{"id":306446,"date":"2020-10-01T07:00:05","date_gmt":"2020-10-01T11:00:05","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/%series%\/why-wont-my-husband-lead\/"},"modified":"2020-10-01T07:00:05","modified_gmt":"2020-10-01T11:00:05","slug":"why-wont-my-husband-lead","status":"publish","type":"podcast","link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/why-wont-my-husband-lead\/","title":{"rendered":"Why Won&#8217;t My Husband Lead?"},"content":{"rendered":"","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>FamilyLife Today hosts Dave and Ann Wilson answer a wife&#8217;s question about responding to a husband who doesn&#8217;t lead.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":91,"featured_media":294104,"menu_order":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","template":"","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","inline_featured_image":false,"_uag_custom_page_level_css":"","episode_type":"","audio_file":"https:\/\/mp3.familylife.com\/fl2020-10-01.mp3","podmotor_file_id":"","podmotor_episode_id":"","cover_image":"","cover_image_id":"","duration":"00:28:09","filesize":"25.78M","filesize_raw":"27035313","date_recorded":"","explicit":"","block":""},"categories":[2810,2831],"tags":[2877],"podcast_series":[],"cwp_profile":[3647],"series":[2101],"class_list":["post-306446","podcast","type-podcast","status-publish","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-growing-spiritually","category-wives","tag-marriage","cwp_profile-dave-and-ann-wilson","series-familylife-today"],"acf":[],"episode_featured_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/09\/FLT-Podcast-Cover-2-508x508-3.jpg?w=508","episode_player_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2023\/02\/image-scaled.jpg","download_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-download\/306446\/why-wont-my-husband-lead","player_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-player\/306446\/why-wont-my-husband-lead","audio_player":null,"episode_data":{"playerMode":"light","subscribeUrls":{"apple_podcasts":{"key":"apple_podcasts","url":"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303?mt=2&app=podcast","label":"Apple Podcasts","class":"apple_podcasts","icon":"apple-podcasts.png"},"google_podcasts":{"key":"google_podcasts","url":"","label":"Google Podcasts","class":"google_podcasts","icon":"google-podcasts.png"},"spotify":{"key":"spotify","url":"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm","label":"Spotify","class":"spotify","icon":"spotify.png"},"youtube":{"key":"youtube","url":"","label":"YouTube","class":"youtube","icon":"youtube.png"}},"rssFeedUrl":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/feed\/podcast\/familylife-today","embedCode":"<blockquote class=\"wp-embedded-content\" data-secret=\"0ud2efHmvD\"><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/why-wont-my-husband-lead\/\">Why Won&#8217;t My Husband Lead?<\/a><\/blockquote><iframe sandbox=\"allow-scripts\" security=\"restricted\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/why-wont-my-husband-lead\/embed\/#?secret=0ud2efHmvD\" width=\"500\" height=\"350\" title=\"&#8220;Why Won&#8217;t My Husband Lead?&#8221; &#8212; FamilyLife\u00ae - A Cru Ministry\" data-secret=\"0ud2efHmvD\" frameborder=\"0\" marginwidth=\"0\" marginheight=\"0\" scrolling=\"no\" class=\"wp-embedded-content\"><\/iframe><script>\n\/*! This file is auto-generated *\/\n!function(d,l){\"use strict\";l.querySelector&&d.addEventListener&&\"undefined\"!=typeof URL&&(d.wp=d.wp||{},d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage||(d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage=function(e){var t=e.data;if((t||t.secret||t.message||t.value)&&!\/[^a-zA-Z0-9]\/.test(t.secret)){for(var s,r,n,a=l.querySelectorAll('iframe[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),o=l.querySelectorAll('blockquote[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),c=new RegExp(\"^https?:$\",\"i\"),i=0;i<o.length;i++)o[i].style.display=\"none\";for(i=0;i<a.length;i++)s=a[i],e.source===s.contentWindow&&(s.removeAttribute(\"style\"),\"height\"===t.message?(1e3<(r=parseInt(t.value,10))?r=1e3:~~r<200&&(r=200),s.height=r):\"link\"===t.message&&(r=new URL(s.getAttribute(\"src\")),n=new URL(t.value),c.test(n.protocol))&&n.host===r.host&&l.activeElement===s&&(d.top.location.href=t.value))}},d.addEventListener(\"message\",d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage,!1),l.addEventListener(\"DOMContentLoaded\",function(){for(var e,t,s=l.querySelectorAll(\"iframe.wp-embedded-content\"),r=0;r<s.length;r++)(t=(e=s[r]).getAttribute(\"data-secret\"))||(t=Math.random().toString(36).substring(2,12),e.src+=\"#?secret=\"+t,e.setAttribute(\"data-secret\",t)),e.contentWindow.postMessage({message:\"ready\",secret:t},\"*\")},!1)))}(window,document);\n\/\/# sourceURL=https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-includes\/js\/wp-embed.min.js\n<\/script>\n"},"uagb_featured_image_src":{"full":["https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/09\/FLT-Podcast-Cover-2-508x508-3.jpg",508,508,false]},"uagb_author_info":{"display_name":"kfairris@familylife.com","author_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/author\/kfairrisfamilylife-com\/"},"uagb_comment_info":0,"uagb_excerpt":"FamilyLife Today hosts Dave and Ann Wilson answer a wife's question about responding to a husband who doesn't lead.","meta_box":{"show_notes":"","transcript_url":"https:\/\/transcript.familylife.com\/fl2020-10-01.pdf","transcript_content":"<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Dave Wilson has always been a confident take-charge kind of guy; but early on, leading his family spiritually\u2014that was intimidating for him. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I felt like I could lead in other areas of my life better than I could lead my wife, spiritually, and my kids, spiritually. Part of it was I was trained as an athlete, so I could walk on a field and feel confident. I got a degree\/I went to seminary; I have an understanding\u2014I\u2019m not saying I\u2019m great\u2014but I can preach. I know how to lead a church; I know how to cast vision. I know how\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd then I walk in my back door; and I felt a paralysis, like, \u201cI don\u2019t know what to do.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> This is <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> for Thursday, October 1<sup>st<\/sup>. Our hosts are Dave and Ann Wilson; I\u2019m Bob Lepine. You\u2019ll find us online at FamilyLifeToday.com. What should a man do if he feels inadequate to lead his family spiritually, and is there anything his wife can do to encourage him? We\u2019ll talk more about that today. Stay with us. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd welcome to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. Thanks for joining us. I would imagine, as you talk to wives about frustrations in marriage\u2014about the things that they wrestle with\/the things they wish could be fixed, or could be different, or could be better\u2014what we\u2019re going to talk about today is probably, if it\u2019s not at the top of the list, it\u2019s top three; don\u2019t you think? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I think so. After 30 years, I\u2019m amazed that this <em>still<\/em> rises to the top\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes; yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u2014of issues that women are <em>so<\/em> frustrated with and are looking for answers. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> The issue is a wife\u2019s frustration when a husband is failing to initiate\u2014to take the lead\/to lead the relationship\u2014specifically, to lead it spiritually; but it can just be his failure to lead in general\/to be passive; right? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I sat down with a woman, a couple of weeks ago, and she said, \u201cI\u2019m thinking of filing for divorce.\u201d I said, \u201cTell me what\u2019s going on.\u201d She said, \u201cI\u2019m married to a good man; he\u2019s a good father, but he is the most passive man I\u2019ve ever met. He doesn\u2019t lead spiritually at all. He never wants to initiate anything. I\u2019m <em>always<\/em> leading the family. When I hear, biblically, what this should look like, it doesn\u2019t look like it should; and I\u2019m the one always leading. What should I do?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> She\u2019s thinking, \u201cWhat I should do is\u2014I should bail.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> She\u2019s thinking, \u201cThere must be someone <em>else<\/em> out there that would do a better job.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> The level of discontentedness that comes from a husband\u2019s failure to lead spiritually\/to lead in general is something that\u2014it\u2019s not just an annoyance\u2014this goes to the heart of what we <em>long<\/em> for in a marriage relationship. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Right; I don\u2019t think all women are to that point of saying, \u201cI might file for divorce\u201d; but I think they\u2019re lost in thinking, \u201cWhat do I do? Can I do <em>anything<\/em> besides pray for my husband?\u201d So I\u2019m here with two experts. [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> No; I was just thinking the opposite; I was thinking, \u201cOkay, honey.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> No! [Laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Bob and I are sitting here with a wife. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> No; no; no. We\u2019re not turning it on <em>me<\/em>. I\u2019m saying, \u201c<em>Guys<\/em>, help us to know how to respond.\u201d <br>\u00a0\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Wait; wait\u2014okay; here is my first question then: \u201cWhat do women want? What do <em>you<\/em> want from your man in the area of leading spiritually?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Well, I think, as women, we hear what it looks like to be a spiritual leader. Maybe, that involves initiating prayer with our family, or some sort of dialogue about God with our kids, or initiating saying, \u201cHey, kids\/hey, honey, let\u2019s get ready and go to church,\u201d\u2014instead of a wife saying, \u201cAre we going to church today? Are you going to go with me? Are you going to go with the kids?\u201d\u2014someone who is modeling their pursuit of Jesus. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Now, you\u2019ve acknowledged that you had kind of an idealized vision of what that was supposed to look like when you first got married. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Oh, yes; she did! \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> You thought Saint Dave was going to do it a particular way. [Laughter] You had to do some correction to your thinking; because your expectations were\u2014I mean, we talk about Saint Dave\u2014somebody would have to be a saint in order to live up to what were your expectations. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I think we do that as women. We have a picture of what godly men are doing in their homes. Mine was Dennis Rainey\u2014Dennis would talk; and I thought, \u201cDennis is leading his family every day in prayer, reading the Scriptures. He\u2019s calling them together, and they are all sitting at his feet, saying, \u2018Dad, teach us,\u2019\u201d\u2014I was hoping Dave would initiate that, at least, some sort of a time with Jesus as a family. Is that not a realistic expectation? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Well, I mean, first you\u2019ve got to go back and say, \u201cIs that really what happened in the Rainey household?\u201d [Laughter] The answer is, \u201cNo!\u201d I mean, I\u2019m not saying it was bad; but it wasn\u2019t <em>that<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I think a lot of wives do what <em>you<\/em> did. It\u2019s like they <em>glorify<\/em> or they actually create an unrealistic\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u2014expectation. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u2014view. They <em>see<\/em> it [in their mind]; it\u2019s not even real. Same thing they do with \u201cI\u2019m going to marry Prince Charming,\u201d\u2014 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u2014sort of this\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u2014romantic. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u2014glamorized thing. I think you have to go down and say, \u201cWhat should it look like?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut then, as the man, you\u2019ve got to ask, \u201c<em>Why<\/em> am I not leading?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> So with your wife\u2014who is thinking, \u201cMy husband is spiritually passive; he never does anything,\u201d\u2014maybe, the first place to start in your conversation with her is: \u201cWhat is the expectation?\u201d Is that a realistic expectation, and are you expecting him to be more than most men are capable of being?\u2014which is not to say that a guy shouldn\u2019t step up and do something\u2014maybe, this guy is doing <em>nothing<\/em>\u2014but I do think some wives need to have their glorified image adjusted before we get in and start talking about how the man needs to get in shape; right? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I think that\u2019s true. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes; I remember a conversation we had a number of years ago with Elisabeth Elliot when she was still alive. She used an illustration I\u2019ve never forgotten. She said if you walk up, and there is a guy, who has got on a plain white shirt\u2014a business shirt\/dress shirt\u2014but he\u2019s had an ink pen in his pocket, and that ink pen has leaked; and there is a quarter-sized purple spot at the bottom of his pocket\u2014she says, \u201cWhere do your eyes go, and what do you focus on?\u201d You focus on the spot that\u2019s there. She said, \u201cNow, how much of the shirt is still white?\u201d\u2014most of the shirt\/99 percent\u2014\u201cbut your eyes keep getting drawn to the flaw\/to what is wrong.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think that is another part of this equation, where husbands or wives can become so fixated on the flaws that we see in our spouses, that we fail to remember and to recognize the <em>good<\/em> things that we\u2019ve come to take for granted. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I think you are right, Bob. We can focus on the weaknesses; we see the things that need to change. We do that ourselves, as women; instead of looking at ourselves holistically in the mirror, we look at all the flaws; and we don\u2019t see <em>any<\/em> of the good. It\u2019s easy to do that in marriage. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think, too, especially if you are a stronger woman and a woman that is a leader\u2014and maybe, our husband isn\u2019t as strong\u2014we expect him to become this man that is stronger than us. That may never happen. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> I know that\u2014I don\u2019t know if you want to bring this up\u2014but I remember, Ann, back before COVID, you said you got a text from a woman in our church that said, \u201cI want to leave my husband; because he doesn\u2019t want to go to church, because he doesn\u2019t want our kids around this virus.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u201cHe won\u2019t shake hands.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Yes; he doesn\u2019t want to go to church. She\u2019s like\/Ann just sort of relayed this story\u2014I said, \u201cWhat are you going to say to her?\u201d Tell them what you said, because I thought it was really beautiful. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> She was looking at the negative; she said, \u201cHe\u2019s being a bad example to our kids, because he\u2019s being unfriendly to other people.\u201d What I said was: \u201cOh, isn\u2019t it good that you have a husband, who is being protective of you, who is watching out for you, who is watching out for the kids? Maybe, you approach him in that vein of saying, \u2018Thank you for being such a protective husband and a protective father.\u2019\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> So, again, we\u2019re talking to a wife, who is frustrated about her husband not leading the relationship spiritually. We\u2019re saying: \u201cDo you have a realistic expectation? Are you valuing the good things about your spouse?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe principle we are following here is: \u201cBefore you go to try to fix your spouse, have you looked at your own eyes?\u2014the logs that are in your own eyes. Have you gone through a checklist and said, \u2018Okay; I need to really think this through carefully rather than just jumping on the one thing that\u2019s frustrating to me right here\u2019?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Let\u2019s talk about this: \u201cAs men, what motivates you? Maybe, you tend to be more passive, as a man, or not as strong of a leader; how can we, as a wife, motivate you in those areas of leading?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Every man is motivated by praise, by affirmation, by appreciation\u2014every woman is, too, actually\u2014but I know that, when you and any wife sort of critiques or is disappointed, and you sort of think, like, \u201cI\u2019m going to be the coach that\u2019s going to kick him in the rear-end, and it\u2019s going to get him going,\u201d\u2014 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I thought that was helping. Was it not working? [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> No; I mean, obviously, there are times where that does work\u2014there are coaches that use that, at times, and it works\u2014but generally, I think, for me, as a man\u2014I can\u2019t speak for Bob\u2014but I\u2019ve talked to a lot of men that feel that <em>demotivates<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYet, when you <em>praise<\/em>\u2014I\u2019ve said this many times\u2014when you started <em>praising<\/em> who I was, as a man, I actually didn\u2019t think I was that good that you were saying I was; but I wanted to be. It motivated me to be the man you said I was that I wasn\u2019t yet\u2014[Laughter]\u2014which doesn\u2019t make any sense\u2014but it was motivating. Again, I\u2019m not saying every man is motivated that way; but it made me step up. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I agree with that. Bob, would you?\u2014is that true for you? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> I think it is. I\u2019ve said, for years, that guys are not going to keep playing a game that they are not any good at. Guy goes out and plays golf three or four times. He goes, \u201cI\u2019m just not getting the hang of this\u201d; he\u2019s not going to keep trying to conquer it. He\u2019ll just say, \u201cI\u2019m going to go to something that I\u2019m good at.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWell, if he\u2019s tried leading his family, spiritually, three or four times, and he just goes, \u201cThis does not work at all; I feel like a failure,\u201d then he is not motivated to try the fifth time. He just says, \u201cI\u2019m going to try something else; because this, obviously, doesn\u2019t work.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIf a wife can come along and say, \u201cHere is what I saw in that\u2026\u201d\u2014it\u2019s what you did with Dave; you\u2019ve shared the story on <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> about acknowledging the power he had in your sons\u2019 lives, and how they listened to him, and how they gravitated. You pointed it out, and you said, \u201cI\u2019m jealous of the power you carry.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u201c\u2026the power that you carry.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> When Dave heard that, he goes, \u201cOh, there is something here that I\u2019m good at\u201d; and you leaned into that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> For me\u2014and I\u2019ve talked to enough men to know this is common\u2014I felt like I could lead in other areas of my life better than I could lead my wife, spiritually, and my kids, spiritually. <br>\u00a0\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Why is that? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Well, part of it was I was trained as an athlete; so I could walk on a field and feel confident; you know? I know what to do; I know how to read this coverage; I\u2019ve prepared: \u201cGive me the ball; let\u2019s go.\u201d I got a degree\/I went to seminary; I have an understanding\u2014I\u2019m not saying I\u2019m great\u2014but I can preach. I know how to lead a church; I know how to cast vision. I know how\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd then I walk in my back door; and I felt a paralysis like, \u201cI don\u2019t know what to do. I don\u2019t know what <em>she<\/em> wants. Her expectations are <em>way up here<\/em>. I\u2019m supposed to walk in and be [with powerful voice] Dennis Rainey; you know? [Laughter] And I don\u2019t even know what that means; but I hear it all the time.\u201d Nobody\u2019s really\u2014I don\u2019t remember a class in seminary about leading your family\u2014by the way, there <em>should<\/em> be\u2014 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u2014so I\u2019m on my own. \u201cOkay; what did my dad do?\u2014oh, he left.\u201d\u2014okay; so I don\u2019t have that\u2014\u201cWhat did my pastor do at the church I grew up?\u2014I have no idea.\u201d Again, you feel this\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u2014inadequate. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u2014paralysis. You\u2019re scared; because you <em>know<\/em> there is an expectation\u2014I could <em>feel<\/em> it at the dinner table\u2014the kids are sitting there; there is Ann, like, \u201cCome on; do your thing.\u201d I\u2019m like, \u201cWhat\u2019s my\u2026\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think, sometimes, fear paralyzes you; so instead of doing the wrong thing, you do <em>nothing<\/em>. That\u2019s like the worst thing; because your wife is like\u2014oh, she\u2019s so disappointed. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> We\u2019re back to expectations; because it may be that you were not doing <em>nothing<\/em>\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> \u2014but you weren\u2019t living up to Ann\u2019s idealized view of things. This is where I think a wife needs to look at her husband and say, \u201cOkay; what is he doing? Is he modeling godly character?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> That\u2019s a good point. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> \u201cIs he an honest person?\u201d \u201cAre there things that he is\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u201cIs he hard working? Is he providing?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Right; can we <em>lean<\/em> into some of those things and just say, \u201cI\u2019m so grateful that our kids are growing up, seeing somebody, who values hard work,\u201d\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> \u2014or \u201c\u2026who is honest\u201d? This is so important; a lot of kids don\u2019t have that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe\u2019ve said for years that, as parents, our kids are going to pay more attention to what is caught than what is taught. If parents only had one option: \u201cYou can either have devotion times with the kids and do all the formal training\u2014quiet times, all of the\/read bedtime stories\u2014but don\u2019t model anything spiritually\u201d; that\u2019s one option. The other option is: \u201cDon\u2019t do any of that stuff but model godliness.\u201d If you had to pick one, pick \u201cmodel godliness\u201d; right? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Because at the end of the day, that\u2019s what\u2019s going to make a bigger impact in a child\u2019s life. The point is\u2014you don\u2019t have one\u2014it\u2019s not an either\/or; it can be a both\/and. I think a wife can acknowledge and validate, \u201cThese are the things you <em>are<\/em> doing that are making spiritual deposits in our kids\u2019 lives, and I\u2019m grateful for that.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I think, too, to have the conversation with your spouse of saying, \u201cWhat would it look like?\u2014let\u2019s dream together of what we want, spiritually, for our family.\u201d Is that intimidating if a wife asks that question? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> It depends how. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> If she does it like you just did, that\u2019s pretty tender\u2014still a little bit scary for a man to enter that conversation\u2014but I think we had that conversation. What I learned over the years is\u2014you didn\u2019t need me to be Dennis. All you said, really, was: \u201cJust lead anyway you want,\u201d\u2014because you finally gave up the: \u201cIt\u2019s going to look like this,\u201d\u2014and stepped back and said, \u201cIt\u2019s going to look like the way God\u2019s made Dave.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe way God made me was\u2014I want to teach through life. You encouraged me to say, \u201cWell, grab those moments then; because you are good at that. When you\u2019re watching TV, or when you\u2019re in a moment, just turn it and go, \u2018Hey, let\u2019s go vertical here.\u2019\u201d Hopefully, that\u2019s what I\u2019m doing anyway in my life. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI remember\u2014and again, I\u2019m like a lot of guys\u2014I\u2019m like, \u201cJust tell me what to do\/just tell me what to do, and I\u2019ll do it.\u201d I remember doing a Lions\u2019 chapel\u2014I don\u2019t know; 20-some years ago\u2014and a guy came up after and said, \u201cMy wife wants me to lead her spiritually. I don\u2019t know what to do.\u201d I said, \u201cI know what to do. Here\u2019s a devotional,\u201d\u2014it\u2019s a daily devotional\u2014\u201cread it with her. There is a little prayer at the end. It\u2019ll take you five minutes. Do that every day. This is a tool.\u201d I gave him something out of the toolbox. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHe did it, and I didn\u2019t know he did it. He never said another word about it for several weeks. Then I run into Rebecca, his wife, somewhere; and she goes, \u201cOh my goodness! Thank you.\u201d I go, \u201cWhat?\u201d \u201cMy husband is now leading me spiritually, and it\u2019s because you gave him this little devotional book. We do it every night. It\u2019s unbelievable; it\u2019s changed our entire marriage.\u201d I\u2019m like, \u201cOh, that\u2019s good!\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAgain, it was just\u2014and what do we have?\u2014FamilyLife<sup>\u00ae<\/sup> has all kinds of tools. We have <em>The Story of Us<\/em>, where it\u2019s all the speaker couples writing little devos that you can do daily. There is a tool; just take it, guys. I can make a guarantee: \u201cOne hundred percent of the wives listening right now are going to say, \u2018If my husband said, \u201cLet\u2019s do this,\u201d I\u2019m in.\u2019\u201d I doubt if any of them are going to say, \u201cNo; I don\u2019t want to do that.\u201d They are going to say, \u201cI\u2019m in, because he\u2019s going to\u2026\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSmall simple way to initiate\u2014that\u2019s really what it came down to. You just said to me, \u201cJust initiate. It doesn\u2019t have to be a big prayer; it doesn\u2019t have to be a long Bible study. All you have to do is just take a step, and we\u2019ll all follow.\u201d It changed our family. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> It was interesting\u2014I was leading a Bible study with Detroit Lions\u2019 wives, probably, around 20 of them. They are all in their 20s and 30s; and one wife said, \u201cIt\u2019s interesting what we\u2019ve been doing. Every morning, my husband wakes me up, and we do a YouVersion Bible app devotional together before he leaves for work.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe wives stopped; there was silence, and they were like, \u201cWait. Wait. Wait. What do you do?\u201d She said, \u201cYes; it\u2019s only takes ten minutes, but we read that together\u2014it\u2019s Scripture\u2014then we pray quickly. It\u2019s not very long.\u201d There was so much jealousy in the room. Yet, all they are doing is reading it together, being intentional of taking the time; but every wife was <em>longing<\/em> for that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> You know, I think most guys, when they hear that, they are thinking to themselves, \u201cOkay, I could try that; but honestly, I will feel like a poser and like a fraud if I say to my wife, \u2018Let\u2019s read this devotional.\u2019 It\u2019s like she\u2019s going to be thinking,\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u201cWhat?!\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> \u2014\u201c\u2018Oh, who do you think you are?\u2019\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Really? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Sure; we think, \u201cYou know me; you know the flaws. You know that I\u2019m not Dennis Rainey.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u201cI\u2019m not the initiator.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Right; so if I do this, you\u2019re going to go, \u201cWhat do you want?\u201d or \u201cThis is not\u2026\u201d\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u201cHow long will it last?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes; right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Although, could it be\u2014and I hope the wife would look at this\u2014and a husband could go the other way\u2014it\u2019s like [wife:] \u201cWait a minute,\u201d\u2014if you said, \u201cHey, tomorrow morning, I\u2019m getting up; I\u2019m going to start a workout program.\u201d It might be like [wife\u2019s potential\u00a0 response], \u201cYou\u2019ve never done that before, dude\u201d\u2014but it\u2019d be like [wife\u2019s preferred response]\u2014\u201cWow! That\u2019s inspiring; good for you!\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWell, it\u2019s the same thing\u2014it\u2019s like, \u201cI want our marriage to be different. I\u2019m not very good at this; I\u2019ve never even done it before, but will you go with me? Let\u2019s start a workout program together called Devotions,\u201d\u2014or whatever you want to do\u2014maybe, it\u2019s a five-minute\/one-minute prayer. Why not aspire to something better and greater than where you are right now? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> Maybe, you start with once a week\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> \u2014if you haven\u2019t been doing anything. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Yes; although you are not going to lose 20 pounds once a week. You\u2019re going to have to do it every day. [Laughter] No, three times a week\u2014that\u2019s what you need. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I think, too, for us as women, not to become resentful; because there is a seed of bitterness and resentment that can start to grow that vanquishes your feelings for your husband. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> Let me add this\u2014just one last thought; it just hit me\/I was thinking\u2014\u201cOkay; if you think like an athlete, or business person, or whatever, and you want to be the first stringer\u201d\u2014I mean, I was a quarterback. I didn\u2019t want to be the backup; I want to be the starter. If I\u2019m the backup, and the starter is better than me, what am I going to do if I want to get that job? Man, when he goes to bed at night, I\u2019m working out. When he\u2019s\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> This is Voddie Baucham who says this. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave:<\/strong> \u2014I\u2019m watching film; I\u2019m doing whatever it takes to get first place. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI know a lot of guys say, \u201cMy wife is more spiritually mature than me. She\u2019s probably a better leader than I could be.\u201d I\u2019m like, \u201cWhen she goes to bed, get in the Word,\u201d \u201cGet in a small group with guys.\u201d If you\u2019re like you\u2019re not there yet, let\u2019s rise to the place and win that job; because it\u2019s the job God gave you. Why wouldn\u2019t you say, \u201cThis is more important than anything else\u201d? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI\u2019m looking at men right now and saying, \u201cDude, be the starter. You can do it. It\u2019s going to take some time and practice. You can do it; and when you take it, your wife is going to fall right behind.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> What did you say to the wife, who said, \u201cI\u2019m frustrated. I want to get a divorce, because he\u2019s passive and won\u2019t lead our family spiritually\u201d? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ann:<\/strong> I pointed her to the good things. I also said, \u201cGod has made you a natural leader,\u201d\u2014and this probably hurt her feelings a little bit\u2014and I said, \u201cYou are a little bit scary. You are <em>so strong<\/em> that it probably scares him to the point of not knowing what to do, because he\u2019s going to be scared he\u2019s doing it wrong.\u201d I said, \u201cIf you could pull back just a little bit. You\u2019re a natural leader\u2014if he doesn\u2019t pray\u2014pray. If you\u2019re going to bed, and you\u2019re talking about spiritual things, and he doesn\u2019t jump on the page with you, then it\u2019s okay. Tell him he\u2019s a <em>good<\/em> man; see the things and say the things that you see that are really <em>great<\/em> about him.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tShe went on to say, \u201cHe loves Jesus. He just doesn\u2019t know how to pursue Him in the way that I do.\u201d I said, \u201cIt\u2019s not going to look like the way you\u2019re doing it. It will look different, and that\u2019s okay.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes; Dave, you mentioned tools that you recommended to guys. The couples who speak at our <em>Weekend to Remember<\/em><sup>\u00ae<\/sup> marriage getaways have collaborated on a devotional that couples can read once a week together to facilitate a spiritual conversation and have a time to pray together. Now, again, it\u2019s once a week; so we\u2019re trying to make this as easy and doable for couples as possible. Set your date\u2014plan that every Sunday night or every Thursday morning, whenever you want to do it\u2014you\u2019re going to get out <em>The Story of Us<\/em> devotional, read that week\u2019s devotional, spend a little time praying together. That\u2019s a step in the right direction. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou can go to our website, FamilyLifeToday.com, to find out more about <em>The Story of Us<\/em> devotional. You can order it from us, online; or you can call to order. Then I\u2019d just recommend, guys, read your book, <em>Vertical Marriage<\/em>. In fact, what I\u2019d suggest is that you read a few pages of that book out loud together as a way, again, to have some spiritual dialogue in your marriage. The book by Dave and Ann Wilson is called <em>Vertical Marriage: The One Secret that Will Change Your Marriage<\/em>. Go to FamilyLifeToday.com to order copies of the book, or call us at 1-800-358-6329 to order a copy\u2014that\u2019s 1-800-\u201cF\u201d as in family, \u201cL\u201d as in life, and then the word, \u201cTODAY.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou know, I sometimes wish our listeners could just spend a couple of days with us listening to some of the phone calls that come in, reading the emails\/the letters that we get from people, hearing about the impact <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is having in the lives of people all around the country. There are marriages that are still together because of this program. There are children who are being pointed in a new direction because mom and dad are listening to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. Those of you who support this ministry\u2014you\u2019re the ones making that possible. You\u2019re the ones who are providing the practical biblical help and hope that so many couples are looking for today. Every time you donate, you\u2019re investing in their marriages and in their families. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIf you can make a donation right now to help support the ongoing work of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>, we\u2019d love to say, \u201cThank you,\u201d by sending you a copy of a book written by Heather DeJesus Yates, who joined us this week on <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. It\u2019s a book about infertility and adoption and about how God can meet you in the midst of that journey and give you a bigger vision for your life, your marriage, and your family than maybe the one you started out with. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tMaybe, you know somebody, who is on that path right now, and you want to get a copy of the book to give to them as a gift. Make a donation to FamilyLife, either online at FamilyLifeToday.com, or call to donate at 1-800-FL-TODAY; ask for your copy of the book, <em>A Mother of Thousands<\/em>, by Heather DeJesus Yates. We\u2019re happy to send it to you as our way of saying, \u201cThank you for partnering with us in the ongoing ministry of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\u201d We appreciate you. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe hope you can join us, again, tomorrow when we\u2019re going to hear a conversation that happened recently as Ron Deal, who gives leadership to FamilyLife Blended<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>, spoke with Sandi Patty and her husband, Don Peslis, about what happens when a marriage begins in the midst of a lot of brokenness. That conversation comes up tomorrow. I hope you can be here for that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch, along with our entire broadcast production team. On behalf of our hosts, Dave and Ann Wilson, I\u2019m Bob Lepine. We will see you back next time for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas; a Cru<sup>\u00ae <\/sup>Ministry. Help for today. Hope for tomorrow.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright <sup>\u00a9<\/sup> 2020 FamilyLife. 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