{"id":306714,"date":"2021-02-05T07:00:06","date_gmt":"2021-02-05T12:00:06","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/%series%\/the-intersection-between-sports-and-faith\/"},"modified":"2021-02-05T07:00:06","modified_gmt":"2021-02-05T12:00:06","slug":"the-intersection-between-sports-and-faith","status":"publish","type":"podcast","link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/the-intersection-between-sports-and-faith\/","title":{"rendered":"The Intersection Between Sports and Faith"},"content":{"rendered":"<p>Do you find it difficult to live out your faith in your work? On FamilyLife Today, join hosts Dave and Ann Wilson as they talk with ESPN commentator Jason Romano about how to bloom where you are planted.<\/p>\n<p>Show Notes and Resources<\/p>\n<p> \tDownload FamilyLife&#8217;s new app! https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/app\/<br \/>\n \tFind resources from this podcast at https:\/\/shop.familylife.com\/Products.aspx?categoryid=130.<br \/>\n \tCheck out all that&#8217;s available on the FamilyLife Podcast Network.\u00a0 https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/familylife-podcast-network\/<\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Do you find it difficult to live out your faith in your work? On FamilyLife Today, join hosts Dave and Ann Wilson as they talk with ESPN commentator Jason Romano about how to bloom where you are planted.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":91,"featured_media":294104,"menu_order":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","template":"","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","inline_featured_image":false,"_uag_custom_page_level_css":"","episode_type":"","audio_file":"https:\/\/fltoday.s3.us-east-1.amazonaws.com\/fl2021-02-05.mp3","cover_image":"","cover_image_id":"","duration":"00:28:57","filesize":"26.51M","filesize_raw":"27795564","date_recorded":"","explicit":"","block":""},"categories":[2826],"tags":[4299,4699,2916,4002],"podcast_series":[8427],"cwp_profile":[9692],"series":[2101],"class_list":["post-306714","podcast","type-podcast","status-publish","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-men","tag-faith","tag-leadership","tag-men","tag-reaching-out","podcast_series-the-uniform-of-leadership","cwp_profile-jason-romano","series-familylife-today"],"acf":[],"episode_featured_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/09\/FLT-Podcast-Cover-2-508x508-3.jpg?w=508","episode_player_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2023\/02\/image-scaled.jpg","download_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-download\/306714\/the-intersection-between-sports-and-faith","player_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-player\/306714\/the-intersection-between-sports-and-faith","audio_player":null,"episode_data":{"playerMode":"light","subscribeUrls":{"apple_podcasts":{"key":"apple_podcasts","url":"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303?mt=2&app=podcast","label":"Apple Podcasts","class":"apple_podcasts","icon":"apple-podcasts.png"},"google_podcasts":{"key":"google_podcasts","url":"","label":"Google Podcasts","class":"google_podcasts","icon":"google-podcasts.png"},"spotify":{"key":"spotify","url":"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm","label":"Spotify","class":"spotify","icon":"spotify.png"},"youtube":{"key":"youtube","url":"","label":"YouTube","class":"youtube","icon":"youtube.png"}},"rssFeedUrl":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/feed\/podcast\/familylife-today","embedCode":"<blockquote class=\"wp-embedded-content\" data-secret=\"Mde8k6unMq\"><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/the-intersection-between-sports-and-faith\/\">The Intersection Between Sports and Faith<\/a><\/blockquote><iframe sandbox=\"allow-scripts\" security=\"restricted\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/the-intersection-between-sports-and-faith\/embed\/#?secret=Mde8k6unMq\" width=\"500\" height=\"350\" title=\"&#8220;The Intersection Between Sports and Faith&#8221; &#8212; FamilyLife\u00ae - A Cru Ministry\" data-secret=\"Mde8k6unMq\" frameborder=\"0\" marginwidth=\"0\" marginheight=\"0\" scrolling=\"no\" class=\"wp-embedded-content\"><\/iframe><script>\n\/*! This file is auto-generated *\/\n!function(d,l){\"use strict\";l.querySelector&&d.addEventListener&&\"undefined\"!=typeof URL&&(d.wp=d.wp||{},d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage||(d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage=function(e){var t=e.data;if((t||t.secret||t.message||t.value)&&!\/[^a-zA-Z0-9]\/.test(t.secret)){for(var s,r,n,a=l.querySelectorAll('iframe[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),o=l.querySelectorAll('blockquote[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),c=new RegExp(\"^https?:$\",\"i\"),i=0;i<o.length;i++)o[i].style.display=\"none\";for(i=0;i<a.length;i++)s=a[i],e.source===s.contentWindow&&(s.removeAttribute(\"style\"),\"height\"===t.message?(1e3<(r=parseInt(t.value,10))?r=1e3:~~r<200&&(r=200),s.height=r):\"link\"===t.message&&(r=new URL(s.getAttribute(\"src\")),n=new URL(t.value),c.test(n.protocol))&&n.host===r.host&&l.activeElement===s&&(d.top.location.href=t.value))}},d.addEventListener(\"message\",d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage,!1),l.addEventListener(\"DOMContentLoaded\",function(){for(var e,t,s=l.querySelectorAll(\"iframe.wp-embedded-content\"),r=0;r<s.length;r++)(t=(e=s[r]).getAttribute(\"data-secret\"))||(t=Math.random().toString(36).substring(2,12),e.src+=\"#?secret=\"+t,e.setAttribute(\"data-secret\",t)),e.contentWindow.postMessage({message:\"ready\",secret:t},\"*\")},!1)))}(window,document);\n\/\/# sourceURL=https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-includes\/js\/wp-embed.min.js\n<\/script>\n"},"spectra_custom_meta":{"_wp_page_template":["default"],"transcript_url":["https:\/\/transcript.familylife.com\/fl2021-02-05.pdf"],"audio_file":["https:\/\/fltoday.s3.us-east-1.amazonaws.com\/fl2021-02-05.mp3"],"transcript_content":["<b>Bob:<\/b> During the years that he worked as a producer at ESPN, Jason Romano had a conversation with Coach Tony Dungy that marked his life.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> Coach stops; he says, \u201cJason, I understand that you are a follower of Christ. That\u2019s great.\u201d Then he asked me the question that changes my life forever, and I really mean this when I say this. He says, \u201cJason, how do you live your faith out in the work place, here, at ESPN?\u201d I thought, \u201cThere is no way I could be a Christian and live my faith out at a place that was sort of a big business secular type setting.\u201d<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nHis assistant, Jessica, comes right up in front of him; and she looks at me\/she goes, \u201cYou don\u2019t get it.\u201d She\u2019s like, \u201cUntil you\u2019re called away, you are to bloom where you\u2019re planted. Right here, this is your mission field.\u201d<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Bob: <\/b>This is <i>FamilyLife Today<\/i> for Friday, February 5<sup>th<\/sup>. Our hosts are Dave and Ann Wilson; I'm Bob Lepine. You can find us online at FamilyLifeToday.com. We\u2019re going to talk today about how all of us can bloom where we are planted or\u2014as Dave Wilson likes to say\u2014\u201cHow we make a dent where we are sent.\u201d Stay with us.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Bob: <\/b>And welcome to <i>FamilyLife Today<\/i>. Thanks for joining us. I\u2019ve just got to say, \u201cI\u2019m proud of you.\u201d We\u2019ve got an ESPN alumnus here with us on <i>FamilyLife Today<\/i>.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Yes.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Bob:<\/b> We\u2019ve been talking for a long time, and you have not said, \u201cCover 2,\u201d once. [Laughter] I just\/I\u2019m really proud that you have been able to\u2014\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Here is what I want to know, Bob. Do you know what Cover 2 is?<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Bob:<\/b> I know it has something to do with a defense; right? [Laughter]\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Yes.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Bob:<\/b> How\u2019s that? That\u2019s pretty good; right?<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Yes.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Bob:<\/b> That\u2019s about as far as I can go on that.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Okay; I want to know if my wife\u2014\n\n<b>Bob:<\/b> Do you know what a Cover 2 is?<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> \u2014knows what Cover 2 is. She\u2019s lived with a quarterback her <i>whole<\/i> life.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Ann:<\/b> Isn\u2019t it the defensive backs\u2014\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Yes.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Ann:<\/b> \u2014what they are running?<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Yes; it\u2019s basically two high safeties in the middle of the field on the hashes.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Bob:<\/b> That\u2019s Cover 2.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> It determines everything: what you can run and change your routes. Anyway, we\u2019re not here to talk about Cover 2\u2014[Laughter]\n\n<b>Bob:<\/b> I shouldn\u2019t have brought it up!<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> \u2014or talk about football.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Bob:<\/b> Now, we\u2019re into a pass-rush defense; okay?<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> We just lost half the audience, Bob.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Bob:<\/b> We did; we did.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> It is fun to have somebody from ESPN\u201417 years\u2014Jason Romano worked for ESPN; no longer works for ESPN. He\u2019s at a level now we all aspire to: he is an author; he\u2019s a podcaster; he\u2019s an emcee of ministries. And really\u2014we didn\u2019t mention this before\u2014but you\u2019re with <i>Sports Spectrum<\/i>.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> Yes.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Jason, glad to have you here. Tell us a little bit about what you\u2019re doing these days.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> I love it. First of all, thanks guys for having me on your show. Yes, <i>Sports Spectrum <\/i>is the intersection of sports and faith\/faith in Jesus. <i>Sports Spectrum<\/i> is a ministry that\u2019s been around for 35 years, telling these stories in the sports world, but intersecting it with faith in Christ. We get to do a lot of interviews like with Dave and Ann Wilson on my show and talk about sports and faith. It\u2019s really cool.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Ann:<\/b> Jason, how did you become passionate about that?<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> That goes back to being a kid\u2014sports. Well, the faith part is later in my life; I was 27 when I began my walk with Jesus. But sports was all I cared about; in many ways, I tell people it was my god; because I didn\u2019t have a relationship with Jesus when I was a kid. I did go to Catholic church a little bit, here and there, but very rarely\u2014out of\/sort of obligation\u2014but Sundays were about football\/sometimes, bowling.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nNot until I was 27, my brother, Chris, was headed down a really bad path. Jesus got a hold of him, and He did a 180 in his life; I watched him live this new life out. I thought he was crazy at first. When he became a Christian, I thought, \u201cWhat is wrong with this dude? He\u2019s in some sort of cult or something.\u201d But I watched him, for three years, live out his faith; and it became very attractive. I was curious; I said, \u201cChris, tell me what\u2019s really going on here.\u201d He would kind of give me little hints about Jesus and say, \u201cHis church,\u201d and things like that; but for me, it was just a curiosity. I was really impressed with what happened to him in his life.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nMy life wasn\u2019t spiraling out of control from a worldly perspective\u2014got married, moved into our first house, got the ESPN job\u2014things were looking good; but I saw what he had, and I wanted it. He shared the gospel with me on Mother\u2019s Day, 2001, in the back bedroom of his house. I tell people I had no idea what I was saying, \u201cYes,\u201d to; but my heart was opened to say, \u201cYes,\u201d to it. That was the beginning\/the start of my relationship [with God]. It\u2019s been\u2014gosh\u2014almost 20 years now. I haven\u2019t reached it, or gotten to wherever we want to get to; but I\u2019m just so glad that he did that [shared the gospel], because it changed my life.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Bob:<\/b> In your work with <i>Sports Spectrum<\/i>, has there been anybody, who you\u2019ve interviewed, where it was like that little kid could not wait to get to meet this person that you were a super fan boy for?<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> Oh, yes; Darryl Strawberry is the guy. Darryl wrote the Foreword to my first book, <i>Live to Forgive<\/i>. If you met 12-year-old Jason, the walls were covered with Darryl Strawberry posters; the notebooks were covered with stats. Literally, at bats to at bat to at bat of what Darryl Strawberry was doing, watching WOR in New York as a kid. Fast forward to all the way to 2009, and I\u2019m spending the day with Darryl Strawberry at ESPN.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nNow, I\u2019m a Christian at this point; but I\u2019m not working in ministry. I\u2019m still doing my job at ESPN. Darryl comes; and I wanted to spend the day with him, talking about the \u201986 Mets. We didn\u2019t talk baseball at all for eight hours. We talked about Jesus; we talked about faith, forgiveness, our parents, addiction\u2014all the things that Darryl Strawberry has been through\u2014if you know anything about his story.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nThen fast forward four or five years later\u2014six years later\u2014I\u2019m in ministry, hosting a show that I am doing, and interviewing my childhood hero. We\u2019re not talking about baseball, again; we\u2019re talking about Jesus. It\u2019s pretty crazy.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Bob:<\/b> That is great.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Yes; so\/and one of the things you said about your job at ESPN is\u2014people come in\u2014some of them heroes\u2014\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> Sure.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> \u2014but obviously, sports figures\u2014and leave a mark on you.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> Yes.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> You just hit on one thing that hit me in your book, <i>The Uniform of Leadership<\/i>, about ministry. Tony Dungy\u2014and, maybe, his assistant\u2014tell us that story, though; because that was a <i>really<\/i> interesting perspective to think about: \u201cWhat is ministry? What isn\u2019t ministry?\u201d Tell us that story.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> That is\/that was a pivotal, life-changing moment for me that day; and I didn\u2019t know what was happening. My job, at that point at ESPN, I was a talent producer\u2014that was the title\u2014but in essence, I was the booker. I was the guy who would book the guests, bring them to ESPN, and then set their day up. You go through all of the different shows. ESPN, obviously, has many, many, many shows, like <i>SportsCenter<\/i>, and <i>Mike &amp; Mike<\/i>, and <i>First Take<\/i>\u2014all of these shows\u2014<i>NFL Live<\/i>\u2014that you would have seen and watched.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nI put a schedule together. I knew, at that point, that I was a follower of Christ for sure. I\u2019m eight\/nine years into my walk with the Lord, but I always struggled with what it was like to have my faith brought to the workplace. I didn\u2019t know what that meant. I always thought, \u201cChurch on Sunday; maybe, life group\/small group middle of the week\u201d; but when I went to ESPN, that was my job. ESPN and all that church stuff was kind of separate. Now, I wasn\u2019t <i>denying<\/i> Christ at work; but I thought it was separate.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nWhen Coach Dungy comes, I\u2019m excited because I know he is a man of faith\u2014Hall of Fame coach. I knew, when he was coming, he was going to bring Jesus into the conversation just the way that Coach is. If you ever talk to Coach, or know anything about Coach Dungy, he is a gentle giant; but he exudes Christ\/who Christ is, in my opinion, in the way that he talks and the gentle spirit that he is.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nCoach is here; he does <i>Mike &amp; Mike<\/i> in the morning. We find ourselves in this green room, which is just a little side office; but we\u2019re in this green room, and we\u2019re just hanging out. His assistant, Jessica, is there; his publisher, Todd, and his coauthor, Nathan, are with him\u2014it\u2019s four people total. Those other three are all believers, who I had kind of relationships with in different projects in the past; so they knew that I was a Christian. They had told Coach Dungy that I was a Christian.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nCoach stops right in the middle, while we\u2019re hanging out in the green room that morning; and he says, \u201cJason, I understand you are a follower of Christ. That\u2019s so cool.\u201d He didn\u2019t have to do this, by the way; Coach Dungy does not have to stop and take an interest in me. I\u2019m just a <i>nobody<\/i>; I\u2019m just a producer at ESPN, doing my job; right? But this is great leadership, on Coach Dungy\u2019s part, to actually make every <i>single<\/i> person around him feel like they are worth a million dollars.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nHe stops, and he says, \u201cJason, I understand that you are a follower of Christ. That\u2019s great.\u201d Then he asks me the question that changes my life forever\u2014I really mean this when I say this\u2014he says\u2014and nobody has ever asked me this question before\u2014he says, \u201cJason, how do you live your faith out in the workplace here at ESPN if you\u2019re a Christian? How does that work for you? How do you live your faith out?\u201d<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nI was caught off guard. My answer was definitely not the answer he wanted; I said, \u201cI don\u2019t even know if I can do that, Coach. I mean, I\u2019m at ESPN. If I\u2019m going to live out my faith, I need to go work for a sports ministry like the Fellowship of Christian Athletes or <i>Sports Spectrum<\/i>,\u201d\u2014which, spoiler alert: I am now\u2014[Laughter]\u2014but at the time, I wasn\u2019t thinking about that. I thought, \u201cThere is no way I can be a Christian and live my faith out at a place like ESPN, or any kind of place that was sort of a big business secular-type setting.\u201d<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nI could sense he was not happy. He was just kind of shaking his head, and he was about to respond. Before he could, his assistant, Jessica, comes right up in front of him; and I had known Jessica from a couple previous engagements, and different bookings, and things like that; so she had the permission to be bold in this moment. She comes up with me, puts her hands on her hips. She looks at me\/she goes, \u201cYou don\u2019t get it; do you?\u201d I said, \u201cOh my gosh, Jessica! What don\u2019t I get?!\u201d I\u2019m like scared a little bit for a minute; I\u2019m like, \u201cWhat don\u2019t I get? I don\u2019t understand what you\u2019re trying to say.\u201d She\u2019s like, \u201cYou don\u2019t get it. Look where you are working; you are at ESPN. There are 3,000 employees on this campus that you can impact for Jesus.\u201d<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Ann:<\/b> \u201cIt\u2019s your mission field.\u201d<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> That\u2019s what she said; she goes, \u201cThis is a mission field for you, right here at ESPN.\u201d She said, \u201cSomeday, you might be called away to go work in ministry\u201d\u2014and that happened\u2014she\u2019s like, \u201cUntil that day happens, you are to bloom where you are planted. Right here, this is your mission field.\u201d It was like a light bulb went on in my brain; I said, \u201cOh my gosh! I get it now; I get it.\u201d<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nI\u2019ll tell you what happened, guys\u2014before that day, I would say, \u201cI was an ESPN producer, who happened to be a husband, who happened to be a dad.\u201d That was really the identity that I kind of aligned with. After that day\u2014now again, it\u2019s all a process; so it takes a little while\u2014but I realized, \u201cI am a follower of Christ first, who happens to work at ESPN.\u201d Order is important here, and that\u2019s what happened with me.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nI went from understanding that [previous mindset to] \u201cWait a minute! Jesus isn\u2019t just a piece of my life. He is the <i>centerpiece<\/i> of all that I am. He comes with me to ESPN; so when I go to ESPN, and step in that office every single day, there is an opportunity to be Jesus to someone in there.\u201d I saw the people I worked with; I saw the work that I did as a more purposeful work; I saw that it wasn\u2019t about me anymore. For many years, I was focused on climbing the corporate ladder: \u201cLet\u2019s see if I can get that next producer job,\u201d or \u201c\u2026if I can get that next level,\u201d \u201c\u2026 that raise,\u201d \u201c...that salary.\u201d<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nWell, after Coach Dungy and a few other things take place, I realize, \u201cWait a minute; I\u2019ve got this whole thing <i>backwards<\/i> here. My job every day is to come into ESPN and say [to God], \u2018How can I serve You at ESPN?\u2019 not \u2018What can ESPN do for me?\u2019\u201d<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Bob:<\/b> Tell Jason how you say it; you don\u2019t say, \u201cBloom where you\u2019re planted.\u201d<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Yes; \u201cBloom where you\u2019re planted\u201d is in your book\u2014and it\u2019s a great phrase\u2014I\u2019ve always said, \u201cMake a dent where you\u2019re sent.\u201d<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> Oh, I like that.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Here is the thing that I like about that is: \u201cWe are sent to make a dent\u201d; in other words, I get it from <i>Tommy Boy<\/i>. Remember Tommy?\u2014\u201cThat will leave a mark!\u201d<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> Yes! [Laughter]<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> That\u2019s where I first got it! [Laughter]<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> \u201cThat\u2019s going to leave a mark!\u201d<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> \u201cThat will leave a mark.\u201d I\u2019m like, \u201cEverywhere God sends you, you want to leave a mark,\u201d\u2014a good mark; right?<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nBut here is the thing that happens\u2014when I used that at our church\/you know, \u201cMake a dent where you are sent,\u201d\u2014people will come up every time and say, \u201cHey, I\u2019ve got a question. I know where you are sent; you are a pastor. I know where he is sent; he\u2019s a missionary\/she\u2019s a missionary. I don\u2019t know where I\u2019m sent.\u201d You know what the profound answer is?\u2014\u201cYou are sent where you are.\u201d<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> Yes.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> That is what Tony Dungy was telling you in a sense: \u201cWhere you are is your calling\u201d; you know?<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> Yes.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> That\u2019s what <i>you<\/i> discovered. I don\u2019t think most of us understand that.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> I didn\u2019t either. I had been a Christian for nine years up to that point before Coach Dungy asked me that question. I didn\u2019t realize, \u201cWait a minute; this isn\u2019t just a job that I\u2019m going to.\u201d I enjoyed my job, by the way;\u2014<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Yes.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> \u2014I <i>loved<\/i> working at ESPN prior to that moment with Coach Dungy. I loved it even more <i>after<\/i>, because I knew I got to do a job that I enjoyed; I got to work in the toy department of the world\u2014as I call it\u2014like the sports world; are you kidding me?! But now, it became more purposeful work.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nI do miss being around others, who think differently. I try to actually, intentionally, have conversations with a lot of people, whether it\u2019s through social media or even just meeting up at different places that aren\u2019t followers of Christ of just kind of hear their perspective, and talk to them, and be able to witness to them the only way I can.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> And the amazing thing is you are doing it, now, in a different way\u2014\n\n<b>Ann:<\/b> Right.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> \u2014because your broadcast\/your podcast is influencing non-church\/non-Christian people. That\u2019s why you do it, because they are interested in sports\u2019 lives. You\u2019re using that platform to say, \u201cI may not be sitting in an office beside you; but man, we\u2019re impacting your life right now\u201d; right?<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> Yes.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Ann:<\/b> I think it starts with where we talked earlier about putting the jersey on correctly.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> Yes.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Ann:<\/b> Do you do that the first thing in the morning?\u2014like, \u201cOkay, I need to make sure\u201d\u2014as you said before\u2014\u201cthat Jesus is first. I\u2019m going to serve <i>Him<\/i> before I serve myself today\u201d?<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> I try to.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Ann:<\/b> Yes.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> We all mess that up, obviously. I just\/this past year, in 2020, thinking about discipline, and everything was kind of taken away from us in the pandemic\u2014this might be a horrible situation for a lot of people\u2014but this is, also, an opportunity to come out of this different as followers of Christ.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nFor me, I actually tried to\u2014again, I mess up occasionally; so I\u2019m not perfect\u2014but I try to make sure that the first 30 minutes every morning was with Him. I would spend time listening to worship music, or even just shutting down the phone and just\u2014sometimes, I am going for walks and doing this; but just praying\u2014spending that quiet time\u2014like that has to be\/now, it\u2019s almost become habit formed in a good way, where I have to have that time in the morning\/that quiet time with God. When I don\u2019t have that\u2014whether I\u2019m on vacation or things kind of get out of whack\u2014you feel it; you feel <i>that<\/i>.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nI think that, if I am going to talk about being a leader, and talk about\u2014especially leading in my house, but also leading others, or writing a book about leadership\u2014I\u2019ve got to be accountable to myself too. I\u2019ve got to make sure I\u2019ve got my priorities straight.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Yes; one of the stories that hit me about that was you turning down the opportunity to be a producer\u2014\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> Yes.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> \u2014because of how it would affect your family.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> Yes.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Talk about that.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> At ESPN, they give reviews. They have a mid-year review in the middle of the year; and then at the end of the year, you are either on the right track, moving ahead, or\u2014I forget the third one\u2014but it\u2019s like these levels that they kind of qualify you at in terms of your work; they evaluate you. You sometimes get a little bit of a raise or a bump: \u201cOh, you get a 3 percent raise for your review,\u201d\u2014or whatever.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nThat mid-year review in 2008\u2014it was scathing\u2014it was like, \u201cJason is all focused on himself. He doesn\u2019t care about his teammates. He\u2019s focused on the next job and not the job he is currently working at and getting paid for.\u201d I was like, \u201cOh my gosh!\u201d<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Bob:<\/b> Yikes!<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> It was <i>bad<\/i>; it was an eye-opener.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Was it true?<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> It was!<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Yes?<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> Yes; at the time, I didn\u2019t think it was: I\u2019m like, \u201cNO! You should have told me this. I was just trying to do what everybody else was doing and get the next job at ESPN.\u201d But it was true; I was <i>so<\/i> focused on Jason and wearing that uniform backwards.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nI will say\u2014that same year, I had this opportunity\u2014I wrote about me and this woman named Carol going after this manager job in the middle of 2008. Carol was 26; at the time, I was probably 34, I think, and more experienced. I\u2019m like, \u201cThere is no way that Carol is going to get this job over me.\u201d I went in there, with my chest out, thinking, \u201cI\u2019m good here.\u201d<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nCarol got the job. [Laughter] You talk about humbling; like I was like, \u201cWhoa! Okay; so I thought I deserved this.\u201d But Carol and I\u2014because we had such a great relationship, as coworkers, we agreed, no matter who was going to get this job, that we were going to support each other. We did. Carol got the job; I said, \u201cAlright; I can either be the bad guy\/the bully here, or I can just serve and be a support to you. I am here for you, however I can help\/however I can serve.\u201d<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nCarol was working with me on having this potential of becoming a producer at ESPN. All that title\u2014I\u2019m talking about the title, Producer. Producer is a general term that we can all use for all the behind-the-scenes people; but there is an actual title called Producer 1 that is a level that a lot of people strive towards, and I was trying to go there. I had this opportunity to become a Producer 1 in the summer 2008, and it was about a $30,000 pay increase. When you get that job, it\u2019s sort of\/it raises up, in my opinion, the level of how people view you in the work that you do; right?<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nI was all set to do it; and then I remember one day going in\u2014and they called it shadowing\u2014I would go in, and I would shadow another Producer and see what this job was going to be like. It was like 5 in the afternoon until 3 in the morning; it was Wednesday through Sunday, weekends; and it was not glamorous at all, but it was an opportunity to get this bump in pay; right? \u2014and this raise.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nI remember going in, and I shadowed. All it took was one day. The next day, I came in, and I said to Carol\u2014I said, \u201cI don\u2019t think I\u2019m going to be a Producer 1.\u201d She goes, \u201cWhy? What\u2019s wrong?\u201d I said, \u201cI see what\u2019s happening here. If I take this job\u201d\u2014which they didn\u2019t offer me the job, actually; I just assumed they were training me toward it\u2014I said, \u201cBut if they offer me this job and I take it, I will <i>never<\/i> see my daughter,\u201d\u2014in my opinion, I will never see her. She\u2019ll be in school during the day, and on the weekends, I\u2019m working; and I\u2019m there.\n\nI said, \u201cShe\u2019s four years old\u201d\u2014at that point. I said, \u201cIf I take this job, there is a very good chance that I might be stuck in this job for the next five to ten years\u2014however they want me to be in this job, and they control my hours.\u201d I can\u2019t say, \u201cGuys, I need to work 9 to 5 today, Monday through Friday.\u201d They are not going to do that; sports doesn\u2019t happen between 9 to 5, Monday through Friday; it happens nights and weekends.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nI made a point\/I made a choice; I remember going to a few of the bosses and saying, \u201cListen, I don\u2019t think I\u2019m going to continue my training to become a Producer 1.\u201d They said, \u201cWell, how come?\u201d I said, \u201cI can\u2019t take the chance of not being able to be around my kid and missing the next ten years of her life.\u201d They looked at me; and they were like, \u201cYou won\u2019t miss the next\u2026\u201d\u2014I said, \u201cYou can\u2019t guarantee that; can you?\u201d They said, \u201cWe can\u2019t guarantee that you can work the hours that you may want to work; but we\u2019ll do our best.\u201d I\u2019m like, \u201cI just can\u2019t; I\u2019m sorry.\u201d<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nI went back the next day. Carol said to me, \u201cWhat can I do for <i>you<\/i> to help your life be better so that you <i>can<\/i> be around your child?\u201d It changed my life; I said: \u201cCan I work on the NFL?\u201d \u201cCan I work Sunday through Thursday?\u201d \u201cCan I work 7 to 5 during the week, or 8 to 5, and then come home at night and be with my kid?\u201d She said, \u201cYes, absolutely; let\u2019s make that happen.\u201d I didn\u2019t get the $30,000 raise; but I look back now, and I did not miss my kid\u2014I was there for her, being able to be in the most pivotal moments, I think, in her life, especially when she needed a dad;\u2014\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Yes.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> \u2014because I didn\u2019t have a dad that was around or available. I wanted to make sure that she had what I couldn\u2019t have. If it meant not getting a $30,000 raise increase or a job title prestige\u2014whatever you want to call it\u2014I don\u2019t regret that, by the way, one iota. Other people, maybe, do\u2014I don\u2019t know\u2014but for me, I had to make that choice.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Yes; and I\u2019m guessing your daughter\u2014maybe, I\u2019m wrong\u2014does she even know that you\u2019ve made that choice?<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> I don\u2019t know if she does. It\u2019s weird; she won\u2019t read my books.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Ann:<\/b> She would know\u2014\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> She\u2019s a teenager. I don\u2019t know; she doesn\u2019t read anything. [Laughter]\n\n<b>Ann:<\/b> But she would know, had you made that decision and taken that job,\u2014\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> Absolutely.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Ann:<\/b> \u2014because she wouldn\u2019t have a relationship with you.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> And leadership is all the little behind-the-scene decisions that literally change people\u2019s lives. Way to go!<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> Thanks, man.\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> That was a <i>big<\/i> decision.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> It was. I look back now, and I recognize\u2014you know my daughter is 16, and she is probably like, \u201cWhatever, Dad!\u201d which is pretty much the response I get on everything\u2014\u201cWhatever, Dad!\u201d [Laughter] But I hope, when she is 24\/25, and we can sit down and really\u2014and she maybe gets married, and has kids of her own\u2014that she sees and understands that it\u2019s these little moments and these decisions that you can make in your life that can make the difference between\u2014who knows?\u2014maybe not even being able to have a relationship with her; you know?<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Right.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> That was big for me, especially with what I went through with my own dad.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Right.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Bob:<\/b> Just don\u2019t do what Dave Wilson would do, and go to her and say, \u201cYou know, you owe me $300,000 because I stayed home.\u201d [Laughter]<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> \u201cLet me do the math here.\u201d [Laughter]\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Ten years, 30 grand\u2014that\u2019s about right. [Laughter]\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> Yes; maybe, she\u2019ll pay me back someday.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Bob:<\/b> Jason, thank you for being with us. These are <i>great<\/i> leadership principles for moms, dads\u2014for every one of us.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Ann:<\/b> Right.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Oh, yes!<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Bob:<\/b> Thank you.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> Thank you.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Bob:<\/b> Jason\u2019s book, again, is called <i>The Uniform of Leadership: Lessons on True Success from My ESPN Life<\/i>. We\u2019ve got copies of the book available to you in our <i>FamilyLife Today<\/i> Resource Center. You can request your copy, online, at FamilyLifeToday.com; or you can call to order: 1-800-FL-TODAY is our number. Again, get a copy of Jason Romano\u2019s book, <i>The Uniform of Leadership<\/i>. Order online at FamilyLifeToday.com; or call to order: 1-800-358-6329\u2014that\u2019s 1-800-\u201cF\u201d as in family, \u201cL\u201d as in life, and then the word, \u201cTODAY.\u201d<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nI wish our listeners could be here each week as we get letters, here, at FamilyLife<sup>\u00ae<\/sup> from listeners\/get emails that folks send in\u2014people, who tell us, \u201cThe conversation you had on this particular subject on this particular day, God used that in my life in a dramatic way. It was exactly what I needed to hear. I\u2019ve made the changes; I\u2019ve pivoted. I\u2019ve\/I was reminded of what\u2019s true; I\u2019m starting to live that out.\u201d There are people whose lives are headed in a different direction today because God used <i>FamilyLife Today<\/i> to interact with them.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nI just want to say, \u201cThank you,\u201d to those of you who are, not only listeners to <i>FamilyLife Today<\/i>, but the financial supporters of this ministry\u2014those of you who may have been impacted by this ministry yourself, and you want to make sure others receive the same benefit\u2014those of you who support us financially, with a one-time donation or on a monthly basis as Legacy Partners, we are so grateful for you.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nWe talked earlier this week about the issue of pornography and the pandemic that exists in our culture around pornography. Joe Rigney was our guest; and his book, which is called <i>More Than a Battle<\/i>\u2014we\u2019re making that book available as a thank-you gift this week to any of you who can support the work of <i>FamilyLife Today<\/i>. You can make your donation, online, at FamilyLifeToday.com; or you can call 1-800-FL-TODAY to donate.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nThis book is an important book for every person to read because all of us\u2014whether we are struggling with this issue or not\u2014we\u2019re interacting with people who are. This book gives guidance on how to break free from the bondage that so many experience when it comes to pornography. Again, the title of the book is <i>More Than a Battle<\/i>. It is our gift to you when you make a donation to support <i>FamilyLife Today<\/i> this week. Thanks, in advance, for that donation. You can donate, online, at FamilyLifeToday.com; or call 1-800-FL-TODAY.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nWe hope you have a great weekend. Hope you and your family are somehow able to worship together with your local church this weekend, and I hope you can join us back on Monday when we\u2019re going to talk football again, a little bit, because Derwin Gray, who used to play in the NFL, is going to be with us. He is a pastor now in North Carolina. He\u2019s written a book, looking at what makes up the good life; and it\u2019s different than what you might imagine. Join us as we talk with Derwin about that on Monday.\n\nI want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch. We got some help from Justin Adams this week as well. On behalf of our hosts, Dave and Ann Wilson, I\u2019m Bob Lepine. We will see you back next time for another edition of <i>FamilyLife Today<\/i>.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<i>FamilyLife Today<\/i> is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas; a Cru<sup>\u00ae <\/sup>Ministry. Help for today. Hope for tomorrow.\n\nWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs? <span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nCopyright <sup>\u00a9<\/sup> 2021 FamilyLife. 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you find it difficult to live out your faith in your work? On FamilyLife Today, join hosts Dave and Ann Wilson as they talk with ESPN commentator Jason Romano about how to bloom where you are planted.","meta_box":{"show_notes":"","transcript_url":"https:\/\/transcript.familylife.com\/fl2021-02-05.pdf","transcript_content":"<b>Bob:<\/b> During the years that he worked as a producer at ESPN, Jason Romano had a conversation with Coach Tony Dungy that marked his life.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> Coach stops; he says, \u201cJason, I understand that you are a follower of Christ. That\u2019s great.\u201d Then he asked me the question that changes my life forever, and I really mean this when I say this. He says, \u201cJason, how do you live your faith out in the work place, here, at ESPN?\u201d I thought, \u201cThere is no way I could be a Christian and live my faith out at a place that was sort of a big business secular type setting.\u201d<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nHis assistant, Jessica, comes right up in front of him; and she looks at me\/she goes, \u201cYou don\u2019t get it.\u201d She\u2019s like, \u201cUntil you\u2019re called away, you are to bloom where you\u2019re planted. Right here, this is your mission field.\u201d<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Bob: <\/b>This is <i>FamilyLife Today<\/i> for Friday, February 5<sup>th<\/sup>. Our hosts are Dave and Ann Wilson; I'm Bob Lepine. You can find us online at FamilyLifeToday.com. We\u2019re going to talk today about how all of us can bloom where we are planted or\u2014as Dave Wilson likes to say\u2014\u201cHow we make a dent where we are sent.\u201d Stay with us.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Bob: <\/b>And welcome to <i>FamilyLife Today<\/i>. Thanks for joining us. I\u2019ve just got to say, \u201cI\u2019m proud of you.\u201d We\u2019ve got an ESPN alumnus here with us on <i>FamilyLife Today<\/i>.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Yes.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Bob:<\/b> We\u2019ve been talking for a long time, and you have not said, \u201cCover 2,\u201d once. [Laughter] I just\/I\u2019m really proud that you have been able to\u2014\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Here is what I want to know, Bob. Do you know what Cover 2 is?<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Bob:<\/b> I know it has something to do with a defense; right? [Laughter]\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Yes.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Bob:<\/b> How\u2019s that? That\u2019s pretty good; right?<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Yes.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Bob:<\/b> That\u2019s about as far as I can go on that.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Okay; I want to know if my wife\u2014\n\n<b>Bob:<\/b> Do you know what a Cover 2 is?<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> \u2014knows what Cover 2 is. She\u2019s lived with a quarterback her <i>whole<\/i> life.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Ann:<\/b> Isn\u2019t it the defensive backs\u2014\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Yes.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Ann:<\/b> \u2014what they are running?<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Yes; it\u2019s basically two high safeties in the middle of the field on the hashes.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Bob:<\/b> That\u2019s Cover 2.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> It determines everything: what you can run and change your routes. Anyway, we\u2019re not here to talk about Cover 2\u2014[Laughter]\n\n<b>Bob:<\/b> I shouldn\u2019t have brought it up!<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> \u2014or talk about football.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Bob:<\/b> Now, we\u2019re into a pass-rush defense; okay?<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> We just lost half the audience, Bob.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Bob:<\/b> We did; we did.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> It is fun to have somebody from ESPN\u201417 years\u2014Jason Romano worked for ESPN; no longer works for ESPN. He\u2019s at a level now we all aspire to: he is an author; he\u2019s a podcaster; he\u2019s an emcee of ministries. And really\u2014we didn\u2019t mention this before\u2014but you\u2019re with <i>Sports Spectrum<\/i>.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> Yes.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Jason, glad to have you here. Tell us a little bit about what you\u2019re doing these days.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> I love it. First of all, thanks guys for having me on your show. Yes, <i>Sports Spectrum <\/i>is the intersection of sports and faith\/faith in Jesus. <i>Sports Spectrum<\/i> is a ministry that\u2019s been around for 35 years, telling these stories in the sports world, but intersecting it with faith in Christ. We get to do a lot of interviews like with Dave and Ann Wilson on my show and talk about sports and faith. It\u2019s really cool.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Ann:<\/b> Jason, how did you become passionate about that?<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> That goes back to being a kid\u2014sports. Well, the faith part is later in my life; I was 27 when I began my walk with Jesus. But sports was all I cared about; in many ways, I tell people it was my god; because I didn\u2019t have a relationship with Jesus when I was a kid. I did go to Catholic church a little bit, here and there, but very rarely\u2014out of\/sort of obligation\u2014but Sundays were about football\/sometimes, bowling.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nNot until I was 27, my brother, Chris, was headed down a really bad path. Jesus got a hold of him, and He did a 180 in his life; I watched him live this new life out. I thought he was crazy at first. When he became a Christian, I thought, \u201cWhat is wrong with this dude? He\u2019s in some sort of cult or something.\u201d But I watched him, for three years, live out his faith; and it became very attractive. I was curious; I said, \u201cChris, tell me what\u2019s really going on here.\u201d He would kind of give me little hints about Jesus and say, \u201cHis church,\u201d and things like that; but for me, it was just a curiosity. I was really impressed with what happened to him in his life.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nMy life wasn\u2019t spiraling out of control from a worldly perspective\u2014got married, moved into our first house, got the ESPN job\u2014things were looking good; but I saw what he had, and I wanted it. He shared the gospel with me on Mother\u2019s Day, 2001, in the back bedroom of his house. I tell people I had no idea what I was saying, \u201cYes,\u201d to; but my heart was opened to say, \u201cYes,\u201d to it. That was the beginning\/the start of my relationship [with God]. It\u2019s been\u2014gosh\u2014almost 20 years now. I haven\u2019t reached it, or gotten to wherever we want to get to; but I\u2019m just so glad that he did that [shared the gospel], because it changed my life.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Bob:<\/b> In your work with <i>Sports Spectrum<\/i>, has there been anybody, who you\u2019ve interviewed, where it was like that little kid could not wait to get to meet this person that you were a super fan boy for?<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> Oh, yes; Darryl Strawberry is the guy. Darryl wrote the Foreword to my first book, <i>Live to Forgive<\/i>. If you met 12-year-old Jason, the walls were covered with Darryl Strawberry posters; the notebooks were covered with stats. Literally, at bats to at bat to at bat of what Darryl Strawberry was doing, watching WOR in New York as a kid. Fast forward to all the way to 2009, and I\u2019m spending the day with Darryl Strawberry at ESPN.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nNow, I\u2019m a Christian at this point; but I\u2019m not working in ministry. I\u2019m still doing my job at ESPN. Darryl comes; and I wanted to spend the day with him, talking about the \u201986 Mets. We didn\u2019t talk baseball at all for eight hours. We talked about Jesus; we talked about faith, forgiveness, our parents, addiction\u2014all the things that Darryl Strawberry has been through\u2014if you know anything about his story.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nThen fast forward four or five years later\u2014six years later\u2014I\u2019m in ministry, hosting a show that I am doing, and interviewing my childhood hero. We\u2019re not talking about baseball, again; we\u2019re talking about Jesus. It\u2019s pretty crazy.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Bob:<\/b> That is great.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Yes; so\/and one of the things you said about your job at ESPN is\u2014people come in\u2014some of them heroes\u2014\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> Sure.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> \u2014but obviously, sports figures\u2014and leave a mark on you.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> Yes.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> You just hit on one thing that hit me in your book, <i>The Uniform of Leadership<\/i>, about ministry. Tony Dungy\u2014and, maybe, his assistant\u2014tell us that story, though; because that was a <i>really<\/i> interesting perspective to think about: \u201cWhat is ministry? What isn\u2019t ministry?\u201d Tell us that story.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> That is\/that was a pivotal, life-changing moment for me that day; and I didn\u2019t know what was happening. My job, at that point at ESPN, I was a talent producer\u2014that was the title\u2014but in essence, I was the booker. I was the guy who would book the guests, bring them to ESPN, and then set their day up. You go through all of the different shows. ESPN, obviously, has many, many, many shows, like <i>SportsCenter<\/i>, and <i>Mike &amp; Mike<\/i>, and <i>First Take<\/i>\u2014all of these shows\u2014<i>NFL Live<\/i>\u2014that you would have seen and watched.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nI put a schedule together. I knew, at that point, that I was a follower of Christ for sure. I\u2019m eight\/nine years into my walk with the Lord, but I always struggled with what it was like to have my faith brought to the workplace. I didn\u2019t know what that meant. I always thought, \u201cChurch on Sunday; maybe, life group\/small group middle of the week\u201d; but when I went to ESPN, that was my job. ESPN and all that church stuff was kind of separate. Now, I wasn\u2019t <i>denying<\/i> Christ at work; but I thought it was separate.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nWhen Coach Dungy comes, I\u2019m excited because I know he is a man of faith\u2014Hall of Fame coach. I knew, when he was coming, he was going to bring Jesus into the conversation just the way that Coach is. If you ever talk to Coach, or know anything about Coach Dungy, he is a gentle giant; but he exudes Christ\/who Christ is, in my opinion, in the way that he talks and the gentle spirit that he is.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nCoach is here; he does <i>Mike &amp; Mike<\/i> in the morning. We find ourselves in this green room, which is just a little side office; but we\u2019re in this green room, and we\u2019re just hanging out. His assistant, Jessica, is there; his publisher, Todd, and his coauthor, Nathan, are with him\u2014it\u2019s four people total. Those other three are all believers, who I had kind of relationships with in different projects in the past; so they knew that I was a Christian. They had told Coach Dungy that I was a Christian.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nCoach stops right in the middle, while we\u2019re hanging out in the green room that morning; and he says, \u201cJason, I understand you are a follower of Christ. That\u2019s so cool.\u201d He didn\u2019t have to do this, by the way; Coach Dungy does not have to stop and take an interest in me. I\u2019m just a <i>nobody<\/i>; I\u2019m just a producer at ESPN, doing my job; right? But this is great leadership, on Coach Dungy\u2019s part, to actually make every <i>single<\/i> person around him feel like they are worth a million dollars.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nHe stops, and he says, \u201cJason, I understand that you are a follower of Christ. That\u2019s great.\u201d Then he asks me the question that changes my life forever\u2014I really mean this when I say this\u2014he says\u2014and nobody has ever asked me this question before\u2014he says, \u201cJason, how do you live your faith out in the workplace here at ESPN if you\u2019re a Christian? How does that work for you? How do you live your faith out?\u201d<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nI was caught off guard. My answer was definitely not the answer he wanted; I said, \u201cI don\u2019t even know if I can do that, Coach. I mean, I\u2019m at ESPN. If I\u2019m going to live out my faith, I need to go work for a sports ministry like the Fellowship of Christian Athletes or <i>Sports Spectrum<\/i>,\u201d\u2014which, spoiler alert: I am now\u2014[Laughter]\u2014but at the time, I wasn\u2019t thinking about that. I thought, \u201cThere is no way I can be a Christian and live my faith out at a place like ESPN, or any kind of place that was sort of a big business secular-type setting.\u201d<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nI could sense he was not happy. He was just kind of shaking his head, and he was about to respond. Before he could, his assistant, Jessica, comes right up in front of him; and I had known Jessica from a couple previous engagements, and different bookings, and things like that; so she had the permission to be bold in this moment. She comes up with me, puts her hands on her hips. She looks at me\/she goes, \u201cYou don\u2019t get it; do you?\u201d I said, \u201cOh my gosh, Jessica! What don\u2019t I get?!\u201d I\u2019m like scared a little bit for a minute; I\u2019m like, \u201cWhat don\u2019t I get? I don\u2019t understand what you\u2019re trying to say.\u201d She\u2019s like, \u201cYou don\u2019t get it. Look where you are working; you are at ESPN. There are 3,000 employees on this campus that you can impact for Jesus.\u201d<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Ann:<\/b> \u201cIt\u2019s your mission field.\u201d<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> That\u2019s what she said; she goes, \u201cThis is a mission field for you, right here at ESPN.\u201d She said, \u201cSomeday, you might be called away to go work in ministry\u201d\u2014and that happened\u2014she\u2019s like, \u201cUntil that day happens, you are to bloom where you are planted. Right here, this is your mission field.\u201d It was like a light bulb went on in my brain; I said, \u201cOh my gosh! I get it now; I get it.\u201d<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nI\u2019ll tell you what happened, guys\u2014before that day, I would say, \u201cI was an ESPN producer, who happened to be a husband, who happened to be a dad.\u201d That was really the identity that I kind of aligned with. After that day\u2014now again, it\u2019s all a process; so it takes a little while\u2014but I realized, \u201cI am a follower of Christ first, who happens to work at ESPN.\u201d Order is important here, and that\u2019s what happened with me.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nI went from understanding that [previous mindset to] \u201cWait a minute! Jesus isn\u2019t just a piece of my life. He is the <i>centerpiece<\/i> of all that I am. He comes with me to ESPN; so when I go to ESPN, and step in that office every single day, there is an opportunity to be Jesus to someone in there.\u201d I saw the people I worked with; I saw the work that I did as a more purposeful work; I saw that it wasn\u2019t about me anymore. For many years, I was focused on climbing the corporate ladder: \u201cLet\u2019s see if I can get that next producer job,\u201d or \u201c\u2026if I can get that next level,\u201d \u201c\u2026 that raise,\u201d \u201c...that salary.\u201d<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nWell, after Coach Dungy and a few other things take place, I realize, \u201cWait a minute; I\u2019ve got this whole thing <i>backwards<\/i> here. My job every day is to come into ESPN and say [to God], \u2018How can I serve You at ESPN?\u2019 not \u2018What can ESPN do for me?\u2019\u201d<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Bob:<\/b> Tell Jason how you say it; you don\u2019t say, \u201cBloom where you\u2019re planted.\u201d<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Yes; \u201cBloom where you\u2019re planted\u201d is in your book\u2014and it\u2019s a great phrase\u2014I\u2019ve always said, \u201cMake a dent where you\u2019re sent.\u201d<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> Oh, I like that.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Here is the thing that I like about that is: \u201cWe are sent to make a dent\u201d; in other words, I get it from <i>Tommy Boy<\/i>. Remember Tommy?\u2014\u201cThat will leave a mark!\u201d<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> Yes! [Laughter]<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> That\u2019s where I first got it! [Laughter]<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> \u201cThat\u2019s going to leave a mark!\u201d<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> \u201cThat will leave a mark.\u201d I\u2019m like, \u201cEverywhere God sends you, you want to leave a mark,\u201d\u2014a good mark; right?<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nBut here is the thing that happens\u2014when I used that at our church\/you know, \u201cMake a dent where you are sent,\u201d\u2014people will come up every time and say, \u201cHey, I\u2019ve got a question. I know where you are sent; you are a pastor. I know where he is sent; he\u2019s a missionary\/she\u2019s a missionary. I don\u2019t know where I\u2019m sent.\u201d You know what the profound answer is?\u2014\u201cYou are sent where you are.\u201d<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> Yes.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> That is what Tony Dungy was telling you in a sense: \u201cWhere you are is your calling\u201d; you know?<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> Yes.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> That\u2019s what <i>you<\/i> discovered. I don\u2019t think most of us understand that.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> I didn\u2019t either. I had been a Christian for nine years up to that point before Coach Dungy asked me that question. I didn\u2019t realize, \u201cWait a minute; this isn\u2019t just a job that I\u2019m going to.\u201d I enjoyed my job, by the way;\u2014<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Yes.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> \u2014I <i>loved<\/i> working at ESPN prior to that moment with Coach Dungy. I loved it even more <i>after<\/i>, because I knew I got to do a job that I enjoyed; I got to work in the toy department of the world\u2014as I call it\u2014like the sports world; are you kidding me?! But now, it became more purposeful work.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nI do miss being around others, who think differently. I try to actually, intentionally, have conversations with a lot of people, whether it\u2019s through social media or even just meeting up at different places that aren\u2019t followers of Christ of just kind of hear their perspective, and talk to them, and be able to witness to them the only way I can.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> And the amazing thing is you are doing it, now, in a different way\u2014\n\n<b>Ann:<\/b> Right.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> \u2014because your broadcast\/your podcast is influencing non-church\/non-Christian people. That\u2019s why you do it, because they are interested in sports\u2019 lives. You\u2019re using that platform to say, \u201cI may not be sitting in an office beside you; but man, we\u2019re impacting your life right now\u201d; right?<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> Yes.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Ann:<\/b> I think it starts with where we talked earlier about putting the jersey on correctly.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> Yes.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Ann:<\/b> Do you do that the first thing in the morning?\u2014like, \u201cOkay, I need to make sure\u201d\u2014as you said before\u2014\u201cthat Jesus is first. I\u2019m going to serve <i>Him<\/i> before I serve myself today\u201d?<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> I try to.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Ann:<\/b> Yes.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> We all mess that up, obviously. I just\/this past year, in 2020, thinking about discipline, and everything was kind of taken away from us in the pandemic\u2014this might be a horrible situation for a lot of people\u2014but this is, also, an opportunity to come out of this different as followers of Christ.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nFor me, I actually tried to\u2014again, I mess up occasionally; so I\u2019m not perfect\u2014but I try to make sure that the first 30 minutes every morning was with Him. I would spend time listening to worship music, or even just shutting down the phone and just\u2014sometimes, I am going for walks and doing this; but just praying\u2014spending that quiet time\u2014like that has to be\/now, it\u2019s almost become habit formed in a good way, where I have to have that time in the morning\/that quiet time with God. When I don\u2019t have that\u2014whether I\u2019m on vacation or things kind of get out of whack\u2014you feel it; you feel <i>that<\/i>.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nI think that, if I am going to talk about being a leader, and talk about\u2014especially leading in my house, but also leading others, or writing a book about leadership\u2014I\u2019ve got to be accountable to myself too. I\u2019ve got to make sure I\u2019ve got my priorities straight.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Yes; one of the stories that hit me about that was you turning down the opportunity to be a producer\u2014\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> Yes.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> \u2014because of how it would affect your family.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> Yes.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Talk about that.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> At ESPN, they give reviews. They have a mid-year review in the middle of the year; and then at the end of the year, you are either on the right track, moving ahead, or\u2014I forget the third one\u2014but it\u2019s like these levels that they kind of qualify you at in terms of your work; they evaluate you. You sometimes get a little bit of a raise or a bump: \u201cOh, you get a 3 percent raise for your review,\u201d\u2014or whatever.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nThat mid-year review in 2008\u2014it was scathing\u2014it was like, \u201cJason is all focused on himself. He doesn\u2019t care about his teammates. He\u2019s focused on the next job and not the job he is currently working at and getting paid for.\u201d I was like, \u201cOh my gosh!\u201d<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Bob:<\/b> Yikes!<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> It was <i>bad<\/i>; it was an eye-opener.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Was it true?<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> It was!<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Yes?<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> Yes; at the time, I didn\u2019t think it was: I\u2019m like, \u201cNO! You should have told me this. I was just trying to do what everybody else was doing and get the next job at ESPN.\u201d But it was true; I was <i>so<\/i> focused on Jason and wearing that uniform backwards.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nI will say\u2014that same year, I had this opportunity\u2014I wrote about me and this woman named Carol going after this manager job in the middle of 2008. Carol was 26; at the time, I was probably 34, I think, and more experienced. I\u2019m like, \u201cThere is no way that Carol is going to get this job over me.\u201d I went in there, with my chest out, thinking, \u201cI\u2019m good here.\u201d<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nCarol got the job. [Laughter] You talk about humbling; like I was like, \u201cWhoa! Okay; so I thought I deserved this.\u201d But Carol and I\u2014because we had such a great relationship, as coworkers, we agreed, no matter who was going to get this job, that we were going to support each other. We did. Carol got the job; I said, \u201cAlright; I can either be the bad guy\/the bully here, or I can just serve and be a support to you. I am here for you, however I can help\/however I can serve.\u201d<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nCarol was working with me on having this potential of becoming a producer at ESPN. All that title\u2014I\u2019m talking about the title, Producer. Producer is a general term that we can all use for all the behind-the-scenes people; but there is an actual title called Producer 1 that is a level that a lot of people strive towards, and I was trying to go there. I had this opportunity to become a Producer 1 in the summer 2008, and it was about a $30,000 pay increase. When you get that job, it\u2019s sort of\/it raises up, in my opinion, the level of how people view you in the work that you do; right?<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nI was all set to do it; and then I remember one day going in\u2014and they called it shadowing\u2014I would go in, and I would shadow another Producer and see what this job was going to be like. It was like 5 in the afternoon until 3 in the morning; it was Wednesday through Sunday, weekends; and it was not glamorous at all, but it was an opportunity to get this bump in pay; right? \u2014and this raise.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nI remember going in, and I shadowed. All it took was one day. The next day, I came in, and I said to Carol\u2014I said, \u201cI don\u2019t think I\u2019m going to be a Producer 1.\u201d She goes, \u201cWhy? What\u2019s wrong?\u201d I said, \u201cI see what\u2019s happening here. If I take this job\u201d\u2014which they didn\u2019t offer me the job, actually; I just assumed they were training me toward it\u2014I said, \u201cBut if they offer me this job and I take it, I will <i>never<\/i> see my daughter,\u201d\u2014in my opinion, I will never see her. She\u2019ll be in school during the day, and on the weekends, I\u2019m working; and I\u2019m there.\n\nI said, \u201cShe\u2019s four years old\u201d\u2014at that point. I said, \u201cIf I take this job, there is a very good chance that I might be stuck in this job for the next five to ten years\u2014however they want me to be in this job, and they control my hours.\u201d I can\u2019t say, \u201cGuys, I need to work 9 to 5 today, Monday through Friday.\u201d They are not going to do that; sports doesn\u2019t happen between 9 to 5, Monday through Friday; it happens nights and weekends.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nI made a point\/I made a choice; I remember going to a few of the bosses and saying, \u201cListen, I don\u2019t think I\u2019m going to continue my training to become a Producer 1.\u201d They said, \u201cWell, how come?\u201d I said, \u201cI can\u2019t take the chance of not being able to be around my kid and missing the next ten years of her life.\u201d They looked at me; and they were like, \u201cYou won\u2019t miss the next\u2026\u201d\u2014I said, \u201cYou can\u2019t guarantee that; can you?\u201d They said, \u201cWe can\u2019t guarantee that you can work the hours that you may want to work; but we\u2019ll do our best.\u201d I\u2019m like, \u201cI just can\u2019t; I\u2019m sorry.\u201d<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nI went back the next day. Carol said to me, \u201cWhat can I do for <i>you<\/i> to help your life be better so that you <i>can<\/i> be around your child?\u201d It changed my life; I said: \u201cCan I work on the NFL?\u201d \u201cCan I work Sunday through Thursday?\u201d \u201cCan I work 7 to 5 during the week, or 8 to 5, and then come home at night and be with my kid?\u201d She said, \u201cYes, absolutely; let\u2019s make that happen.\u201d I didn\u2019t get the $30,000 raise; but I look back now, and I did not miss my kid\u2014I was there for her, being able to be in the most pivotal moments, I think, in her life, especially when she needed a dad;\u2014\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Yes.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> \u2014because I didn\u2019t have a dad that was around or available. I wanted to make sure that she had what I couldn\u2019t have. If it meant not getting a $30,000 raise increase or a job title prestige\u2014whatever you want to call it\u2014I don\u2019t regret that, by the way, one iota. Other people, maybe, do\u2014I don\u2019t know\u2014but for me, I had to make that choice.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Yes; and I\u2019m guessing your daughter\u2014maybe, I\u2019m wrong\u2014does she even know that you\u2019ve made that choice?<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> I don\u2019t know if she does. It\u2019s weird; she won\u2019t read my books.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Ann:<\/b> She would know\u2014\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> She\u2019s a teenager. I don\u2019t know; she doesn\u2019t read anything. [Laughter]\n\n<b>Ann:<\/b> But she would know, had you made that decision and taken that job,\u2014\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> Absolutely.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Ann:<\/b> \u2014because she wouldn\u2019t have a relationship with you.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> And leadership is all the little behind-the-scene decisions that literally change people\u2019s lives. Way to go!<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> Thanks, man.\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> That was a <i>big<\/i> decision.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> It was. I look back now, and I recognize\u2014you know my daughter is 16, and she is probably like, \u201cWhatever, Dad!\u201d which is pretty much the response I get on everything\u2014\u201cWhatever, Dad!\u201d [Laughter] But I hope, when she is 24\/25, and we can sit down and really\u2014and she maybe gets married, and has kids of her own\u2014that she sees and understands that it\u2019s these little moments and these decisions that you can make in your life that can make the difference between\u2014who knows?\u2014maybe not even being able to have a relationship with her; you know?<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Right.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> That was big for me, especially with what I went through with my own dad.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Right.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Bob:<\/b> Just don\u2019t do what Dave Wilson would do, and go to her and say, \u201cYou know, you owe me $300,000 because I stayed home.\u201d [Laughter]<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> \u201cLet me do the math here.\u201d [Laughter]\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Ten years, 30 grand\u2014that\u2019s about right. [Laughter]\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> Yes; maybe, she\u2019ll pay me back someday.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Bob:<\/b> Jason, thank you for being with us. These are <i>great<\/i> leadership principles for moms, dads\u2014for every one of us.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Ann:<\/b> Right.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Dave:<\/b> Oh, yes!<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Bob:<\/b> Thank you.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Jason:<\/b> Thank you.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<b>Bob:<\/b> Jason\u2019s book, again, is called <i>The Uniform of Leadership: Lessons on True Success from My ESPN Life<\/i>. We\u2019ve got copies of the book available to you in our <i>FamilyLife Today<\/i> Resource Center. You can request your copy, online, at FamilyLifeToday.com; or you can call to order: 1-800-FL-TODAY is our number. Again, get a copy of Jason Romano\u2019s book, <i>The Uniform of Leadership<\/i>. Order online at FamilyLifeToday.com; or call to order: 1-800-358-6329\u2014that\u2019s 1-800-\u201cF\u201d as in family, \u201cL\u201d as in life, and then the word, \u201cTODAY.\u201d<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nI wish our listeners could be here each week as we get letters, here, at FamilyLife<sup>\u00ae<\/sup> from listeners\/get emails that folks send in\u2014people, who tell us, \u201cThe conversation you had on this particular subject on this particular day, God used that in my life in a dramatic way. It was exactly what I needed to hear. I\u2019ve made the changes; I\u2019ve pivoted. I\u2019ve\/I was reminded of what\u2019s true; I\u2019m starting to live that out.\u201d There are people whose lives are headed in a different direction today because God used <i>FamilyLife Today<\/i> to interact with them.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nI just want to say, \u201cThank you,\u201d to those of you who are, not only listeners to <i>FamilyLife Today<\/i>, but the financial supporters of this ministry\u2014those of you who may have been impacted by this ministry yourself, and you want to make sure others receive the same benefit\u2014those of you who support us financially, with a one-time donation or on a monthly basis as Legacy Partners, we are so grateful for you.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nWe talked earlier this week about the issue of pornography and the pandemic that exists in our culture around pornography. Joe Rigney was our guest; and his book, which is called <i>More Than a Battle<\/i>\u2014we\u2019re making that book available as a thank-you gift this week to any of you who can support the work of <i>FamilyLife Today<\/i>. You can make your donation, online, at FamilyLifeToday.com; or you can call 1-800-FL-TODAY to donate.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nThis book is an important book for every person to read because all of us\u2014whether we are struggling with this issue or not\u2014we\u2019re interacting with people who are. This book gives guidance on how to break free from the bondage that so many experience when it comes to pornography. Again, the title of the book is <i>More Than a Battle<\/i>. It is our gift to you when you make a donation to support <i>FamilyLife Today<\/i> this week. Thanks, in advance, for that donation. You can donate, online, at FamilyLifeToday.com; or call 1-800-FL-TODAY.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nWe hope you have a great weekend. Hope you and your family are somehow able to worship together with your local church this weekend, and I hope you can join us back on Monday when we\u2019re going to talk football again, a little bit, because Derwin Gray, who used to play in the NFL, is going to be with us. He is a pastor now in North Carolina. He\u2019s written a book, looking at what makes up the good life; and it\u2019s different than what you might imagine. Join us as we talk with Derwin about that on Monday.\n\nI want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch. We got some help from Justin Adams this week as well. On behalf of our hosts, Dave and Ann Wilson, I\u2019m Bob Lepine. We will see you back next time for another edition of <i>FamilyLife Today<\/i>.<span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\n<i>FamilyLife Today<\/i> is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas; a Cru<sup>\u00ae <\/sup>Ministry. Help for today. Hope for tomorrow.\n\nWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs? <span class=\"Apple-converted-space\">\u00a0<\/span>\n\nCopyright <sup>\u00a9<\/sup> 2021 FamilyLife. 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