{"id":304728,"date":"2017-10-17T11:00:00","date_gmt":"2017-10-17T15:00:00","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/%series%\/made-to-be-seen\/"},"modified":"2017-10-17T11:00:00","modified_gmt":"2017-10-17T15:00:00","slug":"made-to-be-seen","status":"publish","type":"podcast","link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/made-to-be-seen\/","title":{"rendered":"Made to Be Seen"},"content":{"rendered":"","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Author Sara Hagerty and Barbara Rainey remind listeners that we were created to be seen first by God, and then by the people around us.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":91,"featured_media":294104,"menu_order":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","template":"","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","inline_featured_image":false,"_uag_custom_page_level_css":"","episode_type":"","audio_file":"https:\/\/web.familylifetoday.com\/fl2017-10-17.mp3","podmotor_file_id":"","podmotor_episode_id":"","cover_image":"","cover_image_id":"","duration":"00:29:18","filesize":"26.83M","filesize_raw":"28130002","date_recorded":"","explicit":"","block":""},"categories":[2853,2838],"tags":[6339,6341,2210,6340,6338],"podcast_series":[8241],"cwp_profile":[3052,3331],"series":[2101],"class_list":["post-304728","podcast","type-podcast","status-publish","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-frazzled-family","category-mothers","tag-meeting-god","tag-owning-your-faith","tag-prayer","tag-serving-others","tag-unseen","podcast_series-unseen","cwp_profile-barbara-rainey","cwp_profile-sara-hagerty","series-familylife-today"],"acf":[],"episode_featured_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/09\/FLT-Podcast-Cover-2-508x508-3.jpg?w=508","episode_player_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2023\/02\/image-scaled.jpg","download_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-download\/304728\/made-to-be-seen","player_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-player\/304728\/made-to-be-seen","audio_player":null,"episode_data":{"playerMode":"light","subscribeUrls":{"apple_podcasts":{"key":"apple_podcasts","url":"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303?mt=2&app=podcast","label":"Apple Podcasts","class":"apple_podcasts","icon":"apple-podcasts.png"},"google_podcasts":{"key":"google_podcasts","url":"","label":"Google Podcasts","class":"google_podcasts","icon":"google-podcasts.png"},"spotify":{"key":"spotify","url":"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm","label":"Spotify","class":"spotify","icon":"spotify.png"},"youtube":{"key":"youtube","url":"","label":"YouTube","class":"youtube","icon":"youtube.png"}},"rssFeedUrl":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/feed\/podcast\/familylife-today","embedCode":"<blockquote class=\"wp-embedded-content\" data-secret=\"bkktM32M1y\"><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/made-to-be-seen\/\">Made to Be Seen<\/a><\/blockquote><iframe sandbox=\"allow-scripts\" security=\"restricted\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/made-to-be-seen\/embed\/#?secret=bkktM32M1y\" width=\"500\" height=\"350\" title=\"&#8220;Made to Be Seen&#8221; &#8212; FamilyLife\u00ae - A Cru Ministry\" data-secret=\"bkktM32M1y\" frameborder=\"0\" marginwidth=\"0\" marginheight=\"0\" scrolling=\"no\" class=\"wp-embedded-content\"><\/iframe><script>\n\/*! This file is auto-generated *\/\n!function(d,l){\"use strict\";l.querySelector&&d.addEventListener&&\"undefined\"!=typeof URL&&(d.wp=d.wp||{},d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage||(d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage=function(e){var t=e.data;if((t||t.secret||t.message||t.value)&&!\/[^a-zA-Z0-9]\/.test(t.secret)){for(var s,r,n,a=l.querySelectorAll('iframe[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),o=l.querySelectorAll('blockquote[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),c=new RegExp(\"^https?:$\",\"i\"),i=0;i<o.length;i++)o[i].style.display=\"none\";for(i=0;i<a.length;i++)s=a[i],e.source===s.contentWindow&&(s.removeAttribute(\"style\"),\"height\"===t.message?(1e3<(r=parseInt(t.value,10))?r=1e3:~~r<200&&(r=200),s.height=r):\"link\"===t.message&&(r=new URL(s.getAttribute(\"src\")),n=new URL(t.value),c.test(n.protocol))&&n.host===r.host&&l.activeElement===s&&(d.top.location.href=t.value))}},d.addEventListener(\"message\",d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage,!1),l.addEventListener(\"DOMContentLoaded\",function(){for(var e,t,s=l.querySelectorAll(\"iframe.wp-embedded-content\"),r=0;r<s.length;r++)(t=(e=s[r]).getAttribute(\"data-secret\"))||(t=Math.random().toString(36).substring(2,12),e.src+=\"#?secret=\"+t,e.setAttribute(\"data-secret\",t)),e.contentWindow.postMessage({message:\"ready\",secret:t},\"*\")},!1)))}(window,document);\n\/\/# sourceURL=https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-includes\/js\/wp-embed.min.js\n<\/script>\n"},"spectra_custom_meta":{"_wp_page_template":["default"],"transcript_url":["https:\/\/transcript.familylifetoday.com\/fl2017-10-17.pdf"],"audio_file":["https:\/\/web.familylifetoday.com\/fl2017-10-17.mp3"],"transcript_content":["<strong>Bob: <\/strong>When you spend time with God in prayer, is it more about duty\u2014or is there delight? Here is Sara Hagerty. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Sara: <\/strong>I think about one of my children\u2014you know, we have adopted four of our children\u2014and one of my children had been very independent when we brought her into our family\u2014and we wooed her. We went for longer walks with her and taught her what it was like just to be a daughter\u2014\u201cHey, we want to spend time with you.\u201d And in the same way, I think God gives us this invitation into prayer. It\u2019s not, \u201cYou need to pray more;\u201d but it actually is, \u201cWhen you see My eyes on you, you kind of want to talk to Me.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>This is <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> for Tuesday, October 17<sup>th<\/sup>. Our host is the President of FamilyLife<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>, Dennis Rainey, and I\u2019m Bob Lepine. How do we spend more time getting to know the God who pursues us? We\u2019ll talk about that today with Sara Hagerty. Stay with us. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>1:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd welcome to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. Thanks for joining us. You\u2019ve taken some of these internet quizzes; right? Do you know\u2014are you an introvert or an extrovert\u2014an ambivert? What kind of \u2013vert are you? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Ambivert?!\u00a0 [Laughter]\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>You\u2019ve not heard of an ambivert? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Barbara: <\/strong>No; what is it? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Oh, an ambivert is\u2014you know what an ambivert is? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>No, I\u2019ve never heard that term. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Seriously? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>So, three out of four people in here are normal. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>You guys are obviously\u2014[Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>Maybe, you\u2019re the ambivert. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Maybe. You\u2019re not\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Barbara: <\/strong>\u2014or you made it up. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>You\u2019re obviously not spending enough time online. You can google ambivert. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>I\u2019ve got to pick up my phone. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>An ambivert is somebody who is\u2014like ambidextrous\u2014can adjust how they relate to others depending on the situation they\u2019re in. So, you\u2019re thinking, \u201cWell, isn\u2019t everybody an ambivert?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>Yes. Wouldn\u2019t everybody want to be an ambivert? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>At some level, I think we all are adjusting all the time\u2014but in different social settings\u2014I think we morph to one or the other. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>2:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSome of us like to have the spotlight on us. Some of us would rather be in the corner. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Barbara: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Some of us\u2014it just depends on where we are and what\u2019s going on, whether we want people noticing us or not. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Well, didn\u2019t Jesus say, \u201cWe are to be the light of the world,\u201d and that we weren\u2019t supposed to hide our light under a bushel? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>So, you\u2019re saying that we all need to be in the spotlight? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>I don\u2019t know about being in the spotlight. \u201cWe just need to let our light shine,\u201d He said, \u201cin such a way that God is glorified.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Sometimes though, the light can shine in the corner\u2014if that\u2019s where you\u2019re hiding out; right? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Yes, and sometimes, it can shine on stage which is where Bob is hiding out. [Laughter]\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tOur guest on the show today is Sara Hagerty. She is the wife of Nate and the mom of six. She has a heart for God, a heart for orphans, and a heart for women having a relationship with God. She\u2019s written a book called <em>Unseen: The Gift of Being Hidden in a World That Loves to Be Noticed<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>3:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd I\u2019m going to ask you question about that in just a second, Sara\u2014but I want to also recognize my bride of more than 45 years\u2014Barbara\u2014who is joining us again on <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Barbara: <\/strong>Thank you. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Welcome back. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>And she has a heart for Dennis and a heart for kids and grandkids\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Barbara: <\/strong>I do. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u2014and a heart for moms; right? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Barbara: <\/strong>Yes, I do. Yes, I just\u2014I know what it\u2019s like to be where moms live because I\u2019ve been there. So, I do want to encourage women to\u2014as Sara is talking about\u2014find God where He has you in this season of your life. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Sara, here you\u2019ve written a book that is called <em>Unseen<\/em>\u2014and yet, you nodded your head when I quoted Matthew, Chapter 5, about our light should shine so that God is glorified. We were made to be seen\u2014not hidden\u2014right? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>Correct. He created us\u2014I go back to Psalm 139\u2014\u201cLord, You have searched me and know me. You know my sitting down and my rising up.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>4:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou understand my thought afar off. Where\u201d\u2014farther down\u2014\u201cWhere can I go from Your Spirit? Where can I flee from Your presence? For You formed my inward parts, You covered me in my mother\u2019s womb. I will praise You for I am fearfully and wonderfully made.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br>I mean this whole Psalm is about\u2014even farther down\u201415\u2014\u201cMy frame was not hidden from You when I was made in secret.\u201d From the very beginning, we were formed under His eye. We were made to be seen. The starting place, though\u2014of where we are seen\u2014is what this book talks about. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>So, you\u2019re saying that we need to first be seen by God, and then\u2014as we have a relationship with Him\u2014we are to let our light shine to the world in such a way that\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>Exactly. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>\u2014people are going to see God in us. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>Exactly\u2014and in such a way that we know that He\u2019s ordained. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think that there are a lot of opportunities\u2014especially in our ever connected world right now\u2014to produce a light that shines\u2014but I might suggest that we need to connect deeper to the Source so that we are connecting to His light shining through us in the way that He would have it shine through us.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>5:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThat we\u2019re not actually <em>forcing<\/em> a light to shine, but we are actually connecting to Him and letting His light shine through us in the right way and at the right time and at His ordained plan for us. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Okay. I want you to sell me on this idea that you are proposing here because I\u2019m cruising along, I\u2019m doing fine; you know? Jesus and me\u2014we\u2019re cool; right? I\u2019m involved in ministry. What\u2019s this, \u201cslow down and experience God in a new way\u201d? I\u2019m just kind of like, \u201cYou know it\u2019s all good. Leave it alone.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>Well, I might suggest, not necessarily that where you are, \u201cIt\u2019s all good. Leave it alone\u201d\u2014that that\u2019s something to interrupt, but more-so\u2014that there are parts of our day where there is real opportunity for dialogue with God when we invite Him in there\u2014when we invite His Word in there\u2014in the unconventional ways. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think all of us are familiar with a morning quiet time, but what about\u2014for a woman or a man\u2014while you\u2019re cooking dinner? Or what about while you\u2019re sitting in line at the DMV\u2014opening up His Word and saying, \u201cWhat do You have to say to me here?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>6:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhat I might suggest is that those are the opportunities to invite God to speak. Invite yourself to see His eyes upon you there. As we have those times, could it be that there is even more opportunity for making an impact on His Kingdom? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Now, you\u2019re not dialing down and spending this time with God so that you can then, go back online in two hours and say, \u201cHere, I had this amazing time with God two hours ago, and I just wanted to share it with you all?\u201d You\u2019re not doing that; are you? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>No\u2014that\u2019s exactly it. This is actually an opportunity to spend the time with God that, maybe, nobody would know about\u2014to spend the time conversing with Him or engaging with His Word that you\u2019re not necessarily going to go teach a Bible study about. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>This is not going to help your social media platform for you to be acknowledging these things. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>My publisher might not like this! [Laughter]\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>I know!\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Barbara: <\/strong>Yes. It reminds me of the verse where we are told to pray without ceasing\u2014and to me, that\u2019s what I am hearing you say. It\u2019s taking that friendship\u2014taking that relationship\u2014and trying to <em>engage<\/em> in getting to know God and hearing from Him throughout the day. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>7:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe tend to be so sort of \u201cprescribed\u201d\u2014at least I used to be that way more than I am now\u2014but I used to think, \u201cIn the morning, I get up, have my quiet time\u2014check that off the list\u201d\u2014and move on to do all the other things. The next morning, have my quiet time\u2014check it off the list\u2014if I was able to, because my kids usually woke up before I could have a quiet time so I usually felt like a failure for not having a quiet time\u2014but regardless. My point is, that many of us tend to look at life and\u2014in order to feel like we can survive\u2014we prescribe it or we structure it or we fix it so that we kind of know what to expect. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>Exactly. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Barbara:<\/strong> By doing that, though, we\u2019re not necessarily having this ongoing conversation with God. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Barbara: <\/strong>That\u2019s what I\u2019m hearing from you. I\u2019m hearing you say, \u201cCan I have a conversation with God outside of my quiet time or outside of church or outside of the Bible study I\u2019m participating in? Can I talk to Him when I\u2019m sitting at the DMV or doing the laundry or all of these other things?\u201d\u2014and you\u2019re saying, \u201cYes.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>8:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tTo me, that\u2019s what\u2019s so inviting and inspiring actually, too\u2014about your book\u2014is you\u2019re showing us a way to have a more authentic\u2014and even a deeper friendship with God\u2014which is what we all long for anyway. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Sara, Barbara read your book, and her comment was: \u201cThis book is really about prayer.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Barbara: <\/strong>Yes, that was my\u2014sort of my conclusion. Would you agree? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>I would. You know you mentioned Paul\u2019s invitation to pray without ceasing\u2014I think a lot of us would hear that and feel guilt\u2014I mean, if we\u2019re honest\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Barbara: <\/strong>Yes, we do. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>\u2014like\u2014\u201cI don\u2019t do that.\u201d So, we sort of guilt ourselves into maybe, a greater disciplined prayer life. What I might suggest is that when we start to see the beauty of God\u2019s eyes on us in the hidden pockets of our day, we actually want to talk back to Him. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think about one of my children\u2014you know we have adopted four of our children and two of them at older ages\u2014and one of my children had been very independent when we brought her into our family. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>9:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSo, she could go for <em>hours<\/em> in a day without connecting with us. That was really familiar to her. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe actually had to train her subtly\u2014I mean we didn\u2019t tell her we were training her\u2014that part of being in a family is you connect, \u201cHey, even if it\u2019s just you tell me what you\u2019re reading or tell me what you ate for lunch.\u201d It isn\u2019t this, \u201cYou live independently; and we\u2019re actually just providing for your needs and you\u2019re under our roof\u201d\u2014but we have an ongoing relationship. I think in many ways our relationship with God is similar. We need to be trained. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut part of being trained with this particular child\u2014we called it Project Woo\u2014and we wooed her. We took her on ice cream dates and took her out to get hot chocolate, and we went for longer walks with her and taught her what it was like just by engaging with her to be a daughter: \u201cHey, we want to spend time with you.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIn the same way, I think God gives us this invitation to prayer. It\u2019s not you need to pray more, as Paul invites us to pray without ceasing\u2014but it actually is, \u201cWhen you see\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>10:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014My eyes on you, you kind of want to talk to Me more.\u201d [Laughter]\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Yes. Let\u2019s talk about a time in your marriage when you and Nate were struggling with having children. How did that impact your\u2014view of God, your relationship with God\u2014and how did He use it in your life? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>I believed that God was good because I could see other people\u2019s\u2014demonstration in other people\u2019s lives\u2014of God being good. I knew what His Word said about Him being good; but when I was really quiet and outside of just the realm of everyday life, I recognized that deep down inside it didn\u2019t feel like He was good to me because my friends were having their first and second and third babies, and my womb was barren. So, if He was good and I was spending time regularly asking Him to open my womb, it must be actually that He is just not good to <em>me<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI remember one particular day, fourth floor of Martha Jefferson Hospital\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>11:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014which is where my friends all had their babies in Charlottesville, Virginia and I felt like I could have gotten a frequent flyer pass. I went to visit one friend, and she said\u2014I was just kind of asking her about her labor, though not really even knowing what to ask because I hadn\u2019t experienced it\u2014I said, \u201cDo you think you could do this again?\u201d She said, \u201cWell, sure, I mean this is a rite of passage; right?\u201d And as she said that, my heart sunk\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>\u2014because I thought, \u201cOh, that\u2019s a rite of passage for you, but it\u2019s a do not enter sign for me\u2014I can\u2019t get there.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSo, I left that hospital room, walked down to the elevator, took the elevator down to my car with my heart just sinking on the inside. Kind of\u2014it\u2019s all coming together for me like\u2014\u201cThey keep getting what I want, and I\u2019m not. So, the variable here must be me, God. It can\u2019t be You because You are good.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut in that time and in that space, instead of\u2014one option\u2014and we didn\u2019t have social media then\u2014but one option, at that point in time, could have been scroll my phone, look at what other people are doing in their lives, check out on social media,\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>12:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014fill my mind with some kind of noise\u2014but the other option really felt like an invitation: Get quiet before God and say, \u201cThis hurts,\u201d and have a dialogue with God. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tFor me, it was in the Psalms. I mean the psalmist felt like they wrote my song so I used the Psalms to pray to Him\u2014\u201cI feel that You\u2019ve abandoned me. I feel that You\u2019ve left me, God. What does Your Word say about ones like me who are brokenhearted?\u201d And I read that His Word says, \u201cHe\u2019s near to the brokenhearted,\u201d and I start to go\u2014\u201cOkay, maybe, it isn\u2019t that You\u2019re not good to me. Maybe, it is actually that You have something for me here in this barrenness.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Bob: <\/strong>Did you ever\u2014in the midst of that\u2014lose faith? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>You know, I actually didn\u2019t. I think at that point in time, it still felt fresh to me and I was connected enough to people in my world. I think\u2014for me\u2014it was much more subtle. I was starting to grow cold on the inside which could be potentially a worse flavor of losing the faith\u2014saying the right things but feeling cold on the inside.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>13:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI would look at what God was doing in other people\u2019s lives and see that it just wasn\u2019t matching mine. So, I could still keep saying the right language but\u2014on the inside\u2014feel like I\u2019ve been forgotten. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> You think about that in human relationships\u2014I mean, if we are spending time with a husband or a wife and we\u2019re disappointed at what\u2019s going on and how our life is going\u2014you can develop that coldness, that alienation\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u2014that isolation. We talk about it at the <em>Weekend to Remember<\/em><sup>\u00ae<\/sup> marriage getaways all the time\u2014that the natural drift of every relationship is toward isolation. It\u2019s not toward oneness. If that\u2019s true in marriage, then the natural drift in our relationship with God is toward that place of isolation or busyness or distraction\u2014not toward a place of oneness. That has to be intentionally pursued. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>That\u2019s exactly right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>And if you are pursuing that, there will be some points of growth, some lessons learned. You will see God at work. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>14:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI wonder how that kind of worked its way out for you to adopt two children from Ethiopia and two from Uganda. Did God use that time of barrenness to give you a heart for the orphan? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>You know we always had a heart for adoption. We lived with a family\u2014we were building a house and\u2014while our house was being built we lived with a family who had adopted. The first night that we stayed there, my husband and I said to each other, \u201cWe think we are here much more than just for a place to stay.\u201d We were witnessing this melded family\u2014and I think both of us sort of passively were going, \u201cHuh? We could see ourselves doing this.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tLike every young couple, we thought trying to have children meant having children. We certainly didn\u2019t think it was something we\u2019d do so soon but\u2014several years into our struggles with infertility\u2014this family was still in our lives. We\u2019re still watching the fruit of their outpouring and their melded family and going, \u201cI think this might be for us.\u201d So, maybe, much sooner than we would have had the idea been entirely new we\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>15:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014instead of walking down a long road of pursuing lots of fertility options\u2014we decided to adopt. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>What did you do? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>We spent a summer praying and asking God, \u201cWhere\u2014where are our children? If we\u2019re to adopt, are they here domestically? Are they international? Where?\u201d Really felt drawn specifically to Africa. At that point in time, Ethiopia was the only country open in Africa for adoption. There was a real natural fit with a program there, so we started the adoption process. We sort of shocked everyone in our world and said, \u201cWe think we\u2019re going to do this!\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tTwo years later, we were in Ethiopia, and we brought home our first two children\u2014but while we were there for that week, we went to tour our children\u2019s orphanage, and there was a girl there giving tours. She was a young girl\u2014seven\/eight\/nine\u2014and it was clear that her role at the orphanage was, \u201cI show the families who are coming to get their babies what the orphanage is like. That\u2019s what I do.\u201d But she had this look in her eyes as she\u2019s showing us around that just said, \u201cTake me home.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>16:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Barbara: <\/strong>Wow. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara:<\/strong> We left there and I said to Nate, \u201cWe <em>have<\/em> to go back\u201d\u2014not necessarily for her particularly\u2014but my heart was just so tugged for the older child who is in an orphanage less likely to be adopted watching the babies born and turned over into families arms within months. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tA year later, we started the process adopting from Uganda. At that point in time, we adopted two children outside the birth order\u2014we adopted a five year old and a seven year old from Uganda. So\u2014within two years\u2014our family grew from just the two of us to six of us total\u2014six bodies. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Yes; there you go. And not long after that, you got pregnant. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>That\u2019s exactly right. It was a little bit longer. It was\u2014we had been married for 13 years when I conceived our first biological child. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Dennis: <\/strong>So, take us to the moment when God answered that prayer. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>It\u2019s interesting\u2014it was early in the morning when I found out that I was pregnant; and after having been down the road\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>17:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014those listeners who have been through infertility know\u2014you could\u2014you\u2019d want to buy pregnancy tests in bulk from Costco because it just felt like you kept hanging on to hope. I just knew the familiar. I was very familiar with asking again and hearing, \u201cNo,\u201d and asking again and hearing, \u201cNo.\u201d So, the shock of actually finding out that I was pregnant\u2014and I was alone\u2014of course, I just wept. Then, when my husband woke up, the first words out of his mouth when I told him were \u201cDo you think the favor of God has lifted from our lives?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBoth of us\u2014in that timespan\u2014had seen so much fruit on the inside of our lives from the Lord saying, \u201cNo,\u201d to my womb. Both of us had developed a reach for God that we didn\u2019t have when life was working like we thought it should. Both of us had found a new conversation with God and a new way to engage with His Word when it felt like our life wasn\u2019t working\u2014that it actually felt like favor. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Weakness. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>Weakness\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>18:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014His power is made perfect in our weakness. We had found a beautiful, engaging relationship with God when my womb was barren. So, when we found out that God had finally answered all these prayers, all of the sudden we thought, \u201cWhat\u2014the season we just left was actually amazing\u2014because we found Him because He was there.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>You actually grieved. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>It was the strangest thing, and I imagine that\u2014I haven\u2019t, to this day, had anyone else in my shoes\u2014not that there wouldn\u2019t be anyone\u2014but 13 years is a long time to walk through infertility\u2014but I can imagine that I\u2019m not alone in that. When you start to see the fruit of God in suffering then, truly\u2014His Word tells us, \u201cGod is near to the brokenhearted.\u201d He was so near to us that it actually felt like\u2014\u201cWill we be able to find Him when our hearts don\u2019t feel so broken?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>You wound up conceiving not just one but a second biological child. How old are your bio-kids today? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>My daughter is five months. So, we actually\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>19:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014in three years, we conceived three biological children. I did have a miscarriage. So, my biological son\u2014Bo\u2014is three. He is our family mascot. [Laughter]\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>So, in the last four years? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>In the last four years, I\u2019ve conceived three children\u2014yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Has the favor of God left you? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>It certainly hasn\u2019t. I mean we all know; right? When I say that, that God\u2019s goodness is\u2014it just shows up in different ways, in different seasons\u2014and it has been rich. We have six children. Barbara can attest\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Barbara: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>\u2014there is just a great refining that happens the more children you add to your\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Oh, you think?!\u00a0 [Laughter]\u00a0 You think God\u2019s done with you when He gives you six? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>We are not sitting back eating bonbons. [Laughter]\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Barbara: <\/strong>\u00a0Well, I never went through infertility like you did, but we\u2019ve been through some seasons of suffering in our lives, and I know what you are talking about when you say, \u201cYou sense the presence of God in a way when you\u2019re in those really, really hard places\u201d\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Barbara: <\/strong>\u2014because we\u2019ve been there. I\u2019ve experienced that, and I know what that\u2019s like. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>20:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd I understand what you mean\u2014at a different level because of different experiences\u2014but nonetheless, coming out\u2014you do wonder, \u201cAm I going to continue to connect with God?\u201d To me, that was the thing that I remember feeling in several different situations that we\u2019ve been through\u2014\u201cAm I going to miss hearing from Him as much as I did when we were in those hard times?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>The Apostle Paul talked about a thorn\u2014a thorn in his flesh that he entreated God\u2014strong word\u2014he <em>pleaded<\/em> with God to remove it\u2014but Paul said that God told Him, \u201cMy grace is sufficient for you, for My power is made perfect in weakness.\u201d That\u2019s an interesting kind of dichotomy\u2014\u201cMy power is made perfect in weakness\u201d\u2014power displayed where people are broken\u2014not doing well.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>21:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tPaul goes on\u2014\u201cTherefore I will boast all the more gladly of my weaknesses, so that the power of Christ may rest upon me. For the sake of Christ, then, I am content with weaknesses, insults, hardships, persecutions, and calamities. For when I am weak, then I am strong.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br>What Paul is saying there to us\u2014through the inspiration of the Holy Spirit\u2014is what your book\u2019s about\u2014you\u2019re going to find God in those weak moments more clearly than when you feel like you\u2019re on the mountaintop. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>That\u2019s exactly right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Yes; I think there have undoubtedly been listeners today resonating with this conversation who will want to get a copy of the book,\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>22:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014<em>Unseen: The Gift of Being Hidden in a World That Loves to Be Noticed<\/em>. It\u2019s written by our guest today, Sara Hagerty. We\u2019ve got copies of her book in our <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> Resource Center. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou can order from us online at FamilyLifeToday.com\u2014or you can call to order at 1-800-358-6329. 1-800-FL-TODAY. Again, the website\u2014if you\u2019d like to order the book <em>Unseen<\/em>, by Sara Hagerty\u2014FamilyLifeToday.com. You can also call to order at 1-800- \u201cF\u201d as in family, \u201cL\u201d as in life, and then the word, \u201cTODAY.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe\u2019re in the middle of a very busy season here at FamilyLife. We\u2019ve got our Summit on Stepfamily Ministries coming up here in a few weeks. We are working on finishing <em>The Art of Parenting<\/em><sup>\u00ae<\/sup> video series. Our <em>Weekend to Remember<\/em> getaways are in full swing. A lot going on\u2014all of it centered on one thing, and that is\u2014\u201cHelping to effectively develop godly marriages and families who change the world one home at a time.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>23:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAll that we do at FamilyLife has that as its central mission. Our goal is to provide practical, biblical help and hope for marriages and families\u2014day-in and day-out\u2014through this radio program, through our resources\u2014online\u2014at our events. That\u2019s what <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is all about. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe good news is we are having an impact on more marriages and families all around the world every day as a result of contributions we\u2019ve received from listeners like you\u2014folks who say, \u201cWhat you guys are doing is important. We want to see it expand. We want to see more people reached.\u201d Every donation we receive goes right back in to helping us reach more people\u2014more often\u2014with more help and more hope. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSo, thanks to those of you who have already contributed, making today\u2019s program possible. Now, we need to talk about tomorrow\u2019s program and next week and the week beyond. If you can help with a donation today, we\u2019d love to hear from you. It\u2019s easy to donate online at FamilyLifeToday.com\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>24:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014or you can call to donate\u20141-800-FL-TODAY. You can also mail your donation to us at P.O. Box 7111, Little Rock, Arkansas; our zip code is 72223. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tTomorrow, we\u2019re going to continue the conversation about how we can be still and know that God is God and that He is with us. Sara Hagerty joins us again tomorrow. Hope you can be back with us again as well. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch, along with help today from Justin Adams. On behalf of our host, Dennis Rainey, I\u2019m Bob Lepine. We will see you back next time for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas. A Cru<sup>\u00ae <\/sup>Ministry. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\n\t\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\tHelp for today. Hope for tomorrow.\n\t\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright <sup>\u00a9<\/sup> 2017 FamilyLife. All rights reserved.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/\">www.FamilyLife.com<\/a>\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\n\t\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\t1\n\t\t\t\t<\/p>"],"_seopress_titles_title":[""],"_seopress_titles_desc":[""],"_seopress_robots_index":[""],"duration":["00:29:18"],"show_notes":[""],"_thumbnail_id":["294104"],"filesize":["26.83M"],"filesize_raw":["28130002"],"_uag_css_file_name":["uag-css-304728.css"],"_uag_js_file_name":["uag-js-304728.js"],"_uag_page_assets":["a:9:{s:3:\"css\";s:82560:\".wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape-top svg{width: calc( 100% + 1.3px );}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape.uagb-container__shape-top .uagb-container__shape-fill{fill: rgba(51,51,51,1);}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape-bottom svg{width: calc( 100% + 1.3px );}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape.uagb-container__shape-bottom 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Sara Hagerty and Barbara Rainey remind listeners that we were created to be seen first by God, and then by the people around us.","meta_box":{"show_notes":"","transcript_url":"https:\/\/transcript.familylifetoday.com\/fl2017-10-17.pdf","transcript_content":"<strong>Bob: <\/strong>When you spend time with God in prayer, is it more about duty\u2014or is there delight? Here is Sara Hagerty. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Sara: <\/strong>I think about one of my children\u2014you know, we have adopted four of our children\u2014and one of my children had been very independent when we brought her into our family\u2014and we wooed her. We went for longer walks with her and taught her what it was like just to be a daughter\u2014\u201cHey, we want to spend time with you.\u201d And in the same way, I think God gives us this invitation into prayer. It\u2019s not, \u201cYou need to pray more;\u201d but it actually is, \u201cWhen you see My eyes on you, you kind of want to talk to Me.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>This is <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> for Tuesday, October 17<sup>th<\/sup>. Our host is the President of FamilyLife<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>, Dennis Rainey, and I\u2019m Bob Lepine. How do we spend more time getting to know the God who pursues us? We\u2019ll talk about that today with Sara Hagerty. Stay with us. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>1:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd welcome to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. Thanks for joining us. You\u2019ve taken some of these internet quizzes; right? Do you know\u2014are you an introvert or an extrovert\u2014an ambivert? What kind of \u2013vert are you? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Ambivert?!\u00a0 [Laughter]\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>You\u2019ve not heard of an ambivert? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Barbara: <\/strong>No; what is it? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Oh, an ambivert is\u2014you know what an ambivert is? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>No, I\u2019ve never heard that term. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Seriously? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>So, three out of four people in here are normal. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>You guys are obviously\u2014[Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>Maybe, you\u2019re the ambivert. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Maybe. You\u2019re not\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Barbara: <\/strong>\u2014or you made it up. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>You\u2019re obviously not spending enough time online. You can google ambivert. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>I\u2019ve got to pick up my phone. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>An ambivert is somebody who is\u2014like ambidextrous\u2014can adjust how they relate to others depending on the situation they\u2019re in. So, you\u2019re thinking, \u201cWell, isn\u2019t everybody an ambivert?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>Yes. Wouldn\u2019t everybody want to be an ambivert? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>At some level, I think we all are adjusting all the time\u2014but in different social settings\u2014I think we morph to one or the other. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>2:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSome of us like to have the spotlight on us. Some of us would rather be in the corner. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Barbara: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Some of us\u2014it just depends on where we are and what\u2019s going on, whether we want people noticing us or not. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Well, didn\u2019t Jesus say, \u201cWe are to be the light of the world,\u201d and that we weren\u2019t supposed to hide our light under a bushel? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>So, you\u2019re saying that we all need to be in the spotlight? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>I don\u2019t know about being in the spotlight. \u201cWe just need to let our light shine,\u201d He said, \u201cin such a way that God is glorified.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Sometimes though, the light can shine in the corner\u2014if that\u2019s where you\u2019re hiding out; right? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Yes, and sometimes, it can shine on stage which is where Bob is hiding out. [Laughter]\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tOur guest on the show today is Sara Hagerty. She is the wife of Nate and the mom of six. She has a heart for God, a heart for orphans, and a heart for women having a relationship with God. She\u2019s written a book called <em>Unseen: The Gift of Being Hidden in a World That Loves to Be Noticed<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>3:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd I\u2019m going to ask you question about that in just a second, Sara\u2014but I want to also recognize my bride of more than 45 years\u2014Barbara\u2014who is joining us again on <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Barbara: <\/strong>Thank you. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Welcome back. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>And she has a heart for Dennis and a heart for kids and grandkids\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Barbara: <\/strong>I do. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u2014and a heart for moms; right? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Barbara: <\/strong>Yes, I do. Yes, I just\u2014I know what it\u2019s like to be where moms live because I\u2019ve been there. So, I do want to encourage women to\u2014as Sara is talking about\u2014find God where He has you in this season of your life. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Sara, here you\u2019ve written a book that is called <em>Unseen<\/em>\u2014and yet, you nodded your head when I quoted Matthew, Chapter 5, about our light should shine so that God is glorified. We were made to be seen\u2014not hidden\u2014right? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>Correct. He created us\u2014I go back to Psalm 139\u2014\u201cLord, You have searched me and know me. You know my sitting down and my rising up.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>4:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou understand my thought afar off. Where\u201d\u2014farther down\u2014\u201cWhere can I go from Your Spirit? Where can I flee from Your presence? For You formed my inward parts, You covered me in my mother\u2019s womb. I will praise You for I am fearfully and wonderfully made.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br>I mean this whole Psalm is about\u2014even farther down\u201415\u2014\u201cMy frame was not hidden from You when I was made in secret.\u201d From the very beginning, we were formed under His eye. We were made to be seen. The starting place, though\u2014of where we are seen\u2014is what this book talks about. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>So, you\u2019re saying that we need to first be seen by God, and then\u2014as we have a relationship with Him\u2014we are to let our light shine to the world in such a way that\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>Exactly. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>\u2014people are going to see God in us. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>Exactly\u2014and in such a way that we know that He\u2019s ordained. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think that there are a lot of opportunities\u2014especially in our ever connected world right now\u2014to produce a light that shines\u2014but I might suggest that we need to connect deeper to the Source so that we are connecting to His light shining through us in the way that He would have it shine through us.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>5:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThat we\u2019re not actually <em>forcing<\/em> a light to shine, but we are actually connecting to Him and letting His light shine through us in the right way and at the right time and at His ordained plan for us. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Okay. I want you to sell me on this idea that you are proposing here because I\u2019m cruising along, I\u2019m doing fine; you know? Jesus and me\u2014we\u2019re cool; right? I\u2019m involved in ministry. What\u2019s this, \u201cslow down and experience God in a new way\u201d? I\u2019m just kind of like, \u201cYou know it\u2019s all good. Leave it alone.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>Well, I might suggest, not necessarily that where you are, \u201cIt\u2019s all good. Leave it alone\u201d\u2014that that\u2019s something to interrupt, but more-so\u2014that there are parts of our day where there is real opportunity for dialogue with God when we invite Him in there\u2014when we invite His Word in there\u2014in the unconventional ways. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think all of us are familiar with a morning quiet time, but what about\u2014for a woman or a man\u2014while you\u2019re cooking dinner? Or what about while you\u2019re sitting in line at the DMV\u2014opening up His Word and saying, \u201cWhat do You have to say to me here?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>6:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhat I might suggest is that those are the opportunities to invite God to speak. Invite yourself to see His eyes upon you there. As we have those times, could it be that there is even more opportunity for making an impact on His Kingdom? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Now, you\u2019re not dialing down and spending this time with God so that you can then, go back online in two hours and say, \u201cHere, I had this amazing time with God two hours ago, and I just wanted to share it with you all?\u201d You\u2019re not doing that; are you? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>No\u2014that\u2019s exactly it. This is actually an opportunity to spend the time with God that, maybe, nobody would know about\u2014to spend the time conversing with Him or engaging with His Word that you\u2019re not necessarily going to go teach a Bible study about. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>This is not going to help your social media platform for you to be acknowledging these things. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>My publisher might not like this! [Laughter]\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>I know!\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Barbara: <\/strong>Yes. It reminds me of the verse where we are told to pray without ceasing\u2014and to me, that\u2019s what I am hearing you say. It\u2019s taking that friendship\u2014taking that relationship\u2014and trying to <em>engage<\/em> in getting to know God and hearing from Him throughout the day. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>7:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe tend to be so sort of \u201cprescribed\u201d\u2014at least I used to be that way more than I am now\u2014but I used to think, \u201cIn the morning, I get up, have my quiet time\u2014check that off the list\u201d\u2014and move on to do all the other things. The next morning, have my quiet time\u2014check it off the list\u2014if I was able to, because my kids usually woke up before I could have a quiet time so I usually felt like a failure for not having a quiet time\u2014but regardless. My point is, that many of us tend to look at life and\u2014in order to feel like we can survive\u2014we prescribe it or we structure it or we fix it so that we kind of know what to expect. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>Exactly. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Barbara:<\/strong> By doing that, though, we\u2019re not necessarily having this ongoing conversation with God. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Barbara: <\/strong>That\u2019s what I\u2019m hearing from you. I\u2019m hearing you say, \u201cCan I have a conversation with God outside of my quiet time or outside of church or outside of the Bible study I\u2019m participating in? Can I talk to Him when I\u2019m sitting at the DMV or doing the laundry or all of these other things?\u201d\u2014and you\u2019re saying, \u201cYes.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>8:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tTo me, that\u2019s what\u2019s so inviting and inspiring actually, too\u2014about your book\u2014is you\u2019re showing us a way to have a more authentic\u2014and even a deeper friendship with God\u2014which is what we all long for anyway. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Sara, Barbara read your book, and her comment was: \u201cThis book is really about prayer.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Barbara: <\/strong>Yes, that was my\u2014sort of my conclusion. Would you agree? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>I would. You know you mentioned Paul\u2019s invitation to pray without ceasing\u2014I think a lot of us would hear that and feel guilt\u2014I mean, if we\u2019re honest\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Barbara: <\/strong>Yes, we do. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>\u2014like\u2014\u201cI don\u2019t do that.\u201d So, we sort of guilt ourselves into maybe, a greater disciplined prayer life. What I might suggest is that when we start to see the beauty of God\u2019s eyes on us in the hidden pockets of our day, we actually want to talk back to Him. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think about one of my children\u2014you know we have adopted four of our children and two of them at older ages\u2014and one of my children had been very independent when we brought her into our family. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>9:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSo, she could go for <em>hours<\/em> in a day without connecting with us. That was really familiar to her. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe actually had to train her subtly\u2014I mean we didn\u2019t tell her we were training her\u2014that part of being in a family is you connect, \u201cHey, even if it\u2019s just you tell me what you\u2019re reading or tell me what you ate for lunch.\u201d It isn\u2019t this, \u201cYou live independently; and we\u2019re actually just providing for your needs and you\u2019re under our roof\u201d\u2014but we have an ongoing relationship. I think in many ways our relationship with God is similar. We need to be trained. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut part of being trained with this particular child\u2014we called it Project Woo\u2014and we wooed her. We took her on ice cream dates and took her out to get hot chocolate, and we went for longer walks with her and taught her what it was like just by engaging with her to be a daughter: \u201cHey, we want to spend time with you.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIn the same way, I think God gives us this invitation to prayer. It\u2019s not you need to pray more, as Paul invites us to pray without ceasing\u2014but it actually is, \u201cWhen you see\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>10:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014My eyes on you, you kind of want to talk to Me more.\u201d [Laughter]\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Yes. Let\u2019s talk about a time in your marriage when you and Nate were struggling with having children. How did that impact your\u2014view of God, your relationship with God\u2014and how did He use it in your life? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>I believed that God was good because I could see other people\u2019s\u2014demonstration in other people\u2019s lives\u2014of God being good. I knew what His Word said about Him being good; but when I was really quiet and outside of just the realm of everyday life, I recognized that deep down inside it didn\u2019t feel like He was good to me because my friends were having their first and second and third babies, and my womb was barren. So, if He was good and I was spending time regularly asking Him to open my womb, it must be actually that He is just not good to <em>me<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI remember one particular day, fourth floor of Martha Jefferson Hospital\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>11:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014which is where my friends all had their babies in Charlottesville, Virginia and I felt like I could have gotten a frequent flyer pass. I went to visit one friend, and she said\u2014I was just kind of asking her about her labor, though not really even knowing what to ask because I hadn\u2019t experienced it\u2014I said, \u201cDo you think you could do this again?\u201d She said, \u201cWell, sure, I mean this is a rite of passage; right?\u201d And as she said that, my heart sunk\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>\u2014because I thought, \u201cOh, that\u2019s a rite of passage for you, but it\u2019s a do not enter sign for me\u2014I can\u2019t get there.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSo, I left that hospital room, walked down to the elevator, took the elevator down to my car with my heart just sinking on the inside. Kind of\u2014it\u2019s all coming together for me like\u2014\u201cThey keep getting what I want, and I\u2019m not. So, the variable here must be me, God. It can\u2019t be You because You are good.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut in that time and in that space, instead of\u2014one option\u2014and we didn\u2019t have social media then\u2014but one option, at that point in time, could have been scroll my phone, look at what other people are doing in their lives, check out on social media,\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>12:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014fill my mind with some kind of noise\u2014but the other option really felt like an invitation: Get quiet before God and say, \u201cThis hurts,\u201d and have a dialogue with God. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tFor me, it was in the Psalms. I mean the psalmist felt like they wrote my song so I used the Psalms to pray to Him\u2014\u201cI feel that You\u2019ve abandoned me. I feel that You\u2019ve left me, God. What does Your Word say about ones like me who are brokenhearted?\u201d And I read that His Word says, \u201cHe\u2019s near to the brokenhearted,\u201d and I start to go\u2014\u201cOkay, maybe, it isn\u2019t that You\u2019re not good to me. Maybe, it is actually that You have something for me here in this barrenness.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Bob: <\/strong>Did you ever\u2014in the midst of that\u2014lose faith? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>You know, I actually didn\u2019t. I think at that point in time, it still felt fresh to me and I was connected enough to people in my world. I think\u2014for me\u2014it was much more subtle. I was starting to grow cold on the inside which could be potentially a worse flavor of losing the faith\u2014saying the right things but feeling cold on the inside.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>13:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI would look at what God was doing in other people\u2019s lives and see that it just wasn\u2019t matching mine. So, I could still keep saying the right language but\u2014on the inside\u2014feel like I\u2019ve been forgotten. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> You think about that in human relationships\u2014I mean, if we are spending time with a husband or a wife and we\u2019re disappointed at what\u2019s going on and how our life is going\u2014you can develop that coldness, that alienation\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u2014that isolation. We talk about it at the <em>Weekend to Remember<\/em><sup>\u00ae<\/sup> marriage getaways all the time\u2014that the natural drift of every relationship is toward isolation. It\u2019s not toward oneness. If that\u2019s true in marriage, then the natural drift in our relationship with God is toward that place of isolation or busyness or distraction\u2014not toward a place of oneness. That has to be intentionally pursued. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>That\u2019s exactly right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>And if you are pursuing that, there will be some points of growth, some lessons learned. You will see God at work. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>14:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI wonder how that kind of worked its way out for you to adopt two children from Ethiopia and two from Uganda. Did God use that time of barrenness to give you a heart for the orphan? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>You know we always had a heart for adoption. We lived with a family\u2014we were building a house and\u2014while our house was being built we lived with a family who had adopted. The first night that we stayed there, my husband and I said to each other, \u201cWe think we are here much more than just for a place to stay.\u201d We were witnessing this melded family\u2014and I think both of us sort of passively were going, \u201cHuh? We could see ourselves doing this.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tLike every young couple, we thought trying to have children meant having children. We certainly didn\u2019t think it was something we\u2019d do so soon but\u2014several years into our struggles with infertility\u2014this family was still in our lives. We\u2019re still watching the fruit of their outpouring and their melded family and going, \u201cI think this might be for us.\u201d So, maybe, much sooner than we would have had the idea been entirely new we\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>15:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014instead of walking down a long road of pursuing lots of fertility options\u2014we decided to adopt. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>What did you do? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>We spent a summer praying and asking God, \u201cWhere\u2014where are our children? If we\u2019re to adopt, are they here domestically? Are they international? Where?\u201d Really felt drawn specifically to Africa. At that point in time, Ethiopia was the only country open in Africa for adoption. There was a real natural fit with a program there, so we started the adoption process. We sort of shocked everyone in our world and said, \u201cWe think we\u2019re going to do this!\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tTwo years later, we were in Ethiopia, and we brought home our first two children\u2014but while we were there for that week, we went to tour our children\u2019s orphanage, and there was a girl there giving tours. She was a young girl\u2014seven\/eight\/nine\u2014and it was clear that her role at the orphanage was, \u201cI show the families who are coming to get their babies what the orphanage is like. That\u2019s what I do.\u201d But she had this look in her eyes as she\u2019s showing us around that just said, \u201cTake me home.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>16:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Barbara: <\/strong>Wow. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara:<\/strong> We left there and I said to Nate, \u201cWe <em>have<\/em> to go back\u201d\u2014not necessarily for her particularly\u2014but my heart was just so tugged for the older child who is in an orphanage less likely to be adopted watching the babies born and turned over into families arms within months. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tA year later, we started the process adopting from Uganda. At that point in time, we adopted two children outside the birth order\u2014we adopted a five year old and a seven year old from Uganda. So\u2014within two years\u2014our family grew from just the two of us to six of us total\u2014six bodies. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Yes; there you go. And not long after that, you got pregnant. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>That\u2019s exactly right. It was a little bit longer. It was\u2014we had been married for 13 years when I conceived our first biological child. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Dennis: <\/strong>So, take us to the moment when God answered that prayer. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>It\u2019s interesting\u2014it was early in the morning when I found out that I was pregnant; and after having been down the road\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>17:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014those listeners who have been through infertility know\u2014you could\u2014you\u2019d want to buy pregnancy tests in bulk from Costco because it just felt like you kept hanging on to hope. I just knew the familiar. I was very familiar with asking again and hearing, \u201cNo,\u201d and asking again and hearing, \u201cNo.\u201d So, the shock of actually finding out that I was pregnant\u2014and I was alone\u2014of course, I just wept. Then, when my husband woke up, the first words out of his mouth when I told him were \u201cDo you think the favor of God has lifted from our lives?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBoth of us\u2014in that timespan\u2014had seen so much fruit on the inside of our lives from the Lord saying, \u201cNo,\u201d to my womb. Both of us had developed a reach for God that we didn\u2019t have when life was working like we thought it should. Both of us had found a new conversation with God and a new way to engage with His Word when it felt like our life wasn\u2019t working\u2014that it actually felt like favor. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Weakness. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>Weakness\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>18:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014His power is made perfect in our weakness. We had found a beautiful, engaging relationship with God when my womb was barren. So, when we found out that God had finally answered all these prayers, all of the sudden we thought, \u201cWhat\u2014the season we just left was actually amazing\u2014because we found Him because He was there.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>You actually grieved. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>It was the strangest thing, and I imagine that\u2014I haven\u2019t, to this day, had anyone else in my shoes\u2014not that there wouldn\u2019t be anyone\u2014but 13 years is a long time to walk through infertility\u2014but I can imagine that I\u2019m not alone in that. When you start to see the fruit of God in suffering then, truly\u2014His Word tells us, \u201cGod is near to the brokenhearted.\u201d He was so near to us that it actually felt like\u2014\u201cWill we be able to find Him when our hearts don\u2019t feel so broken?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>You wound up conceiving not just one but a second biological child. How old are your bio-kids today? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>My daughter is five months. So, we actually\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>19:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014in three years, we conceived three biological children. I did have a miscarriage. So, my biological son\u2014Bo\u2014is three. He is our family mascot. [Laughter]\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>So, in the last four years? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>In the last four years, I\u2019ve conceived three children\u2014yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Has the favor of God left you? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>It certainly hasn\u2019t. I mean we all know; right? When I say that, that God\u2019s goodness is\u2014it just shows up in different ways, in different seasons\u2014and it has been rich. We have six children. Barbara can attest\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Barbara: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>\u2014there is just a great refining that happens the more children you add to your\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Oh, you think?!\u00a0 [Laughter]\u00a0 You think God\u2019s done with you when He gives you six? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>We are not sitting back eating bonbons. [Laughter]\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Barbara: <\/strong>\u00a0Well, I never went through infertility like you did, but we\u2019ve been through some seasons of suffering in our lives, and I know what you are talking about when you say, \u201cYou sense the presence of God in a way when you\u2019re in those really, really hard places\u201d\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Barbara: <\/strong>\u2014because we\u2019ve been there. I\u2019ve experienced that, and I know what that\u2019s like. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>20:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd I understand what you mean\u2014at a different level because of different experiences\u2014but nonetheless, coming out\u2014you do wonder, \u201cAm I going to continue to connect with God?\u201d To me, that was the thing that I remember feeling in several different situations that we\u2019ve been through\u2014\u201cAm I going to miss hearing from Him as much as I did when we were in those hard times?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>The Apostle Paul talked about a thorn\u2014a thorn in his flesh that he entreated God\u2014strong word\u2014he <em>pleaded<\/em> with God to remove it\u2014but Paul said that God told Him, \u201cMy grace is sufficient for you, for My power is made perfect in weakness.\u201d That\u2019s an interesting kind of dichotomy\u2014\u201cMy power is made perfect in weakness\u201d\u2014power displayed where people are broken\u2014not doing well.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>21:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tPaul goes on\u2014\u201cTherefore I will boast all the more gladly of my weaknesses, so that the power of Christ may rest upon me. For the sake of Christ, then, I am content with weaknesses, insults, hardships, persecutions, and calamities. For when I am weak, then I am strong.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br>What Paul is saying there to us\u2014through the inspiration of the Holy Spirit\u2014is what your book\u2019s about\u2014you\u2019re going to find God in those weak moments more clearly than when you feel like you\u2019re on the mountaintop. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Sara: <\/strong>That\u2019s exactly right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Yes; I think there have undoubtedly been listeners today resonating with this conversation who will want to get a copy of the book,\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>22:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014<em>Unseen: The Gift of Being Hidden in a World That Loves to Be Noticed<\/em>. It\u2019s written by our guest today, Sara Hagerty. We\u2019ve got copies of her book in our <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> Resource Center. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou can order from us online at FamilyLifeToday.com\u2014or you can call to order at 1-800-358-6329. 1-800-FL-TODAY. Again, the website\u2014if you\u2019d like to order the book <em>Unseen<\/em>, by Sara Hagerty\u2014FamilyLifeToday.com. You can also call to order at 1-800- \u201cF\u201d as in family, \u201cL\u201d as in life, and then the word, \u201cTODAY.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe\u2019re in the middle of a very busy season here at FamilyLife. We\u2019ve got our Summit on Stepfamily Ministries coming up here in a few weeks. We are working on finishing <em>The Art of Parenting<\/em><sup>\u00ae<\/sup> video series. Our <em>Weekend to Remember<\/em> getaways are in full swing. A lot going on\u2014all of it centered on one thing, and that is\u2014\u201cHelping to effectively develop godly marriages and families who change the world one home at a time.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>23:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAll that we do at FamilyLife has that as its central mission. Our goal is to provide practical, biblical help and hope for marriages and families\u2014day-in and day-out\u2014through this radio program, through our resources\u2014online\u2014at our events. That\u2019s what <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is all about. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe good news is we are having an impact on more marriages and families all around the world every day as a result of contributions we\u2019ve received from listeners like you\u2014folks who say, \u201cWhat you guys are doing is important. We want to see it expand. We want to see more people reached.\u201d Every donation we receive goes right back in to helping us reach more people\u2014more often\u2014with more help and more hope. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSo, thanks to those of you who have already contributed, making today\u2019s program possible. Now, we need to talk about tomorrow\u2019s program and next week and the week beyond. If you can help with a donation today, we\u2019d love to hear from you. It\u2019s easy to donate online at FamilyLifeToday.com\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>24:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014or you can call to donate\u20141-800-FL-TODAY. You can also mail your donation to us at P.O. Box 7111, Little Rock, Arkansas; our zip code is 72223. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tTomorrow, we\u2019re going to continue the conversation about how we can be still and know that God is God and that He is with us. Sara Hagerty joins us again tomorrow. Hope you can be back with us again as well. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch, along with help today from Justin Adams. On behalf of our host, Dennis Rainey, I\u2019m Bob Lepine. We will see you back next time for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas. A Cru<sup>\u00ae <\/sup>Ministry. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\n\t\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\tHelp for today. Hope for tomorrow.\n\t\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright <sup>\u00a9<\/sup> 2017 FamilyLife. 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