{"id":306656,"date":"2021-01-01T07:00:05","date_gmt":"2021-01-01T12:00:05","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/%series%\/no-where-else-to-go-but-jesus\/"},"modified":"2021-01-01T07:00:05","modified_gmt":"2021-01-01T12:00:05","slug":"no-where-else-to-go-but-jesus","status":"publish","type":"podcast","link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/no-where-else-to-go-but-jesus\/","title":{"rendered":"No Where Else To Go, But Jesus"},"content":{"rendered":"","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>How do you keep walking forward, when all hope seems gone? Hear the dramatic story of Katherine James as she recalls how the Lord walked alongside her during the dark days of her son&#8217;s drug addiction.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":91,"featured_media":294104,"menu_order":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","template":"","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","inline_featured_image":false,"_uag_custom_page_level_css":"","episode_type":"","audio_file":"https:\/\/mp3.familylife.com\/fl2021-01-01.mp3","cover_image":"","cover_image_id":"","duration":"00:29:12","filesize":"26.73M","filesize_raw":"28031897","date_recorded":"","explicit":"","block":""},"categories":[2840,2841,2834],"tags":[5924],"podcast_series":[8418],"cwp_profile":[9682],"series":[2101],"class_list":["post-306656","podcast","type-podcast","status-publish","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-addiction","category-anger-and-rebellion","category-praying-for-your-children","tag-drug-addiction","podcast_series-a-prayer-for-orion","cwp_profile-katherine-james","series-familylife-today"],"acf":[],"episode_featured_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/09\/FLT-Podcast-Cover-2-508x508-3.jpg?w=508","episode_player_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2023\/02\/image-scaled.jpg","download_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-download\/306656\/no-where-else-to-go-but-jesus","player_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-player\/306656\/no-where-else-to-go-but-jesus","audio_player":null,"episode_data":{"playerMode":"light","subscribeUrls":{"apple_podcasts":{"key":"apple_podcasts","url":"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303?mt=2&app=podcast","label":"Apple Podcasts","class":"apple_podcasts","icon":"apple-podcasts.png"},"google_podcasts":{"key":"google_podcasts","url":"","label":"Google Podcasts","class":"google_podcasts","icon":"google-podcasts.png"},"spotify":{"key":"spotify","url":"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm","label":"Spotify","class":"spotify","icon":"spotify.png"},"youtube":{"key":"youtube","url":"","label":"YouTube","class":"youtube","icon":"youtube.png"}},"rssFeedUrl":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/feed\/podcast\/familylife-today","embedCode":"<blockquote class=\"wp-embedded-content\" data-secret=\"3ZItuJM62I\"><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/no-where-else-to-go-but-jesus\/\">No Where Else To Go, But Jesus<\/a><\/blockquote><iframe sandbox=\"allow-scripts\" security=\"restricted\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/no-where-else-to-go-but-jesus\/embed\/#?secret=3ZItuJM62I\" width=\"500\" height=\"350\" title=\"&#8220;No Where Else To Go, But Jesus&#8221; &#8212; FamilyLife\u00ae - A Cru Ministry\" data-secret=\"3ZItuJM62I\" frameborder=\"0\" marginwidth=\"0\" marginheight=\"0\" scrolling=\"no\" class=\"wp-embedded-content\"><\/iframe><script>\n\/*! This file is auto-generated *\/\n!function(d,l){\"use strict\";l.querySelector&&d.addEventListener&&\"undefined\"!=typeof URL&&(d.wp=d.wp||{},d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage||(d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage=function(e){var t=e.data;if((t||t.secret||t.message||t.value)&&!\/[^a-zA-Z0-9]\/.test(t.secret)){for(var s,r,n,a=l.querySelectorAll('iframe[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),o=l.querySelectorAll('blockquote[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),c=new RegExp(\"^https?:$\",\"i\"),i=0;i<o.length;i++)o[i].style.display=\"none\";for(i=0;i<a.length;i++)s=a[i],e.source===s.contentWindow&&(s.removeAttribute(\"style\"),\"height\"===t.message?(1e3<(r=parseInt(t.value,10))?r=1e3:~~r<200&&(r=200),s.height=r):\"link\"===t.message&&(r=new URL(s.getAttribute(\"src\")),n=new URL(t.value),c.test(n.protocol))&&n.host===r.host&&l.activeElement===s&&(d.top.location.href=t.value))}},d.addEventListener(\"message\",d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage,!1),l.addEventListener(\"DOMContentLoaded\",function(){for(var e,t,s=l.querySelectorAll(\"iframe.wp-embedded-content\"),r=0;r<s.length;r++)(t=(e=s[r]).getAttribute(\"data-secret\"))||(t=Math.random().toString(36).substring(2,12),e.src+=\"#?secret=\"+t,e.setAttribute(\"data-secret\",t)),e.contentWindow.postMessage({message:\"ready\",secret:t},\"*\")},!1)))}(window,document);\n\/\/# sourceURL=https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-includes\/js\/wp-embed.min.js\n<\/script>\n"},"spectra_custom_meta":{"_wp_page_template":["default"],"transcript_url":["https:\/\/transcript.familylife.com\/fl2021-01-01.pdf"],"audio_file":["https:\/\/mp3.familylife.com\/fl2021-01-01.mp3"],"transcript_content":["<strong>Bob: <\/strong>When Katherine James\u2019 son started experimenting with drugs while he was in high school, Katherine was alarmed; because she knew about his addictive personality. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> The first overdose was one of those things, where all of these things had to happen for him to have lived; he did, but he went into septic shock. He was on life support for three or four days. The doctor actually said that this was the worst overdose he had ever seen, which was kind of like, \u201cWhat do you mean?\u201d That\u2019s when my faith was shaken to its <em>core<\/em>.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> This is <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> for Friday, January 1<sup>st<\/sup>. Our hosts are Dave and Ann Wilson; I'm Bob Lepine. You can find us online at FamilyLifeToday.com. What do we do, as parents, if a child\u2019s substance abuse has gotten completely out of control and become life-threatening? How do we respond? We\u2019ll talk with Katherine James about that today. Stay with us. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd welcome to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. Thanks for joining us. I have to think that we have some parents listening this week, who are hearing the story that we\u2019re sharing and going, \u201cThat\u2019s our story; we\u2019ve had the same thing happen.\u201d Maybe, it\u2019s happening now; and you\u2019re anxious, and you\u2019re fearful, and you want to be wise. You want to do anything and everything you can to keep a child from dangerous, destructive behavior. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYet, there\u2019s no guarantee that there\u2019s anything you <em>can<\/em> do. I\u2019ve walked with parents, who have had kids\u2014you guys have too\u2014parents, who have had kids in the middle of drug addiction, where they put them in programs. Kids go through the programs; they come out; they lapse back over and over again. The parents are at their wits end, going, \u201cWe\u2019d do anything to stop this.\u201d If we knew the magic words, we\u2019d tell you the magic words; but in some cases, there just aren\u2019t any magic words. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I think parents are looking for hope, and they\u2019d love to have a quick fix. I talk to so many parents, who think, \u201cGod could do this! He could miraculously change things, and heal my son or daughter with a spoken word.\u201d But it doesn\u2019t always happen like that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> It does sometimes happen like that; but most of the time, it seems like there\u2019s a process. I\u2019m glad we\u2019re talking about it; because so often, the church is silent, and quiet, and afraid. This program\u2019s going to be helpful to a lot of people; you need to share it with people. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes; Katherine James is joining us this week on <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. Welcome back. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> Thanks.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Katherine is a mom; she\u2019s a writer. She\u2019s a fellow staff member with us on staff of Cru<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>. She\u2019s written a book called <em>A Prayer for Orion<\/em>, which is, as I said, a memoir that no mom ever wants to have to write. It\u2019s about your youngest son. It began as kind of dabbling with what kids were dabbling with in middle school, which was smoking weed. You learned about it; you confronted him. You thought maybe the behavior had self-corrected. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThen, you started to find evidence; you found a homemade bong hidden in the insulation in the crawlspace outside of his room. It was back to another confrontation and more grounding. I\u2019m sure you and your husband were wondering, \u201cWhat can <em>we<\/em> do? <em>Is<\/em> there something we can do that will bring this behavior to an end?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Yes; yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I\u2019m interested in the title. When I first read it, I thought Orion was your son. Why <em>A Prayer for Orion<\/em>?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> During this time, one of the most powerful things I feel like God taught me was, basically, the power of prayer. I began praying constantly, and so did my husband. We have this huge bay window in the front of our house. If you look up around January, you can see the constellation Orion\u2014and the belt of Orion\u2014basically, it has three stars right in a row. We have three kids, and I used to sort of use the stars as kind of naming my children as I prayed for each one. That\u2019s kind of where it began; it was sort of a working title to begin with, and then ended up using it. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I don\u2019t know if I\u2019ve ever read an opening paragraph quite like this. Obviously, as Bob has walked us through, started with smoking weed; but it went beyond that. I thought, when I read this\u2014first of all, we\u2019re an author; and we can\u2019t write anything like this\u2014\u201cThis is genius; this is beautiful, this is creative. What a way to introduce the reader to this story.\u201d Is it okay if I read it?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> Please. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> [Reading book] Chapter title: \u201cSick.\u201d \u201cThey say that when you tie a rubber tube around an upper arm, you feel the lub the way a river feels a rock\u2014a swish up, and over, or around\u2014the river tightens and narrows. The weight behind if shoots out water like the universe shoots out stars, but the gritty fog of sediment tells the whole story. The needle goes in; rubber tube\u2014pull it tight\u2014flatten the arm; needle.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou introduce to the reader\u2014we don\u2019t know yet\u2014but: \u201cWhat in the world is this about?\u201d Obviously, your son went from weed to harder drugs. Tell us about that journey.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> Yes; most of you have probably heard about the opiate epidemic, which has gotten worse and worse. Goodness, I don\u2019t know how many lives now; but in 2017, something like 70,000 lives were lost to opiate overdoses. Actually, COVID has increased that amount. We\u2019re not talking about it that much, because there are other things going on in the news; it is <em>awful<\/em>.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tOne of the things that high school kids have started doing is, basically, popping pills from their parents\u2019 medicine cabinet. Sometimes, that will be opiate painkillers and that sort of thing; they are very easy to access. There\u2019s also other things: that at parties, they\u2019re tossing around Mollies; and there\u2019s all these psychedelic drugs\u2014acid and that sort of thing. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIn certain groups, it\u2019s really very, very normal to do this; pills are seen as not being all that dangerous, really. For a kid like my son, as I talked about before, he really does have an addictive personality. Somebody like him, who takes a pill, it turns into, \u201cI need another one.\u201d Somebody else, it\u2019s like, \u201cOh, that was kind of interesting,\u201d and they go home. [For our son,] it started with weed, and then who knows how it escalated into something far worse. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe loved his friends; they were <em>great<\/em>. We ended up with a lot of the kids, that he was hanging out with and our girls were hanging out with, in our home; because they would come for Bible studies. We talked to them, and some of them came to Christ and started growing. They\u2019re just doing wonderful, most of them. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAt the same point, there were other kids that our son was hanging out with, who were doing these things. We don\u2019t know exactly how it started, or what pills they were taking\u2014or what have you\u2014that kind of thing. Ultimately, I guess he started taking like a Percocet or that sort of thing. They can be prescribed from doctors for pain. You get it from your grandmother\u2019s medicine cabinet; those are the Oxycodone\/that kind of thing. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIf they get it on the street, you don\u2019t know what they\u2019re made up of. Even pills\u2014this is something I didn\u2019t learn until recently\u2014even pills on the street can have something called Fentanyl in them. Fentanyl is what\u2019s responsible for a lot of the overdose deaths\u2014it\u2019s very strong\u201450-100 times stronger than heroin. What happens is\u2014the pills\u2014harder to get\/more expensive\u2014so they start going to heroin on the street, which is much, much cheaper. Sometimes the heroin is laced with Fentanyl. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I was shocked in the book that you even said some of the dealers will put so much Fentanyl, or another substance, in the drug that, if someone overdoses or dies, it gives them a good reputation?\u2014like, \u201cWhat is <em>that<\/em>?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> Yes; it gets darker, and darker, and darker; it\u2019s shocking. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tA dealer\u2014what happens with heroin is\u2014they are in these little cellophane\/sort of little packets\u2014they\u2019re tiny. On the packets, they\u2019ll stamp their particular brand. Say you start producing heroin, or whatever, in these little packets; you\u2019re going to stamp it with your name\u2014something like that\u2014or you\u2019ll name it something: \u201cMickey Mouse\u201d\u2014whatever\u2014so they\u2019ll know it\u2019s coming from <em>you<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIf you include in your batch for that week some Fentanyl\u2014or something particularly strong in them\u2014and a couple people overdose and die or just overdose, people know that\u2019s a good batch; so they\u2019ll go to <em>you<\/em> for the rest of it. It\u2019s a horrible thing, but it sells. They make more money that way. A couple intentional overdoses are worth selling off bags to make thousands of dollars. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Can you imagine that you ever thought you would know about this?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> I know; right?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> It\u2019s just a <em>whole<\/em> world. With the opiate epidemic going on, it was just, \u201cWow.\u201d It kind of blew my mind how bad it was. Back when I was growing up, it was just like, \u201cThe city,\u201d\u2014maybe a couple streets that have this stuff, but\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Was your reaction any different? You told us earlier that, when you caught him with weed\u2014now it\u2019s heroin\u2014is it a different reaction for you? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> Yes, yes; that was the mother of all drugs. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> How did you catch him? How did you know he was using?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> You know what? It\u2019s all so complicated in the situation. His friends actually said, \u201cYou need to tell your parents that you\u2019re doing heroin.\u201d He sat down next to us and he told us, and he cried\u2014he said, \u201cI\u2019m doing heroin.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Why would his friends tell him to tell you guys? And these are friends that are hanging out at your house; is that right?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> Yes; they had come to Christ, so they really cared for him. They were really worried about him. I don\u2019t think any of them were into the really hard drugs. Somehow, he had gotten in. Like I said before, he\u2019s an addictive kid; we knew he was going to go in that direction, and he did. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tOnce he told us, my first reaction was, \u201cYou\u2019re going to rehab.\u201d To me, at that point, that\u2019s what you do\u2014you go to rehab\u2014which, oftentimes, you should. Rick was able to see things a little clearer at that point. He knew that our son, because of who he is\u2014and as we know, every kid is different\u2014that he would just run, and then he wouldn\u2019t stay because of his anxiety issues. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tMostly, what we told him\u2014I don\u2019t remember as far as what he was able and not able to do\u2014but we tested him constantly, like every day. I got the tests that tested for every possible drug that you take, and then I tested him. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> He was saying, \u201cI want help, and I\u2019ll get tested. I want you to help me with this.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> Yes; yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> And his friends were encouraging that. Again, I\u2019m guessing you\u2019re thinking, \u201cOkay; as long as we\u2019re testing him, and he wants help, then we\u2019re going to win this battle.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Yes; yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>But that\u2019s not exactly the direction it went. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> No; because of the <em>physical<\/em> addiction. I think, psychologically, many addicts\/most addicts want out, but it\u2019s a physical thing. At that point, we just started testing him every day. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> You\u2019re praying; you\u2019re looking up, even in a beautiful way, at the sky, and you\u2019re talking to God about your son, not for days or weeks\u2014years\u2014right? How did that go? It doesn\u2019t seem like He\u2019s hearing or answering your prayer. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> Yes; oh, boy. You know, when you go through these difficult times, everything become more alive. You are awake and sensitive to the Holy Spirit and what\u2019s happening around you, because you\u2019re desperate\/because you\u2019re constantly in prayer. What happened was\u2014we would get little encouragements, here and there\u2014kind of like God reminding us, \u201cYes; I\u2019m here. I\u2019m here,\u201d even though, for all intents and purposes, it seemed like He was nowhere.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> You started a prayer group at church?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> Yes; mostly, it was parents; people who love people, who are battling addictions; some were in prison; some were still living at home; older kids\/younger kids\u2014all sorts of things. Once you let the word out, it\u2019s such a need. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIn the same way, as we began to pray, we saw things happening in these kids\u2019 lives that were pretty amazing. As of today, none of them died. The fact that they\u2019re all alive, if you understand the culture and you understand what\u2019s going on, is a miracle that they\u2019re all living, so pray, pray, pray!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThere isn\u2019t any other sure thing. You can try to do all the right things\u2014it\u2019s <em>very<\/em> important to get wisdom from other parents, and read things, and all of that\u2014very, very important; and do your research\u2014but at the same time, the only thing that\u2019s for <em>sure<\/em> is prayer\u2014and that this isn\u2019t out of the blue; there\u2019s nothing random about this. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> You mention that he didn\u2019t just overdose <em>once<\/em>. Sometimes, you read that, and you\u2019re like, \u201cHe died.\u201d But he overdosed and did several times?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> Yes; he did. The first overdose was one of those things, where\u2014I think I talk about it in the book\u2014where all of these things had to happen for him to have lived, and he did. He was in the ICU; he was on life support for three or four days. We prayed; the whole waiting room was filled with mostly his friends, who had come to Christ\/were walking with God. Little by little, things started to happen with his body. He needed to get his blood pressure up; he went into septic shock. The doctor actually said that this was the worst overdose that he\u2019d seen where anybody lived through it. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tOne year later, I was knocking on his door in the morning to wake him up; and he wasn\u2019t answering. My husband came and kicked it in. He was blue; at that point, my husband ran towards him; and I ran away from him\u2014just the different kind of impulses that we had. He\u2019s trying to revive him, and I just leave. It was so scary! I did see him when the door came down, and I saw his blue face; and I didn\u2019t <em>want<\/em> to see anymore. I immediately called 911; but at the same point, I\u2019m physically just melting. My knees are completely giving way. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAll I could think was\u2014because things had been going really well before that\u2014I\u2019d been thanking God for how well he was doing! At that point, all I could think was, \u201cAre you real, God? I\u2019ve been thanking You this whole time, and then this. What is going on? How could You possibly let this happen?\u201d That\u2019s when my faith was shaken to its <em>core<\/em>, and it was either going to disappear or grow stronger. This is an <em>amazing<\/em> thing that God did at that moment. Rick came over to me, as the paramedics were going up the stairs, I guess. He said, \u201cDon\u2019t worry; I\u2019ll believe for you.\u201d That might not make any sense; but at the time, it was\/I was like, \u201cOkay, God; You\u2019re even going to get me through this.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> After that second overdose, were you afraid to be hopeful again?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> Yes, yes. I was afraid to be hopeful again after that. One of the things that became a revelation for me was that my \u201cIf only-s\u201d became \u201cEven ifs.\u201d My \u201cIf only-s\u201d\u2014which I\u2019d been struggling with since Day One\u2014were: \u201cIf only I\u2019d done this differently,\u201d or \u201c\u2026we\u2019d done this differently...\u201d \u201cIf only we\u2019d seen things earlier\u2026\u201d \u201cIf only we\u2019d been harder on him\u2026\u201d\u2014or whatever it was\u2014which was doing nothing except polluting my prayer life. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThese turned into an \u201cEven if\u2026\u201d It\u2019s kind of like Jesus at Gethsemane. \u201cPlease take this from Me; but not My will, but Yours.\u201d I was able to come to Christ\/to Jesus and say, \u201cEven if our son dies\u2014it will be the most painful thing I\u2019ll ever go through\u2014but even if our son dies, I\u2019m okay; heaven\u2019s okay. I\u2019m going to be good.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> That\u2019s <em>huge<\/em>.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> And it was <em>amazing<\/em>\u2014it just relieved all of the fear; I wasn\u2019t afraid anymore!\u2014it was okay; you know, it was okay. I knew it would be hard, but it was okay. Once you\u2019re <em>not<\/em> afraid of the worst thing you could imagine, the freedom that comes is wonderful\u2014and the sense of peace\u2014you <em>are<\/em> walking with God at that point. You\u2019re not just, \u201cAlright; if that\u2019s what You want, I\u2019ll do it, or whatever; Your will be done.\u201d No; it was like, \u201cYou\u2019re going to take care of me in ways I could <em>never<\/em> imagine.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> It seems like that\u2019s a point, as parents, that we all need to come to. It\u2019s like a surrendering of everything\/of our kids. That\u2019s a <em>hard<\/em> thing to do; because it\u2019s <em>releasing<\/em> your child to God\u2014whether they have an addiction\/whether they\u2019ve walked away from God\u2014wherever they are in life. That\u2019s a hard place to come to. Is that the place you\u2019d encourage parents to get to?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> I would, hands down.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> And yet, you didn\u2019t get there overnight. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> Did not get there overnight. Very hard to get to; but if you\u2019re struggling right now in that place of complete uncertainty and fear, and you don\u2019t know what\u2019s going to happen, and there\u2019s tumult at home or whatever\u2014that is a place you want to get to. Get there by prayer\u2014constant, constant prayer\u2014and read Scripture. Hebrews 11 is great, talking about the faith. Some people didn\u2019t experience the answers to their prayers in the very end, but they knew a <em>better<\/em> future was coming for them.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> His second time in the hospital was a turning point of sorts; wasn\u2019t it?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> Yes; it was such a gradual thing. He got jobs that he held down well. He\u2019d tell us things; he got a little more open about what was going on\u2014he said somebody had come into where he was working and offered him pills; and he was mad at the guy, because he knew the guy <em>knew<\/em> that he was trying not to use\u2014things like that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt\u2019s interesting\u2014we always wanted and expected him to have this miraculous spiritual awakening and start leading Bible studies with his dad\u2014things like that\/that\u2014\u201cThis is how it works for the Christian; they, all of a sudden, discover the Spirit-filled life, and then everything\u2019s perfect.\u201d It wasn\u2019t at all like that; it was very, very slow. He\u2019s still a very internal person, but his heart\u2019s good.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tMore than one time, I feel like God gave me the image of a turtle. [Laughs] I was praying\u2014it finally came to me: \u201cI should pray that, like a turtle, he would always go slow, slow, in the right direction. I don\u2019t care how slow it is, but always let him go in the right direction and never back\u201d; right? I was praying this as I was walking through a park one day. Got in the car, headed out. I had to stop; because this little turtle was, literally,\u00a0 walking on the road, five feet in front of the car. It was going so slow, I had to pick it up and carry it to the other side of the road. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut things like that\u2014slowly, you could tell things were headed in the right direction. Even now, though, there\u2019s always going to be a little bit of a fear there that something could happen. But I do\/I think that I\u2019ve gotten to that place, where my first reaction is to go back to, \u201cEven if\u2026\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Today, he\u2019s living independently. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> He\u2019s married. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> He\u2019s married; has a little baby girl.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> And as far as you know, substance use is a part of the past, not a part of the present. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> No; he\u2019s doing really well; so thankful.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> And the story is not over. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> No. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> I talk to parents, all the time, who are in the middle of difficult situations with a prodigal\/with somebody, who\u2019s using\u2014whatever their circumstance is\u2014there\u2019s a broken heart in that conversation. There\u2019s also a sense of hopelessness. I have to look at them and say, \u201cThe story\u2019s not over. We don\u2019t know what God\u2019s going to do. There\u2019s still hope. Keep crying out; keep interceding; keep pointing him in the right direction; keep asking God for wisdom.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> You\u2019re walking around the walls of Jericho; not a single brick\u2019s fallen. You\u2019ve got to be thinking, \u201cJust give me, at least, a brick!\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> \u201c\u2026just a brick.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> But this could be Day Six. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u2014and your prayers are being <em>heard<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> Yes, yes, yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> He had to know mom was writing a book, telling the story.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> He did. I asked if he wanted to vet it, and he took it to read. He got through the first couple pages; and he said, \u201cI\u2019m sorry. I can\u2019t read it.\u201d I said, \u201cI\u2019m so sorry I did that to you.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> But he was okay; he signed off on you telling this story.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> Yes, yes. And all of his friends, who are in here as well\u2014I ran it by them\u2014so everybody signed off.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Now, there are a lot of moms and dads\u2014and maybe a lot of addicts\u2014who are going to read this and get hope because of the story.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Thanks for writing it. Thanks for coming here, and thanks for sharing your story. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> Thank you. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> We\u2019ve got copies of Katherine\u2019s book, which is called <em>A Prayer for Orion: A Son\u2019s Addiction and a Mother\u2019s Love<\/em>. You can order it from us, online, at FamilyLifeToday.com. Again, our website: FamilyLifeToday.com. You\u2019ll find additional resources there for parents, whose kids have become involved with substance abuse: other books, articles, resources that we have available. Again, go to FamilyLifeToday.com for more information. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIf we can pray for you and your family, if you\u2019re going through this or <em>any<\/em> challenge, it would be a privilege to be able to pray for your family in the new year. Get in touch with us and let us know how we can be praying for you. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tOf course, today is the first day of 2021, and we\u2019re all praying that 2021 will be a different year\/a better year than 2020 was. 2020 was <em>challenging<\/em>; it was hard for many of us. Yet, God was with us and sustained us as He always does; we\u2019re grateful for that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe do want to say, \u201cThank you,\u201d to those of you who, over the last 30 days, have responded to the matching-gift challenge that we had made available to us, here at FamilyLife<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>. We don\u2019t have the final total yet; because many of you mailed in donations, and we\u2019re waiting for those donations to arrive to see if we did, in fact, take full advantage of that matching gift. Pray for that, if you would; and thanks, again, to those of you who donated. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tPray for us in the new year ahead as we look to be innovative and creative about how we can most effectively minister to marriages and families\u2014that God will open new doors as He has already been doing for us in so many ways\u2014pray that 2021 will be a fruitful year of ministry for us, here at FamilyLife. Again, anytime we can help you, please do get in touch with us and let us know. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe hope you have a great weekend. I hope you and your family are able to worship together in your local church this weekend. And I hope you can join us back on Monday when Dave and Ann Wilson are going to share with us about their engagement; about the very first <em>Weekend to Remember<\/em><sup>\u00ae<\/sup> marriage getaway they ever went to, back before they were married; and then about the first tumultuous months of marriage, where eventually they looked at each other and said, \u201cWe made a <em>huge<\/em> mistake.\u201d We\u2019ll hear that story Monday. I hope you can tune in for that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch, along with our entire broadcast production team. On behalf of our hosts, Dave and Ann Wilson, I\u2019m Bob Lepine. We will see you back next time for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas; a Cru<sup>\u00ae <\/sup>Ministry. Help for today. Hope for tomorrow.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright <sup>\u00a9<\/sup> 2020 FamilyLife. All rights reserved.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/\">www.FamilyLife.com<\/a>\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\n\t\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\t1\n\t\t\t\t<\/p>"],"_seopress_titles_title":[""],"_seopress_titles_desc":[""],"_seopress_robots_index":[""],"duration":["00:29:12"],"show_notes":[""],"_thumbnail_id":["294104"],"filesize":["26.73M"],"filesize_raw":["28031897"],"_uag_css_file_name":["uag-css-306656.css"],"_uag_js_file_name":["uag-js-306656.js"],"_uag_page_assets":["a:9:{s:3:\"css\";s:82560:\".wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape-top svg{width: calc( 100% + 1.3px );}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape.uagb-container__shape-top .uagb-container__shape-fill{fill: rgba(51,51,51,1);}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape-bottom svg{width: calc( 100% + 1.3px );}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape.uagb-container__shape-bottom 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do you keep walking forward, when all hope seems gone? Hear the dramatic story of Katherine James as she recalls how the Lord walked alongside her during the dark days of her son's drug addiction.","meta_box":{"show_notes":"","transcript_url":"https:\/\/transcript.familylife.com\/fl2021-01-01.pdf","transcript_content":"<strong>Bob: <\/strong>When Katherine James\u2019 son started experimenting with drugs while he was in high school, Katherine was alarmed; because she knew about his addictive personality. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> The first overdose was one of those things, where all of these things had to happen for him to have lived; he did, but he went into septic shock. He was on life support for three or four days. The doctor actually said that this was the worst overdose he had ever seen, which was kind of like, \u201cWhat do you mean?\u201d That\u2019s when my faith was shaken to its <em>core<\/em>.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> This is <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> for Friday, January 1<sup>st<\/sup>. Our hosts are Dave and Ann Wilson; I'm Bob Lepine. You can find us online at FamilyLifeToday.com. What do we do, as parents, if a child\u2019s substance abuse has gotten completely out of control and become life-threatening? How do we respond? We\u2019ll talk with Katherine James about that today. Stay with us. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd welcome to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. Thanks for joining us. I have to think that we have some parents listening this week, who are hearing the story that we\u2019re sharing and going, \u201cThat\u2019s our story; we\u2019ve had the same thing happen.\u201d Maybe, it\u2019s happening now; and you\u2019re anxious, and you\u2019re fearful, and you want to be wise. You want to do anything and everything you can to keep a child from dangerous, destructive behavior. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYet, there\u2019s no guarantee that there\u2019s anything you <em>can<\/em> do. I\u2019ve walked with parents, who have had kids\u2014you guys have too\u2014parents, who have had kids in the middle of drug addiction, where they put them in programs. Kids go through the programs; they come out; they lapse back over and over again. The parents are at their wits end, going, \u201cWe\u2019d do anything to stop this.\u201d If we knew the magic words, we\u2019d tell you the magic words; but in some cases, there just aren\u2019t any magic words. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I think parents are looking for hope, and they\u2019d love to have a quick fix. I talk to so many parents, who think, \u201cGod could do this! He could miraculously change things, and heal my son or daughter with a spoken word.\u201d But it doesn\u2019t always happen like that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> It does sometimes happen like that; but most of the time, it seems like there\u2019s a process. I\u2019m glad we\u2019re talking about it; because so often, the church is silent, and quiet, and afraid. This program\u2019s going to be helpful to a lot of people; you need to share it with people. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes; Katherine James is joining us this week on <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. Welcome back. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> Thanks.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Katherine is a mom; she\u2019s a writer. She\u2019s a fellow staff member with us on staff of Cru<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>. She\u2019s written a book called <em>A Prayer for Orion<\/em>, which is, as I said, a memoir that no mom ever wants to have to write. It\u2019s about your youngest son. It began as kind of dabbling with what kids were dabbling with in middle school, which was smoking weed. You learned about it; you confronted him. You thought maybe the behavior had self-corrected. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThen, you started to find evidence; you found a homemade bong hidden in the insulation in the crawlspace outside of his room. It was back to another confrontation and more grounding. I\u2019m sure you and your husband were wondering, \u201cWhat can <em>we<\/em> do? <em>Is<\/em> there something we can do that will bring this behavior to an end?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Yes; yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I\u2019m interested in the title. When I first read it, I thought Orion was your son. Why <em>A Prayer for Orion<\/em>?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> During this time, one of the most powerful things I feel like God taught me was, basically, the power of prayer. I began praying constantly, and so did my husband. We have this huge bay window in the front of our house. If you look up around January, you can see the constellation Orion\u2014and the belt of Orion\u2014basically, it has three stars right in a row. We have three kids, and I used to sort of use the stars as kind of naming my children as I prayed for each one. That\u2019s kind of where it began; it was sort of a working title to begin with, and then ended up using it. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I don\u2019t know if I\u2019ve ever read an opening paragraph quite like this. Obviously, as Bob has walked us through, started with smoking weed; but it went beyond that. I thought, when I read this\u2014first of all, we\u2019re an author; and we can\u2019t write anything like this\u2014\u201cThis is genius; this is beautiful, this is creative. What a way to introduce the reader to this story.\u201d Is it okay if I read it?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> Please. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> [Reading book] Chapter title: \u201cSick.\u201d \u201cThey say that when you tie a rubber tube around an upper arm, you feel the lub the way a river feels a rock\u2014a swish up, and over, or around\u2014the river tightens and narrows. The weight behind if shoots out water like the universe shoots out stars, but the gritty fog of sediment tells the whole story. The needle goes in; rubber tube\u2014pull it tight\u2014flatten the arm; needle.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou introduce to the reader\u2014we don\u2019t know yet\u2014but: \u201cWhat in the world is this about?\u201d Obviously, your son went from weed to harder drugs. Tell us about that journey.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> Yes; most of you have probably heard about the opiate epidemic, which has gotten worse and worse. Goodness, I don\u2019t know how many lives now; but in 2017, something like 70,000 lives were lost to opiate overdoses. Actually, COVID has increased that amount. We\u2019re not talking about it that much, because there are other things going on in the news; it is <em>awful<\/em>.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tOne of the things that high school kids have started doing is, basically, popping pills from their parents\u2019 medicine cabinet. Sometimes, that will be opiate painkillers and that sort of thing; they are very easy to access. There\u2019s also other things: that at parties, they\u2019re tossing around Mollies; and there\u2019s all these psychedelic drugs\u2014acid and that sort of thing. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIn certain groups, it\u2019s really very, very normal to do this; pills are seen as not being all that dangerous, really. For a kid like my son, as I talked about before, he really does have an addictive personality. Somebody like him, who takes a pill, it turns into, \u201cI need another one.\u201d Somebody else, it\u2019s like, \u201cOh, that was kind of interesting,\u201d and they go home. [For our son,] it started with weed, and then who knows how it escalated into something far worse. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe loved his friends; they were <em>great<\/em>. We ended up with a lot of the kids, that he was hanging out with and our girls were hanging out with, in our home; because they would come for Bible studies. We talked to them, and some of them came to Christ and started growing. They\u2019re just doing wonderful, most of them. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAt the same point, there were other kids that our son was hanging out with, who were doing these things. We don\u2019t know exactly how it started, or what pills they were taking\u2014or what have you\u2014that kind of thing. Ultimately, I guess he started taking like a Percocet or that sort of thing. They can be prescribed from doctors for pain. You get it from your grandmother\u2019s medicine cabinet; those are the Oxycodone\/that kind of thing. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIf they get it on the street, you don\u2019t know what they\u2019re made up of. Even pills\u2014this is something I didn\u2019t learn until recently\u2014even pills on the street can have something called Fentanyl in them. Fentanyl is what\u2019s responsible for a lot of the overdose deaths\u2014it\u2019s very strong\u201450-100 times stronger than heroin. What happens is\u2014the pills\u2014harder to get\/more expensive\u2014so they start going to heroin on the street, which is much, much cheaper. Sometimes the heroin is laced with Fentanyl. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I was shocked in the book that you even said some of the dealers will put so much Fentanyl, or another substance, in the drug that, if someone overdoses or dies, it gives them a good reputation?\u2014like, \u201cWhat is <em>that<\/em>?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> Yes; it gets darker, and darker, and darker; it\u2019s shocking. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tA dealer\u2014what happens with heroin is\u2014they are in these little cellophane\/sort of little packets\u2014they\u2019re tiny. On the packets, they\u2019ll stamp their particular brand. Say you start producing heroin, or whatever, in these little packets; you\u2019re going to stamp it with your name\u2014something like that\u2014or you\u2019ll name it something: \u201cMickey Mouse\u201d\u2014whatever\u2014so they\u2019ll know it\u2019s coming from <em>you<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIf you include in your batch for that week some Fentanyl\u2014or something particularly strong in them\u2014and a couple people overdose and die or just overdose, people know that\u2019s a good batch; so they\u2019ll go to <em>you<\/em> for the rest of it. It\u2019s a horrible thing, but it sells. They make more money that way. A couple intentional overdoses are worth selling off bags to make thousands of dollars. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Can you imagine that you ever thought you would know about this?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> I know; right?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> It\u2019s just a <em>whole<\/em> world. With the opiate epidemic going on, it was just, \u201cWow.\u201d It kind of blew my mind how bad it was. Back when I was growing up, it was just like, \u201cThe city,\u201d\u2014maybe a couple streets that have this stuff, but\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Was your reaction any different? You told us earlier that, when you caught him with weed\u2014now it\u2019s heroin\u2014is it a different reaction for you? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> Yes, yes; that was the mother of all drugs. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> How did you catch him? How did you know he was using?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> You know what? It\u2019s all so complicated in the situation. His friends actually said, \u201cYou need to tell your parents that you\u2019re doing heroin.\u201d He sat down next to us and he told us, and he cried\u2014he said, \u201cI\u2019m doing heroin.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Why would his friends tell him to tell you guys? And these are friends that are hanging out at your house; is that right?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> Yes; they had come to Christ, so they really cared for him. They were really worried about him. I don\u2019t think any of them were into the really hard drugs. Somehow, he had gotten in. Like I said before, he\u2019s an addictive kid; we knew he was going to go in that direction, and he did. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tOnce he told us, my first reaction was, \u201cYou\u2019re going to rehab.\u201d To me, at that point, that\u2019s what you do\u2014you go to rehab\u2014which, oftentimes, you should. Rick was able to see things a little clearer at that point. He knew that our son, because of who he is\u2014and as we know, every kid is different\u2014that he would just run, and then he wouldn\u2019t stay because of his anxiety issues. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tMostly, what we told him\u2014I don\u2019t remember as far as what he was able and not able to do\u2014but we tested him constantly, like every day. I got the tests that tested for every possible drug that you take, and then I tested him. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> He was saying, \u201cI want help, and I\u2019ll get tested. I want you to help me with this.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> Yes; yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> And his friends were encouraging that. Again, I\u2019m guessing you\u2019re thinking, \u201cOkay; as long as we\u2019re testing him, and he wants help, then we\u2019re going to win this battle.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Yes; yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>But that\u2019s not exactly the direction it went. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> No; because of the <em>physical<\/em> addiction. I think, psychologically, many addicts\/most addicts want out, but it\u2019s a physical thing. At that point, we just started testing him every day. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> You\u2019re praying; you\u2019re looking up, even in a beautiful way, at the sky, and you\u2019re talking to God about your son, not for days or weeks\u2014years\u2014right? How did that go? It doesn\u2019t seem like He\u2019s hearing or answering your prayer. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> Yes; oh, boy. You know, when you go through these difficult times, everything become more alive. You are awake and sensitive to the Holy Spirit and what\u2019s happening around you, because you\u2019re desperate\/because you\u2019re constantly in prayer. What happened was\u2014we would get little encouragements, here and there\u2014kind of like God reminding us, \u201cYes; I\u2019m here. I\u2019m here,\u201d even though, for all intents and purposes, it seemed like He was nowhere.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> You started a prayer group at church?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> Yes; mostly, it was parents; people who love people, who are battling addictions; some were in prison; some were still living at home; older kids\/younger kids\u2014all sorts of things. Once you let the word out, it\u2019s such a need. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIn the same way, as we began to pray, we saw things happening in these kids\u2019 lives that were pretty amazing. As of today, none of them died. The fact that they\u2019re all alive, if you understand the culture and you understand what\u2019s going on, is a miracle that they\u2019re all living, so pray, pray, pray!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThere isn\u2019t any other sure thing. You can try to do all the right things\u2014it\u2019s <em>very<\/em> important to get wisdom from other parents, and read things, and all of that\u2014very, very important; and do your research\u2014but at the same time, the only thing that\u2019s for <em>sure<\/em> is prayer\u2014and that this isn\u2019t out of the blue; there\u2019s nothing random about this. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> You mention that he didn\u2019t just overdose <em>once<\/em>. Sometimes, you read that, and you\u2019re like, \u201cHe died.\u201d But he overdosed and did several times?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> Yes; he did. The first overdose was one of those things, where\u2014I think I talk about it in the book\u2014where all of these things had to happen for him to have lived, and he did. He was in the ICU; he was on life support for three or four days. We prayed; the whole waiting room was filled with mostly his friends, who had come to Christ\/were walking with God. Little by little, things started to happen with his body. He needed to get his blood pressure up; he went into septic shock. The doctor actually said that this was the worst overdose that he\u2019d seen where anybody lived through it. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tOne year later, I was knocking on his door in the morning to wake him up; and he wasn\u2019t answering. My husband came and kicked it in. He was blue; at that point, my husband ran towards him; and I ran away from him\u2014just the different kind of impulses that we had. He\u2019s trying to revive him, and I just leave. It was so scary! I did see him when the door came down, and I saw his blue face; and I didn\u2019t <em>want<\/em> to see anymore. I immediately called 911; but at the same point, I\u2019m physically just melting. My knees are completely giving way. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAll I could think was\u2014because things had been going really well before that\u2014I\u2019d been thanking God for how well he was doing! At that point, all I could think was, \u201cAre you real, God? I\u2019ve been thanking You this whole time, and then this. What is going on? How could You possibly let this happen?\u201d That\u2019s when my faith was shaken to its <em>core<\/em>, and it was either going to disappear or grow stronger. This is an <em>amazing<\/em> thing that God did at that moment. Rick came over to me, as the paramedics were going up the stairs, I guess. He said, \u201cDon\u2019t worry; I\u2019ll believe for you.\u201d That might not make any sense; but at the time, it was\/I was like, \u201cOkay, God; You\u2019re even going to get me through this.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> After that second overdose, were you afraid to be hopeful again?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> Yes, yes. I was afraid to be hopeful again after that. One of the things that became a revelation for me was that my \u201cIf only-s\u201d became \u201cEven ifs.\u201d My \u201cIf only-s\u201d\u2014which I\u2019d been struggling with since Day One\u2014were: \u201cIf only I\u2019d done this differently,\u201d or \u201c\u2026we\u2019d done this differently...\u201d \u201cIf only we\u2019d seen things earlier\u2026\u201d \u201cIf only we\u2019d been harder on him\u2026\u201d\u2014or whatever it was\u2014which was doing nothing except polluting my prayer life. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThese turned into an \u201cEven if\u2026\u201d It\u2019s kind of like Jesus at Gethsemane. \u201cPlease take this from Me; but not My will, but Yours.\u201d I was able to come to Christ\/to Jesus and say, \u201cEven if our son dies\u2014it will be the most painful thing I\u2019ll ever go through\u2014but even if our son dies, I\u2019m okay; heaven\u2019s okay. I\u2019m going to be good.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> That\u2019s <em>huge<\/em>.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> And it was <em>amazing<\/em>\u2014it just relieved all of the fear; I wasn\u2019t afraid anymore!\u2014it was okay; you know, it was okay. I knew it would be hard, but it was okay. Once you\u2019re <em>not<\/em> afraid of the worst thing you could imagine, the freedom that comes is wonderful\u2014and the sense of peace\u2014you <em>are<\/em> walking with God at that point. You\u2019re not just, \u201cAlright; if that\u2019s what You want, I\u2019ll do it, or whatever; Your will be done.\u201d No; it was like, \u201cYou\u2019re going to take care of me in ways I could <em>never<\/em> imagine.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> It seems like that\u2019s a point, as parents, that we all need to come to. It\u2019s like a surrendering of everything\/of our kids. That\u2019s a <em>hard<\/em> thing to do; because it\u2019s <em>releasing<\/em> your child to God\u2014whether they have an addiction\/whether they\u2019ve walked away from God\u2014wherever they are in life. That\u2019s a hard place to come to. Is that the place you\u2019d encourage parents to get to?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> I would, hands down.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> And yet, you didn\u2019t get there overnight. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> Did not get there overnight. Very hard to get to; but if you\u2019re struggling right now in that place of complete uncertainty and fear, and you don\u2019t know what\u2019s going to happen, and there\u2019s tumult at home or whatever\u2014that is a place you want to get to. Get there by prayer\u2014constant, constant prayer\u2014and read Scripture. Hebrews 11 is great, talking about the faith. Some people didn\u2019t experience the answers to their prayers in the very end, but they knew a <em>better<\/em> future was coming for them.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> His second time in the hospital was a turning point of sorts; wasn\u2019t it?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> Yes; it was such a gradual thing. He got jobs that he held down well. He\u2019d tell us things; he got a little more open about what was going on\u2014he said somebody had come into where he was working and offered him pills; and he was mad at the guy, because he knew the guy <em>knew<\/em> that he was trying not to use\u2014things like that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt\u2019s interesting\u2014we always wanted and expected him to have this miraculous spiritual awakening and start leading Bible studies with his dad\u2014things like that\/that\u2014\u201cThis is how it works for the Christian; they, all of a sudden, discover the Spirit-filled life, and then everything\u2019s perfect.\u201d It wasn\u2019t at all like that; it was very, very slow. He\u2019s still a very internal person, but his heart\u2019s good.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tMore than one time, I feel like God gave me the image of a turtle. [Laughs] I was praying\u2014it finally came to me: \u201cI should pray that, like a turtle, he would always go slow, slow, in the right direction. I don\u2019t care how slow it is, but always let him go in the right direction and never back\u201d; right? I was praying this as I was walking through a park one day. Got in the car, headed out. I had to stop; because this little turtle was, literally,\u00a0 walking on the road, five feet in front of the car. It was going so slow, I had to pick it up and carry it to the other side of the road. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut things like that\u2014slowly, you could tell things were headed in the right direction. Even now, though, there\u2019s always going to be a little bit of a fear there that something could happen. But I do\/I think that I\u2019ve gotten to that place, where my first reaction is to go back to, \u201cEven if\u2026\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Today, he\u2019s living independently. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> He\u2019s married. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> He\u2019s married; has a little baby girl.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> And as far as you know, substance use is a part of the past, not a part of the present. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> No; he\u2019s doing really well; so thankful.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> And the story is not over. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> No. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> I talk to parents, all the time, who are in the middle of difficult situations with a prodigal\/with somebody, who\u2019s using\u2014whatever their circumstance is\u2014there\u2019s a broken heart in that conversation. There\u2019s also a sense of hopelessness. I have to look at them and say, \u201cThe story\u2019s not over. We don\u2019t know what God\u2019s going to do. There\u2019s still hope. Keep crying out; keep interceding; keep pointing him in the right direction; keep asking God for wisdom.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> You\u2019re walking around the walls of Jericho; not a single brick\u2019s fallen. You\u2019ve got to be thinking, \u201cJust give me, at least, a brick!\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> \u201c\u2026just a brick.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> But this could be Day Six. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u2014and your prayers are being <em>heard<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> Yes, yes, yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> He had to know mom was writing a book, telling the story.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> He did. I asked if he wanted to vet it, and he took it to read. He got through the first couple pages; and he said, \u201cI\u2019m sorry. I can\u2019t read it.\u201d I said, \u201cI\u2019m so sorry I did that to you.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> But he was okay; he signed off on you telling this story.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> Yes, yes. And all of his friends, who are in here as well\u2014I ran it by them\u2014so everybody signed off.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Now, there are a lot of moms and dads\u2014and maybe a lot of addicts\u2014who are going to read this and get hope because of the story.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Thanks for writing it. Thanks for coming here, and thanks for sharing your story. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine:<\/strong> Thank you. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> We\u2019ve got copies of Katherine\u2019s book, which is called <em>A Prayer for Orion: A Son\u2019s Addiction and a Mother\u2019s Love<\/em>. You can order it from us, online, at FamilyLifeToday.com. Again, our website: FamilyLifeToday.com. You\u2019ll find additional resources there for parents, whose kids have become involved with substance abuse: other books, articles, resources that we have available. Again, go to FamilyLifeToday.com for more information. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIf we can pray for you and your family, if you\u2019re going through this or <em>any<\/em> challenge, it would be a privilege to be able to pray for your family in the new year. Get in touch with us and let us know how we can be praying for you. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tOf course, today is the first day of 2021, and we\u2019re all praying that 2021 will be a different year\/a better year than 2020 was. 2020 was <em>challenging<\/em>; it was hard for many of us. Yet, God was with us and sustained us as He always does; we\u2019re grateful for that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe do want to say, \u201cThank you,\u201d to those of you who, over the last 30 days, have responded to the matching-gift challenge that we had made available to us, here at FamilyLife<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>. We don\u2019t have the final total yet; because many of you mailed in donations, and we\u2019re waiting for those donations to arrive to see if we did, in fact, take full advantage of that matching gift. Pray for that, if you would; and thanks, again, to those of you who donated. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tPray for us in the new year ahead as we look to be innovative and creative about how we can most effectively minister to marriages and families\u2014that God will open new doors as He has already been doing for us in so many ways\u2014pray that 2021 will be a fruitful year of ministry for us, here at FamilyLife. Again, anytime we can help you, please do get in touch with us and let us know. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe hope you have a great weekend. I hope you and your family are able to worship together in your local church this weekend. And I hope you can join us back on Monday when Dave and Ann Wilson are going to share with us about their engagement; about the very first <em>Weekend to Remember<\/em><sup>\u00ae<\/sup> marriage getaway they ever went to, back before they were married; and then about the first tumultuous months of marriage, where eventually they looked at each other and said, \u201cWe made a <em>huge<\/em> mistake.\u201d We\u2019ll hear that story Monday. I hope you can tune in for that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch, along with our entire broadcast production team. On behalf of our hosts, Dave and Ann Wilson, I\u2019m Bob Lepine. We will see you back next time for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas; a Cru<sup>\u00ae <\/sup>Ministry. Help for today. Hope for tomorrow.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright <sup>\u00a9<\/sup> 2020 FamilyLife. All rights reserved.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/\">www.FamilyLife.com<\/a>\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\n\t\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\t1\n\t\t\t\t<\/p>","theme_header_position":"","post_header_is_sticky":"","is_header_overlay":""},"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast\/306656","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/podcast"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/91"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=306656"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/294104"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=306656"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=306656"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=306656"},{"taxonomy":"podcast_series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast_series?post=306656"},{"taxonomy":"cwp_profile","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/cwp_profile?post=306656"},{"taxonomy":"series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/series?post=306656"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}