{"id":303611,"date":"2015-08-11T11:00:00","date_gmt":"2015-08-11T15:00:00","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/%series%\/the-default-of-feminism\/"},"modified":"2015-08-11T11:00:00","modified_gmt":"2015-08-11T15:00:00","slug":"the-default-of-feminism","status":"publish","type":"podcast","link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/the-default-of-feminism\/","title":{"rendered":"The Default of Feminism"},"content":{"rendered":"","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Author Courtney Reissig explains that to most feminists, equality equals sameness. Reissig shares how God changed her from a staunch feminist to a Bible-believing wife and mother.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":91,"featured_media":294104,"menu_order":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","template":"","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","inline_featured_image":false,"_uag_custom_page_level_css":"","episode_type":"","audio_file":"https:\/\/web.familylifetoday.com\/fl2015-08-11.mp3","cover_image":"","cover_image_id":"","duration":"00:","filesize":"23.15M","filesize_raw":"24270136","date_recorded":"","explicit":"","block":""},"categories":[2831,2093],"tags":[4808,5801,5344,5800,5803,5802],"podcast_series":[8097],"cwp_profile":[3418],"series":[2101],"class_list":["post-303611","podcast","type-podcast","status-publish","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-wives","category-women","tag-becoming-a-christian","tag-bible-truths","tag-biblical-model","tag-cultural-feminism","tag-how-to-be-a-christian","tag-how-to-become-a-christian","podcast_series-the-accidental-feminist","cwp_profile-courtney-reissig","series-familylife-today"],"acf":[],"episode_featured_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/09\/FLT-Podcast-Cover-2-508x508-3.jpg?w=508","episode_player_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2023\/02\/image-scaled.jpg","download_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-download\/303611\/the-default-of-feminism","player_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-player\/303611\/the-default-of-feminism","audio_player":null,"episode_data":{"playerMode":"light","subscribeUrls":{"apple_podcasts":{"key":"apple_podcasts","url":"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303?mt=2&app=podcast","label":"Apple Podcasts","class":"apple_podcasts","icon":"apple-podcasts.png"},"google_podcasts":{"key":"google_podcasts","url":"","label":"Google Podcasts","class":"google_podcasts","icon":"google-podcasts.png"},"spotify":{"key":"spotify","url":"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm","label":"Spotify","class":"spotify","icon":"spotify.png"},"youtube":{"key":"youtube","url":"","label":"YouTube","class":"youtube","icon":"youtube.png"}},"rssFeedUrl":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/feed\/podcast\/familylife-today","embedCode":"<blockquote class=\"wp-embedded-content\" data-secret=\"rAtgjhbYFC\"><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/the-default-of-feminism\/\">The Default of Feminism<\/a><\/blockquote><iframe sandbox=\"allow-scripts\" security=\"restricted\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/the-default-of-feminism\/embed\/#?secret=rAtgjhbYFC\" width=\"500\" height=\"350\" title=\"&#8220;The Default of Feminism&#8221; &#8212; FamilyLife\u00ae - A Cru Ministry\" data-secret=\"rAtgjhbYFC\" frameborder=\"0\" marginwidth=\"0\" marginheight=\"0\" scrolling=\"no\" class=\"wp-embedded-content\"><\/iframe><script>\n\/*! This file is auto-generated *\/\n!function(d,l){\"use strict\";l.querySelector&&d.addEventListener&&\"undefined\"!=typeof URL&&(d.wp=d.wp||{},d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage||(d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage=function(e){var t=e.data;if((t||t.secret||t.message||t.value)&&!\/[^a-zA-Z0-9]\/.test(t.secret)){for(var s,r,n,a=l.querySelectorAll('iframe[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),o=l.querySelectorAll('blockquote[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),c=new RegExp(\"^https?:$\",\"i\"),i=0;i<o.length;i++)o[i].style.display=\"none\";for(i=0;i<a.length;i++)s=a[i],e.source===s.contentWindow&&(s.removeAttribute(\"style\"),\"height\"===t.message?(1e3<(r=parseInt(t.value,10))?r=1e3:~~r<200&&(r=200),s.height=r):\"link\"===t.message&&(r=new URL(s.getAttribute(\"src\")),n=new URL(t.value),c.test(n.protocol))&&n.host===r.host&&l.activeElement===s&&(d.top.location.href=t.value))}},d.addEventListener(\"message\",d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage,!1),l.addEventListener(\"DOMContentLoaded\",function(){for(var e,t,s=l.querySelectorAll(\"iframe.wp-embedded-content\"),r=0;r<s.length;r++)(t=(e=s[r]).getAttribute(\"data-secret\"))||(t=Math.random().toString(36).substring(2,12),e.src+=\"#?secret=\"+t,e.setAttribute(\"data-secret\",t)),e.contentWindow.postMessage({message:\"ready\",secret:t},\"*\")},!1)))}(window,document);\n\/\/# sourceURL=https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-includes\/js\/wp-embed.min.js\n<\/script>\n"},"spectra_custom_meta":{"_wp_page_template":["default"],"transcript_url":["https:\/\/transcript.familylifetoday.com\/fl2015-08-11.pdf"],"audio_file":["https:\/\/web.familylifetoday.com\/fl2015-08-11.mp3"],"transcript_content":["<strong>Bob: <\/strong>The Bible says children are a blessing from the Lord. The culture says: \u201cChildren can be awfully inconvenient,\u201d and \u201cYou ought to wait a while before you have any.\u201d\u00a0 Here\u2019s author and speaker, Courtney Reissig. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Feminism told women a lie\u2014that they had an <em>endless<\/em> amount of choices, and an endless amount of time, and that they could have everything they wanted when they wanted it. The reality is\u2014biology has told us: \u201cNo you can\u2019t.\u201d\u00a0 No amount of technology is going to allow women to have children for as long as they would like to have them. I think that\u2019s one of the\u2014especially with Christian women\u2014the way that feminism has influenced them most acutely regarding children. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>This is <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> for Tuesday, August 11<sup>th<\/sup>. Our host is the President of FamilyLife<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>, Dennis Rainey, and I\u2019m Bob Lepine. We\u2019ll examine today some of the ways feminist thinking has influenced the culture and found its way into the church. Stay tuned. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>1:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd welcome to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. Thanks for joining us. We\u2019ve had the opportunity this week to hear a little bit of Courtney Reissig\u2019s story about her time away in a far country. [Laughter]\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>I was wondering how you were going to describe what she was dealing with. Courtney\u2014welcome back to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Thanks for having me. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>I\u2019m going to go right to it today. Courtney has written a book called <em>The Accidental Feminist<\/em>. You and your husband Daniel have been married since 2009. You live here in Little Rock\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>I do. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>\u2014and we are thrilled to have you back. I want to ask you if you can summarize\u2014this may be impossible\u2014what do you think women are looking for when they embrace a feminist way of thinking?\u2014what\u2019s the longing of their souls?\u2014do you think?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Well, I may even go\u2014step back from that and say, \u201cDo you think women are <em>consciously<\/em> embracing a feminist way of thinking, saying, \u2018I\u2019m looking for something. Therefore, this is what I am\u2019?\u201d or \u201cIs the default position of women in our culture today a feminist way of thinking?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>2:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Yes. I think it is default. I think some women are consciously saying they are feminist. When those women are\u2014I think they may be seeing some evidences of women not being, in their minds, equal\u2014or they feel like women are not getting the advantages that they need. So, they want equality. When those women embrace it, I think they want that; or they don\u2019t want the stereotype\u2014that she has to be home with her kids, and she can\u2019t have any ambition, and she can\u2019t have an opinion. So, they are like: \u201cI\u2019m strong. I want women to be strong.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut I think most women are embracing feminism and not even realizing it. Even a woman who would say, \u201cI\u2019m not a feminist,\u201d is most likely embracing it because it\u2019s just what we live and breathe in our culture now. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Well, if you ask the average person on the street: \u201cWhat is feminism?\u201d most of them are going to say, \u201cEqual pay for equal work.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u201cThat\u2019s what feminism is.\u201d By the way, if that\u2019s what it is, I\u2019m a feminist.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>3:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>You don\u2019t have any problems with equal pay for equal work for women; right?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>No. No, I don\u2019t. A Christian women\u2019s author calls it\u2014\u201cA radical notion that Jesus believes that women are people too\u201d\u2014which is\u2014[Laughter]\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>You would agree with that?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Absolutely!\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Okay, so, what\u2019s the difference between \u201cthe radical notion that Jesus believes women are people too,\u201d and the kind of feminism that you would say is problematic in the church culture today?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Because feminism is very fluid\u2014so, people\u2014you can\u2019t really pin it down. Some women will say\u2014like the other author would say that \u201cIt\u2019s the radical notion that women are people too.\u201d\u00a0 Some would say it is equality\u2014equal pay for equal work. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI define it as equality equals sameness. I believe I first heard Mary Kassian say that before\u2014is that: \u201cWe are equal; therefore, we are the same.\u201d So, we can do the same things. If a woman wants to preach, she can preach. Submission in marriage is mutual. It doesn\u2019t matter if the husband submits or the wife submits. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>4:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are both called to submit to one another. It doesn\u2019t matter who stays home with the children. A husband can stay home or a mom can stay home\u2014it doesn\u2019t really matter. So, it\u2019s the interchangeability of that. Besides biology, we\u2019re really not all that different. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think that\u2014that\u2019s the more problematic notion of feminism. That\u2019s kind of what we all believe if we are not consciously looking beyond that for answers in Scripture. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>So, there are aspects of the cultural feminist movement today that you would say: \u201cI\u2019m for that. I don\u2019t want women to be oppressed. I\u2014equal pay for equal job.\u201d\u00a0 If you\u2019re talking to the church today and saying: \u201cHere\u2019s where we need to shake hands with the feminists and say: \u2018We\u2019re with you. We agree.\u2019\u201dWhat would you say?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Well, definitely, equal pay for equal work. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>I think we can hold hands and say, \u201cIt\u2019s a good thing that women are <em>full<\/em> participants in our society because I think that society is better when men and women are working together\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>5:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014when they are both contributing their viewpoints to a culture,\u201d\u2014I think that culture does better. When women are oppressed, we are missing a very unique and valuable voice. I think that\u2019s one of the primary ways we can link arms with feminists\u2014is that we can say: \u201cAbsolutely. We need women to be full participants in society\u2014to be voting, to be\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>We believe they are just as noble as Jesus believes they are; right?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Absolutely. And that was <em>so radical<\/em> about Jesus\u2014is that He was welcoming women into a culture that viewed women as very beneath them. I think that we can even look at Him as the model in that\u2014yes, He believes women are people too\u2014but He still is the Author of creation and created us differently. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>You answer that in your book by going back to the book of Genesis\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>\u2014and talk about how men and women are made in the image of God. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Yes; yes. People think feminism is the answer for women, and I actually think it\u2019s not. I think Genesis is the answer for women. God created us in His image. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>6:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are telling a story about God, in our humanity\u2014but then, it also goes on to say, in Genesis 1:26 and 27\u2014that He created male and female in His image. There has got to be something there about being female that images God that is not just mere humanity or biology. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think that feminism was trying to answer a problem of the battle of the sexes\u2014which is a problem that we see coming out of Genesis 3, where sin entered the world; and now, we have strife. So, feminism isn\u2019t the answer. If we had just gone back to the Word of God, we could see that the answer is found in: \u201cWe were created to image God in very unique ways that tell a <em>story<\/em> about who God is,\u201d\u2014and a much better story than what feminism could ever tell us. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>I\u2019ve said, for years, that during the \u201850s and the \u201860s\u2014the time when I was growing up\u2014I think the culture endorsed and embraced male selfishness in such a way that\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>7:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014after years of that, a lot of women said: \u201cWell, now, hang on just a second!\u00a0 If men can be as self-focused as they can be, we should have the right to be equally selfish.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Absolutely. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>And I\u2019ve said that, in my mind, is second-wave feminism, saying, \u201cI want the right to be as self-focused and as selfish as men have been allowed to be,\u201d\u2014not just allowed to be but celebrated. We hear a lot of people talk about the \u201850s and the \u201860s as kind of the glory days of traditional roles. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Well, anybody who lived through it, and knows what family structures were like in the \u201850s and the \u201860s\u2014there was a whole lot of dysfunction. There was a whole lot of sin and selfishness going on back then. I, for one, am not interested in going back to the <em>Mad Men<\/em> days and saying, \u201cThis is what it should be like for men and women in our culture.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>It\u2019s so unique, too, in an American Western culture too. It doesn\u2019t take into account the person who lives in India or the person who lives in Africa. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>8:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe\u2014there has got to be something bigger than just a throwback to the \u201850s and \u201860s, or even a throwback to the 1900s and late 1800s, when first-wave feminists were coming on the scene because they were answering a very real problem of women had no voice to do anything. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Maternal health laws weren\u2019t in place. So, a woman had no voice to care for herself and her unborn baby. There were very real problems that were addressed; but I think, as Christians, we have a better answer than putting women in front of men and continuing this whole battle-of-the-sexes thing. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>I\u2019ve said, for years, that I believe the feminist movement occurred because men were not the godly men God called them to be\u2014to lay down their lives on behalf of women. If they had given women the dignity, the nobility, the value that God places on them, as women, and as men\u2014especially husbands\u2014are commanded to give them, this whole movement as we know it today\u2014I don\u2019t think would have occurred. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>I think that many women went in search of identity. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>9:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThey just searched in the wrong place. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Yes, they did. They were looking for\u2014Betty Friedan encouraged them to find their identity, not in their role in the home, but in themselves. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>And not according to how God designed them,\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>\u2014as women, to function. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Yes, and the problem with the 1950s and \u201860s was the home was the place of consumption\u2014not a place of productivity. It\u2019s this post-World War II era, where the housewife, who stayed home, was a status symbol of \u201cYou\u2019ve arrived.\u201d\u00a0 She\u2019s educated\/she\u2019s made it. She\u2019s found the husband, and he provides for her. Now, she has hired help who watch her children; and she can play bridge with her friends. She has an endless amount of free time that women didn\u2019t have before. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI would get bored, too, if someone else was watching my children\u2014or my children were gone all day\u2014and I had someone else cooking for me, and I had a lot of free time. I would get bored too. We\u2019ve kind of lost this understanding of what it means to be productive and to work. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>10:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe identity was in the home\u2014so you\u2019ve arrived as this housewife. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>And what I want to say, as gently as I can\u2014both the problem with men and with women\u2014when they seek to define their identity apart from Jesus Christ\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Absolutely. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Dennis: <\/strong>\u2014and the Scriptures, it\u2019s not going to work because that\u2019s not how God designed men to behave\u2014or for that matter, how women should also live. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>And you talked about how we tend to look at women in our culture and through American lenses; but we\u2019ve got to be aware that, around the world, in Muslim cultures, women don\u2019t get the dignity\/the respect\u2014they are mistreated\u2014in Asian cultures, the same kind of thing. It would be easy to make a case for the fact that there is a worldwide epidemic of women being\u2014is oppressed the right word?\u2014do you think?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Yes\u2014which is why the language of women being oppressed in America is so bothersome to me\u2014because I feel like it really diminishes the true oppression that women face throughout the world. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>11:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBecause a woman can\u2019t preach or because a wife is biblically called to submit to her husband, that\u2019s not oppression. It\u2019s a real slap in the face to the woman who truly is oppressed. But I do think it is an epidemic\u2014I think that it\u2019s a <em>tremendous<\/em> problem. I think, not being a feminist and being a Christian woman, who says: \u201cFeminism is not the answer. I think I\u2019ve got a better answer than \u2018Let\u2019s empower women to rise above the men.\u2019\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe have a family friend who told us that, in some African cultures, the women do <em>everything<\/em>. The men kind of sit at the city gates or sit and converse with one another. When the gospel comes to these cultures\u2014and the men see that they are supposed to love their wives, and to sacrifice for their wives, and to die for them\u2014it really changes the way they view how they treat their wives. It can really put them at odds with the people who aren\u2019t believers in their culture. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think to not have a stereotype and a caricature\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>12:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014that we just say, \u201cWe\u2019ve got to be like the 1950s,\u201d\u2014but to really have a better biblical model than that\u2014I think, for cultures and for people\u2014that it can apply to anyone across all time and all countries. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Yes, we ought to acknowledge that, if guys start stepping up and living sacrificially for their wives\u2014or even in a dating culture, where a guy says, \u201cI\u2019m going to be sacrificial for my girlfriend,\u201d\u2014some of the other guys are going to say: \u201cHey, dude, don\u2019t\u2014don\u2019t\u2014no! First of all, now, all of us look bad;\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u2014\u201cand you\u2019re messing up a good thing that we\u2019ve got going here.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Exactly. I want to go to something you talk about in your book. You talk about how women relate to men\u2014women who are feminists\u2014how they relate to men. Explain and unpack how you see this occurring today. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>One of the things is that women\u2014they want men to care for them, and to be chivalrous, and treat them with some respect. Romantic comedies are a good barometer. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>13:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNo one in romantic comedies wants the woman to be the one who gets down on one knee at the end\u2014those aren\u2019t the ones that do well. There is something within us that wants the man to be the man; but you also see, in romantic comedies, that there is something about the woman who is like in control and he helps break her in the end or something like that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think that women relate to men in two ways. They relate to them in the sense that they want them to be men, but then, only men to an extent\u2014so: \u201cDon\u2019t tell me what to do \/ don\u2019t control my life\u2014but can you still treat me like I\u2019m a queen?\u201d\u00a0 I think that\u2019s a real problem with how women relate to men. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Is that how you related to guys when you were dating guys in college?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Oh, absolutely. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u201cTreat me like a queen, but then, don\u2019t\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>\u201c\u2014don\u2019t control me.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Yes, absolutely. I didn\u2019t want to be controlled by <em>anybody<\/em>. I didn\u2019t want anyone controlling me\u2014which is the problem of the Fall\u2014I mean, that\u2019s what happened with Adam and Eve. Adam and Eve did not want God controlling them. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>14:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think feminism started in the Garden. I think feminism started when Eve said, \u201cDid God really say\u2026?\u201d and \u201cNo, God can\u2019t be trusted with what He told me. So, I\u2019m going to go and forge my own path.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>And when God says to Eve, \u201cYour desire will be for your husband, and he will rule over you,\u201d God is setting up there that one of the results of your disobedience is there is going to be this battle for control between men and women. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>There is some debate about what that passage means. I, personally, think it is the evidence of the strife we have between the sexes. I think it\u2019s that women want to control men, or they\u2019re passive about men\u2014they let them control them. There are two ways\u2014so, women might not feel this burning desire to control men; but they kind of just let men walk all over them\u2014they don\u2019t even think about it. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Okay, let\u2019s talk for a moment about how a feminist views children because it\u2019s not just men that they have an opinion about. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Yes; yes.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Children can redefine their lives. So, they\u2019ve got an opinion about them as well. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>15:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Feminism was really the driving force behind the pro-choice movement. <em>Roe v. Wade<\/em> was, in a lot of ways, brought about because women didn\u2019t want the constraints of having children. They wanted to be able to have sex when they wanted it, and they wanted children when they wanted children because children do\u2014they change your life completely, from the time you get pregnant with them until the time they leave your house. Feminism really made children a lesser status for women\u2014so, to want to have children is the end of your life as you know it. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think a more subtle way that feminism has influenced us\u2014especially as Christian women and how we view children\u2014is the belief that having children can <em>wait. <\/em>Let\u2019s say you are a young woman, who is graduating from college. The prevailing message you are getting is that: \u201cStart your life. Start your career, and then, think about husband and children.\u201d\u00a0 Then, even the young married couple\u2014I mean, how often are we advising them to: \u201cEnjoy yourselves. Get that house. Get your life in order before you have children\u201d?\u00a0 The reality is\u2014anyone who has had children knows\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>16:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014there is no amount of getting ready for children that prepares you for having children. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tFeminism told women a lie that they had an <em>endless<\/em> amount of choices, and an endless amount of time, and that they could have everything they want when they want it. The reality is biology has told us: \u201cNo, you can\u2019t.\u201d\u00a0 No amount of technology is going to allow women to have children for as long as they would like to have them. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tA lot of women are finding, in their 30s\u2014they are trying to have children and being met with a negative pregnancy test after negative pregnancy test <em>because<\/em> they bought the lie that: \u201cI can have it all. I can have my career in my 20s, and I can have children in my 30s.\u201d\u00a0 I think that\u2019s one of\u2014especially with Christian women\u2014the ways feminism has influenced them most acutely regarding children. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>You know, it\u2019s an easy target to create a target on the wall here\u2014call feminism and start throwing different darts\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>\u2014that we look back at and accusing them of being the source of it. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Sure. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>17:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>But I wonder, today, if much of the Christian community\u2019s opinion of children has been influenced by this movement of not seeing children as a blessing\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>\u2014not seeing children as this incredible gift \/ a <em>delightful <\/em>gift\u2014but instead, a cost\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>\u2014and something that is standing between you and you being all that you were designed to be. That, to me, is an oxymoron. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Yes, I think some of it is feminism, and I think some of it is just the culture that we live in. We have a very autonomous selfish culture, where \u201cWhat I want \/ what I want to do\u201d is ultimate. I think feminism is a piece of that, but I don\u2019t think it is the <em>entire<\/em> problem. I think it\u2019s just we have a very selfish culture. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tMy generation, I think, was given everything they wanted, when they wanted it, in a lot of ways. I think that children disrupt that\u2014you don\u2019t get things you want, when you want it. I think people see that and it terrifies them. Career has been kind of the main focus\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>18:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014dream big \/ do big things\u2014and children seem very small on the scale of doing big things in this world. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>So, how do you think differently about men, and marriage, and children today than Courtney would have thought in the middle of your college years?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>I always <em>liked<\/em> kids. So, children weren\u2019t as hard for me; but I see men as valuable. I see\u2014because we are created as image-bearers\u2014we both bring something to the table. So, I need men\u2014and primarily, my husband\u2014in the same way that men need women. We need their input \/ they need our input. We, together, image God most fully. I think that has helped me to appreciate the contribution they bring. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tMen aren\u2019t stupid. They are not these buffoons who\u2014\u201cIf they would just act like <em>me<\/em>, then, everything would be better.\u201d I think that is, sometimes, what we feel like, as women\u2014is: \u201cIf men just acted like women, then, our life would be so much better\u201d; but that would not fully image the Godhead and the way that God designed it to be. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>19:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSo\u2014and children\u2014they are a blessing\u2014but they are hard work, and they disrupt your life in ways you never ever would have dreamed. But they are <em>much better<\/em> than you ever could have imagined they\u2019d be. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>And they do redeem us from ourselves; don\u2019t they?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Oh, absolutely\u2014absolutely!\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>I mean, you can\u2019t be a great parent and be selfish simultaneously. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>No. I often say: \u201cI know less about parenting today than I did two years ago; and each passing day, I know less about parenting.\u201d\u00a0 [Laughter]\u00a0 So, I thought\u2014I had all these visions of what I was going to be, as a parent; and they rocked my world. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>So, take a step back and look at Courtney today and\u2014if I could have gotten in some kind of time machine and gone back to when you were a sophomore\/junior in college and said: \u201cHey, Courtney, here is the picture. Here is what it is going to look like\u201d\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u201cHere\u2019s where you are going to be ten years from now.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>\u201cWhat do you think about that, Courtney?\u201d\u00a0 What would you have said\u2014\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>20:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u201cThat\u2019s somebody else!\u201d?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Yes\u2014\u201cmarried to someone who is in ministry and\u201d\u2014yes, I would have thought that would not have been my life. One of the things of\u2014as a newer believer is\u2014I thought that if I wasn\u2019t doing something really big for the Lord\u2014like going on the mission field and being martyred for my faith\u2014then, I wasn\u2019t doing something of <em>value<\/em>. I really missed the beauty in the mundane. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think part of the accidental feminism of my new life in Christ was thinking that a husband, and children, and the mundane reality of life was kind of slowing me down. It really doesn\u2019t slow me down\u2014it enriches my life and it makes my life better. It allows me to see my sin in ways I never saw before\u2014which, for me, is more important than dying on the mission field for Christ. I needed to see the reality of my sin, and I needed to see that there is beauty in the mundane. I didn\u2019t have to go half across the world to be doing something of value for the Lord. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Well, your perspective of life radically changed. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>21:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tTomorrow, we\u2019re going to talk about the word that <em>really r<\/em>adically changed in your life, as a wife\u2014it\u2019s the word, \u201csubmission.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>You\u2019re going to go there; right?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>We are going to go there, and I think we\u2019ll have a good time doing it. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Yes. I hope our listeners agree with you by the time it is all said and done. We do have copies of Courtney\u2019s book available in our <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> Resource Center. Let me encourage our listeners to go, online, at FamilyLifeToday.com. Click the link in the upper left-hand corner of the screen that says, \u201cGO DEEPER.\u201d There you will find a copy of the book, <em>The Accidental Feminist<\/em>, by Courtney Reissig. Again, the website is FamilyLifeToday.com. Click the link that says, \u201cGO DEEPER. You can order a copy of the book from us, online, if you\u2019d like. Or you can call 1-800-FL-TODAY and request the book by phone\u20141-800-358-6329. That\u2019s 1-800-\u201cF\u201d as in family, \u201cL\u201d as in life, and then, the word, \u201cTODAY.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>22:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou know, the reason that we have conversations like this on <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is because we are convinced that, when our lives are aligned with what the Bible teaches about marriage and family, God is glorified. There is joy that comes to us as our lives are in alignment with God\u2019s purposes. I really appreciate, Dennis, those folks who partner with us in this ministry and make the ministry of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> possible. Your donations\u2014whether you are a Legacy Partner or a person who makes an occasional contribution\u2014you hear something and you go, \u201cI want to support that;\u201d or maybe, God has used a resource in your life and you just want to express your thanks\u2014your support is what makes this ministry possible, and we are grateful for your partnership with us. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIn fact, if you can make a donation today, we\u2019d like to express our gratitude by sending you a copy of a book that Dennis and Barbara Rainey have written called <em>Two Hearts Praying as One<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>23:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt\u2019s about husbands and wives praying together\u2014which is something that we think is pretty important. In fact, we are going to be\u2014we\u2019re going to be encouraging you in that direction more in the weeks to come. So, stay tuned for that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAgain, right now, you can request the book, <em>Two Hearts Praying as One<\/em>, when you make a donation to support this ministry. Click the link in the upper right-hand corner of our website, FamilyLifeToday.com\u2014the link that says, \u201cI CARE.\u201d You can make an online donation. Or call 1-800-FL-TODAY. Make your donation over the phone and request the book on prayer. Or write to us\u2014mail your donation and request the book when you write to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> at PO Box 7111, Little Rock, AR; and our zip code is 72223. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBy the way, if your donation today is the first donation you\u2019ve made during the year 2015, we\u2019ll add an additional thank-you gift\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>24:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014and that\u2019s a prayer card designed to give you ways you can pray for your family in the midst of difficult times. Again, that\u2019s for anyone who is making a first-time donation to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> during 2015. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNow, tomorrow, we are going to continue our conversation with Courtney Reissig about the way that feminism has influenced our thinking, our culture, and our lives. In fact, we are going to get into the subject of submission tomorrow. So, I hope you can be back with us for that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch, along with our entire broadcast production team. On behalf of our host, Dennis Rainey, I\u2019m Bob Lepine. We will see you back next time for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHelp for today. Hope for tomorrow.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright <sup>\u00a9<\/sup> 2015 FamilyLife. All rights reserved.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/\">www.FamilyLife.com<\/a>\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\n\t\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\t1\n\t\t\t\t<\/p>"],"_seopress_titles_title":[""],"_seopress_titles_desc":[""],"_seopress_robots_index":[""],"duration":["00:"],"show_notes":[""],"_thumbnail_id":["294104"],"filesize":["23.15M"],"filesize_raw":["24270136"],"_uag_css_file_name":["uag-css-303611.css"],"_uag_js_file_name":["uag-js-303611.js"],"_uag_page_assets":["a:9:{s:3:\"css\";s:82560:\".wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape-top svg{width: calc( 100% + 1.3px );}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape.uagb-container__shape-top .uagb-container__shape-fill{fill: rgba(51,51,51,1);}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape-bottom svg{width: calc( 100% + 1.3px );}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape.uagb-container__shape-bottom 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Courtney Reissig explains that to most feminists, equality equals sameness. Reissig shares how God changed her from a staunch feminist to a Bible-believing wife and mother.","meta_box":{"show_notes":"","transcript_url":"https:\/\/transcript.familylifetoday.com\/fl2015-08-11.pdf","transcript_content":"<strong>Bob: <\/strong>The Bible says children are a blessing from the Lord. The culture says: \u201cChildren can be awfully inconvenient,\u201d and \u201cYou ought to wait a while before you have any.\u201d\u00a0 Here\u2019s author and speaker, Courtney Reissig. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Feminism told women a lie\u2014that they had an <em>endless<\/em> amount of choices, and an endless amount of time, and that they could have everything they wanted when they wanted it. The reality is\u2014biology has told us: \u201cNo you can\u2019t.\u201d\u00a0 No amount of technology is going to allow women to have children for as long as they would like to have them. I think that\u2019s one of the\u2014especially with Christian women\u2014the way that feminism has influenced them most acutely regarding children. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>This is <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> for Tuesday, August 11<sup>th<\/sup>. Our host is the President of FamilyLife<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>, Dennis Rainey, and I\u2019m Bob Lepine. We\u2019ll examine today some of the ways feminist thinking has influenced the culture and found its way into the church. Stay tuned. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>1:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd welcome to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. Thanks for joining us. We\u2019ve had the opportunity this week to hear a little bit of Courtney Reissig\u2019s story about her time away in a far country. [Laughter]\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>I was wondering how you were going to describe what she was dealing with. Courtney\u2014welcome back to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Thanks for having me. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>I\u2019m going to go right to it today. Courtney has written a book called <em>The Accidental Feminist<\/em>. You and your husband Daniel have been married since 2009. You live here in Little Rock\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>I do. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>\u2014and we are thrilled to have you back. I want to ask you if you can summarize\u2014this may be impossible\u2014what do you think women are looking for when they embrace a feminist way of thinking?\u2014what\u2019s the longing of their souls?\u2014do you think?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Well, I may even go\u2014step back from that and say, \u201cDo you think women are <em>consciously<\/em> embracing a feminist way of thinking, saying, \u2018I\u2019m looking for something. Therefore, this is what I am\u2019?\u201d or \u201cIs the default position of women in our culture today a feminist way of thinking?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>2:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Yes. I think it is default. I think some women are consciously saying they are feminist. When those women are\u2014I think they may be seeing some evidences of women not being, in their minds, equal\u2014or they feel like women are not getting the advantages that they need. So, they want equality. When those women embrace it, I think they want that; or they don\u2019t want the stereotype\u2014that she has to be home with her kids, and she can\u2019t have any ambition, and she can\u2019t have an opinion. So, they are like: \u201cI\u2019m strong. I want women to be strong.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut I think most women are embracing feminism and not even realizing it. Even a woman who would say, \u201cI\u2019m not a feminist,\u201d is most likely embracing it because it\u2019s just what we live and breathe in our culture now. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Well, if you ask the average person on the street: \u201cWhat is feminism?\u201d most of them are going to say, \u201cEqual pay for equal work.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u201cThat\u2019s what feminism is.\u201d By the way, if that\u2019s what it is, I\u2019m a feminist.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>3:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>You don\u2019t have any problems with equal pay for equal work for women; right?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>No. No, I don\u2019t. A Christian women\u2019s author calls it\u2014\u201cA radical notion that Jesus believes that women are people too\u201d\u2014which is\u2014[Laughter]\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>You would agree with that?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Absolutely!\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Okay, so, what\u2019s the difference between \u201cthe radical notion that Jesus believes women are people too,\u201d and the kind of feminism that you would say is problematic in the church culture today?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Because feminism is very fluid\u2014so, people\u2014you can\u2019t really pin it down. Some women will say\u2014like the other author would say that \u201cIt\u2019s the radical notion that women are people too.\u201d\u00a0 Some would say it is equality\u2014equal pay for equal work. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI define it as equality equals sameness. I believe I first heard Mary Kassian say that before\u2014is that: \u201cWe are equal; therefore, we are the same.\u201d So, we can do the same things. If a woman wants to preach, she can preach. Submission in marriage is mutual. It doesn\u2019t matter if the husband submits or the wife submits. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>4:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are both called to submit to one another. It doesn\u2019t matter who stays home with the children. A husband can stay home or a mom can stay home\u2014it doesn\u2019t really matter. So, it\u2019s the interchangeability of that. Besides biology, we\u2019re really not all that different. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think that\u2014that\u2019s the more problematic notion of feminism. That\u2019s kind of what we all believe if we are not consciously looking beyond that for answers in Scripture. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>So, there are aspects of the cultural feminist movement today that you would say: \u201cI\u2019m for that. I don\u2019t want women to be oppressed. I\u2014equal pay for equal job.\u201d\u00a0 If you\u2019re talking to the church today and saying: \u201cHere\u2019s where we need to shake hands with the feminists and say: \u2018We\u2019re with you. We agree.\u2019\u201dWhat would you say?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Well, definitely, equal pay for equal work. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>I think we can hold hands and say, \u201cIt\u2019s a good thing that women are <em>full<\/em> participants in our society because I think that society is better when men and women are working together\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>5:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014when they are both contributing their viewpoints to a culture,\u201d\u2014I think that culture does better. When women are oppressed, we are missing a very unique and valuable voice. I think that\u2019s one of the primary ways we can link arms with feminists\u2014is that we can say: \u201cAbsolutely. We need women to be full participants in society\u2014to be voting, to be\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>We believe they are just as noble as Jesus believes they are; right?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Absolutely. And that was <em>so radical<\/em> about Jesus\u2014is that He was welcoming women into a culture that viewed women as very beneath them. I think that we can even look at Him as the model in that\u2014yes, He believes women are people too\u2014but He still is the Author of creation and created us differently. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>You answer that in your book by going back to the book of Genesis\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>\u2014and talk about how men and women are made in the image of God. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Yes; yes. People think feminism is the answer for women, and I actually think it\u2019s not. I think Genesis is the answer for women. God created us in His image. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>6:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are telling a story about God, in our humanity\u2014but then, it also goes on to say, in Genesis 1:26 and 27\u2014that He created male and female in His image. There has got to be something there about being female that images God that is not just mere humanity or biology. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think that feminism was trying to answer a problem of the battle of the sexes\u2014which is a problem that we see coming out of Genesis 3, where sin entered the world; and now, we have strife. So, feminism isn\u2019t the answer. If we had just gone back to the Word of God, we could see that the answer is found in: \u201cWe were created to image God in very unique ways that tell a <em>story<\/em> about who God is,\u201d\u2014and a much better story than what feminism could ever tell us. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>I\u2019ve said, for years, that during the \u201850s and the \u201860s\u2014the time when I was growing up\u2014I think the culture endorsed and embraced male selfishness in such a way that\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>7:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014after years of that, a lot of women said: \u201cWell, now, hang on just a second!\u00a0 If men can be as self-focused as they can be, we should have the right to be equally selfish.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Absolutely. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>And I\u2019ve said that, in my mind, is second-wave feminism, saying, \u201cI want the right to be as self-focused and as selfish as men have been allowed to be,\u201d\u2014not just allowed to be but celebrated. We hear a lot of people talk about the \u201850s and the \u201860s as kind of the glory days of traditional roles. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Well, anybody who lived through it, and knows what family structures were like in the \u201850s and the \u201860s\u2014there was a whole lot of dysfunction. There was a whole lot of sin and selfishness going on back then. I, for one, am not interested in going back to the <em>Mad Men<\/em> days and saying, \u201cThis is what it should be like for men and women in our culture.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>It\u2019s so unique, too, in an American Western culture too. It doesn\u2019t take into account the person who lives in India or the person who lives in Africa. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>8:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe\u2014there has got to be something bigger than just a throwback to the \u201850s and \u201860s, or even a throwback to the 1900s and late 1800s, when first-wave feminists were coming on the scene because they were answering a very real problem of women had no voice to do anything. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Maternal health laws weren\u2019t in place. So, a woman had no voice to care for herself and her unborn baby. There were very real problems that were addressed; but I think, as Christians, we have a better answer than putting women in front of men and continuing this whole battle-of-the-sexes thing. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>I\u2019ve said, for years, that I believe the feminist movement occurred because men were not the godly men God called them to be\u2014to lay down their lives on behalf of women. If they had given women the dignity, the nobility, the value that God places on them, as women, and as men\u2014especially husbands\u2014are commanded to give them, this whole movement as we know it today\u2014I don\u2019t think would have occurred. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>I think that many women went in search of identity. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>9:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThey just searched in the wrong place. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Yes, they did. They were looking for\u2014Betty Friedan encouraged them to find their identity, not in their role in the home, but in themselves. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>And not according to how God designed them,\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>\u2014as women, to function. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Yes, and the problem with the 1950s and \u201860s was the home was the place of consumption\u2014not a place of productivity. It\u2019s this post-World War II era, where the housewife, who stayed home, was a status symbol of \u201cYou\u2019ve arrived.\u201d\u00a0 She\u2019s educated\/she\u2019s made it. She\u2019s found the husband, and he provides for her. Now, she has hired help who watch her children; and she can play bridge with her friends. She has an endless amount of free time that women didn\u2019t have before. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI would get bored, too, if someone else was watching my children\u2014or my children were gone all day\u2014and I had someone else cooking for me, and I had a lot of free time. I would get bored too. We\u2019ve kind of lost this understanding of what it means to be productive and to work. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>10:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe identity was in the home\u2014so you\u2019ve arrived as this housewife. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>And what I want to say, as gently as I can\u2014both the problem with men and with women\u2014when they seek to define their identity apart from Jesus Christ\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Absolutely. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Dennis: <\/strong>\u2014and the Scriptures, it\u2019s not going to work because that\u2019s not how God designed men to behave\u2014or for that matter, how women should also live. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>And you talked about how we tend to look at women in our culture and through American lenses; but we\u2019ve got to be aware that, around the world, in Muslim cultures, women don\u2019t get the dignity\/the respect\u2014they are mistreated\u2014in Asian cultures, the same kind of thing. It would be easy to make a case for the fact that there is a worldwide epidemic of women being\u2014is oppressed the right word?\u2014do you think?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Yes\u2014which is why the language of women being oppressed in America is so bothersome to me\u2014because I feel like it really diminishes the true oppression that women face throughout the world. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>11:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBecause a woman can\u2019t preach or because a wife is biblically called to submit to her husband, that\u2019s not oppression. It\u2019s a real slap in the face to the woman who truly is oppressed. But I do think it is an epidemic\u2014I think that it\u2019s a <em>tremendous<\/em> problem. I think, not being a feminist and being a Christian woman, who says: \u201cFeminism is not the answer. I think I\u2019ve got a better answer than \u2018Let\u2019s empower women to rise above the men.\u2019\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe have a family friend who told us that, in some African cultures, the women do <em>everything<\/em>. The men kind of sit at the city gates or sit and converse with one another. When the gospel comes to these cultures\u2014and the men see that they are supposed to love their wives, and to sacrifice for their wives, and to die for them\u2014it really changes the way they view how they treat their wives. It can really put them at odds with the people who aren\u2019t believers in their culture. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think to not have a stereotype and a caricature\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>12:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014that we just say, \u201cWe\u2019ve got to be like the 1950s,\u201d\u2014but to really have a better biblical model than that\u2014I think, for cultures and for people\u2014that it can apply to anyone across all time and all countries. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Yes, we ought to acknowledge that, if guys start stepping up and living sacrificially for their wives\u2014or even in a dating culture, where a guy says, \u201cI\u2019m going to be sacrificial for my girlfriend,\u201d\u2014some of the other guys are going to say: \u201cHey, dude, don\u2019t\u2014don\u2019t\u2014no! First of all, now, all of us look bad;\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u2014\u201cand you\u2019re messing up a good thing that we\u2019ve got going here.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Exactly. I want to go to something you talk about in your book. You talk about how women relate to men\u2014women who are feminists\u2014how they relate to men. Explain and unpack how you see this occurring today. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>One of the things is that women\u2014they want men to care for them, and to be chivalrous, and treat them with some respect. Romantic comedies are a good barometer. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>13:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNo one in romantic comedies wants the woman to be the one who gets down on one knee at the end\u2014those aren\u2019t the ones that do well. There is something within us that wants the man to be the man; but you also see, in romantic comedies, that there is something about the woman who is like in control and he helps break her in the end or something like that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think that women relate to men in two ways. They relate to them in the sense that they want them to be men, but then, only men to an extent\u2014so: \u201cDon\u2019t tell me what to do \/ don\u2019t control my life\u2014but can you still treat me like I\u2019m a queen?\u201d\u00a0 I think that\u2019s a real problem with how women relate to men. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Is that how you related to guys when you were dating guys in college?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Oh, absolutely. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u201cTreat me like a queen, but then, don\u2019t\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>\u201c\u2014don\u2019t control me.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Yes, absolutely. I didn\u2019t want to be controlled by <em>anybody<\/em>. I didn\u2019t want anyone controlling me\u2014which is the problem of the Fall\u2014I mean, that\u2019s what happened with Adam and Eve. Adam and Eve did not want God controlling them. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>14:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think feminism started in the Garden. I think feminism started when Eve said, \u201cDid God really say\u2026?\u201d and \u201cNo, God can\u2019t be trusted with what He told me. So, I\u2019m going to go and forge my own path.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>And when God says to Eve, \u201cYour desire will be for your husband, and he will rule over you,\u201d God is setting up there that one of the results of your disobedience is there is going to be this battle for control between men and women. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>There is some debate about what that passage means. I, personally, think it is the evidence of the strife we have between the sexes. I think it\u2019s that women want to control men, or they\u2019re passive about men\u2014they let them control them. There are two ways\u2014so, women might not feel this burning desire to control men; but they kind of just let men walk all over them\u2014they don\u2019t even think about it. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Okay, let\u2019s talk for a moment about how a feminist views children because it\u2019s not just men that they have an opinion about. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Yes; yes.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Children can redefine their lives. So, they\u2019ve got an opinion about them as well. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>15:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Feminism was really the driving force behind the pro-choice movement. <em>Roe v. Wade<\/em> was, in a lot of ways, brought about because women didn\u2019t want the constraints of having children. They wanted to be able to have sex when they wanted it, and they wanted children when they wanted children because children do\u2014they change your life completely, from the time you get pregnant with them until the time they leave your house. Feminism really made children a lesser status for women\u2014so, to want to have children is the end of your life as you know it. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think a more subtle way that feminism has influenced us\u2014especially as Christian women and how we view children\u2014is the belief that having children can <em>wait. <\/em>Let\u2019s say you are a young woman, who is graduating from college. The prevailing message you are getting is that: \u201cStart your life. Start your career, and then, think about husband and children.\u201d\u00a0 Then, even the young married couple\u2014I mean, how often are we advising them to: \u201cEnjoy yourselves. Get that house. Get your life in order before you have children\u201d?\u00a0 The reality is\u2014anyone who has had children knows\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>16:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014there is no amount of getting ready for children that prepares you for having children. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tFeminism told women a lie that they had an <em>endless<\/em> amount of choices, and an endless amount of time, and that they could have everything they want when they want it. The reality is biology has told us: \u201cNo, you can\u2019t.\u201d\u00a0 No amount of technology is going to allow women to have children for as long as they would like to have them. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tA lot of women are finding, in their 30s\u2014they are trying to have children and being met with a negative pregnancy test after negative pregnancy test <em>because<\/em> they bought the lie that: \u201cI can have it all. I can have my career in my 20s, and I can have children in my 30s.\u201d\u00a0 I think that\u2019s one of\u2014especially with Christian women\u2014the ways feminism has influenced them most acutely regarding children. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>You know, it\u2019s an easy target to create a target on the wall here\u2014call feminism and start throwing different darts\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>\u2014that we look back at and accusing them of being the source of it. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Sure. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>17:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>But I wonder, today, if much of the Christian community\u2019s opinion of children has been influenced by this movement of not seeing children as a blessing\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>\u2014not seeing children as this incredible gift \/ a <em>delightful <\/em>gift\u2014but instead, a cost\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>\u2014and something that is standing between you and you being all that you were designed to be. That, to me, is an oxymoron. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Yes, I think some of it is feminism, and I think some of it is just the culture that we live in. We have a very autonomous selfish culture, where \u201cWhat I want \/ what I want to do\u201d is ultimate. I think feminism is a piece of that, but I don\u2019t think it is the <em>entire<\/em> problem. I think it\u2019s just we have a very selfish culture. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tMy generation, I think, was given everything they wanted, when they wanted it, in a lot of ways. I think that children disrupt that\u2014you don\u2019t get things you want, when you want it. I think people see that and it terrifies them. Career has been kind of the main focus\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>18:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014dream big \/ do big things\u2014and children seem very small on the scale of doing big things in this world. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>So, how do you think differently about men, and marriage, and children today than Courtney would have thought in the middle of your college years?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>I always <em>liked<\/em> kids. So, children weren\u2019t as hard for me; but I see men as valuable. I see\u2014because we are created as image-bearers\u2014we both bring something to the table. So, I need men\u2014and primarily, my husband\u2014in the same way that men need women. We need their input \/ they need our input. We, together, image God most fully. I think that has helped me to appreciate the contribution they bring. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tMen aren\u2019t stupid. They are not these buffoons who\u2014\u201cIf they would just act like <em>me<\/em>, then, everything would be better.\u201d I think that is, sometimes, what we feel like, as women\u2014is: \u201cIf men just acted like women, then, our life would be so much better\u201d; but that would not fully image the Godhead and the way that God designed it to be. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>19:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSo\u2014and children\u2014they are a blessing\u2014but they are hard work, and they disrupt your life in ways you never ever would have dreamed. But they are <em>much better<\/em> than you ever could have imagined they\u2019d be. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>And they do redeem us from ourselves; don\u2019t they?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Oh, absolutely\u2014absolutely!\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>I mean, you can\u2019t be a great parent and be selfish simultaneously. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>No. I often say: \u201cI know less about parenting today than I did two years ago; and each passing day, I know less about parenting.\u201d\u00a0 [Laughter]\u00a0 So, I thought\u2014I had all these visions of what I was going to be, as a parent; and they rocked my world. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>So, take a step back and look at Courtney today and\u2014if I could have gotten in some kind of time machine and gone back to when you were a sophomore\/junior in college and said: \u201cHey, Courtney, here is the picture. Here is what it is going to look like\u201d\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u201cHere\u2019s where you are going to be ten years from now.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>\u201cWhat do you think about that, Courtney?\u201d\u00a0 What would you have said\u2014\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>20:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u201cThat\u2019s somebody else!\u201d?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Courtney: <\/strong>Yes\u2014\u201cmarried to someone who is in ministry and\u201d\u2014yes, I would have thought that would not have been my life. One of the things of\u2014as a newer believer is\u2014I thought that if I wasn\u2019t doing something really big for the Lord\u2014like going on the mission field and being martyred for my faith\u2014then, I wasn\u2019t doing something of <em>value<\/em>. I really missed the beauty in the mundane. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think part of the accidental feminism of my new life in Christ was thinking that a husband, and children, and the mundane reality of life was kind of slowing me down. It really doesn\u2019t slow me down\u2014it enriches my life and it makes my life better. It allows me to see my sin in ways I never saw before\u2014which, for me, is more important than dying on the mission field for Christ. I needed to see the reality of my sin, and I needed to see that there is beauty in the mundane. I didn\u2019t have to go half across the world to be doing something of value for the Lord. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Well, your perspective of life radically changed. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>21:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tTomorrow, we\u2019re going to talk about the word that <em>really r<\/em>adically changed in your life, as a wife\u2014it\u2019s the word, \u201csubmission.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>You\u2019re going to go there; right?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>We are going to go there, and I think we\u2019ll have a good time doing it. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Yes. I hope our listeners agree with you by the time it is all said and done. We do have copies of Courtney\u2019s book available in our <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> Resource Center. Let me encourage our listeners to go, online, at FamilyLifeToday.com. Click the link in the upper left-hand corner of the screen that says, \u201cGO DEEPER.\u201d There you will find a copy of the book, <em>The Accidental Feminist<\/em>, by Courtney Reissig. Again, the website is FamilyLifeToday.com. Click the link that says, \u201cGO DEEPER. You can order a copy of the book from us, online, if you\u2019d like. Or you can call 1-800-FL-TODAY and request the book by phone\u20141-800-358-6329. That\u2019s 1-800-\u201cF\u201d as in family, \u201cL\u201d as in life, and then, the word, \u201cTODAY.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>22:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou know, the reason that we have conversations like this on <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is because we are convinced that, when our lives are aligned with what the Bible teaches about marriage and family, God is glorified. There is joy that comes to us as our lives are in alignment with God\u2019s purposes. I really appreciate, Dennis, those folks who partner with us in this ministry and make the ministry of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> possible. Your donations\u2014whether you are a Legacy Partner or a person who makes an occasional contribution\u2014you hear something and you go, \u201cI want to support that;\u201d or maybe, God has used a resource in your life and you just want to express your thanks\u2014your support is what makes this ministry possible, and we are grateful for your partnership with us. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIn fact, if you can make a donation today, we\u2019d like to express our gratitude by sending you a copy of a book that Dennis and Barbara Rainey have written called <em>Two Hearts Praying as One<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>23:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt\u2019s about husbands and wives praying together\u2014which is something that we think is pretty important. In fact, we are going to be\u2014we\u2019re going to be encouraging you in that direction more in the weeks to come. So, stay tuned for that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAgain, right now, you can request the book, <em>Two Hearts Praying as One<\/em>, when you make a donation to support this ministry. Click the link in the upper right-hand corner of our website, FamilyLifeToday.com\u2014the link that says, \u201cI CARE.\u201d You can make an online donation. Or call 1-800-FL-TODAY. Make your donation over the phone and request the book on prayer. Or write to us\u2014mail your donation and request the book when you write to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> at PO Box 7111, Little Rock, AR; and our zip code is 72223. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBy the way, if your donation today is the first donation you\u2019ve made during the year 2015, we\u2019ll add an additional thank-you gift\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>24:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014and that\u2019s a prayer card designed to give you ways you can pray for your family in the midst of difficult times. Again, that\u2019s for anyone who is making a first-time donation to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> during 2015. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNow, tomorrow, we are going to continue our conversation with Courtney Reissig about the way that feminism has influenced our thinking, our culture, and our lives. In fact, we are going to get into the subject of submission tomorrow. So, I hope you can be back with us for that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch, along with our entire broadcast production team. On behalf of our host, Dennis Rainey, I\u2019m Bob Lepine. We will see you back next time for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHelp for today. Hope for tomorrow.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright <sup>\u00a9<\/sup> 2015 FamilyLife. All rights reserved.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/\">www.FamilyLife.com<\/a>\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\n\t\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\t1\n\t\t\t\t<\/p>","theme_header_position":"","post_header_is_sticky":"","is_header_overlay":""},"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast\/303611","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/podcast"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/91"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=303611"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/294104"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=303611"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=303611"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=303611"},{"taxonomy":"podcast_series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast_series?post=303611"},{"taxonomy":"cwp_profile","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/cwp_profile?post=303611"},{"taxonomy":"series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/series?post=303611"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}