{"id":304448,"date":"2017-04-04T11:00:00","date_gmt":"2017-04-04T15:00:00","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/%series%\/realizing-theres-a-problem\/"},"modified":"2017-04-04T11:00:00","modified_gmt":"2017-04-04T15:00:00","slug":"realizing-theres-a-problem","status":"publish","type":"podcast","link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/realizing-theres-a-problem\/","title":{"rendered":"Realizing There&#8217;s a Problem"},"content":{"rendered":"","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Ron Welch describes the psychological profiles of a controlling husband and his wife. Ron and his wife, Jan, explain how the truth of the gospel is healing their marriage.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":91,"featured_media":294104,"menu_order":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","template":"","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","inline_featured_image":false,"_uag_custom_page_level_css":"","episode_type":"","audio_file":"https:\/\/web.familylifetoday.com\/fl2017-04-04.mp3","cover_image":"","cover_image_id":"","duration":"00:","filesize":"25.63M","filesize_raw":"26877299","date_recorded":"","explicit":"","block":""},"categories":[2082,2902],"tags":[5295,4584,5585,5588,4051,5586,2212,5587],"podcast_series":[8058],"cwp_profile":[9375],"series":[2101],"class_list":["post-304448","podcast","type-podcast","status-publish","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-communication","category-resolving-conflict","tag-controlling","tag-fear","tag-insecure","tag-low-self-esteem","tag-resolving-conflict","tag-safety","tag-setting-boundaries","tag-threats","podcast_series-the-controlling-husband","cwp_profile-ron-and-jan-welch","series-familylife-today"],"acf":[],"episode_featured_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/09\/FLT-Podcast-Cover-2-508x508-3.jpg?w=508","episode_player_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2023\/02\/image-scaled.jpg","download_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-download\/304448\/realizing-theres-a-problem","player_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-player\/304448\/realizing-theres-a-problem","audio_player":null,"episode_data":{"playerMode":"light","subscribeUrls":{"apple_podcasts":{"key":"apple_podcasts","url":"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303?mt=2&app=podcast","label":"Apple Podcasts","class":"apple_podcasts","icon":"apple-podcasts.png"},"google_podcasts":{"key":"google_podcasts","url":"","label":"Google Podcasts","class":"google_podcasts","icon":"google-podcasts.png"},"spotify":{"key":"spotify","url":"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm","label":"Spotify","class":"spotify","icon":"spotify.png"},"youtube":{"key":"youtube","url":"","label":"YouTube","class":"youtube","icon":"youtube.png"}},"rssFeedUrl":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/feed\/podcast\/familylife-today","embedCode":"<blockquote class=\"wp-embedded-content\" data-secret=\"lw6UgHbdvR\"><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/realizing-theres-a-problem\/\">Realizing There&#8217;s a Problem<\/a><\/blockquote><iframe sandbox=\"allow-scripts\" security=\"restricted\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/realizing-theres-a-problem\/embed\/#?secret=lw6UgHbdvR\" width=\"500\" height=\"350\" title=\"&#8220;Realizing There&#8217;s a Problem&#8221; &#8212; FamilyLife\u00ae - A Cru Ministry\" data-secret=\"lw6UgHbdvR\" frameborder=\"0\" marginwidth=\"0\" marginheight=\"0\" scrolling=\"no\" class=\"wp-embedded-content\"><\/iframe><script>\n\/*! This file is auto-generated *\/\n!function(d,l){\"use strict\";l.querySelector&&d.addEventListener&&\"undefined\"!=typeof URL&&(d.wp=d.wp||{},d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage||(d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage=function(e){var t=e.data;if((t||t.secret||t.message||t.value)&&!\/[^a-zA-Z0-9]\/.test(t.secret)){for(var s,r,n,a=l.querySelectorAll('iframe[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),o=l.querySelectorAll('blockquote[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),c=new RegExp(\"^https?:$\",\"i\"),i=0;i<o.length;i++)o[i].style.display=\"none\";for(i=0;i<a.length;i++)s=a[i],e.source===s.contentWindow&&(s.removeAttribute(\"style\"),\"height\"===t.message?(1e3<(r=parseInt(t.value,10))?r=1e3:~~r<200&&(r=200),s.height=r):\"link\"===t.message&&(r=new URL(s.getAttribute(\"src\")),n=new URL(t.value),c.test(n.protocol))&&n.host===r.host&&l.activeElement===s&&(d.top.location.href=t.value))}},d.addEventListener(\"message\",d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage,!1),l.addEventListener(\"DOMContentLoaded\",function(){for(var e,t,s=l.querySelectorAll(\"iframe.wp-embedded-content\"),r=0;r<s.length;r++)(t=(e=s[r]).getAttribute(\"data-secret\"))||(t=Math.random().toString(36).substring(2,12),e.src+=\"#?secret=\"+t,e.setAttribute(\"data-secret\",t)),e.contentWindow.postMessage({message:\"ready\",secret:t},\"*\")},!1)))}(window,document);\n\/\/# sourceURL=https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-includes\/js\/wp-embed.min.js\n<\/script>\n"},"spectra_custom_meta":{"_wp_page_template":["default"],"transcript_url":["https:\/\/transcript.familylifetoday.com\/fl2017-04-04.pdf"],"audio_file":["https:\/\/web.familylifetoday.com\/fl2017-04-04.mp3"],"transcript_content":["<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Ron Welch describes himself as a controlling husband. He and his wife Jan say one of the ways that has manifested itself in their marriage is that Ron has sometimes insisted that Jan make his priorities number one in her life. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jan: <\/strong>I would really be caught in a situation where I wanted to help somebody; but if I helped them, then it is going to anger my husband because: \u201cWhy are you putting\u2014going out of your way to do something?\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>Then, \u201cWhat would happen if <em>I<\/em> had something <em>I<\/em> needed done or wanted done at the same time?\u201d It was an obvious choice. She was like, \u201cWell, I don\u2019t want to rock the boat; so, I guess I\u2019m not going to be the person I want to be.\u201d <em>That\u2019s<\/em> what ended up happening rather than doing what I believe we\u2019re called to do\u2014to build our wives up to become the women God intended them to be\u2014I was putting every barrier and wall between her and God that I could. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>This is <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> for Tuesday, April 4<sup>th<\/sup>. Our host is the President of FamilyLife<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>, Dennis Rainey, and I\u2019m Bob Lepine. What do you do when you start to recognize controlling tendencies in your marriage? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>1:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHow can you get help? We\u2019re going to talk about that today. Stay with us.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd welcome to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. Thanks for joining us. You\u2019ve had the occasion to talk to husbands and wives, over the years, who have been in a marriage where they didn\u2019t want the marriage to end; but they didn\u2019t know what else to do. They felt trapped and without any hope for how this marriage could ever be what it was supposed to be; right?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Yes; and they\u2019ve repeatedly tried to get it out of the ditch; but in that state of hopelessness, have truly lost faith. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Yes; the tires just keep spinning, and you don\u2019t get anywhere. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Yes. We\u2019ve got a couple with us today who have experienced that, but the good news is they got out of the ditch\u2014not only that\u2014but they have a wrecker service. [Laughter] They are pulling couples out all over the country. Jan and Ron Welch join us, again, on <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. Welcome to the broadcast. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jan: <\/strong>Thank you. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>Pleasure to be here. Thank you. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>2:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Ron has written a book called <em>The Controlling Husband<\/em>. It\u2019s subtitled <em>What Every Woman Needs to Know<\/em>. Ron\u2019s a professor at Denver Seminary. Jan is a school teacher. They have two sons. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAs we get started talking about a controlling husband, I want you to do a profile on two different people. Number one, what\u2019s the profile of a controlling husband? And secondly, what\u2019s the profile of the woman who married him?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>The controlling husband would look like a man who thinks he pretty well has things under control on the surface; yet underneath, is a scared little boy. He\u2019s not nearly as confident as he wants you to think; but he has to spend a lot of time convincing you, because he\u2019s talking to himself. He has tendencies that work toward the anxious kind of experience: \u201cI\u2019m kind of not certain things are going to work out well, and I\u2019d like to change that. I\u2019d like to see if I can prevent bad things from happening.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>3:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIn addition, he is what we call narcissistic. He might have that temperament that says: \u201cIf I could <em>only<\/em> let them know how okay I was\u2014man, things would be really good. So, I\u2019ve got to work hard to make sure they know that.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>You know, you\u2019re describing yourself here because you wrote the book\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Dennis: <\/strong>\u2014about your story. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>Yes; indeed. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>That was taking place in your marriage; right?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>Every year, over and over again. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Alright\u2014just a little confession on the frontend, because that\u2019s one of the things I really appreciate about your book. You got raw and honest about how you were a controlling husband in your marriage. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNow, talk about what the profile is of a wife who marries a controlling man. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>Let me make one comment first. You said I <em>was<\/em> a controlling husband. I think it\u2019s fair to say, \u201cI\u2019m a recovering controlling husband.\u201d\u00a0 [Laughter]\u00a0 That\u2019s a little more honest, because this is a <em>daily<\/em> battle. Let\u2019s be clear about that! \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe controlling husband\u2019s wife is the kind of woman who may have not had a lot of confidence in herself before the relationship started. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>4:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tShe might have had some difficulty in her family of origin\u2014maybe with a dad who was kind of controlling\u2014or maybe previous relationships \/ boyfriends who have been controlling. She might have gotten to think, \u201cThis is kind of how it\u2019s supposed to be.\u201d\u00a0 She may have a very strong devotion to biblical principles and think: \u201cThe Bible says, \u2018Submit.\u2019 When I think of submit, the way I understand it is I\u2019m supposed to do what I am told.\u201d She may think: \u201cI want to have a voice, but I\u2019m certain that a strong Christian man will understand that. He won\u2019t step on me. He\u2019ll let my voice be heard.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd then, she may also be the kind of person who really wants other people to be okay\u2014to please them \/ to make them happy\u2014because she thinks servanthood and serving others is really important. All great qualities; but when matched with someone, who is more than happy to take, now you have a taker and a giver. The combination can be incredibly destructive. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Your pattern in <em>your<\/em> marriage\u2014where you were exercising control \/ where Jan was isolated and was <em>being<\/em> controlled\u2014did it last a decade? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> I would say 12 to 14\/15 years.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>5:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> You said there was a point in your marriage where you started to notice your sons were being controlling of their mother. You thought, \u201cThey learned it from <em>me<\/em>.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Was that enough of a realization to cause you to go, \u201cOkay, something has got to be changed here,\u201d or was that just one of those things that you noticed and thought, \u201cThis is not good, but I don\u2019t know what to do about it\u201d?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>No; it was ground-shaking for me. It was the realization that\u2014not only was <em>I<\/em> treating her that way, but I was teaching my sons how to behave that way as well. I started thinking about the people who talked about how much I like to be in control or I always had to be right. I started realizing that I had been mainly a kind of a cognitive Christian most of my life\u2014I had said all the right things \/ done all the right things\u2014I followed all the appropriate descriptions of what Christian men were supposed to be. But the relationship in my heart with Christ that would transform me, from the inside out, was really not there. I wasn\u2019t submitting <em>myself <\/em>to <em>anyone<\/em>, including God. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>6:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jan: <\/strong>In my mind, if you are a Christian, there is something very special about, not only <em>being<\/em> a Christian, but how you act and how you treat other people. To be honest, I think I treated other people better and was more compassionate. I could tell you an example. A friend would need something\u2014I would have to change my whole schedule, but I could do it. Ron would be like: \u201cWhy are you doing that? You don\u2019t need to do that. They don\u2019t do anything for you.\u201d\u00a0 But in my heart and in my mind was: \u201cI want to help those people. I feel better when I can help other people.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI would really be caught in a situation where I wanted to help somebody; but if I helped them, then it is going to anger my husband because, \u201cWhy are you going out of your way to do something?\u201d Yet, your heart is saying, \u201cI want to help this person.\u201d And my husband is saying: \u201cYou don\u2019t need to do that. I don\u2019t know why you\u2019re\u2026\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Yes; \u201cFocus on me instead.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jan: <\/strong>\u201cFocus on me\u201d; yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>And then, \u201cWhat would happen if <em>I<\/em> had something <em>I<\/em> needed done or wanted done at the same time?\u201d Then, she had to choose between; and it was an obvious choice: \u201cWell, I don\u2019t want to rock the boat. So I guess I\u2019m not going be the person I want to be.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>7:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>That\u2019s<\/em> what ended up happening rather than doing what I believe we are called to do\u2014to build our wives up to become the women God intended them to be\u2014I was putting every barrier and wall between her and God that I could. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>\u2014and tearing her down in the process. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>\u2014and tearing her down in the process. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jan: <\/strong>Yes; and that\u2019s a hard thing to overcome, especially like for me, because my childhood was very much like that. My self-esteem was yards behind me. Marriage was a dream\u2014getting away from this situation\u2014being married \/ being loved unconditionally. There were all these conditions\u2014and it just <em>floored me<\/em>\u2014and there was no one I could talk to \/ there was no one I could turn to. I just tried to get through it the best way that I could, because I really <em>loved<\/em> him. I saw so much good in him, but what I felt was just very empty. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Ron, if I had been with you at the time\u2014ten years into your marriage\u2014and I had said to you, \u201cDo you experience love, and joy, and peace, and patience, and kindness, and goodness, and gentleness, and faithfulness, and self-control\u201d\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>8:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t--these things that should be flourishing in the life of a believer\u2014would you have said, \u201cYes; I do\u201d? Or would you have realized that, \u201cWell, maybe there is something wrong here\u201d\u2014do you think?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> No; I wouldn\u2019t have called myself content, or peaceful, or satisfied. I was constantly unhappy\u2014I was just generally an unhappy person.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> And you have a PhD in what?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> A doctoral degree in psychology\u2014yes; clinical psychology.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Okay.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> That you had at that point?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> Yes; I did. [Laughter] I get it; I get it. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> There\u2019s a verse in the Bible\u2014 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jan:<\/strong> \u2014ten years after we were married\u2014he didn\u2019t come in with it.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> I know. But there\u2019s this verse in the Bible that says, \u201cPhysician, heal thyself.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Do you know that verse?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> Unfortunately; yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> I\u2019m just thinking, \u201cDidn\u2019t you\u2014in any of your class work or in any of your PhD studies\u2014start to go: \u201cOh, wait! Maybe there\u2019s some stuff in my own life\u201d?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> You know what\u2019s hard?\u2014is when your heart is closed to other possibilities God can open for you, then you tend to make very certain that all of the things He\u2019s throwing at you to get you to listen are not attended to.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>9:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> You had a hearing problem.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> Very selective; very selective. It wasn\u2019t like she was the <em>only<\/em> one\u2014she was the one that I was hurting the most. I could <em>teach<\/em> all the right things in classes\u2014I could read 2 Peter 1\u2014I could read about goodness, and godliness, and kindness, and perseverance, and all this stuff that I\u2019m <em>supposed<\/em> to be, as a person. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHere is what it would look like\u2014I wouldn\u2019t ask her where she wanted to go for dinner, because I wanted to know where she wanted to go for dinner. I asked her, \u201cWhere do you want to go for dinner?\u201d so I could start a conversation about the barbeque I wanted to have.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Ah.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> Does that make sense?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> So it wasn\u2019t a process of opening up to listen to her. I wouldn\u2019t listen, even to everything she had to say\u2014I would, partway through her sentences\u2014I would be thinking of how I would respond so I could correct her. That\u2019s how bad it was. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>I can just see how this would <em>destroy<\/em> a marriage relationship. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>10:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSo you saw this behavior in your sons. It was like looking at a mirror\u2014you go: \u201cThat\u2019s me!\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Ron: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>\u201cThat\u2019s the way I\u2019m treating her.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWalk us through the process that you began to engage in becoming a <em>recovering<\/em> controlling husband. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>The first thing I had to do\u2014the first skill I had to pay attention to--was how to shut up, because I found that the biggest problem I have is a really big mouth. If I can just start by saying\u2014yes; I know you get this [Laughter]. If I can just start by being <em>quiet<\/em>\u2014and my first thought is: \u201cHow is she going to be affected by the words that come out of my mouth?\u201d and \u201cHow proud is God going to be of the thing I have to say right now? How much is this going to build her up?\u201d\u2014now, I will admit\u2014I have spent a lot of time being quiet and I had to be silent. I had to wait to understand what God wanted me to say. I had never done that in my life\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>11:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014waiting on God \/ trusting Him to tell me how to communicate with my wife was a brand-new skill!\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>I have to believe, at this point, you have just jumped past something that I know you must have done; but you just moved to a practical fix-it solution, so typical of us, as men.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>Yes; yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Tell us about your repentance with God\u2014and how it dawned on you what you had sown in your marriage\u2014and your repentance to Jan. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>It was at about the same time that I was in the process of working in the federal prison system as a psychologist. I was in the midst of a very, very difficult environment. There was a lot of evil around me. I was realizing how much of that I was bringing home. I would be just as helpless at work\u2014I would try to control things. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhat ended up happening, in terms of repentance, Dennis, was\u2014there was a period of probably one to two years, where I started realizing\u2014that I had not only not had a relationship with my wife as I wanted\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>12:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI largely had no relationship with Christ at all. I was telling Him what to do too! I had a whole set of emails I would send to God, saying: \u201cThis is the plan. Let\u2019s go with this!\u201d\u00a0 Knowing God as I do now, He tended to kind of look at that and said, \u201cOh, you have so little idea of what you are missing.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI spent a lot of nights crying. I spent a lot of time with Jan, in a posture of saying: \u201cI <em>know<\/em> I can\u2019t take away what I\u2019ve done, but is there any way you could learn to forgive me? Is there any <em>chance<\/em> that I could start somewhere and try to make up for what I\u2019ve done?\u201d\u00a0 Most of the next couple of years, I felt like I had to act certain ways in order to make up for what I had done. I\u2019ll be honest\u2014it felt like she was just waiting for me to go back to the guy I was. In her eyes, I could just see: \u201cNow, wait, it\u2019s just going to be a matter of time. You\u2019re going to be the guy I know you are.\u201d\u00a0 She was believing in me, but she was still questioning\u2014she wasn\u2019t certain that God could actually do that kind of a miracle. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>13:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>And she\u2019d had 15 years\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u2014of conditioned response to your control. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> Absolutely.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> So, this\u2014she was having to unlearn patterns and say, \u201cCan I step out here and really trust that the foundation is going to hold?\u201d\u00a0 <br><br><strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Yes; and you are regaining trust too\u2014let\u2019s just be honest. You don\u2019t build distrust over a period of 15 years without needing to bring forth the fruits of repentance so that Jan can learn to believe again. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tDo you remember when your heart was beginning to move toward believing him again and it felt really risky?\u2014it was like, \u201cI\u2019m not sure about this.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Jan: <\/strong>You know, I had heard it before to a certain point. It is like: \u201cOkay; yes,\u201d <br>\u201cAlright; sure, \u201cYes; okay.\u201d It still happens\u2014not as much\u2014but stress\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>It happened yesterday! \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jan: <\/strong>Yes, while travelling. His students have nicknamed me \u201cThe Calminator\u201d; because I\u2019ve learned over the years: \u201cIt is okay. It\u2019s going to be fine.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>The Calminator?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jan: <\/strong>The Calminator. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Got it; okay. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>C-A-L-M. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jan: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Bob: <\/strong>That\u2019s right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jan: <\/strong>Yes; Calminator. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>14:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhen Ron teaches at Denver Seminary a family and marriage class, I get to come at the end, before they take their exam. We talk about our marriage. Someone had mentioned that to him\u2014that I was the Calminator. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>But you are saying\u2014over the years, he\u2019d get angry; and then he\u2019d say: \u201cOh, I\u2019m sorry. I shouldn\u2019t have gotten angry.\u201d But you had no hope that anything was going to change. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jan: <\/strong>Hope was there, but it was kind of very well-hidden. You always have to be hopeful, no matter what situation you\u2019re in. I think,\u00a0 in some ways, I kind of made peace with: \u201cThis is my life. This is the road I chose \/ this is the man I chose.\u201d My happiness is really on other people\u2014if they are happy, I\u2019m happy. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jan: <\/strong>And so, yes; there were times\u2014conversations we would have\u2014and he\u2019s like: \u201cI\u2019m really trying. I\u2019m <em>really<\/em> trying.\u201d I would say, \u201cYes; I know you\u2019re really trying,\u201d but little things would still flare. As time went on, those became less and less. I think, also, I found my voice. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>15:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHe gave me the opportunity to start saying\u2014and he would say, \u201cPlease tell me when I\u2019m doing this!\u201d Now, when you are in the middle of an episode, you really don\u2019t want to stoke that fire and say, \u201cOh, you\u2019re doing it <em>now<\/em>.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jan: <\/strong>So, a few minutes after whatever passed\u2014maybe 20 minutes or whatever\u2014I\u2019d go back and say, \u201cYou know, during that situation, this is how it came across to me.\u201d He would: \u201cOh! Okay; I\u2019m <em>so<\/em> sorry.\u201d And even now, I think, if it was happening, I can pretty much do it. Each time, it got a little quicker. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>But you had to notice a difference\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jan: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u2014in the fact that he was <em>inviting<\/em> you to speak into his behavior. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jan: <\/strong>Yes; definitely. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>I mean, the first time he came to you and said, \u201cI realize I\u2019ve been doing this, and I do want to be different,\u201d I\u2019m sure you thought, \u201cWell, we\u2019ll see how long this lasts.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jan: <\/strong>Yes; at first, I think so too. Also, when someone is hurting like he was hurting, the last thing you want to do is add more to that\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>16:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Jan: <\/strong>\u2014to really say: \u201cYou know, the way you made me feel\u2014no one should have to feel this way.\u201d I would keep silent about that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think, more recently, we\u2019ve really been able\u2014especially, through writing this book\u2014we went to some really bad places. He would be writing late at night\u2014he would look over, and he\u2019d talk about something. I would say: \u201cOkay. This is to help other people. This is so they don\u2019t have to go through this.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Dennis: <\/strong>As I was reading your book, I tweeted one of the quotes that you had. This one is at the beginning of Chapter 3, and it\u2019s a Swedish proverb. It\u2019s really describing what you were doing and what he needed. The proverb reads, \u201cLove me when I least deserve it, because that\u2019s when I really need it.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd you think about marriage\u2014what is it but two imperfect people who desperately need to be loved in the midst of <em>raw<\/em> life?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>17:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI mean, it\u2019s not as simple as a Hollywood movie wants to make it. It has mountaintops, and valleys, and, as you just described, dark places. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jan: <\/strong>\u2014very. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>But that began to change your life as she began to respond to you and became a safe person\u2014where you could blow it, and yet, you knew she wasn\u2019t going to go anywhere. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>Another thing I did, at that same time, was\u2014I went to other men that I knew. I started saying: \u201cI see in you the kind of husband I\u2019d like to be. Can you please help me figure out how I missed the boat?\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Dennis: <\/strong>So you broke the silence. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Cool. I mean, really, really cool. That had to be one of the most courageous things you\u2019ve ever done in your entire life. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>I know I remember crying a lot. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Think about it for a moment. For a man to go to another man\u2014that really is the mark of a repentant man\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jan: <\/strong>Very much so. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>\u2014to say: \u201cI\u2019ve blown it. I need help. Would you teach me? Would you train me? Would you mentor me?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>18:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI mean, now, we are getting serious, at this point. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Jan, you have just, in the last few years,\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jan: <\/strong>\u2014few years \/ yes; literally. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u2014started to get a picture of what the reality of a relationship with Christ looks like. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jan: <\/strong>That God loves me\u2014He loves me if I\u2019m overweight \/ He loves me when I\u2019m having a bad day\u2014when I do something wrong. Why would God love me when I didn\u2019t feel like my dad did? And, in some ways, my husband\u2014because of all these imperfections\u2014I could just lay them out: \u201cWhy would anyone love me, because I\u2019m so imperfect?\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Ron, is there anything Jan could have said to you or done in the first ten years of your marriage that would have caused you to wake up sooner than you did; do you think?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>I do. We\u2019ve talked about this. I think that this process\u2014and I think it is important for your listeners to know\u2014I think this is a two-way process. There were definitely places where she could have said, \u201cThis is the line.\u201d But I want the wives out there to know that we\u2019re not talking about men who <em>enjoy<\/em> hurting them. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>19:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI realize you\u2019ve done radio broadcasts on domestic violence, and people who are more antisocial and really have serious problems in terms of enjoying it. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tMost of the men that I\u2019ve worked with would give <em>anything<\/em> to find a way for God and their family to help them become the kind of guy that could be <em>so<\/em> connected to their Lord that they would believe: \u201cIt is okay. He\u2019s got our back,\u201d and that they wouldn\u2019t have to act this way. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>I guess I want that man, who is wanting out right now, to hear clearly what you did. You went to God and cried out in your brokenness\u2014 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>\u201cI\u2019ve sinned. I have not loved my wife as You have commanded me to.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> You went to her \/ confessed that. You went to some other men and, not only confessed that, but kind of flipped the coin over and said: \u201cMentor me. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>\u201cCoach me. Train me.\u201d\u00a0 And then, you began to listen\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>\u2014and began to honor your wife and began to nourish and cherish her. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>20:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAs you\u2019ve found life in Christ, who has taught you to love, how to forgive, and how to let go\u2014you\u2019ve been able to do that, because your wife is nodding right now. She\u2019s smiling, and her head is nodding. It\u2019s not like you are perfect, but you\u2019re on the right road. And I hope a lot of men, listening, will take this as a wake-up call. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Yes; and you hope that they would have the courage to say, \u201cMaybe I need to read the book.\u201d I mean, that takes some guts for a guy to say, \u201cThis may be me.\u201d\u00a0 A lot of guys, who are like you, are going to say: \u201cNo; that\u2019s not me. That\u2019s some\u2026\u201d It takes some courage for a guy to say, \u201cI\u2019m going to get a copy of this and read it.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>And I just want to say a word to the wife, who looks over across the bed\u2014and beside the bed on the table\u2014sees the book, <em>The Controlling Husband<\/em>.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u2014and she didn\u2019t put it there. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>\u2014and she didn\u2019t put it there. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Resist the urge to say: \u201cWhat are you learning? Are you getting it yet?!\u201d [Laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>21:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tJust let the Spirit of God go to work and see what he says to you. Expect God to work. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Because that\u2019s ultimately, if it\u2019s going to work, got to be a spiritual transformation in somebody\u2019s life, as you described. We do have copies of the book, <em>The Controlling Husband<\/em>, in our <em>FamilyLife Today <\/em>Resource Center. We have talked, on other programs, about the fact that it can be the wife who\u2019s the controller in a relationship. In this situation, Ron, you were the one who was controlling the relationship and holding your wife hostage in the process.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut, honestly, I think what you\u2019ve written about here works both ways, whether it\u2019s the husband or the wife who is the one who is the controller. I think couples would be helped by getting a copy of this book, which, again, we have, online, at FamilyLifeToday.com. You can order it from us on our website if you\u2019d like. Or you can call 1-800-FLTODAY and order by phone.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>22:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tGo to the web at FamilyLifeToday.com; or call 1-800-FLTODAY to get a copy of Ron Welch\u2019s book, <em>The Controlling Husband<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou know, our goal, here at FamilyLife, is to help couples avoid some of the pitfalls that can be common in marriage and family relationships\u2014and when we fall into those traps, which all of us, inevitably, wind up with either patterns or isolated incidences, where we hurt one another\u2014sometimes unintentionally \/ sometimes intentionally. Here, at FamilyLife, our goal is to provide people with practical biblical help and hope so that couples can do the repair work necessary for their relationships\u2014not just to survive\u2014but to thrive; and for husbands and wives to find joy in their relationship and joy as they raise their children.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>23:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are very much indebted to those of you who are, not just listeners to <em>FamilyLife Today, <\/em>but those of you who have joined with us and become partners and said, \u201cWe want to see the things that you guys are talking about reach more people.\u201d Every time you make a donation to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>, that\u2019s what you\u2019re making possible. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou\u2019re helping us reach more people more often with what God\u2019s Word has to say about marriages and families. We\u2019re grateful for those of you who do partner with us, either as monthly Legacy Partners, or those who give a gift, from time to time, as God prompts you to do so. We appreciate that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou can donate easily, online, at FamilyLifeToday.com; or call 1-800-FL-TODAY to donate. Or if it\u2019s easier for you, you can mail your donation to <em>FamilyLife Today <\/em>at PO Box 7111, Little Rock, AR; our zip code is 72223. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>24:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBy the way, when you do get in touch with us to make a donation, there are resources we have available to help you pray for one another in marriage and to help you find some fresh ways to have fun together, as a couple. You can request those resources when you donate, and we\u2019re happy to get them to you.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd we hope you can be back with us tomorrow when we\u2019re going to talk about how you break the cycle. If somebody is a controller in marriage, what can you do so that that pattern doesn\u2019t just keep repeating itself? We\u2019ll talk about that tomorrow. I hope you can tune in for that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch, along with our entire broadcast production team. On behalf of our host, Dennis Rainey, I\u2019m Bob Lepine. We will see you back tomorrow for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\n\t\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\tHelp for today. Hope for tomorrow.\n\t\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright <sup>\u00a9<\/sup> 2017 FamilyLife. All rights reserved.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/\">www.FamilyLife.com<\/a>\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\n\t\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\t1\n\t\t\t\t<\/p>"],"_seopress_titles_title":[""],"_seopress_titles_desc":[""],"_seopress_robots_index":[""],"duration":["00:"],"show_notes":[""],"_thumbnail_id":["294104"],"filesize":["25.63M"],"filesize_raw":["26877299"],"_uag_css_file_name":["uag-css-304448.css"],"_uag_js_file_name":["uag-js-304448.js"],"_uag_page_assets":["a:9:{s:3:\"css\";s:82560:\".wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape-top svg{width: calc( 100% + 1.3px );}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape.uagb-container__shape-top .uagb-container__shape-fill{fill: rgba(51,51,51,1);}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape-bottom svg{width: calc( 100% + 1.3px );}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape.uagb-container__shape-bottom 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Welch describes the psychological profiles of a controlling husband and his wife. Ron and his wife, Jan, explain how the truth of the gospel is healing their marriage.","meta_box":{"show_notes":"","transcript_url":"https:\/\/transcript.familylifetoday.com\/fl2017-04-04.pdf","transcript_content":"<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Ron Welch describes himself as a controlling husband. He and his wife Jan say one of the ways that has manifested itself in their marriage is that Ron has sometimes insisted that Jan make his priorities number one in her life. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jan: <\/strong>I would really be caught in a situation where I wanted to help somebody; but if I helped them, then it is going to anger my husband because: \u201cWhy are you putting\u2014going out of your way to do something?\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>Then, \u201cWhat would happen if <em>I<\/em> had something <em>I<\/em> needed done or wanted done at the same time?\u201d It was an obvious choice. She was like, \u201cWell, I don\u2019t want to rock the boat; so, I guess I\u2019m not going to be the person I want to be.\u201d <em>That\u2019s<\/em> what ended up happening rather than doing what I believe we\u2019re called to do\u2014to build our wives up to become the women God intended them to be\u2014I was putting every barrier and wall between her and God that I could. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>This is <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> for Tuesday, April 4<sup>th<\/sup>. Our host is the President of FamilyLife<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>, Dennis Rainey, and I\u2019m Bob Lepine. What do you do when you start to recognize controlling tendencies in your marriage? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>1:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHow can you get help? We\u2019re going to talk about that today. Stay with us.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd welcome to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. Thanks for joining us. You\u2019ve had the occasion to talk to husbands and wives, over the years, who have been in a marriage where they didn\u2019t want the marriage to end; but they didn\u2019t know what else to do. They felt trapped and without any hope for how this marriage could ever be what it was supposed to be; right?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Yes; and they\u2019ve repeatedly tried to get it out of the ditch; but in that state of hopelessness, have truly lost faith. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Yes; the tires just keep spinning, and you don\u2019t get anywhere. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Yes. We\u2019ve got a couple with us today who have experienced that, but the good news is they got out of the ditch\u2014not only that\u2014but they have a wrecker service. [Laughter] They are pulling couples out all over the country. Jan and Ron Welch join us, again, on <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. Welcome to the broadcast. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jan: <\/strong>Thank you. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>Pleasure to be here. Thank you. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>2:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Ron has written a book called <em>The Controlling Husband<\/em>. It\u2019s subtitled <em>What Every Woman Needs to Know<\/em>. Ron\u2019s a professor at Denver Seminary. Jan is a school teacher. They have two sons. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAs we get started talking about a controlling husband, I want you to do a profile on two different people. Number one, what\u2019s the profile of a controlling husband? And secondly, what\u2019s the profile of the woman who married him?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>The controlling husband would look like a man who thinks he pretty well has things under control on the surface; yet underneath, is a scared little boy. He\u2019s not nearly as confident as he wants you to think; but he has to spend a lot of time convincing you, because he\u2019s talking to himself. He has tendencies that work toward the anxious kind of experience: \u201cI\u2019m kind of not certain things are going to work out well, and I\u2019d like to change that. I\u2019d like to see if I can prevent bad things from happening.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>3:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIn addition, he is what we call narcissistic. He might have that temperament that says: \u201cIf I could <em>only<\/em> let them know how okay I was\u2014man, things would be really good. So, I\u2019ve got to work hard to make sure they know that.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>You know, you\u2019re describing yourself here because you wrote the book\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Dennis: <\/strong>\u2014about your story. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>Yes; indeed. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>That was taking place in your marriage; right?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>Every year, over and over again. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Alright\u2014just a little confession on the frontend, because that\u2019s one of the things I really appreciate about your book. You got raw and honest about how you were a controlling husband in your marriage. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNow, talk about what the profile is of a wife who marries a controlling man. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>Let me make one comment first. You said I <em>was<\/em> a controlling husband. I think it\u2019s fair to say, \u201cI\u2019m a recovering controlling husband.\u201d\u00a0 [Laughter]\u00a0 That\u2019s a little more honest, because this is a <em>daily<\/em> battle. Let\u2019s be clear about that! \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe controlling husband\u2019s wife is the kind of woman who may have not had a lot of confidence in herself before the relationship started. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>4:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tShe might have had some difficulty in her family of origin\u2014maybe with a dad who was kind of controlling\u2014or maybe previous relationships \/ boyfriends who have been controlling. She might have gotten to think, \u201cThis is kind of how it\u2019s supposed to be.\u201d\u00a0 She may have a very strong devotion to biblical principles and think: \u201cThe Bible says, \u2018Submit.\u2019 When I think of submit, the way I understand it is I\u2019m supposed to do what I am told.\u201d She may think: \u201cI want to have a voice, but I\u2019m certain that a strong Christian man will understand that. He won\u2019t step on me. He\u2019ll let my voice be heard.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd then, she may also be the kind of person who really wants other people to be okay\u2014to please them \/ to make them happy\u2014because she thinks servanthood and serving others is really important. All great qualities; but when matched with someone, who is more than happy to take, now you have a taker and a giver. The combination can be incredibly destructive. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Your pattern in <em>your<\/em> marriage\u2014where you were exercising control \/ where Jan was isolated and was <em>being<\/em> controlled\u2014did it last a decade? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> I would say 12 to 14\/15 years.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>5:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> You said there was a point in your marriage where you started to notice your sons were being controlling of their mother. You thought, \u201cThey learned it from <em>me<\/em>.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Was that enough of a realization to cause you to go, \u201cOkay, something has got to be changed here,\u201d or was that just one of those things that you noticed and thought, \u201cThis is not good, but I don\u2019t know what to do about it\u201d?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>No; it was ground-shaking for me. It was the realization that\u2014not only was <em>I<\/em> treating her that way, but I was teaching my sons how to behave that way as well. I started thinking about the people who talked about how much I like to be in control or I always had to be right. I started realizing that I had been mainly a kind of a cognitive Christian most of my life\u2014I had said all the right things \/ done all the right things\u2014I followed all the appropriate descriptions of what Christian men were supposed to be. But the relationship in my heart with Christ that would transform me, from the inside out, was really not there. I wasn\u2019t submitting <em>myself <\/em>to <em>anyone<\/em>, including God. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>6:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jan: <\/strong>In my mind, if you are a Christian, there is something very special about, not only <em>being<\/em> a Christian, but how you act and how you treat other people. To be honest, I think I treated other people better and was more compassionate. I could tell you an example. A friend would need something\u2014I would have to change my whole schedule, but I could do it. Ron would be like: \u201cWhy are you doing that? You don\u2019t need to do that. They don\u2019t do anything for you.\u201d\u00a0 But in my heart and in my mind was: \u201cI want to help those people. I feel better when I can help other people.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI would really be caught in a situation where I wanted to help somebody; but if I helped them, then it is going to anger my husband because, \u201cWhy are you going out of your way to do something?\u201d Yet, your heart is saying, \u201cI want to help this person.\u201d And my husband is saying: \u201cYou don\u2019t need to do that. I don\u2019t know why you\u2019re\u2026\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Yes; \u201cFocus on me instead.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jan: <\/strong>\u201cFocus on me\u201d; yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>And then, \u201cWhat would happen if <em>I<\/em> had something <em>I<\/em> needed done or wanted done at the same time?\u201d Then, she had to choose between; and it was an obvious choice: \u201cWell, I don\u2019t want to rock the boat. So I guess I\u2019m not going be the person I want to be.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>7:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>That\u2019s<\/em> what ended up happening rather than doing what I believe we are called to do\u2014to build our wives up to become the women God intended them to be\u2014I was putting every barrier and wall between her and God that I could. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>\u2014and tearing her down in the process. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>\u2014and tearing her down in the process. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jan: <\/strong>Yes; and that\u2019s a hard thing to overcome, especially like for me, because my childhood was very much like that. My self-esteem was yards behind me. Marriage was a dream\u2014getting away from this situation\u2014being married \/ being loved unconditionally. There were all these conditions\u2014and it just <em>floored me<\/em>\u2014and there was no one I could talk to \/ there was no one I could turn to. I just tried to get through it the best way that I could, because I really <em>loved<\/em> him. I saw so much good in him, but what I felt was just very empty. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Ron, if I had been with you at the time\u2014ten years into your marriage\u2014and I had said to you, \u201cDo you experience love, and joy, and peace, and patience, and kindness, and goodness, and gentleness, and faithfulness, and self-control\u201d\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>8:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t--these things that should be flourishing in the life of a believer\u2014would you have said, \u201cYes; I do\u201d? Or would you have realized that, \u201cWell, maybe there is something wrong here\u201d\u2014do you think?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> No; I wouldn\u2019t have called myself content, or peaceful, or satisfied. I was constantly unhappy\u2014I was just generally an unhappy person.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> And you have a PhD in what?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> A doctoral degree in psychology\u2014yes; clinical psychology.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Okay.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> That you had at that point?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> Yes; I did. [Laughter] I get it; I get it. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> There\u2019s a verse in the Bible\u2014 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jan:<\/strong> \u2014ten years after we were married\u2014he didn\u2019t come in with it.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> I know. But there\u2019s this verse in the Bible that says, \u201cPhysician, heal thyself.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Do you know that verse?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> Unfortunately; yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> I\u2019m just thinking, \u201cDidn\u2019t you\u2014in any of your class work or in any of your PhD studies\u2014start to go: \u201cOh, wait! Maybe there\u2019s some stuff in my own life\u201d?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> You know what\u2019s hard?\u2014is when your heart is closed to other possibilities God can open for you, then you tend to make very certain that all of the things He\u2019s throwing at you to get you to listen are not attended to.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>9:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> You had a hearing problem.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> Very selective; very selective. It wasn\u2019t like she was the <em>only<\/em> one\u2014she was the one that I was hurting the most. I could <em>teach<\/em> all the right things in classes\u2014I could read 2 Peter 1\u2014I could read about goodness, and godliness, and kindness, and perseverance, and all this stuff that I\u2019m <em>supposed<\/em> to be, as a person. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHere is what it would look like\u2014I wouldn\u2019t ask her where she wanted to go for dinner, because I wanted to know where she wanted to go for dinner. I asked her, \u201cWhere do you want to go for dinner?\u201d so I could start a conversation about the barbeque I wanted to have.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Ah.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> Does that make sense?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> So it wasn\u2019t a process of opening up to listen to her. I wouldn\u2019t listen, even to everything she had to say\u2014I would, partway through her sentences\u2014I would be thinking of how I would respond so I could correct her. That\u2019s how bad it was. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>I can just see how this would <em>destroy<\/em> a marriage relationship. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>10:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSo you saw this behavior in your sons. It was like looking at a mirror\u2014you go: \u201cThat\u2019s me!\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Ron: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>\u201cThat\u2019s the way I\u2019m treating her.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWalk us through the process that you began to engage in becoming a <em>recovering<\/em> controlling husband. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>The first thing I had to do\u2014the first skill I had to pay attention to--was how to shut up, because I found that the biggest problem I have is a really big mouth. If I can just start by saying\u2014yes; I know you get this [Laughter]. If I can just start by being <em>quiet<\/em>\u2014and my first thought is: \u201cHow is she going to be affected by the words that come out of my mouth?\u201d and \u201cHow proud is God going to be of the thing I have to say right now? How much is this going to build her up?\u201d\u2014now, I will admit\u2014I have spent a lot of time being quiet and I had to be silent. I had to wait to understand what God wanted me to say. I had never done that in my life\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>11:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014waiting on God \/ trusting Him to tell me how to communicate with my wife was a brand-new skill!\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>I have to believe, at this point, you have just jumped past something that I know you must have done; but you just moved to a practical fix-it solution, so typical of us, as men.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>Yes; yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Tell us about your repentance with God\u2014and how it dawned on you what you had sown in your marriage\u2014and your repentance to Jan. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>It was at about the same time that I was in the process of working in the federal prison system as a psychologist. I was in the midst of a very, very difficult environment. There was a lot of evil around me. I was realizing how much of that I was bringing home. I would be just as helpless at work\u2014I would try to control things. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhat ended up happening, in terms of repentance, Dennis, was\u2014there was a period of probably one to two years, where I started realizing\u2014that I had not only not had a relationship with my wife as I wanted\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>12:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI largely had no relationship with Christ at all. I was telling Him what to do too! I had a whole set of emails I would send to God, saying: \u201cThis is the plan. Let\u2019s go with this!\u201d\u00a0 Knowing God as I do now, He tended to kind of look at that and said, \u201cOh, you have so little idea of what you are missing.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI spent a lot of nights crying. I spent a lot of time with Jan, in a posture of saying: \u201cI <em>know<\/em> I can\u2019t take away what I\u2019ve done, but is there any way you could learn to forgive me? Is there any <em>chance<\/em> that I could start somewhere and try to make up for what I\u2019ve done?\u201d\u00a0 Most of the next couple of years, I felt like I had to act certain ways in order to make up for what I had done. I\u2019ll be honest\u2014it felt like she was just waiting for me to go back to the guy I was. In her eyes, I could just see: \u201cNow, wait, it\u2019s just going to be a matter of time. You\u2019re going to be the guy I know you are.\u201d\u00a0 She was believing in me, but she was still questioning\u2014she wasn\u2019t certain that God could actually do that kind of a miracle. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>13:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>And she\u2019d had 15 years\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u2014of conditioned response to your control. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> Absolutely.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> So, this\u2014she was having to unlearn patterns and say, \u201cCan I step out here and really trust that the foundation is going to hold?\u201d\u00a0 <br><br><strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Yes; and you are regaining trust too\u2014let\u2019s just be honest. You don\u2019t build distrust over a period of 15 years without needing to bring forth the fruits of repentance so that Jan can learn to believe again. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tDo you remember when your heart was beginning to move toward believing him again and it felt really risky?\u2014it was like, \u201cI\u2019m not sure about this.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Jan: <\/strong>You know, I had heard it before to a certain point. It is like: \u201cOkay; yes,\u201d <br>\u201cAlright; sure, \u201cYes; okay.\u201d It still happens\u2014not as much\u2014but stress\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>It happened yesterday! \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jan: <\/strong>Yes, while travelling. His students have nicknamed me \u201cThe Calminator\u201d; because I\u2019ve learned over the years: \u201cIt is okay. It\u2019s going to be fine.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>The Calminator?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jan: <\/strong>The Calminator. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Got it; okay. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>C-A-L-M. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jan: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Bob: <\/strong>That\u2019s right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jan: <\/strong>Yes; Calminator. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>14:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhen Ron teaches at Denver Seminary a family and marriage class, I get to come at the end, before they take their exam. We talk about our marriage. Someone had mentioned that to him\u2014that I was the Calminator. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>But you are saying\u2014over the years, he\u2019d get angry; and then he\u2019d say: \u201cOh, I\u2019m sorry. I shouldn\u2019t have gotten angry.\u201d But you had no hope that anything was going to change. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jan: <\/strong>Hope was there, but it was kind of very well-hidden. You always have to be hopeful, no matter what situation you\u2019re in. I think,\u00a0 in some ways, I kind of made peace with: \u201cThis is my life. This is the road I chose \/ this is the man I chose.\u201d My happiness is really on other people\u2014if they are happy, I\u2019m happy. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jan: <\/strong>And so, yes; there were times\u2014conversations we would have\u2014and he\u2019s like: \u201cI\u2019m really trying. I\u2019m <em>really<\/em> trying.\u201d I would say, \u201cYes; I know you\u2019re really trying,\u201d but little things would still flare. As time went on, those became less and less. I think, also, I found my voice. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>15:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHe gave me the opportunity to start saying\u2014and he would say, \u201cPlease tell me when I\u2019m doing this!\u201d Now, when you are in the middle of an episode, you really don\u2019t want to stoke that fire and say, \u201cOh, you\u2019re doing it <em>now<\/em>.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jan: <\/strong>So, a few minutes after whatever passed\u2014maybe 20 minutes or whatever\u2014I\u2019d go back and say, \u201cYou know, during that situation, this is how it came across to me.\u201d He would: \u201cOh! Okay; I\u2019m <em>so<\/em> sorry.\u201d And even now, I think, if it was happening, I can pretty much do it. Each time, it got a little quicker. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>But you had to notice a difference\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jan: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u2014in the fact that he was <em>inviting<\/em> you to speak into his behavior. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jan: <\/strong>Yes; definitely. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>I mean, the first time he came to you and said, \u201cI realize I\u2019ve been doing this, and I do want to be different,\u201d I\u2019m sure you thought, \u201cWell, we\u2019ll see how long this lasts.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jan: <\/strong>Yes; at first, I think so too. Also, when someone is hurting like he was hurting, the last thing you want to do is add more to that\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>16:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Jan: <\/strong>\u2014to really say: \u201cYou know, the way you made me feel\u2014no one should have to feel this way.\u201d I would keep silent about that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think, more recently, we\u2019ve really been able\u2014especially, through writing this book\u2014we went to some really bad places. He would be writing late at night\u2014he would look over, and he\u2019d talk about something. I would say: \u201cOkay. This is to help other people. This is so they don\u2019t have to go through this.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Dennis: <\/strong>As I was reading your book, I tweeted one of the quotes that you had. This one is at the beginning of Chapter 3, and it\u2019s a Swedish proverb. It\u2019s really describing what you were doing and what he needed. The proverb reads, \u201cLove me when I least deserve it, because that\u2019s when I really need it.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd you think about marriage\u2014what is it but two imperfect people who desperately need to be loved in the midst of <em>raw<\/em> life?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>17:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI mean, it\u2019s not as simple as a Hollywood movie wants to make it. It has mountaintops, and valleys, and, as you just described, dark places. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jan: <\/strong>\u2014very. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>But that began to change your life as she began to respond to you and became a safe person\u2014where you could blow it, and yet, you knew she wasn\u2019t going to go anywhere. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>Another thing I did, at that same time, was\u2014I went to other men that I knew. I started saying: \u201cI see in you the kind of husband I\u2019d like to be. Can you please help me figure out how I missed the boat?\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Dennis: <\/strong>So you broke the silence. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Cool. I mean, really, really cool. That had to be one of the most courageous things you\u2019ve ever done in your entire life. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>I know I remember crying a lot. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Think about it for a moment. For a man to go to another man\u2014that really is the mark of a repentant man\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jan: <\/strong>Very much so. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>\u2014to say: \u201cI\u2019ve blown it. I need help. Would you teach me? Would you train me? Would you mentor me?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>18:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI mean, now, we are getting serious, at this point. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Jan, you have just, in the last few years,\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jan: <\/strong>\u2014few years \/ yes; literally. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u2014started to get a picture of what the reality of a relationship with Christ looks like. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Jan: <\/strong>That God loves me\u2014He loves me if I\u2019m overweight \/ He loves me when I\u2019m having a bad day\u2014when I do something wrong. Why would God love me when I didn\u2019t feel like my dad did? And, in some ways, my husband\u2014because of all these imperfections\u2014I could just lay them out: \u201cWhy would anyone love me, because I\u2019m so imperfect?\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Ron, is there anything Jan could have said to you or done in the first ten years of your marriage that would have caused you to wake up sooner than you did; do you think?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>I do. We\u2019ve talked about this. I think that this process\u2014and I think it is important for your listeners to know\u2014I think this is a two-way process. There were definitely places where she could have said, \u201cThis is the line.\u201d But I want the wives out there to know that we\u2019re not talking about men who <em>enjoy<\/em> hurting them. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>19:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI realize you\u2019ve done radio broadcasts on domestic violence, and people who are more antisocial and really have serious problems in terms of enjoying it. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tMost of the men that I\u2019ve worked with would give <em>anything<\/em> to find a way for God and their family to help them become the kind of guy that could be <em>so<\/em> connected to their Lord that they would believe: \u201cIt is okay. He\u2019s got our back,\u201d and that they wouldn\u2019t have to act this way. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>I guess I want that man, who is wanting out right now, to hear clearly what you did. You went to God and cried out in your brokenness\u2014 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>\u201cI\u2019ve sinned. I have not loved my wife as You have commanded me to.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> You went to her \/ confessed that. You went to some other men and, not only confessed that, but kind of flipped the coin over and said: \u201cMentor me. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>\u201cCoach me. Train me.\u201d\u00a0 And then, you began to listen\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ron: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>\u2014and began to honor your wife and began to nourish and cherish her. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>20:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAs you\u2019ve found life in Christ, who has taught you to love, how to forgive, and how to let go\u2014you\u2019ve been able to do that, because your wife is nodding right now. She\u2019s smiling, and her head is nodding. It\u2019s not like you are perfect, but you\u2019re on the right road. And I hope a lot of men, listening, will take this as a wake-up call. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Yes; and you hope that they would have the courage to say, \u201cMaybe I need to read the book.\u201d I mean, that takes some guts for a guy to say, \u201cThis may be me.\u201d\u00a0 A lot of guys, who are like you, are going to say: \u201cNo; that\u2019s not me. That\u2019s some\u2026\u201d It takes some courage for a guy to say, \u201cI\u2019m going to get a copy of this and read it.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>And I just want to say a word to the wife, who looks over across the bed\u2014and beside the bed on the table\u2014sees the book, <em>The Controlling Husband<\/em>.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u2014and she didn\u2019t put it there. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>\u2014and she didn\u2019t put it there. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Resist the urge to say: \u201cWhat are you learning? Are you getting it yet?!\u201d [Laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>21:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tJust let the Spirit of God go to work and see what he says to you. Expect God to work. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Because that\u2019s ultimately, if it\u2019s going to work, got to be a spiritual transformation in somebody\u2019s life, as you described. We do have copies of the book, <em>The Controlling Husband<\/em>, in our <em>FamilyLife Today <\/em>Resource Center. We have talked, on other programs, about the fact that it can be the wife who\u2019s the controller in a relationship. In this situation, Ron, you were the one who was controlling the relationship and holding your wife hostage in the process.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut, honestly, I think what you\u2019ve written about here works both ways, whether it\u2019s the husband or the wife who is the one who is the controller. I think couples would be helped by getting a copy of this book, which, again, we have, online, at FamilyLifeToday.com. You can order it from us on our website if you\u2019d like. Or you can call 1-800-FLTODAY and order by phone.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>22:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tGo to the web at FamilyLifeToday.com; or call 1-800-FLTODAY to get a copy of Ron Welch\u2019s book, <em>The Controlling Husband<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou know, our goal, here at FamilyLife, is to help couples avoid some of the pitfalls that can be common in marriage and family relationships\u2014and when we fall into those traps, which all of us, inevitably, wind up with either patterns or isolated incidences, where we hurt one another\u2014sometimes unintentionally \/ sometimes intentionally. Here, at FamilyLife, our goal is to provide people with practical biblical help and hope so that couples can do the repair work necessary for their relationships\u2014not just to survive\u2014but to thrive; and for husbands and wives to find joy in their relationship and joy as they raise their children.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>23:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are very much indebted to those of you who are, not just listeners to <em>FamilyLife Today, <\/em>but those of you who have joined with us and become partners and said, \u201cWe want to see the things that you guys are talking about reach more people.\u201d Every time you make a donation to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>, that\u2019s what you\u2019re making possible. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou\u2019re helping us reach more people more often with what God\u2019s Word has to say about marriages and families. We\u2019re grateful for those of you who do partner with us, either as monthly Legacy Partners, or those who give a gift, from time to time, as God prompts you to do so. We appreciate that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou can donate easily, online, at FamilyLifeToday.com; or call 1-800-FL-TODAY to donate. Or if it\u2019s easier for you, you can mail your donation to <em>FamilyLife Today <\/em>at PO Box 7111, Little Rock, AR; our zip code is 72223. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>24:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBy the way, when you do get in touch with us to make a donation, there are resources we have available to help you pray for one another in marriage and to help you find some fresh ways to have fun together, as a couple. You can request those resources when you donate, and we\u2019re happy to get them to you.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd we hope you can be back with us tomorrow when we\u2019re going to talk about how you break the cycle. If somebody is a controller in marriage, what can you do so that that pattern doesn\u2019t just keep repeating itself? We\u2019ll talk about that tomorrow. I hope you can tune in for that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch, along with our entire broadcast production team. On behalf of our host, Dennis Rainey, I\u2019m Bob Lepine. We will see you back tomorrow for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\n\t\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\tHelp for today. Hope for tomorrow.\n\t\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright <sup>\u00a9<\/sup> 2017 FamilyLife. 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