{"id":306953,"date":"2021-07-21T07:00:05","date_gmt":"2021-07-21T11:00:05","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/%series%\/live-to-forgive\/"},"modified":"2021-07-21T07:00:05","modified_gmt":"2021-07-21T11:00:05","slug":"live-to-forgive","status":"publish","type":"podcast","link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/live-to-forgive\/","title":{"rendered":"Live To Forgive"},"content":{"rendered":"","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Being let down by those closest to us can sometimes make them the hardest to forgive. Jason Romano tells the story of the work God did to help him forgive his dad.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":91,"featured_media":294104,"menu_order":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","template":"","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","inline_featured_image":false,"_uag_custom_page_level_css":"","episode_type":"","audio_file":"https:\/\/mp3.familylife.com\/fl2021-07-21.mp3","podmotor_file_id":"","podmotor_episode_id":"","cover_image":"","cover_image_id":"","duration":"00:29:41","filesize":"27.17M","filesize_raw":"28491420","date_recorded":"","explicit":"","block":""},"categories":[2906,2822,2825],"tags":[6989,2699],"podcast_series":[],"cwp_profile":[9692],"series":[2101],"class_list":["post-306953","podcast","type-podcast","status-publish","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-becoming-a-christian","category-growing-in-your-faith","category-honoring-your-parents","tag-adult-relationship-with-parents","tag-forgiveness","cwp_profile-jason-romano","series-familylife-today"],"acf":[],"episode_featured_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/09\/FLT-Podcast-Cover-2-508x508-3.jpg?w=508","episode_player_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2023\/02\/image-scaled.jpg","download_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-download\/306953\/live-to-forgive","player_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-player\/306953\/live-to-forgive","audio_player":null,"episode_data":{"playerMode":"light","subscribeUrls":{"apple_podcasts":{"key":"apple_podcasts","url":"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303?mt=2&app=podcast","label":"Apple Podcasts","class":"apple_podcasts","icon":"apple-podcasts.png"},"google_podcasts":{"key":"google_podcasts","url":"","label":"Google Podcasts","class":"google_podcasts","icon":"google-podcasts.png"},"spotify":{"key":"spotify","url":"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm","label":"Spotify","class":"spotify","icon":"spotify.png"},"youtube":{"key":"youtube","url":"","label":"YouTube","class":"youtube","icon":"youtube.png"}},"rssFeedUrl":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/feed\/podcast\/familylife-today","embedCode":"<blockquote class=\"wp-embedded-content\" data-secret=\"ORk1nRX81q\"><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/live-to-forgive\/\">Live To Forgive<\/a><\/blockquote><iframe sandbox=\"allow-scripts\" security=\"restricted\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/live-to-forgive\/embed\/#?secret=ORk1nRX81q\" width=\"500\" height=\"350\" title=\"&#8220;Live To Forgive&#8221; &#8212; FamilyLife\u00ae - A Cru Ministry\" data-secret=\"ORk1nRX81q\" frameborder=\"0\" marginwidth=\"0\" marginheight=\"0\" scrolling=\"no\" class=\"wp-embedded-content\"><\/iframe><script>\n\/*! This file is auto-generated *\/\n!function(d,l){\"use strict\";l.querySelector&&d.addEventListener&&\"undefined\"!=typeof URL&&(d.wp=d.wp||{},d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage||(d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage=function(e){var t=e.data;if((t||t.secret||t.message||t.value)&&!\/[^a-zA-Z0-9]\/.test(t.secret)){for(var s,r,n,a=l.querySelectorAll('iframe[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),o=l.querySelectorAll('blockquote[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),c=new RegExp(\"^https?:$\",\"i\"),i=0;i<o.length;i++)o[i].style.display=\"none\";for(i=0;i<a.length;i++)s=a[i],e.source===s.contentWindow&&(s.removeAttribute(\"style\"),\"height\"===t.message?(1e3<(r=parseInt(t.value,10))?r=1e3:~~r<200&&(r=200),s.height=r):\"link\"===t.message&&(r=new URL(s.getAttribute(\"src\")),n=new URL(t.value),c.test(n.protocol))&&n.host===r.host&&l.activeElement===s&&(d.top.location.href=t.value))}},d.addEventListener(\"message\",d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage,!1),l.addEventListener(\"DOMContentLoaded\",function(){for(var e,t,s=l.querySelectorAll(\"iframe.wp-embedded-content\"),r=0;r<s.length;r++)(t=(e=s[r]).getAttribute(\"data-secret\"))||(t=Math.random().toString(36).substring(2,12),e.src+=\"#?secret=\"+t,e.setAttribute(\"data-secret\",t)),e.contentWindow.postMessage({message:\"ready\",secret:t},\"*\")},!1)))}(window,document);\n\/\/# sourceURL=https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-includes\/js\/wp-embed.min.js\n<\/script>\n"},"spectra_custom_meta":{"_wp_page_template":["default"],"transcript_url":["https:\/\/transcript.familylife.com\/fl2021-07-21.pdf"],"audio_file":["https:\/\/mp3.familylife.com\/fl2021-07-21.mp3"],"transcript_content":["<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> I pretty much lost all respect for him, at that point, when he calls me and asks me for money. I\u2019m like, \u201cYou spent all your money on gambling and drinking and now you\u2019re calling me, in college, and saying, \u2018Can I borrow money?\u2019\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Welcome to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>, where we want to help you pursue the relationships that matter most. I\u2019m Ann Wilson.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> And I\u2019m Dave Wilson, and you can find us at FamilyLifeToday.com or on our FamilyLife<sup>\u00ae<\/sup> app.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> This is <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Today, we\u2019ve got Jason Romano with us, one of our great friends. Welcome to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. Jason, glad to have you back.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> Thanks for having me back, guys.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Jason leads really an incredible ministry called <em>Sports Spectrum<\/em>, where they interview athletes about their faith. Formerly, he was with ESPN for 17 years\u2014a job we all wish we had\u2014I wish I had.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Do we?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Oh, yes; what a <em>great<\/em>\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Every guy wishes for that?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u2014I mean, it\u2019s just something you turn on everyday at 7 am and turn it off at midnight.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Oh, that\u2019s terrible.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> So anyway\u2014I\u2019m just kidding; I\u2019m just kidding\u2014but really, what he\u2019s doing now is phenomenal. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut <em>you<\/em>, Jason, have an incredible story with <em>your<\/em> dad that, when I read your book about\u2014well, you\u2019re going to tell us today about that\u2014but man, your relationship with your dad was similar to mine; wasn\u2019t it?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> I had a father, growing up, who wasn\u2019t around.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u2014physically or emotionally?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> \u2014emotionally.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> If you had to describe him, as a little boy like under 12, what would you have described him as?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> I would describe him as a very loud\u2014in some cases, angry\u2014person who loved sports. That\u2019s the best way I could have described him.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> And then you got older, and you became resentful.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> Very much so. In fact, the 12-year-old Jason, I never felt love from my father. I\u2019m sure he loved me\u2014and of course, I under the current here loved him, too, because he\u2019s [my] dad\u2014but I never <em>felt<\/em> that love. The only way I ever really felt love from my father, even growing up through high school into college, was when we would have a connection for sports and when he was sober. Unfortunately, because of the drinking, he wasn\u2019t sober that often. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAs I got older, and I started experiencing things as a teenager, and seeing him in states that you shouldn\u2019t have to see your dad in\u2014usually drunk\u2014I became very <em>resentful<\/em> and very angry. Didn\u2019t know how to process it; I didn\u2019t have anybody in my life to walk me through it other than my mom. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to be careful here, because my mom saved us [Jason and siblings]. I tell people, \u201cWhen we were easily headed down a track like my father, my mom kept us back on the narrow\/the straight and narrow and <em>allowed<\/em> us to have experiences, like normal kids, even though our relationship with my dad was anything but normal.\u201d For the most part, other than that, I kind of had just a normal childhood, thankfully: you know, just going to school, playing sports, hanging out with my friends.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> And it sounds like you lost respect for him.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> Very much so, especially as I got older, and I got into my\/got into college and, even more, out of college. I\u2019ll tell you a time when I definitely realized I\u2019d lost respect for him\u2014when I was in college\u201419 years old. I went away; it was a community college, but it was about three hours away. I lived in an off-campus apartment, growing up quickly, just trying to live on my own. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI got a call at midnight from my father; I\u2019m like, \u201cWhat\u2019s going on here?\u201d I knew my dad wasn\u2019t in a good place anyways. At that point, he\u2019d already missed my high school graduation because he was in a rehab center; so I knew he wasn\u2019t doing well. I answer the phone. My dad is on the other end, calling up, telling me that he had no money and was asking me for money. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNow, I\u2019m in college. Anybody listening, who\u2019s ever went to college, knows that we are the <em>poorest<\/em> people on earth; [Laughter] we have <em>no<\/em> money. But it was so bad that my dad got so desperate. I think he was hoping that I would have some kind of empathy or sympathy for him\/feel sorry for him. \u201cI\u2019m sorry, Dad, that you\u2019re in this spot\/that you lost all your money. Sure, I\u2019ll send you the $5 that I have,\u201d which is pretty much what it was. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut I pretty much lost all respect for him, at that point, when he calls me and asks me for money. I\u2019m like, \u201cAre you serious? You drank yourself out of this. You spent all your money on\u201d\u2014he gambled a lot too\u2014\"so you spent all your money on gambling and drinking and now you\u2019re calling me, in college, and saying, \u2018Can I borrow money?\u2019 What are you doing?! What are you doing?!\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> There\u2019s, obviously, an <em>anger<\/em>\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> Very much so.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u2014there, and you even said your brothers wanted to <em>kill<\/em> him.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> Oh, yes. There was a time\u2014this was a couple of years after this\u2014in fact, one of the chapters in <em>Live to Forgive<\/em> is the time my brothers wanted to kill my dad. We didn\u2019t know how else to title that chapter other than what it was. This was a story that they told; I wasn\u2019t even around for this. I wanted, as people read the book, to see that it wasn\u2019t just me that was affected by what my dad had done; my two brothers went through this too.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Are they older or younger?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> They\u2019re younger; I\u2019m the oldest. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tOne day, my dad comes home. My dad was\u2014it was up and down with him\u2014I mean, when he had his bad moments, it was really bad. My dad shows up drunk, and my brothers saw that my dad was yelling and screaming at our grandparents. My one brother, Damian, and him got in a verbal exchange but, also, a physical exchange.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> And at this point, <em>none<\/em> of you are believers or followers of Christ. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> None of us are [at this point]; so we have no faith\/no understanding of who Jesus is. Even after that, which we can talk about, I still had a lot of issues with my father; but at that moment, my brother saw what had happened to my dad. He said, \u201cListen, you\u2019ve got to call the cops on this guy; because I\u2019m going to kill him if he doesn\u2019t get out of my face right now.\u201d It was that much anger that that had spilled up in my brother\u2019s life. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhen they told that story for the book, I remember talking to them and saying, \u201cI don\u2019t think I knew all about this.\u201d I remember them telling me kind of: \u201cThere was a time we almost killed Dad,\u201d or \u201c\u2026felt like we wanted to kill him\u201d; but I had not experienced that. But I\u2019m glad they told me; because I went through my own stuff with him, but they went through it too. So this wasn\u2019t just a Jason story; this was all three of my dad\u2019s sons\u2019 story that we all went through, and it was bad.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> And so a few years later, you surrender your life to Jesus;\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u2014and it all goes away; right? [Laughter] Everything\u2019s wonderful and\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> Isn\u2019t that how it\u2019s supposed to work, Dave?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u2014perfect relationship.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> Oh, yes; \u201cThank You, Jesus!\u201d [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> So really, talk about that; because some people may think that\u2019s true. You still had a struggle, and you had to go on a journey. Tell us what happened.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> Very much so. I\u2019m so grateful that that day took place that I began that journey with Jesus. My brother, Chris, who I just mentioned, led me to the Lord Mother\u2019s Day 2001\u201420 years now; I\u2019ll never forget it. I had to understand who Jesus was for me; it was my relationship. But there were many moments, even after that, where I didn\u2019t understand truly what <em>forgiveness<\/em> was about and understanding how to process what was going on with my father. Even after I became a Christian, my dad still continued his battle and his struggle with alcohol for the next 15 years. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Had you shared your faith with him?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> Yes; mult\/I wouldn\u2019t say multiple times, but a few times. I mean, all three of his boys now are Christians. A little bit of a spoiler alert: my dad\u2019s not walking with the Lord still to this day; so that is a tension in our home a little bit. I\u2019ll get to how he\u2019s doing in a second.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut he, at that point\u2014you know, I\u2019m walking and trying to <em>learn<\/em> who Jesus is: trying to understand salvation, and the cross, and forgiveness\u2014and if you read the words of Paul, he says, \u201cLet all bitterness and anger and wrath and slander and clamor be put away from you, along with all malice,\u201d\u2014verse 32\u2014\u201cBe kind to one another, forgive as God in Christ has forgiven you.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThat part\u2014the \u201cLet all bitterness and wrath and anger\u2026\u201d\u2014like that didn\u2019t happen. It took me a very, very long time to understand; because what would happen is: my dad and I\/we lived two hours apart. My dad, unfortunately, had a DWI. In 2006, he lost his license; so he wasn\u2019t able to drive. We very rarely saw each other\u2014a couple of times a year, even in the midst of his drinking\u2014but we would <em>talk<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHis outlet was to pick up the phone and call. My dad has never had a smartphone. He doesn\u2019t have\/he\u2019s never been on the internet to this day\u2014has no email\u2014it\u2019s good old-fashioned 1993 relationship, where he picks up the phone and calls you. That was good; but it wasn\u2019t good, because that was where he would go to\u2014especially when he drank\u2014he would pick up that phone and he would call. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHere\u2019s how I knew I hadn\u2019t forgiven my father: when he would call, and he was sober, everything was fine. We can talk; we can have\/most of our conversations revolved around sports, but we could talk. But when he called and he was drunk, I turned into a different person\u2014I turned into, in essence, <em>him<\/em>\u2014I wasn\u2019t drunk, but I was <em>angry<\/em>; I was <em>bitter<\/em>; I was lashing out, saying things back to him that you wouldn\u2019t want to wish anybody would say to anyone. That\u2019s not the example of Jesus, and it took me a long time to forgive him.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Well what happened? I mean, there\u2019s a journey\u2014I\u2019ve been on that journey, so I know it can take a <em>long<\/em> time\u2014but what changed?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> I think what changed was this powerful word\u2014that we all need more of, I think, in our lives\u2014empathy. See, I never saw my dad and thought about what he was going through. I only thought about what he did, or how he acted, and how it affected me\u2014how it affected my wife, my daughter, my brothers, my mom, extended family\u2014I mean, my dad ruined a lot of relationships because of his drinking. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI always thought about the effect it had on other people. I never thought about how it affected him. He must not have enjoyed the life that he was living; seriously. I always thought, \u201cMan, this guy\u2019s probably just this bad dude, who would say these things,\u201d and \u201cI just wish he would stop drinking,\u201d\u2014for many years, that was my prayer. My prayer was simply\u2014even after I became a Christian, it wasn\u2019t that he would come to Jesus; this is just honesty here\u2014it was that he would stop drinking. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut it came to a boiling point in 2013, where my dad hit his lowest point. At this point\u2014my dad is not only drinking heavily still, and he\u2019s in his early 60s here\u2014he\u2019s also struggling with depression. When you combine the alcohol and the depression, that\u2019s a recipe for disaster; it was bad. My dad hit his lowest point in 2013; he tried to end his life\u2014woke up one day, just didn\u2019t want to live\u2014he had hinted at that in the past on different phone calls. I had heard that since he was 40 years old on phone calls\/that: \u201cMaybe I\u2019ll just end my life. Maybe I\u2019m just not worth living for.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThere were moments\u2014I hate to admit this\u2014but it\u2019s the truth in where I was in my walk, where I thought it would be better, maybe, if he wasn\u2019t here. I hate saying that, but it\u2019s true. I didn\u2019t, again, have that empathy for my dad. I just thought, \u201cWell, this was easy if it just would all go away.\u201d My dad thought that way, too; and he tried to end his life. He took a bunch of pills. Thankfully, I think really quickly after he took those pills, he recognized that this wasn\u2019t a good situation. He called 911; they came. They took him to the hospital; and they saved him in a sense, and he\u2019s alive. He\u2019s still alive today, thankfully. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut it was at that moment, when I got the call from the nurse\u2014and here\u2019s where I know where my mindset was with my father, at that point, six, seven, eight years ago now\u2014the nurse calls me and says, \u201cJason, your father is here at the hospital\u2014took some pills last night\u2014but we have him, and he\u2019s okay. He\u2019s going to survive. We didn\u2019t know if you wanted to come visit him, or if you wanted to come up and see him, or whatever.\u201d I said, \u201cNo, I\u2019m good. Thank you for calling me and letting me know that.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI hang up the phone, and I had nothing. I was numb; I didn\u2019t even have any feeling\u2014there was no sadness; there was no empathy\u2014\u201cMaybe this is just what needs to happen; it just needs to go away.\u201d But I spent the next week really diving deep into prayer, talking to my pastor\/my small group and sharing. I\u2019ve always shared about my dad and just say, \u201cCan you pray for him? He\u2019s still struggling with his alcohol.\u201d While at this point, I\u2019m saying, \u201cCan you pray for him? He\u2019s now in a really, really bad spot; he tried to end his life.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tMy pastor and I had a conversation one day; and he goes, \u201cYou know, you need to think about forgiving him.\u201d I\u2019m like, \u201cI don\u2019t know what you\u2019re talking about. I\u2019m fine; I forgave him years ago.\u201d I had thought I had forgiven him for many years; but every single time he would call, and he would be drunk, and I would lash back out, I realized I hadn\u2019t forgiven him. I was still bitter; the bitterness was there. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAllowing him back into my life I thought was forgiveness, but that\u2019s not what it is. Because forgiveness is <em>not<\/em> about the other person; in fact, it\u2019s <em>never<\/em> about the other person. Forgiveness is about ourselves and the chains that we carry when we hold onto that bitterness and that unforgiveness. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tA week later, my dad, actually from the hospital, calls me. He\u2019s <em>lifeless<\/em>; the voice I hear on the other end is just a man, who has no intention to want to live anymore. When I heard my dad\u2019s voice that day\u2014maybe it was because of what my pastor said; maybe it was just because I finally had empathy for my father for the first time in my life\u2014that was the moment, where I told him, verbally, that I forgave him. I said, \u201cListen, Dad, I know what you\u2019re going through; I\u2019m so sorry.\u201d I said, \u201cI just want you to know I forgive you and don\u2019t worry about anything else right now; just get better.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> What was his response?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> My dad was not feeling great at that time, so there wasn\u2019t really a response. It was most like\u2014it wasn\u2019t even \u201cThank you\u201d; it was like, you know, \u201cWhatever.\u201d But it wasn\u2019t about my father at that point; for that moment, it was what <em>I<\/em> needed. Now, it also was what my dad needed; but I had to make a decision that, if my dad never could get sober, I still had to choose to forgive him; because it wasn\u2019t about him. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI\u2019m happy to report\u2014that day, when he went into the hospital\u2014that\u2019s the last day, to this day, that he\u2019s had a drink. He\u2019s been able to stay sober now for seven\/almost eight years. That\u2019s a miracle in its own right; and that\u2019s an answer to prayer, because that\u2019s where my dad was\u2014and that\u2019s what I prayed for\u2014was for him to get sober. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNow, we\u2019re hoping someday that he begins a walk with the Lord; and that still hasn\u2019t happened yet. Our relationship now is better, but it\u2019s not great\u2014but it\u2019s not horrible anymore, and there\u2019s no bitterness\u2014there\u2019s still things that my dad does, where I\u2019m just like, \u201cOh my gosh! Please stop.\u201d [Laughter] But I\u2019ve forgiven him; reconciliation for us took place. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI tell people: \u201cForgiveness is <em>always<\/em> required, because Jesus tells us to\u2014just read \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tMatthew 18; just read various other passages in the Bible\u2014but where forgiveness is <em>always<\/em> required, reconciliation sometimes can\u2019t always take place. Sometimes the damage is not repairable; but again, remembering that forgiveness is not about anything that other person does; it\u2019s for yourself.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I remember when I was toward the end of my journey of forgiving my dad, I read this quote by Lewis Smedes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> Yes! It\u2019s in my book.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Lewis is one of the guys\u2014that is [in]my opinion: an authority\u2014so much written about forgiveness. Lewis says: \u201cWhen you forgive someone, you set a prisoner free, only to discover you\u2019re the prisoner.\u201d I mean, I literally [book dropping] dropped the book. I mean, it hit me; the second I read it, I\u2019m like, \u201cOh, my goodness; I\u2019m the prisoner.\u201d I <em>thought<\/em> I was locking him up: \u201cAnd that\u2019s what he gets,\u201d and \u201cThat\u2019s what he deserves for all these years of alcohol and abandoning your son,\u201d\u2014blah, blah, blah. When I read that, it hit me. It was like God was saying, \u201cYou\u2019re the prisoner, and you\u2019re <em>never<\/em> going to be free. You\u2019ve got the key; you\u2019ve got to unlock that, and forgive your dad.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAgain, it didn\u2019t happen that day, but when I did\u2014and I can sit here now, in my 60s, and I used to say it to the men at my church\u2014\u201cI became a man at age 35, because that\u2019s when I was free to become who God wanted Dave Wilson to be. I was not able to be the husband she needed\/the dad my kids\u2014and I\u2019m not saying I\u2019m a perfect man\u2014but it was like, man, it was that <em>big<\/em>, holding onto that bitterness. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI know there\u2019s listeners, right now, it\u2019s like, \u201cI can\u2019t forgive.\u201d\u00a0 I know what\u2014you can\u2019t, and neither could I, and Jason couldn\u2019t either\u2014but God can <em>through<\/em> you. I really think it\u2019s <em>supernatural<\/em>.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> Absolutely.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> It\u2019s a supernatural thing\/a divine power of God, especially when the wound is that deep and hurtful, to be able to let that go.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> Look at the example of Jesus; right? He was beaten, mocked, spit on, made fun of\u2014everything you could imagine a person goes through\u2014and yet, He\u2019s standing there\/or up there on the cross\u2014and the people, who put Him up there, are mocking Him and making fun of Him. He looks down; He says, \u201cFather, forgive them for they don\u2019t know what they\u2019re doing.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I will say, as a wife, it was probably the most marked difference in Dave that I\u2019ve ever seen; because he became free. I think you had an anger issue kind of simmering below the surface all the time.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u2014just like Jason was saying.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Yes, and you really were released from that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> And here\u2019s the thing that is so critical to understand, and if you\u2019re a dad or you\u2019re a mom, please hear this: \u201cIf you don\u2019t deal with this, you will continue it. It will go into your legacy; you pass it on. The sins of the father visit through the generations.\u201d I didn\u2019t know it then\u2014that my decision to forgive my dad\u2014would affect my sons. They didn\u2019t really even know; they were so young at the time. And again, I\u2019m not saying they don\u2019t have bitterness and those kinds of issues; but man, it changed the legacy because they have a dad, now, who\u2019s free. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd again\u2014not perfect freedom\u2014because you know, we get triggered at times; but it\u2019s like I no longer have this desire to punish him. That\u2019s what Smedes defines forgiveness: \u201cYou give up your right to punish.\u201d You know, God\/[Jesus] was punished <em>for<\/em> us and forgave us; and we can do the same thing. I would say to anyone listening: \u201cToday\u2019s your day.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> It doesn\u2019t mean we\u2019re perfect\u2014absolutely, choose forgiveness\u2014but it doesn\u2019t mean we\u2019re perfect either. I still struggle with\u2014not anger I would say\u2014but lashing out sometimes at my daughter, or my wife, or a few people. But I will say that, having chosen forgiveness, especially walking through writing a book about forgiveness, has helped me understand that that\u2019s available to us every single day. Like that\u2019s what we do every single day when we wake up to Jesus and we say, \u201cGod, forgive us of our sins.\u201d We\u2019re asking for forgiveness every day; but then it\u2019s our responsibility then, to be Christ-like in that, to exude that on everybody else. If we don\u2019t, we\u2019re basically putting a hand in God\u2019s face and saying, \u201cI got this\u201d; and that\u2019s when we get in trouble.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> And we don\u2019t have this.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> We don\u2019t have it, clearly! [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I\u2019d say, \u201cPick up Jason\u2019s book today, <em>Live to Forgive<\/em>. I love the subtitle, <em>Moving Forward When Those We Love Hurt Us<\/em>. You want to move forward?\u2014it starts right here.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Dave, will you pray?\u2014just for people that are struggling with that\/that are struggling with forgiving people.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I\u2019d love to do that. Let\u2019s pray. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tFather, You know better than any of us the pain of what it took to offer Your Son as the payment for our sin and to forgive us. We didn\u2019t deserve it; we didn\u2019t even ask You for it. But You unconditionally loved us, and You love us still, and You made a way for us to be completely forgiven and free. And through the blood of our Savior, Jesus, and even through His resurrection, we have, not only forgiveness to ourselves, but we actually have the power of God residing in us to empower us to forgive others that don\u2019t deserve it. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tLord, just as You have forgiven us, give us the power to forgive others and set them free; but in the process, set ourselves free. Lord, I know we cannot do it without You; and we need You desperately to help us. We ask right now; and we commit we will do and we will be what You call us to be through Your Son, Jesus. We thank You for His forgiveness. We pray in His name. Amen.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Amen.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> Amen.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> I have to think that many of us, as we\u2019ve listened today to Dave and Ann Wilson talking with Jason Romano about his relationship with his father, we\u2019ve thought about people in our own lives\u2014maybe parents, maybe siblings, other family members, who have wounded us\u2014and the question is: \u201cHave we been able to move to forgiveness?\u201d Jason has written about his relationship with his dad in a book called <em>Live to Forgive: Moving Forward When Those We Love Hurt Us<\/em>. It\u2019s a book we\u2019ve got in our <em>Family Life Today<\/em> Resource Center. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt\u2019s a book I think many of us would benefit from reading. The Bible makes it clear that a failure to forgive says something about our own relationship with Jesus. If we are forgiven people, we forgive others. You can get a copy of Jason\u2019s book, <em>Live to Forgive<\/em>, when you order it, online, at FamilyLifeToday.com; or call to order at 1-800-358-6329; that\u2019s 1-800-\u201cF\u201d as in family, \u201cL\u201d as in life and then the word, \u201cTODAY.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou know, our goal, here, at FamilyLife is to effectively develop godly marriages and families. We believe that what the Bible teaches about relationships is something that all of us need a better understanding of. It\u2019s something we need to embrace and live out as followers of Christ. So each day on <em>FamilyLife Today,<\/em> we provide you with practical biblical help and hope for your marriage and your family. We want to challenge you, and encourage you, and equip you to live out your faith in your home. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe\u2019re able to do this because your fellow listeners\/people just like you have reached out in the past and have made today\u2019s program possible. <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is entirely listener-supported. The program you\u2019ve heard today happened because of their contributions. I want to challenge you: \u201cIf you\u2019re a regular listener to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>, and if you\u2019ve never made a donation, today would be a great day for you to join the team: to pay it forward\/to help others in your community, and around the world, benefit from what they\u2019re hearing on <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\u201d There are hundreds of thousands of people, who connect with us every day. You help make that possible when you donate. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIf you\u2019re able to make a donation today, we\u2019d love to send you, as a thank-you gift, a copy of Arlene Pellicane\u2019s book, <em>Screen Kids<\/em>, all about how, as parents, we can wisely manage the screen time in our homes and with our kids\u2014not just our kids\u2014with us too. I mean, we\u2019ve got to be shrewd about how we handle screens. Arlene\u2019s book is our thank-you gift when you go online today and make a donation at FamilyLifeToday.com or when you call 1-800-358-6329\u20141-800-FL-TODAY\u2014and make a donation over the phone. Just ask for a copy of the book, <em>Screen Kids. <\/em>Thank you for being part of the <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> team and making this program, and all that we do at FamilyLife, possible for so many.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd we hope you can join us, again, tomorrow when we\u2019re going to talk about managing screens at home. Arlene Pellicane was with us last week; she\u2019s back again this week to continue the conversation. I hope you can join us for that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tOn behalf of our hosts, Dave and Ann Wilson, I\u2019m Bob Lepine. We will see you tomorrow for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife; a Cru<sup>\u00ae <\/sup>Ministry. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHelping you pursue the relationships that matter most.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright <sup>\u00a9<\/sup> 2021 FamilyLife. All rights reserved.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/\">www.FamilyLife.com<\/a>\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\n\t\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\t1\n\t\t\t\t<\/p>"],"_seopress_titles_title":[""],"_seopress_titles_desc":[""],"_seopress_robots_index":[""],"duration":["00:29:41"],"show_notes":[""],"_thumbnail_id":["294104"],"filesize":["27.17M"],"filesize_raw":["28491420"],"_uag_css_file_name":["uag-css-306953.css"],"_uag_js_file_name":["uag-js-306953.js"],"_uag_page_assets":["a:9:{s:3:\"css\";s:82560:\".wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape-top svg{width: calc( 100% + 1.3px );}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape.uagb-container__shape-top .uagb-container__shape-fill{fill: rgba(51,51,51,1);}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape-bottom svg{width: calc( 100% + 1.3px );}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape.uagb-container__shape-bottom 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let down by those closest to us can sometimes make them the hardest to forgive. Jason Romano tells the story of the work God did to help him forgive his dad.","meta_box":{"show_notes":"","transcript_url":"https:\/\/transcript.familylife.com\/fl2021-07-21.pdf","transcript_content":"<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> I pretty much lost all respect for him, at that point, when he calls me and asks me for money. I\u2019m like, \u201cYou spent all your money on gambling and drinking and now you\u2019re calling me, in college, and saying, \u2018Can I borrow money?\u2019\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Welcome to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>, where we want to help you pursue the relationships that matter most. I\u2019m Ann Wilson.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> And I\u2019m Dave Wilson, and you can find us at FamilyLifeToday.com or on our FamilyLife<sup>\u00ae<\/sup> app.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> This is <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Today, we\u2019ve got Jason Romano with us, one of our great friends. Welcome to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. Jason, glad to have you back.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> Thanks for having me back, guys.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Jason leads really an incredible ministry called <em>Sports Spectrum<\/em>, where they interview athletes about their faith. Formerly, he was with ESPN for 17 years\u2014a job we all wish we had\u2014I wish I had.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Do we?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Oh, yes; what a <em>great<\/em>\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Every guy wishes for that?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u2014I mean, it\u2019s just something you turn on everyday at 7 am and turn it off at midnight.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Oh, that\u2019s terrible.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> So anyway\u2014I\u2019m just kidding; I\u2019m just kidding\u2014but really, what he\u2019s doing now is phenomenal. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut <em>you<\/em>, Jason, have an incredible story with <em>your<\/em> dad that, when I read your book about\u2014well, you\u2019re going to tell us today about that\u2014but man, your relationship with your dad was similar to mine; wasn\u2019t it?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> I had a father, growing up, who wasn\u2019t around.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u2014physically or emotionally?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> \u2014emotionally.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> If you had to describe him, as a little boy like under 12, what would you have described him as?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> I would describe him as a very loud\u2014in some cases, angry\u2014person who loved sports. That\u2019s the best way I could have described him.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> And then you got older, and you became resentful.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> Very much so. In fact, the 12-year-old Jason, I never felt love from my father. I\u2019m sure he loved me\u2014and of course, I under the current here loved him, too, because he\u2019s [my] dad\u2014but I never <em>felt<\/em> that love. The only way I ever really felt love from my father, even growing up through high school into college, was when we would have a connection for sports and when he was sober. Unfortunately, because of the drinking, he wasn\u2019t sober that often. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAs I got older, and I started experiencing things as a teenager, and seeing him in states that you shouldn\u2019t have to see your dad in\u2014usually drunk\u2014I became very <em>resentful<\/em> and very angry. Didn\u2019t know how to process it; I didn\u2019t have anybody in my life to walk me through it other than my mom. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to be careful here, because my mom saved us [Jason and siblings]. I tell people, \u201cWhen we were easily headed down a track like my father, my mom kept us back on the narrow\/the straight and narrow and <em>allowed<\/em> us to have experiences, like normal kids, even though our relationship with my dad was anything but normal.\u201d For the most part, other than that, I kind of had just a normal childhood, thankfully: you know, just going to school, playing sports, hanging out with my friends.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> And it sounds like you lost respect for him.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> Very much so, especially as I got older, and I got into my\/got into college and, even more, out of college. I\u2019ll tell you a time when I definitely realized I\u2019d lost respect for him\u2014when I was in college\u201419 years old. I went away; it was a community college, but it was about three hours away. I lived in an off-campus apartment, growing up quickly, just trying to live on my own. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI got a call at midnight from my father; I\u2019m like, \u201cWhat\u2019s going on here?\u201d I knew my dad wasn\u2019t in a good place anyways. At that point, he\u2019d already missed my high school graduation because he was in a rehab center; so I knew he wasn\u2019t doing well. I answer the phone. My dad is on the other end, calling up, telling me that he had no money and was asking me for money. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNow, I\u2019m in college. Anybody listening, who\u2019s ever went to college, knows that we are the <em>poorest<\/em> people on earth; [Laughter] we have <em>no<\/em> money. But it was so bad that my dad got so desperate. I think he was hoping that I would have some kind of empathy or sympathy for him\/feel sorry for him. \u201cI\u2019m sorry, Dad, that you\u2019re in this spot\/that you lost all your money. Sure, I\u2019ll send you the $5 that I have,\u201d which is pretty much what it was. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut I pretty much lost all respect for him, at that point, when he calls me and asks me for money. I\u2019m like, \u201cAre you serious? You drank yourself out of this. You spent all your money on\u201d\u2014he gambled a lot too\u2014\"so you spent all your money on gambling and drinking and now you\u2019re calling me, in college, and saying, \u2018Can I borrow money?\u2019 What are you doing?! What are you doing?!\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> There\u2019s, obviously, an <em>anger<\/em>\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> Very much so.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u2014there, and you even said your brothers wanted to <em>kill<\/em> him.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> Oh, yes. There was a time\u2014this was a couple of years after this\u2014in fact, one of the chapters in <em>Live to Forgive<\/em> is the time my brothers wanted to kill my dad. We didn\u2019t know how else to title that chapter other than what it was. This was a story that they told; I wasn\u2019t even around for this. I wanted, as people read the book, to see that it wasn\u2019t just me that was affected by what my dad had done; my two brothers went through this too.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Are they older or younger?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> They\u2019re younger; I\u2019m the oldest. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tOne day, my dad comes home. My dad was\u2014it was up and down with him\u2014I mean, when he had his bad moments, it was really bad. My dad shows up drunk, and my brothers saw that my dad was yelling and screaming at our grandparents. My one brother, Damian, and him got in a verbal exchange but, also, a physical exchange.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> And at this point, <em>none<\/em> of you are believers or followers of Christ. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> None of us are [at this point]; so we have no faith\/no understanding of who Jesus is. Even after that, which we can talk about, I still had a lot of issues with my father; but at that moment, my brother saw what had happened to my dad. He said, \u201cListen, you\u2019ve got to call the cops on this guy; because I\u2019m going to kill him if he doesn\u2019t get out of my face right now.\u201d It was that much anger that that had spilled up in my brother\u2019s life. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhen they told that story for the book, I remember talking to them and saying, \u201cI don\u2019t think I knew all about this.\u201d I remember them telling me kind of: \u201cThere was a time we almost killed Dad,\u201d or \u201c\u2026felt like we wanted to kill him\u201d; but I had not experienced that. But I\u2019m glad they told me; because I went through my own stuff with him, but they went through it too. So this wasn\u2019t just a Jason story; this was all three of my dad\u2019s sons\u2019 story that we all went through, and it was bad.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> And so a few years later, you surrender your life to Jesus;\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u2014and it all goes away; right? [Laughter] Everything\u2019s wonderful and\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> Isn\u2019t that how it\u2019s supposed to work, Dave?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u2014perfect relationship.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> Oh, yes; \u201cThank You, Jesus!\u201d [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> So really, talk about that; because some people may think that\u2019s true. You still had a struggle, and you had to go on a journey. Tell us what happened.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> Very much so. I\u2019m so grateful that that day took place that I began that journey with Jesus. My brother, Chris, who I just mentioned, led me to the Lord Mother\u2019s Day 2001\u201420 years now; I\u2019ll never forget it. I had to understand who Jesus was for me; it was my relationship. But there were many moments, even after that, where I didn\u2019t understand truly what <em>forgiveness<\/em> was about and understanding how to process what was going on with my father. Even after I became a Christian, my dad still continued his battle and his struggle with alcohol for the next 15 years. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Had you shared your faith with him?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> Yes; mult\/I wouldn\u2019t say multiple times, but a few times. I mean, all three of his boys now are Christians. A little bit of a spoiler alert: my dad\u2019s not walking with the Lord still to this day; so that is a tension in our home a little bit. I\u2019ll get to how he\u2019s doing in a second.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut he, at that point\u2014you know, I\u2019m walking and trying to <em>learn<\/em> who Jesus is: trying to understand salvation, and the cross, and forgiveness\u2014and if you read the words of Paul, he says, \u201cLet all bitterness and anger and wrath and slander and clamor be put away from you, along with all malice,\u201d\u2014verse 32\u2014\u201cBe kind to one another, forgive as God in Christ has forgiven you.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThat part\u2014the \u201cLet all bitterness and wrath and anger\u2026\u201d\u2014like that didn\u2019t happen. It took me a very, very long time to understand; because what would happen is: my dad and I\/we lived two hours apart. My dad, unfortunately, had a DWI. In 2006, he lost his license; so he wasn\u2019t able to drive. We very rarely saw each other\u2014a couple of times a year, even in the midst of his drinking\u2014but we would <em>talk<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHis outlet was to pick up the phone and call. My dad has never had a smartphone. He doesn\u2019t have\/he\u2019s never been on the internet to this day\u2014has no email\u2014it\u2019s good old-fashioned 1993 relationship, where he picks up the phone and calls you. That was good; but it wasn\u2019t good, because that was where he would go to\u2014especially when he drank\u2014he would pick up that phone and he would call. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHere\u2019s how I knew I hadn\u2019t forgiven my father: when he would call, and he was sober, everything was fine. We can talk; we can have\/most of our conversations revolved around sports, but we could talk. But when he called and he was drunk, I turned into a different person\u2014I turned into, in essence, <em>him<\/em>\u2014I wasn\u2019t drunk, but I was <em>angry<\/em>; I was <em>bitter<\/em>; I was lashing out, saying things back to him that you wouldn\u2019t want to wish anybody would say to anyone. That\u2019s not the example of Jesus, and it took me a long time to forgive him.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Well what happened? I mean, there\u2019s a journey\u2014I\u2019ve been on that journey, so I know it can take a <em>long<\/em> time\u2014but what changed?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> I think what changed was this powerful word\u2014that we all need more of, I think, in our lives\u2014empathy. See, I never saw my dad and thought about what he was going through. I only thought about what he did, or how he acted, and how it affected me\u2014how it affected my wife, my daughter, my brothers, my mom, extended family\u2014I mean, my dad ruined a lot of relationships because of his drinking. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI always thought about the effect it had on other people. I never thought about how it affected him. He must not have enjoyed the life that he was living; seriously. I always thought, \u201cMan, this guy\u2019s probably just this bad dude, who would say these things,\u201d and \u201cI just wish he would stop drinking,\u201d\u2014for many years, that was my prayer. My prayer was simply\u2014even after I became a Christian, it wasn\u2019t that he would come to Jesus; this is just honesty here\u2014it was that he would stop drinking. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut it came to a boiling point in 2013, where my dad hit his lowest point. At this point\u2014my dad is not only drinking heavily still, and he\u2019s in his early 60s here\u2014he\u2019s also struggling with depression. When you combine the alcohol and the depression, that\u2019s a recipe for disaster; it was bad. My dad hit his lowest point in 2013; he tried to end his life\u2014woke up one day, just didn\u2019t want to live\u2014he had hinted at that in the past on different phone calls. I had heard that since he was 40 years old on phone calls\/that: \u201cMaybe I\u2019ll just end my life. Maybe I\u2019m just not worth living for.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThere were moments\u2014I hate to admit this\u2014but it\u2019s the truth in where I was in my walk, where I thought it would be better, maybe, if he wasn\u2019t here. I hate saying that, but it\u2019s true. I didn\u2019t, again, have that empathy for my dad. I just thought, \u201cWell, this was easy if it just would all go away.\u201d My dad thought that way, too; and he tried to end his life. He took a bunch of pills. Thankfully, I think really quickly after he took those pills, he recognized that this wasn\u2019t a good situation. He called 911; they came. They took him to the hospital; and they saved him in a sense, and he\u2019s alive. He\u2019s still alive today, thankfully. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut it was at that moment, when I got the call from the nurse\u2014and here\u2019s where I know where my mindset was with my father, at that point, six, seven, eight years ago now\u2014the nurse calls me and says, \u201cJason, your father is here at the hospital\u2014took some pills last night\u2014but we have him, and he\u2019s okay. He\u2019s going to survive. We didn\u2019t know if you wanted to come visit him, or if you wanted to come up and see him, or whatever.\u201d I said, \u201cNo, I\u2019m good. Thank you for calling me and letting me know that.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI hang up the phone, and I had nothing. I was numb; I didn\u2019t even have any feeling\u2014there was no sadness; there was no empathy\u2014\u201cMaybe this is just what needs to happen; it just needs to go away.\u201d But I spent the next week really diving deep into prayer, talking to my pastor\/my small group and sharing. I\u2019ve always shared about my dad and just say, \u201cCan you pray for him? He\u2019s still struggling with his alcohol.\u201d While at this point, I\u2019m saying, \u201cCan you pray for him? He\u2019s now in a really, really bad spot; he tried to end his life.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tMy pastor and I had a conversation one day; and he goes, \u201cYou know, you need to think about forgiving him.\u201d I\u2019m like, \u201cI don\u2019t know what you\u2019re talking about. I\u2019m fine; I forgave him years ago.\u201d I had thought I had forgiven him for many years; but every single time he would call, and he would be drunk, and I would lash back out, I realized I hadn\u2019t forgiven him. I was still bitter; the bitterness was there. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAllowing him back into my life I thought was forgiveness, but that\u2019s not what it is. Because forgiveness is <em>not<\/em> about the other person; in fact, it\u2019s <em>never<\/em> about the other person. Forgiveness is about ourselves and the chains that we carry when we hold onto that bitterness and that unforgiveness. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tA week later, my dad, actually from the hospital, calls me. He\u2019s <em>lifeless<\/em>; the voice I hear on the other end is just a man, who has no intention to want to live anymore. When I heard my dad\u2019s voice that day\u2014maybe it was because of what my pastor said; maybe it was just because I finally had empathy for my father for the first time in my life\u2014that was the moment, where I told him, verbally, that I forgave him. I said, \u201cListen, Dad, I know what you\u2019re going through; I\u2019m so sorry.\u201d I said, \u201cI just want you to know I forgive you and don\u2019t worry about anything else right now; just get better.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> What was his response?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> My dad was not feeling great at that time, so there wasn\u2019t really a response. It was most like\u2014it wasn\u2019t even \u201cThank you\u201d; it was like, you know, \u201cWhatever.\u201d But it wasn\u2019t about my father at that point; for that moment, it was what <em>I<\/em> needed. Now, it also was what my dad needed; but I had to make a decision that, if my dad never could get sober, I still had to choose to forgive him; because it wasn\u2019t about him. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI\u2019m happy to report\u2014that day, when he went into the hospital\u2014that\u2019s the last day, to this day, that he\u2019s had a drink. He\u2019s been able to stay sober now for seven\/almost eight years. That\u2019s a miracle in its own right; and that\u2019s an answer to prayer, because that\u2019s where my dad was\u2014and that\u2019s what I prayed for\u2014was for him to get sober. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNow, we\u2019re hoping someday that he begins a walk with the Lord; and that still hasn\u2019t happened yet. Our relationship now is better, but it\u2019s not great\u2014but it\u2019s not horrible anymore, and there\u2019s no bitterness\u2014there\u2019s still things that my dad does, where I\u2019m just like, \u201cOh my gosh! Please stop.\u201d [Laughter] But I\u2019ve forgiven him; reconciliation for us took place. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI tell people: \u201cForgiveness is <em>always<\/em> required, because Jesus tells us to\u2014just read \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tMatthew 18; just read various other passages in the Bible\u2014but where forgiveness is <em>always<\/em> required, reconciliation sometimes can\u2019t always take place. Sometimes the damage is not repairable; but again, remembering that forgiveness is not about anything that other person does; it\u2019s for yourself.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I remember when I was toward the end of my journey of forgiving my dad, I read this quote by Lewis Smedes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> Yes! It\u2019s in my book.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Lewis is one of the guys\u2014that is [in]my opinion: an authority\u2014so much written about forgiveness. Lewis says: \u201cWhen you forgive someone, you set a prisoner free, only to discover you\u2019re the prisoner.\u201d I mean, I literally [book dropping] dropped the book. I mean, it hit me; the second I read it, I\u2019m like, \u201cOh, my goodness; I\u2019m the prisoner.\u201d I <em>thought<\/em> I was locking him up: \u201cAnd that\u2019s what he gets,\u201d and \u201cThat\u2019s what he deserves for all these years of alcohol and abandoning your son,\u201d\u2014blah, blah, blah. When I read that, it hit me. It was like God was saying, \u201cYou\u2019re the prisoner, and you\u2019re <em>never<\/em> going to be free. You\u2019ve got the key; you\u2019ve got to unlock that, and forgive your dad.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAgain, it didn\u2019t happen that day, but when I did\u2014and I can sit here now, in my 60s, and I used to say it to the men at my church\u2014\u201cI became a man at age 35, because that\u2019s when I was free to become who God wanted Dave Wilson to be. I was not able to be the husband she needed\/the dad my kids\u2014and I\u2019m not saying I\u2019m a perfect man\u2014but it was like, man, it was that <em>big<\/em>, holding onto that bitterness. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI know there\u2019s listeners, right now, it\u2019s like, \u201cI can\u2019t forgive.\u201d\u00a0 I know what\u2014you can\u2019t, and neither could I, and Jason couldn\u2019t either\u2014but God can <em>through<\/em> you. I really think it\u2019s <em>supernatural<\/em>.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> Absolutely.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> It\u2019s a supernatural thing\/a divine power of God, especially when the wound is that deep and hurtful, to be able to let that go.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> Look at the example of Jesus; right? He was beaten, mocked, spit on, made fun of\u2014everything you could imagine a person goes through\u2014and yet, He\u2019s standing there\/or up there on the cross\u2014and the people, who put Him up there, are mocking Him and making fun of Him. He looks down; He says, \u201cFather, forgive them for they don\u2019t know what they\u2019re doing.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I will say, as a wife, it was probably the most marked difference in Dave that I\u2019ve ever seen; because he became free. I think you had an anger issue kind of simmering below the surface all the time.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u2014just like Jason was saying.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Yes, and you really were released from that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> And here\u2019s the thing that is so critical to understand, and if you\u2019re a dad or you\u2019re a mom, please hear this: \u201cIf you don\u2019t deal with this, you will continue it. It will go into your legacy; you pass it on. The sins of the father visit through the generations.\u201d I didn\u2019t know it then\u2014that my decision to forgive my dad\u2014would affect my sons. They didn\u2019t really even know; they were so young at the time. And again, I\u2019m not saying they don\u2019t have bitterness and those kinds of issues; but man, it changed the legacy because they have a dad, now, who\u2019s free. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd again\u2014not perfect freedom\u2014because you know, we get triggered at times; but it\u2019s like I no longer have this desire to punish him. That\u2019s what Smedes defines forgiveness: \u201cYou give up your right to punish.\u201d You know, God\/[Jesus] was punished <em>for<\/em> us and forgave us; and we can do the same thing. I would say to anyone listening: \u201cToday\u2019s your day.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> It doesn\u2019t mean we\u2019re perfect\u2014absolutely, choose forgiveness\u2014but it doesn\u2019t mean we\u2019re perfect either. I still struggle with\u2014not anger I would say\u2014but lashing out sometimes at my daughter, or my wife, or a few people. But I will say that, having chosen forgiveness, especially walking through writing a book about forgiveness, has helped me understand that that\u2019s available to us every single day. Like that\u2019s what we do every single day when we wake up to Jesus and we say, \u201cGod, forgive us of our sins.\u201d We\u2019re asking for forgiveness every day; but then it\u2019s our responsibility then, to be Christ-like in that, to exude that on everybody else. If we don\u2019t, we\u2019re basically putting a hand in God\u2019s face and saying, \u201cI got this\u201d; and that\u2019s when we get in trouble.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> And we don\u2019t have this.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> We don\u2019t have it, clearly! [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I\u2019d say, \u201cPick up Jason\u2019s book today, <em>Live to Forgive<\/em>. I love the subtitle, <em>Moving Forward When Those We Love Hurt Us<\/em>. You want to move forward?\u2014it starts right here.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Dave, will you pray?\u2014just for people that are struggling with that\/that are struggling with forgiving people.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I\u2019d love to do that. Let\u2019s pray. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tFather, You know better than any of us the pain of what it took to offer Your Son as the payment for our sin and to forgive us. We didn\u2019t deserve it; we didn\u2019t even ask You for it. But You unconditionally loved us, and You love us still, and You made a way for us to be completely forgiven and free. And through the blood of our Savior, Jesus, and even through His resurrection, we have, not only forgiveness to ourselves, but we actually have the power of God residing in us to empower us to forgive others that don\u2019t deserve it. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tLord, just as You have forgiven us, give us the power to forgive others and set them free; but in the process, set ourselves free. Lord, I know we cannot do it without You; and we need You desperately to help us. We ask right now; and we commit we will do and we will be what You call us to be through Your Son, Jesus. We thank You for His forgiveness. We pray in His name. Amen.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Amen.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jason:<\/strong> Amen.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> I have to think that many of us, as we\u2019ve listened today to Dave and Ann Wilson talking with Jason Romano about his relationship with his father, we\u2019ve thought about people in our own lives\u2014maybe parents, maybe siblings, other family members, who have wounded us\u2014and the question is: \u201cHave we been able to move to forgiveness?\u201d Jason has written about his relationship with his dad in a book called <em>Live to Forgive: Moving Forward When Those We Love Hurt Us<\/em>. It\u2019s a book we\u2019ve got in our <em>Family Life Today<\/em> Resource Center. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt\u2019s a book I think many of us would benefit from reading. The Bible makes it clear that a failure to forgive says something about our own relationship with Jesus. If we are forgiven people, we forgive others. You can get a copy of Jason\u2019s book, <em>Live to Forgive<\/em>, when you order it, online, at FamilyLifeToday.com; or call to order at 1-800-358-6329; that\u2019s 1-800-\u201cF\u201d as in family, \u201cL\u201d as in life and then the word, \u201cTODAY.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou know, our goal, here, at FamilyLife is to effectively develop godly marriages and families. We believe that what the Bible teaches about relationships is something that all of us need a better understanding of. It\u2019s something we need to embrace and live out as followers of Christ. So each day on <em>FamilyLife Today,<\/em> we provide you with practical biblical help and hope for your marriage and your family. We want to challenge you, and encourage you, and equip you to live out your faith in your home. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe\u2019re able to do this because your fellow listeners\/people just like you have reached out in the past and have made today\u2019s program possible. <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is entirely listener-supported. The program you\u2019ve heard today happened because of their contributions. I want to challenge you: \u201cIf you\u2019re a regular listener to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>, and if you\u2019ve never made a donation, today would be a great day for you to join the team: to pay it forward\/to help others in your community, and around the world, benefit from what they\u2019re hearing on <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\u201d There are hundreds of thousands of people, who connect with us every day. You help make that possible when you donate. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIf you\u2019re able to make a donation today, we\u2019d love to send you, as a thank-you gift, a copy of Arlene Pellicane\u2019s book, <em>Screen Kids<\/em>, all about how, as parents, we can wisely manage the screen time in our homes and with our kids\u2014not just our kids\u2014with us too. I mean, we\u2019ve got to be shrewd about how we handle screens. Arlene\u2019s book is our thank-you gift when you go online today and make a donation at FamilyLifeToday.com or when you call 1-800-358-6329\u20141-800-FL-TODAY\u2014and make a donation over the phone. Just ask for a copy of the book, <em>Screen Kids. <\/em>Thank you for being part of the <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> team and making this program, and all that we do at FamilyLife, possible for so many.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd we hope you can join us, again, tomorrow when we\u2019re going to talk about managing screens at home. Arlene Pellicane was with us last week; she\u2019s back again this week to continue the conversation. I hope you can join us for that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tOn behalf of our hosts, Dave and Ann Wilson, I\u2019m Bob Lepine. We will see you tomorrow for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife; a Cru<sup>\u00ae <\/sup>Ministry. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHelping you pursue the relationships that matter most.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright <sup>\u00a9<\/sup> 2021 FamilyLife. All rights reserved.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/\">www.FamilyLife.com<\/a>\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\n\t\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\t1\n\t\t\t\t<\/p>","theme_header_position":"","post_header_is_sticky":"","is_header_overlay":""},"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast\/306953","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/podcast"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/91"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=306953"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/294104"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=306953"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=306953"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=306953"},{"taxonomy":"podcast_series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast_series?post=306953"},{"taxonomy":"cwp_profile","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/cwp_profile?post=306953"},{"taxonomy":"series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/series?post=306953"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}