{"id":314640,"date":"2025-05-14T03:26:20","date_gmt":"2025-05-14T07:26:20","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/%series%\/what-to-do-when-you-want-to-yell-at-your-husband-ann-wilson\/"},"modified":"2025-06-17T10:56:30","modified_gmt":"2025-06-17T14:56:30","slug":"what-to-do-when-you-want-to-yell-at-your-husband-ann-wilson","status":"publish","type":"podcast","link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/what-to-do-when-you-want-to-yell-at-your-husband-ann-wilson\/","title":{"rendered":"What to Do When You Want to Yell at Your Husband &#8211; Ann Wilson"},"content":{"rendered":"<p>In this emotionally rich and spiritually grounded episode of FamilyLife Today, Dave and Ann Wilson dive into one of the most personal, transformative aspects of their marriage\u2014how powerful, life-giving words can uplift and transform a spouse, especially within the context of Christian marriage.<\/p>\n<p>The episode centers on themes from Ann Wilson\u2019s book, specifically focusing on how women can speak life into their husbands even when all they want to do is criticize or \u201ccoach\u201d them. Dave vulnerably shares the impact of Ann&#8217;s affirmations over their 45 years of marriage\u2014how both praise and constructive criticism shaped him into a better man, father, husband, and spiritual leader.<\/p>\n<p>One pivotal story revisited multiple times is when Ann expressed disappointment in the difference between Dave\u2019s passionate presence at church and his disengaged presence at home. While Dave\u2019s initial reaction was defensive, he later realized through prayer that God was speaking through Ann, awakening him to the need for spiritual leadership at home.<\/p>\n<p>They unpack the idea of the wife as a \u201chelper suitable\u201d (from Genesis 2:18), diving deep into the original Hebrew words \u201cezer\u201d and \u201ck\u2019negdo.\u201d These terms, often misunderstood as denoting subservience, are redefined as symbols of strength, equality, and divine partnership. Ann shares insights from theologians and Jewish scholars, painting a picture of a wife not as a passive supporter but a warrior who stands toe to toe with her husband, helping him become all that God created him to be.<\/p>\n<p>The Wilsons emphasize the importance of affirming the good in each other rather than tearing each other down, especially when trying to correct faults. Critique alone rarely motivates change; but love-filled truth, built on a foundation of encouragement, does. They compare it to making deposits in an emotional bank account: affirmations are deposits, and critiques are withdrawals. Without a balance of positivity, correction only causes further distance.<\/p>\n<p>The episode ends with a reflection on the spiritual reality of marriage. They stress that spouses must first be filled by God, or they will look to each other to meet needs only Christ can fill\u2014resulting in disappointment and relational strain. Instead, if both partners are spiritually nourished, their love and support become an overflow rather than a demand.<\/p>\n<p>This candid conversation offers practical insight, biblical wisdom, and personal vulnerability that challenges and encourages both husbands and wives to build marriages that reflect God\u2019s design and grace.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Yelling at your husband? FamilyLife Today co-host Ann Wilson redefined &#8220;suitable helper&#8221; and turned her marriage into one of strength and partnership.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":47000,"featured_media":312569,"menu_order":0,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"closed","template":"","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","inline_featured_image":false,"_uag_custom_page_level_css":"","episode_type":"audio","audio_file":"https:\/\/traffic.omny.fm\/d\/clips\/cbd16f10-ac60-4f09-b4df-b15400ce35aa\/33aaac7e-3581-4e21-a3df-b154011ba58c\/d4277a75-5b02-4735-8361-b2d100ea9d3d\/audio.mp3","podmotor_file_id":"","podmotor_episode_id":"","cover_image":"","cover_image_id":"","duration":"00:22:57","filesize":"21.04M","filesize_raw":"","date_recorded":"2025-05-14 03:26:20","explicit":"","block":""},"categories":[2082,2901,2831],"tags":[],"podcast_series":[10996],"cwp_profile":[],"series":[2101],"class_list":["post-314640","podcast","type-podcast","status-publish","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-communication","category-husbands","category-wives","podcast_series-speak-life-to-your-husband-when-you-want-to-yell-at-him-ann-wilson","series-familylife-today"],"acf":[],"episode_featured_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2025\/02\/image_bbee74.jpg?w=1024","episode_player_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2023\/02\/image-scaled.jpg","download_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-download\/314640\/what-to-do-when-you-want-to-yell-at-your-husband-ann-wilson","player_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-player\/314640\/what-to-do-when-you-want-to-yell-at-your-husband-ann-wilson","audio_player":null,"episode_data":{"playerMode":"light","subscribeUrls":{"apple_podcasts":{"key":"apple_podcasts","url":"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303?mt=2&app=podcast","label":"Apple Podcasts","class":"apple_podcasts","icon":"apple-podcasts.png"},"google_podcasts":{"key":"google_podcasts","url":"","label":"Google Podcasts","class":"google_podcasts","icon":"google-podcasts.png"},"spotify":{"key":"spotify","url":"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm","label":"Spotify","class":"spotify","icon":"spotify.png"},"youtube":{"key":"youtube","url":"","label":"YouTube","class":"youtube","icon":"youtube.png"}},"rssFeedUrl":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/feed\/podcast\/familylife-today","embedCode":"<blockquote class=\"wp-embedded-content\" data-secret=\"StjGWgpRKc\"><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/what-to-do-when-you-want-to-yell-at-your-husband-ann-wilson\/\">What to Do When You Want to Yell at Your Husband &#8211; Ann Wilson<\/a><\/blockquote><iframe sandbox=\"allow-scripts\" security=\"restricted\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/what-to-do-when-you-want-to-yell-at-your-husband-ann-wilson\/embed\/#?secret=StjGWgpRKc\" width=\"500\" height=\"350\" title=\"&#8220;What to Do When You Want to Yell at Your Husband &#8211; Ann Wilson&#8221; &#8212; FamilyLife\u00ae - A Cru Ministry\" data-secret=\"StjGWgpRKc\" frameborder=\"0\" marginwidth=\"0\" marginheight=\"0\" scrolling=\"no\" class=\"wp-embedded-content\"><\/iframe><script>\n\/*! This file is auto-generated *\/\n!function(d,l){\"use strict\";l.querySelector&&d.addEventListener&&\"undefined\"!=typeof URL&&(d.wp=d.wp||{},d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage||(d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage=function(e){var t=e.data;if((t||t.secret||t.message||t.value)&&!\/[^a-zA-Z0-9]\/.test(t.secret)){for(var s,r,n,a=l.querySelectorAll('iframe[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),o=l.querySelectorAll('blockquote[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),c=new RegExp(\"^https?:$\",\"i\"),i=0;i<o.length;i++)o[i].style.display=\"none\";for(i=0;i<a.length;i++)s=a[i],e.source===s.contentWindow&&(s.removeAttribute(\"style\"),\"height\"===t.message?(1e3<(r=parseInt(t.value,10))?r=1e3:~~r<200&&(r=200),s.height=r):\"link\"===t.message&&(r=new URL(s.getAttribute(\"src\")),n=new URL(t.value),c.test(n.protocol))&&n.host===r.host&&l.activeElement===s&&(d.top.location.href=t.value))}},d.addEventListener(\"message\",d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage,!1),l.addEventListener(\"DOMContentLoaded\",function(){for(var e,t,s=l.querySelectorAll(\"iframe.wp-embedded-content\"),r=0;r<s.length;r++)(t=(e=s[r]).getAttribute(\"data-secret\"))||(t=Math.random().toString(36).substring(2,12),e.src+=\"#?secret=\"+t,e.setAttribute(\"data-secret\",t)),e.contentWindow.postMessage({message:\"ready\",secret:t},\"*\")},!1)))}(window,document);\n\/\/# sourceURL=https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-includes\/js\/wp-embed.min.js\n<\/script>\n"},"uagb_featured_image_src":{"full":["https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2025\/02\/image_bbee74.jpg",1024,1024,true]},"uagb_author_info":{"display_name":"Margaret","author_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/author\/margaret-coylefamilylife-com\/"},"uagb_comment_info":0,"uagb_excerpt":"Yelling at your husband? FamilyLife Today co-host Ann Wilson redefined \"suitable helper\" and turned her marriage into one of strength and partnership.","meta_box":{"show_notes":"<ul>\n<li>Purchase \"<a href=\"https:\/\/shop.familylife.com\/product\/how-to-speak-life-to-your-husband-when-all-you-want-to-do-is-yell-at-him\">How to Speak Life to Your Husband<\/a>\" on our website.<\/li>\n<li>Every donation to FamilyLife in May will be matched. <a href=\"https:\/\/donate.familylife.com\/may-2025\/?cru_source=D0002408AT&amp;cru_medium=podcast&amp;cru_campaign=May2025\">Donate today on our website<\/a>.<\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<hr \/>\n<ul>\n<li>Find resources from this podcast at <a href=\"https:\/\/shop.familylife.com\/product-category\/radio-resources\/\">shop.familylife.com<\/a>.<\/li>\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/shop.familylife.com\/product-category\/past-radio-resources\/\">See resources from our past podcasts.<\/a><\/li>\n<li>Find more content and resources on the <a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/app\/\">FamilyLife's app<\/a>!<\/li>\n<li>Help others find FamilyLife. Leave a review on <a href=\"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303\">Apple Podcast<\/a> or <a href=\"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm?si=d6dfa8d2415f4750\">Spotify<\/a>.<\/li>\n<li>Check out all the FamilyLife's podcasts on the <a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/familylife-podcast-network\/\">FamilyLife Podcast Network<\/a><\/li>\n<\/ul>\n","transcript_url":"https:\/\/transcript.familylife.com\/fl2025-05-14.pdf","transcript_content":"<p>FamilyLife Today\u00ae with Dave and Ann Wilson - Web Version Transcript<\/p>\n<p>This content has been generated by an artificial intelligence language model. While we strive for accuracy and quality, please note that the information provided will most likely not be entirely error-free or up-to-date. We recommend independently verifying the content with the originally-released audio. This transcript is provided for your personal use and general information purposes only. References to conferences, resources, or other special promotions may be obsolete. We do not assume any responsibility or liability for the use or interpretation of this content.<\/p>\n<p>What to Do When You Want to Yell at Your Husband<\/p>\n<p>Guest:Ann Wilson<\/p>\n<p>From the series:Speak Life into Your Husband When All You Want to Do Is Yell at Him (Day 2 of 2)<\/p>\n<p>Air date:May 14, 2025<\/p>\n<p>Dave:I could share thousands of times in our marriage, in 45 years, where your words of life, standing toe to toe, have helped me see how great I can be and better as a man, and a husband, and dad; but at the same time, your words of truth\u2014you have said hard things to me that I didn't want to hear\u2014but I needed to hear.<\/p>\n<p>We've said this many times\u2014the night that I crawled into bed, after a long weekend\u2014and you said, \u201cI wish the man that led our church lived here. I watched you preach this morning; and you're on fire, and you're casting vision, and you're praying with a fervency; and when you come home, you just don't bring any of that; you're just sort of dead.\u201d I remember\u2014I should have said, \u201cThanks; that was helpful,\u201d\u2014I jumped out of bed, and said, \u201cYou don't realize I'm the best husband in the whole church. You think those other guys aren\u2019t losers compared to me?\u201d That's how I responded, because I didn't like the critique. But the next day, when I'm sitting with God\u2014and saying, \u201cGod, were You speaking to me through Ann?\u201d\u2014He's like, \u201cYep.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Dave:Welcome to FamilyLife Today, where we want to help you pursue the relationships that matter most. I'm Dave Wilson.<\/p>\n<p>Ann:And I'm Ann Wilson. And you can find us at FamilyLifeToday.com. This is FamilyLife Today.<\/p>\n<p>Dave:Okay, I'm excited to continue our conversation about your book\u2014the Ann Wilson book on\u2014How to Speak Life to Your Husband: When All You Want to Do Is Yell at Him. It's sort of a memoir of Ann Wilson.<\/p>\n<p>Ann:But my favorite part is your writing; because at the end of each chapter, you have some really good things to say.<\/p>\n<p>Dave:And I know what you're doing right now\u2014you're speaking life to me\u2014you're living out the book. Let's jump back into the conversation.<\/p>\n<p>I think that\u2019s what wives and women may not understand\u2014when you critique a man; when you boo him; or criticize him; or compare him to other men who are better, in your mind, thinking, \u201cIt's going to motivate him,\u201d\u2014it's almost like a hard coach: \u201cI\u2019m going to coach him hard.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann:It's like a coach, yeah: \u201cYou can't do this.\u201d I thought you would think, \u201cI\u2019m going to show you how good I can be.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Dave:I'm sure, in some ways, that happens every once in a while; but most of the time, it doesn't motivate; it demotivates a man.<\/p>\n<p>Ann:You think it deflates him.<\/p>\n<p>Dave:A man is not motivated by critique\u2014I'm not sure women are either\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Ann:No, we aren\u2019t.<\/p>\n<p>Dave:\u2014it probably goes both ways.<\/p>\n<p>Ann:Oh, it's totally both ways.<\/p>\n<p>Dave:But I know\u2014when you started speaking life, and believing in me; and saying I was a good man of God: \u201cYou're a good husband,\u201d \u201cYou're a great dad,\u201d \u201cYou're a good leader,\u201d\u2014all the things that you used to say the opposite of\u2014at first, I was skeptical: \u201cYou don't really [believe that]; you're just saying it.\u201d But then, over time,\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Ann:And I never said anything that I didn't see; because I'm not one who can be like, \u201cOh, I'm just going to say this and fake him out.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Dave:No, I knew that.<\/p>\n<p>Ann:I'm not just going to say things that aren't true, but I hope that he becomes. It wasn't manipulation at all; it was God showing me these little corners of you that I hadn't seen before, like, \u201cWhoa!\u201d<\/p>\n<p>We've shared this a bunch of times, but my biggest complaint was probably you as a spiritual leader. I had Dennis Rainey in my head: \u201cYou need to get in there,\u201d and [speaking like Dave] \u201cLet's open the Word, kids,\u201d and have these big time devotionals. I had these expectations of what that should look like.<\/p>\n<p>When I asked God to show me the greatness, and show me even how you're leading\u2014we've shared this so many times\u2014that you came out of the bedroom, after praying with the boys; and my prayer was, \u201cGod, show me the greatness of Dave.\u201d I was in awe\u2014this was the first time it had ever happened\u2014they were little. You came out the room; and my words were: \u201cI'm so jealous of the power you have. The boys\u2014when you're in there, and you're praying\u2014I watch them; and they're locked into you. Everything you said, they're clinging to every word. I go in there, and there's bedlam and chaos; and they're not listening to anything. But man, I wish I had that power that you carry; it's pretty phenomenal.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Dave:Yeah; literally, I can see myself at the top of the stairs\u2014and you sitting in the hallway, saying that.<\/p>\n<p>Ann:What?!<\/p>\n<p>Dave:That's how powerful words of life can be. I mean, words of death\u2014you can remember where you were standing when somebody critiqued you or said you're a loser\u2014but words of life, the same thing. It's like I can remember standing there; we're still in that house. I remember looking down at you, and thinking, \u201cReally? She thinks I do good? The boys hang on me?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>I am telling you, wives: understand this. This is what I did in the book\u2014I come at the end of every chapter, and say, \u201cI want to just give you a husband's perspective on what Ann just said,\u201d\u2014\u201cWives, understand this: the next night, I'm running up the stairs into that bedroom to pray and have devotionals from my boys, which I was not doing a lot of because I felt like, \u2018I'm not a very good spiritual leader. I don't do it the way Ann wants me to do it; I don't stand at the end of the bedroom with a pulpit and a big Bible that's 18 inches wide and preach the gospel.\u2019\u201d<\/p>\n<p>That was sort of the joke; because [her expectation was]: \u201cI want a sermon given to our kids.\u201d I would just lay on the bed; we talk about God; we pray. All I know is I'm running up the stairs the next night; because she says I'm good at this. She says the boys hang on every word. I'm just telling you women: \u201cThat's how you motivate a man.\u201d Again, you're not lying; you're just\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Ann:\u2014or manipulating.<\/p>\n<p>Dave:\u2014you're just seeing. You're asking God, \u201cGive me eyes,\u201d\u2014one son calls them \u201cGod goggles\u201d\u2014\u201cGive me God goggles to see my man the way You see him. And I'm going to speak to him the words You speak to him, which are words of affirmation and belief.\u201d I'm just telling you: \u201cYou want to motivate a man?\u201d Don't do it to motivate your man; just do it because you really are seeing something great. Don't hold it to yourself; speak it out.<\/p>\n<p>I'm telling you\u2014it's like this\u2014I've said this many times on stages when we talk about this in Vertical Marriage. It's like you are saying I'm this man, and I have my hands way up above my head. I felt like I'm this man\u2014I'm way down here\u2014and some of that's because I've believed that, and you've told me that most of my life. And so now, you're saying I'm this man\u2014and I'm like, \u201cNo, I'm not. I don't even see myself as that way.\u201d All I know is, as you kept saying that, I started to realize: \u201cShe really does see me differently now. She does think I'm a good man, and a good leader, and a good provider, and a good spiritual leader, and a good husband.\u201d And all I know is I was like, \u201cI'm going to become the man she says I am, that I'm not yet, but I'm going to become that guy.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>That's how it works for men. I'm sure it works that same way for women; but man, as you believe in us, and you speak life to us, we want to become the man you say we are and get better.<\/p>\n<p>Who was it?\u2014I think it was Matt Chandler, wasn't it?\u2014we just interviewed.<\/p>\n<p>Ann:Oh, yeah.<\/p>\n<p>Dave:I think he said, \u201cWhen you put a crown on a man, he'll become a king.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann:Yeah.<\/p>\n<p>Dave:That idea is like you are saying, \u201cYou're this guy\u201d; and that made me go, \u201cI will be that guy.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann:I think my thought was: \u201cGod, You know who you created Dave to be. You know all of the places inside of him of what You created him to become. And part of my job and my role\u201d\u2014and it goes both ways\u2014\"is to pull out those things that God put in you.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>I think part of the question is for me, as a woman, I had to go back and think, \u201cWhat is my pushback, even with whom I'm supposed to be, as a wife?\u201d And when we started speaking for the Weekend to Remember, when you get into Genesis:\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Dave:The book of Genesis.<\/p>\n<p>Ann:\u20142:18, and God's creating woman; He says that He's created woman to be a helper suitable for Adam. This was when we first started speaking for FamilyLife; I was 29. I remember I kept studying this, looking at it. I've been to seminary\u2014I knew that I should look it up in Hebrew\u2014but I didn't. And so I looked it up in the dictionary\u2014Webster's dictionary\u2014and the word I was looking\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Dave:You were like, \u201cWhere's my helper?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann:Yeah; because I'm like, \u201cWhy does he get a helper? I don't have a helper. Of course, the man gets a helper; and the woman doesn\u2019t. I wish I had somebody to help me.\u201d I think that all the time when the kids were little: \u201cI wish I had somebody to help me around here.\u201d That word really got stuck with me: \u201cI don't want to be the helper.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>The helper\u2014when the dictionary talks about basically someone important tells them what to do\u2014I'm like, \u201cThis is why I don't want to be the helper!\u201d And when I talked to you about it, you're like, \u201cHave you looked it up in the Hebrew?\u201d I\u2019m like, \u201cNo.\u201d To look it up in the Hebrew was really interesting for me; I feel like I've still been learning about this.<\/p>\n<p>We had\u2014remember when we had Kristi McLelland on?\u2014phenomenal. I like that the word, \u201chelper,\u201d in Hebrew is the word, ezer. That word is a powerful word; there's nothing subservient or inferior about being a helper: \u201cIt carries the idea of strengthening someone in a way they cannot do for themselves, revealing a powerful understanding of God's unique strength and influence given to the woman.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>And then, the word, \u201csuitable,\u201d is the word, kenegdo, which is not used any other time in Scripture in the whole Bible. And that word means \u201cto stand, toe to toe,\u201d which is also interesting to me; because it's not the little \u201ch\u201d helper. Helper: this word is used many times in Psalms when Israel's in trouble, and they're calling out: \u201cWhere does my help come from?\u201d The only Psalm that Moses wrote talks about Moses saying, \u201cOur help comes from our Ezer, comes from God.\u201d When you think of it in that term, that's a powerful word of help to a man.<\/p>\n<p>Dave:I mean, it's shattering! \u201cGod is our help.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann:It's not the little \u201ch\u201d helper.<\/p>\n<p>Dave:God is called an Ezer; He's a Helper. So to say a wife is a helper is not a demeaning, subservient term. It's like you are as powerful, in your man's life, as God is. You're a helper.<\/p>\n<p>Ann:Well, maybe not that powerful; but\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Dave:You're very powerful. It isn't like you're a weak little sidekick over here, who does everything so the man's life will be better. You're a partner, an equal partner, who stands\u2014talk about suitable\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Ann:\u2014toe to toe.<\/p>\n<p>Dave:\u2014kenegdo\u2014toe to toe; what's that mean?\u2014toe to toe?<\/p>\n<p>Ann:I think my best description of it was when we were having a lunch with some of our guests; several different theologians were in the room. That word, \u201ctoe to toe,\u201d I was asking a lot of the people at lunch, \u201cWhat do you guys think it means?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Dave:Dr. Jeff Myers was sitting there that day, over lunch. He made a comment; I recorded it, because\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Ann:Did you?!<\/p>\n<p>Dave:Yeah, the conversation got really rich. Here's a guy with a doctorate in theology, and we're just discussing. You were writing the book and studying this whole thing, and he's a scholar. And he's like, \u201cYeah, I've studied this many times.\u201d When he made a comment\u2014which you put in the book\u2014where he said, \u201cI think God was trying to give us a picture of, when a husband looks at his wife, he sees in her eyes the man he can be,\u201d\u2014that's a different picture of helper. It's like an equal partner, who brings out the best. You stand toe to toe\u2014that means you speak life, and you compliment, and you encourage\u2014but it also means that you will speak the truth.<\/p>\n<p>Ann:You will speak the truth. I think that that's really important for you, as a listener, to hear. We're not saying you're just this subservient quiet little mouse in the house. When you have something to say\u2014and we'll talk about this in a little bit\u2014it's really important for you to say it, because we strengthen one another in our marriage as iron sharpens iron. A lot of times that's used for men in the Scriptures, but we do that in our marriage too. We strengthen each other by sometimes speaking hard truths, but we do it in a way that can be heard and understood.<\/p>\n<p>Dave:I could share thousands of times in our marriage, in 45 years, where your words of life, standing toe to toe, have helped me see how great I can be; and better as a man, and a husband, and dad. But at the same time, your words of truth\u2014which, later in the book, you talk about\u2014you got to package those words of truth in love: Ephesians 4:15: \u201cSpeak the truth in love.\u201d You got to package them in a building-up way, even though it's hard truth. You have said hard things to me that I didn't want to hear, but I needed to hear.<\/p>\n<p>In some ways, standing, toe to toe, being an ezer kenegdo is like: \u201cYou're my partner, and you bring life to me; but you also hold me accountable to be the man that God wants me to be.\u201d Those hard truths made me better; they sharpened me. And so both ways, it works.<\/p>\n<p>Ann:But when I was only speaking hard truths, you couldn't hear it; because they were\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Dave:They're all withdrawals. And when you start speaking life\u2014you\u2019re deposit, deposit, deposit\u2014and now, you got to make a withdrawal with a hard truth, he's going to receive it; because he feels built up. Now, you're taking a dollar out when you put in $500 million. That's a pretty good analogy of how much life you're speaking\u2014it does hurt\u2014but it does sharpen us.<\/p>\n<p>We've said this many times\u2014the night that I crawled into bed after a long weekend; and you said, \u201cI wish the man that led our church lived here,\u201d\u2014 I'm not saying that's the best way to say it, but that\u2019s\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Ann:It wasn't the [best] timing either.<\/p>\n<p>Dave:That\u2019s, literally, what you said. I didn't even know what you meant; I'm like, \u201cWhat do you mean?!\u201d And you were just like, \u201cI watched you preach this morning; and you're on fire, and you're casting vision, and you're praying with a fervency. When you come home, you just don't bring any of that; you're just sort of dead.\u201d I remember\u2014I should have said, \u201cThanks; that was helpful,\u201d\u2014I jumped out of bed, and said, \u201cYou don't realize I'm the best husband in the whole church. You think those other guys aren\u2019t losers compared to me?\u201d\u2014that's how I responded, because I didn't like the critique.<\/p>\n<p>But the next day, when I'm sitting with God\u2014and saying, \u201cGod, were You speaking to me through Ann?\u201d\u2014He's like, \u201cYep.\u201d And then, those words motivated me. I remember saying, even on my knees right there in my little bedroom office\u2014again, the boys were young then\u2014I just remember saying, \u201cOkay, God. The most important disciples in my life that I'm pouring into are not a thousand people at my church; it's Ann; it's CJ; it's Austin and Cody. I should be bringing to my home more energy than I bring anywhere else,\u201d\u2014not that your job doesn't matter; your ministry, whatever you're doing, it matters\u2014you bring everything you got. You work unto the Lord; and you are excellent; and you bring passion.<\/p>\n<p>But I was bringing it out there and not in here. And those words that you spoke were hard words. You just said what you felt; but I heard God use those, and say, \u201cYou got to step up and be the man that I've called you to be.\u201d I felt like I made a commitment that day, to say, \u201cI'm stepping up. I got to become a better husband and better dad. I got to be a spiritual leader in this home, not just in the church.\u201d That was a hard toe-to-toe moment, where I think you were my helper, suitable to transform me in some ways.<\/p>\n<p>Ann:And I think we do that with our kids, too, when we\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Dave:Oh, for sure.<\/p>\n<p>Ann:\u2014look at them; and we see who God made them to be; and to speak truth. We're speaking both love and truth to our kids.<\/p>\n<p>I think what hit me, about that lunchtime when we were talking about the \u201chelper suitable,\u201d my thought was, \u201cWhen Dave looks into my eyes, what does he see? What's the reflection that he sees?\u201d A lot of that's my way of being. \u201cIf you were being totally honest\u2014back in the day, when we talked about this: the chopping plant story and the boo story\u2014what did you see when you looked into my eyes?\u201d I don't think I've ever asked you this.<\/p>\n<p>Dave:I felt like you were discouraged and disappointed that I wasn't the man you thought I was when we dated, when we're engaged, I wasn't the spiritual leader. I wasn't romantic as much as you thought I would be. I didn't serve you the way you thought I would be. And you know what? All of that was true; I wasn't doing any of that.<\/p>\n<p>I've been speaking around the country at these Iron Sharpens Iron men's conferences; we got a thousand men in the room. One of the workshops I've been doing this year is: \u201cHow to Become the Husband Your Wife Thought She Married.\u201d These guys come in there; they've heard the same thing: \u201cI thought you were going to be this,\u201d\u2014because when we're dating, we're romantic; we're giving everything we got. And then, we get married; and we sort of get lazy on the marriage side. We get energized on the job side, and our wives feel duped.<\/p>\n<p>And so what happens? They start speaking that out; and the man's like, \u201cOkay, you don't like what I'm doing? Okay, I'll see you later\u201d; and they go back to work. It all starts to change, I think\u2014and it's on us, as men, to become the men\u2014and that's what I challenge the guys to be. It's like: \u201cMan, what would we look like to really love your wife like she's the most important person in your life? Because she is; she\u2019s more important than the kids.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann:That'll be your book.<\/p>\n<p>Dave:Yeah, maybe that'll happen. But all I know is I felt like you were disappointed.<\/p>\n<p>Ann:When you look at me now, what do you see?<\/p>\n<p>Dave:I feel like you think I'm the man. I mean some ways I'm like, you're deluded, but you keep saying, \u201cYou're amazing.\u201d I feel like, in some ways, you see me as your helper now. You didn't get a helper; you got one right here. And I want to be your helper; I want to be serving you. I don't want to be asked to vacuum the family room; I want to see it, and step up, and do it because you deserve it; because you're going to do it. I know there's still\u2014sometimes, you're like, \u201cSeriously? I asked you to vacuum the family room yesterday\u201d; and still, we just lay there, like: \u201cWell, I'm going to do it.\u201d But I was like, \u201cNo, get off the couch; and do it now,\u201d\u2014because you made me a better man.<\/p>\n<p>Ann:Well, it's interesting with all of this: as we've been learning all of that\u2014I love the word, ezer kenegdo, now\u2014\u201chelper suitable.\u201d It's a term that I want to be a part; I'm helping you to become the man that God created you to be.<\/p>\n<p>But one of the things I love that Kristi McLelland also said was: when she asked a Jewish rabbi, over in Israel, \u201cWhat do you think ezer kenegdo means?\u2014helper suitable for Adam? She said he thought about it for a minute; he said, \u201cYou know what I think it means, Kristi?\u2014is that God knew there was an enemy in the garden. It would take the man and the woman, standing side by side in battle together, to defeat the enemy. It would take the two of them.\u201d It made me think, when I heard that: \u201cHow often, we had been facing each other, fighting each other; when God was saying, \u2018No, I put you together on the planet, and in your family, to battle the enemy together\u2014not battle each other\u2014but battle together; because there's a great battle going on in marriage and family.\u2019\u201d We have to win it together.<\/p>\n<p>Dave:Yeah; I think a lot of couples really do think they're enemies, their spouse.<\/p>\n<p>Ann:Me too.<\/p>\n<p>Dave:They've been disappointed and, maybe, even hurt.<\/p>\n<p>Ann:\u2014abandoned.<\/p>\n<p>Dave:Then, again\u2014we say this, it feels like we say it every four or five pages in the book\u2014\u201cIf your man is hurting you, physically; verbally assaulting you, we are not saying, \u201cCheer your man; stand, toe to toe, and speak life to him.\u201d No, it's like you need to get safe first. We're not saying, \u201cGet divorced\u201d; but \u201cGet safe\u201d; and hopefully, God can transform him by you protecting yourself.<\/p>\n<p>But if he's a goodwill-man; he's just trying his best\u2014but he's like me\u2014he's clueless; and he's missing; and he's falling short, you get the chance to transform your man by being the helper God has created both of us to be to one another, to bring life into his soul and literally transform him.<\/p>\n<p>Ann:Let me tell you: if you're trying to find life through your husband, you're trying in the wrong place to give you life. I think we say this\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Dave:That goes back to vertical.<\/p>\n<p>Ann:Yeah, I was going to say, \u201cWe say this over and over.\u201d I would say, as my testimony: \u201cIt is not Dave who fills me up. He's great; and sometimes, he's not. But it is not Dave who fills me up; it is Jesus.\u201d That's why I have to be in the Word every single day. I know this sounds weird; but when I'm in the Word, I have my eyes on the Father. If I'm not in the Word for three days in a row, they automatically drift toward Dave; they drift toward you; because I'm like: \u201cOh, why isn't he\u2026 or \u201cWhy does he\u2026\u201d; I automatically try to find my life through you. And it's just a habit; that's a bad habit. When we're not locked in with the Father, we're looking for other places to fill our soul.<\/p>\n<p>Dave:If we\u2019re not filled up by our relationship with Jesus\u2014again, I know it's easy to say\u2014it's work; it's like a workout. You got to put in the time and let Him fill you [or else] we become a drain in our marriage rather than a fountain.<\/p>\n<p>Ann:Yeah, that's good.<\/p>\n<p>Dave:How about that? I want to be a fountain that overflows the living water of Jesus in me to my spouse, rather than demanding from her or him that they meet my needs so that I can be happy. I'm already happy; I've found life in Christ\u2014that's what vertical is.<\/p>\n<p>Ann:\u2014totally.<\/p>\n<p>Dave:Go vertical, and He'll fill you; and then, you can pour out to serve and love your spouse.<\/p>\n<p>Dave:I hope you've enjoyed this conversation with my wife! We don't usually do this\u2014we usually interview, together, somebody else\u2014but it's been really fun.<\/p>\n<p>Ann:I do not like being in this scene.<\/p>\n<p>Dave:I know you don't like it; I can tell the whole time.<\/p>\n<p>Ann:I don't like talking about it; I don't like talking about myself. I'd rather ask somebody else questions.<\/p>\n<p>Dave:Well, here's the deal: I've got a couple more questions.<\/p>\n<p>Ann:Oh, no.<\/p>\n<p>Dave:And these are sort of special questions that we're going to reserve for our monthly partners. What's a monthly partner?\u2014somebody who financially supports FamilyLife on a monthly basis. We call them our partners, because we can't do this without you. If you want to become a monthly partner, go to FamilyLifeToday.com; you can click on the donate button there and become a partner with us. And if that's you, you get a special extra edition that we save just for our partners.<\/p>\n<p>FamilyLife Today is a donor-supported production of FamilyLife\u00ae, a Cru\u00ae Ministry.<\/p>\n<p>Helping you pursue the relationships that matter most.<\/p>\n<p>If you\u2019ve benefited from the FamilyLife Today transcripts, would you consider donating today to help defray the costs of producing them and making them available online?<\/p>\n<p>Copyright \u00a9 2025 FamilyLife. All rights reserved.<\/p>\n<p>www.FamilyLife.com<\/p>\n","theme_header_position":"Sticky","post_header_is_sticky":"default","is_header_overlay":"0"},"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast\/314640","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/podcast"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/47000"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=314640"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/312569"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=314640"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=314640"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=314640"},{"taxonomy":"podcast_series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast_series?post=314640"},{"taxonomy":"cwp_profile","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/cwp_profile?post=314640"},{"taxonomy":"series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/series?post=314640"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}