nYeah. What we like to say is it was the best and the worst of times at the same time, because that year was a year of growth for our church. We were multiplying and people were getting saved. \r\n\r\nJennie (02:21):\r\n\r\nAnd even in our own lives too. I remember specifically just in my own life, my own soul, I felt like God was just growing me and growing us and our marriage. It was just a year of growth.\r\n\r\nAnn (02:33):\r\n\r\nHow old were your kids then?\r\n\r\nJennie (02:34):\r\n\r\nAlivia was\u2014\r\n\r\nLevi (02:36):\r\n\r\nSeven.\r\n\r\nJennie (02:36):\r\n\r\n\u2014seven.\r\n\r\nLevi (02:37):\r\n\r\nLenya was five.\r\n\r\nJennie (02:39):\r\n\r\nAnd then Daisy was two and a half. And Clover\u2014\r\n\r\nLevi (02:39):\r\n\r\nAnd Clover was one.\r\n\r\nJennie (02:42):\r\n\r\n\u2014was one, almost one. They were bunched in right there at the bottom and yeah, beautiful. I mean, lots of fun. We have always had a real fun family life. I've always loved being a daddy to little girls and daddy-daughter date nights and fun family days and all that. He would take\r\n\r\nJennie (03:00):\r\n\r\nThe girls as they got older, he would take them on trips, preaching trips and\r\n\r\nLevi (03:04):\r\n\r\nJust a lot of intentionality. I had taken my second born daughter, Lynya, our daughter, on her first daddy-daughter trip. And we went to Disneyland and then we started our tradition that we've still continued every year except for 2020. And that is we would always take our family vacation on Easter Sunday. So we'd finish preaching our last service and then get on a plane and go somewhere and turn off my phone and not email and not work the whole trip. And so all that. So it was the best. We were establishing these great rhythms. And then on Christmas 2012, Linya, who is our second born, had had an asthma attack. It was five days\r\n\r\nJennie (03:40):\r\n\r\nBefore\r\n\r\nLevi (03:40):\r\n\r\nChristmas. Five days before Christmas and she just stopped breathing and it was inexplicable out of the normal. She'd had a lot of asthma attacks, but normally takes the medicine, breathes better and it's fine.\r\n\r\nJennie (03:53):\r\n\r\nLevi has asthma and our oldest has asthma too. So we're\r\n\r\nLevi (03:56):\r\n\r\nUsed to asthma. So it's kind of a normal\r\n\r\nJennie (03:57):\r\n\r\nPart of our life.\r\n\r\nLevi (03:58):\r\n\r\nAnd she just stops breathing and starts turning blue. I did CPR. Jennie called 911. We were praying obviously. And in just a matter of moments, she went from being here to not being here.\r\n\r\nAnn (04:14):\r\n\r\nPause right there for a second. This is the most traumatic thing and the greatest fear every parent has and you're living it. And as she's turning blue, Jennie, are you so fearful? Do you think that she could die? Are you thinking that or are you thinking, oh, it'll be okay?\r\n\r\nJennie (04:35):\r\n\r\nWell, I thought she would be okay. So we had just finished a date night. Our date nights were on Thursdays. That was kind of our rhythm. And then family days were on Fridays. And so we just finished our date night. We came to my mom's house, pulled up, and literally in that moment, we were just saying how we're so excited for family day. The week before Christmas for church is just crazy. For anyone, it's crazy, but we just had our schedules packed that week. So all week we were like, okay you guys, it's crazy now, but we're going to have Friday family day and we're going to go ice skating. We're going to have a fancy family dinner. And Levi was going to take Lenia to go Christmas shopping for her sisters. And so we went into date night just like, okay, we just need this.\r\n\r\n(05:17):\r\n\r\nWe need time together and then we're going to be with our kids. And so we rolled up to my mom's house. Literally Levi was like, I just feel so relaxed right now. And that's how\r\n\r\nLevi (05:26):\r\n\r\nWe felt. Well, I finished my sermon that day.\r\n\r\nJennie (05:29):\r\n\r\nSo we were ready for Fresh Life Christmas. We were ready for Christmas as a family and our plan, one of the girls' Christmas presents was taking them to Disneyland. So we were getting ready for that right after\r\n\r\nLevi (05:40):\r\n\r\nChristmas - The day after Christmas, which is the day we ended up having her funeral.\r\n\r\nJennie (05:44):\r\n\r\nYeah. So I walk in and my mom's trying to give Lenia her treatment, but she wasn't taking it. She's sitting on the counter and she looks at me and then I'm trying to give it to her because she's obviously not taking it or she's not doing very well. And then she just passes out on the kitchen counter. And Levi had parked the car and he ran in. He immediately started doing CPR and she had allergies. So did she eat anything? Is this an allergic reaction? And so he just starts with CPR. We call the paramedics and that whole time in that moment, I'm just praying and I'm crying out to God and I'm saying, Lenya, it's okay. Lenya, it's okay. It's going to be okay. Meanwhile, Olivia is seven at the time and then the little ones, they're all in the other room. But the paramedics come in and Levi goes with her.\r\n\r\n(06:35):\r\n\r\nThey take her away. And then I'm with the other girls in the other room and I'm just holding them. And I literally, I'm not thinking that she has died. I'm not thinking that I just said goodbye to her. I'm not thinking those things. I'm literally thinking it's going to be okay. It's going to be okay. It has to be okay. And then my brother drives me to the hospital where Levi and I are sitting in that little waiting room and the doctor comes in. I mean, literally it's just so shocking because we were just planning for Christmas. He just worked so hard on his Christmas message. We were just preparing for family day. The joy of that was like, oh, we're going to just get a moment to breathe. And then all of a sudden we're hearing what no parent wants to hear, but no one wants to hear or is in their nightmares.\r\n\r\n(07:30):\r\n\r\nAnd he says, I'm so sorry, Mr. and Mrs. Lusko. There's nothing more that we can do. And then literally is like, do you want us to keep working on her while you walk in? And we're like, what? We're just in shock. And so they bring us in and it's just the hardest thing\r\n\r\n(07:51):\r\n\r\nEver. And so we walk in and she's laying there and I mean our automatic response, obviously we were just in shock and crying and our automatic response though was Levi was on the other side of her and I'm just looking at her and we each hold one of her hands and it was almost immediate. And I don't even think we knew what we were doing, but we just raised our other hands and we were just saying, God, you gave us Lenya and we give her back to you. And there was just that moment of worshiping in the weeping and acknowledging God in the heartache and the heartbreak and the shock and the terror and the horrors. And I mean, even just looking back, it's like, I don't even know. I don't even know how we did it. I don't know. But God was there with us in our deepest pain.\r\n\r\nDave (08:50):\r\n\r\nYeah. I mean that image of you with your arms up is not what you would expect a parent to be able to do in that darkness. Like you just said, how in the world was that your response?\r\n\r\nLevi (09:07):\r\n\r\nA lot of what came to my mind in that moment was Linda's baby dedication. We had dedicated her to God as parents early on. And in our church we bring parents up and they stand on the stage and they hold the baby and with the pastor there they say, we're going to recognize God in this child's life as long as they're here and that babies are on loan. They're gifts from God. We're here to be stewards, not owners. And I think that's what's so freeing about tithing. You're saying we're stewards of this money, not owners. We want to honor God in how we use his money. So you have a light touch on money because the tithe helps to pry your fingers open. Well, the baby dedication's similar because you're essentially saying, this isn't my child, this is God's child and I want to raise this child to know Jesus.\r\n\r\n(09:56):\r\n\r\nAnd I remember seeing her in the hospital, that was one of the first images that popped into my head. And I remember when we were praying, we said, God, we dedicated her to you when you gave her to us and now we give her back to you as you've taken her home. I don't want to make it sound like we were in a movie. We weren't super human in our faith. We were broken and we were devastated and we were suffering and we were in agony. But I can also say that God gave us peace to past understanding and we in the midst of that agony felt a true sense of it's going to be okay and I'm here with you through this.\r\n\r\nDave (10:38):\r\n\r\nSo how do you walk out to your car?\r\n\r\nAnn (10:41):\r\n\r\nThe worst.\r\n\r\nLevi (10:42):\r\n\r\nYeah, it was hard. We looked at the empty car seat. We looked at. The timing of it was also capricious. I mean, there's no good day to lose a child, but to have gifts under the Christmas tree with her name on them, her stocking was on the fireplace. There's a million things about it that were just so cruel. To have a child die is like having memories taken from you that you've already thought about and enjoyed so you almost feel like they're already yours, but then having them snatch from you because you fantasize about your child's high school graduation, walking them down the aisle. There's so many benchmarks. To this day in our pantry, all of our kids have little tick marks with the date by them and Lenia's stop. It's right there. Everyone's getting older but her. And so all of that's in your mind when you look in the rear view mirror and you see an empty car seat.\r\n\r\n(11:37):\r\n\r\nAnd so we looked at that and we just thought this is not happening. But at the same time, again, it's like a split screen because then Jennie reminded me that we should go back and invite the people in the hospital to church.\r\n\r\nAnn (11:50):\r\n\r\nYeah. Jennie, how does that happen? This is\r\n\r\nDave (11:53):\r\n\r\nRight\r\n\r\nLevi (11:53):\r\n\r\nOutside the hospital?\r\n\r\nAnn (11:54):\r\n\r\nYeah, this is you walk outside, you had just left the hospital and Jennie said, \"Levi, you have to go back in.\" Well, I had already\r\n\r\nLevi (12:00):\r\n\r\nShifted to reverse.\r\n\r\nAnn (12:01):\r\n\r\nReally?\r\n\r\nLevi (12:01):\r\n\r\nShe goes, \"Hold on, you need to go back and invite those people to church.\" And it was just natural. It's just part of our rhythms. You don't build a church by telling people to invite their friends. You build a church by inviting everybody that you meet to come to church. It's not weird or icky evangelism. It's just like natural overflow of we've seen Jesus and we want to tell people about Jesus. And so we always had little cards or invites we could use to invite people. Now it's a website or Instagram, right? But we would say, \"Hey, come to church on Sunday.\" And\r\n\r\nJennie (12:33):\r\n\r\nEven both Livy and Lenia had little purses that they would always put little treasures in. And after she went to heaven, we found Lenia's purse and she had her little mini Bible and she had invitations to Fresh Life Christmas and bracelets. That was who we were as a family. Even Lenia, we would be at the grocery store and she would be like, \"Mom, you didn't invite her to church.\" She was always inviting people and that was kind of who she was, but it was who we were as a family too. And so I don't know exactly what came over me. All I know, I mean, we had spent, I don't even know how long we were in the room with Lenia, but I know that it was the hardest thing to leave because we're walking out and we should have been carrying her with us.\r\n\r\n(13:23):\r\n\r\nWe should have been. She was supposed to come with us. And so leaving the room and leaving the hospital and our daughters were, I mean, they were all asleep. They were in the car, but just looking back and seeing Lenia's is empty, I don't know. I had invitations in the car because even going through the drive through whatever, we would just always, so I was like, those people just were there for us on our worst day. We just need to invite them to come to church. And so Lie, I went in and\r\n\r\nLevi (13:56):\r\n\r\nInvited them. Well, I was crying and I was a hot mess, but I said thank you for everything. And I said, we're having Christmas services and we'd love to invite you to come. And I said, I spent all day working on my message and this all happened, but if you'll come, I'm still going to be there. If you guys would come in my daughter's honor, we would love to have you. And several of them did end up coming, which is beautiful. And even we heard afterwards some of them made faith decisions, which is just fantastic. It's just how God does. God takes the hard things we go through and he uses them for good, right? If you don't get bitter, if you get better. And none of us get to choose what we face, but we all get to choose how we're going to respond to it.\r\n\r\nAnn (14:40):\r\n\r\nYeah.\r\n\r\n(14:41):\r\n\r\nWell, as I listen to you guys, what I think is, oh, those things happened because it was a natural overflow of how God had already filled you. You were filled with him. You're filled with his spirit. And so even though you're in the most devastating experience that you could ever walk through, you're still filled with him. And so Jesus always has his eyes on his people and he's always loving them. And even your response of worship in the midst of suffering and pain is just, you know who your father is and you trust him. That says a lot about your walk with God and your perspective of how much he loves you and he loves your girls. That was almost a supernatural experience. And it reminds me of hearing Tony Evans years ago when I was in my 20s, I think, and he talked about building our foundation.\r\n\r\n(15:32):\r\n\r\nAnd you say something like this in your book, but he says, you don't see people pouring the foundation in the middle of the storm. They're building the foundation when the skies are clear because when the storm comes later, the foundation will last.\r\n\r\nLevi (15:48):\r\n\r\nWell, you got to train for the trial you're not yet in. Yes. That's the thing. I love how\r\n\r\nAnn (15:52):\r\n\r\nYou said that.\r\n\r\nLevi (15:53):\r\n\r\nBut I don't think you ever know when you're in that season when you're potentially doing what's foolish or wise. But Jesus said when the storms come, you find out if it's sand or rock. And so we're all right now determining how we're going to respond to our darkest day.\r\n\r\nDave (16:09):\r\n\r\nRight. So I'm a dad, I'm a pastor. I'm not sure I could preach after that Christmas. I think it'd be very easy to say, \"Hey, I'm going to take this year off.\"\r\n\r\nAnn (16:21):\r\n\r\nAnd people would understand.\r\n\r\nDave (16:22):\r\n\r\nSo talk about that. How were you able to preach and did you write a new message or was it the message you already wrote?\r\n\r\nLevi (16:30):\r\n\r\nWell, you'll recall I spent that day writing that sermon. And I always say this, I want to be really careful because I don't think there's any value in playing her or faking fine. As my friend Esther Allen likes to say, she wrote that book, No More Faking Fine. So there's definitely nothing noble about I pulled my hamstring, but I'm going to keep playing. You can do severe injury if you do that. So that's a disclaimer. And I did take time off. I took a month off preaching after that weekend, but I felt like A, it was adrenaline and instinct. I didn't know any other way through it than that. I had wrote the sermon. It was my way to honor her. I promised those people in the hospital. So there was really never any question that I was going to. I tweaked the ending of the message and worked, of course, the conquering of death into the story, which is the point of Christmas.\r\n\r\n(17:21):\r\n\r\nAnd getting up and doing that, I think was my gift. I mean, most kids have the obligation of stewarding their parents' legacy. God gave us the backwards responsibility of honoring and stewarding our daughter's legacy. And so we just have kind of from the beginning intended to not miss a moment in that journey.\r\n\r\nAnn (17:44):\r\n\r\nI just want to remind our listeners that our vision for families at FamilyLife.com is to follow Jesus, to impact children, parenting, marriages, not just here, but around the world. We can't do that without you.\r\n\r\nDave (18:00):\r\n\r\nYeah. And it's why we do what we do, but you probably don't know this. We have hundreds, even thousands of financial partners, people that pray for us, but also say, \"I don't want to just pray. I want to be a part of this ministry and I'm going to give part of my income every single month to FamilyLife to help this ministry impact the world.\" So you can be a partner with us. In a sense, you're impacting others just through our voice and through this program.\r\n\r\nAnn (18:25):\r\n\r\nAnd we need you.\r\n\r\nDave (18:26):\r\n\r\nYeah. And if you're sitting there thinking, \"Man, I didn't even know they had monthly supporters like that.\" Yes, we do. And they literally are partners. We are partnering together to change the world for Jesus Christ. So here's how you can do that. Just go to FamilyLifeToday.com, click on the donate button and become a partner. Well, I know the title. I don't know the contents of your message, but I think it was Turn Off the Dark.\r\n\r\nLevi (18:51):\r\n\r\nThat's right.\r\n\r\nDave (18:51):\r\n\r\nWhat did that mean?\r\n\r\nLevi (18:53):\r\n\r\nJesus in John chapter one is the light of the world. And I'd always though about you turn on a light. So if you turn on light, you're turning off dark. And the action of turning off the dark, which was inspired by the Spider-Man Broadway play, was this epiphany that when Jesus came Christmas, it was God's attempt to turn off darkness. And so that was what I had spent the whole day kind of writing. And you know how it is when you get a good idea and it kind of works, it's that eureka moment of Archimedes in the bathtub where you're almost ready to run through the streets naked, you're just so excited about your sermon you wrote. And it doesn't always happen, but when it does come in that bolt of inspiration, it's wonderful. And that was how that sermon was given to me. And so it was all kind of full circle.\r\n\r\n(19:37):\r\n\r\nThere wasn't 3,000 people in the church at that point, but I think 6,000 people came to that Christmas Eve service and it was amazing to get to honor Jesus and my daughter in that moment.\r\n\r\nDave (19:47):\r\n\r\nFinally, I'd love to know your perspective on, we said at the beginning, trials can make you better or bitter. And in some ways that sounds so trite in this situation because yeah, when you have a flat tire or the meeting gets canceled, yeah, they can bet. But when you're going through the devastation that you have, talk about that. There's families listening that have lost a loved one, maybe a son or a daughter or a spouse. How is it that God can meet you in that moment? How does he do that? Because you've experienced it.\r\n\r\nLevi (20:24):\r\n\r\nWell, we always want to be really careful to not just come in with our experience and people hearing this, it could feel so insensitive to say, \"You know what? You're going to be fine. God's making you better.\" And like you said, give some sort of Pat answer. Our experience though is that everything Jesus said in Matthew chapter five has been proved in the fire. Blessed are the brokenhearted, blessed are those who mourn, blessed are those who hunger. They will be filled. They will be comforted. Theirs is the kingdom of heaven. There is a reward in suffering and that reward is God does come near. He's near to the brokenhearted. And in a unique way, I really believe if you don't harden your heart, if you open up your heart to God being there, there is a unique treasure that's available to you in the midst of suffering that is honestly an honor.\r\n\r\n(21:15):\r\n\r\nAnd I don't know how to say this any other way than this, so I'll just say it. If I could have what God has given to us in this suffering without going through, I would still want it. I would want every good thing that he's given to us in this because it is so good and there is such a nearness of his spirit and a depth that you can't get outside of being put into a crucible. That's why Paul said to the Philippians, \"To you, it's been entrusted with the grace of not only believing in Jesus, but to suffer for his name.\" And that could sound so cruel. Man, you guys have been given the great gift of suffering, but they would say, \"You're right, Paul. It is a gift to suffer for Jesus.\"\r\n\r\nJennie (21:51):\r\n\r\nYeah. And it's hard though because we wish that she was still with us. And I think that we don't want to say like, \"Oh, people gave their lives to Christ, and since Lenny went to heaven, all these people know God's love.\" Yes, that is true and that's amazing. It's not that. But we miss her and it's hurt so much. And it has been, I mean, especially in those early days and then kind of randomly and sporadically after, but where it's just that weight heavy on your chest where it's hard to breathe and you almost have to just trust God for the next breath. And yes, we believe that God has entrusted us with this pain, but reciprocating it, it's us trusting him in the little moments and trusting him when it hurts so much and trusting him that he's at work. He himself said, \"My ways are not your ways.\r\n\r\n(22:44):\r\n\r\nMy thoughts are not your thoughts. My ways are higher than yours.\" And so trusting him that he is good and that he loves us. And then even just at his word when the Bible says that to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord. So our worst day was actually Lenya's glorious day. And so the tension even with that of the suffering and the pain that we have experienced, but not for her. And that tension of knowing of that hope that we have in Christ, that one day Lenya will not come back to us and we won't get to experience her as a 13-year-old and as a senior in high school. And our daughters are growing up with the void of their sister. However, we have our hope in Christ and we have the hope that because we've placed our faith in Christ and because to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord.\r\n\r\n(23:39):\r\n\r\nAnd there's going to be a day where all of this, we won't even remember it because of the joy that we'll have when we're with Jesus together face to face. So there's just always that tension of the heartache and the pain and the anger, but also the joy and the privilege and the honor to get to serve God in this way and to love God in this way and to steward this.\r\n\r\nAnn (24:09):\r\n\r\nOkay. What did you think of today?\r\n\r\nDave (24:11):\r\n\r\nIt was powerful. Really powerful. I mean, what a heartbreaking struggle. And I know a lot of our listeners and watchers have gone through things like this.\r\n\r\nAnn (24:19):\r\n\r\nOr\r\n\r\nDave (24:20):\r\n\r\nThey\r\n\r\nAnn (24:20):\r\n\r\nKnow someone that is.\r\n\r\nDave (24:21):\r\n\r\nYeah. I went through that with my little brother dying and watching my mom and dad try to navigate that.\r\n\r\nAnn (24:26):\r\n\r\nAnd again, the book is called Through the Eyes of a Lion: Facing Impossible Pain: Finding Incredible Power, and it's by Levi Lusko.\r\n\r\nDave (24:33):\r\n\r\nAnd you can get your copy by clicking the link in the show notes at FamilyLifeToday.com and they'll be back with us for one more day.\r\n\r\nAnn (24:45):\r\n\r\nFamilyLife Today is a donor supported production of FamilyLife, a crew ministry celebrating 50 years of helping you pursue the relationships that matter most.\r\n\r\nFamilyLife Today is a donor-supported production of FamilyLife\u00ae, a Cru\u00ae Ministry. \r\n\r\nHelping you pursue the relationships that matter most.\r\n\r\nIf you\u2019ve benefited from the FamilyLife Today transcripts, would you consider donating today to help defray the costs of producing them and making them available online?\r\n\r\nCopyright \u00a9 2026 FamilyLife. 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Coyle","author_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/author\/margaret-coyle-a9eb952f\/"},"uagb_comment_info":0,"uagb_excerpt":"How do you trust God after loss? Pastor and author Levi Lusko and his wife, Jennie, share about losing their 5-year-old daughter\u2014and wrestling with God in the aftermath.","meta_box":{"show_notes":"\n<ul>\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/levilusko.com\/books\">Through the Eyes of a Lion<\/a>.<\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<hr>\n<ul>\n<li>Thanks to the Christian Standard Bible for sponsoring this episode. Learn more at <a href=\"https:\/\/CSBible.com\">CSBible.com<\/a>.<\/li>\n<li>Follow us on all social platforms: <a href=\"https:\/\/www.facebook.com\/familylifeministry\">Facebook<\/a> | <a href=\"https:\/\/www.instagram.com\/familylife.today\/\">Instagram<\/a> | <a href=\"https:\/\/www.youtube.com\/playlist?list=PLSzse1nmlqbLhDx5FpGVDgLmxy1rmQBau\">YouTube<\/a><\/li>\n<li>Find resources from our podcast at <a href=\"https:\/\/shop.familylife.com\/product-category\/radio-resources\/\">shop.familylife.com<\/a>.<\/li>\n<li>Download <a href=\"https:\/\/www.familylife.com\/app\/\">FamilyLife's app<\/a>!<\/li>\n<li>Help others find FamilyLife. Leave a review on <a href=\"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303\">Apple Podcast<\/a> or <a href=\"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm?si=d6dfa8d2415f4750\">Spotify<\/a>.<\/li>\n<li>Check out all the FamilyLife's podcasts on the <a href=\"https:\/\/www.familylife.com\/familylife-podcast-network\/\">FamilyLife Podcast Network.<\/a><\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<\/li>\n<\/ul>\n\n","transcript_url":"https:\/\/transcript.familylife.com\/fl2026-10-27.pdf","transcript_content":"\nFamilyLife Today\u00ae with Dave and Ann Wilson - Web Version Transcript\r\n\r\nThis content has been generated by an artificial intelligence language model. While we strive for accuracy and quality, please note that the information provided will most likely not be entirely error-free or up-to-date. We recommend independently verifying the content with the originally-released audio. This transcript is provided for your personal use and general information purposes only. References to conferences, resources, or other special promotions may be obsolete. We do not assume any responsibility or liability for the use or interpretation of this content.\r\n\r\nHow to Trust God After Loss: Levi &amp;amp; Jennie Lusko\r\n\r\nGuests:Levi and Jennie Lusko\r\n\r\nFrom the series:When God Doesn\u2019t Stop the Worst: Levi &amp;amp; Jennie Lusko \r\n\r\n(Day 2 of 3)\r\n\r\nAir date:October 27, 2026\r\n\r\nDave (00:04):\r\n\r\nAll right, I want to find out if you ever listened to my sermons. \r\n\r\nAnn (00:08):\r\n\r\nOf course I did.\r\n\r\nDave (00:09):\r\n\r\nThere's one I used\u2014\r\n\r\nAnn (00:09):\r\n\r\nI have them all memorized.\r\n\r\nDave (00:10):\r\n\r\nOkay. Let's see if you can finish this line. Trials can make you\u2014\r\n\r\nAnn (00:14):\r\n\r\nBetter or bitter.\r\n\r\nDave (00:15):\r\n\r\nOh, there you go. There's another part to it.\r\n\r\nAnn (00:17):\r\n\r\nOh.\r\n\r\nDave (00:18):\r\n\r\nTrials can make you better, bitter. See, look at that. You got half of it.\r\n\r\nAnn (00:22):\r\n\r\nOkay.\r\n\r\nDave (00:24):\r\n\r\nThe choice is yours. \r\n\r\nAnn (00:24):\r\n\r\nThe choice is yours. That's it.\r\n\r\nDave (00:32):\r\n\r\nWelcome to FamilyLife Today, where we want to help you pursue the relationships that matter most. I'm Dave Wilson.\r\n\r\nAnn (00:38):\r\n\r\nAnd I'm Ann Wilson, and you can find us at FamilyLifeToday.com. This is FamilyLife Today.\r\n\r\nDave (00:52):\r\n\r\nSo yeah, when pain or adversity enters your life, you have a choice.\r\n\r\nAnn (00:55):\r\n\r\nAnd all of us will have pain and adversity.\r\n\r\nDave (00:58):\r\n\r\nYeah. And being the Detroit Lions chaplain for 33 seasons, I knew a lot about pain and loss. Anyway, we've got a couple with us today, Levi and Jennie Lusko, who've written a book. I mean, your pastors\u2014 \r\n\r\nAnn:\r\n\r\nSeveral books. \r\n\r\nDave:\r\n\r\nYeah, several books, but pastors of Fresh Life Church in Montana and Utah and Wyoming. And who knows? There's probably other states. I probably only got half of them because God has really blessed this thing. But you wrote a book about a painful, excruciating moment in your life as you were starting Fresh Life Church. I guess you were about four or five years old in the church. \r\n\r\nAnn (01:32):\r\n\r\nAnd it's called Through the Eyes of a Lion. Welcome back to FamilyLife Today, you guys.\r\n\r\nLevi (01:36):\r\n\r\nAw, thank you so much for having us.\r\n\r\nJennie (01:38):\r\n\r\nThank you so much.\r\n\r\nLevi (01:39):\r\n\r\nAnd my family grew up in Detroit, actually. Both my mom and my dad are from Lansing. \r\n\r\nDave:\r\n\r\nReally? \r\n\r\nLevi:\r\n\r\nYeah. So he moved to Colorado later on in life, which is where I was born. And he told me my whole life, \"I'm raising you as a Broncos fan because I don't want you to have the pain and agony that I did cheering for the Detroit Lions.\" So I relate to that. \r\n\r\nAnn (01:59):\r\n\r\nA smart man.\r\n\r\nDave (02:00):\r\n\r\nWell, take us back to 2012. You're leading Fresh Life Church and it's December.\r\n\r\nLevi (02:07):\r\n\r\nYeah. What we like to say is it was the best and the worst of times at the same time, because that year was a year of growth for our church. We were multiplying and people were getting saved. \r\n\r\nJennie (02:21):\r\n\r\nAnd even in our own lives too. I remember specifically just in my own life, my own soul, I felt like God was just growing me and growing us and our marriage. It was just a year of growth.\r\n\r\nAnn (02:33):\r\n\r\nHow old were your kids then?\r\n\r\nJennie (02:34):\r\n\r\nAlivia was\u2014\r\n\r\nLevi (02:36):\r\n\r\nSeven.\r\n\r\nJennie (02:36):\r\n\r\n\u2014seven.\r\n\r\nLevi (02:37):\r\n\r\nLenya was five.\r\n\r\nJennie (02:39):\r\n\r\nAnd then Daisy was two and a half. And Clover\u2014\r\n\r\nLevi (02:39):\r\n\r\nAnd Clover was one.\r\n\r\nJennie (02:42):\r\n\r\n\u2014was one, almost one. They were bunched in right there at the bottom and yeah, beautiful. I mean, lots of fun. We have always had a real fun family life. I've always loved being a daddy to little girls and daddy-daughter date nights and fun family days and all that. He would take\r\n\r\nJennie (03:00):\r\n\r\nThe girls as they got older, he would take them on trips, preaching trips and\r\n\r\nLevi (03:04):\r\n\r\nJust a lot of intentionality. I had taken my second born daughter, Lynya, our daughter, on her first daddy-daughter trip. And we went to Disneyland and then we started our tradition that we've still continued every year except for 2020. And that is we would always take our family vacation on Easter Sunday. So we'd finish preaching our last service and then get on a plane and go somewhere and turn off my phone and not email and not work the whole trip. And so all that. So it was the best. We were establishing these great rhythms. And then on Christmas 2012, Linya, who is our second born, had had an asthma attack. It was five days\r\n\r\nJennie (03:40):\r\n\r\nBefore\r\n\r\nLevi (03:40):\r\n\r\nChristmas. Five days before Christmas and she just stopped breathing and it was inexplicable out of the normal. She'd had a lot of asthma attacks, but normally takes the medicine, breathes better and it's fine.\r\n\r\nJennie (03:53):\r\n\r\nLevi has asthma and our oldest has asthma too. So we're\r\n\r\nLevi (03:56):\r\n\r\nUsed to asthma. So it's kind of a normal\r\n\r\nJennie (03:57):\r\n\r\nPart of our life.\r\n\r\nLevi (03:58):\r\n\r\nAnd she just stops breathing and starts turning blue. I did CPR. Jennie called 911. We were praying obviously. And in just a matter of moments, she went from being here to not being here.\r\n\r\nAnn (04:14):\r\n\r\nPause right there for a second. This is the most traumatic thing and the greatest fear every parent has and you're living it. And as she's turning blue, Jennie, are you so fearful? Do you think that she could die? Are you thinking that or are you thinking, oh, it'll be okay?\r\n\r\nJennie (04:35):\r\n\r\nWell, I thought she would be okay. So we had just finished a date night. Our date nights were on Thursdays. That was kind of our rhythm. And then family days were on Fridays. And so we just finished our date night. We came to my mom's house, pulled up, and literally in that moment, we were just saying how we're so excited for family day. The week before Christmas for church is just crazy. For anyone, it's crazy, but we just had our schedules packed that week. So all week we were like, okay you guys, it's crazy now, but we're going to have Friday family day and we're going to go ice skating. We're going to have a fancy family dinner. And Levi was going to take Lenia to go Christmas shopping for her sisters. And so we went into date night just like, okay, we just need this.\r\n\r\n(05:17):\r\n\r\nWe need time together and then we're going to be with our kids. And so we rolled up to my mom's house. Literally Levi was like, I just feel so relaxed right now. And that's how\r\n\r\nLevi (05:26):\r\n\r\nWe felt. Well, I finished my sermon that day.\r\n\r\nJennie (05:29):\r\n\r\nSo we were ready for Fresh Life Christmas. We were ready for Christmas as a family and our plan, one of the girls' Christmas presents was taking them to Disneyland. So we were getting ready for that right after\r\n\r\nLevi (05:40):\r\n\r\nChristmas - The day after Christmas, which is the day we ended up having her funeral.\r\n\r\nJennie (05:44):\r\n\r\nYeah. So I walk in and my mom's trying to give Lenia her treatment, but she wasn't taking it. She's sitting on the counter and she looks at me and then I'm trying to give it to her because she's obviously not taking it or she's not doing very well. And then she just passes out on the kitchen counter. And Levi had parked the car and he ran in. He immediately started doing CPR and she had allergies. So did she eat anything? Is this an allergic reaction? And so he just starts with CPR. We call the paramedics and that whole time in that moment, I'm just praying and I'm crying out to God and I'm saying, Lenya, it's okay. Lenya, it's okay. It's going to be okay. Meanwhile, Olivia is seven at the time and then the little ones, they're all in the other room. But the paramedics come in and Levi goes with her.\r\n\r\n(06:35):\r\n\r\nThey take her away. And then I'm with the other girls in the other room and I'm just holding them. And I literally, I'm not thinking that she has died. I'm not thinking that I just said goodbye to her. I'm not thinking those things. I'm literally thinking it's going to be okay. It's going to be okay. It has to be okay. And then my brother drives me to the hospital where Levi and I are sitting in that little waiting room and the doctor comes in. I mean, literally it's just so shocking because we were just planning for Christmas. He just worked so hard on his Christmas message. We were just preparing for family day. The joy of that was like, oh, we're going to just get a moment to breathe. And then all of a sudden we're hearing what no parent wants to hear, but no one wants to hear or is in their nightmares.\r\n\r\n(07:30):\r\n\r\nAnd he says, I'm so sorry, Mr. and Mrs. Lusko. There's nothing more that we can do. And then literally is like, do you want us to keep working on her while you walk in? And we're like, what? We're just in shock. And so they bring us in and it's just the hardest thing\r\n\r\n(07:51):\r\n\r\nEver. And so we walk in and she's laying there and I mean our automatic response, obviously we were just in shock and crying and our automatic response though was Levi was on the other side of her and I'm just looking at her and we each hold one of her hands and it was almost immediate. And I don't even think we knew what we were doing, but we just raised our other hands and we were just saying, God, you gave us Lenya and we give her back to you. And there was just that moment of worshiping in the weeping and acknowledging God in the heartache and the heartbreak and the shock and the terror and the horrors. And I mean, even just looking back, it's like, I don't even know. I don't even know how we did it. I don't know. But God was there with us in our deepest pain.\r\n\r\nDave (08:50):\r\n\r\nYeah. I mean that image of you with your arms up is not what you would expect a parent to be able to do in that darkness. Like you just said, how in the world was that your response?\r\n\r\nLevi (09:07):\r\n\r\nA lot of what came to my mind in that moment was Linda's baby dedication. We had dedicated her to God as parents early on. And in our church we bring parents up and they stand on the stage and they hold the baby and with the pastor there they say, we're going to recognize God in this child's life as long as they're here and that babies are on loan. They're gifts from God. We're here to be stewards, not owners. And I think that's what's so freeing about tithing. You're saying we're stewards of this money, not owners. We want to honor God in how we use his money. So you have a light touch on money because the tithe helps to pry your fingers open. Well, the baby dedication's similar because you're essentially saying, this isn't my child, this is God's child and I want to raise this child to know Jesus.\r\n\r\n(09:56):\r\n\r\nAnd I remember seeing her in the hospital, that was one of the first images that popped into my head. And I remember when we were praying, we said, God, we dedicated her to you when you gave her to us and now we give her back to you as you've taken her home. I don't want to make it sound like we were in a movie. We weren't super human in our faith. We were broken and we were devastated and we were suffering and we were in agony. But I can also say that God gave us peace to past understanding and we in the midst of that agony felt a true sense of it's going to be okay and I'm here with you through this.\r\n\r\nDave (10:38):\r\n\r\nSo how do you walk out to your car?\r\n\r\nAnn (10:41):\r\n\r\nThe worst.\r\n\r\nLevi (10:42):\r\n\r\nYeah, it was hard. We looked at the empty car seat. We looked at. The timing of it was also capricious. I mean, there's no good day to lose a child, but to have gifts under the Christmas tree with her name on them, her stocking was on the fireplace. There's a million things about it that were just so cruel. To have a child die is like having memories taken from you that you've already thought about and enjoyed so you almost feel like they're already yours, but then having them snatch from you because you fantasize about your child's high school graduation, walking them down the aisle. There's so many benchmarks. To this day in our pantry, all of our kids have little tick marks with the date by them and Lenia's stop. It's right there. Everyone's getting older but her. And so all of that's in your mind when you look in the rear view mirror and you see an empty car seat.\r\n\r\n(11:37):\r\n\r\nAnd so we looked at that and we just thought this is not happening. But at the same time, again, it's like a split screen because then Jennie reminded me that we should go back and invite the people in the hospital to church.\r\n\r\nAnn (11:50):\r\n\r\nYeah. Jennie, how does that happen? This is\r\n\r\nDave (11:53):\r\n\r\nRight\r\n\r\nLevi (11:53):\r\n\r\nOutside the hospital?\r\n\r\nAnn (11:54):\r\n\r\nYeah, this is you walk outside, you had just left the hospital and Jennie said, \"Levi, you have to go back in.\" Well, I had already\r\n\r\nLevi (12:00):\r\n\r\nShifted to reverse.\r\n\r\nAnn (12:01):\r\n\r\nReally?\r\n\r\nLevi (12:01):\r\n\r\nShe goes, \"Hold on, you need to go back and invite those people to church.\" And it was just natural. It's just part of our rhythms. You don't build a church by telling people to invite their friends. You build a church by inviting everybody that you meet to come to church. It's not weird or icky evangelism. It's just like natural overflow of we've seen Jesus and we want to tell people about Jesus. And so we always had little cards or invites we could use to invite people. Now it's a website or Instagram, right? But we would say, \"Hey, come to church on Sunday.\" And\r\n\r\nJennie (12:33):\r\n\r\nEven both Livy and Lenia had little purses that they would always put little treasures in. And after she went to heaven, we found Lenia's purse and she had her little mini Bible and she had invitations to Fresh Life Christmas and bracelets. That was who we were as a family. Even Lenia, we would be at the grocery store and she would be like, \"Mom, you didn't invite her to church.\" She was always inviting people and that was kind of who she was, but it was who we were as a family too. And so I don't know exactly what came over me. All I know, I mean, we had spent, I don't even know how long we were in the room with Lenia, but I know that it was the hardest thing to leave because we're walking out and we should have been carrying her with us.\r\n\r\n(13:23):\r\n\r\nWe should have been. She was supposed to come with us. And so leaving the room and leaving the hospital and our daughters were, I mean, they were all asleep. They were in the car, but just looking back and seeing Lenia's is empty, I don't know. I had invitations in the car because even going through the drive through whatever, we would just always, so I was like, those people just were there for us on our worst day. We just need to invite them to come to church. And so Lie, I went in and\r\n\r\nLevi (13:56):\r\n\r\nInvited them. Well, I was crying and I was a hot mess, but I said thank you for everything. And I said, we're having Christmas services and we'd love to invite you to come. And I said, I spent all day working on my message and this all happened, but if you'll come, I'm still going to be there. If you guys would come in my daughter's honor, we would love to have you. And several of them did end up coming, which is beautiful. And even we heard afterwards some of them made faith decisions, which is just fantastic. It's just how God does. God takes the hard things we go through and he uses them for good, right? If you don't get bitter, if you get better. And none of us get to choose what we face, but we all get to choose how we're going to respond to it.\r\n\r\nAnn (14:40):\r\n\r\nYeah.\r\n\r\n(14:41):\r\n\r\nWell, as I listen to you guys, what I think is, oh, those things happened because it was a natural overflow of how God had already filled you. You were filled with him. You're filled with his spirit. And so even though you're in the most devastating experience that you could ever walk through, you're still filled with him. And so Jesus always has his eyes on his people and he's always loving them. And even your response of worship in the midst of suffering and pain is just, you know who your father is and you trust him. That says a lot about your walk with God and your perspective of how much he loves you and he loves your girls. That was almost a supernatural experience. And it reminds me of hearing Tony Evans years ago when I was in my 20s, I think, and he talked about building our foundation.\r\n\r\n(15:32):\r\n\r\nAnd you say something like this in your book, but he says, you don't see people pouring the foundation in the middle of the storm. They're building the foundation when the skies are clear because when the storm comes later, the foundation will last.\r\n\r\nLevi (15:48):\r\n\r\nWell, you got to train for the trial you're not yet in. Yes. That's the thing. I love how\r\n\r\nAnn (15:52):\r\n\r\nYou said that.\r\n\r\nLevi (15:53):\r\n\r\nBut I don't think you ever know when you're in that season when you're potentially doing what's foolish or wise. But Jesus said when the storms come, you find out if it's sand or rock. And so we're all right now determining how we're going to respond to our darkest day.\r\n\r\nDave (16:09):\r\n\r\nRight. So I'm a dad, I'm a pastor. I'm not sure I could preach after that Christmas. I think it'd be very easy to say, \"Hey, I'm going to take this year off.\"\r\n\r\nAnn (16:21):\r\n\r\nAnd people would understand.\r\n\r\nDave (16:22):\r\n\r\nSo talk about that. How were you able to preach and did you write a new message or was it the message you already wrote?\r\n\r\nLevi (16:30):\r\n\r\nWell, you'll recall I spent that day writing that sermon. And I always say this, I want to be really careful because I don't think there's any value in playing her or faking fine. As my friend Esther Allen likes to say, she wrote that book, No More Faking Fine. So there's definitely nothing noble about I pulled my hamstring, but I'm going to keep playing. You can do severe injury if you do that. So that's a disclaimer. And I did take time off. I took a month off preaching after that weekend, but I felt like A, it was adrenaline and instinct. I didn't know any other way through it than that. I had wrote the sermon. It was my way to honor her. I promised those people in the hospital. So there was really never any question that I was going to. I tweaked the ending of the message and worked, of course, the conquering of death into the story, which is the point of Christmas.\r\n\r\n(17:21):\r\n\r\nAnd getting up and doing that, I think was my gift. I mean, most kids have the obligation of stewarding their parents' legacy. God gave us the backwards responsibility of honoring and stewarding our daughter's legacy. And so we just have kind of from the beginning intended to not miss a moment in that journey.\r\n\r\nAnn (17:44):\r\n\r\nI just want to remind our listeners that our vision for families at FamilyLife.com is to follow Jesus, to impact children, parenting, marriages, not just here, but around the world. We can't do that without you.\r\n\r\nDave (18:00):\r\n\r\nYeah. And it's why we do what we do, but you probably don't know this. We have hundreds, even thousands of financial partners, people that pray for us, but also say, \"I don't want to just pray. I want to be a part of this ministry and I'm going to give part of my income every single month to FamilyLife to help this ministry impact the world.\" So you can be a partner with us. In a sense, you're impacting others just through our voice and through this program.\r\n\r\nAnn (18:25):\r\n\r\nAnd we need you.\r\n\r\nDave (18:26):\r\n\r\nYeah. And if you're sitting there thinking, \"Man, I didn't even know they had monthly supporters like that.\" Yes, we do. And they literally are partners. We are partnering together to change the world for Jesus Christ. So here's how you can do that. Just go to FamilyLifeToday.com, click on the donate button and become a partner. Well, I know the title. I don't know the contents of your message, but I think it was Turn Off the Dark.\r\n\r\nLevi (18:51):\r\n\r\nThat's right.\r\n\r\nDave (18:51):\r\n\r\nWhat did that mean?\r\n\r\nLevi (18:53):\r\n\r\nJesus in John chapter one is the light of the world. And I'd always though about you turn on a light. So if you turn on light, you're turning off dark. And the action of turning off the dark, which was inspired by the Spider-Man Broadway play, was this epiphany that when Jesus came Christmas, it was God's attempt to turn off darkness. And so that was what I had spent the whole day kind of writing. And you know how it is when you get a good idea and it kind of works, it's that eureka moment of Archimedes in the bathtub where you're almost ready to run through the streets naked, you're just so excited about your sermon you wrote. And it doesn't always happen, but when it does come in that bolt of inspiration, it's wonderful. And that was how that sermon was given to me. And so it was all kind of full circle.\r\n\r\n(19:37):\r\n\r\nThere wasn't 3,000 people in the church at that point, but I think 6,000 people came to that Christmas Eve service and it was amazing to get to honor Jesus and my daughter in that moment.\r\n\r\nDave (19:47):\r\n\r\nFinally, I'd love to know your perspective on, we said at the beginning, trials can make you better or bitter. And in some ways that sounds so trite in this situation because yeah, when you have a flat tire or the meeting gets canceled, yeah, they can bet. But when you're going through the devastation that you have, talk about that. There's families listening that have lost a loved one, maybe a son or a daughter or a spouse. How is it that God can meet you in that moment? How does he do that? Because you've experienced it.\r\n\r\nLevi (20:24):\r\n\r\nWell, we always want to be really careful to not just come in with our experience and people hearing this, it could feel so insensitive to say, \"You know what? You're going to be fine. God's making you better.\" And like you said, give some sort of Pat answer. Our experience though is that everything Jesus said in Matthew chapter five has been proved in the fire. Blessed are the brokenhearted, blessed are those who mourn, blessed are those who hunger. They will be filled. They will be comforted. Theirs is the kingdom of heaven. There is a reward in suffering and that reward is God does come near. He's near to the brokenhearted. And in a unique way, I really believe if you don't harden your heart, if you open up your heart to God being there, there is a unique treasure that's available to you in the midst of suffering that is honestly an honor.\r\n\r\n(21:15):\r\n\r\nAnd I don't know how to say this any other way than this, so I'll just say it. If I could have what God has given to us in this suffering without going through, I would still want it. I would want every good thing that he's given to us in this because it is so good and there is such a nearness of his spirit and a depth that you can't get outside of being put into a crucible. That's why Paul said to the Philippians, \"To you, it's been entrusted with the grace of not only believing in Jesus, but to suffer for his name.\" And that could sound so cruel. Man, you guys have been given the great gift of suffering, but they would say, \"You're right, Paul. It is a gift to suffer for Jesus.\"\r\n\r\nJennie (21:51):\r\n\r\nYeah. And it's hard though because we wish that she was still with us. And I think that we don't want to say like, \"Oh, people gave their lives to Christ, and since Lenny went to heaven, all these people know God's love.\" Yes, that is true and that's amazing. It's not that. But we miss her and it's hurt so much. And it has been, I mean, especially in those early days and then kind of randomly and sporadically after, but where it's just that weight heavy on your chest where it's hard to breathe and you almost have to just trust God for the next breath. And yes, we believe that God has entrusted us with this pain, but reciprocating it, it's us trusting him in the little moments and trusting him when it hurts so much and trusting him that he's at work. He himself said, \"My ways are not your ways.\r\n\r\n(22:44):\r\n\r\nMy thoughts are not your thoughts. My ways are higher than yours.\" And so trusting him that he is good and that he loves us. And then even just at his word when the Bible says that to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord. So our worst day was actually Lenya's glorious day. And so the tension even with that of the suffering and the pain that we have experienced, but not for her. And that tension of knowing of that hope that we have in Christ, that one day Lenya will not come back to us and we won't get to experience her as a 13-year-old and as a senior in high school. And our daughters are growing up with the void of their sister. However, we have our hope in Christ and we have the hope that because we've placed our faith in Christ and because to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord.\r\n\r\n(23:39):\r\n\r\nAnd there's going to be a day where all of this, we won't even remember it because of the joy that we'll have when we're with Jesus together face to face. So there's just always that tension of the heartache and the pain and the anger, but also the joy and the privilege and the honor to get to serve God in this way and to love God in this way and to steward this.\r\n\r\nAnn (24:09):\r\n\r\nOkay. What did you think of today?\r\n\r\nDave (24:11):\r\n\r\nIt was powerful. Really powerful. I mean, what a heartbreaking struggle. And I know a lot of our listeners and watchers have gone through things like this.\r\n\r\nAnn (24:19):\r\n\r\nOr\r\n\r\nDave (24:20):\r\n\r\nThey\r\n\r\nAnn (24:20):\r\n\r\nKnow someone that is.\r\n\r\nDave (24:21):\r\n\r\nYeah. I went through that with my little brother dying and watching my mom and dad try to navigate that.\r\n\r\nAnn (24:26):\r\n\r\nAnd again, the book is called Through the Eyes of a Lion: Facing Impossible Pain: Finding Incredible Power, and it's by Levi Lusko.\r\n\r\nDave (24:33):\r\n\r\nAnd you can get your copy by clicking the link in the show notes at FamilyLifeToday.com and they'll be back with us for one more day.\r\n\r\nAnn (24:45):\r\n\r\nFamilyLife Today is a donor supported production of FamilyLife, a crew ministry celebrating 50 years of helping you pursue the relationships that matter most.\r\n\r\nFamilyLife Today is a donor-supported production of FamilyLife\u00ae, a Cru\u00ae Ministry. \r\n\r\nHelping you pursue the relationships that matter most.\r\n\r\nIf you\u2019ve benefited from the FamilyLife Today transcripts, would you consider donating today to help defray the costs of producing them and making them available online?\r\n\r\nCopyright \u00a9 2026 FamilyLife. All rights reserved.\r\n\r\nwww.FamilyLife.com\n","theme_header_position":"","post_header_is_sticky":"","is_header_overlay":""},"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast\/318706","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/podcast"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/47000"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=318706"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/295627"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=318706"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=318706"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=318706"},{"taxonomy":"podcast_series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast_series?post=318706"},{"taxonomy":"cwp_profile","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/cwp_profile?post=318706"},{"taxonomy":"series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/series?post=318706"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}