{"id":307453,"date":"2022-03-31T08:02:09","date_gmt":"2022-03-31T12:02:09","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/%series%\/reimagine-retirement\/"},"modified":"2022-03-31T08:02:09","modified_gmt":"2022-03-31T12:02:09","slug":"reimagine-retirement","status":"publish","type":"podcast","link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/reimagine-retirement\/","title":{"rendered":"Reimagine Retirement"},"content":{"rendered":"","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>What&#8217;s God&#8217;s idea about retirement? Author CJ Cagle help us construct a vision of retirement reflecting His values, priorities, and purposes.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":91,"featured_media":294104,"menu_order":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","template":"","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","inline_featured_image":false,"_uag_custom_page_level_css":"","episode_type":"","audio_file":"https:\/\/mp3.familylife.com\/fl2022-03-31.mp3","podmotor_file_id":"","podmotor_episode_id":"","cover_image":"","cover_image_id":"","duration":"00:25:05","filesize":"22.97M","filesize_raw":"24082258","date_recorded":"","explicit":"","block":""},"categories":[2822],"tags":[7064],"podcast_series":[],"cwp_profile":[9767],"series":[2101],"class_list":["post-307453","podcast","type-podcast","status-publish","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-growing-in-your-faith","tag-reimagine-retirement","cwp_profile-cj-cagle","series-familylife-today"],"acf":[],"episode_featured_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/09\/FLT-Podcast-Cover-2-508x508-3.jpg?w=508","episode_player_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2023\/02\/image-scaled.jpg","download_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-download\/307453\/reimagine-retirement","player_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-player\/307453\/reimagine-retirement","audio_player":null,"episode_data":{"playerMode":"light","subscribeUrls":{"apple_podcasts":{"key":"apple_podcasts","url":"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303?mt=2&app=podcast","label":"Apple Podcasts","class":"apple_podcasts","icon":"apple-podcasts.png"},"google_podcasts":{"key":"google_podcasts","url":"","label":"Google Podcasts","class":"google_podcasts","icon":"google-podcasts.png"},"spotify":{"key":"spotify","url":"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm","label":"Spotify","class":"spotify","icon":"spotify.png"},"youtube":{"key":"youtube","url":"","label":"YouTube","class":"youtube","icon":"youtube.png"}},"rssFeedUrl":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/feed\/podcast\/familylife-today","embedCode":"<blockquote class=\"wp-embedded-content\" data-secret=\"clLt6KrnKe\"><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/reimagine-retirement\/\">Reimagine Retirement<\/a><\/blockquote><iframe sandbox=\"allow-scripts\" security=\"restricted\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/reimagine-retirement\/embed\/#?secret=clLt6KrnKe\" width=\"500\" height=\"350\" title=\"&#8220;Reimagine Retirement&#8221; &#8212; FamilyLife\u00ae - A Cru Ministry\" data-secret=\"clLt6KrnKe\" frameborder=\"0\" marginwidth=\"0\" marginheight=\"0\" scrolling=\"no\" class=\"wp-embedded-content\"><\/iframe><script>\n\/*! This file is auto-generated *\/\n!function(d,l){\"use strict\";l.querySelector&&d.addEventListener&&\"undefined\"!=typeof URL&&(d.wp=d.wp||{},d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage||(d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage=function(e){var t=e.data;if((t||t.secret||t.message||t.value)&&!\/[^a-zA-Z0-9]\/.test(t.secret)){for(var s,r,n,a=l.querySelectorAll('iframe[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),o=l.querySelectorAll('blockquote[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),c=new RegExp(\"^https?:$\",\"i\"),i=0;i<o.length;i++)o[i].style.display=\"none\";for(i=0;i<a.length;i++)s=a[i],e.source===s.contentWindow&&(s.removeAttribute(\"style\"),\"height\"===t.message?(1e3<(r=parseInt(t.value,10))?r=1e3:~~r<200&&(r=200),s.height=r):\"link\"===t.message&&(r=new URL(s.getAttribute(\"src\")),n=new URL(t.value),c.test(n.protocol))&&n.host===r.host&&l.activeElement===s&&(d.top.location.href=t.value))}},d.addEventListener(\"message\",d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage,!1),l.addEventListener(\"DOMContentLoaded\",function(){for(var e,t,s=l.querySelectorAll(\"iframe.wp-embedded-content\"),r=0;r<s.length;r++)(t=(e=s[r]).getAttribute(\"data-secret\"))||(t=Math.random().toString(36).substring(2,12),e.src+=\"#?secret=\"+t,e.setAttribute(\"data-secret\",t)),e.contentWindow.postMessage({message:\"ready\",secret:t},\"*\")},!1)))}(window,document);\n\/\/# sourceURL=https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-includes\/js\/wp-embed.min.js\n<\/script>\n"},"uagb_featured_image_src":{"full":["https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/09\/FLT-Podcast-Cover-2-508x508-3.jpg",508,508,false]},"uagb_author_info":{"display_name":"kfairris@familylife.com","author_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/author\/kfairrisfamilylife-com\/"},"uagb_comment_info":0,"uagb_excerpt":"What's God's idea about retirement? Author CJ Cagle help us construct a vision of retirement reflecting His values, priorities, and purposes.","meta_box":{"show_notes":"","transcript_url":"https:\/\/transcript.familylife.com\/fl2022-03-31.pdf","transcript_content":"<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> So here is a stat you don\u2019t hear every day. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Okay. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> It\u2019s a stat you <em>should<\/em> hear every day; it\u2019s a <em>really<\/em> important stat. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Oh, no. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Are you ready? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> You are going to teach me something right now; aren\u2019t you? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> You\u2019re going to like this, I think. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>Okay.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>A third of people have <em>nothing<\/em> saved for retirement, financially. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> One-third. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Well, a little less than a third\u201433 percent\u2014have nothing saved for retirement. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> That\u2019s depressing. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Here is the question: \u201cHow much do we have saved for retirement?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> More than that! [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> More than zero?! \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> More than zero! \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I hope we are more than zero. [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Ann:<\/strong> We win! \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWelcome to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>, where we want to help you pursue the relationships that matter most. I\u2019m Ann Wilson.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> And I\u2019m Dave Wilson, and you can find us at FamilyLifeToday.com or on our FamilyLife<sup>\u00ae<\/sup> app.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> This is <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> The funny thing is you have <em>no<\/em> idea. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I kind of do. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Do you?! \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I have a little bit of an idea. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> You\u2019ve been looking at the balance sheets? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I don\u2019t look at it, but I hear our financial guy every two years talk about it. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Every two years; it\u2019s like every six months now. [Laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnyway, the reason we are talking about this, which <em>we\u2019ve never<\/em> talked about on <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>;\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u2014not with <em>us<\/em> being the hosts. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u2014this is an important topic. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe have Chris Cagle with us today, who really\u2014Chris, welcome to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>, first of all\u2014thanks for being here. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> Thank you; great to be here. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I mean, you have spent your life sort of thinking about this\u2014wrote a book, obviously\u2014we are going to talk about it: <em>Reimagine Retirement<\/em>. But this wasn\u2019t like your life\u2019s work; you worked in IT most of your life; right? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> I did. IT mainly in the financial services industry. I even spent about ten years working in social work in the juvenile court system, right here in Florida, as a matter of fact. So yes, not a professional finance guy. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> So how did you get into this? I mean, we read your book\u2014and our audience is going to love this conversation\u2014because it is so\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u2014helpful. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> You know better than anybody how <em>critical<\/em> this conversation is. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I\u2019m going to say, too, this is helpful for every stage of life that you are in. If you are younger, don\u2019t think, \u201cI don\u2019t need to think about this.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u201cOh, I wish I had been\u2026\u201d Seriously, I wish I had been thinking, and learning, and making decisions when I was 20\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> Right; right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u2014not just when I\u2019m 60. So yes, Ann, this is so critical.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHow did you get into this? This isn\u2019t your life work. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> Yes, pretty simple actually; just got involved in the financial stewardship\/financial coaching\/counseling ministry in my local church. I kind of gravitated a little bit, first, for my own personal needs in terms of planning my future and working out my own stewardship plan with my own family and, then, just a desire to help others. That led to seeing the need. I started a blog, and the blog kind of led to the opportunity to write the book for B&amp;H. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> But you\u2019ve also been married for almost\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> \u201450 years. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u201450 years; yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> It will be 50 years next year. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Congrats! \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> Yes; thank you. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> That\u2019s pretty cool. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Well, help us start this conversation. How should we start thinking\u2014I\u2019m not going to say \u201cstart\u201d because, hopefully, we have been thinking about retirement\u2014but how should we think about this? You call it \u201creimagine retirement.\u201d Explain what that means. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> Right; yes. The reimagine concept comes from this notion that all of us, really, regardless of our age in this current culture, are bombarded with kind of a worldly view of retirement: work long, work hard, save as much as you can, and then retire to a life of just doing whatever you want to do\u2014leisure, recreation\u2014we see pictures of people on the sea shore, people on the golf course, people on the tennis courts. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Hey, we\u2019re here in Florida. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> And Florida is\u2014yes, it\u2019s kind of the Mecca\u2014The Villages\/the largest incorporated retirement center in the world, I guess; I\u2019m not sure. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> We drove through The Villages not too long ago. I was actually looking for a motorcycle on Facebook<sup>\u00ae<\/sup> Marketplace, and we ended up down there. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I had <em>never<\/em> seen <em>more<\/em> golf carts in my life in one place. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Golf carts everywhere. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> Right, which is probably a good thing once you get about 80\/maybe, 90. Maybe driving golf carts, instead of motor vehicles, might be a good idea; I\u2019m not sure. [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Safer; save a lot of gas money. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> But in some ways, as we drove in there, there was this thought of: \u201cThis is the vision.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u2014\u201cthat most Americans have.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I\u2019m not saying there is anything wrong or right about it; it was just, as you drove into it, you thought, \u201cThat\u2019s what retirement looks like.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> I think there is this constant pressure to: \u201cHow can we amass enough wealth and do all of these things in order to create heaven on earth for ourselves?\u201d You know, God doesn\u2019t promise us heaven on earth. <em>He<\/em> promises us heaven in eternity. Actually, He tells us that life is going to be full of trials and tribulations; but that doesn\u2019t mean we can\u2019t enjoy things on this earth\u2014and certainly living in a nice community, or having a pool to go to, or a tennis court to play tennis on\u2014taking the occasional trip is not a bad thing. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut in <em>Reimagine Retirement<\/em>, I\u2019m trying to kind of recast that or ask my readers to reimagine what retirement would look like, based on a God-centered, Christ-exalting, God-honoring and glorifying view of retirement that would be informed by Scripture. That\u2019s really what my goal was. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Okay, so teach us. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> What is that?\u2014yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> What would that look like? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> It\u2019s based on the principle of stewardship: that we were created by God\/created in God\u2019s image; we belong to Him; and that everything we have actually belongs to Him\/also belongs to Him, and that we kind of been given these things to steward on His behalf. Our mission, as Christians\/as believers, is to live our lives for Him\u2014to glorify Him, to serve others\u2014for the furtherance of God\u2019s kingdom on this earth for as long as we live. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThere is not a hard-stop at 65, or 70, or 75. The vision here is that, God willing, as He enables us and gives us the gifts and ability and resources to do so, we continue to live our lives for Him as long as we can, knowing that that will look different for someone who is 70 than someone who is 30; right? I\u2019m not doing the same things now in my local church that I was doing, now at 70, that I did at 30; but I\u2019m doing a lot of the same things. I was teaching in children\u2019s ministry when I was 30; I\u2019m teaching in children\u2019s ministry when I\u2019m 70. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAs a matter of fact, I have a little girl in my class today\/right now\u2014her first name is Allie\u2014I taught Allie\u2019s <em>mother<\/em> in children\u2019s ministry. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Ann:<\/strong> Wow. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> To me, there is nothing more glorious than that\/more fulfilling than that for me personally: to know that I, not only had the opportunity to impact her mother\u2019s life in a small way as a Sunday school teacher, but now, I have her daughter in my class. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> It\u2019s legacy; yes, that\u2019s amazing. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> Those are the kinds of things God has called me to do, and I think He has called older people to do. I\u2019m almost 70\u2014I don\u2019t know how long I\u2019m going to be able to do that\u2014but I\u2019m going to do it while it\u2019s today and while God gives me the ability to do so. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> So is it the right perspective\/is it God\u2019s perspective to have the thought that: \u201cI will <em>never<\/em> retire\u201d? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> Yes, it\u2019s kind of a trick question\u2014[Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> \u2014kind of a little nuance\/there is a lot more nuance here than we sometimes imagine; it\u2019s not a black-and-white thing. The world\u2019s retirement is: I stop working for pay, and I go on vacation for the rest of my life. The Bible gives us the freedom to stop working for pay\u2014there is nothing in Scripture that prohibits that\u2014what the Bible doesn\u2019t seem to give us the liberty to do, in Christ, is to not live for Jesus for the rest of our lives. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tPart of mapping out a retirement\/imagining a retirement\u2014why the subtitle on the book is <em>Planning and Living for the Glory of God<\/em>\u2014is to plan out that last phase of life in terms of what it might look like: \u201cHow am I going to serve Jesus more?\u201d If I have the resources to be able to stop working fulltime\u2014and don\u2019t have to work for pay; meaning, that I relieve that pressure and I have more time\u2014\u201cHow can I use those gifts\u201d\u2014and they truly are gifts from God\u2014\u201cto serve Him more, serve others more, and glorify Him?\u201d\u2014while at the same time, playing a game of tennis, going to the pool, going to the beach, playing with grandkids. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI like to hike and fish\u2014I do it whenever I can\u2014but if <em>all<\/em> I ever did was go hiking and fishing, I\u2019d get pretty bored. God created me to do things, to make things, to work. The book, for me, is an example of that. You know, I would say to your audience out there: \u201cIf there is somebody out there\/if you\u2019ve thought about writing a book, go write a book. If you think it is going to serve people, and lead people to Christ, and lead people to a God-glorifying kind of view of something, then write about it. Share your life in that way. You can do it.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> One of the things that we thought in our 20s, and when we were starting in our first career\u2014which is <em>still<\/em> our career: ministry\u2014one of things I said from the pulpit, as I started our church 30 years ago, is: \u201cWe will <em>never<\/em> retire,\u201d which in some ways was your perspective, like, \u201cWe\u2019re never going to stop working for the glory of God; it will look different.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut here\u2019s another part of that\u2014that was a <em>bad<\/em> part of that\u2014was: \u201cWe don\u2019t need to save money. We\u2019re going to be working until the very end; so you know, obviously, save a little bit; but you don\u2019t really need to be concerned, because there won\u2019t come a day where you\u2019re just going to have to live off of what you\u2019ve saved.\u201d That was not good wisdom. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I want <em>you<\/em> to talk about that, because you are much wiser about these things than me. If you had a 20-year-old, or a 25-year-old, or even a 30-year-old\u2014and by the way, they are listening right now to you\u2014talk to them about that thought of: \u201cWhat should they be doing, as a younger person,\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u2014\u201cfinancially\u201d? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u2014\u201cfinancially, to think about retirement, and even a mindset?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> Yes; let me first speak to the kind of affirming part of that, or positive part of that, if you can imagine that there might be one. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> There is. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> There is; and that is, that it goes to: \u201cWhat should our attitude be <em>toward<\/em> money? What does the Bible say about money?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<ul><li>\n\t\t\t\t\tIt\u2019s says we can\u2019t serve two masters; we can\u2019t love God <em>and<\/em> money. \n\t\t\t\t<\/li>\n\t\t\t<\/ul><ul><li>\n\t\t\t\t\tAnd that the <em>love<\/em> of money is the root of all evil. If we spend our lives pursuing money, and amassing large amounts of wealth, we can so easily be tempted to make those things our god such that our safety, our security, our joy, our satisfaction\u2014we start to look to those things\u2014we start to look to money for those things. \n\t\t\t\t<\/li>\n\t\t\t<\/ul><p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> They become our security. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> They become our security instead of God\u2019s love for us, His mercy, and <em>His<\/em> promise of provision. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Do you remember the commercial\u2014I don\u2019t know who it was\u2014the financial commercial, where people are walking around; they have a number above their head? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> \u201cWhat\u2019s your number?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Yes; \u201cWhat\u2019s your number?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> Yes; yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I remember, when I saw that years ago, I thought, \u201cThat has often been my security: that number.\u201d You know, I say it is God, and it IS; but there have been times when I lay in bed\u2014and it\u2019s like, \u201cOh, I\u2019m anxious; I\u2019m worried,\u201d\u2014and it\u2019s about the number. If that number had an extra zero or two, I\u2019d be like, \u201cI\u2019ll be all good right now.\u201d I\u2019d be saying, \u201cOh, it\u2019s because I\u2019m trusting in God\u201d; I\u2019m <em>really<\/em> trusting a bank account <em>number<\/em>. That\u2019s what you are saying; right? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> Yes; that displaced trust is where we get into trouble. And in some ways, it can even begin to become idolatrous. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Yes; right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> You know, because if you think about: \u201cWhat is idolatry?\u201d\u2014it\u2019s not just worshipping another god in some literal way\u2014it can be putting trust and faith and trying to find value and worth in something other than our Creator. Money, in our society\/unfortunately, money can be that thing for far too many people. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSo trying to kind of speak <em>against<\/em> that or combat that, especially within the Christian church, is a good thing; but yet, we also have to balance that off against the biblical wisdom that says that it is wise to assume that things are going to happen, because the future is uncertain; and it is wise, in effect, to save for a rainy day. That starts very early in life and continues all the way through to the end. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> So if you are talking to 20- and 30-year-olds, what is your advice on that saving part? Are you saying, \u201cNow is the time\u201d? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> Absolutely; absolutely. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Okay. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> In fact, if you look at some of the math\u2014and I speak to this a little bit in my book\u2014you save a little bit in your 20s and 30s\u2014if you didn\u2019t save anything, you could actually\u2014assuming certain things hold, which may or may not hold in terms of how the markets grow and income and things compound\u2014you could actually end up with more money, at age 60, than if you waited until age 30 or 40 and started saving a little a month and save that same amount every month to age 60. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIf you started at 20, saved until you were 30, and quit and didn\u2019t do anything, you could possibly end up with more money because of the way that\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u2014compound interest. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> We have a real problem getting our heads around exponential growth. We understand 3 + 3 + 3 = 9; right? We don\u2019t understand that 9<sup>3<\/sup> is an exponential number\u2014right?\u2014and how things compound that way. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Yes; and I mean\u2014and you\u2019ve done this probably more than anybody\u2014when you look at compound interest, like you said, that a 20-year-old or 25- or 28-year-old put away five grand or ten grand and just letting it compound\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> Exactly. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u2014it\u2019s <em>crazy<\/em>; it\u2019s like, \u201cWhy wouldn\u2019t we do that?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> <em>Because<\/em> there are a lot of people who are paying off college debts and [other] debts; and they are thinking, \u201cI don\u2019t have any extra money.\u201d What do you say to <em>them<\/em>? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> Right; yes. In the book, I use a word\u2014and it\u2019s not a word I came up with; it\u2019s a word that Ron Blue, well-known financial advisor, author himself, much more well-known than I am came up with\u2014called financial margin. It\u2019s about creating margin in our lives. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tDebt is a margin killer\u2014whether it\u2019s student loan debt, loading up too much on other installment loans, auto loans, mortgages\u2014you hear about people being mortgage-rich; house-rich; mortgage-poor\u2014whatever\u2014or vice versa. Not having the margin to save is a dangerous place to be. So getting out of debt, dealing with debt, minimizing debt is really tantamount to being able to create enough margin to do the other things that God really wants us to do with our money, which is to spend wisely, give generously, and save diligently. It doesn\u2019t mean save every penny that you can get your hands on, like I was talking about a minute ago; but saving\u2014you know if you are in a 401k plan\u2014and they match 2 percent of your contribution\/salary, dollar for dollar; then, at least, save <em>that<\/em> and get the free money; you know? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIf I walked in here and threw a $100 bill on the table and said, \u201cThat\u2019s yours,\u201d would you pick it up? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Oh, yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> Probably would; right? Well, that\u2019s effectively what your employers are doing\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> \u2014when they hand you free money. Non-biblical principle number one: \u201cDon\u2019t say, \u2018No,\u2019 to free money if it\u2019s given with integrity, and with good intent, and honesty, which\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> One of the things I would say, as a pastor from the pulpit, when we talked about money\u2014and by the way, as a pastor, talking about money, they think you\u2019re only going to talk about giving\u2014[Laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u2014but I used what I called the \u201c10-10-80 Plan\u201d; I\u2019m sure you\u2019ve heard of that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> Yes, yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> What do you think of that?\u2014\u201cGive 10; save 10; live on 80 percent.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u201cGive 10 percent; save 10 percent; live on 80 percent.\u201d Talk about that: \u201cIs that a good plan?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> Very, very reasonable plan, especially for young couples, just starting out. You know, what I tell people\u2014when it comes to, say, giving 10 percent; 10 percent is often referred to as the tithe\u2014but you know, the tithe is not a law: \u201cOnly give 10 percent; don\u2019t give any more, don\u2019t give any less.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> I think it\u2019s, in many ways, reflective of a biblical principle. It is a good <em>starting<\/em> place; because if someone, who is making $20,000 a year, if they are giving 20 percent of their gross income, that is $2,000; that is a lot of money. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSome of the principles we see in the Bible about giving: sacrificial, proportional, and cheerful\/generous giving out the heart; right? Sacrificially and proportionality has a lot to do with how we should give. I think 10-10-80 is a great place to start; but I tell people: \u201cIf you are giving 5 percent, and you\u2019d like to give 10, make that your goal,\u201d \u201cIf you\u2019re giving 10 percent, think about 15 percent.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tGod loves a cheerful giver. He has made a lot of promises to us in His Word that aren\u2019t always absolute; but He has made a lot of promises that seem to say that there are these blessings that accrue to people who\u2014have generous hearts, live generous lives, give of themselves to others, give of their finances to others\u2014the money just seems to come. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe were talking earlier with some folks, visiting here, from one of the earlier programs. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> The young lady was talking about how she stepped out, took some risks, wasn\u2019t sure where the money was going to come from, but she was just doing what God called her to do\u2014obeying God and His will for her life\u2014and the money just kind of seemed to come. That\u2019s not <em>always<\/em> going to happen\u2014you know, we can\u2019t assume on that or presume on that\u2014we can always trust God and say, \u201cGod, I\u2019m trusting You to meet my needs as I obey You and step out.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Here is what I would often hear, as a pastor, after talking about the 10-10-80 or any kind of plan; I often would hear: \u201cIf I did the 10-10, I can\u2019t live on 80; there is no way. So I do the 2-0-98.\u201d That was sort of what they would say; in a sense, \u201cI\u2019m not giving as much, because I just <em>can\u2019t<\/em>. So I give a little bit to God.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> The average, I think, in church is about 2 percent\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> Yes, it\u2019s relatively small. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u2014and then, \u201cI don\u2019t really have enough to save right now; I\u2019m going to do that someday. But man, our bills are high; and we\u2019re living\/that\u2019s an impossible plan: 10-10-80.\u201d What would you say to them? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> Well, you know, in some ways, you have to kind of take them at their word; but I think I\u2019ve been at this long enough to know that, if I was to sit down with that person and really kind of asked them to [open the books], if you will\u2014the checkbook in other words\u2014some people are not particularly anxious to do. But to really dig into their finances\u2014we might find where there is discretionary spending that could be reined in; there is maybe some debt that could be retired that could free up margin\u2014\u201cWhat could be done to create margin within the confines of your current living situation and your current income?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br>A lot of times, I find situations where there just isn\u2019t any; so now, we have a different conversation about: \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<ul><li>\n\t\t\t\t\t\u201cWhat can we do to create more income?\u201d\u2014have you, maybe, acquire another skill; take on another part-time job. \u201cWhat can you do to get more income?\u201d \n\t\t\t\t<\/li>\n\t\t\t<\/ul><ul><li>\n\t\t\t\t\tOr maybe, you should consider downsizing. Maybe, you should consider selling that brand-new car, that you got that big car payment on, and buying something that is more affordable and create margin that way. \n\t\t\t\t<\/li>\n\t\t\t<\/ul><p>\n\t\t\t\tThose are <em>very<\/em> hard conversations to have, but there are times when they are necessary. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br>As a coach\/counselor, mostly in the context of my local church, I always go at this with a heart of empathy, of kindness, patience, and mercy\u2014and realize, as Dave Ramsey likes to say, \u201cI\u2019ve done stupid with my money just like everybody else,\u201d\u2014he likes that word; I don\u2019t use that word a lot, but he likes it. I have done stupid with my money; I\u2019ve made mistakes. I wish I could do over some of the things, and that\u2019s really my heart when I\u2019m engaging with a younger person. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou know, it\u2019s tough; and there is so much pressure to buy, consume, to have more. And to war against that in our hearts and in our minds, as Christians, can be very challenging, especially when you\u2019re young, just starting out. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I think we all know that this topic can create a lot of conflict in our marriages. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> Oh, yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> It\u2019s a hot topic. A lot of times, you have a spender and a saver. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Ann:<\/strong> Chris, I am the spender\u2014[Laughter]\u2014it\u2019s not for me\u2014and this has created tension in our marriage. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Did she just say that out loud? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> Yes, she did. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I did say it; and I like to spend on other people. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> She does. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> So that does create tension in our marriage.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think, even as a couple, having this conversation, when you\u2019re not heated about it\/when there is not already conflict on the table, but just to talk about: \u201cHow do we feel about our retirement?\u201d Even if you are in your 20s, 30s, 40s, it\u2019s a great topic. It might be wise to have a counselor\/a financial helper come in\u2014a mentor\u2014just to give you some tips\/some advice if it\u2019s hard to talk about it with yourselves. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI would add this, too\u2014and this has nothing to do as the last step\u2014but to really pray about it, because God talks a lot in the Bible about money, and it\u2019s a topic that He addresses. I think it is a great topic to talk to Him about too. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> So true. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I would just add\u2014CJ, you would know better than anybody\u2014but I know this as a pastor and even as a Christ-follower\u2014if you want to know where your heart is, money is a <em>great<\/em> indicator. We often sort of want to put our head in the sand and pretend it isn\u2019t; but we always say, \u201cIf you want to know what is important to me, look at my calendar\/look at my money\u201d; it <em>does<\/em> reveal. I can say anything I want about my walk with God\u2014if it is not showing up on my calendar, that I am spending time there; or if I\u2019m not able to show you my checkbook and go, \u201cLook, I\u2019m generous; I give because it\u2019s an overflow of what God has done in my life,\u201d\u2014it\u2019s a great gut check. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br>I know this program for people is going to be like, \u201cWow!\u201d\u2014like Ann just said\u2014\u201cWe need to have a conversation in our marriage. It\u2019s time to talk about this.\u201d It may lead to conflict; it may be one of the best conversations ever\u2014especially if you are younger or older\u2014but man, if you made decisions now that were different than you\u2019ve been making because you want to be a <em>great<\/em> steward as Chris said\u2014that\u2019s the term\u2014it could be a legacy-changing moment in your marriage. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>CJ:<\/strong> Absolutely. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> As Christians, our mission doesn\u2019t stop at retirement; and we should always be willing to actively pursue communicating the gospel and living out the Christian life beyond just the age of 65. Ultimately, all that we have\u2014when it comes to our time; and our relationships; and of course, our money\u2014it belongs to God; and the goal is to honor Him and thank Him in everything, and that includes our finances as we consider retirement. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCJ Cagle has written a book called <em>Reimagine Retirement<\/em>. We\u2019ve got copies over in our FamilyLifeResource Center. You can go to our website at FamilyLifeToday.com to order your copy online, or you can order at 1-800-358-6329; that\u2019s 1-800-\u201cF\u201d as in family, \u201cL\u201d as in life, and then the word, \u201cTODAY.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tMany of us, when we examine our life, we don\u2019t like our story; and honestly, when we look at our spouse, we don\u2019t really like their story much either. That can make for a very, very turbulent marriage, which is one of the reasons why we have created the FamilyLife <em>Weekend to Remember<\/em><sup>\u00ae<\/sup> getaway. Right now, through Monday, April 4<sup>th<\/sup>, when you go to FamilyLifeToday.com, you can scroll down, look at the different dates and geographical locations for the <em>Weekend to Remember<\/em> event, find one; and when you sign up, you will get 43 percent off the regular price for a <em>Weekend to Remember<\/em> event. This is a weekend you can enjoy: three days of romance and reconnection with your spouse. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAgain, that [special pricing] is happening now through Monday, April 4<sup>th<\/sup>\u2014no promo code is needed\u2014just sign up at FamilyLifeToday.com and rediscover a way for your marriage to experience encouragement, hope, and joy, all the while, getting practical tools to help you build and grow your relationship with your spouse. Again, you can find all the details at FamilyLifeToday.com; or you can call us at 1-800-\u201cF\u201d as in family, \u201cL\u201d as in life, and then the word, \u201cTODAY.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIf this content today about rethinking your retirement, or any of our FamilyLife programs have been helpful for you, we\u2019d love for you to share today\u2019s podcast with a family member or a friend. Wherever you get your podcasts, it could really advance the ministry of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> if you\u2019d scroll down and rate and review us. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNow, tomorrow, Dave and Ann Wilson are going to be talking, again, with CJ Cagle about that scary word, as we think about retirement, called debt. I hope you can be with us. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tOn behalf of Dave and Ann Wilson, I\u2019m Shelby Abbott. We will see you next time for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife, a Cru<sup>\u00ae <\/sup>Ministry. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHelping you pursue the relationships that matter most.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright <sup>\u00a9<\/sup> 2022 FamilyLife. 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