{"id":306625,"date":"2020-12-18T07:00:05","date_gmt":"2020-12-18T12:00:05","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/%series%\/seeing-the-truth-in-temptations\/"},"modified":"2020-12-18T07:00:05","modified_gmt":"2020-12-18T12:00:05","slug":"seeing-the-truth-in-temptations","status":"publish","type":"podcast","link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/seeing-the-truth-in-temptations\/","title":{"rendered":"Seeing The Truth in Temptations"},"content":{"rendered":"","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Sexual temptation is everywhere! As believers, what do we do? Dave and Ann Wilson talk with Carolyn Weber, about seeing the battle for purity with new eyes.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":91,"featured_media":294104,"menu_order":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","template":"","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","inline_featured_image":false,"_uag_custom_page_level_css":"","episode_type":"","audio_file":"https:\/\/mp3.familylife.com\/fl2020-12-18.mp3","cover_image":"","cover_image_id":"","duration":"00:29:40","filesize":"27.16M","filesize_raw":"28482834","date_recorded":"","explicit":"","block":""},"categories":[2906,2817,2822],"tags":[4299],"podcast_series":[8417],"cwp_profile":[8824],"series":[2101],"class_list":["post-306625","podcast","type-podcast","status-publish","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-becoming-a-christian","category-choosing-a-spouse","category-growing-in-your-faith","tag-faith","podcast_series-the-battle-for-purity-in-todays-world","cwp_profile-carolyn-weber","series-familylife-today"],"acf":[],"episode_featured_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/09\/FLT-Podcast-Cover-2-508x508-3.jpg?w=508","episode_player_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2023\/02\/image-scaled.jpg","download_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-download\/306625\/seeing-the-truth-in-temptations","player_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-player\/306625\/seeing-the-truth-in-temptations","audio_player":null,"episode_data":{"playerMode":"light","subscribeUrls":{"apple_podcasts":{"key":"apple_podcasts","url":"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303?mt=2&app=podcast","label":"Apple Podcasts","class":"apple_podcasts","icon":"apple-podcasts.png"},"google_podcasts":{"key":"google_podcasts","url":"","label":"Google Podcasts","class":"google_podcasts","icon":"google-podcasts.png"},"spotify":{"key":"spotify","url":"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm","label":"Spotify","class":"spotify","icon":"spotify.png"},"youtube":{"key":"youtube","url":"","label":"YouTube","class":"youtube","icon":"youtube.png"}},"rssFeedUrl":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/feed\/podcast\/familylife-today","embedCode":"<blockquote class=\"wp-embedded-content\" data-secret=\"aNsf5WFKze\"><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/seeing-the-truth-in-temptations\/\">Seeing The Truth in Temptations<\/a><\/blockquote><iframe sandbox=\"allow-scripts\" security=\"restricted\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/seeing-the-truth-in-temptations\/embed\/#?secret=aNsf5WFKze\" width=\"500\" height=\"350\" title=\"&#8220;Seeing The Truth in Temptations&#8221; &#8212; FamilyLife\u00ae - A Cru Ministry\" data-secret=\"aNsf5WFKze\" frameborder=\"0\" marginwidth=\"0\" marginheight=\"0\" scrolling=\"no\" class=\"wp-embedded-content\"><\/iframe><script>\n\/*! This file is auto-generated *\/\n!function(d,l){\"use strict\";l.querySelector&&d.addEventListener&&\"undefined\"!=typeof URL&&(d.wp=d.wp||{},d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage||(d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage=function(e){var t=e.data;if((t||t.secret||t.message||t.value)&&!\/[^a-zA-Z0-9]\/.test(t.secret)){for(var s,r,n,a=l.querySelectorAll('iframe[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),o=l.querySelectorAll('blockquote[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),c=new RegExp(\"^https?:$\",\"i\"),i=0;i<o.length;i++)o[i].style.display=\"none\";for(i=0;i<a.length;i++)s=a[i],e.source===s.contentWindow&&(s.removeAttribute(\"style\"),\"height\"===t.message?(1e3<(r=parseInt(t.value,10))?r=1e3:~~r<200&&(r=200),s.height=r):\"link\"===t.message&&(r=new URL(s.getAttribute(\"src\")),n=new URL(t.value),c.test(n.protocol))&&n.host===r.host&&l.activeElement===s&&(d.top.location.href=t.value))}},d.addEventListener(\"message\",d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage,!1),l.addEventListener(\"DOMContentLoaded\",function(){for(var e,t,s=l.querySelectorAll(\"iframe.wp-embedded-content\"),r=0;r<s.length;r++)(t=(e=s[r]).getAttribute(\"data-secret\"))||(t=Math.random().toString(36).substring(2,12),e.src+=\"#?secret=\"+t,e.setAttribute(\"data-secret\",t)),e.contentWindow.postMessage({message:\"ready\",secret:t},\"*\")},!1)))}(window,document);\n\/\/# sourceURL=https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-includes\/js\/wp-embed.min.js\n<\/script>\n"},"spectra_custom_meta":{"_wp_page_template":["default"],"transcript_url":["https:\/\/transcript.familylife.com\/fl2020-12-18.pdf"],"audio_file":["https:\/\/mp3.familylife.com\/fl2020-12-18.mp3"],"transcript_content":["<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> As a university student at Oxford, Carolyn Weber wasn\u2019t really spending a lot of time thinking carefully about many of her life choices. She says she was just kind of going along with the cultural flow. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> I wasn\u2019t really, really promiscuous; and I wasn\u2019t dating all over the place. I was just sort of midstream in many things; I get this with students I even talk with now. They\u2019ll say so many of the same things to me\u2014Christian or non-Christian\/secular campus or Christian campus\u2014where \u201cI had this one night stand,\u201d or \u201cI\u2019ve had this relationship that\u2019s fallen apart.\u201d They identify this longing, but there\u2019s just not really anything to slot it into\u2014like Pascale said\u2014that \u201cGod-shaped void that we all have.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> This is <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> for Friday, December 18<sup>th<\/sup>. Our hosts are Dave and Ann Wilson; I\u2019m Bob Lepine. You can find us online at FamilyLifeToday.com. We\u2019ll talk today with Carolyn Weber about the longings that Jesus came to satisfy. Stay with us. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd welcome to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. Thanks for joining us. I wonder if other husbands or wives have felt, as I have felt on occasion; maybe, you\u2019ve felt this way. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I don\u2019t know, Bob; you haven\u2019t told me what we\u2019re talking about yet. [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> I wonder if folks have ever felt like, in the midst of marital conflict, somehow you are no longer obligated to be faithful to your spouse. I just wonder how the enemy uses conflict in our lives and in our marriages\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> And you want us to actually answer that? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I was going to say, \u201cWhy don\u2019t you tell us about that, Bob?\u201d [Laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> That\u2019s a pretty deep one. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> What I\u2019ve said is\u2014I\u2019ve had that impulse\u2014I have to think that\u2019s an impulse that is one of those whispers that we hear in our ear from the enemy\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Oh, yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> \u2014how he uses conflict to try to sow seeds in a marriage. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I think the secret is identifying the whisperer\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u2014as the enemy, because we don\u2019t always think that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> The reason I bring this up is we have a friend, who is joining us on <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>, Carolyn Weber. Carolyn, welcome back. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> Thank you, again, for having me. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Carolyn\u2019s thinking, \u201cPlease don\u2019t ask <em>me<\/em> that question, Bob.\u201d [Laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> The reason I kind of leaned into that question is because we\u2019re talking, this week, about a book that you\u2019ve written called <em>Sex and the City of God<\/em>. You were pretty transparent; this is a memoir\u2014where you\u2019re talking about your views on relationships and on sexuality\u2014how you viewed it before you came to Christ, how that shifted after you came to Christ, and how that has influenced your marriage relationship. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou talk a lot about your dad in this book and about your relationship with him. But you tell a story here about a conflict in your marriage\u2014a time when you and Kent had had an argument\u2014and you found yourself separated from him\u2014not legally separated\u2014you were off for a few days to do some writing. There was a flash of temptation that came at <em>you<\/em> in that moment; wasn\u2019t there? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> Yes; absolutely. I think what Ann was saying about thoughts\u2014you know?\u2014thoughts are where sins start\/the freewill of our thoughts. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI did not grow up with fellowship, and I think fellowship is <em>so<\/em> important. I actually was really hesitant and wary of it\u2014kind of like C.S. Lewis\u2014you know, I like church; but I don\u2019t like going to church and people at church. [Laughter] My life has been really changed by fellowship, by realizing that my husband can\u2019t be everything to me; and I can\u2019t be everything to him\u2014that is God\u2019s job; only God can do that\u2014but also, that my fellowship with other believers can sustain me in that walk. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThis is, again, why I love Jesus people\u2014why I love sitting with all of\/with you guys, too\u2014is that you can go deep, and you can go shallow with people in the Lord. You can talk about the things that really matter and the things that are really hurtful, or painful, or difficult. You can also laugh about the lighthearted things and the joy. To have that kind of safety with anyone: you can be deeper with somebody in an elevator, who knows Christ, in a few minutes than you can be with someone you\u2019ve known your whole life. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Tell our listeners the story of what happened\u2014I don\u2019t know if you even remember what the source of the conflict was\u2014but tell them about this time when you were at the cabin at the lake, and you and Kent had not been getting along. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> That\u2019s why I brought up fellowship, because I was feeling very lonely in my marriage; and I\u2019m sure Kent would say the same thing. We all do, at times, feel lonely in relationship; and even with our relationship with God, we can feel that way in consolation and desolation. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think it was a combination for us, personally, of probably sleep deprivation\u2014you know, when you\u2019ve had four children under six and that sort of thing\u2014and the things that everybody goes through in life. There are highs and lows in every marriage, and I think there are struggles of all different types. I\u2019d been through a serious illness. We\u2019d had a very difficult situation, in which our family was actually facing a crime that had happened. There was some really dark, dark stuff that we were under pressure for. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThis happens in different ways to all of us\u2014where, really, we should be coming closer together and seeking each other even more so, as that kind of mini-covenant\u2014a lot of times, we push apart because of anger\/because of fear. When you are in a lot of pain, especially in a relationship, it\u2019s hard to have conversation. It\u2019s hard to share those emotions, and it\u2019s hard to really practice holy listening. We want to do a lot of talking; we want to do a lot of <em>yelling<\/em>; we want to do a lot of <em>judging<\/em>; but we don\u2019t want to do a lot of holy listening. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI was at a place, where I just actually stepped away to do some work, but also just some quiet. A lot of things can happen in that space when we\u2019re really, really vulnerable. Again, it goes back to the Garden of Eden; right? We are most likely to be attacked when we are alone. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> There is a lot to be said, even out of obedience, of surrounding yourself with others in Christ or, at least, be in touch with them, or in prayer with them, or whatever at times when you feel threadbare. I was in a situation, where a temptation was particularly tempting, because I wanted connection and relationship more than anything; but again, like any other temptation, it\u2019s just an illusion. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> You\u2019ve found yourself just a short distance from where your ex-fianc\u00e9 might have been staying. You saw his pickup truck outside the home. You\u2019re away on your own; and the thought pops into your mind, \u201cMaybe, I\u2019ll go knock on the door and just say, \u2018Hi.\u2019\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> Yes; that old thought: \u201cOh, nothing serious,\u201d \u201cOh, I\u2019m not really looking for anything,\u201d \u201cOh, I just\u2026\u201d\u2014the old \u201cthe grass is always greener\u201d\u2014\u201cYou know, I might just go say, \u2018Hello\u2019; or see what <em>could<\/em> have been; or say, \u2018Hi\u2019; or whatever else. Those kind of thoughts come from a place of really not being\u2014not only not being obedient\u2014but not being held up in the faith by others when you can\u2019t do it or you feel like your well is low. I shared, too\u2014how, really, in a Holy Spirit way\u2014others do come to your aid in that sense or, especially, if you can\u2019t always turn to prayer\/pray it through. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think it doesn\u2019t always have to be where something is really, really in a horrible state for it to be where it\u2019s corroding you. Water wears down rock as well. Sometimes, just that sort of discontent or that way of not wanting to turn to God to fulfill those needs, can start to really wear at you in whatever relationship. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br>I guess it was the old metaphor: \u201cI\u2019m just going to go knock and see what\u2026\u201d\u2014how I can feel that need, but it was the wrong kind of knocking. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> What kept you from knocking on the door? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> Two things: I would say grace\u2014[Laughter]\u2014is a big one. I think we have <em>no<\/em> idea the warfare done on our behalf. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> We have no idea the constant warfare. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> We just take it for granted. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI also think that, again, I had sisters in Christ that I\u2019ve always been amazed at their connection with me. When I text them and say, \u201cYou know what? That was exactly what I needed right now.\u201d \u201cOh, sure! I was just thinking of you; you were on my heart,\u201d\u2014you know\u2014\u201cI was praying for you,\u201d or \u201cYou were on my heart,\u201d or whatever. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think it was those two things, and then really a recognition of the fact that God loves my husband as much as He loves me; and that we have been put together for a reason; and that the things that I am dealing with in <em>my<\/em> own heart, actually, really have nothing to do with him\u2014they are between me and God. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Dave:<\/strong> I think, you know, one of my favorite authors has said, \u201cEvery time a person is tempted, there is a lot at stake.\u201d I don\u2019t think we often think there is a lot at stake. He says, \u201cYour faith is at stake; your family; and your future.\u201d That\u2019s really true. Sometimes\u2014and you talk about this in the book\u2014it\u2019s like, \u201cWhat\u2019s God\u2019s perspective on love, sex, and relationships?\u201d There is a lot at stake.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou know\u2014I\u2019ll share quickly\u2014but I had a knock on my door, talking about the knock. When Ann and I were dating\u2014I\u2019m a brand-new Christian\u2014this is the first time I\u2019ve ever been in a God-centered, Jesus-foundation relationship; right? My old girlfriend knocks on my house. We had dated for four years; I\u2019m going to marry her\u2014she\u2019s the one. Long story short, we broke up because of me finding Christ and her not\u2014similar to your story, Carolyn\u2014so I leave her and move on. This is six or seven months later; she knocks on my door, out of nowhere, and says, \u201cI made the biggest mistake of my life; I want you back.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI\u2019m a brand-new person now; I\u2019m just looking at her at the front door. She\u2019s like, \u201cCan we talk?\u201d I\u2019m thinking, \u201cNo! No!\u201d; you know? [Laughter] But here is what\u2019s amazing\u2014I get in the car, and I drive with her\u2014it\u2019s really interesting, Bob, because we ended up at the football stadium, where I play college football, and just pulled in the parking lot. No one is there, and we\u2019re talking. She\u2019s basically trying to convince me, \u201cWe should get back together.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI\u2019m falling in love with Ann; our relationship is about Christ. I\u2019m on an <em>amazing<\/em> journey. My faith has never been stronger\u2014a lot of it <em>because<\/em> of the relationship I had with Ann\u2014so I look at her, and I have this choice. I\u2019m thinking, \u201cWow; I used to love her, maybe?\u201d\u2014as I\u2019m looking at her. Again, I have no thought in my head that: \u201cThe stakes are high right now,\u201d\u2014no thought of that\u2014\u201cYour family, your future, your faith is at stake.\u201d None of that was in my mind; all I knew was: \u201cI have a choice to make.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI can take you to that parking spot; because it was a significant moment when I go, \u201cYou know what? We\u2019re done. I\u2019m a new person in Christ; I have a new future. I have a whole new <em>purpose<\/em> in my life, and I don\u2019t know if I am going to marry Ann or not; but she is going where I am going, and I\u2019m going to keep pursuing that. I\u2019m sorry to say this, but we\u2019re done. I don\u2019t know if I will ever talk to you again the rest of our lives.\u201d I drove back to my house, and she got in her car and drove away; and I\u2019ve never talked to her the rest of my life. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut here is the interesting thing\u2014three or four years ago, I\u2019m back at the university for an alumni football team golf outing, of all things\u2014my son is with me\/my youngest son. I said, \u201cHey, let\u2019s go over to the stadium,\u201d\u2014because he is playing college football\u2014\u201cYou\u2019re going to play in the stadium, where I played.\u201d As we pull into that parking lot, what hits me? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> \u2014that memory. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u201cThere is the parking spot!\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I pull up <em>with<\/em> Cody, and I tell him this story. Now, when he\u2019s preaching at my church, he goes, \u201cMy dad told me this story that would have changed <em>everything<\/em> if he had made a different decision.\u201d I thought, \u201cWow; your faith, your family, your future really are at stake.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCarolyn, your whole <em>life<\/em> is what it is now because of this choice you made and that knock. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I\u2019m just thinking\/the listener that is listening right now: \u201cJust don\u2019t underestimate this. I know you\u2019re being tempted; we all are. There are moments that are so significant: Don\u2019t forget. It\u2019s <em>that<\/em> critical; you make the right choice.\u2019\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> They may be saying, \u201cBut you don\u2019t know who I am married to. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u201cYou don\u2019t know what I\u2019m <em>not<\/em> getting in my marriage.\u201d That\u2019s probably true that we could <em>all <\/em>say that in some respect, but you don\u2019t know what God has in store for you. There is always hope for us in our relationship with Him. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> Absolutely; and our bodies are not our own; and other people\u2019s bodies\u2014we have to be respectful of those. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI was thinking of your story, Dave, where you, not only protected your heart, but also that heart of that former girlfriend. You never know in what way, shape, or form it might speak to you. I remember that really spoke to me when I first met Kent, because he didn\u2019t make a pass at me. He didn\u2019t make a move on me or whatever, not as\u2014because he will laugh and joke\u2014he wasn\u2019t \u201cholier than thou\u201d; but you know, it really spoke to me\u2014and not in some sort of cheesy talk of purity and everything else\u2014but actually, in this way of respect for this other person as well. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIf you had just gone to the parking lot with her, yes, that would have changed all of your future decisions and path, and your relationship with your children, and everything else; but also, you don\u2019t know the effect on her as well. It might have really dismantled her opportunity to really understand and recognize an example of the faith or the respect towards her own spirit and body as well. We are in relationship with others. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Carolyn, there is one other story you tell in the book that I just have to have you comment on; because as I was reading it, I was thinking, \u201cThis sounds like a Nicholas Sparks\u2019 book\u201d\u2014you know?\u2014it\u2019s the kiss. [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I mean, the way you describe it. I have never heard of a kiss\u2014I\u2019m like, \u201cThis must be the most <em>amazing<\/em>\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> \u2014\u201ckiss ever.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u2014\u201ckiss ever in the history of the world!\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> This is the first time Kent kissed you, and it was a while after you wished he had kissed you. You\u2019d been wanting\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> Oh, yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> \u2014him to kiss you for a while. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> He took <em>forever<\/em>. [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Well, you don\u2019t even say his name. In most of the book, you call him TDH. Tell us about that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> \u2014which mortifies him. [Laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> TDH stands for Tall, Dark, and Handsome; right? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> Tall, Dark, and Handsome\u2014it\u2019s what all my friends called him at Oxford, too\u2014that\u2014and \u201cTheology Guy.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> So were his lips warm? [Laughter] I mean, what in the world happened? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> I will tell you\u2014it just takes <em>one<\/em>\u2014and it is <em>worth<\/em> the wait. [Laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> What was the setting? Where did the kiss happen? Were you instantly transformed? [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> Well, I think God gives you certain memories in your marriage to keep you going at times; right?\u2014so, \u201cTake this and remember me for good reason\u201d; right? Yes; it was in my college\/at my college, when I was a dean. I had invited him for guest night dinner. It was a very beautiful black tie affair. At that point, we had known each other for a long time; and neither of us were seeing anybody. It was that sort of thing\u2014we had had this long-standing deep friendship\u2014and it had grown a little more serious, where he had visited a few more times. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYes, we knew it was getting serious; and we knew that we were both committed Christians. I had this time where, actually, I knew he was something special, years before; but I was really gifted with the time in which to grow in my own faith. We were actually physically separated for quite some time; I never thought I was going to see him again. So when it picked up, it did get serious fast. Then he kissed me after that guest night dinner, and it was <em>incredible<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> He shows up with the tuxedo on\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> \u2014and with a rose for you, and you have the dinner. Then were you out, walking, after dinner?\u2014is that what it was? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> No; we had gone back upstairs in the college. I had this beautiful office and set of rooms upstairs in a turret, which you can only have in a place like Oxford. It\u2019s just crazy over-the-top what your bedroom and office nook looks like. He kissed me up there; it was very princess like. It was literally the top of a turret. [Laughter] God is such a show off; because you know, I kicked against all that stuff forever; but it was really very fairytale like, even in terms of the setting. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI really admired that he didn\u2019t toy with me or take advantage of me when I was searching for the faith, and asking questions, and had broken up [with someone else], and had been in a very emotional, vulnerable position. He really waited until he was very, very sure; because he said he knew that there would be a responsibility with that, at least, in good faith; right? He remembered his father always saying to him, \u201cYou know, you\u2019re going to have these temptations\u2014and you are a guy; and that\u2019s really, really normal\u2014but really, think of the girl\u2019s heart too. Really, think of how you are respecting her in this situation.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI believe that with my whole heart. I think that we are all made in the reflection of God, and we have to respect that innate dignity. One of those ways is not to be thinking about: \u201cHey, I want to kiss this woman!\u201d Think about: \u201cWhat\u2019s the effect if you do?\u201d \u201cWhat are the consequences if you do, for her, as well?\u201d He had really carefully thought that out. It was: \u201cWow! It was good.\u201d [Laughter] I can see why He declared it good! [Laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> This is so much at what is at the heart of your book\u2014is the idea that, when we think about relationships, and when we think about sexuality, and when we think about how we\u2019re interacting with others, we can\u2019t just be thinking about: \u201cWhat am I getting out of this?\u201d or \u201cWhat\u2019s my desire?\u201d or \u201cHow do I <em>benefit<\/em> from this?\u201d We really have to <em>care<\/em> <em>for<\/em> the other people we\u2019re relating to and have <em>their<\/em> best interests at heart in order to be doing what Jesus is calling us to do. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Yes; one of the things that struck me, as I read your book\u2014and by the way, I couldn\u2019t put it down. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> When I started reading from Page 1, I turned to Ann and said, \u201cOh my goodness! You\u2019ve got to read this book. It\u2019s just so\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u2014 \u201cit\u2019s compelling.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> Thank you. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> It\u2019s so <em>beautifully<\/em> written too. I want to read a paragraph\u2014but I\u2019m not going to do that\u2014but here\/here\u2019s what really struck me\u2014and I don\u2019t even know if this was part of your goal in the book\u2014but I was really struck with how beautifully Kent treated you\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u2014as you dated\u2014even what you described: the kiss was so magnificent, because of the way you were treated by him as a precious jewel\/valued. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> He cared for your heart.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Yes; as a husband now\u2014I hope every man that would read it would be <em>challenged<\/em> to think, \u201cAm I treating my bride\u201d\u2014married one year or married forty\u2014\u201clike that?\u201d because that\u2019s the love of God. He\u2014you were precious; I\u2019m guessing you still are. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI know marriage is hard\u2014you\u2019ve got kids and all that\u2014but you\u2019re precious, and he modeled for us the love of God. I\u2019m sure you did that back as well; but I really caught that, as a man, reading the book, like, \u201cI want to treat Ann that way: after 40 years, she should not feel any less than she did when we were engaged.\u201d That was <em>such<\/em> a beautiful picture of the heart and love of God. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> Well, thank you for sharing that; because I did write it from a very deep place over a long period of time. I didn\u2019t mean for the title to be salacious at all. If you told me I was going to write a book with the word, \u201csex,\u201d in it, I never would have guessed that, as a literature professor and homeschooling mom; you know? [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut I was beginning to think, \u201cWhat do I want to tell my own children?\u201d\u2014that\u2019s exactly\u2014thinking about what to tell my sons\/thinking about what to tell my daughter. In high school, they are not sending them home with any relational information\/with any sense of how you are treating somebody because you believe they are\/fully believe they are precious and, also, looking at how incredibly beautiful marriage is as this mini-covenant. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe all get battle-weary; we all get tired; and the world comes at us. We\u2019re always so busy; and we have a million needs\u2014as parents and sandwich generations, too, caring for the elderly and for our children\u2014so many things can come at us and so many temptations and issues. But really working to protect that precious is so important\u2014that sort of sacred space between the two of you\u2014is really, really important. I would say that that\u2019s really what spoke to me. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThat, also really\/it really spoke to my faith. I think we are, also, there to bolster each other\u2019s faith in marriage and help each other on our journey. We\u2019re not responsible for each other that way; ultimately, that\u2019s with God; but that authenticity of seeing someone try to model that out and try to live that; and the decisions might not always be right or perfect. Even when there is tension or disagreement, there is a willingness to have conversation; there is a willingness to remember that that person is precious\u2014is everything. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes; Carolyn, thank you for the book; thanks for the conversation. Tell Kent we said, \u201cHi.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> I will; thank you. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> I hope his kiss today is just as nice as the first one. [Laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> Well, we have a lot more viewers now in terms of the kids\u2014[Laughter]\u2014a house of seven\u2014so it\u2019s not real easy to have an intimate kiss; but you know, I\u2019ll tell him that; and we\u2019ll go for it. [Laughter] I\u2019ll say you guys recommend it. Thank you! [Laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Absolutely; let me encourage listeners to get a copy of the book we\u2019ve been talking about. It\u2019s Carolyn Weber\u2019s book, <em>Sex and the City of God<\/em>: <em>A Memoir of Love and Longing<\/em>. We\u2019ve got it in our <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> Resource Center. You can order it from us, online, at FamilyLifeToday.com; or you can call 1-800-FL-TODAY to get a copy. Again, the title of the book is <em>Sex and the City of God<\/em> by Carolyn Weber. Order online at FamilyLifeToday.com, or call 1-800-FL-TODAY to request your copy of Carolyn\u2019s book. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNow, we have got the president of FamilyLife<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>, David Robbins, who is joining us in the studio today to talk a little bit about the impact this ministry is having in the lives of <em>so<\/em> many people. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>David:<\/strong> We had a father write to us recently; and he shared, \u201cYour broadcasts are a blessing to my life: first, as a follower of Jesus; but secondly, now that I\u2019m 36, I don\u2019t have the wisdom and the training to disciple my kids and to pass this truth on to my family. You guys are equipping me with those biblical principles so that our kids don\u2019t wither when they are sent out into the world, but they know how to thrive.\u201d It is <em>so<\/em> encouraging to get feedback like that and know we are equipping and impacting a father but, also, his kids. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAs we\u2019re here at the end of this very unprecedented crazy year, I invite you\u2014and may I, also, say\u2014\u201cI challenge you to join with us in our mission to reach every home. God is impacting and equipping our children and our children\u2019s children and leaving a lasting legacy for the kingdom. Would you financially partner with us to <em>advance<\/em> the kingdom of God and equip marriages and families all across the world? Your gifts are <em>making<\/em> a kingdom difference.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> We\u2019ve had some exciting news this week as well. We\u2019ve had an increase in the matching-gift amount that is available in our matching-gift fund. What was a $2 million-matching-gift fund is now a $2.7 million-matching-gift fund. The need is more urgent for <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> listeners; we need <em>you<\/em> to give so we can take full advantage of this increased matching-gift opportunity. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhen you give, we\u2019d like to send you a couple of thank-you gifts. We\u2019ll send you a copy of my book, <em>Love Like You Mean It<\/em>; and we\u2019ll send you a flash drive that includes more than 100 of the best <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> programs from the last 28 years. You can give your gift, online, at FamilyLifeToday.com; or you can call 1-800-FL-TODAY to donate. Thanks, in advance, for whatever you are able to do. We appreciate you. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe hope you have a great weekend. Hope you and your family are able to worship together in your local church this weekend, however your church is meeting. I hope you can join us back on Monday when we\u2019re going to talk about the challenges blended families face during the holiday season. Ron Deal, the head of FamilyLife Blended<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>, will join us, along with some special guests to have that conversation. I hope you can join us as well. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch, along with our entire broadcast production team. On behalf of our hosts, Dave and Ann Wilson, I\u2019m Bob Lepine. We will see you back next time for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas; a Cru<sup>\u00ae <\/sup>Ministry. Help for today. Hope for tomorrow.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright <sup>\u00a9<\/sup> 2020 FamilyLife. All rights reserved.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/\">www.FamilyLife.com<\/a>\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\n\t\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\t1\n\t\t\t\t<\/p>"],"_seopress_titles_title":[""],"_seopress_titles_desc":[""],"_seopress_robots_index":[""],"duration":["00:29:40"],"show_notes":[""],"_thumbnail_id":["294104"],"filesize":["27.16M"],"filesize_raw":["28482834"],"_uag_css_file_name":["uag-css-306625.css"],"_uag_js_file_name":["uag-js-306625.js"],"_uag_page_assets":["a:9:{s:3:\"css\";s:82560:\".wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape-top svg{width: calc( 100% + 1.3px );}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape.uagb-container__shape-top .uagb-container__shape-fill{fill: rgba(51,51,51,1);}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape-bottom svg{width: calc( 100% + 1.3px );}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape.uagb-container__shape-bottom 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temptation is everywhere! As believers, what do we do? Dave and Ann Wilson talk with Carolyn Weber, about seeing the battle for purity with new eyes.","meta_box":{"show_notes":"","transcript_url":"https:\/\/transcript.familylife.com\/fl2020-12-18.pdf","transcript_content":"<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> As a university student at Oxford, Carolyn Weber wasn\u2019t really spending a lot of time thinking carefully about many of her life choices. She says she was just kind of going along with the cultural flow. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> I wasn\u2019t really, really promiscuous; and I wasn\u2019t dating all over the place. I was just sort of midstream in many things; I get this with students I even talk with now. They\u2019ll say so many of the same things to me\u2014Christian or non-Christian\/secular campus or Christian campus\u2014where \u201cI had this one night stand,\u201d or \u201cI\u2019ve had this relationship that\u2019s fallen apart.\u201d They identify this longing, but there\u2019s just not really anything to slot it into\u2014like Pascale said\u2014that \u201cGod-shaped void that we all have.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> This is <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> for Friday, December 18<sup>th<\/sup>. Our hosts are Dave and Ann Wilson; I\u2019m Bob Lepine. You can find us online at FamilyLifeToday.com. We\u2019ll talk today with Carolyn Weber about the longings that Jesus came to satisfy. Stay with us. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd welcome to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. Thanks for joining us. I wonder if other husbands or wives have felt, as I have felt on occasion; maybe, you\u2019ve felt this way. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I don\u2019t know, Bob; you haven\u2019t told me what we\u2019re talking about yet. [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> I wonder if folks have ever felt like, in the midst of marital conflict, somehow you are no longer obligated to be faithful to your spouse. I just wonder how the enemy uses conflict in our lives and in our marriages\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> And you want us to actually answer that? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I was going to say, \u201cWhy don\u2019t you tell us about that, Bob?\u201d [Laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> That\u2019s a pretty deep one. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> What I\u2019ve said is\u2014I\u2019ve had that impulse\u2014I have to think that\u2019s an impulse that is one of those whispers that we hear in our ear from the enemy\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Oh, yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> \u2014how he uses conflict to try to sow seeds in a marriage. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I think the secret is identifying the whisperer\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u2014as the enemy, because we don\u2019t always think that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> The reason I bring this up is we have a friend, who is joining us on <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>, Carolyn Weber. Carolyn, welcome back. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> Thank you, again, for having me. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Carolyn\u2019s thinking, \u201cPlease don\u2019t ask <em>me<\/em> that question, Bob.\u201d [Laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> The reason I kind of leaned into that question is because we\u2019re talking, this week, about a book that you\u2019ve written called <em>Sex and the City of God<\/em>. You were pretty transparent; this is a memoir\u2014where you\u2019re talking about your views on relationships and on sexuality\u2014how you viewed it before you came to Christ, how that shifted after you came to Christ, and how that has influenced your marriage relationship. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou talk a lot about your dad in this book and about your relationship with him. But you tell a story here about a conflict in your marriage\u2014a time when you and Kent had had an argument\u2014and you found yourself separated from him\u2014not legally separated\u2014you were off for a few days to do some writing. There was a flash of temptation that came at <em>you<\/em> in that moment; wasn\u2019t there? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> Yes; absolutely. I think what Ann was saying about thoughts\u2014you know?\u2014thoughts are where sins start\/the freewill of our thoughts. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI did not grow up with fellowship, and I think fellowship is <em>so<\/em> important. I actually was really hesitant and wary of it\u2014kind of like C.S. Lewis\u2014you know, I like church; but I don\u2019t like going to church and people at church. [Laughter] My life has been really changed by fellowship, by realizing that my husband can\u2019t be everything to me; and I can\u2019t be everything to him\u2014that is God\u2019s job; only God can do that\u2014but also, that my fellowship with other believers can sustain me in that walk. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThis is, again, why I love Jesus people\u2014why I love sitting with all of\/with you guys, too\u2014is that you can go deep, and you can go shallow with people in the Lord. You can talk about the things that really matter and the things that are really hurtful, or painful, or difficult. You can also laugh about the lighthearted things and the joy. To have that kind of safety with anyone: you can be deeper with somebody in an elevator, who knows Christ, in a few minutes than you can be with someone you\u2019ve known your whole life. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Tell our listeners the story of what happened\u2014I don\u2019t know if you even remember what the source of the conflict was\u2014but tell them about this time when you were at the cabin at the lake, and you and Kent had not been getting along. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> That\u2019s why I brought up fellowship, because I was feeling very lonely in my marriage; and I\u2019m sure Kent would say the same thing. We all do, at times, feel lonely in relationship; and even with our relationship with God, we can feel that way in consolation and desolation. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think it was a combination for us, personally, of probably sleep deprivation\u2014you know, when you\u2019ve had four children under six and that sort of thing\u2014and the things that everybody goes through in life. There are highs and lows in every marriage, and I think there are struggles of all different types. I\u2019d been through a serious illness. We\u2019d had a very difficult situation, in which our family was actually facing a crime that had happened. There was some really dark, dark stuff that we were under pressure for. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThis happens in different ways to all of us\u2014where, really, we should be coming closer together and seeking each other even more so, as that kind of mini-covenant\u2014a lot of times, we push apart because of anger\/because of fear. When you are in a lot of pain, especially in a relationship, it\u2019s hard to have conversation. It\u2019s hard to share those emotions, and it\u2019s hard to really practice holy listening. We want to do a lot of talking; we want to do a lot of <em>yelling<\/em>; we want to do a lot of <em>judging<\/em>; but we don\u2019t want to do a lot of holy listening. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI was at a place, where I just actually stepped away to do some work, but also just some quiet. A lot of things can happen in that space when we\u2019re really, really vulnerable. Again, it goes back to the Garden of Eden; right? We are most likely to be attacked when we are alone. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> There is a lot to be said, even out of obedience, of surrounding yourself with others in Christ or, at least, be in touch with them, or in prayer with them, or whatever at times when you feel threadbare. I was in a situation, where a temptation was particularly tempting, because I wanted connection and relationship more than anything; but again, like any other temptation, it\u2019s just an illusion. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> You\u2019ve found yourself just a short distance from where your ex-fianc\u00e9 might have been staying. You saw his pickup truck outside the home. You\u2019re away on your own; and the thought pops into your mind, \u201cMaybe, I\u2019ll go knock on the door and just say, \u2018Hi.\u2019\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> Yes; that old thought: \u201cOh, nothing serious,\u201d \u201cOh, I\u2019m not really looking for anything,\u201d \u201cOh, I just\u2026\u201d\u2014the old \u201cthe grass is always greener\u201d\u2014\u201cYou know, I might just go say, \u2018Hello\u2019; or see what <em>could<\/em> have been; or say, \u2018Hi\u2019; or whatever else. Those kind of thoughts come from a place of really not being\u2014not only not being obedient\u2014but not being held up in the faith by others when you can\u2019t do it or you feel like your well is low. I shared, too\u2014how, really, in a Holy Spirit way\u2014others do come to your aid in that sense or, especially, if you can\u2019t always turn to prayer\/pray it through. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think it doesn\u2019t always have to be where something is really, really in a horrible state for it to be where it\u2019s corroding you. Water wears down rock as well. Sometimes, just that sort of discontent or that way of not wanting to turn to God to fulfill those needs, can start to really wear at you in whatever relationship. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br>I guess it was the old metaphor: \u201cI\u2019m just going to go knock and see what\u2026\u201d\u2014how I can feel that need, but it was the wrong kind of knocking. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> What kept you from knocking on the door? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> Two things: I would say grace\u2014[Laughter]\u2014is a big one. I think we have <em>no<\/em> idea the warfare done on our behalf. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> We have no idea the constant warfare. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> We just take it for granted. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI also think that, again, I had sisters in Christ that I\u2019ve always been amazed at their connection with me. When I text them and say, \u201cYou know what? That was exactly what I needed right now.\u201d \u201cOh, sure! I was just thinking of you; you were on my heart,\u201d\u2014you know\u2014\u201cI was praying for you,\u201d or \u201cYou were on my heart,\u201d or whatever. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think it was those two things, and then really a recognition of the fact that God loves my husband as much as He loves me; and that we have been put together for a reason; and that the things that I am dealing with in <em>my<\/em> own heart, actually, really have nothing to do with him\u2014they are between me and God. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Dave:<\/strong> I think, you know, one of my favorite authors has said, \u201cEvery time a person is tempted, there is a lot at stake.\u201d I don\u2019t think we often think there is a lot at stake. He says, \u201cYour faith is at stake; your family; and your future.\u201d That\u2019s really true. Sometimes\u2014and you talk about this in the book\u2014it\u2019s like, \u201cWhat\u2019s God\u2019s perspective on love, sex, and relationships?\u201d There is a lot at stake.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou know\u2014I\u2019ll share quickly\u2014but I had a knock on my door, talking about the knock. When Ann and I were dating\u2014I\u2019m a brand-new Christian\u2014this is the first time I\u2019ve ever been in a God-centered, Jesus-foundation relationship; right? My old girlfriend knocks on my house. We had dated for four years; I\u2019m going to marry her\u2014she\u2019s the one. Long story short, we broke up because of me finding Christ and her not\u2014similar to your story, Carolyn\u2014so I leave her and move on. This is six or seven months later; she knocks on my door, out of nowhere, and says, \u201cI made the biggest mistake of my life; I want you back.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI\u2019m a brand-new person now; I\u2019m just looking at her at the front door. She\u2019s like, \u201cCan we talk?\u201d I\u2019m thinking, \u201cNo! No!\u201d; you know? [Laughter] But here is what\u2019s amazing\u2014I get in the car, and I drive with her\u2014it\u2019s really interesting, Bob, because we ended up at the football stadium, where I play college football, and just pulled in the parking lot. No one is there, and we\u2019re talking. She\u2019s basically trying to convince me, \u201cWe should get back together.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI\u2019m falling in love with Ann; our relationship is about Christ. I\u2019m on an <em>amazing<\/em> journey. My faith has never been stronger\u2014a lot of it <em>because<\/em> of the relationship I had with Ann\u2014so I look at her, and I have this choice. I\u2019m thinking, \u201cWow; I used to love her, maybe?\u201d\u2014as I\u2019m looking at her. Again, I have no thought in my head that: \u201cThe stakes are high right now,\u201d\u2014no thought of that\u2014\u201cYour family, your future, your faith is at stake.\u201d None of that was in my mind; all I knew was: \u201cI have a choice to make.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI can take you to that parking spot; because it was a significant moment when I go, \u201cYou know what? We\u2019re done. I\u2019m a new person in Christ; I have a new future. I have a whole new <em>purpose<\/em> in my life, and I don\u2019t know if I am going to marry Ann or not; but she is going where I am going, and I\u2019m going to keep pursuing that. I\u2019m sorry to say this, but we\u2019re done. I don\u2019t know if I will ever talk to you again the rest of our lives.\u201d I drove back to my house, and she got in her car and drove away; and I\u2019ve never talked to her the rest of my life. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut here is the interesting thing\u2014three or four years ago, I\u2019m back at the university for an alumni football team golf outing, of all things\u2014my son is with me\/my youngest son. I said, \u201cHey, let\u2019s go over to the stadium,\u201d\u2014because he is playing college football\u2014\u201cYou\u2019re going to play in the stadium, where I played.\u201d As we pull into that parking lot, what hits me? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> \u2014that memory. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u201cThere is the parking spot!\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I pull up <em>with<\/em> Cody, and I tell him this story. Now, when he\u2019s preaching at my church, he goes, \u201cMy dad told me this story that would have changed <em>everything<\/em> if he had made a different decision.\u201d I thought, \u201cWow; your faith, your family, your future really are at stake.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCarolyn, your whole <em>life<\/em> is what it is now because of this choice you made and that knock. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I\u2019m just thinking\/the listener that is listening right now: \u201cJust don\u2019t underestimate this. I know you\u2019re being tempted; we all are. There are moments that are so significant: Don\u2019t forget. It\u2019s <em>that<\/em> critical; you make the right choice.\u2019\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> They may be saying, \u201cBut you don\u2019t know who I am married to. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u201cYou don\u2019t know what I\u2019m <em>not<\/em> getting in my marriage.\u201d That\u2019s probably true that we could <em>all <\/em>say that in some respect, but you don\u2019t know what God has in store for you. There is always hope for us in our relationship with Him. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> Absolutely; and our bodies are not our own; and other people\u2019s bodies\u2014we have to be respectful of those. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI was thinking of your story, Dave, where you, not only protected your heart, but also that heart of that former girlfriend. You never know in what way, shape, or form it might speak to you. I remember that really spoke to me when I first met Kent, because he didn\u2019t make a pass at me. He didn\u2019t make a move on me or whatever, not as\u2014because he will laugh and joke\u2014he wasn\u2019t \u201cholier than thou\u201d; but you know, it really spoke to me\u2014and not in some sort of cheesy talk of purity and everything else\u2014but actually, in this way of respect for this other person as well. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIf you had just gone to the parking lot with her, yes, that would have changed all of your future decisions and path, and your relationship with your children, and everything else; but also, you don\u2019t know the effect on her as well. It might have really dismantled her opportunity to really understand and recognize an example of the faith or the respect towards her own spirit and body as well. We are in relationship with others. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Carolyn, there is one other story you tell in the book that I just have to have you comment on; because as I was reading it, I was thinking, \u201cThis sounds like a Nicholas Sparks\u2019 book\u201d\u2014you know?\u2014it\u2019s the kiss. [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I mean, the way you describe it. I have never heard of a kiss\u2014I\u2019m like, \u201cThis must be the most <em>amazing<\/em>\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> \u2014\u201ckiss ever.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u2014\u201ckiss ever in the history of the world!\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> This is the first time Kent kissed you, and it was a while after you wished he had kissed you. You\u2019d been wanting\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> Oh, yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> \u2014him to kiss you for a while. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> He took <em>forever<\/em>. [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Well, you don\u2019t even say his name. In most of the book, you call him TDH. Tell us about that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> \u2014which mortifies him. [Laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> TDH stands for Tall, Dark, and Handsome; right? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> Tall, Dark, and Handsome\u2014it\u2019s what all my friends called him at Oxford, too\u2014that\u2014and \u201cTheology Guy.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> So were his lips warm? [Laughter] I mean, what in the world happened? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> I will tell you\u2014it just takes <em>one<\/em>\u2014and it is <em>worth<\/em> the wait. [Laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> What was the setting? Where did the kiss happen? Were you instantly transformed? [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> Well, I think God gives you certain memories in your marriage to keep you going at times; right?\u2014so, \u201cTake this and remember me for good reason\u201d; right? Yes; it was in my college\/at my college, when I was a dean. I had invited him for guest night dinner. It was a very beautiful black tie affair. At that point, we had known each other for a long time; and neither of us were seeing anybody. It was that sort of thing\u2014we had had this long-standing deep friendship\u2014and it had grown a little more serious, where he had visited a few more times. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYes, we knew it was getting serious; and we knew that we were both committed Christians. I had this time where, actually, I knew he was something special, years before; but I was really gifted with the time in which to grow in my own faith. We were actually physically separated for quite some time; I never thought I was going to see him again. So when it picked up, it did get serious fast. Then he kissed me after that guest night dinner, and it was <em>incredible<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> He shows up with the tuxedo on\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> \u2014and with a rose for you, and you have the dinner. Then were you out, walking, after dinner?\u2014is that what it was? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> No; we had gone back upstairs in the college. I had this beautiful office and set of rooms upstairs in a turret, which you can only have in a place like Oxford. It\u2019s just crazy over-the-top what your bedroom and office nook looks like. He kissed me up there; it was very princess like. It was literally the top of a turret. [Laughter] God is such a show off; because you know, I kicked against all that stuff forever; but it was really very fairytale like, even in terms of the setting. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI really admired that he didn\u2019t toy with me or take advantage of me when I was searching for the faith, and asking questions, and had broken up [with someone else], and had been in a very emotional, vulnerable position. He really waited until he was very, very sure; because he said he knew that there would be a responsibility with that, at least, in good faith; right? He remembered his father always saying to him, \u201cYou know, you\u2019re going to have these temptations\u2014and you are a guy; and that\u2019s really, really normal\u2014but really, think of the girl\u2019s heart too. Really, think of how you are respecting her in this situation.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI believe that with my whole heart. I think that we are all made in the reflection of God, and we have to respect that innate dignity. One of those ways is not to be thinking about: \u201cHey, I want to kiss this woman!\u201d Think about: \u201cWhat\u2019s the effect if you do?\u201d \u201cWhat are the consequences if you do, for her, as well?\u201d He had really carefully thought that out. It was: \u201cWow! It was good.\u201d [Laughter] I can see why He declared it good! [Laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> This is so much at what is at the heart of your book\u2014is the idea that, when we think about relationships, and when we think about sexuality, and when we think about how we\u2019re interacting with others, we can\u2019t just be thinking about: \u201cWhat am I getting out of this?\u201d or \u201cWhat\u2019s my desire?\u201d or \u201cHow do I <em>benefit<\/em> from this?\u201d We really have to <em>care<\/em> <em>for<\/em> the other people we\u2019re relating to and have <em>their<\/em> best interests at heart in order to be doing what Jesus is calling us to do. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Yes; one of the things that struck me, as I read your book\u2014and by the way, I couldn\u2019t put it down. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> When I started reading from Page 1, I turned to Ann and said, \u201cOh my goodness! You\u2019ve got to read this book. It\u2019s just so\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u2014 \u201cit\u2019s compelling.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> Thank you. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> It\u2019s so <em>beautifully<\/em> written too. I want to read a paragraph\u2014but I\u2019m not going to do that\u2014but here\/here\u2019s what really struck me\u2014and I don\u2019t even know if this was part of your goal in the book\u2014but I was really struck with how beautifully Kent treated you\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u2014as you dated\u2014even what you described: the kiss was so magnificent, because of the way you were treated by him as a precious jewel\/valued. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> He cared for your heart.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Yes; as a husband now\u2014I hope every man that would read it would be <em>challenged<\/em> to think, \u201cAm I treating my bride\u201d\u2014married one year or married forty\u2014\u201clike that?\u201d because that\u2019s the love of God. He\u2014you were precious; I\u2019m guessing you still are. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI know marriage is hard\u2014you\u2019ve got kids and all that\u2014but you\u2019re precious, and he modeled for us the love of God. I\u2019m sure you did that back as well; but I really caught that, as a man, reading the book, like, \u201cI want to treat Ann that way: after 40 years, she should not feel any less than she did when we were engaged.\u201d That was <em>such<\/em> a beautiful picture of the heart and love of God. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> Well, thank you for sharing that; because I did write it from a very deep place over a long period of time. I didn\u2019t mean for the title to be salacious at all. If you told me I was going to write a book with the word, \u201csex,\u201d in it, I never would have guessed that, as a literature professor and homeschooling mom; you know? [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut I was beginning to think, \u201cWhat do I want to tell my own children?\u201d\u2014that\u2019s exactly\u2014thinking about what to tell my sons\/thinking about what to tell my daughter. In high school, they are not sending them home with any relational information\/with any sense of how you are treating somebody because you believe they are\/fully believe they are precious and, also, looking at how incredibly beautiful marriage is as this mini-covenant. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe all get battle-weary; we all get tired; and the world comes at us. We\u2019re always so busy; and we have a million needs\u2014as parents and sandwich generations, too, caring for the elderly and for our children\u2014so many things can come at us and so many temptations and issues. But really working to protect that precious is so important\u2014that sort of sacred space between the two of you\u2014is really, really important. I would say that that\u2019s really what spoke to me. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThat, also really\/it really spoke to my faith. I think we are, also, there to bolster each other\u2019s faith in marriage and help each other on our journey. We\u2019re not responsible for each other that way; ultimately, that\u2019s with God; but that authenticity of seeing someone try to model that out and try to live that; and the decisions might not always be right or perfect. Even when there is tension or disagreement, there is a willingness to have conversation; there is a willingness to remember that that person is precious\u2014is everything. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes; Carolyn, thank you for the book; thanks for the conversation. Tell Kent we said, \u201cHi.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> I will; thank you. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> I hope his kiss today is just as nice as the first one. [Laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Carolyn:<\/strong> Well, we have a lot more viewers now in terms of the kids\u2014[Laughter]\u2014a house of seven\u2014so it\u2019s not real easy to have an intimate kiss; but you know, I\u2019ll tell him that; and we\u2019ll go for it. [Laughter] I\u2019ll say you guys recommend it. Thank you! [Laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Absolutely; let me encourage listeners to get a copy of the book we\u2019ve been talking about. It\u2019s Carolyn Weber\u2019s book, <em>Sex and the City of God<\/em>: <em>A Memoir of Love and Longing<\/em>. We\u2019ve got it in our <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> Resource Center. You can order it from us, online, at FamilyLifeToday.com; or you can call 1-800-FL-TODAY to get a copy. Again, the title of the book is <em>Sex and the City of God<\/em> by Carolyn Weber. Order online at FamilyLifeToday.com, or call 1-800-FL-TODAY to request your copy of Carolyn\u2019s book. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNow, we have got the president of FamilyLife<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>, David Robbins, who is joining us in the studio today to talk a little bit about the impact this ministry is having in the lives of <em>so<\/em> many people. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>David:<\/strong> We had a father write to us recently; and he shared, \u201cYour broadcasts are a blessing to my life: first, as a follower of Jesus; but secondly, now that I\u2019m 36, I don\u2019t have the wisdom and the training to disciple my kids and to pass this truth on to my family. You guys are equipping me with those biblical principles so that our kids don\u2019t wither when they are sent out into the world, but they know how to thrive.\u201d It is <em>so<\/em> encouraging to get feedback like that and know we are equipping and impacting a father but, also, his kids. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAs we\u2019re here at the end of this very unprecedented crazy year, I invite you\u2014and may I, also, say\u2014\u201cI challenge you to join with us in our mission to reach every home. God is impacting and equipping our children and our children\u2019s children and leaving a lasting legacy for the kingdom. Would you financially partner with us to <em>advance<\/em> the kingdom of God and equip marriages and families all across the world? Your gifts are <em>making<\/em> a kingdom difference.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> We\u2019ve had some exciting news this week as well. We\u2019ve had an increase in the matching-gift amount that is available in our matching-gift fund. What was a $2 million-matching-gift fund is now a $2.7 million-matching-gift fund. The need is more urgent for <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> listeners; we need <em>you<\/em> to give so we can take full advantage of this increased matching-gift opportunity. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhen you give, we\u2019d like to send you a couple of thank-you gifts. We\u2019ll send you a copy of my book, <em>Love Like You Mean It<\/em>; and we\u2019ll send you a flash drive that includes more than 100 of the best <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> programs from the last 28 years. You can give your gift, online, at FamilyLifeToday.com; or you can call 1-800-FL-TODAY to donate. Thanks, in advance, for whatever you are able to do. We appreciate you. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe hope you have a great weekend. Hope you and your family are able to worship together in your local church this weekend, however your church is meeting. I hope you can join us back on Monday when we\u2019re going to talk about the challenges blended families face during the holiday season. Ron Deal, the head of FamilyLife Blended<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>, will join us, along with some special guests to have that conversation. I hope you can join us as well. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch, along with our entire broadcast production team. On behalf of our hosts, Dave and Ann Wilson, I\u2019m Bob Lepine. We will see you back next time for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas; a Cru<sup>\u00ae <\/sup>Ministry. Help for today. Hope for tomorrow.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright <sup>\u00a9<\/sup> 2020 FamilyLife. All rights reserved.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/\">www.FamilyLife.com<\/a>\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\n\t\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\t1\n\t\t\t\t<\/p>","theme_header_position":"","post_header_is_sticky":"","is_header_overlay":""},"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast\/306625","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/podcast"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/91"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=306625"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/294104"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=306625"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=306625"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=306625"},{"taxonomy":"podcast_series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast_series?post=306625"},{"taxonomy":"cwp_profile","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/cwp_profile?post=306625"},{"taxonomy":"series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/series?post=306625"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}