{"id":307201,"date":"2021-08-17T07:00:05","date_gmt":"2021-08-17T11:00:05","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/%series%\/heart-and-spine-for-children\/"},"modified":"2021-08-17T07:00:05","modified_gmt":"2021-08-17T11:00:05","slug":"heart-and-spine-for-children","status":"publish","type":"podcast","link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/heart-and-spine-for-children\/","title":{"rendered":"Heart and Spine for Children"},"content":{"rendered":"","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>What do we want the future of the Church to look like? Valerie Bell, Matt Markins, and Mike Handler call on the Church to raise up children who love Jesus for the rest of their lives.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":91,"featured_media":294104,"menu_order":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","template":"","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","inline_featured_image":false,"_uag_custom_page_level_css":"","episode_type":"","audio_file":"https:\/\/mp3.familylife.com\/fl2021-08-17.mp3","podmotor_file_id":"","podmotor_episode_id":"","cover_image":"","cover_image_id":"","duration":"00:29:01","filesize":"26.57M","filesize_raw":"27863615","date_recorded":"","explicit":"","block":""},"categories":[2867,2806,2855,2870],"tags":[4798,2209],"podcast_series":[8466],"cwp_profile":[9728,9729,9727],"series":[2101],"class_list":["post-307201","podcast","type-podcast","status-publish","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-church-involvement","category-spiritual-development","category-teens","category-tweens","tag-kids","tag-parenting","podcast_series-raising-resilient-kids","cwp_profile-matt-markins","cwp_profile-mike-handler","cwp_profile-valerie-bell","series-familylife-today"],"acf":[],"episode_featured_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/09\/FLT-Podcast-Cover-2-508x508-3.jpg?w=508","episode_player_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2023\/02\/image-scaled.jpg","download_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-download\/307201\/heart-and-spine-for-children","player_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-player\/307201\/heart-and-spine-for-children","audio_player":null,"episode_data":{"playerMode":"light","subscribeUrls":{"apple_podcasts":{"key":"apple_podcasts","url":"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303?mt=2&app=podcast","label":"Apple Podcasts","class":"apple_podcasts","icon":"apple-podcasts.png"},"google_podcasts":{"key":"google_podcasts","url":"","label":"Google Podcasts","class":"google_podcasts","icon":"google-podcasts.png"},"spotify":{"key":"spotify","url":"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm","label":"Spotify","class":"spotify","icon":"spotify.png"},"youtube":{"key":"youtube","url":"","label":"YouTube","class":"youtube","icon":"youtube.png"}},"rssFeedUrl":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/feed\/podcast\/familylife-today","embedCode":"<blockquote class=\"wp-embedded-content\" data-secret=\"ClUdiCGaxH\"><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/heart-and-spine-for-children\/\">Heart and Spine for Children<\/a><\/blockquote><iframe sandbox=\"allow-scripts\" security=\"restricted\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/heart-and-spine-for-children\/embed\/#?secret=ClUdiCGaxH\" width=\"500\" height=\"350\" title=\"&#8220;Heart and Spine for Children&#8221; &#8212; FamilyLife\u00ae - A Cru Ministry\" data-secret=\"ClUdiCGaxH\" frameborder=\"0\" marginwidth=\"0\" marginheight=\"0\" scrolling=\"no\" class=\"wp-embedded-content\"><\/iframe><script>\n\/*! This file is auto-generated *\/\n!function(d,l){\"use strict\";l.querySelector&&d.addEventListener&&\"undefined\"!=typeof URL&&(d.wp=d.wp||{},d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage||(d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage=function(e){var t=e.data;if((t||t.secret||t.message||t.value)&&!\/[^a-zA-Z0-9]\/.test(t.secret)){for(var s,r,n,a=l.querySelectorAll('iframe[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),o=l.querySelectorAll('blockquote[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),c=new RegExp(\"^https?:$\",\"i\"),i=0;i<o.length;i++)o[i].style.display=\"none\";for(i=0;i<a.length;i++)s=a[i],e.source===s.contentWindow&&(s.removeAttribute(\"style\"),\"height\"===t.message?(1e3<(r=parseInt(t.value,10))?r=1e3:~~r<200&&(r=200),s.height=r):\"link\"===t.message&&(r=new URL(s.getAttribute(\"src\")),n=new URL(t.value),c.test(n.protocol))&&n.host===r.host&&l.activeElement===s&&(d.top.location.href=t.value))}},d.addEventListener(\"message\",d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage,!1),l.addEventListener(\"DOMContentLoaded\",function(){for(var e,t,s=l.querySelectorAll(\"iframe.wp-embedded-content\"),r=0;r<s.length;r++)(t=(e=s[r]).getAttribute(\"data-secret\"))||(t=Math.random().toString(36).substring(2,12),e.src+=\"#?secret=\"+t,e.setAttribute(\"data-secret\",t)),e.contentWindow.postMessage({message:\"ready\",secret:t},\"*\")},!1)))}(window,document);\n\/\/# sourceURL=https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-includes\/js\/wp-embed.min.js\n<\/script>\n"},"uagb_featured_image_src":{"full":["https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/09\/FLT-Podcast-Cover-2-508x508-3.jpg",508,508,false]},"uagb_author_info":{"display_name":"kfairris@familylife.com","author_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/author\/kfairrisfamilylife-com\/"},"uagb_comment_info":0,"uagb_excerpt":"What do we want the future of the Church to look like? Valerie Bell, Matt Markins, and Mike Handler call on the Church to raise up children who love Jesus for the rest of their lives.","meta_box":{"show_notes":"","transcript_url":"https:\/\/transcript.familylife.com\/fl2021-08-17.pdf","transcript_content":"<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>Okay; think back to when our first son, CJ, was born; remember that?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Thirty-five years ago.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Yes; what do you think our goal was? [Laughter] Do you think we had any goals?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I\u2019m laughing, because we had <em>no <\/em>goal. We hadn\u2019t even really thought about it. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Well, no; we did think\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> You did.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u2014before he was born, we were like, \u201cWe\u2019re going to raise these guys to love Jesus\u2014our kids!\u201d I mean, we had <em>that<\/em> in mind.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Oh, definitely. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Like we wanted to raise kids that would impact the world for Jesus.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> That was our goal.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> But then, we had no idea how to get there. [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Do you think that\u2019s true?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I think we were like most typical parents. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> We had a dream. We heard what the dream should be, maybe at church. We had no concept of how hard it would be and what it would look like.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> And how you get just lost in the dailies\/the demands of life.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> And I would say every parent can relate.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWelcome to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>, where we want to help you pursue the relationships that matter most. I\u2019m Ann Wilson.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> And I\u2019m Dave Wilson, and you can find us at FamilyLifeToday.com or on our FamilyLife<sup>\u00ae<\/sup> app.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> This is <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> In fact, when we wrote <em>No Perfect Parents, <\/em>that was the purpose; it was like: \u201cHow can we help parents decide what their bullseye\u201d\u2014we called it\u2014\u201cwhat they\u2019re trying to raise?\u201d Most parents, including us when we started, really didn\u2019t know what that looked like.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> And I love FamilyLife\u2019s\u2014the <em>Art of Parenting<\/em><sup>\u00ae <\/sup>[video series]\u2014because it had that same concept in mind: \u201cHow can we raise these kids to follow Jesus?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Yes; we wanted <em>resilient<\/em> kids\u2014 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> That\u2019s what we wanted!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u2014kids whose faith was resilient for their entire lifetime. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou know, we\u2019ve got a whole group of writers in the studio today, who wrote a book called <em>Resilient, <\/em>which is all about\/let me read you the subtitle: <em>Child Discipleship and the Fearless Future of the Church. <\/em>As I read this, you know, it was about the church; but it was also about the family. It\u2019s the partnership there.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> And I\u2019m so excited for today\u2014because every parent that I know, who wants to raise children of the faith\u2014have the same dilemma: \u201cI have this goal. I don\u2019t know how to get there, and I\u2019m not even sure how to describe what the goal is.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe\u2019ve got three authors here to help us do this; right?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Yes. Valerie Bell, Matt Markins, and Mike Handler. You guys, welcome, again, to <em>FamilyLife Today. <\/em>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Mike:<\/strong> It\u2019s so good to be here.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Valerie:<\/strong> Thank you!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Matt:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> And some of our listeners know this name\/probably, a lot do: Awana is what Valerie\u2019s the CEO of. You all work with Awana. Chief Strategy, Matt, over here; Mike is Chief Communications; right?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Mike:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u2014with the radio voice. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Mike: <\/strong>That\u2019s it.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>I mean, you\u2019re an amazing team for Awana but, also, an amazing team as authors. As we read your book, it was <em>compelling<\/em> to help families\u2014we just talked about parents\u2014but also, the church understand what we\u2019re trying to produce.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Mike:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> And this is elementary. Every church should be able to answer this question; every family should; but a lot of us can\u2019t: \u201cWhat is it we are trying to raise as parents?\u201d and \u201cAs children\u2019s ministers in the church, what should be the goal?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Valerie:<\/strong> We should have our eye on the future church. We looked at 2050; and we said, \u201cThese kids are going to be adults in 2050. What are we wanting that church to look like?\u201d If you want a strong family\/if you want strong children, you should be <em>very invested <\/em>in building a strong church; because out of that church, children grow in the soil of that rich faith that they find in church.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou know, to have this sense of future\u2014\u201cWhat is the future goal that we\u2019re trying to build here?\u201d\u2014you know, we\u2019ve said we want to raise kids, who will love Jesus for the rest of their lives. There\u2019s that passionate identity with Christ\u2014and not just with Christ\u2014but with His church\/with God\u2019s people. There is this sense that our children have the capacity to, even in this strong culture, build a primary identity, or primary allegiance, with God, and with Jesus, and with the Bible, and with the church.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAll of these things fall under this category of discipleship. That\u2019s the broader heading for all of those things that I\u2019ve been describing. We want to raise disciples.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Mike:<\/strong> I love how you started that out; because everyone listening is like: \u201cOf course, we want to make disciples! We want our children to love Jesus for the rest of their lives. But something has changed!\u201d Our listeners are probably thinking, \u201cThe culture around us has changed rapidly.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe talk about this story in the book about a public official, who was going before the Senate to be confirmed for public office. He\u2019s being grilled because of his orthodox, evangelical, Bible-believing beliefs. What is this telling us? It\u2019s telling us: \u201cThings that were once celebrated about the Christian faith, in our culture, are becoming, increasingly, no longer celebrated.\u201d Christian thinking may, in the future, be increasingly marginalized. We have to ask ourselves: \u201cAre we giving kids lesser things that will not travel with them into their adult lives?\u201d \u201cWhat can we do to disciple resilient young people, who are going to engage the culture and lead the future of the church?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Valerie:<\/strong> Let\u2019s speak into the family for a second, too,\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Yes; do that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Valerie:<\/strong> \u2014because the Christian family has changed. We know, from our own record-keeping, that Christian families\u2014who say they are church-attenders\u2014their kids, from the church rolls, actually, are only going to be there 1.7 times on average per month.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Well, Valerie, I thought it was interesting, as you were talking about how important the church is\u2014I think, especially, with COVID; because we\u2019ve all been in our own homes, worshiping maybe online or just\u2014we\u2019re thinking, \u201cI can make disciples in my own home!\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Valerie:<\/strong> I\u2019m glad you brought that up.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Yes; and I see a lot of people\u2014they\u2019ve stopped going to church,\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Valerie:<\/strong> Okay; yes, I understand that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u2014thinking it\u2019s not necessary. And yet, you\u2019re saying, \u201cThe church is <em>so <\/em>necessary.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Valerie:<\/strong> Okay, there\u2019s a difference between being consumers\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Matt:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Valerie:<\/strong> \u2014and builders.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Matt:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Valerie:<\/strong> The builders come: and they minster to each other; they contribute financially; they contribute in so many ways. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBefore COVID, we had become consumer Christians:\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> What is that? Define that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Valerie:<\/strong> \u2014\u201cWell, I\u2019ll go to this church; because I like the music,\u201d and \u201cThis is where they have these really great programs,\u201d and \u201cI like Such-and-such\u2019s preaching.\u201d We\u2019re giving it the consumer test; \u201cDoes it meet our Good Housekeeping<sup>\u00ae<\/sup> seal of approval standards for Christian entertainment?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tDuring COVID, I watched TV and went to church that way. I <em>loved <\/em>the access to some of the best preaching in the world.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Matt:<\/strong> Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Valerie:<\/strong> But it is very clear to me, after having experienced it, that that is <em>far removed <\/em>from being involved in a local body of believers. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHere, you\u2019ve got kids\u20141.7 times\u2014you know, that\u2019s about 24 hours in a year. Listen, you <em>cannot make disciples<\/em> with that little amount of time. Somewhere, our priorities and our primary allegiance, as parents, has shifted. We need to shift back to the primary allegiance being\u2014making sure that our kids have access to everything they need, including things that are more than edu-tainment\u2014that will give them strength to deal with 2050 when they\u2019re adults.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> What would you say? Talk to the mom or dad, who\u2019s listening, going, \u201cOkay, I don\u2019t want to do what Valerie\u2019s saying\u2014maybe I have been doing it\u2014What should I do? I\u2019m a mom\u201d\u2014or I\u2019m a dad\u2014\u201cI want to raise a resilient disciple.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u201cTell us. <em>Teach<\/em> us.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u201cHow do I do it? What should I do?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Mike:<\/strong> Yes; well, I think the church is the place where life-on-life discipleship happens. It\u2019s seeing a kid in the eye; it\u2019s being, knee to knee, with a child. I\u2019m a parent of four kids\u2014and I can say something\u2014I have a teenage son and a soon-to-be teenaged daughter. Good night! That just is enough there to raise one\u2019s faith. [Laughter] But I also know that there are other men, in my son Griffin\u2019s life, who can speak to him, who will say all of the same things I\u2019ve said; but he\u2019ll have a listening ear to some of their words that he won\u2019t have to mine. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> It\u2019s crazy! Dave and I would say to our kids\u2014like he [son] would come home and say, \u201cOh, this is what Rob said! It was amazing,\u201d\u2014we would look at each other; we\u2019d go to bed that night, and it was like, \u201cWe\u2019ve said that <em>a million <\/em>times!\u201d [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u201cWe\u2019ve said that for ten years!\u201d [Laughter] But they heard it differently because they respected someone else.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Mike:<\/strong> Exactly!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Valerie:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> And it\u2019s necessary.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Mike:<\/strong> Yes, it is; it is! You know, in Hebrews\u2014\u201cthe assembly of the believers,\u201d\u2014like that is what we\u2019re going for here. And the church is in a prime spot right now; COVID probably accelerated some things that were ten, twenty, thirty years out. But it also accelerated our ability, as a local church, to start dreaming again\/to start saying: \u201cOkay, this is a newer reality that we\u2019re living in, different than what we\u2019ve lived in before. What can we do in this present that will line us up for a better future, especially as it relates to our kids?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I remember, when we were going to seminary, we were taking classes; we were doing ministry. I decided to lead a girls\u2019 Awana group. We had a little sleepover with these sixth-grade girls. I remember thinking, \u201cWhat am I doing?\u201d\u2014you know, I don\u2019t have kids yet, but I <em>love<\/em> these girls!\u2014I remember thinking, \u201cAre they getting it? Are they knowing that I love them; that I care about them?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt was about 1:00 in the morning, and we were in these sleeping bags on the floor. This girl, out of nowhere, says, \u201cYou guys, will you pray for me? My parents are going through a divorce. I feel lost and alone.\u201d I mean, talk about vulnerable!\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Mike:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u2014for a 12-year-old! Which then led another girl to share the fears that she was going through\/the stress she was going through; her grandmother was raising her. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI get teary thinking about it; because I remember thinking, \u201cLord, what an amazing gift that You\u2019ve given me, that You\u2019re allowing these girls to open up with their hearts and their vulnerability\/their fears.\u201d And then we prayed for each other\u2014these little sixth-grade girls, just praying for each other\u2014and asking God to come in and meet them where they were. That\u2019s discipleship,\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Valerie:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u2014\u2014where you\u2019re walking alongside,\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Mike:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u2014in the highs and the lows, hearing their hearts, and praying for them. That\u2019s what we have an opportunity to do, whether you have kids or you don\u2019t.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Mike:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> If God puts that on your heart, you can become one of those people, who speaks life into a world-changer!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Mike:<\/strong> Yes, absolutely. You can be dual income\/no kids; right?\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Yes!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Mike:<\/strong> \u2014or you can be a grandparent; or you can be somebody whom God has called to not even get married and have kids, but you can still be influential in the life of a child\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Mike:<\/strong> \u2014or a community of kids. That\u2019s amazing! That\u2019s stewardship.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Matt:<\/strong> It is.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Mike:<\/strong> I think there are two practical applications: for parents, looking through the home lens, the first practical application is: \u201cWe\u2019ve got to put our phones down.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Oh, yes!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Mike:<\/strong> \u201cWe\u2019ve got to put our mobile devices down. This is about raising a generation that\u2019s going to engage the culture of the future\/to <em>shape<\/em> the future of the church. Let\u2019s create space to be present with our kids: listen to them; ask questions; tell them about a time when we messed up, and we needed forgiveness; live the gospel out in front of them.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut the second application, I think, is that same parent, turning toward the church. We\u2019ve got to have eyes to see other kids in the church, who don\u2019t have that loving, caring adult. You see a family that probably may not be discipling their kids; and we have this feeling that says, \u201cI need to reach out to <em>that <\/em>child.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> And what would you say to the parent listening, who\u2019s thinking, \u201cI don\u2019t have time for that! I barely have time to function!\u201d What would your encouragement to them be?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Valerie:<\/strong> Find time; you don\u2019t have anything more important to do. Children, who are discipled, are leaders. That\u2019s another word for disciple; they are leaders. Yes, they follow Jesus; but they don\u2019t get led into things that will be self-destructive. So many of the things that are happening in culture are very self-destructive. I would <em>really <\/em>encourage a parent, who is feeling that spread out in life, to start editing away,\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Matt:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Valerie:<\/strong> \u2014especially during these years when you\u2019re raising kids. You can take up that other stuff later. Make sure that you are doing the most primary, essential part of parenting, which is discipleship.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Matt:<\/strong> I would say that, Valerie, if our lifestyle is so cluttered that we can\u2019t find time to disciple our kids, then we are living the wrong lifestyle. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Valerie:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Matt:<\/strong> We are not living a lifestyle that\u2019s living out the ways of Jesus. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Mike:<\/strong> So much of discipleship is showing up.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Matt:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Mike:<\/strong> I mean, it\u2019s simple conversations.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Matt:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Mike:<\/strong> It\u2019s making space in those margins even: having conversations in the minivan; or maybe, you have an older child, and you\u2019re at the pick-up line for a younger child at school\u2014just being able to talk then\/to listen as well\u2014to show up.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> The word that came to my mind is \u201cengage\u201d\u2014 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Mike:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u2014just engage! \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI\u2019m sure we\u2019ve shared it on this program before\u2014and I know we put it in the book\u2014this day, when I was a young dad. Again, you know my story\u2014I didn\u2019t have a dad\u2014so there\u2019s part of me, thinking, \u201cI\u2019m not sure how to raise a disciple,\u201d\u2014I\u2019m not even sure how to be a dad\u2014\u201chow to be a spiritual disciple-maker, you know, of my three boys.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe\u2019re at the playground; they\u2019re all playing on the jungle gym. I\u2019m sitting, watching Ann play with our boys. Literally, having this moment like, \u201cThis is awesome! I\u2019m a dad. I\u2019ve got a legacy now. I never did!\u2014my dad never did this.\u201d I was sitting there; and I actually, looked around and saw other dads doing the same thing. I was thinking, \u201cThis is cool\u201d; you know? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnn comes walking over\u2014and she just told this story, so it\u2019s fresh\u2014she comes walking over\u2014and tell them what you think you said. I\u2019ll tell them what you really said. [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> The <em>way<\/em> I thought I said it was, \u201cWhat are you doing?\u201d He goes, \u201cThis is amazing! I\u2019m watching the boys.\u201d I\u2019m like, \u201cAre you going to be one of <em>those <\/em>dads?\u2014that\u2019s just sitting, observing?\u201d He said, \u201cUhhhh, yes; this is cool!\u201d [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Anyway, she\u2019s being nice! She sat down and said, \u201c<em>What are you doing<\/em>?!\u201d\u2014just like that\u2014[Laughter]\u2014like, \u201cLook what you\u2019re doing!\u201d And I did; I had <em>no<\/em> eyes to see what was happening.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Mike:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I was like, \u201cThis is great!\u201d She goes, \u201cAre you going to be one of these dads that watches? Look at the other dads; are you going to engage?\u201d And she leaves. I was sitting there, going, \u201cGod, did You just talk to me?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Yes! [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> All I\u2019m saying is that day, it was a moment for me, as a young father,\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Mike:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u2014to go, \u201cI have an opportunity to engage.\u201d Now, here\u2019s the thing\u2014I became that dad\u2014in the front yard, engaging\u2014 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> You did.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u2014again, not perfectly\u2014but when you say to me, \u201cOkay, engage spiritually to lead your boys\u201d\u2014and if you have daughters\u2014\u201cto become disciples,\u201d then I was like, \u201cWhat does that look like?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Valerie:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Mike:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I think a lot of our listeners or parents are like, \u201cI can get my kid to church. And I agree, I need to do that\u2014but my side of training and instructing in the Lord\u2014I\u2019m not sure I know what that looks like.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Matt:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> So what would you say to them? Because obviously, getting another person from the church to influence them is a key learning; that\u2019s <em>huge<\/em>.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Matt:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> As we look back on our sons, we had that; and you did as well. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut talk to the dad or mom, who says, \u201cI\u2019m not sure what I would do.\u201d What would you tell them to do <em>besides<\/em> connect to the church?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Valerie:<\/strong> You know, I think to answer that question, I would like to just back us up a little bit and look at the context of the culture that we\u2019re living in. We are living with people, who are shattered. It reminds me of my neighborhood\u2014we had a terrible situation\u2014we were the only believers in this neighborhood. They knew we were in ministry; we didn\u2019t have a choice not to be a witness or anything. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe had a night where a girl from the high school was killed in an accident three days\/very close to graduation. It shook us all! Before we knew it, they started showing up\u2014families from our neighborhood\u2014to our house. It just was the place to come. In this situation, we held hands; we were all crying. And nobody, except our family, knew how to pray; but they <em>knew<\/em> where to come! They <em>knew<\/em> that they needed God\u2019s people, and they needed God\u2019s comfort when they couldn\u2019t answer those questions for their children.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think we\u2019re living in a very similar time. I think that there is an understanding that our neighbors need God\u2019s people. We need the church; they need the church. We need answers for the questions that we have right now. I see this as a tremendous opportunity for the church to be the shining light. I love these Scriptures\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I was just thinking of: \u201cYou are the light of the world.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Valerie:<\/strong> Yes; \u201cDo everything without grumbling or arguing, so that you may become blameless and pure, children of God without fault in a warped and crooked generation. Then you will shine among them like lights, like stars in the sky.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Valerie:<\/strong> That\u2019s Philippians 2. I think that\u2019s a picture of God\u2019s dream for us during this COVID time\u2014that the church would shine like stars\u2014isn\u2019t that a beautiful phrase?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Valerie:<\/strong> That they would <em>know <\/em>that they can come to us for comfort, and understanding, and interpretation of what they\u2019ve just gone through.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Matt:<\/strong> I\u2019d like to draw a direct line between that and how to make this uber-practical; some good handles here. Let\u2019s talk about that \u201cwarped and crooked generation.\u201d Our children\u2014we\u2019ve got a choice!\u2014\u201cAre we going to build a moat of protection around them?\u201d\u2014which, I think we all know, is an illusion; right?\u2014\u201cor do we want to prepare them to thrive, like those shining stars, in the midst of a crooked generation?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tOur kids need heart and spine; right? They need a heart to be compassionate\u2014to engage the culture around them\u2014but they\u2019ve got to be rooted in the gospel\/in the spine of truth. We have to help our kids have compassion\u2014to say: \u201cI hear you,\u201d \u201cI\u2019m listening,\u201d \u201cI love you\u201d; but to not waver from the gospel. Heart and spine: that\u2019s what our children need. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Mike:<\/strong> Yes; we can also talk about that from having the ability to stand, uncompromisingly, on truth; right?\u2014that would be that spine. But also, to be kind of just unquestionable in your love: \u201cThey will know we are Christians by our love.\u201d That wasn\u2019t just a throwaway bumper sticker\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Yes, yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Mike:<\/strong> \u2014back in the day of Christ. That was for us today\/His disciples, here, today. What an opportunity we have in our homes, and at our block parties; you know?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Matt:<\/strong> Mike, there\u2019s risk in heart and spine; right?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Mike:<\/strong> Oh!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Matt:<\/strong> There\u2019s risk. If I communicate love, and if I communicate compassion\u2014but I\u2019m not wavering from truth\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Mike:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Matt:<\/strong> \u2014we, as the church, have got to lead. We\u2019ve got to help our kids to lead with heart and spine.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> And the truth is\u2014and you know this\u2014if heart and spine isn\u2019t modeled by mom and dad\u2014or single mom, or single dad, or blended family\u2014it\u2019s going to be hard for the kid\/our children to catch it. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Mike:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> The challenge even, as we wrap up\u2014for me is\u2014to look men in the eyes and say, \u201cMan, heart!\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Mike:<\/strong> Yes, yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u201cRadical love for you, as dads.\u201d And Ann can do that for the moms. But, for the parents, I would just say: \u201cMan, what does it look like to radically love God and love your neighbor?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Mike:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u201cWhat does it look like to stand strong on the Word?\u201d As a parent, as you\u2019re trying to create that in your kids, it starts <em>here<\/em>. You can\u2019t give away what you don\u2019t first possess, and it starts with <em>us<\/em>.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> I think all of us, as parents, can recognize that we tend to lean in one direction or another\u2014either heart or spine; full of truth or full of grace\u2014we need to make sure that we are demonstrating and modeling both of those for our children, that that\u2019s a part of the reality of who we are as followers of Christ. Live that out\u2014and then call our kids to the same commitment to truth, with an equal commitment to grace, and mercy, and kindness, and generosity\u2014the heart of the gospel.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tGreat conversation today as Dave and Ann Wilson have bene talking to Valerie Bell, Matt Markins, and Mike Handler. They are the co-authors of a book called <em>Resilient: Child Discipleship and the Fearless Future of the Church. <\/em>This is a book, not just for church leaders; but it\u2019s a book for all of us, as parents, to be thinking about how we effectively communicate the message of the gospel to our children in a way that penetrates\/a way that connects with them.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe have copies of the book in our <em>FamilyLife Today <\/em>Resource Center. You can request your copy online at FamilyLifeToday.com. Again, the title of the book is <em>Resilient. <\/em>Or you can call to order; the number is 1-800-FL-TODAY; that\u2019s 1-800-358-6329; 1-800-\u201cF\u201d as in family, \u201cL\u201d as in life, and then the word, \u201cTODAY.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou know, these conversations that we hear every day on <em>FamilyLife Today <\/em>happen because of listeners, just like you, who have made it happen. Some of you, who are listeners, have given, from time to time, to support this ministry. Some of you are regular givers, monthly\u2014what we call\u2014Legacy Partners, who invest in this ministry, month in and month out. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe want to, first of all, say, \u201cThank you,\u201d for your financial support; but we also want to encourage you, if you\u2019re a regular listener, we\u2019re praying\u2014here in the last two weeks of August, as we head into a new fall season\u2014we\u2019re praying that God would raise up, in every city where <em>FamilyLife Today <\/em>is heard, two families who would step forward and say, \u201cWe want to help make <em>FamilyLife Today <\/em>possible in our community. We want to make sure the program is on, not just for us, but for the tens of thousands of people, who are listening in our community, or the hundreds of thousands of people, who are listening all around the world.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAs a monthly Legacy Partner, you make <em>FamilyLife Today <\/em>possible. Would you join us, first of all, in praying that God would raise up new Legacy Partners? And then, would you consider being one of those new families, in your community, to become a monthly donor to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhen you do, we want to say, \u201cThank you,\u201d first of all, by making available a copy of Dave and Ann Wilson\u2019s new book, which is called <em>No Perfect Parents<\/em>. We also want to send you an all-access pass to a number of messages from Dave and Ann\u2014some of them have been featured on <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>; some of them have never been heard by <em>FamilyLife Today <\/em>listeners\u2014you\u2019ll have access to those messages. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd we want to send you a certificate so that you and your spouse, or someone you know, can attend, as your guest, an upcoming <em>Weekend to Remember<\/em><sup>\u00ae<\/sup> marriage getaway. We\u2019re about to kick off the fall season of getaways. There are going to be about 30 getaways in cities all across the country. We\u2019ll send you a certificate so that, as a couple, you can attend; or you can pass it on to someone you\u2019d like to share it with.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAll of this is our way of saying, \u201cThank you for joining the team and becoming a monthly <em>FamilyLife Today <\/em>Legacy Partner.\u201d You can find out more when you go online at FamilyLifeToday.com, or you can call 1-800-FL-TODAY. If you\u2019re not able to become a Legacy Partner, but you can make a one-time gift today, we\u2019d still love to hear from you; and we\u2019ll send you a copy of Dave and Ann\u2019s book, <em>No Perfect Parents, <\/em>along with access to these messages from the Wilsons, as well, for making a one-time gift. Again, you can do that online at FamilyLifeToday.com; or call 1-800-FL-TODAY to donate. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd we hope you can join us, again, tomorrow when we\u2019re going to talk about how we can raise sons and daughters, who know how to winsomely\/effectively share their faith with their peers. How can we raise sons and daughters who are evangelists? We\u2019ll talk more about that tomorrow. I hope you can tune in for that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tOn behalf of our hosts, Dave and Ann Wilson, I\u2019m Bob Lepine. We\u2019ll see you back next time for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today. <\/em>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife; a Cru<sup>\u00ae <\/sup>Ministry. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHelping you pursue the relationships that matter most.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright <sup>\u00a9<\/sup> 2021 FamilyLife. All rights reserved.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/\">www.FamilyLife.com<\/a>\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\n\t\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\t1\n\t\t\t\t<\/p>","theme_header_position":"","post_header_is_sticky":"","is_header_overlay":""},"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast\/307201","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/podcast"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/91"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=307201"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/294104"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=307201"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=307201"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=307201"},{"taxonomy":"podcast_series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast_series?post=307201"},{"taxonomy":"cwp_profile","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/cwp_profile?post=307201"},{"taxonomy":"series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/series?post=307201"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}