{"id":306792,"date":"2021-03-25T07:00:04","date_gmt":"2021-03-25T11:00:04","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/%series%\/combatting-insecurity-in-a-second-marriage\/"},"modified":"2021-03-25T07:00:04","modified_gmt":"2021-03-25T11:00:04","slug":"combatting-insecurity-in-a-second-marriage","status":"publish","type":"podcast","link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/combatting-insecurity-in-a-second-marriage\/","title":{"rendered":"Combatting Insecurity in a Second Marriage"},"content":{"rendered":"","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>As a second wife or second husband, have you ever felt second best? Ron Deal talks with Lore Ferguson Wilbert about how to combat the insecurities that naturally arise in second marriages.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":91,"featured_media":294104,"menu_order":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","template":"","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","inline_featured_image":false,"_uag_custom_page_level_css":"","episode_type":"","audio_file":"https:\/\/mp3.familylife.com\/fl2021-03-25.mp3","cover_image":"","cover_image_id":"","duration":"00:31:06","filesize":"28.48M","filesize_raw":"29859207","date_recorded":"","explicit":"","block":""},"categories":[2859,10445],"tags":[4327],"podcast_series":[],"cwp_profile":[9623,3300],"series":[2101],"class_list":["post-306792","podcast","type-podcast","status-publish","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-dating-and-preparing-for-marriage","category-stepmarriage-advice","tag-second-marriage","cwp_profile-lore-ferguson-wilbert","cwp_profile-ron-deal","series-familylife-today"],"acf":[],"episode_featured_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/09\/FLT-Podcast-Cover-2-508x508-3.jpg?w=508","episode_player_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2023\/02\/image-scaled.jpg","download_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-download\/306792\/combatting-insecurity-in-a-second-marriage","player_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-player\/306792\/combatting-insecurity-in-a-second-marriage","audio_player":null,"episode_data":{"playerMode":"light","subscribeUrls":{"apple_podcasts":{"key":"apple_podcasts","url":"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303?mt=2&app=podcast","label":"Apple Podcasts","class":"apple_podcasts","icon":"apple-podcasts.png"},"google_podcasts":{"key":"google_podcasts","url":"","label":"Google Podcasts","class":"google_podcasts","icon":"google-podcasts.png"},"spotify":{"key":"spotify","url":"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm","label":"Spotify","class":"spotify","icon":"spotify.png"},"youtube":{"key":"youtube","url":"","label":"YouTube","class":"youtube","icon":"youtube.png"}},"rssFeedUrl":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/feed\/podcast\/familylife-today","embedCode":"<blockquote class=\"wp-embedded-content\" data-secret=\"P10mnnFQEG\"><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/combatting-insecurity-in-a-second-marriage\/\">Combatting Insecurity in a Second Marriage<\/a><\/blockquote><iframe sandbox=\"allow-scripts\" security=\"restricted\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/combatting-insecurity-in-a-second-marriage\/embed\/#?secret=P10mnnFQEG\" width=\"500\" height=\"350\" title=\"&#8220;Combatting Insecurity in a Second Marriage&#8221; &#8212; FamilyLife\u00ae - A Cru Ministry\" data-secret=\"P10mnnFQEG\" frameborder=\"0\" marginwidth=\"0\" marginheight=\"0\" scrolling=\"no\" class=\"wp-embedded-content\"><\/iframe><script>\n\/*! This file is auto-generated *\/\n!function(d,l){\"use strict\";l.querySelector&&d.addEventListener&&\"undefined\"!=typeof URL&&(d.wp=d.wp||{},d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage||(d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage=function(e){var t=e.data;if((t||t.secret||t.message||t.value)&&!\/[^a-zA-Z0-9]\/.test(t.secret)){for(var s,r,n,a=l.querySelectorAll('iframe[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),o=l.querySelectorAll('blockquote[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),c=new RegExp(\"^https?:$\",\"i\"),i=0;i<o.length;i++)o[i].style.display=\"none\";for(i=0;i<a.length;i++)s=a[i],e.source===s.contentWindow&&(s.removeAttribute(\"style\"),\"height\"===t.message?(1e3<(r=parseInt(t.value,10))?r=1e3:~~r<200&&(r=200),s.height=r):\"link\"===t.message&&(r=new URL(s.getAttribute(\"src\")),n=new URL(t.value),c.test(n.protocol))&&n.host===r.host&&l.activeElement===s&&(d.top.location.href=t.value))}},d.addEventListener(\"message\",d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage,!1),l.addEventListener(\"DOMContentLoaded\",function(){for(var e,t,s=l.querySelectorAll(\"iframe.wp-embedded-content\"),r=0;r<s.length;r++)(t=(e=s[r]).getAttribute(\"data-secret\"))||(t=Math.random().toString(36).substring(2,12),e.src+=\"#?secret=\"+t,e.setAttribute(\"data-secret\",t)),e.contentWindow.postMessage({message:\"ready\",secret:t},\"*\")},!1)))}(window,document);\n\/\/# sourceURL=https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-includes\/js\/wp-embed.min.js\n<\/script>\n"},"spectra_custom_meta":{"_wp_page_template":["default"],"transcript_url":["https:\/\/transcript.familylife.com\/fl2021-03-25.pdf"],"audio_file":["https:\/\/mp3.familylife.com\/fl2021-03-25.mp3"],"transcript_content":["<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Whether other people know it or not, Lore Ferguson Wilbert says she carries with her the knowledge that she is a second wife; she\u2019s married to someone who\u2019s been married before. She says there\u2019s a stigma that\u2019s attached to that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Lore: <\/strong>You know, in the church in particular, I think there are some unfortunate narratives around divorce and remarriage. I think I feel acutely aware of being a second wife, depending on who I\u2019m around, and what their thoughts about it are, or what they suspect to be my husband\u2019s story but don\u2019t know to be true. I\u2019m reminded I don\u2019t have maybe a traditional route here in the way that I got to marriage.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>This is <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> for Thursday, March 25<sup>th<\/sup>. Our hosts are Dave and Ann Wilson; I'm Bob Lepine. You can find us online at FamilyLifeToday.com. What\u2019s it like to be a second wife in a second marriage?\u2014to carry that with you. We\u2019re going to hear more about that today from Lore Ferguson Wilbert. Stay with us.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd welcome to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. Thanks for joining us. I think all of us, in this culture in particular, wrestle with the whole issue of comparison. Social media fuels this; we look around and we go, \u201cWhy is everybody else\u2019s marriage good?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>Oh, I never compare myself, Bob!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>Absolutely, I do it every day. Do men not do it?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>Oh yes we do. I\u2019m kidding; we compare, I think, daily.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>I guess you don\u2019t talk about it as much as women do, because women talk about this.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>They do?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>We do struggle with this.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>I will confess that\u2014we\u2019ve done interviews here on <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>, where it\u2019s been a husband and wife\u2014and the wife has been\/she\u2019s just been the biggest admirer of her husband.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>You\u2019re talking about Ann? You\u2019re talking about Ann!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>Oh, you\u2019re talking about me. [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>She just said: \u201cYou know, he is so this and so that,\u201d \u201cI love his preaching,\u201d or \u201c\u2026his\u2026\u201d I\u2019ll go home and go, \u201cHow come you never rave about me the way I hear other wives rave\u2026\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>Do you say it or think it?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>I\u2019ve had that conversation with Mary Ann, where I\u2019ve just said, \u201cSo\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>\u2014\u201cdo you like me?\u201d [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u2014\u201cdo you think I\u2019m special?\u201d\u2014right? I think all of us think: \u201cWhy doesn\u2019t he look at me the way that other guy looks at his wife?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u201cWhy doesn\u2019t my wife hold my hand the way that that woman\u2019s holding her husband\u2019s hand?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>Where are you going with this, Bob?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Ron Deal, who gives leadership to FamilyLife Blended<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>, did an interview recently\u2014a very interesting interview\u2014with Lore Ferguson Wilbert. Lore is a second wife; her husband has been married previously. She wrote an article in <em>Fathom<\/em> magazine, where she talked about what it\u2019s like to be a second wife and the constant sense of comparison. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe should mention, by the way, that in four weeks, FamilyLife<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>\u2019s <em>Blended &amp; Blessed<\/em><sup>\u00ae<\/sup> event\u2014there\u2019ll be couples watching it in their homes; there\u2019ll be groups that are getting together to watch it\u2014there\u2019ll be thousands of people all across the country tuned in for that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>\u2014and churches that are doing it too.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Yes, absolutely. Again, more information online. The <em>Blended &amp; Blessed<\/em> event is the premier event every year for couples, who are in second marriages\/blended marriages. You\u2019ll get real help for your family\/for your marriage by attending this event. Again, there\u2019s more information, online, at FamilyLifeToday.com.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tLet\u2019s listen to the first part of Ron Deal\u2019s conversation with Lore Ferguson Wilbert about what it\u2019s like to be a second wife in a marriage.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t[<em>FamilyLife Blended<\/em> Podcast]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> Here we are; we\u2019re still in the middle of the COVID crazies, as I\u2019ve come to call them. [Laughter] That\u2019s certainly not a life we ever expected, or counted on, or anticipated; yet, we find ourselves living in this and trying to make the best of it. Is it that sort of an experience? Is that a good parallel for you?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Lore:<\/strong> Yes, I think they are the experiences that are like: \u201cThis isn\u2019t what I wanted, and so I\u2019m just going to begrudgingly find contentment in it.\u201d Then, there\u2019s the surprising experiences; I think of Lewis\u2019 famous book, <em>Surprised by Joy<\/em>. There\u2019s just things we\u2019re not looking for\/things we\u2019re not necessarily paying attention to, and suddenly, God drops them in our lives; and we think, \u201cWell, that was totally unexpected.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think there have been moments, maybe spread out along our marriage, where I have felt like: \u201cOkay, this is harder\u2026\u201d or \u201c\u2026different.\u201d I think those moments get less and less as time goes on.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> Okay, I\u2019m pulling together a couple of dots there. I heard you say, a little while ago, you don\u2019t really think about it very much\u2014being the second wife\u2014until something prompts that; then it comes up. Maybe somebody refers to you or says something from the outside that reminds you: \u201cOh, yes, that\u2019s true.\u201d Then I just heard you say there\u2019s moments, where that just kind of resurrects. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI\u2019m curious: is there any pattern to those moments? What are those moments about? And then what happens in you when you go, \u201cOh, yes, that is my life\u201d?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Lore:<\/strong> I think I am most acutely aware of being a second wife in those moments, where something is tender for my husband. I\u2019m aware there\u2019s a wound there that I didn\u2019t cause; and yet, it\u2019s a big part of his story. I am called to care for that wound as his wife. I\u2019m called to be invested in the healing of that wound\u2014even though I didn\u2019t cause it, even though I\/I\u2019m devastated that it\u2019s there\u2014just aware that it\u2019s there. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIn the church in particular, I think there are some unfortunate narratives around divorce and remarriage. I think I feel acutely aware of being a second wife, depending on who I am around, and what their thoughts about it are, or what they suspect to be my husband\u2019s story but don\u2019t know to be true. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe don\u2019t share the specifics of his divorce with everyone, even though there were biblical grounds for it. It\u2019s just a hard story, and we want to be careful. But I am reminded\u2014yes, it\u2019s an uncomfortable subject for some people; so I\u2019m reminded\u2014\u201cOh, I\u2019m not\/I don\u2019t have maybe a traditional route here in the way that I got to marriage.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> I want to come back to the wounds in your husband that you see; that\u2019s a good one. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tLet\u2019s just stay on those church narratives for a minute. Yes, conversation\u2014the way we teach and preach, dialogue, and the assumptions that people make\u2014those are big; right? And what a bind for you to want to gently handle the circumstances around your husband\u2019s divorce; yet, people almost demand an explanation. What do you do with that?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Lore:<\/strong> He decided, early, on that he wanted to comfort others with the comfort he had been given\u2014Corinthians talks about that\u2014so we are very, very openhanded in how we shared about the story. We\u2019re very careful to, as much as we can, to cover a multitude of sins and to not be specific about sins done against him. He\u2019s very specific though about sins he committed, so he leads with that. In his sharing of the narrative, he leads with his brokenness in the marriage\/his failures in that marriage. We\u2019ve just decided, as a couple, we\u2019re going to try and comfort others with the comfort we\u2019ve been given and be open about that. We have taken the posture\u2014and this isn\u2019t the posture for everyone\u2014but we\u2019ve taken the posture that nothing is off limits: if someone asks, we\u2019ll tell them. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe can\u2019t control the outcome; we can\u2019t control what\u2019s said about us; we can\u2019t control the narrative that people make up in their minds about us. We just have to be faithful to the story that God\u2019s given us to live; we have to be faithful to stewarding that story. All we can do is be honest and truthful about it and be honest and truthful about where we\u2019ve seen God\u2019s healing, and where we\u2019re waiting for God\u2019s healing, and where we\u2019re praying for God\u2019s healing, and just walk in faith that way, which is not easy.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> Right, right, right. But I so appreciate that because, as somebody, who has spent close to 30 years ministering to people\u2014in circumstances that they didn\u2019t always choose or want to be in; and sometimes, they did choose\/it was their fault; they did bring it about\u2014but nevertheless, it\u2019s the: \u201cHow do we, as a church, respond to others?\u201d\u2014and your courage and willingness to be open with the story. In fact, this blog that you wrote is just so insightful and so revealing. Just for you guys to do that\u2014publicly in writing, for example; and privately, in conversation with people\u2014I think that is where redemptive moments happen for others. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tTo the listener right now, I just want to say: \u201cYou may never have thought that you had a ministry, if you will. You always felt like you had to be the one ministered to; but you underestimate the power of your personal story in the hands of somebody else, who is also struggling and wrestling with some question, and how that brings encouragement and courage to people, who feel second class.\u201d It\u2019s not just the second-wife thing but it\u2019s that second-class thing. I think you said a little while ago, \u201csecondhand\u201d;\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Lore:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> \u2014and I was struck by that. Yes, right; you feel secondhand\u2014almost like it\u2019s a demotion or something to be the second wife\u2014to be, even in church circles, there\u2019s just those messages that make people shrink. I see you saying, \u201cNo, we don\u2019t have to do that; we can stand up.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Lore:<\/strong> Yes, I think the whole\u2014to me the whole point of the gospel is that we are all fractured jars\u2014we are all broken in some way; we have all experienced brokenness in some way\u2014and God wants to make us whole. He wants to take what\u2019s been broken and He wants us to be the letter that He\u2019s written to the world\u2014that\u2019s what Paul calls us\u2014so: \u201cHow do I take what isn\u2019t what I expected and choose to be the letter that God is using for my life to the world to preach the gospel?\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAlso, it\u2019s just a good reminder, to me, of the gospel that our marriage is not any more special to God than their marriage was. God was for their marriage; He was in their marriage. Even though sin fractured it to the point of divorce, God was still for them in that marriage. God is in our marriage, and He\u2019s for our marriage, and He\u2019s working through our marriage. I don\u2019t have to compare our marriages to one another.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> Yes, and that\u2019s so good. Why compare? It\u2019s okay to say, \u201cOf course, God was for that marriage,\u201d like He\u2019s for your marriage.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Lore:<\/strong> Yes; that was actually\/I will say that is one of the most freeing concepts that I\u2019ve had in our marriage. I think, when we were just newly together, I had questions about his past: I had questions about his sexual past, questions about his conflicts that they might have had, or specifics in their marriage. I found somewhat of a reticence in him to talking about some of those things. At first, I thought, \u201cWell, I\u2019m going to be your wife. Why won\u2019t you talk to me about these things?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut the more time went on, the more I thought, \u201cIf I\u2019m walking into covenant\/if I\u2019m in covenant with this man, that means that our marriage is precious in the eyes of God and is to be protected by God. It\u2019s wrong of me to assume that I\u2019m allowed to know everything that happened in their covenant that was protected by God.\u201d That freed me up to just say, \u201cYou know what? I\u2019m going to trust that, if my husband needs to tell me something, he\u2019s going to. But if I don\u2019t need to know something, or it\u2019s not my business, I don\u2019t need to know it.\u201d I can be free to just say, \u201cGod was in that.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> Let\u2019s drill down on that. It\u2019s not your business\u2014like if you had another couple come up to you right now, it wouldn\u2019t be your business to be probing into parts of their relationship that they\u2019re not opening to you\u2014is it that same sort of thing?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Lore:<\/strong> I think there\u2019s moments when we need to probe in our friends\u2019 lives and ask specific questions.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> Yes, good point.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Lore:<\/strong> But I think that when I\u2019m\u2014if my motivations in probing are to feel better about myself, or to compete with a previous marriage in any way, or to put down someone else, or to excuse my sin in the way that it might be wounding my husband and to sort of put that on her\u2014that\u2019s not a good motivation. I think, when I\u2019m probing with a couple, if my motivation is just to dig up dirt, that\u2019s not a good motivation. But if my motivation is to care for and shepherd, that\u2019s a good motivation; so I want to probe in those moments. I hope that\u2019s a helpful distinction. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> It is; it\u2019s a very good distinction. I appreciate that wisdom. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t[Studio]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Let me step in here. We\u2019ve been listening to the first part of a conversation between Ron Deal and Lore Ferguson Wilbert, talking about what it\u2019s like to be a second wife. I think the point about\u2014\u201cWhat\u2019s your motivation as you dig into these subjects?\u201d\u2014that\u2019s a great question to be wrestling with.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>I can remember, when I was in middle school, my stepmom, who was my dad\u2019s second wife, asking me questions about my mom. I could tell, even as a 13-\/14-year-old, she was comparing\u2014like, \u201cHey, I\u2019m funnier than your mom was; right?\u201d\u2014it was a little awkward; I mean, I can remember this decades later. I\u2019m now realizing she was comparing, and she was wondering about that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>That\u2019s interesting; because the first time I met your stepmom, she was cooking. She was asking me questions, like, \u201cOh, what kind of cook is Dave\u2019s mom?\u201d\u2014because she was extraordinary cook\u2014but I remember feeling like, \u201cOh, she\u2019s feeling some of that comparison.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Well, and in Part Two of this conversation between Ron and Lore, they talk about how a healthy sense of your identity is necessary to know who you are in Christ. That\u2019s so critical when you face these kinds of issues of competition. Let\u2019s listen to the conversation as it continues here.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t[<em>FamilyLife Blended<\/em> Podcast]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>Let me dial down. We\u2019ve used the word, \u201ccompetition,\u201d a couple of times. I think it\u2019s great\u2014you saying, \u201cHey, from God\u2019s point of view, He was for the first marriage; He\u2019s for this marriage,\u201d\u2014let\u2019s look at it from your point of view for a minute. Let\u2019s just get earthly about this: \u201cDoesn\u2019t every woman want to be first in her husband\u2019s heart? What do you do with that thought that you\u2019re second?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Lore:<\/strong> Yes, I feel that. What helps me is to know that I am my husband\u2019s first right now. He has chosen me; he is not thinking about her. We have open conversations about these things. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut there have been times, where\u2014we moved away from the city where we lived for a while; because there were just some bitter memories for him here, because of their previous marriage\u2014and then we had to move back a few years later. That was really, really difficult for him to just imagine being on the same streets, around the same grocery stores, and all those things. He had to really dial down and wrestle with the Lord over: \u201cAm I going to honor, and please, and love my current wife?\u2014or am I going to be continuing to think about my previous wife?\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHe chose to come back here; he chose to come back to the city, because he knew it would be better for me. This was where our community was. In that choice, I was able to see how he laid down his life for me\u2014he does that every day\u2014lays down his life for me.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tPart of being first to him\/part of being his covenantal wife right now, is deciding to actually, not overlook those wounds when they come up, but to step into those places. For instance, if we drive past a location that has a specific bitter memory attached to it for him, and he gets quiet\u2014instead of just letting that happen\u2014stepping in and saying, \u201cI am the wife that he has now. I am the partner with him and with God in helping to heal these wounds; so I\u2019m going to step into that and say, \u2018Hey, what\u2019s going through your mind right now as we pass that place? What are you thinking about? How can I love you through that?\u2019\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe more time goes on, and the more talking that we do about it, the more God heals those places; so he can drive past places that he couldn\u2019t drive past, even three years ago, without a bitter memory coming.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> One of the things I\u2019ve wondered about \u201csecond wife\u201d\u2014reflecting on your blog\u2014is that your husband has to maybe unlearn some patterns and some rhythms of the past. You talk a little bit about sleeping on a different side of the bed. Clearly, you\u2019re different people; and your husband has to adapt to that. Have there ever been some ripples in there, where you go, \u201cOkay, this is a leftover from the past.\u201d Again, is this just an adjustment, or what\u2019s your attitude around those things?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Lore:<\/strong> I think, again, the more time goes on, the fewer those ripples are. I think, in the beginning, it was around things\u2014I actually prefer to stay in; she preferred to go out\u2014it was around things like that. I\u2019m just much more of a homebody than she was, and it took changing. He ate\u2014he drank a lot of soda\u2014and ate a lot of sugar before we got married. [Laughter] I was like, \u201cI can\u2019t live like that; I don\u2019t have her body. I have a different body. I can\u2019t eat those things and keep the body that I have.\u201d It took a change of diet and just saying, \u201cI\u2019m not\u2026we are different people.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNow, she bears the image of God. She has intrinsic value and intrinsic identity given to her by God. I have a different identity and different value given to me by God. That doesn\u2019t make her less than me or me more than her; it just makes us different. We have to figure out how to navigate those differences in marriage. I am a night person, and she wasn\u2019t a night person; so bedtime and wakeup time has been an area where we\u2019ve just had to learn to adjust to one another over the past.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> There\u2019s something else you reference in your blog. You said, \u201cWalk with patience, endurance, and lose the expectations that lead mostly to resentments.\u201d Have there been any expectations you had to lose?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Lore:<\/strong> I think everyone comes to every marriage with expectations. What I\u2019ve learned is that my husband is a different man\u2014that God disciplined him through that divorce\u2014and he does not value the same things that he valued before. That has been such a good thing for me to just realize: \u201cIf I wanted the husband, who was making these decisions with a different heart before, that\u2019s the husband that was not a good husband, and not obedient and submissive to the Lord in the way that he needed to be. Instead, I have a husband, who makes different decisions with his money; and yet, honors the Lord and loves me and cherishes me. I\u2019m going to take that second\/I\u2019m going to take this husband.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> Which of those two qualities is worth more: \u201cHow he spends his money\u201d or \u201cHow he honors his God?\u201d That fills a different bank account; doesn\u2019t it? Right, each one of those goes in a different direction; you\u2019re right. You\u2019re better off with the man that you have.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t[Studio]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Well, we\u2019ve been listening to a great conversation between Ron Deal and Lore Ferguson Wilbert, talking about what it\u2019s like to be a second wife or a second husband. If you\u2019re in a second marriage, how you deal with expectations, and adjustments, and the fact that there are, undoubtedly, going to be things about your first marriage that you\u2019re going to go, \u201cI liked it better with that other person.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>Just you saying that causes insecurity in my life, like, \u201cOh, that would be so terrible!\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>It has to be the case. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>Sure!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>I mean, we\u2019re different people; you go, \u201cThat other person did this better than you do.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>But the insecurity that comes out of that\u2014that\u2019s where I think Lore\u2019s point about: \u201cWhere\u2019s your identity, and how do you then maturely adjust your expectations?\u201d\u2014you go, \u201cOkay, my first husband did this\u201d; but just as Ron said at the end, \u201cI am where God has me today, and I need to learn to be content in where I am.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>I think it\u2019s the greener grass syndrome; we all struggle\u2014whether it\u2019s your first marriage, and you\u2019re thinking, \u201cI was better off when I was single\u201d; now, you\u2019re in a second marriage, and you\u2019re thinking, \u201cI was better off\u2026\u201d\u2014I think, as they got to at the end, you have to look at what you have that is good and actually realize it\u2019s the best.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>I would add: \u201cAnd who you are\/that you\u2019re enough,\u201d because that\u2019s the identity piece.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThere\u2019s actually a lot more to this conversation. I would hope our listeners would, first of all, subscribe to Ron\u2019s podcast. Go online at FamilyLifeToday.com and start listening, especially if you\u2019re in a second marriage\/you\u2019re in a blended family. <em>FamilyLife Blended<\/em> is all about how you can thrive in the relationship you\u2019re in today. That\u2019s where God has you; that\u2019s where you can grow, and expand, and thrive. Go to FamilyLifeToday.com; there\u2019s information there about this particular podcast episode\/about the <em>FamilyLife Blended <\/em>podcast, where you can subscribe to that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThere\u2019s also information about an upcoming event, called <em>Blended &amp; Blessed<\/em>. This is an annual event; it\u2019s going to be a livestream event this year\u2014one day, Saturday, \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tApril 24<sup>th<\/sup>\u2014online. All around the world, folks are going to be joining us for a day, where we focus on the issues that are facing couples in second marriages or in blended families.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tRon Deal gives leadership to this. We\u2019re going to hear from David and Meg Robbins, Ray and Robyn McKelvey, a whole lot more. It\u2019s an online event; and by the way, it\u2019s also being streamed in Spanish this year. You can watch this with a group from church, with a small group, watch it just by yourselves. All of the information about how to sign up for the <em>Blended &amp; Blessed<\/em> one-day livestream is available on our website at FamilyLifeToday.com. Check it out; and plan to join us on Saturday, April 24<sup>th<\/sup>, for <em>Blended &amp; Blessed<\/em>.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tLet me just add that there are a myriad of resources to help blended couples\/blended families, with the issues you\u2019re facing, available from us, here, at <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. There are links on our websites to books and articles; again, Ron Deal\u2019s podcast is available. There\u2019s so much we have available. Go to FamilyLifeToday.com to check it all out. If you have any questions about the one-day livestream, give us a call at 1-800-FL-TODAY; that\u2019s our number: 1-800-358-6329; that\u2019s 1-800-\u201cF\u201d as in family, \u201cL\u201d as in life, and then the word, \u201cTODAY.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to say a quick word of thanks to those of you who have called us or gone online to make a donation this week. We\u2019ve been hearing from <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> listeners, saying, \u201cWe believe in what you\u2019re doing and want to help support the ministry of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\u201d I think one thing that may be motivating folks is we\u2019ve been offering a book called <em>The Negativity Remedy<\/em>; we talked about it earlier this week. That\u2019s our thank-you gift to you this week when you donate to support the ministry of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tOf course, your donations are vital for the work that we do here. We\u2019re listener-supported. Without your financial support, we could not continue the work of this ministry; so thanks, in advance, for either making an online donation or calling 1-800-FL-TODAY to donate. Again, when you do, ask for your copy of the book, <em>The Negativity Remedy<\/em>. It\u2019s our thank-you gift to you when you support the work of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe hope you can join us, again, tomorrow. We\u2019re going to hear more from Ron Deal and Lore Ferguson Wilbert about the reality of being a second wife in a marriage. I hope you can be with us for that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch. We got some extra help this week from Bruce Goff and, of course, our entire broadcast production team is involved. On behalf of our hosts, Dave and Ann Wilson, I\u2019m Bob Lepine. We will see you back next time for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas; a Cru<sup>\u00ae <\/sup>Ministry. Help for today. Hope for tomorrow.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright <sup>\u00a9<\/sup> 2021 FamilyLife. All rights reserved.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/\">www.FamilyLife.com<\/a>\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\n\t\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\t1\n\t\t\t\t<\/p>"],"_seopress_titles_title":[""],"_seopress_titles_desc":[""],"_seopress_robots_index":[""],"duration":["00:31:06"],"show_notes":[""],"_thumbnail_id":["294104"],"filesize":["28.48M"],"filesize_raw":["29859207"],"_uag_css_file_name":["uag-css-306792.css"],"_uag_js_file_name":["uag-js-306792.js"],"_uag_page_assets":["a:9:{s:3:\"css\";s:82560:\".wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape-top svg{width: calc( 100% + 1.3px );}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape.uagb-container__shape-top .uagb-container__shape-fill{fill: rgba(51,51,51,1);}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape-bottom svg{width: calc( 100% + 1.3px );}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape.uagb-container__shape-bottom 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a second wife or second husband, have you ever felt second best? Ron Deal talks with Lore Ferguson Wilbert about how to combat the insecurities that naturally arise in second marriages.","meta_box":{"show_notes":"","transcript_url":"https:\/\/transcript.familylife.com\/fl2021-03-25.pdf","transcript_content":"<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Whether other people know it or not, Lore Ferguson Wilbert says she carries with her the knowledge that she is a second wife; she\u2019s married to someone who\u2019s been married before. She says there\u2019s a stigma that\u2019s attached to that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Lore: <\/strong>You know, in the church in particular, I think there are some unfortunate narratives around divorce and remarriage. I think I feel acutely aware of being a second wife, depending on who I\u2019m around, and what their thoughts about it are, or what they suspect to be my husband\u2019s story but don\u2019t know to be true. I\u2019m reminded I don\u2019t have maybe a traditional route here in the way that I got to marriage.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>This is <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> for Thursday, March 25<sup>th<\/sup>. Our hosts are Dave and Ann Wilson; I'm Bob Lepine. You can find us online at FamilyLifeToday.com. What\u2019s it like to be a second wife in a second marriage?\u2014to carry that with you. We\u2019re going to hear more about that today from Lore Ferguson Wilbert. Stay with us.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd welcome to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. Thanks for joining us. I think all of us, in this culture in particular, wrestle with the whole issue of comparison. Social media fuels this; we look around and we go, \u201cWhy is everybody else\u2019s marriage good?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>Oh, I never compare myself, Bob!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>Absolutely, I do it every day. Do men not do it?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>Oh yes we do. I\u2019m kidding; we compare, I think, daily.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>I guess you don\u2019t talk about it as much as women do, because women talk about this.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>They do?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>We do struggle with this.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>I will confess that\u2014we\u2019ve done interviews here on <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>, where it\u2019s been a husband and wife\u2014and the wife has been\/she\u2019s just been the biggest admirer of her husband.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>You\u2019re talking about Ann? You\u2019re talking about Ann!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>Oh, you\u2019re talking about me. [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>She just said: \u201cYou know, he is so this and so that,\u201d \u201cI love his preaching,\u201d or \u201c\u2026his\u2026\u201d I\u2019ll go home and go, \u201cHow come you never rave about me the way I hear other wives rave\u2026\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>Do you say it or think it?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>I\u2019ve had that conversation with Mary Ann, where I\u2019ve just said, \u201cSo\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>\u2014\u201cdo you like me?\u201d [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u2014\u201cdo you think I\u2019m special?\u201d\u2014right? I think all of us think: \u201cWhy doesn\u2019t he look at me the way that other guy looks at his wife?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u201cWhy doesn\u2019t my wife hold my hand the way that that woman\u2019s holding her husband\u2019s hand?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>Where are you going with this, Bob?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Ron Deal, who gives leadership to FamilyLife Blended<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>, did an interview recently\u2014a very interesting interview\u2014with Lore Ferguson Wilbert. Lore is a second wife; her husband has been married previously. She wrote an article in <em>Fathom<\/em> magazine, where she talked about what it\u2019s like to be a second wife and the constant sense of comparison. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe should mention, by the way, that in four weeks, FamilyLife<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>\u2019s <em>Blended &amp; Blessed<\/em><sup>\u00ae<\/sup> event\u2014there\u2019ll be couples watching it in their homes; there\u2019ll be groups that are getting together to watch it\u2014there\u2019ll be thousands of people all across the country tuned in for that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>\u2014and churches that are doing it too.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Yes, absolutely. Again, more information online. The <em>Blended &amp; Blessed<\/em> event is the premier event every year for couples, who are in second marriages\/blended marriages. You\u2019ll get real help for your family\/for your marriage by attending this event. Again, there\u2019s more information, online, at FamilyLifeToday.com.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tLet\u2019s listen to the first part of Ron Deal\u2019s conversation with Lore Ferguson Wilbert about what it\u2019s like to be a second wife in a marriage.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t[<em>FamilyLife Blended<\/em> Podcast]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> Here we are; we\u2019re still in the middle of the COVID crazies, as I\u2019ve come to call them. [Laughter] That\u2019s certainly not a life we ever expected, or counted on, or anticipated; yet, we find ourselves living in this and trying to make the best of it. Is it that sort of an experience? Is that a good parallel for you?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Lore:<\/strong> Yes, I think they are the experiences that are like: \u201cThis isn\u2019t what I wanted, and so I\u2019m just going to begrudgingly find contentment in it.\u201d Then, there\u2019s the surprising experiences; I think of Lewis\u2019 famous book, <em>Surprised by Joy<\/em>. There\u2019s just things we\u2019re not looking for\/things we\u2019re not necessarily paying attention to, and suddenly, God drops them in our lives; and we think, \u201cWell, that was totally unexpected.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think there have been moments, maybe spread out along our marriage, where I have felt like: \u201cOkay, this is harder\u2026\u201d or \u201c\u2026different.\u201d I think those moments get less and less as time goes on.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> Okay, I\u2019m pulling together a couple of dots there. I heard you say, a little while ago, you don\u2019t really think about it very much\u2014being the second wife\u2014until something prompts that; then it comes up. Maybe somebody refers to you or says something from the outside that reminds you: \u201cOh, yes, that\u2019s true.\u201d Then I just heard you say there\u2019s moments, where that just kind of resurrects. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI\u2019m curious: is there any pattern to those moments? What are those moments about? And then what happens in you when you go, \u201cOh, yes, that is my life\u201d?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Lore:<\/strong> I think I am most acutely aware of being a second wife in those moments, where something is tender for my husband. I\u2019m aware there\u2019s a wound there that I didn\u2019t cause; and yet, it\u2019s a big part of his story. I am called to care for that wound as his wife. I\u2019m called to be invested in the healing of that wound\u2014even though I didn\u2019t cause it, even though I\/I\u2019m devastated that it\u2019s there\u2014just aware that it\u2019s there. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIn the church in particular, I think there are some unfortunate narratives around divorce and remarriage. I think I feel acutely aware of being a second wife, depending on who I am around, and what their thoughts about it are, or what they suspect to be my husband\u2019s story but don\u2019t know to be true. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe don\u2019t share the specifics of his divorce with everyone, even though there were biblical grounds for it. It\u2019s just a hard story, and we want to be careful. But I am reminded\u2014yes, it\u2019s an uncomfortable subject for some people; so I\u2019m reminded\u2014\u201cOh, I\u2019m not\/I don\u2019t have maybe a traditional route here in the way that I got to marriage.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> I want to come back to the wounds in your husband that you see; that\u2019s a good one. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tLet\u2019s just stay on those church narratives for a minute. Yes, conversation\u2014the way we teach and preach, dialogue, and the assumptions that people make\u2014those are big; right? And what a bind for you to want to gently handle the circumstances around your husband\u2019s divorce; yet, people almost demand an explanation. What do you do with that?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Lore:<\/strong> He decided, early, on that he wanted to comfort others with the comfort he had been given\u2014Corinthians talks about that\u2014so we are very, very openhanded in how we shared about the story. We\u2019re very careful to, as much as we can, to cover a multitude of sins and to not be specific about sins done against him. He\u2019s very specific though about sins he committed, so he leads with that. In his sharing of the narrative, he leads with his brokenness in the marriage\/his failures in that marriage. We\u2019ve just decided, as a couple, we\u2019re going to try and comfort others with the comfort we\u2019ve been given and be open about that. We have taken the posture\u2014and this isn\u2019t the posture for everyone\u2014but we\u2019ve taken the posture that nothing is off limits: if someone asks, we\u2019ll tell them. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe can\u2019t control the outcome; we can\u2019t control what\u2019s said about us; we can\u2019t control the narrative that people make up in their minds about us. We just have to be faithful to the story that God\u2019s given us to live; we have to be faithful to stewarding that story. All we can do is be honest and truthful about it and be honest and truthful about where we\u2019ve seen God\u2019s healing, and where we\u2019re waiting for God\u2019s healing, and where we\u2019re praying for God\u2019s healing, and just walk in faith that way, which is not easy.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> Right, right, right. But I so appreciate that because, as somebody, who has spent close to 30 years ministering to people\u2014in circumstances that they didn\u2019t always choose or want to be in; and sometimes, they did choose\/it was their fault; they did bring it about\u2014but nevertheless, it\u2019s the: \u201cHow do we, as a church, respond to others?\u201d\u2014and your courage and willingness to be open with the story. In fact, this blog that you wrote is just so insightful and so revealing. Just for you guys to do that\u2014publicly in writing, for example; and privately, in conversation with people\u2014I think that is where redemptive moments happen for others. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tTo the listener right now, I just want to say: \u201cYou may never have thought that you had a ministry, if you will. You always felt like you had to be the one ministered to; but you underestimate the power of your personal story in the hands of somebody else, who is also struggling and wrestling with some question, and how that brings encouragement and courage to people, who feel second class.\u201d It\u2019s not just the second-wife thing but it\u2019s that second-class thing. I think you said a little while ago, \u201csecondhand\u201d;\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Lore:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> \u2014and I was struck by that. Yes, right; you feel secondhand\u2014almost like it\u2019s a demotion or something to be the second wife\u2014to be, even in church circles, there\u2019s just those messages that make people shrink. I see you saying, \u201cNo, we don\u2019t have to do that; we can stand up.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Lore:<\/strong> Yes, I think the whole\u2014to me the whole point of the gospel is that we are all fractured jars\u2014we are all broken in some way; we have all experienced brokenness in some way\u2014and God wants to make us whole. He wants to take what\u2019s been broken and He wants us to be the letter that He\u2019s written to the world\u2014that\u2019s what Paul calls us\u2014so: \u201cHow do I take what isn\u2019t what I expected and choose to be the letter that God is using for my life to the world to preach the gospel?\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAlso, it\u2019s just a good reminder, to me, of the gospel that our marriage is not any more special to God than their marriage was. God was for their marriage; He was in their marriage. Even though sin fractured it to the point of divorce, God was still for them in that marriage. God is in our marriage, and He\u2019s for our marriage, and He\u2019s working through our marriage. I don\u2019t have to compare our marriages to one another.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> Yes, and that\u2019s so good. Why compare? It\u2019s okay to say, \u201cOf course, God was for that marriage,\u201d like He\u2019s for your marriage.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Lore:<\/strong> Yes; that was actually\/I will say that is one of the most freeing concepts that I\u2019ve had in our marriage. I think, when we were just newly together, I had questions about his past: I had questions about his sexual past, questions about his conflicts that they might have had, or specifics in their marriage. I found somewhat of a reticence in him to talking about some of those things. At first, I thought, \u201cWell, I\u2019m going to be your wife. Why won\u2019t you talk to me about these things?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut the more time went on, the more I thought, \u201cIf I\u2019m walking into covenant\/if I\u2019m in covenant with this man, that means that our marriage is precious in the eyes of God and is to be protected by God. It\u2019s wrong of me to assume that I\u2019m allowed to know everything that happened in their covenant that was protected by God.\u201d That freed me up to just say, \u201cYou know what? I\u2019m going to trust that, if my husband needs to tell me something, he\u2019s going to. But if I don\u2019t need to know something, or it\u2019s not my business, I don\u2019t need to know it.\u201d I can be free to just say, \u201cGod was in that.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> Let\u2019s drill down on that. It\u2019s not your business\u2014like if you had another couple come up to you right now, it wouldn\u2019t be your business to be probing into parts of their relationship that they\u2019re not opening to you\u2014is it that same sort of thing?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Lore:<\/strong> I think there\u2019s moments when we need to probe in our friends\u2019 lives and ask specific questions.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> Yes, good point.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Lore:<\/strong> But I think that when I\u2019m\u2014if my motivations in probing are to feel better about myself, or to compete with a previous marriage in any way, or to put down someone else, or to excuse my sin in the way that it might be wounding my husband and to sort of put that on her\u2014that\u2019s not a good motivation. I think, when I\u2019m probing with a couple, if my motivation is just to dig up dirt, that\u2019s not a good motivation. But if my motivation is to care for and shepherd, that\u2019s a good motivation; so I want to probe in those moments. I hope that\u2019s a helpful distinction. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> It is; it\u2019s a very good distinction. I appreciate that wisdom. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t[Studio]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Let me step in here. We\u2019ve been listening to the first part of a conversation between Ron Deal and Lore Ferguson Wilbert, talking about what it\u2019s like to be a second wife. I think the point about\u2014\u201cWhat\u2019s your motivation as you dig into these subjects?\u201d\u2014that\u2019s a great question to be wrestling with.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>I can remember, when I was in middle school, my stepmom, who was my dad\u2019s second wife, asking me questions about my mom. I could tell, even as a 13-\/14-year-old, she was comparing\u2014like, \u201cHey, I\u2019m funnier than your mom was; right?\u201d\u2014it was a little awkward; I mean, I can remember this decades later. I\u2019m now realizing she was comparing, and she was wondering about that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>That\u2019s interesting; because the first time I met your stepmom, she was cooking. She was asking me questions, like, \u201cOh, what kind of cook is Dave\u2019s mom?\u201d\u2014because she was extraordinary cook\u2014but I remember feeling like, \u201cOh, she\u2019s feeling some of that comparison.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Well, and in Part Two of this conversation between Ron and Lore, they talk about how a healthy sense of your identity is necessary to know who you are in Christ. That\u2019s so critical when you face these kinds of issues of competition. Let\u2019s listen to the conversation as it continues here.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t[<em>FamilyLife Blended<\/em> Podcast]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>Let me dial down. We\u2019ve used the word, \u201ccompetition,\u201d a couple of times. I think it\u2019s great\u2014you saying, \u201cHey, from God\u2019s point of view, He was for the first marriage; He\u2019s for this marriage,\u201d\u2014let\u2019s look at it from your point of view for a minute. Let\u2019s just get earthly about this: \u201cDoesn\u2019t every woman want to be first in her husband\u2019s heart? What do you do with that thought that you\u2019re second?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Lore:<\/strong> Yes, I feel that. What helps me is to know that I am my husband\u2019s first right now. He has chosen me; he is not thinking about her. We have open conversations about these things. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut there have been times, where\u2014we moved away from the city where we lived for a while; because there were just some bitter memories for him here, because of their previous marriage\u2014and then we had to move back a few years later. That was really, really difficult for him to just imagine being on the same streets, around the same grocery stores, and all those things. He had to really dial down and wrestle with the Lord over: \u201cAm I going to honor, and please, and love my current wife?\u2014or am I going to be continuing to think about my previous wife?\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHe chose to come back here; he chose to come back to the city, because he knew it would be better for me. This was where our community was. In that choice, I was able to see how he laid down his life for me\u2014he does that every day\u2014lays down his life for me.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tPart of being first to him\/part of being his covenantal wife right now, is deciding to actually, not overlook those wounds when they come up, but to step into those places. For instance, if we drive past a location that has a specific bitter memory attached to it for him, and he gets quiet\u2014instead of just letting that happen\u2014stepping in and saying, \u201cI am the wife that he has now. I am the partner with him and with God in helping to heal these wounds; so I\u2019m going to step into that and say, \u2018Hey, what\u2019s going through your mind right now as we pass that place? What are you thinking about? How can I love you through that?\u2019\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe more time goes on, and the more talking that we do about it, the more God heals those places; so he can drive past places that he couldn\u2019t drive past, even three years ago, without a bitter memory coming.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> One of the things I\u2019ve wondered about \u201csecond wife\u201d\u2014reflecting on your blog\u2014is that your husband has to maybe unlearn some patterns and some rhythms of the past. You talk a little bit about sleeping on a different side of the bed. Clearly, you\u2019re different people; and your husband has to adapt to that. Have there ever been some ripples in there, where you go, \u201cOkay, this is a leftover from the past.\u201d Again, is this just an adjustment, or what\u2019s your attitude around those things?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Lore:<\/strong> I think, again, the more time goes on, the fewer those ripples are. I think, in the beginning, it was around things\u2014I actually prefer to stay in; she preferred to go out\u2014it was around things like that. I\u2019m just much more of a homebody than she was, and it took changing. He ate\u2014he drank a lot of soda\u2014and ate a lot of sugar before we got married. [Laughter] I was like, \u201cI can\u2019t live like that; I don\u2019t have her body. I have a different body. I can\u2019t eat those things and keep the body that I have.\u201d It took a change of diet and just saying, \u201cI\u2019m not\u2026we are different people.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNow, she bears the image of God. She has intrinsic value and intrinsic identity given to her by God. I have a different identity and different value given to me by God. That doesn\u2019t make her less than me or me more than her; it just makes us different. We have to figure out how to navigate those differences in marriage. I am a night person, and she wasn\u2019t a night person; so bedtime and wakeup time has been an area where we\u2019ve just had to learn to adjust to one another over the past.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> There\u2019s something else you reference in your blog. You said, \u201cWalk with patience, endurance, and lose the expectations that lead mostly to resentments.\u201d Have there been any expectations you had to lose?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Lore:<\/strong> I think everyone comes to every marriage with expectations. What I\u2019ve learned is that my husband is a different man\u2014that God disciplined him through that divorce\u2014and he does not value the same things that he valued before. That has been such a good thing for me to just realize: \u201cIf I wanted the husband, who was making these decisions with a different heart before, that\u2019s the husband that was not a good husband, and not obedient and submissive to the Lord in the way that he needed to be. Instead, I have a husband, who makes different decisions with his money; and yet, honors the Lord and loves me and cherishes me. I\u2019m going to take that second\/I\u2019m going to take this husband.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> Which of those two qualities is worth more: \u201cHow he spends his money\u201d or \u201cHow he honors his God?\u201d That fills a different bank account; doesn\u2019t it? Right, each one of those goes in a different direction; you\u2019re right. You\u2019re better off with the man that you have.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t[Studio]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Well, we\u2019ve been listening to a great conversation between Ron Deal and Lore Ferguson Wilbert, talking about what it\u2019s like to be a second wife or a second husband. If you\u2019re in a second marriage, how you deal with expectations, and adjustments, and the fact that there are, undoubtedly, going to be things about your first marriage that you\u2019re going to go, \u201cI liked it better with that other person.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>Just you saying that causes insecurity in my life, like, \u201cOh, that would be so terrible!\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>It has to be the case. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>Sure!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>I mean, we\u2019re different people; you go, \u201cThat other person did this better than you do.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>But the insecurity that comes out of that\u2014that\u2019s where I think Lore\u2019s point about: \u201cWhere\u2019s your identity, and how do you then maturely adjust your expectations?\u201d\u2014you go, \u201cOkay, my first husband did this\u201d; but just as Ron said at the end, \u201cI am where God has me today, and I need to learn to be content in where I am.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>I think it\u2019s the greener grass syndrome; we all struggle\u2014whether it\u2019s your first marriage, and you\u2019re thinking, \u201cI was better off when I was single\u201d; now, you\u2019re in a second marriage, and you\u2019re thinking, \u201cI was better off\u2026\u201d\u2014I think, as they got to at the end, you have to look at what you have that is good and actually realize it\u2019s the best.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>I would add: \u201cAnd who you are\/that you\u2019re enough,\u201d because that\u2019s the identity piece.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThere\u2019s actually a lot more to this conversation. I would hope our listeners would, first of all, subscribe to Ron\u2019s podcast. Go online at FamilyLifeToday.com and start listening, especially if you\u2019re in a second marriage\/you\u2019re in a blended family. <em>FamilyLife Blended<\/em> is all about how you can thrive in the relationship you\u2019re in today. That\u2019s where God has you; that\u2019s where you can grow, and expand, and thrive. Go to FamilyLifeToday.com; there\u2019s information there about this particular podcast episode\/about the <em>FamilyLife Blended <\/em>podcast, where you can subscribe to that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThere\u2019s also information about an upcoming event, called <em>Blended &amp; Blessed<\/em>. This is an annual event; it\u2019s going to be a livestream event this year\u2014one day, Saturday, \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tApril 24<sup>th<\/sup>\u2014online. All around the world, folks are going to be joining us for a day, where we focus on the issues that are facing couples in second marriages or in blended families.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tRon Deal gives leadership to this. We\u2019re going to hear from David and Meg Robbins, Ray and Robyn McKelvey, a whole lot more. It\u2019s an online event; and by the way, it\u2019s also being streamed in Spanish this year. You can watch this with a group from church, with a small group, watch it just by yourselves. All of the information about how to sign up for the <em>Blended &amp; Blessed<\/em> one-day livestream is available on our website at FamilyLifeToday.com. Check it out; and plan to join us on Saturday, April 24<sup>th<\/sup>, for <em>Blended &amp; Blessed<\/em>.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tLet me just add that there are a myriad of resources to help blended couples\/blended families, with the issues you\u2019re facing, available from us, here, at <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. There are links on our websites to books and articles; again, Ron Deal\u2019s podcast is available. There\u2019s so much we have available. Go to FamilyLifeToday.com to check it all out. If you have any questions about the one-day livestream, give us a call at 1-800-FL-TODAY; that\u2019s our number: 1-800-358-6329; that\u2019s 1-800-\u201cF\u201d as in family, \u201cL\u201d as in life, and then the word, \u201cTODAY.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to say a quick word of thanks to those of you who have called us or gone online to make a donation this week. We\u2019ve been hearing from <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> listeners, saying, \u201cWe believe in what you\u2019re doing and want to help support the ministry of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\u201d I think one thing that may be motivating folks is we\u2019ve been offering a book called <em>The Negativity Remedy<\/em>; we talked about it earlier this week. That\u2019s our thank-you gift to you this week when you donate to support the ministry of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tOf course, your donations are vital for the work that we do here. We\u2019re listener-supported. Without your financial support, we could not continue the work of this ministry; so thanks, in advance, for either making an online donation or calling 1-800-FL-TODAY to donate. Again, when you do, ask for your copy of the book, <em>The Negativity Remedy<\/em>. It\u2019s our thank-you gift to you when you support the work of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe hope you can join us, again, tomorrow. We\u2019re going to hear more from Ron Deal and Lore Ferguson Wilbert about the reality of being a second wife in a marriage. I hope you can be with us for that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch. We got some extra help this week from Bruce Goff and, of course, our entire broadcast production team is involved. On behalf of our hosts, Dave and Ann Wilson, I\u2019m Bob Lepine. We will see you back next time for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas; a Cru<sup>\u00ae <\/sup>Ministry. Help for today. Hope for tomorrow.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright <sup>\u00a9<\/sup> 2021 FamilyLife. 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