{"id":306874,"date":"2021-06-07T07:00:04","date_gmt":"2021-06-07T11:00:04","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/%series%\/jesus-restorer-of-women\/"},"modified":"2021-06-07T07:00:04","modified_gmt":"2021-06-07T11:00:04","slug":"jesus-restorer-of-women","status":"publish","type":"podcast","link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/jesus-restorer-of-women\/","title":{"rendered":"Jesus, Restorer of Women"},"content":{"rendered":"","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>What did Jesus think of women?  With her long-term experience learning the Jewish culture, Kristi McLelland allows us to see more clearly how Jesus was radically loving toward the women of His day.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":91,"featured_media":294104,"menu_order":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","template":"","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","inline_featured_image":false,"_uag_custom_page_level_css":"","episode_type":"","audio_file":"https:\/\/mp3.familylife.com\/fl2021-06-07.mp3","podmotor_file_id":"","podmotor_episode_id":"","cover_image":"","cover_image_id":"","duration":"00:31:41","filesize":"29.01M","filesize_raw":"30415712","date_recorded":"","explicit":"","block":""},"categories":[2822],"tags":[4403,4001],"podcast_series":[8447],"cwp_profile":[9713],"series":[2101],"class_list":["post-306874","podcast","type-podcast","status-publish","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-growing-in-your-faith","tag-bible-study","tag-women","podcast_series-jesus-and-women","cwp_profile-kristi-mclelland","series-familylife-today"],"acf":[],"episode_featured_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/09\/FLT-Podcast-Cover-2-508x508-3.jpg?w=508","episode_player_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2023\/02\/image-scaled.jpg","download_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-download\/306874\/jesus-restorer-of-women","player_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-player\/306874\/jesus-restorer-of-women","audio_player":null,"episode_data":{"playerMode":"light","subscribeUrls":{"apple_podcasts":{"key":"apple_podcasts","url":"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303?mt=2&app=podcast","label":"Apple Podcasts","class":"apple_podcasts","icon":"apple-podcasts.png"},"google_podcasts":{"key":"google_podcasts","url":"","label":"Google Podcasts","class":"google_podcasts","icon":"google-podcasts.png"},"spotify":{"key":"spotify","url":"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm","label":"Spotify","class":"spotify","icon":"spotify.png"},"youtube":{"key":"youtube","url":"","label":"YouTube","class":"youtube","icon":"youtube.png"}},"rssFeedUrl":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/feed\/podcast\/familylife-today","embedCode":"<blockquote class=\"wp-embedded-content\" data-secret=\"H3r7wqbFeM\"><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/jesus-restorer-of-women\/\">Jesus, Restorer of Women<\/a><\/blockquote><iframe sandbox=\"allow-scripts\" security=\"restricted\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/jesus-restorer-of-women\/embed\/#?secret=H3r7wqbFeM\" width=\"500\" height=\"350\" title=\"&#8220;Jesus, Restorer of Women&#8221; &#8212; FamilyLife\u00ae - A Cru Ministry\" data-secret=\"H3r7wqbFeM\" frameborder=\"0\" marginwidth=\"0\" marginheight=\"0\" scrolling=\"no\" class=\"wp-embedded-content\"><\/iframe><script>\n\/*! This file is auto-generated *\/\n!function(d,l){\"use strict\";l.querySelector&&d.addEventListener&&\"undefined\"!=typeof URL&&(d.wp=d.wp||{},d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage||(d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage=function(e){var t=e.data;if((t||t.secret||t.message||t.value)&&!\/[^a-zA-Z0-9]\/.test(t.secret)){for(var s,r,n,a=l.querySelectorAll('iframe[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),o=l.querySelectorAll('blockquote[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),c=new RegExp(\"^https?:$\",\"i\"),i=0;i<o.length;i++)o[i].style.display=\"none\";for(i=0;i<a.length;i++)s=a[i],e.source===s.contentWindow&&(s.removeAttribute(\"style\"),\"height\"===t.message?(1e3<(r=parseInt(t.value,10))?r=1e3:~~r<200&&(r=200),s.height=r):\"link\"===t.message&&(r=new URL(s.getAttribute(\"src\")),n=new URL(t.value),c.test(n.protocol))&&n.host===r.host&&l.activeElement===s&&(d.top.location.href=t.value))}},d.addEventListener(\"message\",d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage,!1),l.addEventListener(\"DOMContentLoaded\",function(){for(var e,t,s=l.querySelectorAll(\"iframe.wp-embedded-content\"),r=0;r<s.length;r++)(t=(e=s[r]).getAttribute(\"data-secret\"))||(t=Math.random().toString(36).substring(2,12),e.src+=\"#?secret=\"+t,e.setAttribute(\"data-secret\",t)),e.contentWindow.postMessage({message:\"ready\",secret:t},\"*\")},!1)))}(window,document);\n\/\/# sourceURL=https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-includes\/js\/wp-embed.min.js\n<\/script>\n"},"uagb_featured_image_src":{"full":["https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/09\/FLT-Podcast-Cover-2-508x508-3.jpg",508,508,false]},"uagb_author_info":{"display_name":"kfairris@familylife.com","author_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/author\/kfairrisfamilylife-com\/"},"uagb_comment_info":0,"uagb_excerpt":"What did Jesus think of women? With her long-term experience learning the Jewish culture, Kristi McLelland allows us to see more clearly how Jesus was radically loving toward the women of His day.","meta_box":{"show_notes":"","transcript_url":"https:\/\/transcript.familylife.com\/fl2021-06-07.pdf","transcript_content":"<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>Alright, so I\u2019m going to ask you a question; I already know your answer. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Maybe I\u2019m going to change it.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Yes, I just know.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Okay.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> There\u2019s <em>no<\/em> option for you with this question.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Okay.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> You\u2019ve been all around the country; you\u2019ve been all around several different countries in the world. What\u2019s your favorite country\/favorite place to visit?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> No doubt\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Why am I even asking you?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u2014Israel!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWelcome to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>,where we want to help you pursue the relationships that matter most. I\u2019m Ann Wilson.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> And I\u2019m Dave Wilson, and you can find us at FamilyLifeToday.com or on our FamilyLife<sup>\u00ae<\/sup> app.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>This is <a id=\"_Hlk71638305\"><em>FamilyLife Today<\/em><\/a><em>.<\/em> \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe have traveled all around the world.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> It sounds like: \u201cOh, we\u2019re so special.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I was going to add\u2014and it\u2019s not that we\u2019re these rich people vacationing\u2014we\u2019re really doing mission work all around the world, which has been even better to me; because we\u2019re really living in the midst of people around the world. But there\u2019s something about Israel.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> You\u2019re getting teary just talking about it; isn\u2019t that crazy? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> It\u2019s so weird\u2014when I go there, I feel like I\u2019m home\u2014it\u2019s the weirdest thing. I felt like [that] the first time I went, and I\u2019ve only been four times.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Only four times\u2014I\u2019ve been there once\u2014what\u2019s wrong with that picture? How do you get to go four, and I\u2019ve been there once?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I\u2019m taking women over more.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Yes, that\u2019s true.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Yes, but why?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Because it\u2019s where Jesus walked. There\u2019s something about reading the Scriptures there\u2014and you know this is where it happened\u2014that it comes alive, like the Scriptures came alive. When you\u2019re at the place where Jesus did the Sermon on the Mount, you\u2019re thinking, \u201cIt really happened.\u201d Or when you\u2019re on the Sea of Galilee, you\u2019re imagining Peter walking on the water and Jesus walking on the water. It really did make Scripture come alive in a way that I\u2019ve never experienced. Did you feel that when you went?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Oh, it was life-changing for all the same reasons; but we\u2019re done talking about us.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe have\u2014I\u2019m so excited; I know you are as well\u2014because we have an expert scholar guide, Kristi McLelland, with us, who\u2019s going to bring this to life. What we\u2019ve experienced in Israel is really because of people, like you, that know the history, know the culture, and can just give insight into stories we\u2019ve read our whole lives. Obviously, standing there is one thing; but to understand things we don\u2019t\/we just can\u2019t understand just by reading it. We\u2019re excited to have you here!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Kristi, first of all, welcome to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kristi:<\/strong> Thank you so much for having me. I\u2019m so excited to be here!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> We\u2019re excited, too. You\u2019re a speaker; you\u2019re a teacher; you\u2019re a college professor. You\u2019ve made <em>several<\/em> trips to Israel; how many times have you been there?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kristi:<\/strong> I\u2019ve been taking teams to Israel for 14 years, multiple times a year.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Your video series and your workbook study guide is <em>Jesus and Women<\/em>. Walk us through that journey. How did that become something so passionate you said, \u201cI\u2019ve got to get this on video to help men and women understand Jesus\u201d?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kristi:<\/strong> You know, one of the things that I really came home with in 2007 was getting to know Jesus in His Jewish world: eating the foods He would have eaten, looking up and seeing the stars in the sky that He would have known. Like you mentioned\u2014the Sea of Galilee\u2014I will never forget the first time I ever saw the Sea of Galilee; I just started crying, because that\u2019s Jesus\u2019 world. He is all around and on that lake during His earthly ministry. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tOne of the things I really learned, as I was studying there, was just how different Jesus was in His world, 2000 years ago, when it came to His posture toward, His attitude about, and His ministry to women. It really set Him apart; it made Him very distinctive from the other rabbis, sages, Pharisees, teachers of the law of the day. Being a female, myself, it just lit me on fire. I tell people all the time: \u201cI went to Israel and learned that God is better than I ever knew.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Well, walk us into some of that; because I mean, it\u2019s obviously gold that you, like you said, you felt like: \u201cI have to get this out.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> You talk about a cultural shift happening, so walk us through that as well.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kristi:<\/strong> Yes, it\u2019s important to understand what Jesus is doing when it comes to women, 2000 years ago. He\u2019s actually repairing something; He\u2019s restoring something. Something good had been marred, and He was bringing it back to good. Women and Judaism have a very good history and a very good beginning. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI know you guys are a family-and-marriage show. You know the first man and woman in the story of the Bible: <em>Adamah<\/em>, which literally means land, dirt, soil. He\u2019s the dirt man\/the dust man; and Eve\/<em>Chava<\/em>, and her name means life. When you\u2019re reading the Bible through that Hebraic lens, the story goes like: \u201cThe living God created a dust man and brought life to him.\u201d You know, woman has a very good start.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Did you hear that honey? I like that. [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I\u2019m a dust man.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kristi:<\/strong> I brought Valentine\u2019s Day stuff right there.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> It is Valentine\u2019s Day.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Just don\u2019t ever call me dust man, but I will call you life woman. [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kristi:<\/strong> Absolutely.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhen you look at even things like Sabbath for the Jewish people\u2014<em>Shabbat<\/em>, sundown Friday night to sundown Saturday night\u2014they light two <em>Shabbat<\/em> candles to welcome the Sabbath into their home\u2014\u201clike a bride\u201d\u2014is what the Rabbinics say. Interestingly enough, in a patriarchal world, where men lead and rule, there\u2019s only one member of the family that\u2019s allowed to light the <em>Shabbat <\/em>candles; and it\u2019s the <em>mother<\/em>. That honor goes to the mater\/to the matriarch. If the mother is not home, it\u2019s a grandmother; it\u2019s a sister; it\u2019s a daughter; but it has to be a girl. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> It\u2019s always a woman.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kristi:<\/strong> It\u2019s always a woman that lights the <em>Shabbat<\/em> candles.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> It\u2019s interesting. I think my most memorable time in Israel was we were at a <em>Shabbat<\/em> dinner.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u2014at a family\u2019s home.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Yes. I was astounded at the value of family. The Scripture talks about that, and we hear that, but to see it\u2014and the honoring of the mother\u2014of the father even then going through part of Proverbs 31, and honoring her, and then kissing the children. I was in tears.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u2014speaking life to the children.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Children, yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> It was powerful. It\u2019s one of those things, as an American in the church, where you haven\u2019t captured what they have understood and live, and you come back thinking, \u201cWe have to capture that.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Again, it\u2019s what <em>you<\/em> spent your life understanding; but talk to us a little bit about that because as I watched the patriarch of this family\u2014and again, it\u2019s a family we didn\u2019t know; we\u2019re just invited into their home for <em>Shabbat<\/em>\u2014and just watched him honor his wife\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u2014the wife light the candles and begin the <em>Shabbat<\/em>.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> It was just so beautiful. I\u2019m guessing it was a sense of what Jesus has done to elevate the view of women, but this patriarch had that. It modeled for us: \u201cI don\u2019t think I treat my wife that good.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> What a difference going to the American church, where we sit in pews. We don\u2019t talk to one another; we\u2019re just listening to one man. This is: the entire family is involved. I think it shows God\u2019s love for the family.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kristi:<\/strong> That\u2019s right. You fast forward from Adam and Eve to Jesus\u2019 world, 2000 years ago, and woman had lost that sense of honor in the culture. I always say the Middle East is an honor\/shame society; they\u2019re an honor\/shame culture. Being honorable is everything; being shamed or shameful is everything. Jesus is born into a world, where woman has been located and lowered into shame. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhat I talk about, throughout the <em>Jesus and Women<\/em> series, is that in every interaction we have in all four Gospels of Jesus and a woman, He\u2019s bringing two things into her life; He is adamant, persistent, and consistent to bring two things into her life. It doesn\u2019t matter if it\u2019s the Samaritan woman, the Syrophoenician woman, Mary\u2014it doesn\u2019t matter\u2014He\u2019s bringing justice and righteousness to her\u2014<em>mishpat<\/em> and <em>tzedakah<\/em> in Hebrew. We think: \u201cIn what way is He bringing justice and righteousness?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> And what happened?\u2014like why did that fall?\u2014what happened?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kristi:<\/strong> I traced that in Week Two of the series. We see it really begin to happen in the intertestamental period\u2014the 400 years between Malachi, the last book of the Old Testament, and Matthew, the first book of the New Testament\u2014that little white page in our Bibles, that\u2019s blank, a whole lot went down.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Yes, where there was silence for 400 years.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kristi:<\/strong> A whole lot happened during that 400 years. There were various teachers that came on the scene that started teaching things like: \u201cWomen aren\u2019t safe,\u201d \u201cDon\u2019t really trust women,\u201d\u2014you know, if you give her money, you better count all of it before she goes to market; because she may not bring the right change back. You have rabbis saying things like: \u201cDon\u2019t talk a lot to a woman, even your own wife.\u201d That\u2019s not really good for marriages and things like that. [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I remember reading one\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> That would be the opposite of the truth.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Yes; I remember reading one Hebrew scholar that said there was a time that they doubted that a woman had a soul. I was like, \u201cWhat?!\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kristi:<\/strong> Absolutely.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> When you look at Adam and Eve, I think, \u201cHow could you think that? We were both made in God\u2019s image.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kristi:<\/strong> Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tOne distinction in the way we understand the biblical terms\u2014here in the West versus in the Middle East is\u2014when we think of justice, we think Lady Justice; and we think the scales, and we usually think of justice in terms of equality. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut biblical justice is vertical; it\u2019s not horizontal. Biblical justice happens when the honorable reaches down to the shameful: lifts them out of their shame, restores their honor, and sends them forward in <em>shalom<\/em>.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> This is Jesus.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kristi:<\/strong> And this is Jesus and women.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Just that image\u2014when you said Jesus brings two things\u2014one of them justice. Now you explain justice this vertical thing. As a man, and as a husband, and as a father, that hits me right in the face, like: \u201cWait, wait, wait. So if I\u2019m going to love Ann like Christ loved the church\u2014Ephesians 5\u2014that\u2019s what I\u2019m going to do. I\u2019m going to lift up my wife; I\u2019m going to lift up my daughters.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tActually, any woman in our church\u2014you name it\u2014should have a sense that me, as a Christian man, does the same thing Jesus does: that she feels honored; she feels lifted up. We would probably never use the word, \u201cjustice\u201d; because that\u2019s not how we think of it in this term. But that\u2019s what real justice is; that\u2019s what I\u2019m called to do as a husband\/as a dad; right?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kristi:<\/strong> Absolutely; well-said.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> This is a <em>great<\/em> interview; isn\u2019t it? [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kristi:<\/strong> I\u2019m having fun!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Yes, me, too! That\u2019s all I need, hon.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I mean, again, we haven\u2019t even\u2014we\u2019ve just barely touched the surface\u2014but I\u2019m thinking, \u201cHave you felt that with me?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Yes, of course, I do.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Oh good! Because I was thinking you were going to say, \u201cNot very often.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> No, I totally do. I feel like you\u2019re <em>always<\/em> cheering me on; you\u2019re always pushing me forward. You\u2019re always speaking life into me. I feel like you\u2019re very much like what Jesus would say, like: \u201cYou can do this, Ann,\u201d and \u201cI see you.\u201d I think that\u2019s what women are longing, like: \u201cGod, do You see me? Do You see what I\u2019m going through?\u201d \u201cGod, do You believe in me? Do You think I have what it takes to live out the call that You\u2019ve put on my life?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tLike I look at you, Kristi; and I think: \u201cOh, Jesus put that in you\u2014that desire for His Word\/for Truth\u2014you\u2019re a teacher; you\u2019re a scholar,\u201d and \u201cLook what you\u2019re living. He\u2019s brought that and, now, you\u2019re spreading that all around the world.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSo let\u2019s go back to that. We have these 400 years, where all of a sudden, the culture is shifted. Women are being dishonored; they\u2019re not being seen; and now, Jesus comes onto the scene.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kristi:<\/strong> And it\u2019s so important just to begin with the fact that Jesus was never okay with women being anchored in shame, so part of why He came was to do something about it. That from the very beginning\/from the very genesis, we envision Jesus growing up, with Mary lighting the <em>Shabbat<\/em> candles in His home. He\u2019s growing up in that sense of the honor of woman, of <em>Chava<\/em>\/of Eve. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou start to see that justice and righteousness\u2014we\u2019ve kind of unpacked justice a little bit in this vertical world\u2014but tzedakah, the Hebrew word for righteousness, we often think righteousness means clean, or pure, or something like that; so we want to hold that. But Hebrew words\u2014they\u2019re rich\u2014a Hebrew word is like a suitcase full of meanings. You can just pull out a lot of different meanings. Tzedakah also carries the meaning of generosity\/of being generous. A person of tzedakah, in the Middle East to this day, means they are a generous person. Jesus is, not only bringing justice to women, He\u2019s bringing generous justice to women. Jesus is not okay just to lift woman <em>a little bit<\/em> out of her shame. He is adamant, persistent, and consistent to lift her <em>all the way<\/em> out of her shame, restore her honor, and send her forth in <em>shalom<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThink of the stories: the Samaritan woman. And by the way, Jacob\u2019s well is still there in Israel: it\u2019s 180 feet deep; it has never run dry, and you can still pull up water. When we take teams there, we have the women surround the well; and we read John 4 out loud. Every woman gets to read a verse, a part of that story, where it happened. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSo we have the Samaritan woman. We understand, historically and culturally, the Jews and the Samaritans didn\u2019t get along. There\u2019s a 700-year rift between them when Jesus comes on the scene. The beef is already 700 years growing; and we see Jesus and this Samaritan woman in the heat of the day, and she\u2019s alone. The Middle East is\u2014they\u2019re <em>not<\/em> an individualistic culture\u2014they\u2019re a communal culture. The very fact that, as a woman, that she\u2019s coming to the well alone, bells and whistles are going off for us in this story: \u201cWhere are her friends? Where\u2019s her community?\u201d You\u2019re already getting the tinge of shame that she\u2019s coming alone; no one will come with her to the well. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tJesus begins to interact with her. One of the first things He asked her for is for a drink.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> And it\u2019s interesting\u2014He\u2019s already there, alone\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kristi:<\/strong> \u2014already there.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> The disciples have gone to get food; and He\u2019s alone, almost waiting for her.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kristi:<\/strong> I think, <em>absolutely<\/em>, waiting for her. Even in rabbinic literature, the spittle of a Samaritan woman is unclean; that is in rabbinic literature. So when Jesus, as a holy rabbi of Israel, looks at her, as a Samaritan woman, and says, \u201cGive me a drink,\u201d what He\u2019s saying is: \u201cI\u2019ll drink after you.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u2014meaning He\u2019ll be unclean now.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kristi:<\/strong> \u201cI\u2019ll drink after you,\u201d\u2014absolutely. And for Jesus, in that world of clean and unclean\u2014you know, in Judaism, you\u2019re just trying not to touch something to make you unclean. Jesus comes on the scene and radically reverses that; because He, who is clean, is never afraid to touch unclean; because when He touches unclean, unclean becomes clean. It\u2019s the exact opposite of everything they had known and experienced, in the way that they were relating to God through the laws and commandments. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe have this holy rabbi of Israel offering to drink after a Samaritan woman\/that\u2019s unheard of; a holy rabbi of Israel talking to a woman, alone, at a public well in the heat of the day\/that\u2019s unheard of. We don\u2019t have time to just unpack the whole story, but He begins discussing<em> theology<\/em> with her. [Laughter] She starts talking about: \u201cYou guys say we have to worship in Jerusalem. We worship up on this mountain, Mount Gerizim.\u201d The rabbis in that day\/they weren\u2019t really talking with women; they definitely weren\u2019t talking theology with them.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u2014ever, because women didn\u2019t have that right. They didn\u2019t even think they had it in them to have that discussion.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kristi:<\/strong> That\u2019s right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThen we have this <em>huge<\/em> moment\/this watershed\u2014if it\u2019s a movie, the da-te-daaaah comes in\u2014when Jesus looks at her and he says, \u201cGo call your husband.\u201d She says, \u201cI don\u2019t have a husband\u201d; and He says, \u201cYou are right. What you say is right; you\u2019ve had five husbands, and the man you\u2019re now living with is not your husband.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tOne of the things that I like to unpack\u2014as we understand Jesus in His historical, cultural world\u2014in this moment is, at that time, divorce was the exclusive right of the male; only men could divorce their wives. Women could not even legally\/that just wasn\u2019t even a thing. We\u2019ve often thought of her as\u2014having five husbands\u2014it means that: \u201cShe\u2019s a man-eater,\u201d \u201cShe\u2019s a perpetual cheater,\u201d or something like this.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u2014\u201cShe\u2019s loose.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kristi:<\/strong> Yes: \u201cShe\u2019s loose.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u2014\u201cBad morals.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kristi:<\/strong> But there\u2019s absolutely no way that\u2019s what the text is saying, because she would be dead. They stoned adulteresses in that world; we have a story in John, Chapter 8, that tells us that. She\u2019s not lascivious. She\u2019s had five husbands; what\u2019s going on? I always say Jesus was not naming her sin in that moment\u2014 He was naming her shame\u2014because she had been <em>left<\/em> five times. Five men had married and left her; it\u2019s different.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> She felt like: \u201cWhat is wrong with me that all these men would leave me? I must be broken.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> That\u2019s her shame.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kristi:<\/strong> Yes, that\u2019s her shame. Jesus grabs her back to our definition of justice from the moment He says that to her. Go read the narrative; He starts lifting her out of it. In the Gospel of John, she is the <em>first<\/em> person\/<em>the first person<\/em> that He ever explicitly admits that He is the Messiah. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kristi:<\/strong> You can only do a thing for the first time one time. For all of human history, from Genesis 1 to the end of it all, she will forever always be <em>the one<\/em> that holds the right that she was the first one that He told that He was the Messiah. I always joke we\u2019re going to recognize her in heaven; because she\u2019s going to be wearing a pink t-shirt that says, \u201cI was the first.\u201d [Laughter] We\u2019re going to know her, so just to even give her that honor.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd you know the rest of the story. She comes to the well, alone, in shame. Jesus is the shame-killer; He is the honor-restorer; and He\u2019s the <em>shalom<\/em>-bringer. She goes back; she tells her village: \u201cCome meet a man that told me everything I ever did,\u201d\u2014that\u2019s pretty incredible. And by the end of the story, she\u2019s the missiologist for her village.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> She\u2019s the evangelist.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kristi:<\/strong> Her village needs Him.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Yes, the first evangelist is a woman; <em>incredible<\/em>!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Kristi:<\/strong> And you have to just know they\u2019re all looking at her, saying, \u201cThank you. We would have missed Him if it weren\u2019t for you. We wouldn\u2019t know Him if it wasn\u2019t for you.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe text doesn\u2019t say it, so this is a \u201cKristi-sm\u201d as I like to say. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe Bible does not say this; but you know, Jesus is a Galilean rabbi. He\u2019s coming through Samaria down to Jerusalem for the feast and the festivals. I just imagine\u2014as they\u2019re making those treks up and down, after that moment and after that trip\u2014\u201cWhat if they stopped off at that town every time? What if He made friends in that village? What\/you know, just what time, beyond even that moment, would He have spent with them?\u201d We don\u2019t know. We may get to heaven and find out: she started out\/this woman by herself at a well; and by the end of it, once a year, Jesus and the disciples came through and spent four days with them; I mean, can you just even imagine?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I want to talk to women. I get teary thinking about it; because I mean, my story is I have abuse. I have done a lot of things that I regret, and a lot of things have been done to me that have brought so much shame and condemnation. And yet, Jesus\u2014this same Jesus\u2014has lifted <em>me<\/em> up. He\u2019s freed me from those bondages of sin, of shame, of regret; and I\u2019m <em>amazed<\/em> that He uses me in all my brokenness.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHe has the <em>same<\/em> thing for you. I don\u2019t know where you are, or what\u2019s happened, or where you\u2019ve come from; but I do know this: \u201cJesus wants to meet you right where you are.\u201d If it\u2019s at the well, if it\u2019s in the carpool line, if it\u2019s in your shower on the floor, as you\u2019re crying, Jesus is right there; and He wants to bring you hope; He wants to bring you healing; and He wants to lift you up and bring you to that place of: \u201cYou\u2019re Mine, daughter. I see you. I love you, and I will make all things new.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> The Bible makes it clear, in the book of Genesis, that men and women are created equally in God\u2019s image with equal value, equal dignity, equal worth. Dave and Ann Wilson have been talking today with Kristi McLelland, who has created a video series called <em>Jesus and Women: In the First Century and Now<\/em>. There is information about that video series available on our website at FamilyLifeToday.com. Or if you have questions about the series, call us at 1-800-FL-TODAY; and we\u2019ll see how we can help you. Again, go to the website, FamilyLifeToday.com, for more information about the video series, <em>Jesus and Women: In the First Century and Now<\/em>; or call 1-800-FL-TODAY if you have any additional questions.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou know, we live in a culture that is pressing us hard on every side to think differently about marriage, about family, about men and women, about gender and sexuality. The Bible tells us we are not to be conformed to the thinking of this world. We\u2019re, instead, to be transformed by the renewal of our mind. Here, at FamilyLife, our goal is to provide you, day in and day out, with practical biblical help and hope for how you navigate the challenges of marriage and family in a culture that wants to press us away from the biblical standards\/the biblical moorings that we need to hold onto. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThis daily program, heard on hundreds of radio stations across the country and heard as a podcast by people all around the world, is just one way that we are seeking to effectively develop godly marriages and families who can change the world one home at a time. We want to say, \u201cThank you,\u201d today to those of you who make this ministry possible. Every time you make a donation to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>, what you\u2019re actually doing is helping to disciple young moms and dads\/husbands and wives, helping to renew their minds and to think biblically instead of thinking culturally about these important issues. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIf you\u2019re a long-time listener of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>, and you\u2019ve never made a donation, it\u2019s <em>easy<\/em> to donate. Go to FamilyLifeToday.com; you can make your donation online; or you can call us to donate at 1-800-358-6329; that\u2019s 1-800-\u201cF\u201d as in family, \u201cL\u201d as in life, and then the word, \u201cTODAY.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNow, tomorrow, Dave and Ann Wilson will talk with Kristi McLelland about a dinner party Jesus was attending, where a woman disrupted the party and began anointing Jesus\u2019 feet with her tears. We\u2019ll hear that story and hear more about the value and dignity of women in the eyes of Jesus. I hope you can tune in for that tomorrow.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tOn behalf of our hosts, Dave and Ann Wilson, I\u2019m Bob Lepine. Join us back, again, tomorrow for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife, a Cru<sup>\u00ae <\/sup>Ministry. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHelping you pursue the relationships that matter most.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright <sup>\u00a9<\/sup> 2021 FamilyLife. 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