{"id":306653,"date":"2020-12-31T07:01:06","date_gmt":"2020-12-31T12:01:06","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/%series%\/slow-progression-in-a-bad-direction\/"},"modified":"2020-12-31T07:01:06","modified_gmt":"2020-12-31T12:01:06","slug":"slow-progression-in-a-bad-direction","status":"publish","type":"podcast","link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/slow-progression-in-a-bad-direction\/","title":{"rendered":"Slow Progression In A Bad Direction"},"content":{"rendered":"","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Have you ever wondered how a good kid could get caught up in bad decisions? Dave and Ann Wilson talk with Katherine James, author of &#8220;A Prayer for Orion,&#8221; about the journey she had with her son.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":91,"featured_media":294104,"menu_order":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","template":"","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","inline_featured_image":false,"_uag_custom_page_level_css":"","episode_type":"","audio_file":"https:\/\/mp3.familylife.com\/fl2020-12-31.mp3","cover_image":"","cover_image_id":"","duration":"00:31:05","filesize":"28.46M","filesize_raw":"29844141","date_recorded":"","explicit":"","block":""},"categories":[2840,2841,2834],"tags":[5924],"podcast_series":[8418],"cwp_profile":[9682],"series":[2101],"class_list":["post-306653","podcast","type-podcast","status-publish","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-addiction","category-anger-and-rebellion","category-praying-for-your-children","tag-drug-addiction","podcast_series-a-prayer-for-orion","cwp_profile-katherine-james","series-familylife-today"],"acf":[],"episode_featured_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/09\/FLT-Podcast-Cover-2-508x508-3.jpg?w=508","episode_player_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2023\/02\/image-scaled.jpg","download_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-download\/306653\/slow-progression-in-a-bad-direction","player_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-player\/306653\/slow-progression-in-a-bad-direction","audio_player":null,"episode_data":{"playerMode":"light","subscribeUrls":{"apple_podcasts":{"key":"apple_podcasts","url":"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303?mt=2&app=podcast","label":"Apple Podcasts","class":"apple_podcasts","icon":"apple-podcasts.png"},"google_podcasts":{"key":"google_podcasts","url":"","label":"Google Podcasts","class":"google_podcasts","icon":"google-podcasts.png"},"spotify":{"key":"spotify","url":"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm","label":"Spotify","class":"spotify","icon":"spotify.png"},"youtube":{"key":"youtube","url":"","label":"YouTube","class":"youtube","icon":"youtube.png"}},"rssFeedUrl":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/feed\/podcast\/familylife-today","embedCode":"<blockquote class=\"wp-embedded-content\" data-secret=\"YMc0xLNdM0\"><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/slow-progression-in-a-bad-direction\/\">Slow Progression In A Bad Direction<\/a><\/blockquote><iframe sandbox=\"allow-scripts\" security=\"restricted\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/slow-progression-in-a-bad-direction\/embed\/#?secret=YMc0xLNdM0\" width=\"500\" height=\"350\" title=\"&#8220;Slow Progression In A Bad Direction&#8221; &#8212; FamilyLife\u00ae - A Cru Ministry\" data-secret=\"YMc0xLNdM0\" frameborder=\"0\" marginwidth=\"0\" marginheight=\"0\" scrolling=\"no\" class=\"wp-embedded-content\"><\/iframe><script>\n\/*! This file is auto-generated *\/\n!function(d,l){\"use strict\";l.querySelector&&d.addEventListener&&\"undefined\"!=typeof URL&&(d.wp=d.wp||{},d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage||(d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage=function(e){var t=e.data;if((t||t.secret||t.message||t.value)&&!\/[^a-zA-Z0-9]\/.test(t.secret)){for(var s,r,n,a=l.querySelectorAll('iframe[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),o=l.querySelectorAll('blockquote[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),c=new RegExp(\"^https?:$\",\"i\"),i=0;i<o.length;i++)o[i].style.display=\"none\";for(i=0;i<a.length;i++)s=a[i],e.source===s.contentWindow&&(s.removeAttribute(\"style\"),\"height\"===t.message?(1e3<(r=parseInt(t.value,10))?r=1e3:~~r<200&&(r=200),s.height=r):\"link\"===t.message&&(r=new URL(s.getAttribute(\"src\")),n=new URL(t.value),c.test(n.protocol))&&n.host===r.host&&l.activeElement===s&&(d.top.location.href=t.value))}},d.addEventListener(\"message\",d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage,!1),l.addEventListener(\"DOMContentLoaded\",function(){for(var e,t,s=l.querySelectorAll(\"iframe.wp-embedded-content\"),r=0;r<s.length;r++)(t=(e=s[r]).getAttribute(\"data-secret\"))||(t=Math.random().toString(36).substring(2,12),e.src+=\"#?secret=\"+t,e.setAttribute(\"data-secret\",t)),e.contentWindow.postMessage({message:\"ready\",secret:t},\"*\")},!1)))}(window,document);\n\/\/# sourceURL=https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-includes\/js\/wp-embed.min.js\n<\/script>\n"},"spectra_custom_meta":{"_wp_page_template":["default"],"transcript_url":["https:\/\/transcript.familylife.com\/fl2020-12-31.pdf"],"audio_file":["https:\/\/mp3.familylife.com\/fl2020-12-31.mp3"],"transcript_content":["<strong>Bob: <\/strong>When Katherine James and her husband learned that their son had been smoking marijuana, as a high school student, they were concerned for a number of reasons.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>A lot of kids smoke pot, and it turns out to be something stupid they did when they were younger. But for my son, I really did know\/I <em>knew<\/em> he was susceptible to addiction; it runs in the family. Certain things about him\/some of the things he struggled with\u2014I just knew that he was high risk for addiction.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>This is <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> for Thursday, December 31<sup>st<\/sup>. Our hosts are Dave and Ann Wilson; I'm Bob Lepine. You can find us online at FamilyLifeToday.com. The pain that comes with being a parent of a prodigal, especially a prodigal who has become involved with addictive behaviors\/with drugs and alcohol, that pain is a pain that leads all of us to prayer. We\u2019ll talk with Katherine James about her journey today. Stay with us.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd welcome to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. Thanks for joining us. The word that just keeps coming to mind, as I think about what we\u2019re going to talk about, is \u201cheartache.\u201d Families go through seasons, moments, experiences, episodes of heartache. I always try to remember what Jesus said at the end of the Sermon on the Mount\u2014He said, \u201cWinds and rains and storms are coming your way. The question is, \u2018What\u2019s your house anchored on?\u201d and \u201cAre you going to be standing at the end?\u2019\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe\u2019re going to talk about that in a minute; but this is a big day for us here\u2014the last day of 2020. We need to have kind of a heart-to-heart with our listeners here on the last day of the year.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>Yes; in some ways, we\u2019ve been through a storm.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>All of us have been through a storm we thought would be over in a few weeks or maybe a few months, and here we are. Boy oh boy! What a tough, tough year! Yet, we\u2019re standing because of the foundation of Christ; but it\u2019s really been hard. Because of the storm we\u2019ve been in, we had to cancel our <em>Weekend to Remember<\/em><sup>\u00ae<\/sup> marriage events, which took down income.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>Not only that, there\u2019s a storm going on in the world; but there are a lot of storms going on behind closed doors\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>\u2014there are people that are filling out divorce papers; there are parents that are trying to woo their children back to Jesus, who have wandered away\u2014there are these painful realities that are going on.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>There are listeners who have found encouragement and help, and practical biblical wisdom in the midst of the storm, because they\u2019ve connected with us.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>I mean, in some ways, we\u2019re a lighthouse.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>Yes!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>I know Jesus is the lighthouse, not us; but we get to turn on that light every day through this program. I\u2019m telling you\u2014I know\u2014we get letters\/we hear\u2014we offer help; it helps. We offer hope in Christ; it brings hope.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>\u2014and biblical truth that really takes people and centers them.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>That does not happen without you. Today is December 31<sup>st<\/sup>, which means it\u2019s a critical day for FamilyLife<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>; because we depend on the financial giving of listeners, like you. You\u2019re our partners; and when you step up, it makes a <em>huge<\/em> difference. I don\u2019t know if you understand this\u201440 percent of our needed resources, financially, come in the last week of the year.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>That is huge! I mean, I don\u2019t think people understand how critical it is that we partner together. Of all years, boy oh boy, we need you to step up in the middle of the storm and say, \u201cGod has blessed me, and I want to be a blessing to FamilyLife; and I want to be a partner.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>\u00a0<\/em>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>We want to ask you today to be as generous as you can be, here on the last day of 2020. If you\u2019ve not given a yearend gift\u2014or if you\u2019ve given, and you want to call again today or go online again today, and make a second gift\u2014we\u2019re trying to take full advantage of a matching gift that has generously been extended. In fact, the amount of the match has been increased in the last several days; it\u2019s not a total of $2.7 million.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tFor us to take full advantage of that, we need to hear from listeners today. You can donate, online, at FamilyLifeToday.com; or call 1-800-FL-TODAY. Whatever you give will be doubled, as long as there is money in that matching-gift fund. We\u2019ll say, \u201cThank you,\u201d by sending you two gifts: a copy of my book, <em>Love Like You Mean It<\/em>, all about what real love in a marriage relationship looks like, and a flash drive that has more than 100 of the best <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> programs of all time\u2014with Dennis and Barbara Rainey, Dave and Ann Wilson, guests who have been a part of this program through the years\u2014the best of the best! \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe\u2019ll send that to you as a way of saying, \u201cThank you for supporting us, here on the last day of 2020.\u201d We need to hear from you today; so go online at FamilyLifeToday.com, or call 1-800-FL-TODAY to make a yearend donation. Thank you!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>Thank you!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Let\u2019s just say it right now: \u201cThank you for whatever you\u2019re able to do today.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe hope that today\u2019s conversation is going to be an encouragement to families, who may be in a very difficult situation. In fact, I think there are going to be a lot of listeners, who can resonate with our guest today. Katherine James is joining us on <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>; Katherine, welcome to the program.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Thanks!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Katherine is an author and a fellow staff member with us at Cru<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>, formerly Campus Crusade for Christ<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>. She and her husband live in suburban Philadelphia; they have three kids. She\u2019s written\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>Before you get there, Bob, we have to talk about her entrance into the studio today! [Laughter] It was memorable.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>Wait, wait, wait. Are you really going to bring this up?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>I could see <em>me<\/em> doing that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>We brought her in, asked her to sit down. The chair we\u2019re sitting in has rollers, and hers just rolled farther than ours did.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Someone took it, and swiped it out from under me to intimidate me, and I fell on the floor and broke\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>\u2014and broke a glass; you know?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>And a lawsuit is coming. [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tKatherine has written a book\u2014it\u2019s really a memoir\u2014it\u2019s the memoir that no mom would ever want to write. It\u2019s called <em>A Prayer for Orion<\/em>. Take us back to the genesis of this story, when you first recognized that your son was in a bad place.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>He had anxiety from when he was a little kid. He had some sort of predisposing factors that, a lot of times, kids who end up struggling with drugs have. It had been going on for a long time; but he was, at the same time, a <em>really<\/em> good kid, just kind and thoughtful. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tProbably around middle school, something seemed to change with him. He had some <em>great<\/em> friends and, then, started hanging out with some iffy friends. However, he probably wasn\u2019t a great influence on them either. I think, a lot of times, kids\u2019 [parents] assume that somebody else is responsible\/some other kid is the one who\u2019s\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u201cOur kid\u2019s the good kid; it\u2019s the other kids who are the bad kids.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Exactly! Mine\u2019s probably the one that said, \u201cHey, I want some weed!\u201d\u2014you know, that\u2019s not always the way we picture it.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>When you started to see <em>that<\/em>\/some signs, did you have any idea of drugs?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>No; I would say no. It wasn\u2019t until one specific thing happened that I realized, \u201cUh-oh; this is bad. We\u2019re heading in the wrong direction.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Where did your son fit in the family birth order?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>He\u2019s the third\u2014only boy.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>The third of three.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>You guys are involved in ministry\u2014you\u2019re on Cru staff\u2014church is a part of life; Jesus is a part of life\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Yes; yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u2014that\u2019s the background and the foundation he\u2019s growing up in.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Yes, very much so.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>But you said there was one thing that was the wake-up call for you guys that: \u201cWe\u2019re dealing with something we never imagined we would be dealing with.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Right; it was when my daughter found him smoking weed with some friends. For us, that was a shock; because he just wasn\u2019t the kind of kid we ever thought would do that, which it usually is that situation for parents, who have a good kid. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe other thing is, as Christian parents, we think that it\u2019s a matter of: \u201cDo this and, then, this,\u201d \u201cDo this and, then, this\u201d; right? Did all the right things\u2014read the Bible stories at night, modeled a Christian life, loved each other\u2014all these sorts of things; so then, in my mind, anyway, it was sort of: \u201cWell, that\u2019s not going to happen.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>It\u2019s not like he saw mom and dad smoking weed.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Right, right; yes. \u201cWe did the right things; he would turn out to be the right kid\u201d; so that was a shock when he really was doing the wrong things.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>What happened? Your daughter tells you\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>\u2014did you go confront him?\u2014or did he own up to it? What happened?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>I think my daughter took him to youth group, dropped him off there, and then came and told me what they had been doing. I just went over and basically burst into the church and just like, \u201cGet over here right now!\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI was not the sort of mother that is an angry mother; I\u2019m just always like, \u201cI\u2019m not going to yell; I\u2019m going to be very sweet.\u201d I yelled, and I actually pushed him; I was like, \u201cYou <em>stupid<\/em> idiot! You <em>stupid<\/em>, <em>stupid<\/em> idiot!\u201d That was the beginning.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>When your daughter told you, what did you feel?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>Well, she\u2019s feeling angry!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>I know! I know! [Laughter] But anger is a second emotion; so I\u2019m wondering, \u201cWhat was the first emotion? What was at your gut level?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>Look at you!\u2014you\u2019re going deep!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Oh, get all deep on me! Now I have to\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>This is what happens when we talk at night!\u2014[Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>This is what happens; that\u2019s true.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>\u2014she\u2019s like, \u201cHoney, what are you really feeling?\u201d \u201cUh\u2026\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Oh, sort of, \u201cWhat did I do wrong?\u201d That\u2019s where my mind\u2014throughout our whole journey, constantly I struggled with that\u2014\u201cHow did we get here?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>I think a lot of us, as moms, think that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>How did he respond?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>He didn\u2019t fight back or say anything; he never said anything mean to me.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>What did he say?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>I don\u2019t know that he said anything at that point. He got in the car, and I drove him home; he sat down. My husband and I sat down with him, and we talked it through. But that was the general way things went in our home\u2014we would talk with him\u2014I\u2019m sure there was some sort of discipline; I don\u2019t know what it was.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>Let me ask Bob: \u201cIf you caught one of your kids in the same situation, what do you think you\u2019d do?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>I would hope that what I would do, first of all, is to pull back and pray and just say, \u201cLord, I\u2019m going to need to walk by the Spirit, whatever that\u2019s going to look like; and I need wisdom here to know what my full-of-grace-and-truth encounter with my child needs to look like.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Man, I should have done that! [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>I\u2019m not saying that\u2019s what I <em>would<\/em> have done!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>No; I\u2019m sure I prayed.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>This is from a dad of <em>grown<\/em> children now.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Well, that\u2019s right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>I\u2019m just thinking\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>Well, I\u2019m just going to say\u2014I\u2019m sitting beside a mom, who did exactly what you did.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Oh, okay. [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>With one of our sons, after a night of him getting drunk, I remember you going out there; and man, our neighbors heard that one!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>Yes; I will say that I probably reacted instead of responded. I think the base and the root of that was fear: \u201cIs this who you are? Is this who you\u2019re becoming?\u201d It was fear of what it could lead to, maybe.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>You\u2019re good; thank you! That\u2019s <em>exactly<\/em> what I felt! [Laughter] No, it is!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>Is it?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Yes!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>Yes; I\u2019ll tell you what\u2014that same son has said to me now, as an adult, \u201cI wish you would have been harder,\u201d\u2014I mean, sometimes the righteous anger is needed.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>This is where a calculated, Spirit-led approach\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>That\u2019s the key.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u2014because you have to have the wisdom of God; you don\u2019t have wisdom on your own in that moment. What you want to avoid is just a response of the flesh; that is, \u201cThis what I\u2019m feeling; therefore, I\u2019m justified in whatever I do at this moment.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>\u2014reacting.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>When the neighbors were hearing <em>you<\/em>, it was more\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>I might be exaggerating <em>a little<\/em>. [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>I wasn\u2019t yelling; I was having him dig out bushes. [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>Yes; she put him to work!\u2014like, \u201cYou think you\u2019re going to sleep in today?\u2014you\u2019re hungover. Watch this: you\u2019re working.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Was that a calculated Spirit-led response from you?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>I didn\u2019t pray; as I said, I reacted. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think God would probably give us a different response to each child, because He knows who they are. I really do wish I could go back, and talk to me as a younger mom and say, \u201cSit down; pray; ask God, and get wisdom,\u201d\u2014maybe even call people or whatever\u2014get some godly counsel. But no; I did not do that at the time.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>You hate to want to call anybody; because who wants to say, \u201cGuess what my son did last night?\u201d\u2014right?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>It\u2019s true!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>It\u2019s embarrassing.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>\u2014especially when you\u2019re in ministry.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>\u2014in ministry, and when it involves drinking.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>How was your husband a part of it? How was the marriage part?\u2014were you in tandem together?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Yes, I <em>trusted<\/em> my husband. I knew that, as I was going, getting him, that he was praying without ceasing. I think we were both clueless enough, where we were kind of like, \u201cI don\u2019t know what we should do.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Did you walk away from that confrontation with your son, thinking, \u201cWe\u2019re going to keep an eye on him, but I think this is probably a one-time thing,\u201d and \u201cWe\u2019ll watch, but I can\u2019t imagine that this is the direction that he\u2019s going to go\u201d?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>My fear had a lot to do with the fact that I <em>knew<\/em> he was susceptible to addiction; it runs in the family. Certain things about him\/some of the things he struggled with, I just knew that he was high risk for addiction. A lot of kids smoke pot, and it turns out to be something stupid they did when they were younger; but for my son, I really did know.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>Now, was there any sense\u2014I mean, like Bob said, you\u2019re this Christian family\/you\u2019re in full-time Christian work\u2014was there any sense of: \u201cWe have to hide this, or cover it up, or keep it quiet; we don\u2019t want the church to know\u201d? Or was it sort of out there?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>It was sort of out there, just because we were sort of set up that way. We\u2019d always had a very open home. Since the kids were young, we had seminary students\u2014and that sort of thing\u2014friends stayed with us, who needed a place to stay. Our kids have brought their friends over; it kind of just became known. We never had that option of: \u201cAre we going to tell people or are we not going to tell people?\u201d Although, I could see\u2014especially, a family in ministry\u2014how that would be really hard to make that decision, if you were ever given that situation, where you had to: \u201cWell, am I going to tell somebody or not tell somebody?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhen things just continued to get worse and worse with our son, I think, in the end, I\u2019m really grateful we had never been secretive with people. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>Yes; you know, so many churches, really\u2014and ministries\u2014they keep things that are darker\/that don\u2019t line up with what\u2019s supposed to be\u2014like you said earlier: \u201cA plus B should equal C,\u201d\u2014it\u2019s sad; but the church is often the place you hide the most rather than go, and be real, and find healing with other people going through the same thing.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Yes; that\u2019s true.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>This is true for people in the church, not just for people in leadership in a church; there\u2019s a sense: \u201cIf people <em>knew<\/em>, they would judge me.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>Right; sad.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>That\u2019s it.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u201cThey would conclude things about me,\u201d or \u201c\u2026about our parenting,\u201d or \u201c\u2026about our home.\u201d The reason some people feel that is because there are people who will.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>I think, too, it\u2019s interesting\u2014I got cancer later on. You know, if you get cancer, you get casseroles. [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>You get a kid doing drugs\/hard drugs, you get <em>silence<\/em>.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>It\u2019s a <em>unique<\/em> struggle to go through, having a prodigal.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>How did you handle the next several weeks or months?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Yes; we were clueless. It seemed like the more time that went past, we thought it was just a one-time thing. Our son was never a kid, who came through the door stumbling, and also never lost his temper with us; he was always <em>very<\/em> kind. It wasn\u2019t a clear thing until later.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>It\u2019s interesting\u2014even in your book, you don\u2019t name his name\u2014but you call him \u201cSweet boy\u201d throughout the entire book, which I thought, \u201cThat\u2019s so interesting.\u201d It reveals so much to me about him. Describe him to us\u2014the fact that that\u2019s the name you gave him in the book.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Yes; just from a young kid, he was a just a really kind, kind person. I remember one thing he did when he was a kid\u2014he probably would have been four our five, maybe\u2014we used the \u201cFour Spiritual Laws,\u201d which is a Cru thing that kind of shares Christ with people. He\u2019d seen this thing\/this little booklet; so he went up to his room, and he spent all this time and stapled together a little booklet, where he wrote his own four spiritual laws.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>Wow.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Then he went out to the street, and waited for cars to stop at the stop sign, because he wanted to share Christ with them. I remember standing there, thinking, \u201cThis is the most <em>amazing<\/em> thing; I can\u2019t believe he\u2019s doing this. What an awesome thing.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAt the same time, I\u2019m thinking, \u201cPlease don\u2019t do it! [Laughter] What am I going to say?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u201cThis is embarrassing the neighbors\u201d; yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>You know, I\u2019m kind of like, \u201cOh, where\u2019s my heart at?\u201d Anyway, that was one of the things he did as a really young kid.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>In that period of weeks or months\u2014when you thought, \u201cOkay; this was a one-time thing. We\u2019re not seeing anything; things are back to normal,\u201d\u2014was that because he was hiding better than he had before?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Probably; there was a time, where things got really unclear what was going on. Another thing that really showed me\u2014and this is a big deal, too\u2014was probably six months or so after that first youth group thing that happened, I did get the sense: \u201cI should, at least, be looking through his room. I need to, at least, be searching for things and make sure that I\u2019m doing what I can to make sure that he\u2019s not doing anything.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThere\u2019s a little crawlspace in his room. I got in there, and then there\u2019s this insulation that\u2019s stuck to the ceiling; and I pulled it down. There was one of these liter plastic Coke<sup>\u00ae<\/sup> bottles; and it had a hole in one side, and duct tape, and all sorts of strangeness going on with it. I was like, \u201cThis is so a drug paraphernalia thing. I have no idea exactly how it works; I guess it\u2019s a bong.\u201d I didn\u2019t know, but I Googled it. Yes, there were tons of them on there, so I knew exactly what it was then.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnother thing\u2014I just don\u2019t remember exactly how we handled it or what we did\u2014but probably sat in the living room, and talked again, and came up with some sort of a plan.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Discipline; yes. I\u2019m just imagining, as a parent, you don\u2019t want to overreact. But knowing, \u201cWhat\u2019s the right reaction?\u201d\u2014I don\u2019t think any of us <em>know<\/em> that in the moment.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>I think, as a mom, I would have been <em>freaking<\/em> out inside, just kind of panicky.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Yes! \u201cI found a homemade bong in the insulation,\u201d\u2014yes!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Yes; there\u2019s something desperate about that. That was a big wakeup call to me, for sure.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAs far as counseling goes, that was another tough thing; because he wasn\u2019t receptive to it at all. Anything that had to do with his own anxiety, really was like, \u201cHe\u2019s going to run away from it.\u201d It\u2019s not like, \u201cOh, I\u2019m going to make you go; so here\u2014go\u2014I\u2019m dropping you off.\u201d It was more of: \u201cHe\u2019s going to run.\u201d That really had more to do with the anxiety than anything else.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>If you would say, \u201cWhat are you afraid of?\u201d he couldn\u2019t come up with answer for you.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Oh, no, no, no. I don\u2019t know if he didn\u2019t get it himself or whatever. I think he puzzled himself; I don\u2019t think he knew exactly why.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>There had to be\u2014I\u2019m guessing we all do this as parents\u2014we\u2019re just, \u201cWhat did I, as a parent\/did we, as parents, contribute to make this what\u2019s happening with our son?\u201d Is that where you were living? I can imagine lying in bed <em>every night<\/em>.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Yes; absolutely.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>The answer to that is: \u201cMaybe there are things you could or couldn\u2019t have done; but ultimately, kids make their own decisions. God pours grace on our parenting mistakes; and we have to own what was our contribution, if there is a contribution we made; but we can\u2019t own the choice a child makes and say, \u2018We were responsible. If we had done this right or this wrong, we could have spared our son.\u2019 There\u2019s no guarantee on any of that.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>The hard thing is, too, that we need to remember\u2014is the spiritual battle going on\u2014even for us, as parents, where the accuser is <em>constantly<\/em> accusing us\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>\u2014and getting us to feel <em>so horrible<\/em> about\u00a0 maybe what we\u2019ve done as a parent. He loves to put the blame on us.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI\u2019m sure there are things, for every single parent, we have done wrong; but there\u2019s still that point of saying, \u201cGod, I need to hear from You; protect my mind and my heart,\u201d\u2014that surrender, continually, of your child and yourself to Him.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>Yes; I told you\u2014you know, I guess I can say this\u2014we\u2019re finishing up this parenting book. I got up at 4:30 this morning and doing edits. I keep, as I\u2019m reading it, trying to say, \u201cOkay, there\u2019s no way we\u2019re saying, \u2018If you do this, you\u2019ll get this.\u2019\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou think\/you\u2019re writing a parenting\u2014like, \u201cOh, I want to read this; because they\u2019re going to tell us\u2026\u201d It\u2019s like, \u201cNo; we <em>can\u2019t<\/em> guarantee <em>anything<\/em>, but I can guarantee one thing,\u201d\u2014and I know you know this\u2014\u201cThere is a God; He can be trusted. He\u2019s with you in the cave\/in the crawlspace; He\u2019s there in that moment,\u201d\u2014that\u2019s all I can guarantee; I can\u2019t guarantee anything besides that. There are Scriptures\/there are principles in His Word; but at the end of the day, your son or daughter is going to make decisions that make no sense sometimes. There\u2019s a God that\u2019s with them and with you, and you can trust Him.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Lots of prayer\/lots of wise counsel to open your story to others, who you can trust, who can pray with you, and give you godly guidance in your journey. Maybe, together with others, read a book like the one Katherine\u2019s written called <em>A Prayer for Orion: A Son\u2019s Addiction and a Mother\u2019s Love<\/em>. We have copies of the book in our <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> Resource Center. You can order your copy from us, online, at FamilyLifeToday.com. Again, our website is FamilyLifeToday.com. The book is called <em>A Prayer for Orion<\/em> by Katherine James. On our website, you\u2019ll find additional resources\/help for parents, who have children, who are involved in substance abuse. Again, the website is FamilyLifeToday.com.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNow, this is the last opportunity I\u2019ll have to encourage <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> listeners\u2014those of you who listen regularly\u2014today\u2019s the last day for us, here, at FamilyLife to be able to take advantage of a very generous $2.7 million-matching gift that has been made available to us during the month of December. We need to hear from you today, before midnight in your time zone. You can go online at FamilyLifeToday.com, or you can call us at 1-800-FL-TODAY to make a yearend donation. When you do, your donation will be matched, dollar for dollar; we\u2019ll be one step closer to being able to take full advantage of the $2.7 million-matching gift. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIn addition, we\u2019d love to send you, as a thank-you gift, a couple of things, actually. We\u2019ll send you a copy of my book, <em>Love Like You Mean It<\/em>, all about what 1 Corinthians 13 teaches us about what real love in marriage looks like. And we\u2019ll send you a flash drive with more than 100 of the best <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> radio programs from the last \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t28 years\u2014programs with Dennis and Barbara Rainey, with Dave and Ann Wilson, with many of the guests we\u2019ve had here; programs about marriage and parenting\u2014really, the best of the best. The flash drive and the book are our way of saying, \u201cThank you for your generous yearend contribution.\u201d Be as generous as you can be today, if you would. Make your donation, online, at FamilyLifeToday.com; or call 1-800-FL-TODAY and help us end this year where we need to be. We look forward to hearing from you.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe hope you have a safe New Year\u2019s Eve and a happy new year. Hope you can join us back tomorrow as we\u2019re going to hear from Katherine James about her son\u2019s first overdose and how that landed him in the hospital. We\u2019ll pick up the story tomorrow. I hope you can be with us for that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch, along with our entire broadcast production team. On behalf of our hosts, Dave and Ann Wilson, I\u2019m Bob Lepine. We will see you back tomorrow for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas; a Cru<sup>\u00ae <\/sup>Ministry. Help for today. Hope for tomorrow.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright <sup>\u00a9<\/sup> 2020 FamilyLife. All rights reserved.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/\">www.FamilyLife.com<\/a>\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\n\t\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\t1\n\t\t\t\t<\/p>"],"_seopress_titles_title":[""],"_seopress_titles_desc":[""],"_seopress_robots_index":[""],"duration":["00:31:05"],"show_notes":[""],"_thumbnail_id":["294104"],"filesize":["28.46M"],"filesize_raw":["29844141"],"_uag_css_file_name":["uag-css-306653.css"],"_uag_js_file_name":["uag-js-306653.js"],"_uag_page_assets":["a:9:{s:3:\"css\";s:82560:\".wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape-top svg{width: calc( 100% + 1.3px );}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape.uagb-container__shape-top .uagb-container__shape-fill{fill: rgba(51,51,51,1);}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape-bottom svg{width: calc( 100% + 1.3px );}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape.uagb-container__shape-bottom 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you ever wondered how a good kid could get caught up in bad decisions? Dave and Ann Wilson talk with Katherine James, author of \"A Prayer for Orion,\" about the journey she had with her son.","meta_box":{"show_notes":"","transcript_url":"https:\/\/transcript.familylife.com\/fl2020-12-31.pdf","transcript_content":"<strong>Bob: <\/strong>When Katherine James and her husband learned that their son had been smoking marijuana, as a high school student, they were concerned for a number of reasons.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>A lot of kids smoke pot, and it turns out to be something stupid they did when they were younger. But for my son, I really did know\/I <em>knew<\/em> he was susceptible to addiction; it runs in the family. Certain things about him\/some of the things he struggled with\u2014I just knew that he was high risk for addiction.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>This is <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> for Thursday, December 31<sup>st<\/sup>. Our hosts are Dave and Ann Wilson; I'm Bob Lepine. You can find us online at FamilyLifeToday.com. The pain that comes with being a parent of a prodigal, especially a prodigal who has become involved with addictive behaviors\/with drugs and alcohol, that pain is a pain that leads all of us to prayer. We\u2019ll talk with Katherine James about her journey today. Stay with us.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd welcome to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. Thanks for joining us. The word that just keeps coming to mind, as I think about what we\u2019re going to talk about, is \u201cheartache.\u201d Families go through seasons, moments, experiences, episodes of heartache. I always try to remember what Jesus said at the end of the Sermon on the Mount\u2014He said, \u201cWinds and rains and storms are coming your way. The question is, \u2018What\u2019s your house anchored on?\u201d and \u201cAre you going to be standing at the end?\u2019\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe\u2019re going to talk about that in a minute; but this is a big day for us here\u2014the last day of 2020. We need to have kind of a heart-to-heart with our listeners here on the last day of the year.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>Yes; in some ways, we\u2019ve been through a storm.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>All of us have been through a storm we thought would be over in a few weeks or maybe a few months, and here we are. Boy oh boy! What a tough, tough year! Yet, we\u2019re standing because of the foundation of Christ; but it\u2019s really been hard. Because of the storm we\u2019ve been in, we had to cancel our <em>Weekend to Remember<\/em><sup>\u00ae<\/sup> marriage events, which took down income.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>Not only that, there\u2019s a storm going on in the world; but there are a lot of storms going on behind closed doors\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>\u2014there are people that are filling out divorce papers; there are parents that are trying to woo their children back to Jesus, who have wandered away\u2014there are these painful realities that are going on.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>There are listeners who have found encouragement and help, and practical biblical wisdom in the midst of the storm, because they\u2019ve connected with us.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>I mean, in some ways, we\u2019re a lighthouse.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>Yes!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>I know Jesus is the lighthouse, not us; but we get to turn on that light every day through this program. I\u2019m telling you\u2014I know\u2014we get letters\/we hear\u2014we offer help; it helps. We offer hope in Christ; it brings hope.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>\u2014and biblical truth that really takes people and centers them.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>That does not happen without you. Today is December 31<sup>st<\/sup>, which means it\u2019s a critical day for FamilyLife<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>; because we depend on the financial giving of listeners, like you. You\u2019re our partners; and when you step up, it makes a <em>huge<\/em> difference. I don\u2019t know if you understand this\u201440 percent of our needed resources, financially, come in the last week of the year.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>That is huge! I mean, I don\u2019t think people understand how critical it is that we partner together. Of all years, boy oh boy, we need you to step up in the middle of the storm and say, \u201cGod has blessed me, and I want to be a blessing to FamilyLife; and I want to be a partner.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>\u00a0<\/em>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>We want to ask you today to be as generous as you can be, here on the last day of 2020. If you\u2019ve not given a yearend gift\u2014or if you\u2019ve given, and you want to call again today or go online again today, and make a second gift\u2014we\u2019re trying to take full advantage of a matching gift that has generously been extended. In fact, the amount of the match has been increased in the last several days; it\u2019s not a total of $2.7 million.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tFor us to take full advantage of that, we need to hear from listeners today. You can donate, online, at FamilyLifeToday.com; or call 1-800-FL-TODAY. Whatever you give will be doubled, as long as there is money in that matching-gift fund. We\u2019ll say, \u201cThank you,\u201d by sending you two gifts: a copy of my book, <em>Love Like You Mean It<\/em>, all about what real love in a marriage relationship looks like, and a flash drive that has more than 100 of the best <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> programs of all time\u2014with Dennis and Barbara Rainey, Dave and Ann Wilson, guests who have been a part of this program through the years\u2014the best of the best! \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe\u2019ll send that to you as a way of saying, \u201cThank you for supporting us, here on the last day of 2020.\u201d We need to hear from you today; so go online at FamilyLifeToday.com, or call 1-800-FL-TODAY to make a yearend donation. Thank you!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>Thank you!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Let\u2019s just say it right now: \u201cThank you for whatever you\u2019re able to do today.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe hope that today\u2019s conversation is going to be an encouragement to families, who may be in a very difficult situation. In fact, I think there are going to be a lot of listeners, who can resonate with our guest today. Katherine James is joining us on <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>; Katherine, welcome to the program.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Thanks!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Katherine is an author and a fellow staff member with us at Cru<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>, formerly Campus Crusade for Christ<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>. She and her husband live in suburban Philadelphia; they have three kids. She\u2019s written\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>Before you get there, Bob, we have to talk about her entrance into the studio today! [Laughter] It was memorable.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>Wait, wait, wait. Are you really going to bring this up?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>I could see <em>me<\/em> doing that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>We brought her in, asked her to sit down. The chair we\u2019re sitting in has rollers, and hers just rolled farther than ours did.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Someone took it, and swiped it out from under me to intimidate me, and I fell on the floor and broke\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>\u2014and broke a glass; you know?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>And a lawsuit is coming. [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tKatherine has written a book\u2014it\u2019s really a memoir\u2014it\u2019s the memoir that no mom would ever want to write. It\u2019s called <em>A Prayer for Orion<\/em>. Take us back to the genesis of this story, when you first recognized that your son was in a bad place.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>He had anxiety from when he was a little kid. He had some sort of predisposing factors that, a lot of times, kids who end up struggling with drugs have. It had been going on for a long time; but he was, at the same time, a <em>really<\/em> good kid, just kind and thoughtful. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tProbably around middle school, something seemed to change with him. He had some <em>great<\/em> friends and, then, started hanging out with some iffy friends. However, he probably wasn\u2019t a great influence on them either. I think, a lot of times, kids\u2019 [parents] assume that somebody else is responsible\/some other kid is the one who\u2019s\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u201cOur kid\u2019s the good kid; it\u2019s the other kids who are the bad kids.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Exactly! Mine\u2019s probably the one that said, \u201cHey, I want some weed!\u201d\u2014you know, that\u2019s not always the way we picture it.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>When you started to see <em>that<\/em>\/some signs, did you have any idea of drugs?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>No; I would say no. It wasn\u2019t until one specific thing happened that I realized, \u201cUh-oh; this is bad. We\u2019re heading in the wrong direction.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Where did your son fit in the family birth order?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>He\u2019s the third\u2014only boy.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>The third of three.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>You guys are involved in ministry\u2014you\u2019re on Cru staff\u2014church is a part of life; Jesus is a part of life\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Yes; yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u2014that\u2019s the background and the foundation he\u2019s growing up in.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Yes, very much so.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>But you said there was one thing that was the wake-up call for you guys that: \u201cWe\u2019re dealing with something we never imagined we would be dealing with.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Right; it was when my daughter found him smoking weed with some friends. For us, that was a shock; because he just wasn\u2019t the kind of kid we ever thought would do that, which it usually is that situation for parents, who have a good kid. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe other thing is, as Christian parents, we think that it\u2019s a matter of: \u201cDo this and, then, this,\u201d \u201cDo this and, then, this\u201d; right? Did all the right things\u2014read the Bible stories at night, modeled a Christian life, loved each other\u2014all these sorts of things; so then, in my mind, anyway, it was sort of: \u201cWell, that\u2019s not going to happen.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>It\u2019s not like he saw mom and dad smoking weed.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Right, right; yes. \u201cWe did the right things; he would turn out to be the right kid\u201d; so that was a shock when he really was doing the wrong things.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>What happened? Your daughter tells you\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>\u2014did you go confront him?\u2014or did he own up to it? What happened?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>I think my daughter took him to youth group, dropped him off there, and then came and told me what they had been doing. I just went over and basically burst into the church and just like, \u201cGet over here right now!\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI was not the sort of mother that is an angry mother; I\u2019m just always like, \u201cI\u2019m not going to yell; I\u2019m going to be very sweet.\u201d I yelled, and I actually pushed him; I was like, \u201cYou <em>stupid<\/em> idiot! You <em>stupid<\/em>, <em>stupid<\/em> idiot!\u201d That was the beginning.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>When your daughter told you, what did you feel?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>Well, she\u2019s feeling angry!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>I know! I know! [Laughter] But anger is a second emotion; so I\u2019m wondering, \u201cWhat was the first emotion? What was at your gut level?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>Look at you!\u2014you\u2019re going deep!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Oh, get all deep on me! Now I have to\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>This is what happens when we talk at night!\u2014[Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>This is what happens; that\u2019s true.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>\u2014she\u2019s like, \u201cHoney, what are you really feeling?\u201d \u201cUh\u2026\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Oh, sort of, \u201cWhat did I do wrong?\u201d That\u2019s where my mind\u2014throughout our whole journey, constantly I struggled with that\u2014\u201cHow did we get here?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>I think a lot of us, as moms, think that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>How did he respond?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>He didn\u2019t fight back or say anything; he never said anything mean to me.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>What did he say?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>I don\u2019t know that he said anything at that point. He got in the car, and I drove him home; he sat down. My husband and I sat down with him, and we talked it through. But that was the general way things went in our home\u2014we would talk with him\u2014I\u2019m sure there was some sort of discipline; I don\u2019t know what it was.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>Let me ask Bob: \u201cIf you caught one of your kids in the same situation, what do you think you\u2019d do?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>I would hope that what I would do, first of all, is to pull back and pray and just say, \u201cLord, I\u2019m going to need to walk by the Spirit, whatever that\u2019s going to look like; and I need wisdom here to know what my full-of-grace-and-truth encounter with my child needs to look like.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Man, I should have done that! [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>I\u2019m not saying that\u2019s what I <em>would<\/em> have done!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>No; I\u2019m sure I prayed.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>This is from a dad of <em>grown<\/em> children now.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Well, that\u2019s right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>I\u2019m just thinking\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>Well, I\u2019m just going to say\u2014I\u2019m sitting beside a mom, who did exactly what you did.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Oh, okay. [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>With one of our sons, after a night of him getting drunk, I remember you going out there; and man, our neighbors heard that one!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>Yes; I will say that I probably reacted instead of responded. I think the base and the root of that was fear: \u201cIs this who you are? Is this who you\u2019re becoming?\u201d It was fear of what it could lead to, maybe.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>You\u2019re good; thank you! That\u2019s <em>exactly<\/em> what I felt! [Laughter] No, it is!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>Is it?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Yes!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>Yes; I\u2019ll tell you what\u2014that same son has said to me now, as an adult, \u201cI wish you would have been harder,\u201d\u2014I mean, sometimes the righteous anger is needed.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>This is where a calculated, Spirit-led approach\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>That\u2019s the key.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u2014because you have to have the wisdom of God; you don\u2019t have wisdom on your own in that moment. What you want to avoid is just a response of the flesh; that is, \u201cThis what I\u2019m feeling; therefore, I\u2019m justified in whatever I do at this moment.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>\u2014reacting.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>When the neighbors were hearing <em>you<\/em>, it was more\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>I might be exaggerating <em>a little<\/em>. [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>I wasn\u2019t yelling; I was having him dig out bushes. [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>Yes; she put him to work!\u2014like, \u201cYou think you\u2019re going to sleep in today?\u2014you\u2019re hungover. Watch this: you\u2019re working.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Was that a calculated Spirit-led response from you?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>I didn\u2019t pray; as I said, I reacted. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think God would probably give us a different response to each child, because He knows who they are. I really do wish I could go back, and talk to me as a younger mom and say, \u201cSit down; pray; ask God, and get wisdom,\u201d\u2014maybe even call people or whatever\u2014get some godly counsel. But no; I did not do that at the time.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>You hate to want to call anybody; because who wants to say, \u201cGuess what my son did last night?\u201d\u2014right?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>It\u2019s true!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>It\u2019s embarrassing.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>\u2014especially when you\u2019re in ministry.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>\u2014in ministry, and when it involves drinking.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>How was your husband a part of it? How was the marriage part?\u2014were you in tandem together?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Yes, I <em>trusted<\/em> my husband. I knew that, as I was going, getting him, that he was praying without ceasing. I think we were both clueless enough, where we were kind of like, \u201cI don\u2019t know what we should do.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Did you walk away from that confrontation with your son, thinking, \u201cWe\u2019re going to keep an eye on him, but I think this is probably a one-time thing,\u201d and \u201cWe\u2019ll watch, but I can\u2019t imagine that this is the direction that he\u2019s going to go\u201d?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>My fear had a lot to do with the fact that I <em>knew<\/em> he was susceptible to addiction; it runs in the family. Certain things about him\/some of the things he struggled with, I just knew that he was high risk for addiction. A lot of kids smoke pot, and it turns out to be something stupid they did when they were younger; but for my son, I really did know.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>Now, was there any sense\u2014I mean, like Bob said, you\u2019re this Christian family\/you\u2019re in full-time Christian work\u2014was there any sense of: \u201cWe have to hide this, or cover it up, or keep it quiet; we don\u2019t want the church to know\u201d? Or was it sort of out there?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>It was sort of out there, just because we were sort of set up that way. We\u2019d always had a very open home. Since the kids were young, we had seminary students\u2014and that sort of thing\u2014friends stayed with us, who needed a place to stay. Our kids have brought their friends over; it kind of just became known. We never had that option of: \u201cAre we going to tell people or are we not going to tell people?\u201d Although, I could see\u2014especially, a family in ministry\u2014how that would be really hard to make that decision, if you were ever given that situation, where you had to: \u201cWell, am I going to tell somebody or not tell somebody?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhen things just continued to get worse and worse with our son, I think, in the end, I\u2019m really grateful we had never been secretive with people. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>Yes; you know, so many churches, really\u2014and ministries\u2014they keep things that are darker\/that don\u2019t line up with what\u2019s supposed to be\u2014like you said earlier: \u201cA plus B should equal C,\u201d\u2014it\u2019s sad; but the church is often the place you hide the most rather than go, and be real, and find healing with other people going through the same thing.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Yes; that\u2019s true.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>This is true for people in the church, not just for people in leadership in a church; there\u2019s a sense: \u201cIf people <em>knew<\/em>, they would judge me.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>Right; sad.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>That\u2019s it.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u201cThey would conclude things about me,\u201d or \u201c\u2026about our parenting,\u201d or \u201c\u2026about our home.\u201d The reason some people feel that is because there are people who will.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>I think, too, it\u2019s interesting\u2014I got cancer later on. You know, if you get cancer, you get casseroles. [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>You get a kid doing drugs\/hard drugs, you get <em>silence<\/em>.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>It\u2019s a <em>unique<\/em> struggle to go through, having a prodigal.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>How did you handle the next several weeks or months?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Yes; we were clueless. It seemed like the more time that went past, we thought it was just a one-time thing. Our son was never a kid, who came through the door stumbling, and also never lost his temper with us; he was always <em>very<\/em> kind. It wasn\u2019t a clear thing until later.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>It\u2019s interesting\u2014even in your book, you don\u2019t name his name\u2014but you call him \u201cSweet boy\u201d throughout the entire book, which I thought, \u201cThat\u2019s so interesting.\u201d It reveals so much to me about him. Describe him to us\u2014the fact that that\u2019s the name you gave him in the book.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Yes; just from a young kid, he was a just a really kind, kind person. I remember one thing he did when he was a kid\u2014he probably would have been four our five, maybe\u2014we used the \u201cFour Spiritual Laws,\u201d which is a Cru thing that kind of shares Christ with people. He\u2019d seen this thing\/this little booklet; so he went up to his room, and he spent all this time and stapled together a little booklet, where he wrote his own four spiritual laws.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>Wow.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Then he went out to the street, and waited for cars to stop at the stop sign, because he wanted to share Christ with them. I remember standing there, thinking, \u201cThis is the most <em>amazing<\/em> thing; I can\u2019t believe he\u2019s doing this. What an awesome thing.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAt the same time, I\u2019m thinking, \u201cPlease don\u2019t do it! [Laughter] What am I going to say?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u201cThis is embarrassing the neighbors\u201d; yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>You know, I\u2019m kind of like, \u201cOh, where\u2019s my heart at?\u201d Anyway, that was one of the things he did as a really young kid.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>In that period of weeks or months\u2014when you thought, \u201cOkay; this was a one-time thing. We\u2019re not seeing anything; things are back to normal,\u201d\u2014was that because he was hiding better than he had before?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Probably; there was a time, where things got really unclear what was going on. Another thing that really showed me\u2014and this is a big deal, too\u2014was probably six months or so after that first youth group thing that happened, I did get the sense: \u201cI should, at least, be looking through his room. I need to, at least, be searching for things and make sure that I\u2019m doing what I can to make sure that he\u2019s not doing anything.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThere\u2019s a little crawlspace in his room. I got in there, and then there\u2019s this insulation that\u2019s stuck to the ceiling; and I pulled it down. There was one of these liter plastic Coke<sup>\u00ae<\/sup> bottles; and it had a hole in one side, and duct tape, and all sorts of strangeness going on with it. I was like, \u201cThis is so a drug paraphernalia thing. I have no idea exactly how it works; I guess it\u2019s a bong.\u201d I didn\u2019t know, but I Googled it. Yes, there were tons of them on there, so I knew exactly what it was then.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnother thing\u2014I just don\u2019t remember exactly how we handled it or what we did\u2014but probably sat in the living room, and talked again, and came up with some sort of a plan.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Discipline; yes. I\u2019m just imagining, as a parent, you don\u2019t want to overreact. But knowing, \u201cWhat\u2019s the right reaction?\u201d\u2014I don\u2019t think any of us <em>know<\/em> that in the moment.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>I think, as a mom, I would have been <em>freaking<\/em> out inside, just kind of panicky.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Yes! \u201cI found a homemade bong in the insulation,\u201d\u2014yes!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Yes; there\u2019s something desperate about that. That was a big wakeup call to me, for sure.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAs far as counseling goes, that was another tough thing; because he wasn\u2019t receptive to it at all. Anything that had to do with his own anxiety, really was like, \u201cHe\u2019s going to run away from it.\u201d It\u2019s not like, \u201cOh, I\u2019m going to make you go; so here\u2014go\u2014I\u2019m dropping you off.\u201d It was more of: \u201cHe\u2019s going to run.\u201d That really had more to do with the anxiety than anything else.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>If you would say, \u201cWhat are you afraid of?\u201d he couldn\u2019t come up with answer for you.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Oh, no, no, no. I don\u2019t know if he didn\u2019t get it himself or whatever. I think he puzzled himself; I don\u2019t think he knew exactly why.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>There had to be\u2014I\u2019m guessing we all do this as parents\u2014we\u2019re just, \u201cWhat did I, as a parent\/did we, as parents, contribute to make this what\u2019s happening with our son?\u201d Is that where you were living? I can imagine lying in bed <em>every night<\/em>.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Katherine: <\/strong>Yes; absolutely.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>The answer to that is: \u201cMaybe there are things you could or couldn\u2019t have done; but ultimately, kids make their own decisions. God pours grace on our parenting mistakes; and we have to own what was our contribution, if there is a contribution we made; but we can\u2019t own the choice a child makes and say, \u2018We were responsible. If we had done this right or this wrong, we could have spared our son.\u2019 There\u2019s no guarantee on any of that.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>The hard thing is, too, that we need to remember\u2014is the spiritual battle going on\u2014even for us, as parents, where the accuser is <em>constantly<\/em> accusing us\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann: <\/strong>\u2014and getting us to feel <em>so horrible<\/em> about\u00a0 maybe what we\u2019ve done as a parent. He loves to put the blame on us.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI\u2019m sure there are things, for every single parent, we have done wrong; but there\u2019s still that point of saying, \u201cGod, I need to hear from You; protect my mind and my heart,\u201d\u2014that surrender, continually, of your child and yourself to Him.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave: <\/strong>Yes; I told you\u2014you know, I guess I can say this\u2014we\u2019re finishing up this parenting book. I got up at 4:30 this morning and doing edits. I keep, as I\u2019m reading it, trying to say, \u201cOkay, there\u2019s no way we\u2019re saying, \u2018If you do this, you\u2019ll get this.\u2019\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou think\/you\u2019re writing a parenting\u2014like, \u201cOh, I want to read this; because they\u2019re going to tell us\u2026\u201d It\u2019s like, \u201cNo; we <em>can\u2019t<\/em> guarantee <em>anything<\/em>, but I can guarantee one thing,\u201d\u2014and I know you know this\u2014\u201cThere is a God; He can be trusted. He\u2019s with you in the cave\/in the crawlspace; He\u2019s there in that moment,\u201d\u2014that\u2019s all I can guarantee; I can\u2019t guarantee anything besides that. There are Scriptures\/there are principles in His Word; but at the end of the day, your son or daughter is going to make decisions that make no sense sometimes. There\u2019s a God that\u2019s with them and with you, and you can trust Him.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Lots of prayer\/lots of wise counsel to open your story to others, who you can trust, who can pray with you, and give you godly guidance in your journey. Maybe, together with others, read a book like the one Katherine\u2019s written called <em>A Prayer for Orion: A Son\u2019s Addiction and a Mother\u2019s Love<\/em>. We have copies of the book in our <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> Resource Center. You can order your copy from us, online, at FamilyLifeToday.com. Again, our website is FamilyLifeToday.com. The book is called <em>A Prayer for Orion<\/em> by Katherine James. On our website, you\u2019ll find additional resources\/help for parents, who have children, who are involved in substance abuse. Again, the website is FamilyLifeToday.com.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNow, this is the last opportunity I\u2019ll have to encourage <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> listeners\u2014those of you who listen regularly\u2014today\u2019s the last day for us, here, at FamilyLife to be able to take advantage of a very generous $2.7 million-matching gift that has been made available to us during the month of December. We need to hear from you today, before midnight in your time zone. You can go online at FamilyLifeToday.com, or you can call us at 1-800-FL-TODAY to make a yearend donation. When you do, your donation will be matched, dollar for dollar; we\u2019ll be one step closer to being able to take full advantage of the $2.7 million-matching gift. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIn addition, we\u2019d love to send you, as a thank-you gift, a couple of things, actually. We\u2019ll send you a copy of my book, <em>Love Like You Mean It<\/em>, all about what 1 Corinthians 13 teaches us about what real love in marriage looks like. And we\u2019ll send you a flash drive with more than 100 of the best <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> radio programs from the last \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t28 years\u2014programs with Dennis and Barbara Rainey, with Dave and Ann Wilson, with many of the guests we\u2019ve had here; programs about marriage and parenting\u2014really, the best of the best. The flash drive and the book are our way of saying, \u201cThank you for your generous yearend contribution.\u201d Be as generous as you can be today, if you would. Make your donation, online, at FamilyLifeToday.com; or call 1-800-FL-TODAY and help us end this year where we need to be. We look forward to hearing from you.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe hope you have a safe New Year\u2019s Eve and a happy new year. Hope you can join us back tomorrow as we\u2019re going to hear from Katherine James about her son\u2019s first overdose and how that landed him in the hospital. We\u2019ll pick up the story tomorrow. I hope you can be with us for that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch, along with our entire broadcast production team. On behalf of our hosts, Dave and Ann Wilson, I\u2019m Bob Lepine. We will see you back tomorrow for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas; a Cru<sup>\u00ae <\/sup>Ministry. Help for today. Hope for tomorrow.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright <sup>\u00a9<\/sup> 2020 FamilyLife. 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