{"id":307468,"date":"2022-04-09T08:02:09","date_gmt":"2022-04-09T12:02:09","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/%series%\/catherine-parks-making-and-keeping-friends\/"},"modified":"2022-04-09T08:02:09","modified_gmt":"2022-04-09T12:02:09","slug":"catherine-parks-making-and-keeping-friends","status":"publish","type":"podcast","link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-this-week\/catherine-parks-making-and-keeping-friends\/","title":{"rendered":"Catherine Parks: Making and Keeping Friends"},"content":{"rendered":"","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>It&#8217;s easy to make friends in Kindergarten. It gets harder to maintain friendships once we&#8217;re out of school and in the &#8220;real world&#8221; but those key relationships are no less vital. Catherine Parks shares some tips for how to find, make, and keep quality friendships.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":91,"featured_media":0,"menu_order":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","template":"","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","inline_featured_image":false,"_uag_custom_page_level_css":"","episode_type":"","audio_file":"https:\/\/d2c17sq0nj1f7e.cloudfront.net\/flw2022-04-09.mp3","cover_image":"","cover_image_id":"","duration":"00:28:00","filesize":"25.63M","filesize_raw":"26874551","date_recorded":"","explicit":"","block":""},"categories":[2867,2810,2093],"tags":[2576,6606,6607,4388,6324],"podcast_series":[],"cwp_profile":[9517],"series":[10388],"class_list":["post-307468","podcast","type-podcast","status-publish","hentry","category-church-involvement","category-growing-spiritually","category-women","tag-authenticity","tag-building-friendships","tag-finding-friends","tag-relationships","tag-vulnerable","cwp_profile-catherine-parks","series-familylife-this-week"],"acf":[],"episode_featured_image":false,"episode_player_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2023\/10\/FLTW-Podcast-Cover-2-1400x1400-1-300x300-1.jpg","download_link":"https:\/\/dts.podtrac.com\/redirect.mp3\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-download\/307468\/catherine-parks-making-and-keeping-friends","player_link":"https:\/\/dts.podtrac.com\/redirect.mp3\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-player\/307468\/catherine-parks-making-and-keeping-friends","audio_player":null,"episode_data":{"playerMode":"light","subscribeUrls":{"apple_podcasts":{"key":"apple_podcasts","url":"","label":"Apple Podcasts","class":"apple_podcasts","icon":"apple-podcasts.png"},"google_podcasts":{"key":"google_podcasts","url":"","label":"Google Podcasts","class":"google_podcasts","icon":"google-podcasts.png"},"spotify":{"key":"spotify","url":"","label":"Spotify","class":"spotify","icon":"spotify.png"},"youtube":{"key":"youtube","url":"","label":"YouTube","class":"youtube","icon":"youtube.png"}},"rssFeedUrl":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/feed\/podcast\/familylife-this-week","embedCode":"<blockquote class=\"wp-embedded-content\" data-secret=\"9942KSCNzY\"><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-this-week\/catherine-parks-making-and-keeping-friends\/\">Catherine Parks: Making and Keeping Friends<\/a><\/blockquote><iframe sandbox=\"allow-scripts\" security=\"restricted\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-this-week\/catherine-parks-making-and-keeping-friends\/embed\/#?secret=9942KSCNzY\" width=\"500\" height=\"350\" title=\"&#8220;Catherine Parks: Making and Keeping Friends&#8221; &#8212; FamilyLife\u00ae - A Cru Ministry\" data-secret=\"9942KSCNzY\" frameborder=\"0\" marginwidth=\"0\" marginheight=\"0\" scrolling=\"no\" class=\"wp-embedded-content\"><\/iframe><script>\n\/*! This file is auto-generated *\/\n!function(d,l){\"use strict\";l.querySelector&&d.addEventListener&&\"undefined\"!=typeof URL&&(d.wp=d.wp||{},d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage||(d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage=function(e){var t=e.data;if((t||t.secret||t.message||t.value)&&!\/[^a-zA-Z0-9]\/.test(t.secret)){for(var s,r,n,a=l.querySelectorAll('iframe[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),o=l.querySelectorAll('blockquote[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),c=new RegExp(\"^https?:$\",\"i\"),i=0;i<o.length;i++)o[i].style.display=\"none\";for(i=0;i<a.length;i++)s=a[i],e.source===s.contentWindow&&(s.removeAttribute(\"style\"),\"height\"===t.message?(1e3<(r=parseInt(t.value,10))?r=1e3:~~r<200&&(r=200),s.height=r):\"link\"===t.message&&(r=new URL(s.getAttribute(\"src\")),n=new URL(t.value),c.test(n.protocol))&&n.host===r.host&&l.activeElement===s&&(d.top.location.href=t.value))}},d.addEventListener(\"message\",d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage,!1),l.addEventListener(\"DOMContentLoaded\",function(){for(var e,t,s=l.querySelectorAll(\"iframe.wp-embedded-content\"),r=0;r<s.length;r++)(t=(e=s[r]).getAttribute(\"data-secret\"))||(t=Math.random().toString(36).substring(2,12),e.src+=\"#?secret=\"+t,e.setAttribute(\"data-secret\",t)),e.contentWindow.postMessage({message:\"ready\",secret:t},\"*\")},!1)))}(window,document);\n\/\/# sourceURL=https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-includes\/js\/wp-embed.min.js\n<\/script>\n"},"spectra_custom_meta":{"_wp_page_template":["default"],"transcript_url":["https:\/\/transcript.familylife.com\/flw\/flw2022-04-09.pdf"],"audio_file":["https:\/\/d2c17sq0nj1f7e.cloudfront.net\/flw2022-04-09.mp3"],"transcript_content":["<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Have you ever lived through the frustration of fighting with a close friend? You know, that tug-of-war is difficult on your friendship and on your emotions. Author and speaker, Catherine Parks, says there\u2019s one thing we need to keep in mind.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Our battle is not against flesh and blood. The more that we can see each other as being on the same team\u2014and fighting this battle, together, against our sin and against the same enemy\u2014then we'll join with each other in praying. There's just this bond that forms, there, that's <em>really<\/em> unique. I don't think that you find that anywhere else.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> We\u2019re going to talk about how to build that bond of friendship on this edition of <em>FamilyLife This Week. <\/em>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWelcome to <em>FamilyLife This Week. <\/em>I\u2019m Michelle Hill. You know, I seem to be going through a season, right now, where friendships are a little bit harder to come by than they were 15 or 20 years ago. I\u2019m reminded of a good friend that has been a life-long friend. It was the <em>hardest<\/em> friendship to bond and forge together, yet it has been the most <em>rewarding<\/em> friendship.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tJust as I\u2019ve been going through this season, right now, of trying to build friendships that are similar and go deep\u2014like the one I had with Tanesa\u2014and we can\u2019t have our friendship as close anymore; because she lives in Alaska, and I live down in the southern United States. As I\u2019m trying to rebuild some friendships, I happened to meet a lovely lady by the name of Catherine Parks, who is an author and speaker. She <em>loves<\/em> to help women build friendships. She and I sat down, not too long ago, and had a <em>lovely<\/em>, warm conversation about friendships. I asked her point-blank: \u201cWhat is friendship? How do you be a friend?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t[Previous Interview]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes; I mean, I'm going to come at this from a distinctly Christian perspective; because I think God created us with a design that we need each other.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> We see that from Him, saying, \u201cIt's not good for Adam to be alone,\u201d and creating Eve. Then, all the way through [the Bible], the things that He gave His people to remember who He is were things that they were to do in community, all throughout the Old Testament. And then, in the New Testament, we see this design for His people and His church to live life together. You know, 1 John 1 talks about having fellowship with each other by walking in the light.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd so friendship is something that God has given us, as a gift, as we go through life together; to have friends\/people, who are walking alongside of us, who encourage us, and build us up and point us to Christ.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> And we have acquaintances and we have, you know, people that we know on a surface level; but I think <em>true<\/em> friends are people, who are there to walk alongside of us.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> You know, just as you\u2019re talking and laying all of that out, I kept thinking of the friendships in the Bible\u2014like Jonathan and David and Ruth and Naomi\u2014and you know, just those deep, deep friendships. And that's hard to find these days\u2014it feels like. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNow, who has been <em>your<\/em> true friend? Who has been someone to you, who has been able to encourage you, and pull you up, and spur you on?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes; I mean, I'm gifted\u2014with my husband and marriage\u2014to have him as a friend. I treasure that relationship; but sometimes, we need people outside, who can understand things in a different way than maybe a spouse or a family member. I have a friend named Amber, who I've been friends with for almost 14 years; and she's one of my dearest friends. We've, you know, walked through life together\u2014had our kids together\u2014and she knows me extremely well. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tOne of the things that God really did in our friendship\u2014we were probably friends for eight years before it really got past more of the surface things and went deeper as a friendship\u2014and that really came through her just patiently pursuing me. She would open up and share things that were going on in her life. Initially, my response was to try to fix them for her, which was not actually what she wanted. I learned that the hard way. You know, I thought, \u201cWell, why are you telling me this if you don't want me to tell you what to do?\u201d So just a little pro tip: \u201cThat's not usually what people want.\u201d [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> But what I learned is: \u201cShe's opening up, because she trusts me. She wants me to pray for her, and to hold her accountable, and to help her fight against these struggles that she's having.\u201d Her doing that with me gave me the freedom to, also, do that with her and to recognize: \u201cI have this ally\/this person who\u2019s in the ring with me. I need to use <em>her<\/em> and the friendship God has given us so that we can grow in sanctification and grow in godliness together.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> How hard was that?\u2014when, all of a sudden, she's pressing into <em>you<\/em>? That's a scary place to be. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> How was that for you?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes; I had another friend who was kind of doing similar things at the same time. I think it was sort of both of them the Lord used; but at first, when this other friend would ask me questions, she would say, like, \u201cHow's your heart?\u201d and ask very intentional questions. I thought that was really weird. [Laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tMy response was generally like, \u201cThings are fine.\u201d And it wasn't so much that I was hiding something; I just really wasn't paying attention to what was really going on in my life. What ended up happening with this friendship is\u2014I would be going to meet my friend; and I would know, \u201cShe's going to ask me these questions,\u201d\u2014so on the way, I would think, \u201cOh, I need to have something to say when she asks me!\u201d [Laughter] because she started to think that my life was perfect; and I didn't want her to think that. I started to pray, \u201cLord, show me what's going on so that I can give her an honest answer.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> I think it's beautiful, just that you can look back, and you have this 14-year friendship\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> \u2014with, you know, a close friend. We all are made so different. I mean, God just created all of us, just <em>different<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> We've got different personalities\u2014some are introverts\/some are extroverts\u2014and sometimes, it takes somebody, who just continues to pursue and pursue.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes; and I think\u2014you know, in institutional settings\u2014if we can create space for this, I think that's really important; because some people <em>aren't<\/em> going to ever feel comfortable being the pursuer; you know? I have a small group that I meet with on Saturday mornings; and we've just built some of these rhythms into our small group, where we open up with each other. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd it's actually taken some of the pressure off\u2014because there's something about creating the rhythm and the space for that\u2014and then knowing that it's coming and knowing that what we share with each other is going to stay there.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> I think that, many times, we don't realize the space that we need in order to open up.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Because I've heard\u2014at Bible studies or other places\u2014that, when women get together, we can be somewhat catty, or we can <em>fix<\/em>, or we tend to judge, or we tend to always go, maybe, one step further, when God is the God of <em>grace<\/em>. And sometimes, we don't tend to\u2014and I'm putting myself, all in, in this camp\u2014sometimes, we don't tend to give that grace.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> And that's what we <em>need<\/em> in friendships.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes; I think you're absolutely right. We have a tendency to either be judgmental and kind of\u2014you know, it's a pride issue\u2014where we validate ourselves by what we hear someone else is struggling with. But on the other side of things, we tend to think that we're giving grace, when we're actually <em>not<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tOne of the things I've noticed in my own life is: if someone confesses something to me, my temptation is to make excuses for her, and to say, \u201cYou know, that's not that big of a deal,\u201d or \u201cWell, I understand why you did that, because this person did this\u2026\u201d You know, you kind of minimize what she's sharing with me and make it not seem that bad. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhat the Lord really showed me is that, if someone comes to me and confesses something, that means that she's been convicted about it. If I stop her on her way to the cross and say, \u201cYou don't actually need to go there,\u201d then, not only am I denying her the sorrow\u2014like the godly sorrow\u2014that comes with confession of sin, but I'm also denying her the <em>joy <\/em>that comes with experiencing the forgiveness that she will find at the foot of the cross. I can say, \u201cGive yourself grace,\u201d but what I'm actually doing is denying you grace; because I'm not letting you <em>really<\/em> confess that and remind yourself: \u201cGod has forgiven you in Christ; and so I <em>know<\/em> this is a struggle, but He doesn't see you through the lens of that struggle.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> \u201cHe sees you through His Son.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt feels <em>awkward<\/em> to us to speak some of these things over each other; but it's really important that, you know, I get in the habit of doing things like that when someone confesses to me\u2014and not just saying: \u201cOh, it's okay. I'm sure it's not that big of a deal.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd so not denying each other grace by being judgmental but, also, not denying each other grace by minimizing what is really the struggle going on in our lives.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> And that's such a hard thing\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> \u2014to really press into where we feel like God is taking us, especially if we are to develop deeper friendships and relationships with others\u2014that takes <em>time<\/em>.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes, yes; and for some people, it <em>really<\/em> takes time; because they need to trust you. And you don't know what kind of baggage someone is bringing in. You know, a lot of us have been burned by friends. I think one of the things that we need to realize is: friendship is good and it's a gift, but it's not going to meet <em>all<\/em> of our needs; and it's not going to satisfy us, ultimately. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI'm just <em>so<\/em> comforted to know: \u201cJesus knows what it's like to be betrayed by a friend. He knows what it's like to be misunderstood by His closest friends. He knows what it's like to be abandoned by His friends.\u201d There's such sweet comfort in knowing He gets wherever you are right now\u2014whatever your relationships look like\/whatever they've looked like in the past\u2014He understands and knows what you're feeling. He's, ultimately, the friend who sticks closer than a brother. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIf you're looking to someone else to satisfy those deepest needs, you're just going to be disappointed; but if we can be secure in who He is and who He's made us to be, then, hopefully, we will look to <em>serve <\/em>other people in relationships and not just look for what we can get out of them.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Yes; that's a really good point; that's a good point.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe need to take a break; but when we come back, I want to talk to you about some of the practical-ness of how this plays out in our daily lives. So stay tuned. We\u2019ll be right back.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t[Radio Station Spot Break]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle: <\/strong>Welcome back. I'm talking with Catherine Parks. Today, we're talking about friendship. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe need to break this down, practically, for people; because you know, it's the weekend\u2014and we've got a mom, who is arm-deep in dishes or diapers; we've got a dad, who's working on the car\u2014or you know, maybe vice-versa.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> I don't know!\u2014maybe the dad is doing the dishes and the wife is working on the car, or what have you; but there are a <em>lot<\/em> of people, who are sitting there, going, \u201cI just want a friend.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> So, practically, if you're in a church, what are some of those steps that you can take in order to find that friend?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes; the first thing is absolutely just to pray. The Lord loves to honor the prayers of those who are looking for the community He designed us for. And so giving those expectations up to Him, and asking Him to bring that friend or those friends to your life, should be, absolutely, the first place to start.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd then, some of the friendships that I have started in the church nursery. There's something about serving alongside of someone\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> \u2014and having the opportunity to, you know, work\u2014hand in hand\/side by side\u2014that breaks down some of the awkward barriers that are there. You just have casual conversation. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThen, being willing to be the one to take initiative and say: \u201cHey, let's go get coffee,\u201d or \u201cWhy don't you guys come over to our house this weekend?\u201d The biggest thing is: just don't sit back and wait for it to happen. We need to be the ones to pursue those things and being willing to have the surface level conversation, like we talked about; because it may take a lot of those before someone else is comfortable enough to go deeper. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut even\u2014you know, one of the things that the Lord has done so much in my life is using prayer to bind my heart to someone else\u2014having the opportunity to pray for, you know, that person that you just met, and to have coffee with her, and then to keep praying for her, and to see what the Lord does, not only in her life through those prayers, but how He does things in your own heart and in your own life in uniting the two of you together and really giving that relationship up to Him as you're going through.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThat's one of the things\u2014is just being willing to put yourself out there, like we've talked about\u2014and then, engaging in opportunities that your church provides. You know, some churches have a lot of things already established, where you can go and meet people and engage, whether it's a Bible study or some kind of fellowship. And if they don't have one, go to your pastor and say: \u201cYou know, I think there's a need for this. Can I be involved in starting a Saturday morning group or a mom's fellowship?\u201d or you know, something that you see a need for and you want to be the one to start that process.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Okay; so you have a process started, or you have already invited a family over and you've gotten to know some people. What are some second steps? I think, sometimes, we can get caught up\u2014not just in the first part,\u2014 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> \u2014where we\u2019re like: \u201cOh; we had such a <em>great<\/em> evening,\u201d \u201cIt was a <em>wonderful<\/em> game night,\u201d \u201cI got to know these cool people!\u201d It's almost like that second meeting or that third meeting\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> \u2014those are just as hard.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes; one of the things that\u2014and maybe this is, you know, partly because I am more introverted and have less capacity, sometimes, for a lot of those meetings\u2014a follow-up text the next day or a couple days after, and just saying: \u201cI had a great time. How can I be praying for you this week?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd what that does is: it shows that person that you care about them, that you're still thinking about them, and that you want to know what's going on in their life, and you want to be involved in praying for them. And the Lord has used simple texts like that to really grow relationships very quickly; because usually, the other person will reciprocate that back. That's an easy opening for you to engage and then to say, you know, \u201cLet's get together again.\u201d And then, in that next meeting, it\u2019s the opportunity to say, \u201cSo how's this thing going?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> \u201cYou know, you mentioned this... I've been praying for you about that. What's going on with that?\u201d And that's a <em>great<\/em> way to go ahead and start taking the relationship deeper.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Yes; that's a really good point, because it is hard to figure out: \u201cWhere does texting come in? Where do phone calls come in?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Because we live in a day and time, where phone calls just don't happen anymore; but texts <em>do<\/em>.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> <em>But<\/em> sometimes you can read into the emojis or you can\/you\u2019re just like, \u201cWhat <em>really<\/em> is being said?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes; I'm a hater of the phone. [Laughter] I was joking with a friend, the other day: \u201cMy mom is the only person I like to talk to on the phone. If you call me, something is probably going to need to be on fire; because I'm just not a phone chatter.\u201d [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut one of the things I <em>love<\/em> is\u2014you know, apps like Voxer or Marco Polo\u2014are things that some of the friends that I have\u2014we use those a lot; because especially, you know, the opportunity to hear someone's <em>voice<\/em>, and to tell some of that inflection and what's going on.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Right\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> But not to have to\u2014because the truth is\u2014if I have to schedule a time to talk on the phone, things are going to happen; you know?\u2014especially, if you've got kids, or you've got a job, or you know, stuff comes up. I think that's one of the <em>beautiful<\/em> things, about where we are with technology, is having the capacity to have conversations on our own time in a way that can still lead to deeper relationships.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> And that's a good point about Marco Polo or some of those other apps that help us, you know, do that recorded image; and then, we can send it to our friend and then they can reciprocate.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Because I'm thinking of\u2014there was, several months ago, I had a really hard meeting one night\u2014and I <em>needed<\/em> to talk to somebody. I called a friend, and she didn't answer. And well, you know, I hit my head\/I was like: \u201cOf course! She doesn't like talking on the phone\u201d; and yet, it was like, \u201cBut I <em>need<\/em> someone.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Whereas when you <em>do<\/em>, sometimes, use those apps\u2014that will do a recording or something like that\u2014you can\/it sort of does help you, number one, get out what you needed help with or you need just a prayer request.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> And then it's still, face to face, in <em>some<\/em> ways.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes; I have a <em>very<\/em> close group of friends from college, but we graduated from college 14 years ago. We've lost contact over the years. Through Marco Polo, we're actually all on this group together; and that has been just this beautiful way for us to reconnect.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd there are some of the girls on there who don't have super-close friends in their lives, and some who do; but it's been a really unique way for us to stay in touch with each other and to ask for prayer. I think, you know, you may have a situation, where you think, \u201cI used to have this great friend, but now we don't ever talk.\u201d Reach out, you know, and see if you can rekindle an old friendship, too; because I think most of the time, people are open to that. They just need to be asked.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Yes; so Catherine, I want to move beyond technology a little bit. We talked about how to <em>be<\/em> a good friend. What are some of the things that we probably shouldn't say or shouldn't do? I mean, what would we consider a <em>bad<\/em> friend? I mean, I'm just thinking, \u201cThere are probably some bad habits that I have in my life,\u201d and what are some of those?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> I've had the problem, at times, of someone, might open up and talk to me about something; and I can very quickly say, \u201cOh, yeah!\u201d And it's good to kind of empathize with someone and say, \u201cYes; I've experienced that too.\u201d But then there's this impetus to take over the conversation, and be like: \u201cYes; I've struggled with that,\u201d\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> \u2014and \u201cLet me tell you all about it.\u201d This person came to me to open up, and ask for me to listen to <em>her<\/em> and to pray for <em>her<\/em>; and I've just turned the conversation to be all about <em>me<\/em>. I think, you know, I don't always realize that I'm doing it; and then, afterwards, I'm like, \u201cAhh!\u201d\u2014you know, the conviction sets in.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> It\u2019s that one-upmanship sort of thing.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes, yes; \u201cYou've got a problem, but listen to my problem!\u201d [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd so, just being aware of what our role is at certain times and putting in the work to really try to understand other people; because we all engage from the perspective of who we are\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> \u2014and what <em>our<\/em> preferences are. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tLike you're saying, you know, <em>you<\/em> needed to talk to somebody; she's not a phone person. Sometimes, I need to be the phone person for my friends, because that's who <em>they <\/em>are. You know, recognizing, \u201cSometimes, I need to set aside my own desires in order to be there for someone else.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut it takes work to know what that person needs from me and what their preferences are. You know, that doesn't mean that we totally check our own selves at the door; because we're in relationship with each other, because of the unique things about our personalities. And so we don't want to totally get rid of all of those things about ourselves. It needs to be a two-way street, but we do want to be careful about not just making a friendship about our own preferences and our own needs.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Yes; and that's hard; that's hard. And is that something that we should be talking about with our friends?\u2014and saying: \u201cOkay; so do you <em>need<\/em> me to call you?\u201d \u201cDo you <em>need<\/em> face-to-face time?\u201d or \u201cDo you need, you know, talk time?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Is that stuff that we need to be\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> I think we do! And the only reason I think that is because I have friends who do that for me. You know, I had a conversation with a friend\u2014that I've been close to for five years\u2014and just a couple weeks ago, we had a conversation that was <em>very<\/em> revealing to both of us about, you know, assumptions that we've been making about the other person\u2014and what she needed or what she enjoyed\u2014that were <em>wrong<\/em>.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou know, I was assuming a lot of things about her, based on who I was; and she was doing the same. We both realized, if we just had this conversation four years ago, then things could have been a lot easier in our friendship; you know? I need a little bit more time to plan ahead. I can't be spontaneous in the same way that she can; but she needs to understand that me saying, \u201cNo,\u201d doesn't mean, \u201cI don't want to hang out with you.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> It means, \u201cI can hang out with you tomorrow or in a couple of days; but not in five minutes\u201d; you know? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> And so I do think the more we can be clear and the less we can make assumptions about another person's motivations, the more healthy our friendships are going to be. I think that's a great question.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> That's a good point; that's a really good point. It got me to thinking about, you know, some of <em>my<\/em> friendships. I'm single, so I'm the spontaneous one.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> And I'm the one who says, \u201cHey, pack a bag!\u201d You know, \u201cLet's go hiking or whatever.\u201d And, you know, some of my mom friends are like, \u201cUm, I can't just do that.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI'm wondering, \u201cDo you have single friends?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes; I do. And you know, one of the things that I've realized is that is an area that I'm lacking in with sensitivity. It's easy for me to kind of fold my single friends into the rhythm of my family. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> It's harder for me to <em>leave<\/em> my family to be there for my friends\u2014and the recognition of that\u2014I mean, I think, a lot of times, they want to be with my family.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> But I also need to be there for <em>them<\/em> in their space, and in their environment, and in their world\u2014and not just make the assumption, \u201cOh, you'll just do whatever I want,\u201d\u2014you know?\u2014or \u201cYou\u2019ll do whatever we're doing.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHonestly, I mean, I'm sitting here, thinking: \u201cThat's probably a conversation I need to have with some of them!\u2014like: \u2018What is your preference?\u2019 and \u2018What would you need?\u2019 or \u2018What do you prefer in that situation?\u2019\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> And how did those friendships come about?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> A lot of them just through my local church. Our small group community is really robust, and so we have a small group that we meet with every week. We share a meal together every Wednesday night, and then study the Word together. And it's just the highlight of our week to be able to come together.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd then, several of those girls are the ones that are in the Saturday morning group that I talked about. That's the opportunity to, kind of, take those relationships even <em>deeper<\/em>. You know, one of my good friends, who's single is in those groups with me; and she is significantly younger than me. I just <em>love<\/em> her perspective, and she's one of the people that is very transparent\/very honest. That's an example to, you know, everyone else in our group. It\u2019s been a <em>huge<\/em> encouragement to us.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> That's really neat. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Catherine, thank you so much for joining me today and talking about friendship.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Thank you! It's been an honor.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t[Studio]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> What a fun, energizing conversation that was with Catherine Parks. You know, I hope you take some of her advice to heart. If you\u2019re struggling right now, and are like, \u201cI just want a friend,\u201d or \u201cI\u2019m longing to talk to somebody,\u201d\u2014you know, take some of Catherine\u2019s advice and remember the church: remember Bible study; remember being open and honest with other people; and sometimes, it\u2019s going to take <em>you<\/em> taking that first step.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tDo you remember, in the New Testament\u2014in Matthew and probably some of the other Gospels\u2014where Jesus is talking about the Greatest Commandment? He says, \u201cLove the Lord with all your heart, soul, and mind.\u201d Then He goes on and He talks about the second Greatest Commandment, which is \u201cLove your neighbor as yourself.\u201d Well, how do we do that?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNext week, on <em>FamilyLife This Week, <\/em>we\u2019re going to take a look at how to love others like Jesus did. It\u2019s going to be our special Easter edition of <em>FamilyLife This Week, <\/em>so make sure and tune in.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHey, thanks for listening! I <em>appreciate<\/em> you taking time out of your day. I also want to thank the President of FamilyLife<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>, David Robbins, who listens occasionally, I <em>think<\/em>; and our station partners around the country, who listen <em>all<\/em> the time. And a big \u201cThank you!\u201d to our engineer today, who <em>has<\/em> to listen to me\u2014Keith Lynch. Thanks to our producers, Marques Holt and Bruce Goff; they also have to listen to me. Justin Adams is our mastering engineer; and of course, he listens to me; and Megan Martin is our production coordinator, and she <em>gets to <\/em>listen to me. [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tOur program is a production of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>, and our mission is to effectively develop godly families who change the world one home at a time.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI'm Michelle Hill, inviting you to join us again next time for another edition of <em>FamilyLife This Week.<\/em>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright <sup>\u00a9<\/sup> 2019 FamilyLife. All rights reserved.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/\">www.FamilyLife.com<\/a>\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\n\t\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\t1\n\t\t\t\t<\/p>"],"_seopress_titles_title":[""],"_seopress_titles_desc":[""],"_seopress_robots_index":[""],"duration":["00:28:00"],"show_notes":[""],"filesize":["25.63M"],"filesize_raw":["26874551"],"_uag_css_file_name":["uag-css-307468.css"],"_uag_js_file_name":["uag-js-307468.js"],"_uag_page_assets":["a:9:{s:3:\"css\";s:82560:\".wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape-top svg{width: calc( 100% + 1.3px );}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape.uagb-container__shape-top .uagb-container__shape-fill{fill: rgba(51,51,51,1);}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape-bottom svg{width: calc( 100% + 1.3px );}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape.uagb-container__shape-bottom 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easy to make friends in Kindergarten. It gets harder to maintain friendships once we're out of school and in the \"real world\" but those key relationships are no less vital. Catherine Parks shares some tips for how to find, make, and keep quality friendships.","meta_box":{"show_notes":"","transcript_url":"https:\/\/transcript.familylife.com\/flw\/flw2022-04-09.pdf","transcript_content":"<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Have you ever lived through the frustration of fighting with a close friend? You know, that tug-of-war is difficult on your friendship and on your emotions. Author and speaker, Catherine Parks, says there\u2019s one thing we need to keep in mind.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Our battle is not against flesh and blood. The more that we can see each other as being on the same team\u2014and fighting this battle, together, against our sin and against the same enemy\u2014then we'll join with each other in praying. There's just this bond that forms, there, that's <em>really<\/em> unique. I don't think that you find that anywhere else.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> We\u2019re going to talk about how to build that bond of friendship on this edition of <em>FamilyLife This Week. <\/em>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWelcome to <em>FamilyLife This Week. <\/em>I\u2019m Michelle Hill. You know, I seem to be going through a season, right now, where friendships are a little bit harder to come by than they were 15 or 20 years ago. I\u2019m reminded of a good friend that has been a life-long friend. It was the <em>hardest<\/em> friendship to bond and forge together, yet it has been the most <em>rewarding<\/em> friendship.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tJust as I\u2019ve been going through this season, right now, of trying to build friendships that are similar and go deep\u2014like the one I had with Tanesa\u2014and we can\u2019t have our friendship as close anymore; because she lives in Alaska, and I live down in the southern United States. As I\u2019m trying to rebuild some friendships, I happened to meet a lovely lady by the name of Catherine Parks, who is an author and speaker. She <em>loves<\/em> to help women build friendships. She and I sat down, not too long ago, and had a <em>lovely<\/em>, warm conversation about friendships. I asked her point-blank: \u201cWhat is friendship? How do you be a friend?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t[Previous Interview]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes; I mean, I'm going to come at this from a distinctly Christian perspective; because I think God created us with a design that we need each other.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> We see that from Him, saying, \u201cIt's not good for Adam to be alone,\u201d and creating Eve. Then, all the way through [the Bible], the things that He gave His people to remember who He is were things that they were to do in community, all throughout the Old Testament. And then, in the New Testament, we see this design for His people and His church to live life together. You know, 1 John 1 talks about having fellowship with each other by walking in the light.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd so friendship is something that God has given us, as a gift, as we go through life together; to have friends\/people, who are walking alongside of us, who encourage us, and build us up and point us to Christ.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> And we have acquaintances and we have, you know, people that we know on a surface level; but I think <em>true<\/em> friends are people, who are there to walk alongside of us.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> You know, just as you\u2019re talking and laying all of that out, I kept thinking of the friendships in the Bible\u2014like Jonathan and David and Ruth and Naomi\u2014and you know, just those deep, deep friendships. And that's hard to find these days\u2014it feels like. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNow, who has been <em>your<\/em> true friend? Who has been someone to you, who has been able to encourage you, and pull you up, and spur you on?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes; I mean, I'm gifted\u2014with my husband and marriage\u2014to have him as a friend. I treasure that relationship; but sometimes, we need people outside, who can understand things in a different way than maybe a spouse or a family member. I have a friend named Amber, who I've been friends with for almost 14 years; and she's one of my dearest friends. We've, you know, walked through life together\u2014had our kids together\u2014and she knows me extremely well. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tOne of the things that God really did in our friendship\u2014we were probably friends for eight years before it really got past more of the surface things and went deeper as a friendship\u2014and that really came through her just patiently pursuing me. She would open up and share things that were going on in her life. Initially, my response was to try to fix them for her, which was not actually what she wanted. I learned that the hard way. You know, I thought, \u201cWell, why are you telling me this if you don't want me to tell you what to do?\u201d So just a little pro tip: \u201cThat's not usually what people want.\u201d [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> But what I learned is: \u201cShe's opening up, because she trusts me. She wants me to pray for her, and to hold her accountable, and to help her fight against these struggles that she's having.\u201d Her doing that with me gave me the freedom to, also, do that with her and to recognize: \u201cI have this ally\/this person who\u2019s in the ring with me. I need to use <em>her<\/em> and the friendship God has given us so that we can grow in sanctification and grow in godliness together.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> How hard was that?\u2014when, all of a sudden, she's pressing into <em>you<\/em>? That's a scary place to be. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> How was that for you?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes; I had another friend who was kind of doing similar things at the same time. I think it was sort of both of them the Lord used; but at first, when this other friend would ask me questions, she would say, like, \u201cHow's your heart?\u201d and ask very intentional questions. I thought that was really weird. [Laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tMy response was generally like, \u201cThings are fine.\u201d And it wasn't so much that I was hiding something; I just really wasn't paying attention to what was really going on in my life. What ended up happening with this friendship is\u2014I would be going to meet my friend; and I would know, \u201cShe's going to ask me these questions,\u201d\u2014so on the way, I would think, \u201cOh, I need to have something to say when she asks me!\u201d [Laughter] because she started to think that my life was perfect; and I didn't want her to think that. I started to pray, \u201cLord, show me what's going on so that I can give her an honest answer.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> I think it's beautiful, just that you can look back, and you have this 14-year friendship\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> \u2014with, you know, a close friend. We all are made so different. I mean, God just created all of us, just <em>different<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> We've got different personalities\u2014some are introverts\/some are extroverts\u2014and sometimes, it takes somebody, who just continues to pursue and pursue.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes; and I think\u2014you know, in institutional settings\u2014if we can create space for this, I think that's really important; because some people <em>aren't<\/em> going to ever feel comfortable being the pursuer; you know? I have a small group that I meet with on Saturday mornings; and we've just built some of these rhythms into our small group, where we open up with each other. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd it's actually taken some of the pressure off\u2014because there's something about creating the rhythm and the space for that\u2014and then knowing that it's coming and knowing that what we share with each other is going to stay there.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> I think that, many times, we don't realize the space that we need in order to open up.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Because I've heard\u2014at Bible studies or other places\u2014that, when women get together, we can be somewhat catty, or we can <em>fix<\/em>, or we tend to judge, or we tend to always go, maybe, one step further, when God is the God of <em>grace<\/em>. And sometimes, we don't tend to\u2014and I'm putting myself, all in, in this camp\u2014sometimes, we don't tend to give that grace.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> And that's what we <em>need<\/em> in friendships.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes; I think you're absolutely right. We have a tendency to either be judgmental and kind of\u2014you know, it's a pride issue\u2014where we validate ourselves by what we hear someone else is struggling with. But on the other side of things, we tend to think that we're giving grace, when we're actually <em>not<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tOne of the things I've noticed in my own life is: if someone confesses something to me, my temptation is to make excuses for her, and to say, \u201cYou know, that's not that big of a deal,\u201d or \u201cWell, I understand why you did that, because this person did this\u2026\u201d You know, you kind of minimize what she's sharing with me and make it not seem that bad. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhat the Lord really showed me is that, if someone comes to me and confesses something, that means that she's been convicted about it. If I stop her on her way to the cross and say, \u201cYou don't actually need to go there,\u201d then, not only am I denying her the sorrow\u2014like the godly sorrow\u2014that comes with confession of sin, but I'm also denying her the <em>joy <\/em>that comes with experiencing the forgiveness that she will find at the foot of the cross. I can say, \u201cGive yourself grace,\u201d but what I'm actually doing is denying you grace; because I'm not letting you <em>really<\/em> confess that and remind yourself: \u201cGod has forgiven you in Christ; and so I <em>know<\/em> this is a struggle, but He doesn't see you through the lens of that struggle.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> \u201cHe sees you through His Son.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt feels <em>awkward<\/em> to us to speak some of these things over each other; but it's really important that, you know, I get in the habit of doing things like that when someone confesses to me\u2014and not just saying: \u201cOh, it's okay. I'm sure it's not that big of a deal.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd so not denying each other grace by being judgmental but, also, not denying each other grace by minimizing what is really the struggle going on in our lives.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> And that's such a hard thing\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> \u2014to really press into where we feel like God is taking us, especially if we are to develop deeper friendships and relationships with others\u2014that takes <em>time<\/em>.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes, yes; and for some people, it <em>really<\/em> takes time; because they need to trust you. And you don't know what kind of baggage someone is bringing in. You know, a lot of us have been burned by friends. I think one of the things that we need to realize is: friendship is good and it's a gift, but it's not going to meet <em>all<\/em> of our needs; and it's not going to satisfy us, ultimately. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI'm just <em>so<\/em> comforted to know: \u201cJesus knows what it's like to be betrayed by a friend. He knows what it's like to be misunderstood by His closest friends. He knows what it's like to be abandoned by His friends.\u201d There's such sweet comfort in knowing He gets wherever you are right now\u2014whatever your relationships look like\/whatever they've looked like in the past\u2014He understands and knows what you're feeling. He's, ultimately, the friend who sticks closer than a brother. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIf you're looking to someone else to satisfy those deepest needs, you're just going to be disappointed; but if we can be secure in who He is and who He's made us to be, then, hopefully, we will look to <em>serve <\/em>other people in relationships and not just look for what we can get out of them.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Yes; that's a really good point; that's a good point.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe need to take a break; but when we come back, I want to talk to you about some of the practical-ness of how this plays out in our daily lives. So stay tuned. We\u2019ll be right back.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t[Radio Station Spot Break]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle: <\/strong>Welcome back. I'm talking with Catherine Parks. Today, we're talking about friendship. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe need to break this down, practically, for people; because you know, it's the weekend\u2014and we've got a mom, who is arm-deep in dishes or diapers; we've got a dad, who's working on the car\u2014or you know, maybe vice-versa.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> I don't know!\u2014maybe the dad is doing the dishes and the wife is working on the car, or what have you; but there are a <em>lot<\/em> of people, who are sitting there, going, \u201cI just want a friend.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> So, practically, if you're in a church, what are some of those steps that you can take in order to find that friend?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes; the first thing is absolutely just to pray. The Lord loves to honor the prayers of those who are looking for the community He designed us for. And so giving those expectations up to Him, and asking Him to bring that friend or those friends to your life, should be, absolutely, the first place to start.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd then, some of the friendships that I have started in the church nursery. There's something about serving alongside of someone\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> \u2014and having the opportunity to, you know, work\u2014hand in hand\/side by side\u2014that breaks down some of the awkward barriers that are there. You just have casual conversation. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThen, being willing to be the one to take initiative and say: \u201cHey, let's go get coffee,\u201d or \u201cWhy don't you guys come over to our house this weekend?\u201d The biggest thing is: just don't sit back and wait for it to happen. We need to be the ones to pursue those things and being willing to have the surface level conversation, like we talked about; because it may take a lot of those before someone else is comfortable enough to go deeper. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut even\u2014you know, one of the things that the Lord has done so much in my life is using prayer to bind my heart to someone else\u2014having the opportunity to pray for, you know, that person that you just met, and to have coffee with her, and then to keep praying for her, and to see what the Lord does, not only in her life through those prayers, but how He does things in your own heart and in your own life in uniting the two of you together and really giving that relationship up to Him as you're going through.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThat's one of the things\u2014is just being willing to put yourself out there, like we've talked about\u2014and then, engaging in opportunities that your church provides. You know, some churches have a lot of things already established, where you can go and meet people and engage, whether it's a Bible study or some kind of fellowship. And if they don't have one, go to your pastor and say: \u201cYou know, I think there's a need for this. Can I be involved in starting a Saturday morning group or a mom's fellowship?\u201d or you know, something that you see a need for and you want to be the one to start that process.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Okay; so you have a process started, or you have already invited a family over and you've gotten to know some people. What are some second steps? I think, sometimes, we can get caught up\u2014not just in the first part,\u2014 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> \u2014where we\u2019re like: \u201cOh; we had such a <em>great<\/em> evening,\u201d \u201cIt was a <em>wonderful<\/em> game night,\u201d \u201cI got to know these cool people!\u201d It's almost like that second meeting or that third meeting\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> \u2014those are just as hard.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes; one of the things that\u2014and maybe this is, you know, partly because I am more introverted and have less capacity, sometimes, for a lot of those meetings\u2014a follow-up text the next day or a couple days after, and just saying: \u201cI had a great time. How can I be praying for you this week?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd what that does is: it shows that person that you care about them, that you're still thinking about them, and that you want to know what's going on in their life, and you want to be involved in praying for them. And the Lord has used simple texts like that to really grow relationships very quickly; because usually, the other person will reciprocate that back. That's an easy opening for you to engage and then to say, you know, \u201cLet's get together again.\u201d And then, in that next meeting, it\u2019s the opportunity to say, \u201cSo how's this thing going?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> \u201cYou know, you mentioned this... I've been praying for you about that. What's going on with that?\u201d And that's a <em>great<\/em> way to go ahead and start taking the relationship deeper.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Yes; that's a really good point, because it is hard to figure out: \u201cWhere does texting come in? Where do phone calls come in?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Because we live in a day and time, where phone calls just don't happen anymore; but texts <em>do<\/em>.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> <em>But<\/em> sometimes you can read into the emojis or you can\/you\u2019re just like, \u201cWhat <em>really<\/em> is being said?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes; I'm a hater of the phone. [Laughter] I was joking with a friend, the other day: \u201cMy mom is the only person I like to talk to on the phone. If you call me, something is probably going to need to be on fire; because I'm just not a phone chatter.\u201d [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut one of the things I <em>love<\/em> is\u2014you know, apps like Voxer or Marco Polo\u2014are things that some of the friends that I have\u2014we use those a lot; because especially, you know, the opportunity to hear someone's <em>voice<\/em>, and to tell some of that inflection and what's going on.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Right\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> But not to have to\u2014because the truth is\u2014if I have to schedule a time to talk on the phone, things are going to happen; you know?\u2014especially, if you've got kids, or you've got a job, or you know, stuff comes up. I think that's one of the <em>beautiful<\/em> things, about where we are with technology, is having the capacity to have conversations on our own time in a way that can still lead to deeper relationships.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> And that's a good point about Marco Polo or some of those other apps that help us, you know, do that recorded image; and then, we can send it to our friend and then they can reciprocate.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Because I'm thinking of\u2014there was, several months ago, I had a really hard meeting one night\u2014and I <em>needed<\/em> to talk to somebody. I called a friend, and she didn't answer. And well, you know, I hit my head\/I was like: \u201cOf course! She doesn't like talking on the phone\u201d; and yet, it was like, \u201cBut I <em>need<\/em> someone.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Whereas when you <em>do<\/em>, sometimes, use those apps\u2014that will do a recording or something like that\u2014you can\/it sort of does help you, number one, get out what you needed help with or you need just a prayer request.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> And then it's still, face to face, in <em>some<\/em> ways.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes; I have a <em>very<\/em> close group of friends from college, but we graduated from college 14 years ago. We've lost contact over the years. Through Marco Polo, we're actually all on this group together; and that has been just this beautiful way for us to reconnect.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd there are some of the girls on there who don't have super-close friends in their lives, and some who do; but it's been a really unique way for us to stay in touch with each other and to ask for prayer. I think, you know, you may have a situation, where you think, \u201cI used to have this great friend, but now we don't ever talk.\u201d Reach out, you know, and see if you can rekindle an old friendship, too; because I think most of the time, people are open to that. They just need to be asked.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Yes; so Catherine, I want to move beyond technology a little bit. We talked about how to <em>be<\/em> a good friend. What are some of the things that we probably shouldn't say or shouldn't do? I mean, what would we consider a <em>bad<\/em> friend? I mean, I'm just thinking, \u201cThere are probably some bad habits that I have in my life,\u201d and what are some of those?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> I've had the problem, at times, of someone, might open up and talk to me about something; and I can very quickly say, \u201cOh, yeah!\u201d And it's good to kind of empathize with someone and say, \u201cYes; I've experienced that too.\u201d But then there's this impetus to take over the conversation, and be like: \u201cYes; I've struggled with that,\u201d\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> \u2014and \u201cLet me tell you all about it.\u201d This person came to me to open up, and ask for me to listen to <em>her<\/em> and to pray for <em>her<\/em>; and I've just turned the conversation to be all about <em>me<\/em>. I think, you know, I don't always realize that I'm doing it; and then, afterwards, I'm like, \u201cAhh!\u201d\u2014you know, the conviction sets in.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> It\u2019s that one-upmanship sort of thing.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes, yes; \u201cYou've got a problem, but listen to my problem!\u201d [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd so, just being aware of what our role is at certain times and putting in the work to really try to understand other people; because we all engage from the perspective of who we are\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> \u2014and what <em>our<\/em> preferences are. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tLike you're saying, you know, <em>you<\/em> needed to talk to somebody; she's not a phone person. Sometimes, I need to be the phone person for my friends, because that's who <em>they <\/em>are. You know, recognizing, \u201cSometimes, I need to set aside my own desires in order to be there for someone else.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut it takes work to know what that person needs from me and what their preferences are. You know, that doesn't mean that we totally check our own selves at the door; because we're in relationship with each other, because of the unique things about our personalities. And so we don't want to totally get rid of all of those things about ourselves. It needs to be a two-way street, but we do want to be careful about not just making a friendship about our own preferences and our own needs.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Yes; and that's hard; that's hard. And is that something that we should be talking about with our friends?\u2014and saying: \u201cOkay; so do you <em>need<\/em> me to call you?\u201d \u201cDo you <em>need<\/em> face-to-face time?\u201d or \u201cDo you need, you know, talk time?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Is that stuff that we need to be\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> I think we do! And the only reason I think that is because I have friends who do that for me. You know, I had a conversation with a friend\u2014that I've been close to for five years\u2014and just a couple weeks ago, we had a conversation that was <em>very<\/em> revealing to both of us about, you know, assumptions that we've been making about the other person\u2014and what she needed or what she enjoyed\u2014that were <em>wrong<\/em>.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou know, I was assuming a lot of things about her, based on who I was; and she was doing the same. We both realized, if we just had this conversation four years ago, then things could have been a lot easier in our friendship; you know? I need a little bit more time to plan ahead. I can't be spontaneous in the same way that she can; but she needs to understand that me saying, \u201cNo,\u201d doesn't mean, \u201cI don't want to hang out with you.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> It means, \u201cI can hang out with you tomorrow or in a couple of days; but not in five minutes\u201d; you know? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> And so I do think the more we can be clear and the less we can make assumptions about another person's motivations, the more healthy our friendships are going to be. I think that's a great question.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> That's a good point; that's a really good point. It got me to thinking about, you know, some of <em>my<\/em> friendships. I'm single, so I'm the spontaneous one.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> And I'm the one who says, \u201cHey, pack a bag!\u201d You know, \u201cLet's go hiking or whatever.\u201d And, you know, some of my mom friends are like, \u201cUm, I can't just do that.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI'm wondering, \u201cDo you have single friends?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes; I do. And you know, one of the things that I've realized is that is an area that I'm lacking in with sensitivity. It's easy for me to kind of fold my single friends into the rhythm of my family. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> It's harder for me to <em>leave<\/em> my family to be there for my friends\u2014and the recognition of that\u2014I mean, I think, a lot of times, they want to be with my family.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> But I also need to be there for <em>them<\/em> in their space, and in their environment, and in their world\u2014and not just make the assumption, \u201cOh, you'll just do whatever I want,\u201d\u2014you know?\u2014or \u201cYou\u2019ll do whatever we're doing.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHonestly, I mean, I'm sitting here, thinking: \u201cThat's probably a conversation I need to have with some of them!\u2014like: \u2018What is your preference?\u2019 and \u2018What would you need?\u2019 or \u2018What do you prefer in that situation?\u2019\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> And how did those friendships come about?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> A lot of them just through my local church. Our small group community is really robust, and so we have a small group that we meet with every week. We share a meal together every Wednesday night, and then study the Word together. And it's just the highlight of our week to be able to come together.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd then, several of those girls are the ones that are in the Saturday morning group that I talked about. That's the opportunity to, kind of, take those relationships even <em>deeper<\/em>. You know, one of my good friends, who's single is in those groups with me; and she is significantly younger than me. I just <em>love<\/em> her perspective, and she's one of the people that is very transparent\/very honest. That's an example to, you know, everyone else in our group. It\u2019s been a <em>huge<\/em> encouragement to us.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> That's really neat. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Catherine, thank you so much for joining me today and talking about friendship.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Catherine:<\/strong> Thank you! It's been an honor.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t[Studio]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Michelle:<\/strong> What a fun, energizing conversation that was with Catherine Parks. You know, I hope you take some of her advice to heart. If you\u2019re struggling right now, and are like, \u201cI just want a friend,\u201d or \u201cI\u2019m longing to talk to somebody,\u201d\u2014you know, take some of Catherine\u2019s advice and remember the church: remember Bible study; remember being open and honest with other people; and sometimes, it\u2019s going to take <em>you<\/em> taking that first step.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tDo you remember, in the New Testament\u2014in Matthew and probably some of the other Gospels\u2014where Jesus is talking about the Greatest Commandment? He says, \u201cLove the Lord with all your heart, soul, and mind.\u201d Then He goes on and He talks about the second Greatest Commandment, which is \u201cLove your neighbor as yourself.\u201d Well, how do we do that?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNext week, on <em>FamilyLife This Week, <\/em>we\u2019re going to take a look at how to love others like Jesus did. It\u2019s going to be our special Easter edition of <em>FamilyLife This Week, <\/em>so make sure and tune in.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHey, thanks for listening! I <em>appreciate<\/em> you taking time out of your day. I also want to thank the President of FamilyLife<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>, David Robbins, who listens occasionally, I <em>think<\/em>; and our station partners around the country, who listen <em>all<\/em> the time. And a big \u201cThank you!\u201d to our engineer today, who <em>has<\/em> to listen to me\u2014Keith Lynch. Thanks to our producers, Marques Holt and Bruce Goff; they also have to listen to me. Justin Adams is our mastering engineer; and of course, he listens to me; and Megan Martin is our production coordinator, and she <em>gets to <\/em>listen to me. [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tOur program is a production of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>, and our mission is to effectively develop godly families who change the world one home at a time.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI'm Michelle Hill, inviting you to join us again next time for another edition of <em>FamilyLife This Week.<\/em>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright <sup>\u00a9<\/sup> 2019 FamilyLife. 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