{"id":306757,"date":"2021-03-05T07:00:06","date_gmt":"2021-03-05T12:00:06","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/%series%\/whats-the-point\/"},"modified":"2021-03-05T07:00:06","modified_gmt":"2021-03-05T12:00:06","slug":"whats-the-point","status":"publish","type":"podcast","link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/whats-the-point\/","title":{"rendered":"What&#8217;s the Point"},"content":{"rendered":"","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>What&#8217;s the big deal about having sex before marriage? The statistics may surprise you! Shelby Abbott talks about being intentional with your most important human relationships.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":91,"featured_media":294104,"menu_order":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","template":"","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","inline_featured_image":false,"_uag_custom_page_level_css":"","episode_type":"","audio_file":"https:\/\/mp3.familylife.com\/fl2021-03-05.mp3","cover_image":"","cover_image_id":"","duration":"00:29:43","filesize":"27.21M","filesize_raw":"28533421","date_recorded":"","explicit":"","block":""},"categories":[2848,2805],"tags":[6249],"podcast_series":[],"cwp_profile":[3552],"series":[2101],"class_list":["post-306757","podcast","type-podcast","status-publish","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-cultural-issues","category-gods-plan-for-marriage","tag-sex-before-marriage","cwp_profile-shelby-abbott","series-familylife-today"],"acf":[],"episode_featured_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/09\/FLT-Podcast-Cover-2-508x508-3.jpg?w=508","episode_player_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2023\/02\/image-scaled.jpg","download_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-download\/306757\/whats-the-point","player_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-player\/306757\/whats-the-point","audio_player":null,"episode_data":{"playerMode":"light","subscribeUrls":{"apple_podcasts":{"key":"apple_podcasts","url":"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303?mt=2&app=podcast","label":"Apple Podcasts","class":"apple_podcasts","icon":"apple-podcasts.png"},"google_podcasts":{"key":"google_podcasts","url":"","label":"Google Podcasts","class":"google_podcasts","icon":"google-podcasts.png"},"spotify":{"key":"spotify","url":"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm","label":"Spotify","class":"spotify","icon":"spotify.png"},"youtube":{"key":"youtube","url":"","label":"YouTube","class":"youtube","icon":"youtube.png"}},"rssFeedUrl":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/feed\/podcast\/familylife-today","embedCode":"<blockquote class=\"wp-embedded-content\" data-secret=\"kbI1MoapvO\"><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/whats-the-point\/\">What&#8217;s the Point<\/a><\/blockquote><iframe sandbox=\"allow-scripts\" security=\"restricted\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/whats-the-point\/embed\/#?secret=kbI1MoapvO\" width=\"500\" height=\"350\" title=\"&#8220;What&#8217;s the Point&#8221; &#8212; FamilyLife\u00ae - A Cru Ministry\" data-secret=\"kbI1MoapvO\" frameborder=\"0\" marginwidth=\"0\" marginheight=\"0\" scrolling=\"no\" class=\"wp-embedded-content\"><\/iframe><script>\n\/*! This file is auto-generated *\/\n!function(d,l){\"use strict\";l.querySelector&&d.addEventListener&&\"undefined\"!=typeof URL&&(d.wp=d.wp||{},d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage||(d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage=function(e){var t=e.data;if((t||t.secret||t.message||t.value)&&!\/[^a-zA-Z0-9]\/.test(t.secret)){for(var s,r,n,a=l.querySelectorAll('iframe[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),o=l.querySelectorAll('blockquote[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),c=new RegExp(\"^https?:$\",\"i\"),i=0;i<o.length;i++)o[i].style.display=\"none\";for(i=0;i<a.length;i++)s=a[i],e.source===s.contentWindow&&(s.removeAttribute(\"style\"),\"height\"===t.message?(1e3<(r=parseInt(t.value,10))?r=1e3:~~r<200&&(r=200),s.height=r):\"link\"===t.message&&(r=new URL(s.getAttribute(\"src\")),n=new URL(t.value),c.test(n.protocol))&&n.host===r.host&&l.activeElement===s&&(d.top.location.href=t.value))}},d.addEventListener(\"message\",d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage,!1),l.addEventListener(\"DOMContentLoaded\",function(){for(var e,t,s=l.querySelectorAll(\"iframe.wp-embedded-content\"),r=0;r<s.length;r++)(t=(e=s[r]).getAttribute(\"data-secret\"))||(t=Math.random().toString(36).substring(2,12),e.src+=\"#?secret=\"+t,e.setAttribute(\"data-secret\",t)),e.contentWindow.postMessage({message:\"ready\",secret:t},\"*\")},!1)))}(window,document);\n\/\/# sourceURL=https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-includes\/js\/wp-embed.min.js\n<\/script>\n"},"spectra_custom_meta":{"_wp_page_template":["default"],"transcript_url":["https:\/\/transcript.familylife.com\/fl2021-03-05.pdf"],"audio_file":["https:\/\/mp3.familylife.com\/fl2021-03-05.mp3"],"transcript_content":["<strong>Bob: <\/strong>This is <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> for Friday, March 5<sup>th<\/sup>. Our hosts are Dave and Ann Wilson; I'm Bob Lepine. You can find us online at FamilyLifeToday.com. Whether you believe the Bible is God\u2019s Word, or authoritative or not, there are plenty of good, practical reasons why you ought to think <em>twice<\/em> about what the culture is pedaling when it comes to dating, sex, and marriage. Stay with us. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>And welcome to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. Thanks for joining us. I had a friend of mine, who was a pastor, who texted me the other day and said, \u201cI\u2019ve got a dilemma. A couple just reached out and said, \u2018We\u2019re getting married; will you marry us?\u2019\u201d He said, \u201cI learned that they are living together; and I thought, \u2018Okay; do I say , \u2018Yes\u2019? Do I say, \u2018Maybe\u2019? Do I say, \u2018No; not until\u2026\u2019\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou\u2019ve [Dave] been a pastor for years. You\u2019ve had these\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I want to hear what you said here, Bob. You\u2019re throwing it right to <em>me<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> I want to know, because you\u2019ve faced this; I haven\u2019t faced it as a pastor\u2014you have; right? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Oh, I\u2019ve faced it for two decades. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes; more often than not today, couples, who are coming to get married, have lived together prior\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Right; it\u2019s a touchy, hard decision. This happened many times in my Detroit Lions ministry\u2014you know, players, who weren\u2019t followers of Christ\u2014and they wanted to get married, and they were living together. I\u2019m like, \u201cDo I hold them to a standard that is a Christian standard when they are not Christians?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u201cIs this decision I make going to prevent them from taking another step <em>toward<\/em> Christ?\u201d\u2014that\u2019s the <em>tension<\/em> you live in; right? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> I said to my friend\/I said, \u201cI don\u2019t think there\u2019s a one-size-fits-all answer for this. I think it\u2019s a relational issue that you\u2019ve got to be able to sit down\u2014and there is an opening here to be able to talk about the bigger issue,\u201d\u2014which I said is not that they are living together\u2014\u201cThe issue is: \u2018Do they know what God\u2019s Word says?\u2019 and \u2018Are they choosing to put themselves above it?\u2019 If that\u2019s the case, then they are headed into a lot bigger problems in their marriage.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Ann:<\/strong> It\u2019s even trickier when it\u2019s your own family\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u2014or your own kids, who have decided to live together. They know you are not going to be for that, but you still want to have a relationship with your kids. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Well, there\u2019s a new book that is addressing this subject. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I\u2019m so glad! [Laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> We need a new book: \u201cSomebody, please!\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> I am too. Shelby Abbott has written on this subject, and Shelby\u2019s been on <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> a number of times. Shelby, welcome back. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> Thank you. It\u2019s good to be with you guys. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Bob:<\/strong> This is a subject that you have had to address as you\u2019ve been in campus ministry with Cru<sup>\u00ae<\/sup> for more than 21 years. Shelby\u2019s a writer and a speaker as well. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI remember sitting with a social scientist a while back; and he said, \u201cIt used to be that this was the normal pattern for people: you date; you fall in love; you get engaged; you get married; you have sex; you have kids. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Now, you go on <em>The Bachelor<\/em> and do it all backwards?\u2014is that\u2014 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> \u201cThat was the old pattern. Today\u2019s pattern is: you date; you have sex; you fall in love; you move in together; you have kids; you get married.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Let\u2019s ask Shelby, the expert: \u201cWhat is the pattern today? Is that true?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> You know, there are certain patterns that exist in the culture now that are a lot more present than they were a long time ago; but I hesitate to even say that this is what people do, because there are certain people, who\u2014they still go the old-fashioned route\u2014and they don\u2019t sleep with one another before they get married. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Can we call that the biblical route, not just the old-fashioned route?\u2014yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> Yes; the old, old fashioned route; yes. [Laughter] But you know, it is increasingly rare; I\u2019d say that that\u2019s true. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe reason that I wrote this book, though, is not necessarily to try to convince Christian people that they shouldn\u2019t be sleeping with their boyfriend or girlfriend. This was more of a book that reaches out toward a skeptical\u2014or, maybe, non-believing audience\u2014or people who are already living together and help them to see that there are better solutions out there. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe majority of the research that I quote in the book is actually secular research; because the whole theory of: \u201cYou\u2019ve got to test-drive the car before you drive it,\u201d that\u2019s not true at all; and this is from secular ones. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThere is something I talk about in the book called \u201csliding, not deciding.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> Many couples just say, \u201cIt just kind of happened. We just didn\u2019t really talk about it, but my toothbrush was over there. Then I just decided to stay one night, and then I went and grabbed some clothes. Now, I have my own drawer; and now, I\u2026\u201d\u2014blah, blah, blah. There\u2019s like lots of things that they don\u2019t really <em>talk<\/em> about; it just kind of happened. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Well, one of things you said\u2014which I thought, \u201cOh man! If I were a woman, I would want to know this\u201d; because you say\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Dave:<\/strong> If you <em>were<\/em> a woman\u2014you are! [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> No; I\u2019m saying, \u201cIf I were a young\/if I were a young, single woman, I would want to know this.\u201d You talk about how women are more likely to view living together as a step toward marriage; you know, like, \u201cOh, this is just the natural thing; we\u2019ll live together, and then we\u2019ll get married.\u201d But you also said <em>men<\/em> are more likely to see it as a test of the relationship and, maybe, even postpone the commitment. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Those are two different things here. I think, \u201cOh, we need to protect ourselves, and know what the future is, to know what the intent is behind this living-together space.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> Yes; there is lack of communication that often happens in the sliding, and not deciding. They just kind of <em>assume<\/em> that the other person thinks the same thing about <em>why<\/em> they are moving in together, and they couldn\u2019t be more wrong about it. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI read this one thing about a girl, who was living with her boyfriend\u2014I think it was five years\u2014and then they ended up breaking up. She confessed\/she was like, \u201cI felt like I was on a multi-year tryout to be his wife, and he just would <em>never<\/em> actually do it.\u201d He was getting what he wanted; and ultimately, if he didn\u2019t want it anymore\u2014they weren\u2019t married\u2014so he could just ditch it. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> That riles me up! \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> It\u2019s so sad. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I\u2019m like, \u201cOh, you deserve so much <em>better<\/em> than that.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> Yes; of course; yes. Of course, she does. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> My daughter and her, then, boyfriend were living in New York when they were dating; and my daughter was working for a company there. She announced her engagement and shared with everybody. Somehow, in the conversation about the engagement and they were getting married, it came out that they were <em>not<\/em> living together. People were <em>incredulous<\/em> that there was such a thing\u2014two people getting married, who aren\u2019t living together\u2014it is so much the cultural norm that it was kind of like, \u201cLook, a black swan out on the lawn\u201d; right? [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> Yes; I remember when Rachel, my wife, and I got engaged; and then we got married. We were unapologetic to talk to people about the fact that both of us were virgins when we got married. My, then, brother-in-law\u2014my sister\u2019s husband at the time\u2014he just <em>could not<\/em> fathom\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> \u2014the fact that I was 29, and I had never had sex. He just <em>could not<\/em> understand it. I really was like a unicorn to him. [Laughter] It just didn\u2019t make any sense at all, <em>but<\/em> it was incredibly impactful in his life. It was\u2014it was definitely one of those noteworthy things that goes\u2014\u201cI never thought this was <em>possible<\/em>; yet, here I see an example of this. There has got to be something to this Jesus guy that I just don\u2019t get.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Now, I remember, Shelby, being at a <em>Weekend to Remember<\/em><sup>\u00ae<\/sup> marriage getaway. A young man came up to me after the engaged session. He said, \u201cI work at this place with these guys, and I\u2019m engaged to my girlfriend. I\u2019ve told them that we\u2019ve not slept together; and my friends are like, \u2018Are you out of your mind? You\u2019re going to buy the car without a test drive? I mean, what if you guys are not sexually compatible? What are you going to do then?\u2019\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHe\u2019s tossing it to me and saying, \u201cDo I need to worry about whether we are sexually compatible?\u201d I said, \u201cShe\u2019s a woman; right?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> Yes; exactly. [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> \u201cYes.\u201d I said, \u201cYou are, by God\u2019s design, sexually compatible. You were <em>made<\/em> to be sexually compatible. That doesn\u2019t mean there won\u2019t be some hiccups along the way, and you might have to get help along the way; but trust me, testing out the merchandise is not the way to figure out whether you\u2019re going to have an enduring, lifelong, thriving marriage.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> Exactly. The illustration I use in the book is a sexy topic of paper products to talk about sex. [Laughter] I went\/yes, I talked about how the culture tends to view sex like you\u2019re a Post-it note or a sticky note\u2014you just stick to this person here for a time; and then you peel away, and you stick to this person; you peel away, and you stick to this person\u2014to find out what works for you. But sex wasn\u2019t designed to be like that. It is more meant to be like an envelope. When you use an envelope, it\u2019s meant to be used once. You seal it, and then it stays sealed. If you ever try to open it, and then reuse it again, it\u2019s destroyed. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThat\u2019s where I\u2019m trying to get at it. The way that sex was <em>designed<\/em> is supposed to be in a marriage context with one person; because eventually, a sticky note loses its stickiness. You start to become numb to the idea that sex is a beautiful thing if you don\u2019t do it the way that God has <em>called<\/em> you to do it. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Dave and I were doing a <em>Weekend to Remember<\/em> conference, back when we had an engaged session. We talk about why God says to not have premarital sex before marriage and just God\u2019s design for marriage. This woman came up to me afterwards\u2014and she was older\u2014and she said, \u201cHey, my boyfriend and I have been living together for 15 years, and we have three kids; they are getting a little bit older. We are so excited, because we\u2019ve given Jesus our lives this weekend. As we sat in the engaged session, we realized, \u2018Oh! God doesn\u2019t want us to have sex before we are married\u2019; so we\u2019ve decided to move out.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> Wow. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u201cWe\u2019re so excited to have this conversation with our <em>kids<\/em> of why we are moving out, because they are going to think it\u2019s the <em>craziest<\/em> thing they\u2019ve ever heard; but we\u2019re not going to have sex, and we\u2019re going to get married in a month.\u201d She\u2019s like, \u201cWe can\u2019t <em>wait<\/em> to begin this new legacy.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> That\u2019s <em>amazing<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> But I mean, I was like, \u201cWhoa!\u201d She could have said, \u201cOh, we\u2019ve been together \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t15 years\u201d; you know? Jesus\u2014I think when we have this encounter with Him\u2014He does radical things in our lives that can seem <em>foolish<\/em> to people; but man, it is something that changes every aspect of our lives. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> I\u2019ll tell you a similar story. There is a podcast here if our listeners would like to listen; they can go to FamilyLifeToday.com. I had a conversation, years ago, with a couple who had come to one of our <em>Weekend to Remember<\/em> getaways. They were living together at the time. We challenged them not to continue having sex before they got married. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tTo hear their story later, they had grown up in the church; they had met one another on a mission\u2019s trip\u2014a long term\/a 9-month\u2019s mission\u2019s trip\u2014they\u2019d started having sex while they were on the mission\u2019s trip. When they got back home, they moved in together into his parents\u2019 house. They said, \u201c<em>Nobody<\/em> ever said anything to us about this being wrong until we went to the pastor at the church we were going to and we said, \u2018We\u2019d like to help with the three- and four-year-olds.\u2019 The pastor said, \u2018Um, well, we\u2019ve got this deal. You guys aren\u2019t married, and you are living together; you can\u2019t do that.\u2019\u201d They\u2019re like, \u201cWell, what\u2019s the deal?\u201d They did not understand that there was anything about this, biblically. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThey come to the <em>Weekend to Remember<\/em>. They hear us challenge people: \u201cDon\u2019t have sex before you get married. If you\u2019re having sex, stop having sex before you get married.\u201d The husband-to-be is convicted. He goes to his fianc\u00e9; and he says, \u201cI think we need to do this, and stop having sex, until we get married.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHere is what she heard, Shelby. She heard him saying, \u201cI am breaking up with you\u201d; because in <em>her<\/em> mind, if he was going to stop having sex with her, the relationship was not going to survive. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> She thought, \u201cThe only reason you want to be with me, or a primary reason why you want to be with me, is so that you can have sex with me. If now you\u2019re not going to do that, you\u2019ll fall away.\u201d She was saying, \u201cNo! We\u2019ve got to keep having sex,\u201d\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> \u2014because she wanted to keep the relationship there. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWell, he held firm; they parted. They got married, and then wound up teaching the pre-marrieds at their church, eventually, taking them through the <em>Art of Marriage<\/em><sup>\u00ae<\/sup> [video series] and showing them: \u201cThis is how it is supposed to be by God\u2019s design.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt is just fascinating to me that there are people in the culture, who have never heard that the Bible says there is a better way than to live together. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> That\u2019s a beautiful story; I love hearing that. It\u2019s a testament to what the culture thinks about what a romantic relationship is supposed to be in the first place. Most people go into it, and they just kind of intuitively think: \u201cThis is about <em>me<\/em>. What can you do for me?\u201d \u201cHow can you make me feel?\u201d \u201cHow can you improve my reputation?\u201d \u201cHow can you provide me with pleasure?\u201d \u201cHow can you bend to my will and serve me?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut when we are changed at the heart level, and Christ comes in and replaces our heart of stone with a heart of flesh, we can look at a romantic relationship\u2014from the very initial stages, of just being attracted to one another, all the way up through marriage\u2014as: \u201cIt\u2019s not about me; it\u2019s about how I can serve <em>you<\/em> and care for <em>you<\/em>.\u201d When you think about it, it changes the total dynamic of what a relationship is supposed to be like. When you\u2019re thinking specifically about the area of sex, it\u2019s like, \u201cWell, I want to do <em>you<\/em> a service here by <em>not<\/em> offending God and being the right type of godly man\u201d\u2014or\u2014\u201cgodly woman to make sure that I can let you know that I care for you by not touching you.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI\u2019ve told guys this\/I\u2019m like, \u201cIf you can\u2019t keep your hands off your girlfriend\u2014let\u2019s say you, one day, decide to get engaged; and you get married\u2014and you decide to go on a business trip, two or three years into your marriage. Is your wife going to trust you on that business trip?\u201d Or if you have the ability, in the future, to control yourself like you did in the past: \u201cMy wife is <em>never<\/em> going to think that I\u2019m doing something; because I was with her for <em>three<\/em> years,\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> \u2014\u201cand I kept my hands off her. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> \u201cI have much care and consideration for her: as someone, who is dating her; as someone, who is engaged to her; and as someone, who is <em>married<\/em> to her. She can trust me completely, because I kept my hands off her in the past.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> The way I\u2019ve said that to couples is: \u201cIf you are not married, and you are having sex together, here is what you know about each other: \u2018You are both willing to have sex with somebody you are not married to.\u2019 So why do we think, in the future, you\u2019re going to decide, all of a sudden, \u2018Now, I am unwilling to have sex with people\u2019\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> \u2014\u201c\u2018that I am not married to\u2019? I mean, is a switch going to flip or something?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I know for me\u2014you know I didn\u2019t become a follower of Christ until my junior year in college\u2014early in my Christian walk, I was presented now this biblical model of purity\/sexual purity. I thought it was the dumbest thing ever heard; like, \u201cWhat?!\u201d I also\u2014I don\u2019t remember ever seeing a Christian\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u2014obey that; so my question was: \u201cWhy?!\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI love\/Shelby, in the book, says: \u201cWell, here is some data that backs up why God would say, \u2018Prevent this until you are married.\u2019 Here is some data: your chance of divorce is going to be higher if you live together; your chance of having an affair, after you\u2019re married, is going to be higher if you are having sex before you get married.\u201d It\u2019s like, \u201cOh my goodness! So God has our best interest in mind!\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> So it isn\u2019t: \u201cI [God] just don\u2019t want you to enjoy this. I actually know better. I love you; I\u2019m <em>trying<\/em> to protect you and give you the best life possible. Just obey Me, and you will see the fruit come later.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I was going to read one of those stats; it said: \u201cThose who had cohabitated two or more times in their life before marriage were 15 percentage points <em>more likely<\/em> to have been either emotionally, sexually, or electronically unfaithful to their spouse than those who did not cohabitate.\u201d I mean, to put the data with that is compelling; it makes you stop and really think through your choices. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> Yes; I mean, we know, when the hormones kick in, people\u2014especially people who don\u2019t have Jesus\u2014they are just going to do what they are going to do. But one of the things that I wanted to aim with this book, specifically, is to kind of metaphorically put a rock in their shoe. If you ever had a rock in your shoe, you just can\u2019t keep walking with it in there; it just <em>constantly<\/em> bothers you. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tMy hope is that with this\u2014providing, of course, biblical evidence for this but, also, legitimate secular research\u2014that they will have a rock in their shoe; and they will <em>not<\/em> be able to stop thinking about it to the point that they go, \u201cI need to make some better decisions here.\u201d That\u2019s\u2014that was really my goal\u2014to, really, help them to understand that Christ is the solution. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> How do I give a copy of this book to somebody without them interpreting that as: \u201cOh, you are just judging me; and you\u2019re self-righteous.\u201d I mean, I\u2019m thinking of people that I go, \u201cThis would be helpful.\u201d How do I give them a copy without them thinking I\u2019m a jerk? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> Well\u2014[Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Stumped you there; didn\u2019t we? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> Yes; I think that relationship is important. One of the things that we wanted to do, when I wrote this, is that we wanted to pass them out like Tic Tac<sup>\u00ae <\/sup>s; we wanted to give them to as many people as possible. It\u2019s a short read\u2014it\u2019s not very, very long\u2014but it really is aimed to be a clear and concise dagger of information that cuts right to the heart of it. There is humor in there as well. I tried to write it so that it\u2019s incredibly readable for younger people; but handing it to them, the title of the book really gets at the heart of <em>why<\/em> there is a good argument\/a good apologetic <em>for<\/em> marriage and <em>against<\/em> living together. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think, since it\u2019s so permeated in our culture, as we\u2019ve been talking about\u2014that it\u2019s just a natural thing that people think\u2014challenging that in a way that makes people go, \u201cHmm, that\u2019s interesting.\u201d I don\u2019t know how people are going to hand it out to other people; but hopefully, they would do it in a spirit of love and caring for people and saying, \u201cHey, have you ever thought about considering a different option?\u201d I think that that question, in and of itself, is compelling enough to open a little book and read through it. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I sat down with a couple, decades ago; and they were living together. I was assigned to do their wedding in probably three to four months. They share with me\u2014and first time I met them, Scott and Jessica\u2014they said, \u201cHey, we\u2019re so excited; we just gave our lives to Christ.\u201d I go, \u201cWhat?\u201d \u201cYes; in a premarital counseling thing you have set up here at your church. We never understood the gospel. We\u2019re so excited; we gave our lives to Christ. Man, we\u2019re going back to our home\u2026\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI realized they were living together. I remember sitting there, thinking, \u201cHmm? Do I tell them?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Because the other couples that I had actually challenged, most of them, looked at me and said, \u201cOkay; I\u2019m going to go somewhere else and get married. I\u2019m not going to get married here\u201d; you know? I <em>hesitated<\/em> for a second; I said, \u201cWell, let me show God\u2019s plan.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI showed them something they had never heard\u2014and I\u2019d never heard it for a long time\u2014it\u2019s what you said earlier, Shelby, about you think you are having sex with somebody. It\u2019s like a Post-it note: \u201cIt\u2019s no big deal; I just move on.\u201d No, actually, what you\u2019re doing is you\u2019re giving a part of your soul away. God says, \u201cI want to protect your soul.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHere is what I said\/I said this\u2014anyway, I\u2019m not going through exactly what I said\u2014but I laid out a biblical plan for sexual purity. They both looked at me; and I thought, \u201cOh, here it comes. They\u2019re going to go, ;You\u2019re nuts, dude! This is crazy.\u2019\u201d I remember they looked at each other; they looked at me, and they said, \u201cWe\u2019re going to do this. Nobody has ever told us this. That makes so much sense.\u201d And they go, \u201cWe can\u2019t afford it, financially. I don\u2019t know how we\u2019re going to do this, but we\u2019re going to honor God.\u201d I go, \u201cReally?!\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> Beautiful. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> They go, \u201cYes!\u201d They walked out all excited; and I thought, \u201cI wonder if they\u2019ll follow through.\u201d They followed through; they got married. I mean, I\u2019ll never forget this\u2014two years later, I get this call\u2014they said, \u201cHey, we\u2019re pregnant; and we\u2019re naming our baby boy Dave because you were the <em>first<\/em> one to speak the truth to us, and we\u2019ve <em>never<\/em> been able to thank you.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> That\u2019s amazing. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> This little guy now is a teenager. You know, obviously, sometimes, they don\u2019t respond; and they get mad at you. Other times, it\u2019s going to change a legacy. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> That\u2019s beautiful; I love that story. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Shelby, thank you for this conversation. Thanks for the book called <em>What\u2019s the Point?<\/em> \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe hope listeners will join us, and buy a bunch of these, and hand them out\u2014like Tic Tacs\u2014right? [Laughter] That\u2019s what we want them to do. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> If people have Tic Tacs this day and age. [Laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> You can go to our website, FamilyLifeToday.com, to get more information about Shelby\u2019s book, <em>What\u2019s the Point?: Asking the Right Questions about Living Together and Marriage<\/em>. Go to FamilyLifeToday.com to order copies, or call 1-800-FL-TODAY to find out how to order. Again, the website is FamilyLifeToday.com; the phone number to call is 1-800-358-6329; that\u2019s 1-800-\u201cF\u201d as in family, \u201cL\u201d as in life, and then the word, \u201cTODAY.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tDavid Robbins, who is the president of FamilyLife<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>, is here with us in the studio. David, our listeners have had a chance today to hear from a teammate\/from Shelby Abbott. He is, increasingly, a key part of what God is doing through the ministry of FamilyLife. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>David:<\/strong> We\u2019ve had him as a guest on <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> before, but this is the first time he has been a guest on <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> as a part of the FamilyLife team. He is a fairly new addition to the FamilyLife team as the lead writer and contributor for next generation resources. As you likely are aware, GenZers are entering adulthood with different presuppositions about marriage, and whether to marry, and why marriage even exists. We are so <em>grateful<\/em> to have Shelby, as a thought leader, to engage this space; because at FamilyLife, we are about helping effectively develop godly families, generation after generation. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are committed to the <em>timeless<\/em> truth of Scripture while speaking in a compelling and needed way to the cultural moment we are in. We believe in the institution of marriage that God designed for His glory and for our good. I\u2019m really excited to bring you this resource, <em>What\u2019s the Point?<\/em>, and introduce you to Shelby as another member of the team God is raising up, here, at FamilyLife. We are encouraged and committed to help the next generation of marriages\/of families and are so thankful for the ways <em>you<\/em> play a part in that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Well, we sure are. A quick word of thanks to those of you who pray for us and those of you who financially support this mission. You make all that we do at FamilyLife possible, and we are indeed grateful for you. Thank you, David. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe hope you have a great weekend. Hope you and your family are able to worship together in your local church this weekend, and I hope you can join us on Monday when we\u2019re going to hear from Dave Wilson about what real, biblical manhood looks like\u2014not toxic masculinity\u2014biblical masculinity. We\u2019re also going to share with you about our plans for February of 2022 to be back sailing on the <em>Love Like You Mean It<\/em><sup>\u00ae<\/sup> marriage cruise and how you can reserve a stateroom for the cruise. All of that comes up Monday. I hope you can join us. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch. We got some help from our friend, Bruce Goff, and our entire broadcast production team. On behalf of our hosts, Dave and Ann Wilson, I\u2019m Bob Lepine. Have a great weekend. We will see you Monday for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas; a Cru<sup>\u00ae <\/sup>Ministry. Help for today. Hope for tomorrow.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright <sup>\u00a9<\/sup> 2021 FamilyLife. All rights reserved.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/\">www.FamilyLife.com<\/a>\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\n\t\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\t1\n\t\t\t\t<\/p>"],"_seopress_titles_title":[""],"_seopress_titles_desc":[""],"_seopress_robots_index":[""],"duration":["00:29:43"],"show_notes":[""],"_thumbnail_id":["294104"],"filesize":["27.21M"],"filesize_raw":["28533421"],"_uag_css_file_name":["uag-css-306757.css"],"_uag_js_file_name":["uag-js-306757.js"],"_uag_page_assets":["a:9:{s:3:\"css\";s:82560:\".wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape-top svg{width: calc( 100% + 1.3px );}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape.uagb-container__shape-top .uagb-container__shape-fill{fill: rgba(51,51,51,1);}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape-bottom svg{width: calc( 100% + 1.3px );}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape.uagb-container__shape-bottom 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the big deal about having sex before marriage? The statistics may surprise you! Shelby Abbott talks about being intentional with your most important human relationships.","meta_box":{"show_notes":"","transcript_url":"https:\/\/transcript.familylife.com\/fl2021-03-05.pdf","transcript_content":"<strong>Bob: <\/strong>This is <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> for Friday, March 5<sup>th<\/sup>. Our hosts are Dave and Ann Wilson; I'm Bob Lepine. You can find us online at FamilyLifeToday.com. Whether you believe the Bible is God\u2019s Word, or authoritative or not, there are plenty of good, practical reasons why you ought to think <em>twice<\/em> about what the culture is pedaling when it comes to dating, sex, and marriage. Stay with us. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>And welcome to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. Thanks for joining us. I had a friend of mine, who was a pastor, who texted me the other day and said, \u201cI\u2019ve got a dilemma. A couple just reached out and said, \u2018We\u2019re getting married; will you marry us?\u2019\u201d He said, \u201cI learned that they are living together; and I thought, \u2018Okay; do I say , \u2018Yes\u2019? Do I say, \u2018Maybe\u2019? Do I say, \u2018No; not until\u2026\u2019\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou\u2019ve [Dave] been a pastor for years. You\u2019ve had these\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I want to hear what you said here, Bob. You\u2019re throwing it right to <em>me<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> I want to know, because you\u2019ve faced this; I haven\u2019t faced it as a pastor\u2014you have; right? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Oh, I\u2019ve faced it for two decades. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes; more often than not today, couples, who are coming to get married, have lived together prior\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Right; it\u2019s a touchy, hard decision. This happened many times in my Detroit Lions ministry\u2014you know, players, who weren\u2019t followers of Christ\u2014and they wanted to get married, and they were living together. I\u2019m like, \u201cDo I hold them to a standard that is a Christian standard when they are not Christians?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u201cIs this decision I make going to prevent them from taking another step <em>toward<\/em> Christ?\u201d\u2014that\u2019s the <em>tension<\/em> you live in; right? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> I said to my friend\/I said, \u201cI don\u2019t think there\u2019s a one-size-fits-all answer for this. I think it\u2019s a relational issue that you\u2019ve got to be able to sit down\u2014and there is an opening here to be able to talk about the bigger issue,\u201d\u2014which I said is not that they are living together\u2014\u201cThe issue is: \u2018Do they know what God\u2019s Word says?\u2019 and \u2018Are they choosing to put themselves above it?\u2019 If that\u2019s the case, then they are headed into a lot bigger problems in their marriage.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Ann:<\/strong> It\u2019s even trickier when it\u2019s your own family\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u2014or your own kids, who have decided to live together. They know you are not going to be for that, but you still want to have a relationship with your kids. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Well, there\u2019s a new book that is addressing this subject. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I\u2019m so glad! [Laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> We need a new book: \u201cSomebody, please!\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> I am too. Shelby Abbott has written on this subject, and Shelby\u2019s been on <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> a number of times. Shelby, welcome back. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> Thank you. It\u2019s good to be with you guys. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Bob:<\/strong> This is a subject that you have had to address as you\u2019ve been in campus ministry with Cru<sup>\u00ae<\/sup> for more than 21 years. Shelby\u2019s a writer and a speaker as well. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI remember sitting with a social scientist a while back; and he said, \u201cIt used to be that this was the normal pattern for people: you date; you fall in love; you get engaged; you get married; you have sex; you have kids. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Now, you go on <em>The Bachelor<\/em> and do it all backwards?\u2014is that\u2014 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> \u201cThat was the old pattern. Today\u2019s pattern is: you date; you have sex; you fall in love; you move in together; you have kids; you get married.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Let\u2019s ask Shelby, the expert: \u201cWhat is the pattern today? Is that true?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> You know, there are certain patterns that exist in the culture now that are a lot more present than they were a long time ago; but I hesitate to even say that this is what people do, because there are certain people, who\u2014they still go the old-fashioned route\u2014and they don\u2019t sleep with one another before they get married. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Can we call that the biblical route, not just the old-fashioned route?\u2014yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> Yes; the old, old fashioned route; yes. [Laughter] But you know, it is increasingly rare; I\u2019d say that that\u2019s true. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe reason that I wrote this book, though, is not necessarily to try to convince Christian people that they shouldn\u2019t be sleeping with their boyfriend or girlfriend. This was more of a book that reaches out toward a skeptical\u2014or, maybe, non-believing audience\u2014or people who are already living together and help them to see that there are better solutions out there. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe majority of the research that I quote in the book is actually secular research; because the whole theory of: \u201cYou\u2019ve got to test-drive the car before you drive it,\u201d that\u2019s not true at all; and this is from secular ones. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThere is something I talk about in the book called \u201csliding, not deciding.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> Many couples just say, \u201cIt just kind of happened. We just didn\u2019t really talk about it, but my toothbrush was over there. Then I just decided to stay one night, and then I went and grabbed some clothes. Now, I have my own drawer; and now, I\u2026\u201d\u2014blah, blah, blah. There\u2019s like lots of things that they don\u2019t really <em>talk<\/em> about; it just kind of happened. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Well, one of things you said\u2014which I thought, \u201cOh man! If I were a woman, I would want to know this\u201d; because you say\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Dave:<\/strong> If you <em>were<\/em> a woman\u2014you are! [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> No; I\u2019m saying, \u201cIf I were a young\/if I were a young, single woman, I would want to know this.\u201d You talk about how women are more likely to view living together as a step toward marriage; you know, like, \u201cOh, this is just the natural thing; we\u2019ll live together, and then we\u2019ll get married.\u201d But you also said <em>men<\/em> are more likely to see it as a test of the relationship and, maybe, even postpone the commitment. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Those are two different things here. I think, \u201cOh, we need to protect ourselves, and know what the future is, to know what the intent is behind this living-together space.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> Yes; there is lack of communication that often happens in the sliding, and not deciding. They just kind of <em>assume<\/em> that the other person thinks the same thing about <em>why<\/em> they are moving in together, and they couldn\u2019t be more wrong about it. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI read this one thing about a girl, who was living with her boyfriend\u2014I think it was five years\u2014and then they ended up breaking up. She confessed\/she was like, \u201cI felt like I was on a multi-year tryout to be his wife, and he just would <em>never<\/em> actually do it.\u201d He was getting what he wanted; and ultimately, if he didn\u2019t want it anymore\u2014they weren\u2019t married\u2014so he could just ditch it. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> That riles me up! \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> It\u2019s so sad. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I\u2019m like, \u201cOh, you deserve so much <em>better<\/em> than that.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> Yes; of course; yes. Of course, she does. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> My daughter and her, then, boyfriend were living in New York when they were dating; and my daughter was working for a company there. She announced her engagement and shared with everybody. Somehow, in the conversation about the engagement and they were getting married, it came out that they were <em>not<\/em> living together. People were <em>incredulous<\/em> that there was such a thing\u2014two people getting married, who aren\u2019t living together\u2014it is so much the cultural norm that it was kind of like, \u201cLook, a black swan out on the lawn\u201d; right? [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> Yes; I remember when Rachel, my wife, and I got engaged; and then we got married. We were unapologetic to talk to people about the fact that both of us were virgins when we got married. My, then, brother-in-law\u2014my sister\u2019s husband at the time\u2014he just <em>could not<\/em> fathom\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> \u2014the fact that I was 29, and I had never had sex. He just <em>could not<\/em> understand it. I really was like a unicorn to him. [Laughter] It just didn\u2019t make any sense at all, <em>but<\/em> it was incredibly impactful in his life. It was\u2014it was definitely one of those noteworthy things that goes\u2014\u201cI never thought this was <em>possible<\/em>; yet, here I see an example of this. There has got to be something to this Jesus guy that I just don\u2019t get.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Now, I remember, Shelby, being at a <em>Weekend to Remember<\/em><sup>\u00ae<\/sup> marriage getaway. A young man came up to me after the engaged session. He said, \u201cI work at this place with these guys, and I\u2019m engaged to my girlfriend. I\u2019ve told them that we\u2019ve not slept together; and my friends are like, \u2018Are you out of your mind? You\u2019re going to buy the car without a test drive? I mean, what if you guys are not sexually compatible? What are you going to do then?\u2019\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHe\u2019s tossing it to me and saying, \u201cDo I need to worry about whether we are sexually compatible?\u201d I said, \u201cShe\u2019s a woman; right?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> Yes; exactly. [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> \u201cYes.\u201d I said, \u201cYou are, by God\u2019s design, sexually compatible. You were <em>made<\/em> to be sexually compatible. That doesn\u2019t mean there won\u2019t be some hiccups along the way, and you might have to get help along the way; but trust me, testing out the merchandise is not the way to figure out whether you\u2019re going to have an enduring, lifelong, thriving marriage.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> Exactly. The illustration I use in the book is a sexy topic of paper products to talk about sex. [Laughter] I went\/yes, I talked about how the culture tends to view sex like you\u2019re a Post-it note or a sticky note\u2014you just stick to this person here for a time; and then you peel away, and you stick to this person; you peel away, and you stick to this person\u2014to find out what works for you. But sex wasn\u2019t designed to be like that. It is more meant to be like an envelope. When you use an envelope, it\u2019s meant to be used once. You seal it, and then it stays sealed. If you ever try to open it, and then reuse it again, it\u2019s destroyed. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThat\u2019s where I\u2019m trying to get at it. The way that sex was <em>designed<\/em> is supposed to be in a marriage context with one person; because eventually, a sticky note loses its stickiness. You start to become numb to the idea that sex is a beautiful thing if you don\u2019t do it the way that God has <em>called<\/em> you to do it. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Dave and I were doing a <em>Weekend to Remember<\/em> conference, back when we had an engaged session. We talk about why God says to not have premarital sex before marriage and just God\u2019s design for marriage. This woman came up to me afterwards\u2014and she was older\u2014and she said, \u201cHey, my boyfriend and I have been living together for 15 years, and we have three kids; they are getting a little bit older. We are so excited, because we\u2019ve given Jesus our lives this weekend. As we sat in the engaged session, we realized, \u2018Oh! God doesn\u2019t want us to have sex before we are married\u2019; so we\u2019ve decided to move out.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> Wow. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u201cWe\u2019re so excited to have this conversation with our <em>kids<\/em> of why we are moving out, because they are going to think it\u2019s the <em>craziest<\/em> thing they\u2019ve ever heard; but we\u2019re not going to have sex, and we\u2019re going to get married in a month.\u201d She\u2019s like, \u201cWe can\u2019t <em>wait<\/em> to begin this new legacy.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> That\u2019s <em>amazing<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> But I mean, I was like, \u201cWhoa!\u201d She could have said, \u201cOh, we\u2019ve been together \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t15 years\u201d; you know? Jesus\u2014I think when we have this encounter with Him\u2014He does radical things in our lives that can seem <em>foolish<\/em> to people; but man, it is something that changes every aspect of our lives. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> I\u2019ll tell you a similar story. There is a podcast here if our listeners would like to listen; they can go to FamilyLifeToday.com. I had a conversation, years ago, with a couple who had come to one of our <em>Weekend to Remember<\/em> getaways. They were living together at the time. We challenged them not to continue having sex before they got married. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tTo hear their story later, they had grown up in the church; they had met one another on a mission\u2019s trip\u2014a long term\/a 9-month\u2019s mission\u2019s trip\u2014they\u2019d started having sex while they were on the mission\u2019s trip. When they got back home, they moved in together into his parents\u2019 house. They said, \u201c<em>Nobody<\/em> ever said anything to us about this being wrong until we went to the pastor at the church we were going to and we said, \u2018We\u2019d like to help with the three- and four-year-olds.\u2019 The pastor said, \u2018Um, well, we\u2019ve got this deal. You guys aren\u2019t married, and you are living together; you can\u2019t do that.\u2019\u201d They\u2019re like, \u201cWell, what\u2019s the deal?\u201d They did not understand that there was anything about this, biblically. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThey come to the <em>Weekend to Remember<\/em>. They hear us challenge people: \u201cDon\u2019t have sex before you get married. If you\u2019re having sex, stop having sex before you get married.\u201d The husband-to-be is convicted. He goes to his fianc\u00e9; and he says, \u201cI think we need to do this, and stop having sex, until we get married.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHere is what she heard, Shelby. She heard him saying, \u201cI am breaking up with you\u201d; because in <em>her<\/em> mind, if he was going to stop having sex with her, the relationship was not going to survive. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> She thought, \u201cThe only reason you want to be with me, or a primary reason why you want to be with me, is so that you can have sex with me. If now you\u2019re not going to do that, you\u2019ll fall away.\u201d She was saying, \u201cNo! We\u2019ve got to keep having sex,\u201d\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> \u2014because she wanted to keep the relationship there. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWell, he held firm; they parted. They got married, and then wound up teaching the pre-marrieds at their church, eventually, taking them through the <em>Art of Marriage<\/em><sup>\u00ae<\/sup> [video series] and showing them: \u201cThis is how it is supposed to be by God\u2019s design.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt is just fascinating to me that there are people in the culture, who have never heard that the Bible says there is a better way than to live together. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> That\u2019s a beautiful story; I love hearing that. It\u2019s a testament to what the culture thinks about what a romantic relationship is supposed to be in the first place. Most people go into it, and they just kind of intuitively think: \u201cThis is about <em>me<\/em>. What can you do for me?\u201d \u201cHow can you make me feel?\u201d \u201cHow can you improve my reputation?\u201d \u201cHow can you provide me with pleasure?\u201d \u201cHow can you bend to my will and serve me?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut when we are changed at the heart level, and Christ comes in and replaces our heart of stone with a heart of flesh, we can look at a romantic relationship\u2014from the very initial stages, of just being attracted to one another, all the way up through marriage\u2014as: \u201cIt\u2019s not about me; it\u2019s about how I can serve <em>you<\/em> and care for <em>you<\/em>.\u201d When you think about it, it changes the total dynamic of what a relationship is supposed to be like. When you\u2019re thinking specifically about the area of sex, it\u2019s like, \u201cWell, I want to do <em>you<\/em> a service here by <em>not<\/em> offending God and being the right type of godly man\u201d\u2014or\u2014\u201cgodly woman to make sure that I can let you know that I care for you by not touching you.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI\u2019ve told guys this\/I\u2019m like, \u201cIf you can\u2019t keep your hands off your girlfriend\u2014let\u2019s say you, one day, decide to get engaged; and you get married\u2014and you decide to go on a business trip, two or three years into your marriage. Is your wife going to trust you on that business trip?\u201d Or if you have the ability, in the future, to control yourself like you did in the past: \u201cMy wife is <em>never<\/em> going to think that I\u2019m doing something; because I was with her for <em>three<\/em> years,\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> \u2014\u201cand I kept my hands off her. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> \u201cI have much care and consideration for her: as someone, who is dating her; as someone, who is engaged to her; and as someone, who is <em>married<\/em> to her. She can trust me completely, because I kept my hands off her in the past.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> The way I\u2019ve said that to couples is: \u201cIf you are not married, and you are having sex together, here is what you know about each other: \u2018You are both willing to have sex with somebody you are not married to.\u2019 So why do we think, in the future, you\u2019re going to decide, all of a sudden, \u2018Now, I am unwilling to have sex with people\u2019\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> \u2014\u201c\u2018that I am not married to\u2019? I mean, is a switch going to flip or something?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I know for me\u2014you know I didn\u2019t become a follower of Christ until my junior year in college\u2014early in my Christian walk, I was presented now this biblical model of purity\/sexual purity. I thought it was the dumbest thing ever heard; like, \u201cWhat?!\u201d I also\u2014I don\u2019t remember ever seeing a Christian\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u2014obey that; so my question was: \u201cWhy?!\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI love\/Shelby, in the book, says: \u201cWell, here is some data that backs up why God would say, \u2018Prevent this until you are married.\u2019 Here is some data: your chance of divorce is going to be higher if you live together; your chance of having an affair, after you\u2019re married, is going to be higher if you are having sex before you get married.\u201d It\u2019s like, \u201cOh my goodness! So God has our best interest in mind!\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> So it isn\u2019t: \u201cI [God] just don\u2019t want you to enjoy this. I actually know better. I love you; I\u2019m <em>trying<\/em> to protect you and give you the best life possible. Just obey Me, and you will see the fruit come later.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I was going to read one of those stats; it said: \u201cThose who had cohabitated two or more times in their life before marriage were 15 percentage points <em>more likely<\/em> to have been either emotionally, sexually, or electronically unfaithful to their spouse than those who did not cohabitate.\u201d I mean, to put the data with that is compelling; it makes you stop and really think through your choices. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> Yes; I mean, we know, when the hormones kick in, people\u2014especially people who don\u2019t have Jesus\u2014they are just going to do what they are going to do. But one of the things that I wanted to aim with this book, specifically, is to kind of metaphorically put a rock in their shoe. If you ever had a rock in your shoe, you just can\u2019t keep walking with it in there; it just <em>constantly<\/em> bothers you. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tMy hope is that with this\u2014providing, of course, biblical evidence for this but, also, legitimate secular research\u2014that they will have a rock in their shoe; and they will <em>not<\/em> be able to stop thinking about it to the point that they go, \u201cI need to make some better decisions here.\u201d That\u2019s\u2014that was really my goal\u2014to, really, help them to understand that Christ is the solution. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> How do I give a copy of this book to somebody without them interpreting that as: \u201cOh, you are just judging me; and you\u2019re self-righteous.\u201d I mean, I\u2019m thinking of people that I go, \u201cThis would be helpful.\u201d How do I give them a copy without them thinking I\u2019m a jerk? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> Well\u2014[Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Stumped you there; didn\u2019t we? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> Yes; I think that relationship is important. One of the things that we wanted to do, when I wrote this, is that we wanted to pass them out like Tic Tac<sup>\u00ae <\/sup>s; we wanted to give them to as many people as possible. It\u2019s a short read\u2014it\u2019s not very, very long\u2014but it really is aimed to be a clear and concise dagger of information that cuts right to the heart of it. There is humor in there as well. I tried to write it so that it\u2019s incredibly readable for younger people; but handing it to them, the title of the book really gets at the heart of <em>why<\/em> there is a good argument\/a good apologetic <em>for<\/em> marriage and <em>against<\/em> living together. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think, since it\u2019s so permeated in our culture, as we\u2019ve been talking about\u2014that it\u2019s just a natural thing that people think\u2014challenging that in a way that makes people go, \u201cHmm, that\u2019s interesting.\u201d I don\u2019t know how people are going to hand it out to other people; but hopefully, they would do it in a spirit of love and caring for people and saying, \u201cHey, have you ever thought about considering a different option?\u201d I think that that question, in and of itself, is compelling enough to open a little book and read through it. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I sat down with a couple, decades ago; and they were living together. I was assigned to do their wedding in probably three to four months. They share with me\u2014and first time I met them, Scott and Jessica\u2014they said, \u201cHey, we\u2019re so excited; we just gave our lives to Christ.\u201d I go, \u201cWhat?\u201d \u201cYes; in a premarital counseling thing you have set up here at your church. We never understood the gospel. We\u2019re so excited; we gave our lives to Christ. Man, we\u2019re going back to our home\u2026\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI realized they were living together. I remember sitting there, thinking, \u201cHmm? Do I tell them?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Because the other couples that I had actually challenged, most of them, looked at me and said, \u201cOkay; I\u2019m going to go somewhere else and get married. I\u2019m not going to get married here\u201d; you know? I <em>hesitated<\/em> for a second; I said, \u201cWell, let me show God\u2019s plan.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI showed them something they had never heard\u2014and I\u2019d never heard it for a long time\u2014it\u2019s what you said earlier, Shelby, about you think you are having sex with somebody. It\u2019s like a Post-it note: \u201cIt\u2019s no big deal; I just move on.\u201d No, actually, what you\u2019re doing is you\u2019re giving a part of your soul away. God says, \u201cI want to protect your soul.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHere is what I said\/I said this\u2014anyway, I\u2019m not going through exactly what I said\u2014but I laid out a biblical plan for sexual purity. They both looked at me; and I thought, \u201cOh, here it comes. They\u2019re going to go, ;You\u2019re nuts, dude! This is crazy.\u2019\u201d I remember they looked at each other; they looked at me, and they said, \u201cWe\u2019re going to do this. Nobody has ever told us this. That makes so much sense.\u201d And they go, \u201cWe can\u2019t afford it, financially. I don\u2019t know how we\u2019re going to do this, but we\u2019re going to honor God.\u201d I go, \u201cReally?!\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> Beautiful. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> They go, \u201cYes!\u201d They walked out all excited; and I thought, \u201cI wonder if they\u2019ll follow through.\u201d They followed through; they got married. I mean, I\u2019ll never forget this\u2014two years later, I get this call\u2014they said, \u201cHey, we\u2019re pregnant; and we\u2019re naming our baby boy Dave because you were the <em>first<\/em> one to speak the truth to us, and we\u2019ve <em>never<\/em> been able to thank you.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> That\u2019s amazing. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> This little guy now is a teenager. You know, obviously, sometimes, they don\u2019t respond; and they get mad at you. Other times, it\u2019s going to change a legacy. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> That\u2019s beautiful; I love that story. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Shelby, thank you for this conversation. Thanks for the book called <em>What\u2019s the Point?<\/em> \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe hope listeners will join us, and buy a bunch of these, and hand them out\u2014like Tic Tacs\u2014right? [Laughter] That\u2019s what we want them to do. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Shelby:<\/strong> If people have Tic Tacs this day and age. [Laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> You can go to our website, FamilyLifeToday.com, to get more information about Shelby\u2019s book, <em>What\u2019s the Point?: Asking the Right Questions about Living Together and Marriage<\/em>. Go to FamilyLifeToday.com to order copies, or call 1-800-FL-TODAY to find out how to order. Again, the website is FamilyLifeToday.com; the phone number to call is 1-800-358-6329; that\u2019s 1-800-\u201cF\u201d as in family, \u201cL\u201d as in life, and then the word, \u201cTODAY.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tDavid Robbins, who is the president of FamilyLife<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>, is here with us in the studio. David, our listeners have had a chance today to hear from a teammate\/from Shelby Abbott. He is, increasingly, a key part of what God is doing through the ministry of FamilyLife. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>David:<\/strong> We\u2019ve had him as a guest on <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> before, but this is the first time he has been a guest on <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> as a part of the FamilyLife team. He is a fairly new addition to the FamilyLife team as the lead writer and contributor for next generation resources. As you likely are aware, GenZers are entering adulthood with different presuppositions about marriage, and whether to marry, and why marriage even exists. We are so <em>grateful<\/em> to have Shelby, as a thought leader, to engage this space; because at FamilyLife, we are about helping effectively develop godly families, generation after generation. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are committed to the <em>timeless<\/em> truth of Scripture while speaking in a compelling and needed way to the cultural moment we are in. We believe in the institution of marriage that God designed for His glory and for our good. I\u2019m really excited to bring you this resource, <em>What\u2019s the Point?<\/em>, and introduce you to Shelby as another member of the team God is raising up, here, at FamilyLife. We are encouraged and committed to help the next generation of marriages\/of families and are so thankful for the ways <em>you<\/em> play a part in that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Well, we sure are. A quick word of thanks to those of you who pray for us and those of you who financially support this mission. You make all that we do at FamilyLife possible, and we are indeed grateful for you. Thank you, David. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe hope you have a great weekend. Hope you and your family are able to worship together in your local church this weekend, and I hope you can join us on Monday when we\u2019re going to hear from Dave Wilson about what real, biblical manhood looks like\u2014not toxic masculinity\u2014biblical masculinity. We\u2019re also going to share with you about our plans for February of 2022 to be back sailing on the <em>Love Like You Mean It<\/em><sup>\u00ae<\/sup> marriage cruise and how you can reserve a stateroom for the cruise. All of that comes up Monday. I hope you can join us. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch. We got some help from our friend, Bruce Goff, and our entire broadcast production team. On behalf of our hosts, Dave and Ann Wilson, I\u2019m Bob Lepine. Have a great weekend. We will see you Monday for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas; a Cru<sup>\u00ae <\/sup>Ministry. Help for today. Hope for tomorrow.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright <sup>\u00a9<\/sup> 2021 FamilyLife. All rights reserved.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/\">www.FamilyLife.com<\/a>\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\n\t\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\t1\n\t\t\t\t<\/p>","theme_header_position":"","post_header_is_sticky":"","is_header_overlay":""},"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast\/306757","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/podcast"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/91"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=306757"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/294104"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=306757"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=306757"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=306757"},{"taxonomy":"podcast_series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast_series?post=306757"},{"taxonomy":"cwp_profile","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/cwp_profile?post=306757"},{"taxonomy":"series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/series?post=306757"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}