{"id":307353,"date":"2022-01-01T08:03:15","date_gmt":"2022-01-01T13:03:15","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/%series%\/remembering-the-best\/"},"modified":"2025-01-09T12:34:01","modified_gmt":"2025-01-09T17:34:01","slug":"remembering-the-best","status":"publish","type":"podcast","link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-this-week\/remembering-the-best\/","title":{"rendered":"Remembering The Best"},"content":{"rendered":"<p>As we approach a new year, it is appropriate to reflect and remember the good things from the year that is drawing to a close. Hear again, excerpts from some of the most meaningful interviews that aired in 2018.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>As we approach a new year, it is appropriate to reflect and remember the good things from the year that is drawing to a close. Hear again, excerpts from some of the most meaningful interviews that aired this past year, on FamilyLife This Week.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":91,"featured_media":0,"menu_order":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","template":"","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","inline_featured_image":false,"_uag_custom_page_level_css":"","episode_type":"audio","audio_file":"https:\/\/d2c17sq0nj1f7e.cloudfront.net\/flw2022-01-01.mp3","cover_image":"","cover_image_id":"","duration":"00:28:00","filesize":"25.64M","filesize_raw":"26882255","date_recorded":"2022-01-01 08:03:15","explicit":"","block":""},"categories":[2911],"tags":[7021],"podcast_series":[],"cwp_profile":[3142,9495,3259],"series":[10388],"class_list":["post-307353","podcast","type-podcast","status-publish","hentry","category-other-holidays","tag-best","cwp_profile-bob-lepine","cwp_profile-bruce-goff","cwp_profile-tracy-lane","series-familylife-this-week"],"acf":[],"episode_featured_image":false,"episode_player_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2023\/10\/FLTW-Podcast-Cover-2-1400x1400-1-300x300-1.jpg","download_link":"https:\/\/dts.podtrac.com\/redirect.mp3\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-download\/307353\/remembering-the-best","player_link":"https:\/\/dts.podtrac.com\/redirect.mp3\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-player\/307353\/remembering-the-best","audio_player":null,"episode_data":{"playerMode":"light","subscribeUrls":{"apple_podcasts":{"key":"apple_podcasts","url":"","label":"Apple Podcasts","class":"apple_podcasts","icon":"apple-podcasts.png"},"google_podcasts":{"key":"google_podcasts","url":"","label":"Google Podcasts","class":"google_podcasts","icon":"google-podcasts.png"},"spotify":{"key":"spotify","url":"","label":"Spotify","class":"spotify","icon":"spotify.png"},"youtube":{"key":"youtube","url":"","label":"YouTube","class":"youtube","icon":"youtube.png"}},"rssFeedUrl":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/feed\/podcast\/familylife-this-week","embedCode":"<blockquote class=\"wp-embedded-content\" data-secret=\"kEX2WolaPr\"><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-this-week\/remembering-the-best\/\">Remembering The Best<\/a><\/blockquote><iframe sandbox=\"allow-scripts\" security=\"restricted\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-this-week\/remembering-the-best\/embed\/#?secret=kEX2WolaPr\" width=\"500\" height=\"350\" title=\"&#8220;Remembering The Best&#8221; &#8212; FamilyLife\u00ae - A Cru Ministry\" data-secret=\"kEX2WolaPr\" frameborder=\"0\" marginwidth=\"0\" marginheight=\"0\" scrolling=\"no\" class=\"wp-embedded-content\"><\/iframe><script>\n\/*! This file is auto-generated *\/\n!function(d,l){\"use strict\";l.querySelector&&d.addEventListener&&\"undefined\"!=typeof URL&&(d.wp=d.wp||{},d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage||(d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage=function(e){var t=e.data;if((t||t.secret||t.message||t.value)&&!\/[^a-zA-Z0-9]\/.test(t.secret)){for(var s,r,n,a=l.querySelectorAll('iframe[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),o=l.querySelectorAll('blockquote[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),c=new RegExp(\"^https?:$\",\"i\"),i=0;i<o.length;i++)o[i].style.display=\"none\";for(i=0;i<a.length;i++)s=a[i],e.source===s.contentWindow&&(s.removeAttribute(\"style\"),\"height\"===t.message?(1e3<(r=parseInt(t.value,10))?r=1e3:~~r<200&&(r=200),s.height=r):\"link\"===t.message&&(r=new URL(s.getAttribute(\"src\")),n=new URL(t.value),c.test(n.protocol))&&n.host===r.host&&l.activeElement===s&&(d.top.location.href=t.value))}},d.addEventListener(\"message\",d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage,!1),l.addEventListener(\"DOMContentLoaded\",function(){for(var e,t,s=l.querySelectorAll(\"iframe.wp-embedded-content\"),r=0;r<s.length;r++)(t=(e=s[r]).getAttribute(\"data-secret\"))||(t=Math.random().toString(36).substring(2,12),e.src+=\"#?secret=\"+t,e.setAttribute(\"data-secret\",t)),e.contentWindow.postMessage({message:\"ready\",secret:t},\"*\")},!1)))}(window,document);\n\/\/# sourceURL=https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-includes\/js\/wp-embed.min.js\n<\/script>\n"},"spectra_custom_meta":{"_wp_page_template":["default"],"transcript_url":["https:\/\/transcript.familylife.com\/flw\/flw2022-01-01.pdf"],"audio_file":["https:\/\/d2c17sq0nj1f7e.cloudfront.net\/flw2022-01-01.mp3"],"transcript_content":["<p><strong>Michelle:<\/strong> It\u2019s the weekend after Christmas, and we are putting wraps on the year; we\u2019re bidding farewell to another year: <em>Auld Lang Syne<\/em> and all of that. Before we do, I want to take some time with you to <em>remember<\/em>, because remembering is a <em>good<\/em> thing. On this edition of <em>FamilyLife This Week<\/em>, we\u2019re going to remember: we\u2019re going to remember 2018.<\/p>\n<p>Welcome to <em>FamilyLife This Week.<\/em> I\u2019m Michelle Hill. It is the last show\u2014well, the last show of the <em>year<\/em>\u2014not the last show of <em>FamilyLife This Week, <\/em>because I\u2019ll be back next weekend! This weekend we\u2019re going to remember. Remembering is a good thing to do. I try to sit down, about once a week or so, and unload my brain of all the memories of what happened over the last few days, things that remind me of God\u2019s goodness and His love, and His control in my life. I make a list of what I\u2019m thankful for that week. Every so often, I look over that list, and I <em>remember<\/em>.<\/p>\n<p>It\u2019s a good thing to remember. Do you ever do that?\u2014you know, think back over the last few days, or few weeks, or months to remember? That\u2019s what we\u2019re going to do today; we\u2019re going to <em>remember<\/em>. We\u2019re going to think back over the time we\u2019ve spent together, over [the year of] 2018; you know, it [was] a good year.<\/p>\n<p>As they\u2019re raising the ball tower in Times Square in New York City, we\u2019re going to hear some of the best of the best\u2014well, I didn\u2019t include you in this conversation\u2014but what I would consider some of our best shows and our best times together on <em>FamilyLife This Week.<\/em> We\u2019re going to hear from Hayley DiMarco today; also, Elisabeth Elliot; and a few others.<\/p>\n<p>I want to lead off with my friend Tracy Lane. One of the things I strive to do with our guests here, as I put together the shows, is to be practical; but also, <em>provoking<\/em>; because\u00a0 I want you to be thinking through things. One of the shows that hit that nail on the head was [in the] spring with Tracy as we chatted about working moms.<\/p>\n<p>[Previous Interview]<\/p>\n<p><strong>Tracy:<\/strong> Being a mom isn\u2019t the <em>only<\/em> thing that I wanted to do when I grew up. I was working at a job that required about 80 hours a week. I <em>loved<\/em> what I did, but I was <em>exhausted<\/em> when I got home. I didn\u2019t even have a lot of capacity when I got home to be a wife. When I was working 80 hours a week, and we started pursuing what God wanted us to do about parenting and my motherhood, He specifically called me to a career change that was <em>hard<\/em> for me to obey. He had me leave my job of 80 hours a week. I had accepted a promotion\u2014I was about to double my income\u2014and at that same time, He is working in my heart about prioritizing my motherhood.<\/p>\n<p>I stepped away from that; I didn\u2019t know what I was going to. God called me away from that, and He provided me a writing career. The reason that\u2019s important is because He provided me a position that would allow me to pursue, professionally, what He created me to do.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Michelle:<\/strong> How can you encourage some of those moms, who are just starting out, and working in the marketplace, and are feeling totally overwhelmed with: \u201cI can\u2019t keep up with this!\u201d Encourage them.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Tracy:<\/strong> Yes, I agree. It\u2019s really hard to keep up with some days, but I think it\u2019s worth it. Doing what God calls us to is always worth it. When we rely on Him to help us pull it off, it\u2019s going to work. It doesn\u2019t mean it\u2019s always going to feel great. It\u2019s not always going to be easy, but it\u2019s the right thing when we know we\u2019re following Him and prioritizing well.<\/p>\n<p>I will say: \u201cCrock pot dinners save a working mom\u2019s life.\u201d [Laughter] If I\u2019m not cooking a crockpot dinner, my family is eating a sandwich or something. I think that\u2019s the other practical part of encouragement is: \u201cGive yourself a little space!\u201d<\/p>\n<p><strong>Michelle:<\/strong> That\u2019s important.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Tracy:<\/strong> It\u2019s very important. It\u2019s hard for me to not compare myself to a friend, who brews her own kombucha at home; but I don\u2019t have the capacity to do that. And my family will be okay if they\u2019re drinking store-bought apple juice or something in place of that. [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p><strong>Michelle: <\/strong>True.<\/p>\n<p><strong>\u00a0<\/strong><\/p>\n<p><strong>Tracy: <\/strong>Be realistic with your expectations; prioritize the right things. Perfection is not the goal\u2014honoring God and prioritizing your family is the goal\u2014and those are very different.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Michelle:<\/strong> That just hit me, about the competition that is among moms these days. Do you feel that?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Tracy:<\/strong> For sure. I mean, that is <em>everywhere<\/em>\u2014this whole mother competition\u2014this whole mom having to be the best, the best, the best and to provide perfection for her children. I feel that way, as a mom, when I think I\u2019m the one in control of their lives\u2014when <em>I\u2019m<\/em> the one who can create that perfection for them; when <em>I\u2019m<\/em> the one who can give them these three extracurricular activities, and <em>that\u2019s <\/em>going to determine who they are\u2014that\u2019s wrong! I\u2019m not the one! I didn\u2019t think of them; I didn\u2019t create them. I\u2019m not the one who designed the long-term and eternal purposes for them.<\/p>\n<p>Their perfection and their performance is <em>not<\/em> on my shoulders; that is something that <em>God<\/em> wants to work out. We put so much pressure on ourselves, as a mom, so that our kids are more perfect than our neighbor\u2019s kids. God is actually working something out in our children\u2014that He <em>does <\/em>use us as a tool\u2014but it is <em>not<\/em> all on me.<\/p>\n<p>I realize that I am not a very kind, and warm, and nurturing attentive mother when I am on this crazy perfection cycle. They need <em>me<\/em>\u2014they don\u2019t need the perfect set of school grades, reading group, after-school activities\u2014they don\u2019t need all that. But they do need an engaged mom, who is not completely exhausted from trying to create this perfect little world for them.<\/p>\n<p>[Studio]<\/p>\n<p><strong>Michelle:<\/strong> That\u2019s Tracy Lane, again, sharing life from a working mom\u2019s perspective, trying to juggle it all. It\u2019s difficult! It\u2019s <em>very<\/em> difficult. In fact, Tracy and her husband Matt have moved to Philadelphia to get some special help for their daughter, Annie. There\u2019s a link to her story on our website, FamilyLifeThisWeek.com; that\u2019s FamilyLifeThisWeek.com.<\/p>\n<p>We have hit a generation where the dads are <em>very<\/em> involved\u2014hands on\u2014they help with the kids; they change the diapers; they give baths; they feed the kids; they put the kids in bed. Way to go, Millennials! I sat down with one of these Millennial dads, a co-worker of mine, Bruce Goff. We chatted with Bob Lepine about what it\u2019s like to be a young dad, raising children in this generation. Bruce shared a story about the unchanging sin nature of toddlers.<\/p>\n<p>[Previous Interview]<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bruce:<\/strong> So we were eating dinner. Estelle was having French fries and chicken nuggets. I think I initiated it, saying, \u201cHey, Estelle, can you share a French fry with Mommy?\u201d She goes, \u201cNo, mine,\u201d which we discussed. [Laughter] I don\u2019t remember ever teaching her the word, \u201cmine\u201d; but she\u2019s got it. [Laughter] I said to her, \u201cEstelle, you need to be kind and share.\u201d Marie asked her, and Estelle looks down at her fries. She\u2019s starting to think about it, and she is looking so intently. She finds just this little nub, and hands her the little nub. [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>Bob:\u00a0\u2014the smallest. [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bruce:<\/strong> You know, we were very\/Marie is like, \u201c<em>Thank you<\/em>.\u201d As the dinner went on, she would, unprompted, be like, \u201cMommy, fry?\u201d She would dip it in ketchup for her; it was a big one. Then she would offer a chicken nugget. We weren\u2019t even prompting this anymore; I was very pleased with her growth.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong> Let me say two things about that: first, all children are born selfish.<\/p>\n<p>Michelle:\u00a0Right.<\/p>\n<p>Bob:\u00a0Unless we <em>teach<\/em> them how to be other-centered, they will remain self-centered. A part of our job, as parents, is to\u00a0break\u00a0the cycle of self-centeredness and teach them to be other-centered.<\/p>\n<p>Now, ultimately, you want that to come from the heart\u2014that takes a work of God\u2014but you can correct behavior, as a parent, and say, \u201cHere\u2019s how we\u2019re going to live. We\u2019re going to think of others, and put others first, and help others, and be kind to others.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>After a while, she was playing a game; this was <em>fun<\/em> for her.<\/p>\n<p>Bruce:\u00a0Right.<\/p>\n<p>Bob:\u00a0We used to do this with our kids when they were little. I would come home; and I would say, \u201cJohn, you sit over there, and you wait there. In a minute, I\u2019m going to say, \u2018John, would you come here please?\u2019 When I do, I want you to jump up and say, \u2018Yes, Daddy,\u2019 and I want you to run over here.\u201d He\u2019s thinking we\u2019re playing a\u00a0great\u00a0game; right?<\/p>\n<p>Michelle:\u00a0Right; it\u2019s a fun thing.<\/p>\n<p>Bob:\u00a0What I\u2019m doing is, I am teaching him: \u201cHere is how life works.\u201d I think parents just have to be intentional and purposeful to say, \u201cThese are things we want to train into our kids: \u2018Here\u2019s how you meet somebody\u2019; \u2018Here is how you say, \u201cPlease,\u201d and \u201cThank you.\u201d\u2019\u201d<\/p>\n<p>All of this is built; in fact, there is a scene in the movie,\u00a0Like Arrows\u2014you remember it\u2014where one of the kids is bad-mannered at the table while the other child is polite at the table. The mom is kind of like, \u201cHow did you get your kid to do that?\u201d The other mom says, \u201cThere\u2019s no child, who is going to say \u2018Please,\u2019 and \u2018Thank you,\u2019 on their own. They have to be <em>taught<\/em> these things.\u201d That\u2019s our job as parents.<\/p>\n<p>Michelle:\u00a0So how early on are you forming character in your child? I mean, because when they are like a minute old, that\u2019s too early; but then also, you can tell that Bruce and Marie have been working with their two-year-old.<\/p>\n<p>Bob:\u00a0Yes; so I think you can start to see self-centeredness in a child in the early months; you can start to see. Parents would go, \u201cNo, they are just responding to their environment. They are just\u2026\u201d \u201cIt\u2019s whatever their needs are.\u201d Well, keep in mind: the heart of your child is focused on self. No child wakes up in the middle of the night and says, \u201cYou know, I\u2019m uncomfortable with my diaper; but Mom had a <em>terrible<\/em> day today. I\u2019m just going to let her sleep.\u201d [Laughter] No; when a child wakes up in the middle of the night, that child goes, \u201cI want my need met\u00a0immediately.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Michelle:\u00a0Exactly.<\/p>\n<p>Bob:\u00a0You do have to say, \u201cYou\u2019re a part of the family: you fit in; you don\u2019t get everything immediately as soon as you whimper, or fuss, or cry.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>You can start training before the child can speak. In fact, with our kids, Mary Ann had them learning sign language to say, \u201cThank you,\u201d before they could say the words.<\/p>\n<p>Michelle:\u00a0Okay; yes.<\/p>\n<p>Bob:\u00a0So touching the mouth, and\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Michelle:\u00a0It\u2019s a <em>great<\/em> idea.<\/p>\n<p>Bob:\u00a0\u2014and they were able to do it at seven-months\/eight-months-old.<\/p>\n<p>[Studio]<\/p>\n<p><strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Great insights from Bob Lepine and Bruce Goff, two dads who are trying to get it right.<\/p>\n<p>We need to take a break. When we come back, we\u2019re going to hear a story from a woman who has changed the trajectory of <em>my<\/em> life. If you\u2019ve listened to the show for very long, you probably can guess who that is. If not, well, you\u2019re going to have to stick around. We\u2019ll be back in <em>two<\/em> minutes.<\/p>\n<p>[Radio Station Spot Break]<\/p>\n<p><strong>Michelle: <\/strong>Welcome back to <em>FamilyLife This Week<\/em>. I'm Michelle Hill. We\u2019re taking a walk through memory lane. We\u2019re recapping some of the conversations that have made an impact on me and hopefully on you [in] 2018. Back in January [of that year], we put together a show called \u201cEpic Love Stories.\u201d We were sharing the love stories of some famous couples and some not-so-famous couples, the story of what God has done in their lives.<\/p>\n<p>One of those stories was the story of Lars and Elisabeth Gren. You may recognize Elisabeth as Elisabeth Elliot; she was married to Jim Elliot, who was martyred in Ecuador back in the 1950s. In her eight decades of life, she went on to be married a few more times. Here\u2019s the story of her courtship with her second husband and third husband. Here\u2019s Elisabeth.<\/p>\n<p>[Previous <em>FamilyLife Today <\/em>Broadcast]<\/p>\n<p>Elisabeth:\u00a0Through a speaking engagement in Missouri, I met a man by the name of Addison Leach. He was the vice-president of a small college there, and his wife was actually dying of cancer. He had three daughters. He and I got acquainted because he asked me to come and speak for some things that he did in the summertime there at that college.<\/p>\n<p>His wife was supposed to have died ten years before, according to the doctors; but she died about a year later. The following year, Addison Leach asked me to marry him; that was just totally unexpected. He was 18 years older than I was; and 4 years later, he got cancer. About half-a-year after that, he died.<\/p>\n<p>Well, while he was dying, I was taking care of him at home, after he had left the hospital. I got to the point where I really desperately needed somebody to help me; because he was a big man; and he was totally helpless for the last few\/about six weeks. I called the seminary, where my husband had been a professor\u2014he was at Gordon-Conwell Seminary\u2014and asked if there was a young man that might be willing to come and live in my house and help me take care of my husband.<\/p>\n<p>A young man applied for the job. He was to move in on the following Monday; and Monday, my husband died. So naturally, he assumed that he would not be needed. But I called the next day and said, \u201cThe room is ready for you if you\u2019d like to come anyway.\u201d So he moved in, whereupon it struck me that it doesn\u2019t look too good for one lady and one gentleman to be living in a house together. This gentleman happened to be considerably older than many of the other students; and of course, I might have been old enough to be his mother.<\/p>\n<p>But I thought, \u201cWell, I better call the seminary to see if there was another young man that would be willing to come.\u201d So two men came\u2014lived in my house for <em>two<\/em> years\u2014the first one married my daughter; [Laughter] the second one married me. [Laughter and applause]<\/p>\n<p>I want you people to know that this gentleman\u2014he is a southern gentleman\u2014and he never\u00a0called me anything but \u201cMrs. Leach\u201d the whole time he lived in my house. I mean, he was a gentleman; and so was Walt Shepard, who is now my son-in-law.<\/p>\n<p>Bob:\u00a0When you proposed, Lars, did you say, \u201cMrs. Leach, will you marry me?\u201d [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>Lars:\u00a0No, I\u2019ll tell you\u2014I thought about the first one and the short marriage that he had\u2014and the second one only doubled him\u2014so I was <em>weighing<\/em> the possibility of mathematical progression and only really facing possibly eight more years of life. [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>[Studio]<\/p>\n<p><strong>Michelle:<\/strong> That\u2019s Lars and Elisabeth Gren. It\u2019s plain to hear that Lars and Elisabeth had lots of laughs and lots of fun. That\u2019s the <em>spice<\/em> of life; isn\u2019t it? If it weren\u2019t for Elisabeth, I probably wouldn\u2019t be here; she kind of mentored me. We have a link to that story on our website: go to FamilyLifeThisWeek.com; that\u2019s FamilyLifeThisWeek.com.<\/p>\n<p>As I said, I want our conversations to be thought-provoking. I think I pretty well managed to do that back in August [of 2018] with you when Tim Muehlhoff, professor at Biola University, dropped by the studios to share what he learned as he has studied feminism. Here\u2019s Professor Muehlhoff.<\/p>\n<p>[Previous Interview]<\/p>\n<p><strong>Tim:<\/strong> The first wave of feminism was very basic questions: \u201cAre women human?\u201d \u201cShould they be treated as human?\u201d \u201cAre they co-equals with men?\u201d We might think that that\u2019s crazy, because we\u2019re so far past that; but the first wave of feminism, women were not treated as equals. There were very famous philosophers, who were arguing that women were basically grown-up children.<\/p>\n<p>When Jesus comes on the scene, He\u00a0elevates\u00a0women. He says, at the foot of the cross, there\u2019s neither male nor female; they\u2019re all one at the foot of the cross. In a radical way, He elevates women to say: \u201cWomen are just as important in the kingdom of God as men,\u201d and \u201cBoth are made in the image of God, and I died for both.\u201d And He goes on to say, \u201cThe resurrection\u2014My defining moment that validates who I am\u2014I\u2019m going to pick, by providence, two women to be the witnesses.\u201d Then, absolutely, Jesus was a Christian feminist. Without a doubt, He\u2019s a first-wave.<\/p>\n<p>Of course, He would jump off at some point, like I would. But let\u2019s not overlook all these commonalities and points of agreement as we rush toward points of disagreement.<\/p>\n<p>Michelle:\u00a0What it sounds like is that feminism\u00a0has\u00a0helped our society; it has\u00a0improved\u00a0it in many ways.<\/p>\n<p>Tim:\u00a0James\u2014the earliest New Testament book written\u2014James says: \u201cLet me tell you what true, undefiled religion is in the sight of God; caring for orphans and widows in distress.\u201d There\u2019s a place now for women to go, and they weren\u2019t just brought in to make coffee. We know that there were woman deaconesses.<\/p>\n<p>Again, I like\u00a0expanding\u00a0people\u2019s idea of what feminism is. Feminism has just gotten a bad rap among conservative circles. I think a lot of it is based on, quite frankly, ignorance. We need to do a better job of explaining what feminism is.<\/p>\n<p>[Studio]<\/p>\n<p><strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Our time with Tim Muehlhoff was eye-opening; and on many accounts, he was helping conservatives understand what feminism is in its <em>best<\/em> sense. I\u2019m sure that you\u2019d like to know more; so please go to our website, FamilyLifeThisWeek.com, to hear the entire interview. You\u2019ll find a link there to the program, which also includes Courtney Reissig sharing <em>her<\/em> thoughts on embracing a biblical view of feminism.<\/p>\n<p>As we sit in this after-Christmas glow, pretty soon we\u2019ll start getting those bills that pile up\u2014the Visa<sup>\u00ae<\/sup> card, or the Discover<sup>\u00ae<\/sup> card, or what have you\u2014and then we have to think about paying it off, and all the bills. Hayley DiMarco was here and shared about her problem with bills. It really started because of a problem with something else. Here\u2019s Hayley.<\/p>\n<p>[Previous <em>FamilyLife Today <\/em>Broadcast]<\/p>\n<p><strong>Hayley:<\/strong> Shopping therapy has always been my number-one treatment for everything that ails me. I\u2019ve ended up, over the years, in great debt because of my shopping, not just financial debt, but spiritual debt. I\u2019ve been controlled by my urge for stuff; it literally came a point where it made me sick. I just felt like the house was crawling with stuff, like the things didn\u2019t fit in the closets. There was so much coming out\u2014I had no room to put it all\u2014it just made me crazy. This was kind of the beginning of this death to self: was when I started to look around and see how much stuff meant to me and how much it fed my flesh.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong> When you looked at that, and tried to evaluate, \u201cWhat\u2019s really going on in my heart here?\u201d what was exposed? I mean, why would you say, \u201cI will feel better if I come home with something I\u2019ve just bought\u201d? What\u2019s\u2014<\/p>\n<p><strong>Hayley:<\/strong> That\u2019s a good\/it\u2019s a visceral reaction\u2014I walk through Target<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>\u2014that\u2019s kind of my drug\u2014<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong> That\u2019s your temple?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Hayley:<\/strong> \u2014of choice; yes. I walk through there: I just see the things; and I see them in my house, making my life better. I see a <em>beautiful<\/em> home, where everything is put together, and the plates match, and the silverware is not bending;\u2014<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Okay;\u2014<\/p>\n<p><strong>Hayley:<\/strong> \u2014and I see happiness.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong> \u2014I\u2019ve got to stop you there. I\u2019m married to a woman, who I made this statement to\u2014and it\u2019s one of the true original lines I have ever given my wife that was really on target\u2014I mean, here\u2019s what I said to her\/I said, \u201cBarbara, wherever you go, you make things <em>beautiful<\/em>.\u201d And she <em>does<\/em>; she makes things beautiful. There are listeners, right now, who are hearing you describe your home. Is it <em>wrong<\/em> to want to make things beautiful, to make a home appealing to the eye?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Hayley:<\/strong> It\u2019s not; I don\u2019t think it\u2019s wrong at all. I think the problem comes with our heart with regards to it. My heart was that I couldn\u2019t be happy without it. I literally could not walk out of the store if I saw something that appealed to me. I had <em>no power<\/em> over that\u2014 it didn\u2019t matter if my bank account was overdrawn; I had to have that\u2014the way that we worship the stuff is what\u2019s important [to us]; it\u2019s what is the problem.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Michael:<\/strong> It\u2019s almost like when\u2014if people have an opportunity to come over to the house, and if the house isn\u2019t perfect\u2014if that\u2019s a roadblock\u2014like in my family, my mother would not allow us to bring friends over. We wouldn\u2019t have people over to the house if the house wasn\u2019t looking good\/if it wasn\u2019t clean, like, \u201cOh, wow; the house is a mess; no we just can\u2019t.\u201d When the appearance of things or the condition of things\u2014\u201cWell, we don\u2019t have a nice enough car for us to participate in the carpool,\u201d\u2014that\u2019s where it becomes, Hayley alluded to it, becomes a matter of <em>worship<\/em>.<\/p>\n<p>The \u201cLess Is the New More,\u201d\u2014it\u2019s not just stuff\u2014it can be activities; it can be friendships; it can be followers on Twitter<sup>\u00ae<\/sup> or friends on Facebook<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>: \u201cI need more,\u201d \u201cI need more.\u201d<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong> But did you start confronting this\u2014<\/p>\n<p><strong>Hayley:<\/strong> I started confronting it after I got married, yes.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong> \u2014after you got married. So basically, you were bringing debt and the problem into this joint relationship.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Hayley:<\/strong> Well, I had gotten rid of the debt by then; but I brought in the worship. I brought in the worship; it still exists. There are still times when I say, \u201cI really want to have my friends over, but the house is just a mess.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Michael will say, \u201cAre you kidding me? Have we not worked through this? This house\/the way it looks is <em>not<\/em> more important than community and then fellowship. And your friends love you regardless of how the house looks.\u201d Now, that is <em>hard<\/em> for me to overcome; and I have to hear it from him regularly. Otherwise, I can become consumed with how beautiful everything looks.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong> So how, practically, have you dealt with this idol? Back before Easter\u2014Lent\u2014I actually fasted during Lent from certain things. It was healthy for me to do that because I gave up things that I thought were becoming too important to me;\u2014<\/p>\n<p><strong>Hayley:<\/strong> That\u2019s good; yes.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong> \u2014okay? Do you fast from Target?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Hayley:<\/strong> Yes, yes. [Laughter] I did more than that. It was a few years ago when we started to confront this idea. We\/I took an entire year off from buying anything new, except food. I went to Goodwill<sup>\u00ae<\/sup> if we needed anything. I took a year off from Target; I couldn\u2019t even go in it. At first, I tried just to go in it with no cash, but I had credit cards.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Right now, there is a listener, who downloaded the broadcast on their iPhone<sup>\u00ae<\/sup> or their iPod<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>, and they are walking through Target; and she\u2019s convicted.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Hayley:<\/strong> I\u2019ve just ruined it for them. [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong> What is your advice?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Hayley:<\/strong> \u201cPut it back; you don\u2019t need it.\u201d [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong> \u201cStep away from the counter. Get out of the store <em>now<\/em>.\u201d [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p><strong>Michael:<\/strong> Sometimes, on date night, I put on a red polo shirt; and she gets very amorous. [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong> What\u2019s your advice to that woman?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Hayley:<\/strong> I hate to even say it, because they are just going to scream at me; but my advice is: \u201cStop and ask yourself, \u2018Why do I want this? What is my motivation behind it?\u2019\u201d If it isn\u2019t so you can serve God better, then put it back; because really, the chief end of man is to glorify God. Is the stuff in your cart going to glorify Him? It might be something your kids need for school\u2014that\u2019s part of your ministry\u2014that\u2019s part of your glorifying God; but if it\u2019s not, then, is it meant to glorify you?<\/p>\n<p>[Studio]<\/p>\n<p><strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Oh, those are some tough words\u2014thought-provoking\u2014that\u2019s what I promised you; isn\u2019t it? Hayley DiMarco with a reminder that the gifts that we\u2019ve received this Christmas\u2014they\u2019re <em>good<\/em>! But are they the <em>best<\/em>?\u2014because really, what we need to be pondering about is the baby that was given for us at Christmas time, and rose for us at Easter to take away the sins of the world.<\/p>\n<p>Hey, next week, we\u2019re going to cross into the new year, and we\u2019re going to stay up late because the ball is going to drop on Times Square in New York City. And then, we wake up the next day, and it\u2019s [2022]! Perhaps on [New Year\u2019s Day] what you\u2019re going to be thinking about is your resolutions\/how this year is going to be different or <em>not<\/em> so different.<\/p>\n<p>Next week, we\u2019re going to talk with Justin Earley. He\u2019s going to join me in a conversation about habits, behaviors, and those resolutions you love to break. That\u2019s going to be next week on FamilyLifeThisWeek.com. I hope you can join us for that.<\/p>\n<p>Hey, thanks for listening! I want to thank the co-founder of FamilyLife<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>, Dennis Rainey, and our president, David Robbins, along with our station partners around the country. A big \u201cThank you!\u201d to the <em>best<\/em> engineer ever, Keith Lynch. Thanks to our un-surpassed producers, Marques Holt and Bruce Goff. Justin Adams is our matchless mastering engineer, and Megan Martin is the queen of production coordination.<\/p>\n<p>Our program is a production of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>, and our mission is to effectively develop godly families who change the world one home at a time.<\/p>\n<p>I'm Michelle Hill, inviting you to join us again next time for another edition of <em>FamilyLife This Week.<\/em><\/p>\n<p><strong>\u00a0<\/strong><\/p>\n<p>We are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?<\/p>\n<p>Copyright <sup>\u00a9<\/sup> 2021 FamilyLife. All rights reserved.<\/p>\n<p><a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/\">www.FamilyLife.com<\/a><\/p>\n<p>1<\/p>\n"],"duration":["00:28:00"],"filesize":["25.64M"],"filesize_raw":["26882255"],"_edit_lock":["1736444046:47000"],"_edit_last":["47000"],"theme_header_position":["Sticky"],"post_header_is_sticky":["default"],"is_header_overlay":["0"],"episode_type":["audio"],"date_recorded":["2022-01-01 08:03:15"],"enclosure":["https:\/\/d2c17sq0nj1f7e.cloudfront.net\/flw2022-01-01.mp3"],"_seopress_redirections_type":["301"],"_seopress_redirections_logged_status":["both"],"_seopress_analysis_target_kw":[""],"_uag_css_file_name":["uag-css-307353.css"],"_uag_js_file_name":["uag-js-307353.js"],"_uag_page_assets":["a:9:{s:3:\"css\";s:82560:\".wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape-top svg{width: calc( 100% + 1.3px );}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape.uagb-container__shape-top .uagb-container__shape-fill{fill: 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});\";s:18:\"current_block_list\";a:17:{i:0;s:14:\"uagb\/container\";i:1;s:12:\"core\/heading\";i:2;s:9:\"core\/html\";i:3;s:10:\"core\/group\";i:6;s:21:\"uagb\/advanced-heading\";i:7;s:14:\"uagb\/separator\";i:8;s:14:\"uagb\/icon-list\";i:9;s:20:\"uagb\/icon-list-child\";i:10;s:11:\"core\/search\";i:13;s:18:\"core\/legacy-widget\";i:16;s:10:\"uagb\/image\";i:17;s:17:\"core\/social-links\";i:18;s:16:\"core\/social-link\";i:19;s:14:\"core\/paragraph\";i:20;s:30:\"meta-box\/fl-conditional-blocks\";i:21;s:12:\"uagb\/buttons\";i:22;s:18:\"uagb\/buttons-child\";}s:8:\"uag_flag\";b:1;s:11:\"uag_version\";i:1776415230;s:6:\"gfonts\";a:1:{s:7:\"Default\";a:2:{s:10:\"fontfamily\";s:7:\"Default\";s:12:\"fontvariants\";a:0:{}}}s:10:\"gfonts_url\";s:71:\"\/\/fonts.googleapis.com\/css?family=Default&subset=latin&display=fallback\";s:12:\"gfonts_files\";a:0:{}s:14:\"uag_faq_layout\";b:0;}"]},"uagb_featured_image_src":{"full":false},"uagb_author_info":{"display_name":"kfairris@familylife.com","author_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/author\/kfairrisfamilylife-com\/"},"uagb_comment_info":0,"uagb_excerpt":"As we approach a new year, it is appropriate to reflect and remember the good things from the year that is drawing to a close. Hear again, excerpts from some of the most meaningful interviews that aired this past year, on FamilyLife This Week.","meta_box":{"show_notes":"","transcript_url":"https:\/\/transcript.familylife.com\/flw\/flw2022-01-01.pdf","transcript_content":"<p><strong>Michelle:<\/strong> It\u2019s the weekend after Christmas, and we are putting wraps on the year; we\u2019re bidding farewell to another year: <em>Auld Lang Syne<\/em> and all of that. Before we do, I want to take some time with you to <em>remember<\/em>, because remembering is a <em>good<\/em> thing. On this edition of <em>FamilyLife This Week<\/em>, we\u2019re going to remember: we\u2019re going to remember 2018.<\/p>\n<p>Welcome to <em>FamilyLife This Week.<\/em> I\u2019m Michelle Hill. It is the last show\u2014well, the last show of the <em>year<\/em>\u2014not the last show of <em>FamilyLife This Week, <\/em>because I\u2019ll be back next weekend! This weekend we\u2019re going to remember. Remembering is a good thing to do. I try to sit down, about once a week or so, and unload my brain of all the memories of what happened over the last few days, things that remind me of God\u2019s goodness and His love, and His control in my life. I make a list of what I\u2019m thankful for that week. Every so often, I look over that list, and I <em>remember<\/em>.<\/p>\n<p>It\u2019s a good thing to remember. Do you ever do that?\u2014you know, think back over the last few days, or few weeks, or months to remember? That\u2019s what we\u2019re going to do today; we\u2019re going to <em>remember<\/em>. We\u2019re going to think back over the time we\u2019ve spent together, over [the year of] 2018; you know, it [was] a good year.<\/p>\n<p>As they\u2019re raising the ball tower in Times Square in New York City, we\u2019re going to hear some of the best of the best\u2014well, I didn\u2019t include you in this conversation\u2014but what I would consider some of our best shows and our best times together on <em>FamilyLife This Week.<\/em> We\u2019re going to hear from Hayley DiMarco today; also, Elisabeth Elliot; and a few others.<\/p>\n<p>I want to lead off with my friend Tracy Lane. One of the things I strive to do with our guests here, as I put together the shows, is to be practical; but also, <em>provoking<\/em>; because\u00a0 I want you to be thinking through things. One of the shows that hit that nail on the head was [in the] spring with Tracy as we chatted about working moms.<\/p>\n<p>[Previous Interview]<\/p>\n<p><strong>Tracy:<\/strong> Being a mom isn\u2019t the <em>only<\/em> thing that I wanted to do when I grew up. I was working at a job that required about 80 hours a week. I <em>loved<\/em> what I did, but I was <em>exhausted<\/em> when I got home. I didn\u2019t even have a lot of capacity when I got home to be a wife. When I was working 80 hours a week, and we started pursuing what God wanted us to do about parenting and my motherhood, He specifically called me to a career change that was <em>hard<\/em> for me to obey. He had me leave my job of 80 hours a week. I had accepted a promotion\u2014I was about to double my income\u2014and at that same time, He is working in my heart about prioritizing my motherhood.<\/p>\n<p>I stepped away from that; I didn\u2019t know what I was going to. God called me away from that, and He provided me a writing career. The reason that\u2019s important is because He provided me a position that would allow me to pursue, professionally, what He created me to do.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Michelle:<\/strong> How can you encourage some of those moms, who are just starting out, and working in the marketplace, and are feeling totally overwhelmed with: \u201cI can\u2019t keep up with this!\u201d Encourage them.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Tracy:<\/strong> Yes, I agree. It\u2019s really hard to keep up with some days, but I think it\u2019s worth it. Doing what God calls us to is always worth it. When we rely on Him to help us pull it off, it\u2019s going to work. It doesn\u2019t mean it\u2019s always going to feel great. It\u2019s not always going to be easy, but it\u2019s the right thing when we know we\u2019re following Him and prioritizing well.<\/p>\n<p>I will say: \u201cCrock pot dinners save a working mom\u2019s life.\u201d [Laughter] If I\u2019m not cooking a crockpot dinner, my family is eating a sandwich or something. I think that\u2019s the other practical part of encouragement is: \u201cGive yourself a little space!\u201d<\/p>\n<p><strong>Michelle:<\/strong> That\u2019s important.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Tracy:<\/strong> It\u2019s very important. It\u2019s hard for me to not compare myself to a friend, who brews her own kombucha at home; but I don\u2019t have the capacity to do that. And my family will be okay if they\u2019re drinking store-bought apple juice or something in place of that. [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p><strong>Michelle: <\/strong>True.<\/p>\n<p><strong>\u00a0<\/strong><\/p>\n<p><strong>Tracy: <\/strong>Be realistic with your expectations; prioritize the right things. Perfection is not the goal\u2014honoring God and prioritizing your family is the goal\u2014and those are very different.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Michelle:<\/strong> That just hit me, about the competition that is among moms these days. Do you feel that?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Tracy:<\/strong> For sure. I mean, that is <em>everywhere<\/em>\u2014this whole mother competition\u2014this whole mom having to be the best, the best, the best and to provide perfection for her children. I feel that way, as a mom, when I think I\u2019m the one in control of their lives\u2014when <em>I\u2019m<\/em> the one who can create that perfection for them; when <em>I\u2019m<\/em> the one who can give them these three extracurricular activities, and <em>that\u2019s <\/em>going to determine who they are\u2014that\u2019s wrong! I\u2019m not the one! I didn\u2019t think of them; I didn\u2019t create them. I\u2019m not the one who designed the long-term and eternal purposes for them.<\/p>\n<p>Their perfection and their performance is <em>not<\/em> on my shoulders; that is something that <em>God<\/em> wants to work out. We put so much pressure on ourselves, as a mom, so that our kids are more perfect than our neighbor\u2019s kids. God is actually working something out in our children\u2014that He <em>does <\/em>use us as a tool\u2014but it is <em>not<\/em> all on me.<\/p>\n<p>I realize that I am not a very kind, and warm, and nurturing attentive mother when I am on this crazy perfection cycle. They need <em>me<\/em>\u2014they don\u2019t need the perfect set of school grades, reading group, after-school activities\u2014they don\u2019t need all that. But they do need an engaged mom, who is not completely exhausted from trying to create this perfect little world for them.<\/p>\n<p>[Studio]<\/p>\n<p><strong>Michelle:<\/strong> That\u2019s Tracy Lane, again, sharing life from a working mom\u2019s perspective, trying to juggle it all. It\u2019s difficult! It\u2019s <em>very<\/em> difficult. In fact, Tracy and her husband Matt have moved to Philadelphia to get some special help for their daughter, Annie. There\u2019s a link to her story on our website, FamilyLifeThisWeek.com; that\u2019s FamilyLifeThisWeek.com.<\/p>\n<p>We have hit a generation where the dads are <em>very<\/em> involved\u2014hands on\u2014they help with the kids; they change the diapers; they give baths; they feed the kids; they put the kids in bed. Way to go, Millennials! I sat down with one of these Millennial dads, a co-worker of mine, Bruce Goff. We chatted with Bob Lepine about what it\u2019s like to be a young dad, raising children in this generation. Bruce shared a story about the unchanging sin nature of toddlers.<\/p>\n<p>[Previous Interview]<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bruce:<\/strong> So we were eating dinner. Estelle was having French fries and chicken nuggets. I think I initiated it, saying, \u201cHey, Estelle, can you share a French fry with Mommy?\u201d She goes, \u201cNo, mine,\u201d which we discussed. [Laughter] I don\u2019t remember ever teaching her the word, \u201cmine\u201d; but she\u2019s got it. [Laughter] I said to her, \u201cEstelle, you need to be kind and share.\u201d Marie asked her, and Estelle looks down at her fries. She\u2019s starting to think about it, and she is looking so intently. She finds just this little nub, and hands her the little nub. [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>Bob:\u00a0\u2014the smallest. [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bruce:<\/strong> You know, we were very\/Marie is like, \u201c<em>Thank you<\/em>.\u201d As the dinner went on, she would, unprompted, be like, \u201cMommy, fry?\u201d She would dip it in ketchup for her; it was a big one. Then she would offer a chicken nugget. We weren\u2019t even prompting this anymore; I was very pleased with her growth.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong> Let me say two things about that: first, all children are born selfish.<\/p>\n<p>Michelle:\u00a0Right.<\/p>\n<p>Bob:\u00a0Unless we <em>teach<\/em> them how to be other-centered, they will remain self-centered. A part of our job, as parents, is to\u00a0break\u00a0the cycle of self-centeredness and teach them to be other-centered.<\/p>\n<p>Now, ultimately, you want that to come from the heart\u2014that takes a work of God\u2014but you can correct behavior, as a parent, and say, \u201cHere\u2019s how we\u2019re going to live. We\u2019re going to think of others, and put others first, and help others, and be kind to others.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>After a while, she was playing a game; this was <em>fun<\/em> for her.<\/p>\n<p>Bruce:\u00a0Right.<\/p>\n<p>Bob:\u00a0We used to do this with our kids when they were little. I would come home; and I would say, \u201cJohn, you sit over there, and you wait there. In a minute, I\u2019m going to say, \u2018John, would you come here please?\u2019 When I do, I want you to jump up and say, \u2018Yes, Daddy,\u2019 and I want you to run over here.\u201d He\u2019s thinking we\u2019re playing a\u00a0great\u00a0game; right?<\/p>\n<p>Michelle:\u00a0Right; it\u2019s a fun thing.<\/p>\n<p>Bob:\u00a0What I\u2019m doing is, I am teaching him: \u201cHere is how life works.\u201d I think parents just have to be intentional and purposeful to say, \u201cThese are things we want to train into our kids: \u2018Here\u2019s how you meet somebody\u2019; \u2018Here is how you say, \u201cPlease,\u201d and \u201cThank you.\u201d\u2019\u201d<\/p>\n<p>All of this is built; in fact, there is a scene in the movie,\u00a0Like Arrows\u2014you remember it\u2014where one of the kids is bad-mannered at the table while the other child is polite at the table. The mom is kind of like, \u201cHow did you get your kid to do that?\u201d The other mom says, \u201cThere\u2019s no child, who is going to say \u2018Please,\u2019 and \u2018Thank you,\u2019 on their own. They have to be <em>taught<\/em> these things.\u201d That\u2019s our job as parents.<\/p>\n<p>Michelle:\u00a0So how early on are you forming character in your child? I mean, because when they are like a minute old, that\u2019s too early; but then also, you can tell that Bruce and Marie have been working with their two-year-old.<\/p>\n<p>Bob:\u00a0Yes; so I think you can start to see self-centeredness in a child in the early months; you can start to see. Parents would go, \u201cNo, they are just responding to their environment. They are just\u2026\u201d \u201cIt\u2019s whatever their needs are.\u201d Well, keep in mind: the heart of your child is focused on self. No child wakes up in the middle of the night and says, \u201cYou know, I\u2019m uncomfortable with my diaper; but Mom had a <em>terrible<\/em> day today. I\u2019m just going to let her sleep.\u201d [Laughter] No; when a child wakes up in the middle of the night, that child goes, \u201cI want my need met\u00a0immediately.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Michelle:\u00a0Exactly.<\/p>\n<p>Bob:\u00a0You do have to say, \u201cYou\u2019re a part of the family: you fit in; you don\u2019t get everything immediately as soon as you whimper, or fuss, or cry.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>You can start training before the child can speak. In fact, with our kids, Mary Ann had them learning sign language to say, \u201cThank you,\u201d before they could say the words.<\/p>\n<p>Michelle:\u00a0Okay; yes.<\/p>\n<p>Bob:\u00a0So touching the mouth, and\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Michelle:\u00a0It\u2019s a <em>great<\/em> idea.<\/p>\n<p>Bob:\u00a0\u2014and they were able to do it at seven-months\/eight-months-old.<\/p>\n<p>[Studio]<\/p>\n<p><strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Great insights from Bob Lepine and Bruce Goff, two dads who are trying to get it right.<\/p>\n<p>We need to take a break. When we come back, we\u2019re going to hear a story from a woman who has changed the trajectory of <em>my<\/em> life. If you\u2019ve listened to the show for very long, you probably can guess who that is. If not, well, you\u2019re going to have to stick around. We\u2019ll be back in <em>two<\/em> minutes.<\/p>\n<p>[Radio Station Spot Break]<\/p>\n<p><strong>Michelle: <\/strong>Welcome back to <em>FamilyLife This Week<\/em>. I'm Michelle Hill. We\u2019re taking a walk through memory lane. We\u2019re recapping some of the conversations that have made an impact on me and hopefully on you [in] 2018. Back in January [of that year], we put together a show called \u201cEpic Love Stories.\u201d We were sharing the love stories of some famous couples and some not-so-famous couples, the story of what God has done in their lives.<\/p>\n<p>One of those stories was the story of Lars and Elisabeth Gren. You may recognize Elisabeth as Elisabeth Elliot; she was married to Jim Elliot, who was martyred in Ecuador back in the 1950s. In her eight decades of life, she went on to be married a few more times. Here\u2019s the story of her courtship with her second husband and third husband. Here\u2019s Elisabeth.<\/p>\n<p>[Previous <em>FamilyLife Today <\/em>Broadcast]<\/p>\n<p>Elisabeth:\u00a0Through a speaking engagement in Missouri, I met a man by the name of Addison Leach. He was the vice-president of a small college there, and his wife was actually dying of cancer. He had three daughters. He and I got acquainted because he asked me to come and speak for some things that he did in the summertime there at that college.<\/p>\n<p>His wife was supposed to have died ten years before, according to the doctors; but she died about a year later. The following year, Addison Leach asked me to marry him; that was just totally unexpected. He was 18 years older than I was; and 4 years later, he got cancer. About half-a-year after that, he died.<\/p>\n<p>Well, while he was dying, I was taking care of him at home, after he had left the hospital. I got to the point where I really desperately needed somebody to help me; because he was a big man; and he was totally helpless for the last few\/about six weeks. I called the seminary, where my husband had been a professor\u2014he was at Gordon-Conwell Seminary\u2014and asked if there was a young man that might be willing to come and live in my house and help me take care of my husband.<\/p>\n<p>A young man applied for the job. He was to move in on the following Monday; and Monday, my husband died. So naturally, he assumed that he would not be needed. But I called the next day and said, \u201cThe room is ready for you if you\u2019d like to come anyway.\u201d So he moved in, whereupon it struck me that it doesn\u2019t look too good for one lady and one gentleman to be living in a house together. This gentleman happened to be considerably older than many of the other students; and of course, I might have been old enough to be his mother.<\/p>\n<p>But I thought, \u201cWell, I better call the seminary to see if there was another young man that would be willing to come.\u201d So two men came\u2014lived in my house for <em>two<\/em> years\u2014the first one married my daughter; [Laughter] the second one married me. [Laughter and applause]<\/p>\n<p>I want you people to know that this gentleman\u2014he is a southern gentleman\u2014and he never\u00a0called me anything but \u201cMrs. Leach\u201d the whole time he lived in my house. I mean, he was a gentleman; and so was Walt Shepard, who is now my son-in-law.<\/p>\n<p>Bob:\u00a0When you proposed, Lars, did you say, \u201cMrs. Leach, will you marry me?\u201d [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>Lars:\u00a0No, I\u2019ll tell you\u2014I thought about the first one and the short marriage that he had\u2014and the second one only doubled him\u2014so I was <em>weighing<\/em> the possibility of mathematical progression and only really facing possibly eight more years of life. [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>[Studio]<\/p>\n<p><strong>Michelle:<\/strong> That\u2019s Lars and Elisabeth Gren. It\u2019s plain to hear that Lars and Elisabeth had lots of laughs and lots of fun. That\u2019s the <em>spice<\/em> of life; isn\u2019t it? If it weren\u2019t for Elisabeth, I probably wouldn\u2019t be here; she kind of mentored me. We have a link to that story on our website: go to FamilyLifeThisWeek.com; that\u2019s FamilyLifeThisWeek.com.<\/p>\n<p>As I said, I want our conversations to be thought-provoking. I think I pretty well managed to do that back in August [of 2018] with you when Tim Muehlhoff, professor at Biola University, dropped by the studios to share what he learned as he has studied feminism. Here\u2019s Professor Muehlhoff.<\/p>\n<p>[Previous Interview]<\/p>\n<p><strong>Tim:<\/strong> The first wave of feminism was very basic questions: \u201cAre women human?\u201d \u201cShould they be treated as human?\u201d \u201cAre they co-equals with men?\u201d We might think that that\u2019s crazy, because we\u2019re so far past that; but the first wave of feminism, women were not treated as equals. There were very famous philosophers, who were arguing that women were basically grown-up children.<\/p>\n<p>When Jesus comes on the scene, He\u00a0elevates\u00a0women. He says, at the foot of the cross, there\u2019s neither male nor female; they\u2019re all one at the foot of the cross. In a radical way, He elevates women to say: \u201cWomen are just as important in the kingdom of God as men,\u201d and \u201cBoth are made in the image of God, and I died for both.\u201d And He goes on to say, \u201cThe resurrection\u2014My defining moment that validates who I am\u2014I\u2019m going to pick, by providence, two women to be the witnesses.\u201d Then, absolutely, Jesus was a Christian feminist. Without a doubt, He\u2019s a first-wave.<\/p>\n<p>Of course, He would jump off at some point, like I would. But let\u2019s not overlook all these commonalities and points of agreement as we rush toward points of disagreement.<\/p>\n<p>Michelle:\u00a0What it sounds like is that feminism\u00a0has\u00a0helped our society; it has\u00a0improved\u00a0it in many ways.<\/p>\n<p>Tim:\u00a0James\u2014the earliest New Testament book written\u2014James says: \u201cLet me tell you what true, undefiled religion is in the sight of God; caring for orphans and widows in distress.\u201d There\u2019s a place now for women to go, and they weren\u2019t just brought in to make coffee. We know that there were woman deaconesses.<\/p>\n<p>Again, I like\u00a0expanding\u00a0people\u2019s idea of what feminism is. Feminism has just gotten a bad rap among conservative circles. I think a lot of it is based on, quite frankly, ignorance. We need to do a better job of explaining what feminism is.<\/p>\n<p>[Studio]<\/p>\n<p><strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Our time with Tim Muehlhoff was eye-opening; and on many accounts, he was helping conservatives understand what feminism is in its <em>best<\/em> sense. I\u2019m sure that you\u2019d like to know more; so please go to our website, FamilyLifeThisWeek.com, to hear the entire interview. You\u2019ll find a link there to the program, which also includes Courtney Reissig sharing <em>her<\/em> thoughts on embracing a biblical view of feminism.<\/p>\n<p>As we sit in this after-Christmas glow, pretty soon we\u2019ll start getting those bills that pile up\u2014the Visa<sup>\u00ae<\/sup> card, or the Discover<sup>\u00ae<\/sup> card, or what have you\u2014and then we have to think about paying it off, and all the bills. Hayley DiMarco was here and shared about her problem with bills. It really started because of a problem with something else. Here\u2019s Hayley.<\/p>\n<p>[Previous <em>FamilyLife Today <\/em>Broadcast]<\/p>\n<p><strong>Hayley:<\/strong> Shopping therapy has always been my number-one treatment for everything that ails me. I\u2019ve ended up, over the years, in great debt because of my shopping, not just financial debt, but spiritual debt. I\u2019ve been controlled by my urge for stuff; it literally came a point where it made me sick. I just felt like the house was crawling with stuff, like the things didn\u2019t fit in the closets. There was so much coming out\u2014I had no room to put it all\u2014it just made me crazy. This was kind of the beginning of this death to self: was when I started to look around and see how much stuff meant to me and how much it fed my flesh.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong> When you looked at that, and tried to evaluate, \u201cWhat\u2019s really going on in my heart here?\u201d what was exposed? I mean, why would you say, \u201cI will feel better if I come home with something I\u2019ve just bought\u201d? What\u2019s\u2014<\/p>\n<p><strong>Hayley:<\/strong> That\u2019s a good\/it\u2019s a visceral reaction\u2014I walk through Target<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>\u2014that\u2019s kind of my drug\u2014<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong> That\u2019s your temple?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Hayley:<\/strong> \u2014of choice; yes. I walk through there: I just see the things; and I see them in my house, making my life better. I see a <em>beautiful<\/em> home, where everything is put together, and the plates match, and the silverware is not bending;\u2014<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Okay;\u2014<\/p>\n<p><strong>Hayley:<\/strong> \u2014and I see happiness.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong> \u2014I\u2019ve got to stop you there. I\u2019m married to a woman, who I made this statement to\u2014and it\u2019s one of the true original lines I have ever given my wife that was really on target\u2014I mean, here\u2019s what I said to her\/I said, \u201cBarbara, wherever you go, you make things <em>beautiful<\/em>.\u201d And she <em>does<\/em>; she makes things beautiful. There are listeners, right now, who are hearing you describe your home. Is it <em>wrong<\/em> to want to make things beautiful, to make a home appealing to the eye?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Hayley:<\/strong> It\u2019s not; I don\u2019t think it\u2019s wrong at all. I think the problem comes with our heart with regards to it. My heart was that I couldn\u2019t be happy without it. I literally could not walk out of the store if I saw something that appealed to me. I had <em>no power<\/em> over that\u2014 it didn\u2019t matter if my bank account was overdrawn; I had to have that\u2014the way that we worship the stuff is what\u2019s important [to us]; it\u2019s what is the problem.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Michael:<\/strong> It\u2019s almost like when\u2014if people have an opportunity to come over to the house, and if the house isn\u2019t perfect\u2014if that\u2019s a roadblock\u2014like in my family, my mother would not allow us to bring friends over. We wouldn\u2019t have people over to the house if the house wasn\u2019t looking good\/if it wasn\u2019t clean, like, \u201cOh, wow; the house is a mess; no we just can\u2019t.\u201d When the appearance of things or the condition of things\u2014\u201cWell, we don\u2019t have a nice enough car for us to participate in the carpool,\u201d\u2014that\u2019s where it becomes, Hayley alluded to it, becomes a matter of <em>worship<\/em>.<\/p>\n<p>The \u201cLess Is the New More,\u201d\u2014it\u2019s not just stuff\u2014it can be activities; it can be friendships; it can be followers on Twitter<sup>\u00ae<\/sup> or friends on Facebook<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>: \u201cI need more,\u201d \u201cI need more.\u201d<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong> But did you start confronting this\u2014<\/p>\n<p><strong>Hayley:<\/strong> I started confronting it after I got married, yes.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong> \u2014after you got married. So basically, you were bringing debt and the problem into this joint relationship.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Hayley:<\/strong> Well, I had gotten rid of the debt by then; but I brought in the worship. I brought in the worship; it still exists. There are still times when I say, \u201cI really want to have my friends over, but the house is just a mess.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Michael will say, \u201cAre you kidding me? Have we not worked through this? This house\/the way it looks is <em>not<\/em> more important than community and then fellowship. And your friends love you regardless of how the house looks.\u201d Now, that is <em>hard<\/em> for me to overcome; and I have to hear it from him regularly. Otherwise, I can become consumed with how beautiful everything looks.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong> So how, practically, have you dealt with this idol? Back before Easter\u2014Lent\u2014I actually fasted during Lent from certain things. It was healthy for me to do that because I gave up things that I thought were becoming too important to me;\u2014<\/p>\n<p><strong>Hayley:<\/strong> That\u2019s good; yes.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong> \u2014okay? Do you fast from Target?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Hayley:<\/strong> Yes, yes. [Laughter] I did more than that. It was a few years ago when we started to confront this idea. We\/I took an entire year off from buying anything new, except food. I went to Goodwill<sup>\u00ae<\/sup> if we needed anything. I took a year off from Target; I couldn\u2019t even go in it. At first, I tried just to go in it with no cash, but I had credit cards.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Right now, there is a listener, who downloaded the broadcast on their iPhone<sup>\u00ae<\/sup> or their iPod<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>, and they are walking through Target; and she\u2019s convicted.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Hayley:<\/strong> I\u2019ve just ruined it for them. [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong> What is your advice?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Hayley:<\/strong> \u201cPut it back; you don\u2019t need it.\u201d [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong> \u201cStep away from the counter. Get out of the store <em>now<\/em>.\u201d [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p><strong>Michael:<\/strong> Sometimes, on date night, I put on a red polo shirt; and she gets very amorous. [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong> What\u2019s your advice to that woman?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Hayley:<\/strong> I hate to even say it, because they are just going to scream at me; but my advice is: \u201cStop and ask yourself, \u2018Why do I want this? What is my motivation behind it?\u2019\u201d If it isn\u2019t so you can serve God better, then put it back; because really, the chief end of man is to glorify God. Is the stuff in your cart going to glorify Him? It might be something your kids need for school\u2014that\u2019s part of your ministry\u2014that\u2019s part of your glorifying God; but if it\u2019s not, then, is it meant to glorify you?<\/p>\n<p>[Studio]<\/p>\n<p><strong>Michelle:<\/strong> Oh, those are some tough words\u2014thought-provoking\u2014that\u2019s what I promised you; isn\u2019t it? Hayley DiMarco with a reminder that the gifts that we\u2019ve received this Christmas\u2014they\u2019re <em>good<\/em>! But are they the <em>best<\/em>?\u2014because really, what we need to be pondering about is the baby that was given for us at Christmas time, and rose for us at Easter to take away the sins of the world.<\/p>\n<p>Hey, next week, we\u2019re going to cross into the new year, and we\u2019re going to stay up late because the ball is going to drop on Times Square in New York City. And then, we wake up the next day, and it\u2019s [2022]! Perhaps on [New Year\u2019s Day] what you\u2019re going to be thinking about is your resolutions\/how this year is going to be different or <em>not<\/em> so different.<\/p>\n<p>Next week, we\u2019re going to talk with Justin Earley. He\u2019s going to join me in a conversation about habits, behaviors, and those resolutions you love to break. That\u2019s going to be next week on FamilyLifeThisWeek.com. I hope you can join us for that.<\/p>\n<p>Hey, thanks for listening! I want to thank the co-founder of FamilyLife<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>, Dennis Rainey, and our president, David Robbins, along with our station partners around the country. A big \u201cThank you!\u201d to the <em>best<\/em> engineer ever, Keith Lynch. Thanks to our un-surpassed producers, Marques Holt and Bruce Goff. Justin Adams is our matchless mastering engineer, and Megan Martin is the queen of production coordination.<\/p>\n<p>Our program is a production of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>, and our mission is to effectively develop godly families who change the world one home at a time.<\/p>\n<p>I'm Michelle Hill, inviting you to join us again next time for another edition of <em>FamilyLife This Week.<\/em><\/p>\n<p><strong>\u00a0<\/strong><\/p>\n<p>We are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?<\/p>\n<p>Copyright <sup>\u00a9<\/sup> 2021 FamilyLife. 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