{"id":306947,"date":"2021-07-15T07:00:04","date_gmt":"2021-07-15T11:00:04","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/%series%\/living-fearless-at-home\/"},"modified":"2021-07-15T07:00:04","modified_gmt":"2021-07-15T11:00:04","slug":"living-fearless-at-home","status":"publish","type":"podcast","link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/living-fearless-at-home\/","title":{"rendered":"Living Fearless at Home"},"content":{"rendered":"","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Fear might be what drives some people in how they live, but it doesn&#8217;t have to be. Kevin Thompson shares how the source for our decision-making can build a braver home.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":91,"featured_media":294104,"menu_order":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","template":"","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","inline_featured_image":false,"_uag_custom_page_level_css":"","episode_type":"","audio_file":"https:\/\/mp3.familylife.com\/fl2021-07-15.mp3","podmotor_file_id":"","podmotor_episode_id":"","cover_image":"","cover_image_id":"","duration":"00:27:46","filesize":"25.43M","filesize_raw":"26664806","date_recorded":"","explicit":"","block":""},"categories":[2822,2806],"tags":[4798,2209],"podcast_series":[],"cwp_profile":[8832],"series":[2101],"class_list":["post-306947","podcast","type-podcast","status-publish","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-growing-in-your-faith","category-spiritual-development","tag-kids","tag-parenting","cwp_profile-kevin-thompson","series-familylife-today"],"acf":[],"episode_featured_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/09\/FLT-Podcast-Cover-2-508x508-3.jpg?w=508","episode_player_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2023\/02\/image-scaled.jpg","download_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-download\/306947\/living-fearless-at-home","player_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-player\/306947\/living-fearless-at-home","audio_player":null,"episode_data":{"playerMode":"light","subscribeUrls":{"apple_podcasts":{"key":"apple_podcasts","url":"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303?mt=2&app=podcast","label":"Apple Podcasts","class":"apple_podcasts","icon":"apple-podcasts.png"},"google_podcasts":{"key":"google_podcasts","url":"","label":"Google Podcasts","class":"google_podcasts","icon":"google-podcasts.png"},"spotify":{"key":"spotify","url":"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm","label":"Spotify","class":"spotify","icon":"spotify.png"},"youtube":{"key":"youtube","url":"","label":"YouTube","class":"youtube","icon":"youtube.png"}},"rssFeedUrl":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/feed\/podcast\/familylife-today","embedCode":"<blockquote class=\"wp-embedded-content\" data-secret=\"I23SJC0nqC\"><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/living-fearless-at-home\/\">Living Fearless at Home<\/a><\/blockquote><iframe sandbox=\"allow-scripts\" security=\"restricted\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/living-fearless-at-home\/embed\/#?secret=I23SJC0nqC\" width=\"500\" height=\"350\" title=\"&#8220;Living Fearless at Home&#8221; &#8212; FamilyLife\u00ae - A Cru Ministry\" data-secret=\"I23SJC0nqC\" frameborder=\"0\" marginwidth=\"0\" marginheight=\"0\" scrolling=\"no\" class=\"wp-embedded-content\"><\/iframe><script>\n\/*! This file is auto-generated *\/\n!function(d,l){\"use strict\";l.querySelector&&d.addEventListener&&\"undefined\"!=typeof URL&&(d.wp=d.wp||{},d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage||(d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage=function(e){var t=e.data;if((t||t.secret||t.message||t.value)&&!\/[^a-zA-Z0-9]\/.test(t.secret)){for(var s,r,n,a=l.querySelectorAll('iframe[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),o=l.querySelectorAll('blockquote[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),c=new RegExp(\"^https?:$\",\"i\"),i=0;i<o.length;i++)o[i].style.display=\"none\";for(i=0;i<a.length;i++)s=a[i],e.source===s.contentWindow&&(s.removeAttribute(\"style\"),\"height\"===t.message?(1e3<(r=parseInt(t.value,10))?r=1e3:~~r<200&&(r=200),s.height=r):\"link\"===t.message&&(r=new URL(s.getAttribute(\"src\")),n=new URL(t.value),c.test(n.protocol))&&n.host===r.host&&l.activeElement===s&&(d.top.location.href=t.value))}},d.addEventListener(\"message\",d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage,!1),l.addEventListener(\"DOMContentLoaded\",function(){for(var e,t,s=l.querySelectorAll(\"iframe.wp-embedded-content\"),r=0;r<s.length;r++)(t=(e=s[r]).getAttribute(\"data-secret\"))||(t=Math.random().toString(36).substring(2,12),e.src+=\"#?secret=\"+t,e.setAttribute(\"data-secret\",t)),e.contentWindow.postMessage({message:\"ready\",secret:t},\"*\")},!1)))}(window,document);\n\/\/# sourceURL=https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-includes\/js\/wp-embed.min.js\n<\/script>\n"},"uagb_featured_image_src":{"full":["https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/09\/FLT-Podcast-Cover-2-508x508-3.jpg",508,508,false]},"uagb_author_info":{"display_name":"kfairris@familylife.com","author_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/author\/kfairrisfamilylife-com\/"},"uagb_comment_info":0,"uagb_excerpt":"Fear might be what drives some people in how they live, but it doesn't have to be. Kevin Thompson shares how the source for our decision-making can build a braver home.","meta_box":{"show_notes":"","transcript_url":"https:\/\/transcript.familylife.com\/fl2021-07-15.pdf","transcript_content":"<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Okay; so today, we get to talk about fear and about being fearless in your home and in your family. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Okay. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I think of this moment in our life, where we were scared to death; do you know what I\u2019m talking about? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I think I know where you\u2019re going, because they aren\u2019t many times that we have been scared to death. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I mean, frozen; it was 2 or 3 am. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Yes; I woke up in the middle of the night, because there was a TV <em>blaring<\/em> downstairs. None of our kids were in the home at the time; so I thought, \u201cDid we leave that TV on?\u201d But it was so loud. I wake Dave up; and I said, \u201cDid you leave the TV on?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> And the TV is right below our master bedroom. I\u2019m like, \u201cThere is no way; that TV was off!\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Welcome to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>, where we want to help you pursue the relationships that matter most. I\u2019m Ann Wilson.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> And I\u2019m Dave Wilson, and you can find us at FamilyLifeToday.com or on our FamilyLife<sup>\u00ae<\/sup> app.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> This is <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> So the TV clicked on; but then fear grabbed us, like, \u201cWhat if somebody is in our house, watching TV?!\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I said to Dave, \u201cYou go down; you go check it.\u201d <br>\u00a0\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I said, \u201cI\u2019m not going down.\u201d [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Then I said, \u201cWe should call the police.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> We go over and lock our bedroom door. I\u2019m so embarrassed to admit this; we call 911. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I did, at first\u2014I\u2019m like, \u201cI\u2019m just calling,\u201d\u2014because I didn\u2019t even want you to go down. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> We asked them\/we said, \u201cOur front windows\u2014you can look through\u2014could you just come over and look through our front window and tell us if there is somebody in our house?\u201d Long story short, they actually did. The <em>fear<\/em> I felt in that moment was <em>so<\/em> real. Fear is a <em>real<\/em> thing.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe\u2019ve got Kevin Thompson with us today, who has written a book called <em>Fearless Families<\/em>. Obviously, it\u2019s not about being scared at night\u2014I don\u2019t think\u2014is it? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> Not completely; no. [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> It\u2019s a lot bigger than that. The subtitle is <em>Building Brave Homes in an Uncertain World<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tKevin, you are a pastor; right? You\u2019ve been a pastor\u2014how long? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> Almost 20 years.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Really? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> Next year will be 20 years to be at Community Bible Church in Fort Smith, Arkansas. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Yes, with two kids? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> Two kids; yes; and a wife. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> You are the lead pastor of Community Bible Church. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> Correct. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Okay. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> You\u2019ve written a few other books. Let\u2019s talk about this one because, you know, when you talk about fear\u2014and you start the book with a story of fear, even in your own home with your own son\u2014tell us that story. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> Whenever you have a TV blasting, in the middle of the night underneath your bedroom, there is a certain God-given response to that: your heart raises; your adrenaline gets pumping; you\u2019re ready to go. You\u2019re going to fight;\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> \u2014or you\u2019re going to flee; or you could freeze. It goes all the way back to the idea of our ancestors, being out on the prairie, and a possible danger coming out on the horizon; and in that moment, they had to make a choice. Those are <em>great<\/em> responses when your life is truly in danger. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThat is a <em>horrible<\/em> response, Dave, when Ann says, \u201cWe need to talk.\u201d [Laughter] Yet, what happens in our homes, and what happens in our lives, is that same response then rises up in these emotional moments\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> \u2014when our lives are <em>not<\/em> on the line\u2014but in <em>reality<\/em>, instead of fighting\/instead of fleeing or freezing, we then need to engage with our whole hearts with these people that we love. Yet, instead, we respond out of this fear response, which creates trauma within the family and everywhere else. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> My response every time Ann said, \u201cLet\u2019s talk,\u201d early in my marriage\u2014and usually it was a conflict\u2014I literally walked out of the room. You\u2019re so right; it was this built-in\u2014I didn\u2019t even know it\u2014fear: \u201cConflict\u2014talking\/communication\u2014is bad. You avoid it; or you fight, and it ends up ugly.\u201d There were times I just froze as well. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI mean, what you are talking about is so true; but man, you talk about leading a family or trying to create a home that\u2019s fearless: \u201cHow do we go?\u201d because that\u2019s built in us. It\u2019s really a gift from God in a good way, but it can be very negative; right? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> And think about the era that we are living in. I mean, if there has ever been a time where fear is running rampant, it is right now. Our families are facing it. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> Absolutely. I think the first thing that we have to do is to recognize and to source that God-given response, but understand it was given for a God-intended purpose. So the places that we are tempted to fight, flight, or freeze\u2014we have to recognize that\/recognize: \u201cThis is not the place for that,\u201d\u2014and then make a <em>different<\/em> choice. That\u2019s really what the book is about. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe book is about the concept that fear is really ruling our lives in a way that is destroying us. What\u2019s happening is we are making decisions, based on fear, when we need to make them based on love. In the home, in that moment, the home should be the one place that fear does not dominate. I think the home and the church are really the two places that God designed, knowing that we are broken people in a fallen world. Fear is going to be overwhelming to us; and yet, here are two institutions that He gave to us to allow us to learn, to explore, to choose the way of love instead of the way of fear. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYet sadly, so often, in the very place that God has given us to begin to <em>diminish<\/em> our fears, they actually are <em>increased<\/em>. I think about the \u201cChurch of the Afraid\u201d; I think about the \u201cHome of the Afraid\u201d\u2014and how in these places, where God desires for us to learn how to make choices based on love, we\u2019re making them based on fear\u2014what is scary to me is: we don\u2019t realize it; we don\u2019t recognize it!\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Yes; what happened? How did we get there? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> I think that is a <em>great<\/em> question. I do think it\u2019s just part of our sin nature and part that God did put this design within us; and now, as fallen people in the fallen world, it\u2019s all changed in many ways. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI start the book with the story about Silas\u2014fourth grader at the time\u2014we live two blocks down from the school, so it\u2019s always a fun time. This was about the age in which Silas is kind of aware that he is holding his dad\u2019s hand. I remember, one day, he runs off\u2014as we get to the edge of school\u2014and runs off. My sixth-grade daughter looks at me and goes, \u201cThat\u2019s okay, Daddy. He\u2019s just trying to be somebody.\u201d [Laughter] I thought to myself, \u201cAren\u2019t we all?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> But one morning, we get up\u2014normal routine\u2014go to school. I get to the door; he\u2019s not there. I think he\u2019s forgotten his lunch or his backpack. I call his name; he doesn\u2019t respond, and I go look for him. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI find him hiding. In that moment, my world changed; because anxiety that he had been having and was building\u2014the noise in his head that had been building for years\u2014finally expressed itself. What began for us, from that moment, was a journey in which we realized how he was struggling with anxiety. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhat I learned in the next two years\u2014it wasn\u2019t just a genetic component of anxiety that was going on\u2014but as he was going through his issues with anxiety, I noticed that his anxiety was creating anxiety within me. Our home was becoming <em>so tense<\/em>; because we were literally making every decision based off of: \u201cHow can we keep him safe?\u201d \u201cHow can we lessen the emotional trauma of what\u2019s going on?\u201d \u201cHow can we make him feel the most comfortable?\u201d There is an aspect of parenting, where we need to do that; but there is another aspect of parenting, where that\u2019s not really our job. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Okay, Kevin; like just hearing this, so many listeners are resonating right now; because I\u2019ve talked to more parents than ever before in my life that their children are experiencing anxiety, fear, and depression\u2014which just exactly is what you said\u2014is now stirring that up in themselves. We feel paralyzed. Every parent that I\u2019ve talked to, they are saying, \u201cHelp! We don\u2019t know what to do.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> That\u2019s kind of the journey that we went on as we recognized the fear that was going on in our own home and, ultimately, the fear that was going on in my own life. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSome people call this a parenting book: <em>Fearless Families<\/em>. It is <em>not<\/em> a parenting book. It applies to parenting\u2014no doubt\u2014but we think parenting book of: \u201cAlright, here is what parents should do to raise kids\u2026\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Ann:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> This really is, for me: \u201cHere is what I need to do to endure parenting.\u201d [Laughter] That\u2019s what it really is to me; because I don\u2019t think I ever realized how heartbreaking parenting truly is\u2014and that\u2019s just on a <em>normal<\/em> day\u2014 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> \u2014that\u2019s just in <em>normal<\/em> circumstances\u2014and how my nature tends to go back to the concepts of fear, and I will make decisions based on that. What I came to find out is that, whenever fear becomes the prism through which we are making all decisions, we begin to lean on and even make idols into some concepts that really are false gods. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe very first one I talk about is the concept of safety\u2014that safety is a good thing: \u201cWho doesn\u2019t want to keep their children safe?\u201d Clearly, we need to keep our children safe; and yet, that is not something we can fully ensure. So when safety becomes the ultimate god\u2014I call it the foundation of the \u201dHome of the Afraid\u201d\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Wow. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> \u2014the \u201cHome of the Afraid\u201d is built on the foundation of safety. We believe: \u201cIf we can keep our kids safe\/if we can experience safe, then we can build on that foundation and then be strong.\u201d The problem is\u2014you\u2019re a pastor; you\u2019re a pastor\u2019s wife\u2014you all know, that life can turn in an instant:\u2014 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Oh, yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> \u2014the phone call can come; the diagnosis can be there; the global pandemic can suddenly show up. We understand that, while safety is something that\u2019s wise to <em>discern<\/em>, it cannot be something that we idolize. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThink about this: \u201cIs it safe?\u201d How many times did Jesus ever ask the question, \u201cIs it safe?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> That\u2019s a <em>great<\/em> question. [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> He never did\u2014 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Never. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> \u2014and never called us to do so either; that, to me, is <em>convicting<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> In what ways, does that become an idol? Define <em>idol<\/em>\u2014because I know where you are going, and I agree\u2014but I want to make sure we understand this concept. It becomes: \u201cWhat does it mean it\u2019s an idol?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> So when something <em>good<\/em> becomes the <em>dominate<\/em> thing\u2014which for me, in many ways, that was the running question with my son\u2014\u201cIs he going to <em>feel<\/em> safe?\u201d \u201cIs he going to <em>feel<\/em> okay?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhat happens is we get involved in counseling. The counselor looks at me and goes, \u201cKevin, your job here isn\u2019t necessarily to make him <em>feel<\/em> as safe as he can. It\u2019s, as he is going through the circumstance, that he knows he has your support\/that you are with him in the midst of this, not to rescue him from this.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> That is different; isn\u2019t it? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> That is <em>radically<\/em> different, and it changes the question. So whenever we talk about that idea of safety, it is wise to discern and ask the question; but it becomes an idol when we make it the dominate question. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHere is what scares me for the \u201cChurch of the Afraid\u201d: if you ask the majority of our people, they would equate safety with God\u2019s will. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> That\u2019s a great point. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> They would think, \u201cGod would never call them into something <em>dangerous<\/em>.\u201d Well, is the mission field safe? Is it necessarily safe at your job to testify about Jesus? It may not be safe, but it might be the right thing to do; so often, Jesus calls us into <em>risky<\/em> things. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Dave:<\/strong> The first time we took my oldest son on a mission trip to Africa to the bush\u2014and it was going to be really rugged\u2014I remember a couple of parents that we were saying, \u201cHey, go with us\u201d; because it was really parents and their son or daughter. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI remember a couple of parents said to me: \u201cThat\u2019s the most unsafe thing I would <em>ever<\/em> let my son or daughter do. They are 13 years old; it\u2019s irresponsible of you to even <em>ask<\/em> us to consider this.\u201d I should have been wiser; I just looked at them like, \u201cThat\u2019s your concern?! Of course, it\u2019s unsafe.\u201d I mean, it\u2019s as safe as it can be, but there\u2019s not a \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t100 percent safety in walking out to your mailbox today, really. But they were unwilling to let their son or daughter and themselves go anywhere <em>near<\/em> that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAs I came home from that trip with my oldest son, I\u2019m like, \u201cThat was life-changing; he\u2019ll <em>never<\/em> be the same.\u201d There was some fear involved, of course; bad things could have happened. But if safety became an idol, in the sense that we bowed down to, we lose what God wants to do in our lives and our kids\u2019 lives. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> Yes; so in the book, I make two divisions. I talk about the \u201cHome of the Afraid\u201d and the \u201cHome of the Brave.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Kevin:<\/strong> I constructed, as a very basic like third-grade drawing of, what a house looks like. There is a foundation; there is a roof; and there are two walls. The foundation of the \u201cHome of the Afraid\u201d is this idea of safety. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWell, God <em>invites<\/em> us into a different foundation; it\u2019s a foundation of trust. When we trust Him, we learn then to trust one another. The \u201cHome of the Brave\u201d is now learning how to trust God and trust each other. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br>Dave, what you were teaching your son in that moment is: \u201cYou know what? These lives are fleeting. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> \u201cWe can trust God with them, and we\u2019re going to do risky things. We\u2019re not going to be stupid; we\u2019re not going to <em>seek<\/em> out martyrdom. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> \u201cBut we\u2019re going to risk our lives for something that is far greater.\u201d In so doing, you were teaching him trust\u2014not only were you teaching him to trust God\u2014you were teaching that you trust him. You were instilling manhood within him,\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> \u2014which is a <em>powerful<\/em> thing. What you were doing is you were creating the \u201cHome of the Brave.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt doesn\u2019t mean that we <em>ignore<\/em> safety. Clearly, we take it into context and consideration; but it does mean that there are <em>greater<\/em> questions. There are greater questions of: \u201cWhat\u2019s the <em>right<\/em> thing to do?\u201d \u201cWhat is the <em>loving<\/em> thing to do?\u201d \u201cWhat is <em>pure<\/em>?\u201d \u201cWhat is <em>noble<\/em>?\u201d \u201cWhat is <em>true<\/em>?\u201d Those are all far better questions than \u201cWhat is <em>safe<\/em>?\u201d Whenever we prioritize the question of safety over what\u2019s right and what\u2019s loving, we have made safety into a god. As soon as we do that, we\u2019re going to experience the negative consequences of that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut here is the thing: that is our <em>natural bent<\/em>. Our natural bent is that I will go back to this concept of what\u2019s going to keep me safe. Think about this within the context of an emotional discussion with your spouse. Why do we avoid that?\u2014why do people basically have one of two reactions?\u2014if they are in the conversation, they either raise their voice, or they emotionally shut down. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> In both cases, they are doing the exact same thing: they are going to a place of safety. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Kevin:<\/strong> They are <em>not<\/em> willing to put their heart out on the table, and to risk, and to say, \u201cHere is what I <em>feel<\/em>; here is what has hurt me,\u201d \u201cHow have I hurt <em>you<\/em>?\u201d They are not willing to have the <em>meaningful<\/em> conversation. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYet, when a husband and wife trust each other\u2014when you have the <em>commitment<\/em> to know that: \u201cYou know what? There is nothing that you are going to do to break my love,\u201d\u2014whenever you have the transparency to say, \u201cI\u2019m fully invested in this, and that trust is there; that I\u2019m not going to use you or manipulate you; I am for you; I love you.\u201d I have to remind myself of this <em>all<\/em> the time. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> What I really was surprised by, in your opening story, was Silas, you know, hiding; because he was afraid to go to school. I\u2019m reading that, you know, right at the beginning of the thing: \u201cIt\u2019s <em>Fearless Families<\/em>; Kevin is going to say, \u201cAnd I spoke into him, and we got up, and we went.\u201d [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou end up taking his psychologist report\u2014because he sat down to show it to your mom; right?\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> Exactly. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u2014who has been a teacher all these years. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> \u201440 years. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Her answer to you is: \u201cOh, now, I understand <em>you<\/em>,\u201d\u2014your fear! \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u2014as a boy, growing up. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> That\u2019s exactly right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I did not see that coming\u2014that you, now, are going to admit you had fear\u2014and even as a dad, there is some anxiety and fear. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> We sit here; and we think, \u201cOkay; I\u2019m going to lead the \u2018Home of the Brave,\u2019 and that means I\u2019m going to be fearless\u201d; but what happens when we are scared ourselves? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> No; that\u2019s exactly right. What I have found is that adulthood is far more scary [Laughter]\u2014than childhood; right? I get it. We have better tools, and we should navigate. That\u2019s not to downplay or diminish what our kids are going through by any means. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br>But yes; my son\u2014we had him tested\u2014we found a few learning differences that were there. What he was eventually diagnosed with was school refusal. Silas was a straight-A student. He wasn\u2019t being bullied; he was loved by his classmates. But what was happening was, underneath, there were these learning differences that we didn\u2019t know about; and it was creating stress within him. So school, every single day, was becoming more and more scary. Yet, we didn\u2019t know; we thought he was having a <em>great<\/em> time, and everything was going well. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe had this testing done; get this report. I take it next door to my mom; she\u2019s a school teacher for 40 years. She reads it; she looks up at me; she goes, \u201cThis explains so much about <em>you<\/em>.\u201d [Laughter] I was like, \u201cWhat?!\u201d [Laughter] I got to looking; and sure enough, these things were evident in my life, early on, as well. Now, as an adult, they are just as present. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think what is interesting to me is so many of the things that scare you, as a kid, really don\u2019t come to fruition as an adult; right? You watch cartoons: I\u2019ve never slipped into quicksand; right? The anvil has never fallen off the cliff and busted me in the head; but at the same time, the cartoons don\u2019t show the truly scary parts of life either. We experience that every day, how life can change in an <em>instant<\/em>. It\u2019s far more scary, I think, as an adult than as a child. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe reality of God\u2019s invitation of: \u201cAre you going to trust Me or not?\u201d\u2014because here is the reality\u2014when we idolize the question: \u201cIs it safe?\u201d\u2014who are we idolizing in that moment?\u2014ourselves; we think it\u2019s all on us. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> The amazing thing is the fear doesn\u2019t go away! \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> No. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> It doesn\u2019t work! You know, a week later or a month later, you are still afraid, even though you are <em>safe<\/em> as can be. It didn\u2019t <em>touch<\/em> your fear. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> A statement at our house, for the last three years, has been this: \u201cWhen you feel fear, you can avoid it, and let it grow; or you can face it and diminish it,\u201d \u201cYou can avoid it, and let it grow; or you can face it and diminish it.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tOne of the great signs of the healing process for my son is, now, he\u2019ll say, \u201cDad, I\u2019m nervous.\u201d \u201cOkay; well, tell me what you are nervous about.\u201d Then he\u2019ll begin to walk through, maybe, what the next day holds, or what he is experiencing in the moment, or whatever is going on within his own life. Then I\u2019ll ask the question: \u201cOkay, what tools are you going to use to help that process?\u201d \u201cWhat are the stories you are going to tell in your head?\u201d \u201cWhat are the physical things that you can do? Are you going to work out?\u201d \u201cWhat are you going to <em>do<\/em> now?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSo it\u2019s not, as a father, it\u2019s <em>not<\/em>: \u201cHere is what I can do to solve this problem,\u201d\u2014that\u2019s where I was three years ago\u2014it was: \u201cOh my goodness! My son is facing this. What am I going to do to <em>save<\/em> him?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhereas now, it\u2019s: \u201cOkay; let me help you and, hopefully, empower you to use the tools that you and I have learned to begin to diminish this fear.\u201d But in the end, it\u2019s not going to fully go away; but you have a choice to make, in the end: \u201cAre you going to listen to the fear?\u2014or are you going to listen to love? Choose the way of love.\u201d That\u2019s what <em>Fearless Families<\/em> is about. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Now, is, also, the way love\u2014how would you tie in faith? Because I often think of fear\u2014I always think of the tension\u2014it\u2019s really between fear or faith. I guess you are saying trust is similar to faith; or maybe, you are even saying love is similar. I either going to trust in faith; or I\u2019m going to be gripped with fear. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> The way I think of it in my mind\u2014and I\u2019m not saying it\u2019s necessarily right; it\u2019s just the way my mind works\u2014is that the battle between fear and love are revealing what we have faith in. The reason I prefer to say it\u2019s a battle between fear and love is because, when you define love now\u2014not as a force that expresses itself in a feeling\u2014but instead, as a <em>choice<\/em> that expresses itself in an action. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt draws the question back to: \u201cOkay, you\u2019re feeling whatever you are feeling; that\u2019s fine. What are you going to do about it? What <em>action<\/em> are you going to take? Are you going to take an action that is based on fear?\u2014or are you, now, going to take an action that is based on love?\u201d If you take an action based on love, you are doing so in faith. That is now an example that you have faith in God, not necessarily faith in yourself. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Yes; I\u2019ve always said\u2014I think it applies to <em>Fearless Families<\/em>; it definitely applies to our personal lives in terms of your faith\u2014I\u2019ve always tried to stress: \u201cIt\u2019s really where Jesus says about the size of your faith; right? He says you can have faith, the size of a mustard seed, which is miniscule; and it can move mountains. It can make a difference.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI\u2019ve always grown up, thinking I need great big faith; and Jesus is like, \u201cNo; you just need little faith, but you need a great big God.\u201d So I\u2019ve always said, \u201cIt\u2019s not the size of your faith that matters; it\u2019s the size of your God.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> We talk a lot in our house, and in our church as well, the difference between worrying about something and weighing something. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Oh, that\u2019s good. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> Worrying about something is not productive. You\u2019re just ruminating in your head all the things that can go wrong and the decisions you\u2019re facing; right? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Oh, yes; we all do that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> It <em>feels<\/em> productive\u2014it <em>feels<\/em> like you are doing something\u2014but you\u2019re <em>not<\/em>! You\u2019re in the exact same spot. One of the tests, now, if you are worrying something is you get stuck. Worry makes us get <em>stuck<\/em>. We are in the same place three days from now that we are right now. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhereas, we talk about <em>weighing<\/em> a decision, which is kind of like the old bank scales. We talk to our kids; we\u2019ve talked to each other: \u201cAre you worrying about it, or are you weighing it?\u201d \u201cAre you honestly saying, \u2018Alright; is this the right decision or not? Now, let\u2019s move forward.\u2019\u201d That\u2019s the way of love. The way of love is: \u201cWhat is the most loving action to take, right now, today? Let the chips fall where they may. How can we discern that and do the right thing?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSafety comes into that conversation, no doubt. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> But it\u2019s not the ultimate god of what\u2019s going on. The bigness of who God is does apply, which <em>empowers<\/em> us to choose the way of love. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> The way of love makes <em>no sense<\/em> if God is small, because it\u2019s not going to work; but if God is big, then the way of love is <em>always<\/em> the right way. That is what, then, <em>empowers<\/em> us to have trust in Him and to choose that way. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThen, it\u2019s one thing to have trust in a perfect, holy, just God, who is never going to fail you. It\u2019s different for my son to trust me, because I am going to fail him; I\u2019m going to make bad choices sometimes. It\u2019s difficult for my wife to trust me, because I\u2019m going to fail her; there are times, in which, I\u2019m not going to be the husband she needs or deserves. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYet, for us to have a healthy marriage, we\u2019re going to have to learn how to trust each other, which now necessitates forgiveness, and love, and mercy. It demands, now, for me that\u2014man, the mistakes I make, they better not be life-altering mistakes that could just destroy her trust\u2014because when a family, when a marriage, when parenting, when a church loses that foundation of trust, there is nothing left to build the house on. So if you don\u2019t have a trust of God, what good is the church? In a vertical marriage, if you don\u2019t have the trust of God\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> \u2014the marriage can\u2019t be built up. Yet, when that trust exists\u2014when a husband and wife trust each other\u2014there is no limit\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> \u2014on what they can do. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> When a person trusts who God is, there is no limit with what God can do with that person. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> It is easy for any of us to become fearful when our safety is threatened\/when trust has been violated. A spirit of fear\u2014not just normal, healthy fear of things we ought to be concerned about\u2014but a spirit of fear\/that does not come from God. God does not give a spirit of fear; that comes from another place. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tDave and Ann Wilson have been talking today with Kevin Thompson, who has written a book called <em>Fearless Families: Building Brave Homes in an Uncertain World<\/em>. We\u2019ve got Kevin\u2019s book in our <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> Resource Center. You can go to our website, which is FamilyLifeToday.com, to request a copy; or you can call us at 1-800-FL-TODAY. Ask about the book, <em>Fearless Families<\/em>, from Kevin Thompson. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe\u2019ve already heard this week about how social media and screen time can be an issue for families. There is a reason to be cautious and careful when it comes to screen time. Arlene Pellicane has written a book called <em>Screen Kids<\/em>, and we\u2019re making that book available this week to any <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> listener who can help extend the reach of FamilyLife\u2014help us reach more people more often\u2014through this daily radio program, the podcast, what we have available online, our resources, our events. You make all that possible, as a <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> listener, anytime you get in touch with us and make a donation.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is entirely listener-supported. We depend on folks, like you, to be able to do all that we do. Again, if you can help with a donation today, we\u2019d love to send you a copy of Arlene Pellicane\u2019s book, <em>Screen Kids<\/em>, as a way of saying, \u201cThank you for your partnership with us here at FamilyLife.\u201d Make your donation online at FamilyLifeToday.com; or call to donate: 1-800-FL-TODAY. Be sure to ask for your copy of the book, <em>Screen Kids<\/em>; and thank you for partnering with us, here, at FamilyLife. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBe sure to join us, again, tomorrow when we\u2019re going to talk about what happens in a family when mom or dad, or both of them, become controlled by fear. When fear becomes the atmosphere in your home, what happens? Kevin Thompson will be back with us again. I hope you can be here as well. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tOn behalf of our hosts, Dave and Ann Wilson, I\u2019m Bob Lepine. We will see you back next time for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife; a Cru<sup>\u00ae <\/sup>Ministry. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHelping you pursue the relationships that matter most.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright <sup>\u00a9<\/sup> 2021 FamilyLife. 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