{"id":302937,"date":"2014-02-17T12:00:00","date_gmt":"2014-02-17T17:00:00","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/%series%\/the-enemy-of-marriage\/"},"modified":"2014-02-17T12:00:00","modified_gmt":"2014-02-17T17:00:00","slug":"the-enemy-of-marriage","status":"publish","type":"podcast","link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/the-enemy-of-marriage\/","title":{"rendered":"The Enemy of Marriage"},"content":{"rendered":"","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Does your spouse think you&#8217;re selfish?<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":91,"featured_media":294104,"menu_order":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","template":"","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","inline_featured_image":false,"_uag_custom_page_level_css":"","episode_type":"","audio_file":"https:\/\/web.familylifetoday.com\/fl2014-02-17.mp3","cover_image":"","cover_image_id":"","duration":"00:","filesize":"25.34M","filesize_raw":"26575246","date_recorded":"","explicit":"","block":""},"categories":[2862],"tags":[5109],"podcast_series":[7997],"cwp_profile":[3466],"series":[2101],"class_list":["post-302937","podcast","type-podcast","status-publish","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-understanding-differences","tag-selfishness","podcast_series-men-and-women-enjoying-the-difference","cwp_profile-larry-crabb","series-familylife-today"],"acf":[],"episode_featured_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/09\/FLT-Podcast-Cover-2-508x508-3.jpg?w=508","episode_player_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2023\/02\/image-scaled.jpg","download_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-download\/302937\/the-enemy-of-marriage","player_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-player\/302937\/the-enemy-of-marriage","audio_player":null,"episode_data":{"playerMode":"light","subscribeUrls":{"apple_podcasts":{"key":"apple_podcasts","url":"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303?mt=2&app=podcast","label":"Apple Podcasts","class":"apple_podcasts","icon":"apple-podcasts.png"},"google_podcasts":{"key":"google_podcasts","url":"","label":"Google Podcasts","class":"google_podcasts","icon":"google-podcasts.png"},"spotify":{"key":"spotify","url":"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm","label":"Spotify","class":"spotify","icon":"spotify.png"},"youtube":{"key":"youtube","url":"","label":"YouTube","class":"youtube","icon":"youtube.png"}},"rssFeedUrl":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/feed\/podcast\/familylife-today","embedCode":"<blockquote class=\"wp-embedded-content\" data-secret=\"Aps2t1thOP\"><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/the-enemy-of-marriage\/\">The Enemy of Marriage<\/a><\/blockquote><iframe sandbox=\"allow-scripts\" security=\"restricted\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/the-enemy-of-marriage\/embed\/#?secret=Aps2t1thOP\" width=\"500\" height=\"350\" title=\"&#8220;The Enemy of Marriage&#8221; &#8212; FamilyLife\u00ae - A Cru Ministry\" data-secret=\"Aps2t1thOP\" frameborder=\"0\" marginwidth=\"0\" marginheight=\"0\" scrolling=\"no\" class=\"wp-embedded-content\"><\/iframe><script>\n\/*! This file is auto-generated *\/\n!function(d,l){\"use strict\";l.querySelector&&d.addEventListener&&\"undefined\"!=typeof URL&&(d.wp=d.wp||{},d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage||(d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage=function(e){var t=e.data;if((t||t.secret||t.message||t.value)&&!\/[^a-zA-Z0-9]\/.test(t.secret)){for(var s,r,n,a=l.querySelectorAll('iframe[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),o=l.querySelectorAll('blockquote[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),c=new RegExp(\"^https?:$\",\"i\"),i=0;i<o.length;i++)o[i].style.display=\"none\";for(i=0;i<a.length;i++)s=a[i],e.source===s.contentWindow&&(s.removeAttribute(\"style\"),\"height\"===t.message?(1e3<(r=parseInt(t.value,10))?r=1e3:~~r<200&&(r=200),s.height=r):\"link\"===t.message&&(r=new URL(s.getAttribute(\"src\")),n=new URL(t.value),c.test(n.protocol))&&n.host===r.host&&l.activeElement===s&&(d.top.location.href=t.value))}},d.addEventListener(\"message\",d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage,!1),l.addEventListener(\"DOMContentLoaded\",function(){for(var e,t,s=l.querySelectorAll(\"iframe.wp-embedded-content\"),r=0;r<s.length;r++)(t=(e=s[r]).getAttribute(\"data-secret\"))||(t=Math.random().toString(36).substring(2,12),e.src+=\"#?secret=\"+t,e.setAttribute(\"data-secret\",t)),e.contentWindow.postMessage({message:\"ready\",secret:t},\"*\")},!1)))}(window,document);\n\/\/# sourceURL=https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-includes\/js\/wp-embed.min.js\n<\/script>\n"},"spectra_custom_meta":{"_wp_page_template":["default"],"transcript_url":["https:\/\/transcript.familylifetoday.com\/fl2014-02-17.pdf"],"audio_file":["https:\/\/web.familylifetoday.com\/fl2014-02-17.mp3"],"transcript_content":["<strong>Bob: <\/strong>This is <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> for Monday, February 17<sup>th<\/sup>. Our host is the President of FamilyLife<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>, Dennis Rainey, and I\u2019m Bob Lepine. There are significant differences between men and women; but when it comes to being self-centered, we\u2019re all in the same boat. Stay tuned. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>1:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd welcome to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. Thanks for joining us. You know, it was\u2014I guess, almost two decades ago, now\u2014you wrote a book. It was a book called <em>One Home at a Time<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Dennis:<\/strong> I\u2019m glad you could remember it. [Laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> I was having a hard time there for a minute\u2014<em>One Home at a Time<\/em>. You talked about four core messages that you felt like needed to be resolved for homes and families to be pointed in the right direction. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> I remember what they were. You talked about the need for personal repentance and purity. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Bob:<\/strong> People need to be right with God. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> You talked about the need for an understanding of the marriage covenant. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Covenant-keeping love. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> You talked about the need for husbands and wives to understand their unique assignment\u2014their unique responsibilities in marriage. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> And you talked about the need to pass along a legacy of spiritual vitality to the next generation. As I was thinking about those four core messages\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>2:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tand thinking about the guest we\u2019re going to talk to today, I thought, \u201cHe\u2019s pretty in sync with all four of those.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> He has demonstrated those as a part of his life, his teaching, speaking, and writing. It\u2019s good to have Dr. Larry Crabb with us on <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. Larry\u2014welcome back to the broadcast. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> It\u2019s great to be with you guys. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> I say welcome back. How many years ago was it, Bob? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> It\u2019s been 15\/16\/17 years ago. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Dennis:<\/strong> He was so good we had him back on right away; didn\u2019t we? [Laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> I feel so affirmed. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Well, Larry and his wife, Rachel, live on the front range of Colorado. They have two adult sons who are married\u2014five grandchildren. He is a psychologist, a conference speaker, Bible teacher. A lot of people have been to the well and have drunk deeply out of your writings. We\u2019re grateful that you joined us, here on the broadcast. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Well, and I found this interesting because\u201423 books that you\u2019ve written\u2014you wrote one back in 1991. Just recently, that book has been republished. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>3:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhy this book\u2014from 20-plus years ago\u2014that all of a sudden is resurfacing in this era? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> Well, when the publisher said, \u201cWe\u2019re thinking of republishing a book you wrote in \u201991,\u201d I said, \u201cWell, let me read it again and see if I still like it.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes, right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> I read it; and I thought: \u201cYou know, I don\u2019t think I\u2019d change anything. I might add a few thoughts here and there. I, hopefully, have grown a little bit over the years.\u201d But when I read the book, I thought, \u201cThis is a message that <em>I need<\/em> to hear again;\u201d\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> \u2014\u201cand maybe, the church and the culture could use a little bit of it.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> I think the culture could stand to dig into this; don\u2019t you? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Well, the title of the book is <em>Men and Women: Enjoying the Difference; <\/em>and there is a difference. Some folks may differ with us on that; but by the time we are done, I think they are going to hear a good, thorough biblical case for how those differences are to complete each other and how we\u2019re to relate to one another. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI\u2019m going to do something with you, Larry\u2014that I typically don\u2019t do. I\u2019m actually going to give you fair warning to answer a question\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>4:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tlater on, in the broadcast. I like to ask a question, occasionally\u2014not every time\u2014of our guests\u2014that\u2019s one of my favorite questions to ask. It\u2019s this: \u201cOut of everything you\u2019ve done in all your life, what is the most courageous thing you have ever done?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> So, while we\u2019re talking, you can be meditating on that thought. [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> You can sort through all of your heroism over the years. [Laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> The limited array\u2014I\u2019ll look at. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Let\u2019s start with what your book talks about. You begin the first half of the book talking about public enemy number one in marriage\u2014that\u2019s our selfishness. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> That\u2019s the problem. After doing a lot of marriage counseling, over a lot of years, all of my techniques proved relatively useless. All of my training, to some degree, didn\u2019t hit the nail on the head; you know? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Right? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> It just became clear to me that there\u2019s a battle going on in every human being between their flesh and their spirit\u2014to put it in biblical terms\u2014between my self-centeredness and my desire to love the Lord. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>5:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThat\u2019s still going on. I\u2019ve been married for 47 years; but I think I\u2019m more aware of the battle today between my own self-centeredness\u2014that\u2019s still within me\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Oh, yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> \u2014and my desire to love my wife like Christ loved the church. I\u2019ve got an illustration. It wasn\u2019t about two months ago when my wife and I\u2019d both had long days. We\u2019re both tired. We get home. I plop into my chair in front of the television. She plops into her chair, and we\u2019re both exhausted. What Rachel didn\u2019t know was that I was more tired than she was. She should have been sensitive to that, and she simply wasn\u2019t. [Laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI put on the television. I wanted just to veg-out. I didn\u2019t want to think. I didn\u2019t want to do anything. I didn\u2019t want to communicate. I just wanted to veg. Rachel sat down with her computer and was going to clean up some emails. When she sat down to get on her computer, I was watching a favorite television show\u2014whatever it was. Rachel said\u2014to nobody in particular\u2014she said, \u201cOh, I left my iced tea in the kitchen.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Oh, I\u2019ve heard these comments before! \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> And I\u2019m a trained psychologist. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>6:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSo, I could pick up what she was intending there. I think she was actually saying, \u201cThat, maybe, it wouldn\u2019t it be nice if I were to get out of the chair and get her iced tea?\u201d [Laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThis will sound like a silly, trivial story; but it really illustrates the point of the book because something happened in me that I could determine\u2014I could discern within me\u2014what was happening. My reflexive thought was: \u201cWell, you forgot it. You ought to go get it. As your husband, I\u2019m going to hold you accountable for your well-being, as a Christian man.\u201d I was thinking like that. Then, I realized, \u201cOh, Larry, you don\u2019t believe any of that nonsense.\u201d Then, I thought, you know, \u201cWhat would it mean to love her as Christ loved the church?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThis tiny, little moment\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> \u2014it\u2019s a little trivial thing. Here, the Lord comes to earth and dies for me; and I\u2019m not going to get up and get iced tea for my wife. I just found this battle going on. I want to tell you: \u201cI won the battle.\u201d I stood up, without grudging\u2014I went in, got the iced tea, brought it back, and said, \u201cHoney, here\u2019s your iced tea.\u201d And I said it cheerfully. She said, \u201cThanks.\u201d I sat down; and I said, \u201cThat\u2019s all I get?\u201d [Laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>7:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI mean\u2014what I\u2019m telling you is\u2014this self-centeredness thing shows up in the most trivial, ugly ways that we don\u2019t even discern\u2014sometimes, in big, obvious ways\u2014which is terrible. But I think self-centeredness is the <em>real<\/em> problem\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> \u2014that only the cross of Christ deals with. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> You can\u2019t find any solution to self-centeredness apart from the gospel, apart from the power of the Spirit, apart from the new heart that God gives us\u2014all that has got to be crucial. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> For years\u2014when I\u2019ve had people, who have asked me if I would autograph the book I wrote, called <em>The Christian Husband<\/em>\u2014when I\u2019ve signed the autograph, I always\u2014after I sign my name, I write Philippians 2:3, which says, \u201cDo nothing from selfishness or vain conceit, with humility regard one another as more important than yourself.\u201d I\u2019ve told people, \u201cIf you\u2019ll apply this one verse from Scripture in your marriage, it will cure 95 percent of the marriage issues.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Then, it goes on to say, \u201cDon\u2019t merely look out for your own interests, but also for the interests of others.\u201d I saw that theme over and over again in the opening chapters of your book. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>8:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> If we can just figure out how to die to self and how to love somebody else, marriage can be glorious. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> And one of the great problems in seeing that is we get off on the wrong foot without knowing it. Rachel and I met when we were ten years old. We couldn\u2019t start dating then; she was going steady with Carl. [Laughter] But when she was able to discern, at age 12, that Carl wasn\u2019t God\u2019s choice for her, we\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Did you take him out or what did you do? [Laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> I prayed him out! But we actually did have our \u201cfirst date\u201d when we were twelve years old. I, over the next teenage years\u2014I fell in love with her and wanted to marry her; and she wanted to marry me. We stood before the preacher\u2014I can recall\u2014I said all the right words: \u201cI\u2019ll love, honor, and cherish until one of us dies.\u201d But what I was saying, without even realizing it\u2014Proverbs says that the purposes of a man\u2019s heart are like deep waters. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Oh, yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> You really don\u2019t know what your real intentions\u2014what your motivations are. It\u2019s the Spirit of God, through the Word of God, that reveals our hearts and our deceitful ways of thinking. I believe what I was saying, as a 21-year-old kid,\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>9:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tin marrying Rachel\u2014and she was 21, as well\u2014I think what I was saying was:\u201cYou really make me feel good about who I am. Keep it up.\u201d I think that was my commitment to her, without even noticing it. I had a problem with stuttering, as a kid. I was laughed at for being a stutterer. Rachel never laughed at me. She didn\u2019t wear down my self-esteem. She built it up, and I felt encouraged by her. I thought, \u201cMarriage to her could be a really good deal <em>for me<\/em>.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> And I think I didn\u2019t see that, at the time. It\u2019s taken 47 years to get clearer and clearer that that energy is still within me, and only the gospel has the power to release me to love her in a way that I really want to. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> We begin our <em>Weekend to Remember<\/em><sup>\u00ae<\/sup> marriage getaways with a message called \u201cWhy Marriages Fail\u201d. It has five reasons why marriages fail today. The fifth reason\u2014we kind of save it for the giant exclamation point\u2014is this point: \u201cSelfishness\u201d\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> \u2014\u201cof our own hearts.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> You know, we have got one group of people listening to this conversation who are thinking:\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>10:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u201cOkay, yes, I get it. I\u2019m selfish. Yes. So\u2014next\u2014what do you want to talk about next?\u201d Then, there is another group, who are going, \u201cI don\u2019t think I\u2019m as bad as you think I am,\u201d\u2014some people who minimize the reality of their selfishness and some people who kind of rush past it. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tOne of the things you do in your book is\u2014you won\u2019t let us rush past it. You kind of take us deeper into the experience of the reality of our selfishness to make us confront stuff that we try to scoot past too quickly. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> The beginning of the gospel is bad news: \u201cWe\u2019re in trouble.\u201d The center of gospel is incredibly good news. Until we hear the bad news, we don\u2019t appreciate\u2014we can\u2019t sing <em>Amazing Grace<\/em> with any kind of meaning. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> I did have one person\u2014when they first read the book\u2014they said, \u201cLarry, the first half of the book you\u2019re convincing me I\u2019m self-centered. I got the point in the first chapter. Couldn\u2019t you get to the good stuff?\u201d My response is: \u201cI don\u2019t think that you get to the good stuff until you really embrace the bad stuff.\u201d Look at the Bible\u201466 love letters. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>11:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe first 39 are saying\u2014what? \u201cYou\u2019re in trouble.\u201d Then, the next one starts in Matthew; but the hero has come. Once you know what your trouble is, you\u2019re going to be so grateful for the Messiah. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> You alluded to this earlier. Forty-seven years into your marriage, you are more convinced than ever of your self-centeredness. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> You didn\u2019t start out that way. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> No. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> It is interesting how we, as human beings, have to go through life to really understand how marriage and children were given to us, by God, to redeem us from ourselves\u2014to teach us the bad news that we really are selfish. We want to have it our way and how we want to do it. That\u2019s not always going to happen in a marriage or in raising children. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> You know, I think the things that I\u2019ve seen as being a psychologist\u2014that\u2019s kind of a negative part of being a psychologist\u2014we excuse a lot of selfishness on the basis of the wounds that we\u2019ve suffered. One of the points I make in the book\u2014and I make it, I think, rather strongly\u2014at least, I intended to\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>12:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tis our problem really isn\u2019t self-centeredness\u2014it\u2019s <em>justified<\/em> self-centeredness. We really assume that, when we\u2019re looking out for ourselves, that\u2014given how badly we feel \/ what a rotten day we\u2019ve had\u2014whatever it might be\u2014that, somehow, it\u2019s warranted that I require you to come through for me in particular ways. There is no such thing as justified self-centeredness. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Dennis:<\/strong> You\u2019ve counseled\u2014how many people?\u2014several thousands, undoubtedly. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> A bunch. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Yes, you had a guy who justified an affair over something his wife had done or hadn\u2019t done in this case. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> That happens <em>a lot<\/em>. I mean, you\u2019re talking about\u2014his name is Legion. There are so many people that have\u2014when they\u2019ve done something really wrong, like have an affair, which is obviously inexcusable\u2014but when you talk to the guy that\u2019s had the affair, what\u2014and there are several people I can think of when I\u2019m thinking of this\u2014that the response is: \u201cYou know, I know I shouldn\u2019t have done it, but\u2026.\u201d Then, what follows the \u201cbut\u201d is the excuse. It\u2019s the justification. It\u2019s the warrant. It really comes down to: \u201cI\u2019m hurting so badly.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>13:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u201cThe only way that I can find relief from the pain that I have is\u2014not to love my wife because she doesn\u2019t respond well\u2014but have a girlfriend that will respond very well to me. That\u2019s where I feel better.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThere\u2019s a very interesting passage in Hosea 7\u2014I think it is\u2014where God says, \u201cThat the problem with you\u2014I want to redeem you. I <em>long<\/em> to redeem you;\u201d God says, \u201cbut you are getting in the way because you\u2019re wailing on your bed. You\u2019re not crying from your heart.\u201d You look at that passage there. What it says in Hosea 7:13-14\u2014and what I believe God is saying through Hosea is: \u201cWailing on your bed is complaining \/ grumbling about how bad life has made you feel\u2014whether it\u2019s your spouse, or your kids, or your job, or whoever it might be\u2014but somehow, \u2018I\u2019m hurting badly. So, the central priority of the universe is for me not to hurt badly right now. I\u2019m going to find some way to change it.\u2019\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes. Here is how you said it in the book. You said: \u201cWe are wounded, and we are self-centered. The issue we have to get to is which one of those is the biggest problem.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> Yes; yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> And I read that; and I thought,\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>14:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u201cThat\u2019s exactly right,\u201d because when we think our woundedness is the biggest problem, we can\u2019t get the gospel help we need; can we? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> That\u2019s exactly right. Then, Jesus doesn\u2019t become our Savior\u2014He becomes our therapist, who helps us feel better about ourselves. It is almost like you go to the doctor\u2014and the doctor says, \u201cYou have cancer, but why don\u2019t you go play golf?\u201d That\u2019s a <em>bad<\/em> solution to having\u2014I\u2019ve had cancer twice. My doctor did not say, \u201cGo play golf.\u201d He said, \u201cYou need to lie down and have some surgery here.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe gospel says: \u201cI\u2019ve already had the surgery for you. I paid the price. You\u2019re forgiven; but now, we have some more surgery to get the self-centeredness to lessen as the ruling passion within your soul as you relate to your spouse or whoever else.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> What you are really talking about, Larry, is you\u2019re calling men and women to, first, surrender to the One who defeated death on your behalf, Jesus Christ. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Well, before you do that, though, you\u2019ve got to acknowledge the reality\u2014the deep reality of just how selfish you are; right? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> Absolutely. It was Augustine who\u2014the old theologian, from centuries ago\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>15:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\twho defined sin so simply and profoundly when he said, \u201cSin is the condition of being curved in on yourself.\u201d What a simple definition, but what a profound definition. So, in the middle of a conversation about iced tea or in the middle of some big, horrendous thing\u2014whether it is trivial or monumental\u2014\u201cAm I really curved in on myself? Am I really looking out for me and expecting you to take care of me?\u201d Until that\u2019s understood, then, Jesus has not been seen for who He is. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Dennis:<\/strong> And Jesus calls us to die to self. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> And you quoted a verse earlier, in Philippians 2, where it says, \u201cLook not only to your own interests\u2026.\u201d One Greek scholar that I\u2019m familiar with, R.T. Kendall, used to be a pastor over in England. He said that he did some careful research with top-level scholars. The word, \u201conly\u201d, is not in the original because the way you normally read it is \u201cDon\u2019t look out <em>only<\/em> for your own interests.\u201d In other words, \u201cSome of that\u2019s fine,\u201d\u2014 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> \u2014but also, \u201cWhen you have an opportunity, go look after somebody else.\u201d Kendall said: \u201cNo, no; no. Don\u2019t look out for your own self-interests,\u201d\u2014and I think the reason why is because Jesus already did!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>16:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd now, that you are taken care of, you\u2019re free to move toward somebody else without ultimate concern for yourself. Of course, you still want something for yourself; but you\u2019re <em>not demanding<\/em> it anymore. You\u2019re <em>not requiring<\/em> it. Your life doesn\u2019t depend on it. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Well, I\u2019m curious because some people I\u2019ve heard will look at Jesus\u2014giving the Great Commandment\u2014and He says, \u201cLove God with all your heart, soul, mind, and strength. Love your neighbor as yourself.\u201d They will say, \u201cSee there, the Bible teaches you\u2014you are to love yourself.\u201d That\u2019s not what that verse is teaching; is it? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> That\u2019s one of the greatest misunderstandings in all the texts: \u201cI can\u2019t love you until I love myself. So, let me go for ten years of therapy. Then, when I get myself built up in my self-esteem, then, I\u2019ll give you a chance to be loved, as well.\u201d That\u2019s just not what He\u2019s teaching. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHe\u2019s teaching: \u201cYou\u2019re already committed to yourself. Rather than honoring that commitment to yourself\u2014because you don\u2019t need to anymore because God has already committed to you. He\u2019s taking care of your worst problem. You have all the resources you need, right now\u2014whether you have a good self-esteem or not\u2014you have all the resources you need to move toward somebody else.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHere is the key to the whole thing: \u201cThat\u2019s where joy comes from.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>17:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHe\u2019s saying: \u201cI understand what the word, \u2018joy\u2019, is. I\u2019ve been a member of the Trinity for some time. We get along really well because we\u2019re radically other-centered. I want you to bring the kingdom of heaven to earth.\u201d What does that mean? Well, it doesn\u2019t mean, primarily, social justice issues\u2014although, I\u2019m all for social justice and that sort of thing\u2014but that isn\u2019t the point. The point is: \u201cBring God\u2019s Trinitarian kingdom to earth by being radically others-centered.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> So, if somebody sees, in themselves today, the reality of their self-centeredness and they start to see: \u201cThat\u2019s not a good thing. That really is an abomination. It\u2019s an offense before a Holy God,\u201d\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> \u2014\u201cand I need to deal with that,\u201d Christ has dealt with that. How do they appropriate what Christ has done for them? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> You know, the word, \u201cbrokenness\u201d, is so misunderstood in our culture. Brokenness, for most people, means \u201cI\u2019m hurting badly.\u201d But if I\u2019m willing to say that I am at the point where there is no hope for me\u2014apart from help from outside\u2014there\u2019s just no possibility: \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>18:00<\/strong> <br>\u00a0\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u201cI am broken. I am ruined. I\u2019m hopeless. I\u2019m helpless.\u201d That sounds like terrible news. It <em>is<\/em> until you go to the next step. Basically, the response is: \u201cLord, is it possible that, exactly as I am right now, You actually love me? You\u2019re for me? You want me to live a good life? You want\u2014You have given me a new way to live?\u201d If I start, actually, believing that, by faith, then, maybe some good things can happen. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> And so, how does that person surrender to Christ and receive that gift of forgiveness that he needs or she needs? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> Well, that person has to turn to Jesus\u2014as the condition they are aware of that they are now in\u2014as very self-centered and very big trouble\u2014and realize that: \u201cAs long as I continue to live in my self-centeredness, \u2018the way might seem right, but the end there of\u201d\u2014to quote a verse\u2014\u201care the ways of death.\u2019 I\u2019m heading toward absolute misery forever, and that\u2019s not what I want.\u201d A gift is available to me. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt\u2019s simple as, by faith, saying: \u201cI receive the gift. You\u2019ve forgiven me. And more than forgiven me\u2014now, that I\u2019m Your child\u2014You\u2019ve given me\u201d\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>19:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014and this is crucial\u2014\u201cYou\u2019ve given me a new heart.\u201d Ezekiel 36 talks about a new heart. He says that, in this new heart, \u201cYou\u2019re going to be moved to keep My decree.\u201d What I think that means is\u2014you\u2019re going to discover, not the obligation to be others-centered\u2014although it is an obligation\u2014you\u2019re going to discover the <em>desire<\/em> to be others-centered. You\u2019re not just\u2014just being obedient as a grudging sort of a thing\u2014but it\u2019s what you <em>want<\/em> to do with your life. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> It\u2019s not a matter of cleaning up your act first before you come to Christ. It\u2019s a matter of coming as you are. Then, let Him begin to clean up your act in you. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> You don\u2019t take the bath before you come to Jesus because you can\u2019t find the water to clean yourself with. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Well, here\u2019s my challenge to the listener who isn\u2019t sure he or she is a true follower\u2014a believer in Jesus Christ. I don\u2019t know what you are doing or where you are, but don\u2019t let the sun go down today until you\u2019ve settled the issue with the Lord God Almighty. We\u2019re talking\u2014we\u2019re talking about something that\u2019s really serious. If you didn\u2019t hear what Larry said, he said\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>20:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u201cMisery that lasts for eternity.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> It\u2019s not just misery for a lifetime of being selfish. It\u2019s that you\u2019re making a determinative choice on your eternal destination. That\u2019s why Christ went to the cross\u2014is to redeem us from the punishment and judgment of sin, and to give us a name, a family, and a home in heaven with Him some day. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> Everything our soul was designed to enjoy is available in Jesus. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Bob:<\/strong> And I would think, if a listener is not fully persuaded of the reality of his or her own selfishness, they ought to get a copy of <em>Men and Women: Enjoying the Difference<\/em>. Just read the first 118 pages because Larry\u2014of course, now, who is going to want to buy this book now; right? One hundred eighteen pages on how selfish I am\u2014who wants to read that? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> That would be good for them; and it would be good for their spouse, too. And I want to say, \u201cI did not get back to the question that I asked at the beginning of the broadcast\u201d\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Well, we\u2019ll still have time this week for\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> And we\u2019ll do it. We\u2019ll do that this week. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Alright, so, in the meantime, if folks want to dig deeper on this subject of gender\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>21:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tget a copy of Larry Crabb\u2019s book, <em>Men and Women: Enjoying the Difference<\/em>. And a second book that you\u2019ve written on the same subject called <em>Fully Alive:<\/em>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> \u2014<em>A Biblical Vision of Gender That Frees Men and Women to Live Beyond Stereotypes<\/em>. We\u2019ve got both of these books in our <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> Resource Center. I think our listeners will benefit from hearing what Larry adds to this conversation about gender and sexuality. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tGo to FamilyLifeToday.com to get a copy of either or both of Larry Crabb\u2019s books, <em>Men and Women: Enjoying the Difference<\/em> and <em>Fully Alive: A Biblical Vision of Gender That Frees Men and Women to Live Beyond Stereotypes<\/em>. Again, our website is FamilyLifeToday.com; or call, toll-free, at 1-800-FL-TODAY to ask about how to get a copy of either of these books. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tLet me also mention\u2014if in listening to today\u2019s program, you thought to yourself, \u201cI\u2019m not sure that I really understand what it means to be a follower of Jesus,\u201d\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>22:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tor maybe, it occurred to you, for the first time, that this is something that you want to pursue\u2014on our website at FamilyLifeToday.com, we have a link that says, \u201cTWO WAYS TO LIVE.\u201d I want to encourage you to click on that link and get more information about what it means to have a relationship with God by trusting in His Son, Jesus. Again, go to FamilyLifeToday.com. Click on the link that you see there for \u201cTWO WAYS TO LIVE\u201d. Then, jot us a note. Let us know how God has used today\u2019s program in your life. We\u2019d love to hear from you. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd we also want to say, \u201cThanks,\u201d to those of you who make our program possible\u2014those of you who link arms with us in the mission of providing practical, biblical help for marriages and families. You look around, as we do, and see the condition of marriages and families in our culture. You recognize there is a need for dialogue, like we\u2019ve had today, to address the issues we\u2019re talking about here. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>23:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe appreciate your prayerful, financial support of this ministry. That\u2019s what makes <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> possible. In fact, your donations make up about 60 percent of what it costs us to produce and syndicate this program and operate the ministry of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. We do appreciate your generosity. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIn fact, we\u2019d like to say, \u201cThank you,\u201d this month, for your support by sending you some CDs with a conversation we had, a while back, with Pastor Mark Driscoll and his wife Grace on the subject of marriage. It was a candid and transparent conversation. I think you\u2019ll benefit from hearing their story and from hearing their thoughts about how husbands and wives can pursue harmony in the marriage relationship. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tGo to FamilyLifeToday.com to make an online donation. Click the button that says, \u201cI CARE,\u201d and make your donation online. We\u2019ll send these CDs with Mark and Grace Driscoll out to you. Or call 1-800-FL-TODAY. Make a donation over the phone and be sure to ask for the CDs with the Driscolls. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>24:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tOr you can mail a check to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> and request these CDs. Our mailing address is: P O Box 7111, Little Rock, AR. Our zip code is 72223. <br>\u00a0\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd we hope you can be back with us again tomorrow. Larry Crabb is going to be back. We\u2019re going to continue to talk about men, and women, and God\u2014and differences, and marriage, and how all of that fits together. Hope you can tune in. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch, and our entire broadcast production team. On behalf of our host, Dennis Rainey, I\u2019m Bob Lepine. We will see you back next time for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHelp for today. Hope for tomorrow.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright <sup>\u00a9<\/sup> 2014 FamilyLife. All rights reserved.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/\">www.FamilyLife.com<\/a>\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\n\t\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\t1\n\t\t\t\t<\/p>"],"_seopress_titles_title":[""],"_seopress_titles_desc":[""],"_seopress_robots_index":[""],"duration":["00:"],"show_notes":[""],"_thumbnail_id":["294104"],"filesize":["25.34M"],"filesize_raw":["26575246"],"_uag_css_file_name":["uag-css-302937.css"],"_uag_js_file_name":["uag-js-302937.js"],"_uag_page_assets":["a:9:{s:3:\"css\";s:82560:\".wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape-top svg{width: calc( 100% + 1.3px );}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape.uagb-container__shape-top .uagb-container__shape-fill{fill: rgba(51,51,51,1);}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape-bottom svg{width: calc( 100% + 1.3px );}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape.uagb-container__shape-bottom 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your spouse think you're selfish?","meta_box":{"show_notes":"","transcript_url":"https:\/\/transcript.familylifetoday.com\/fl2014-02-17.pdf","transcript_content":"<strong>Bob: <\/strong>This is <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> for Monday, February 17<sup>th<\/sup>. Our host is the President of FamilyLife<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>, Dennis Rainey, and I\u2019m Bob Lepine. There are significant differences between men and women; but when it comes to being self-centered, we\u2019re all in the same boat. Stay tuned. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>1:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd welcome to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. Thanks for joining us. You know, it was\u2014I guess, almost two decades ago, now\u2014you wrote a book. It was a book called <em>One Home at a Time<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Dennis:<\/strong> I\u2019m glad you could remember it. [Laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> I was having a hard time there for a minute\u2014<em>One Home at a Time<\/em>. You talked about four core messages that you felt like needed to be resolved for homes and families to be pointed in the right direction. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> I remember what they were. You talked about the need for personal repentance and purity. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Bob:<\/strong> People need to be right with God. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> You talked about the need for an understanding of the marriage covenant. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Covenant-keeping love. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> You talked about the need for husbands and wives to understand their unique assignment\u2014their unique responsibilities in marriage. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> And you talked about the need to pass along a legacy of spiritual vitality to the next generation. As I was thinking about those four core messages\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>2:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tand thinking about the guest we\u2019re going to talk to today, I thought, \u201cHe\u2019s pretty in sync with all four of those.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> He has demonstrated those as a part of his life, his teaching, speaking, and writing. It\u2019s good to have Dr. Larry Crabb with us on <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. Larry\u2014welcome back to the broadcast. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> It\u2019s great to be with you guys. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> I say welcome back. How many years ago was it, Bob? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> It\u2019s been 15\/16\/17 years ago. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Dennis:<\/strong> He was so good we had him back on right away; didn\u2019t we? [Laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> I feel so affirmed. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Well, Larry and his wife, Rachel, live on the front range of Colorado. They have two adult sons who are married\u2014five grandchildren. He is a psychologist, a conference speaker, Bible teacher. A lot of people have been to the well and have drunk deeply out of your writings. We\u2019re grateful that you joined us, here on the broadcast. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Well, and I found this interesting because\u201423 books that you\u2019ve written\u2014you wrote one back in 1991. Just recently, that book has been republished. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>3:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhy this book\u2014from 20-plus years ago\u2014that all of a sudden is resurfacing in this era? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> Well, when the publisher said, \u201cWe\u2019re thinking of republishing a book you wrote in \u201991,\u201d I said, \u201cWell, let me read it again and see if I still like it.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes, right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> I read it; and I thought: \u201cYou know, I don\u2019t think I\u2019d change anything. I might add a few thoughts here and there. I, hopefully, have grown a little bit over the years.\u201d But when I read the book, I thought, \u201cThis is a message that <em>I need<\/em> to hear again;\u201d\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> \u2014\u201cand maybe, the church and the culture could use a little bit of it.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> I think the culture could stand to dig into this; don\u2019t you? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Well, the title of the book is <em>Men and Women: Enjoying the Difference; <\/em>and there is a difference. Some folks may differ with us on that; but by the time we are done, I think they are going to hear a good, thorough biblical case for how those differences are to complete each other and how we\u2019re to relate to one another. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI\u2019m going to do something with you, Larry\u2014that I typically don\u2019t do. I\u2019m actually going to give you fair warning to answer a question\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>4:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tlater on, in the broadcast. I like to ask a question, occasionally\u2014not every time\u2014of our guests\u2014that\u2019s one of my favorite questions to ask. It\u2019s this: \u201cOut of everything you\u2019ve done in all your life, what is the most courageous thing you have ever done?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> So, while we\u2019re talking, you can be meditating on that thought. [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> You can sort through all of your heroism over the years. [Laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> The limited array\u2014I\u2019ll look at. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Let\u2019s start with what your book talks about. You begin the first half of the book talking about public enemy number one in marriage\u2014that\u2019s our selfishness. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> That\u2019s the problem. After doing a lot of marriage counseling, over a lot of years, all of my techniques proved relatively useless. All of my training, to some degree, didn\u2019t hit the nail on the head; you know? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Right? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> It just became clear to me that there\u2019s a battle going on in every human being between their flesh and their spirit\u2014to put it in biblical terms\u2014between my self-centeredness and my desire to love the Lord. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>5:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThat\u2019s still going on. I\u2019ve been married for 47 years; but I think I\u2019m more aware of the battle today between my own self-centeredness\u2014that\u2019s still within me\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Oh, yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> \u2014and my desire to love my wife like Christ loved the church. I\u2019ve got an illustration. It wasn\u2019t about two months ago when my wife and I\u2019d both had long days. We\u2019re both tired. We get home. I plop into my chair in front of the television. She plops into her chair, and we\u2019re both exhausted. What Rachel didn\u2019t know was that I was more tired than she was. She should have been sensitive to that, and she simply wasn\u2019t. [Laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI put on the television. I wanted just to veg-out. I didn\u2019t want to think. I didn\u2019t want to do anything. I didn\u2019t want to communicate. I just wanted to veg. Rachel sat down with her computer and was going to clean up some emails. When she sat down to get on her computer, I was watching a favorite television show\u2014whatever it was. Rachel said\u2014to nobody in particular\u2014she said, \u201cOh, I left my iced tea in the kitchen.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Oh, I\u2019ve heard these comments before! \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> And I\u2019m a trained psychologist. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>6:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSo, I could pick up what she was intending there. I think she was actually saying, \u201cThat, maybe, it wouldn\u2019t it be nice if I were to get out of the chair and get her iced tea?\u201d [Laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThis will sound like a silly, trivial story; but it really illustrates the point of the book because something happened in me that I could determine\u2014I could discern within me\u2014what was happening. My reflexive thought was: \u201cWell, you forgot it. You ought to go get it. As your husband, I\u2019m going to hold you accountable for your well-being, as a Christian man.\u201d I was thinking like that. Then, I realized, \u201cOh, Larry, you don\u2019t believe any of that nonsense.\u201d Then, I thought, you know, \u201cWhat would it mean to love her as Christ loved the church?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThis tiny, little moment\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> \u2014it\u2019s a little trivial thing. Here, the Lord comes to earth and dies for me; and I\u2019m not going to get up and get iced tea for my wife. I just found this battle going on. I want to tell you: \u201cI won the battle.\u201d I stood up, without grudging\u2014I went in, got the iced tea, brought it back, and said, \u201cHoney, here\u2019s your iced tea.\u201d And I said it cheerfully. She said, \u201cThanks.\u201d I sat down; and I said, \u201cThat\u2019s all I get?\u201d [Laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>7:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI mean\u2014what I\u2019m telling you is\u2014this self-centeredness thing shows up in the most trivial, ugly ways that we don\u2019t even discern\u2014sometimes, in big, obvious ways\u2014which is terrible. But I think self-centeredness is the <em>real<\/em> problem\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> \u2014that only the cross of Christ deals with. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> You can\u2019t find any solution to self-centeredness apart from the gospel, apart from the power of the Spirit, apart from the new heart that God gives us\u2014all that has got to be crucial. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> For years\u2014when I\u2019ve had people, who have asked me if I would autograph the book I wrote, called <em>The Christian Husband<\/em>\u2014when I\u2019ve signed the autograph, I always\u2014after I sign my name, I write Philippians 2:3, which says, \u201cDo nothing from selfishness or vain conceit, with humility regard one another as more important than yourself.\u201d I\u2019ve told people, \u201cIf you\u2019ll apply this one verse from Scripture in your marriage, it will cure 95 percent of the marriage issues.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Then, it goes on to say, \u201cDon\u2019t merely look out for your own interests, but also for the interests of others.\u201d I saw that theme over and over again in the opening chapters of your book. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>8:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> If we can just figure out how to die to self and how to love somebody else, marriage can be glorious. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> And one of the great problems in seeing that is we get off on the wrong foot without knowing it. Rachel and I met when we were ten years old. We couldn\u2019t start dating then; she was going steady with Carl. [Laughter] But when she was able to discern, at age 12, that Carl wasn\u2019t God\u2019s choice for her, we\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Did you take him out or what did you do? [Laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> I prayed him out! But we actually did have our \u201cfirst date\u201d when we were twelve years old. I, over the next teenage years\u2014I fell in love with her and wanted to marry her; and she wanted to marry me. We stood before the preacher\u2014I can recall\u2014I said all the right words: \u201cI\u2019ll love, honor, and cherish until one of us dies.\u201d But what I was saying, without even realizing it\u2014Proverbs says that the purposes of a man\u2019s heart are like deep waters. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Oh, yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> You really don\u2019t know what your real intentions\u2014what your motivations are. It\u2019s the Spirit of God, through the Word of God, that reveals our hearts and our deceitful ways of thinking. I believe what I was saying, as a 21-year-old kid,\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>9:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tin marrying Rachel\u2014and she was 21, as well\u2014I think what I was saying was:\u201cYou really make me feel good about who I am. Keep it up.\u201d I think that was my commitment to her, without even noticing it. I had a problem with stuttering, as a kid. I was laughed at for being a stutterer. Rachel never laughed at me. She didn\u2019t wear down my self-esteem. She built it up, and I felt encouraged by her. I thought, \u201cMarriage to her could be a really good deal <em>for me<\/em>.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> And I think I didn\u2019t see that, at the time. It\u2019s taken 47 years to get clearer and clearer that that energy is still within me, and only the gospel has the power to release me to love her in a way that I really want to. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> We begin our <em>Weekend to Remember<\/em><sup>\u00ae<\/sup> marriage getaways with a message called \u201cWhy Marriages Fail\u201d. It has five reasons why marriages fail today. The fifth reason\u2014we kind of save it for the giant exclamation point\u2014is this point: \u201cSelfishness\u201d\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> \u2014\u201cof our own hearts.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> You know, we have got one group of people listening to this conversation who are thinking:\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>10:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u201cOkay, yes, I get it. I\u2019m selfish. Yes. So\u2014next\u2014what do you want to talk about next?\u201d Then, there is another group, who are going, \u201cI don\u2019t think I\u2019m as bad as you think I am,\u201d\u2014some people who minimize the reality of their selfishness and some people who kind of rush past it. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tOne of the things you do in your book is\u2014you won\u2019t let us rush past it. You kind of take us deeper into the experience of the reality of our selfishness to make us confront stuff that we try to scoot past too quickly. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> The beginning of the gospel is bad news: \u201cWe\u2019re in trouble.\u201d The center of gospel is incredibly good news. Until we hear the bad news, we don\u2019t appreciate\u2014we can\u2019t sing <em>Amazing Grace<\/em> with any kind of meaning. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> I did have one person\u2014when they first read the book\u2014they said, \u201cLarry, the first half of the book you\u2019re convincing me I\u2019m self-centered. I got the point in the first chapter. Couldn\u2019t you get to the good stuff?\u201d My response is: \u201cI don\u2019t think that you get to the good stuff until you really embrace the bad stuff.\u201d Look at the Bible\u201466 love letters. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>11:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe first 39 are saying\u2014what? \u201cYou\u2019re in trouble.\u201d Then, the next one starts in Matthew; but the hero has come. Once you know what your trouble is, you\u2019re going to be so grateful for the Messiah. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> You alluded to this earlier. Forty-seven years into your marriage, you are more convinced than ever of your self-centeredness. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> You didn\u2019t start out that way. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> No. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> It is interesting how we, as human beings, have to go through life to really understand how marriage and children were given to us, by God, to redeem us from ourselves\u2014to teach us the bad news that we really are selfish. We want to have it our way and how we want to do it. That\u2019s not always going to happen in a marriage or in raising children. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> You know, I think the things that I\u2019ve seen as being a psychologist\u2014that\u2019s kind of a negative part of being a psychologist\u2014we excuse a lot of selfishness on the basis of the wounds that we\u2019ve suffered. One of the points I make in the book\u2014and I make it, I think, rather strongly\u2014at least, I intended to\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>12:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tis our problem really isn\u2019t self-centeredness\u2014it\u2019s <em>justified<\/em> self-centeredness. We really assume that, when we\u2019re looking out for ourselves, that\u2014given how badly we feel \/ what a rotten day we\u2019ve had\u2014whatever it might be\u2014that, somehow, it\u2019s warranted that I require you to come through for me in particular ways. There is no such thing as justified self-centeredness. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Dennis:<\/strong> You\u2019ve counseled\u2014how many people?\u2014several thousands, undoubtedly. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> A bunch. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Yes, you had a guy who justified an affair over something his wife had done or hadn\u2019t done in this case. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> That happens <em>a lot<\/em>. I mean, you\u2019re talking about\u2014his name is Legion. There are so many people that have\u2014when they\u2019ve done something really wrong, like have an affair, which is obviously inexcusable\u2014but when you talk to the guy that\u2019s had the affair, what\u2014and there are several people I can think of when I\u2019m thinking of this\u2014that the response is: \u201cYou know, I know I shouldn\u2019t have done it, but\u2026.\u201d Then, what follows the \u201cbut\u201d is the excuse. It\u2019s the justification. It\u2019s the warrant. It really comes down to: \u201cI\u2019m hurting so badly.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>13:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u201cThe only way that I can find relief from the pain that I have is\u2014not to love my wife because she doesn\u2019t respond well\u2014but have a girlfriend that will respond very well to me. That\u2019s where I feel better.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThere\u2019s a very interesting passage in Hosea 7\u2014I think it is\u2014where God says, \u201cThat the problem with you\u2014I want to redeem you. I <em>long<\/em> to redeem you;\u201d God says, \u201cbut you are getting in the way because you\u2019re wailing on your bed. You\u2019re not crying from your heart.\u201d You look at that passage there. What it says in Hosea 7:13-14\u2014and what I believe God is saying through Hosea is: \u201cWailing on your bed is complaining \/ grumbling about how bad life has made you feel\u2014whether it\u2019s your spouse, or your kids, or your job, or whoever it might be\u2014but somehow, \u2018I\u2019m hurting badly. So, the central priority of the universe is for me not to hurt badly right now. I\u2019m going to find some way to change it.\u2019\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes. Here is how you said it in the book. You said: \u201cWe are wounded, and we are self-centered. The issue we have to get to is which one of those is the biggest problem.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> Yes; yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> And I read that; and I thought,\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>14:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u201cThat\u2019s exactly right,\u201d because when we think our woundedness is the biggest problem, we can\u2019t get the gospel help we need; can we? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> That\u2019s exactly right. Then, Jesus doesn\u2019t become our Savior\u2014He becomes our therapist, who helps us feel better about ourselves. It is almost like you go to the doctor\u2014and the doctor says, \u201cYou have cancer, but why don\u2019t you go play golf?\u201d That\u2019s a <em>bad<\/em> solution to having\u2014I\u2019ve had cancer twice. My doctor did not say, \u201cGo play golf.\u201d He said, \u201cYou need to lie down and have some surgery here.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe gospel says: \u201cI\u2019ve already had the surgery for you. I paid the price. You\u2019re forgiven; but now, we have some more surgery to get the self-centeredness to lessen as the ruling passion within your soul as you relate to your spouse or whoever else.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> What you are really talking about, Larry, is you\u2019re calling men and women to, first, surrender to the One who defeated death on your behalf, Jesus Christ. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Well, before you do that, though, you\u2019ve got to acknowledge the reality\u2014the deep reality of just how selfish you are; right? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> Absolutely. It was Augustine who\u2014the old theologian, from centuries ago\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>15:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\twho defined sin so simply and profoundly when he said, \u201cSin is the condition of being curved in on yourself.\u201d What a simple definition, but what a profound definition. So, in the middle of a conversation about iced tea or in the middle of some big, horrendous thing\u2014whether it is trivial or monumental\u2014\u201cAm I really curved in on myself? Am I really looking out for me and expecting you to take care of me?\u201d Until that\u2019s understood, then, Jesus has not been seen for who He is. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Dennis:<\/strong> And Jesus calls us to die to self. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> And you quoted a verse earlier, in Philippians 2, where it says, \u201cLook not only to your own interests\u2026.\u201d One Greek scholar that I\u2019m familiar with, R.T. Kendall, used to be a pastor over in England. He said that he did some careful research with top-level scholars. The word, \u201conly\u201d, is not in the original because the way you normally read it is \u201cDon\u2019t look out <em>only<\/em> for your own interests.\u201d In other words, \u201cSome of that\u2019s fine,\u201d\u2014 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Right. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> \u2014but also, \u201cWhen you have an opportunity, go look after somebody else.\u201d Kendall said: \u201cNo, no; no. Don\u2019t look out for your own self-interests,\u201d\u2014and I think the reason why is because Jesus already did!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>16:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd now, that you are taken care of, you\u2019re free to move toward somebody else without ultimate concern for yourself. Of course, you still want something for yourself; but you\u2019re <em>not demanding<\/em> it anymore. You\u2019re <em>not requiring<\/em> it. Your life doesn\u2019t depend on it. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Well, I\u2019m curious because some people I\u2019ve heard will look at Jesus\u2014giving the Great Commandment\u2014and He says, \u201cLove God with all your heart, soul, mind, and strength. Love your neighbor as yourself.\u201d They will say, \u201cSee there, the Bible teaches you\u2014you are to love yourself.\u201d That\u2019s not what that verse is teaching; is it? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> That\u2019s one of the greatest misunderstandings in all the texts: \u201cI can\u2019t love you until I love myself. So, let me go for ten years of therapy. Then, when I get myself built up in my self-esteem, then, I\u2019ll give you a chance to be loved, as well.\u201d That\u2019s just not what He\u2019s teaching. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHe\u2019s teaching: \u201cYou\u2019re already committed to yourself. Rather than honoring that commitment to yourself\u2014because you don\u2019t need to anymore because God has already committed to you. He\u2019s taking care of your worst problem. You have all the resources you need, right now\u2014whether you have a good self-esteem or not\u2014you have all the resources you need to move toward somebody else.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHere is the key to the whole thing: \u201cThat\u2019s where joy comes from.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>17:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHe\u2019s saying: \u201cI understand what the word, \u2018joy\u2019, is. I\u2019ve been a member of the Trinity for some time. We get along really well because we\u2019re radically other-centered. I want you to bring the kingdom of heaven to earth.\u201d What does that mean? Well, it doesn\u2019t mean, primarily, social justice issues\u2014although, I\u2019m all for social justice and that sort of thing\u2014but that isn\u2019t the point. The point is: \u201cBring God\u2019s Trinitarian kingdom to earth by being radically others-centered.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> So, if somebody sees, in themselves today, the reality of their self-centeredness and they start to see: \u201cThat\u2019s not a good thing. That really is an abomination. It\u2019s an offense before a Holy God,\u201d\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> \u2014\u201cand I need to deal with that,\u201d Christ has dealt with that. How do they appropriate what Christ has done for them? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> You know, the word, \u201cbrokenness\u201d, is so misunderstood in our culture. Brokenness, for most people, means \u201cI\u2019m hurting badly.\u201d But if I\u2019m willing to say that I am at the point where there is no hope for me\u2014apart from help from outside\u2014there\u2019s just no possibility: \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>18:00<\/strong> <br>\u00a0\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u201cI am broken. I am ruined. I\u2019m hopeless. I\u2019m helpless.\u201d That sounds like terrible news. It <em>is<\/em> until you go to the next step. Basically, the response is: \u201cLord, is it possible that, exactly as I am right now, You actually love me? You\u2019re for me? You want me to live a good life? You want\u2014You have given me a new way to live?\u201d If I start, actually, believing that, by faith, then, maybe some good things can happen. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> And so, how does that person surrender to Christ and receive that gift of forgiveness that he needs or she needs? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> Well, that person has to turn to Jesus\u2014as the condition they are aware of that they are now in\u2014as very self-centered and very big trouble\u2014and realize that: \u201cAs long as I continue to live in my self-centeredness, \u2018the way might seem right, but the end there of\u201d\u2014to quote a verse\u2014\u201care the ways of death.\u2019 I\u2019m heading toward absolute misery forever, and that\u2019s not what I want.\u201d A gift is available to me. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt\u2019s simple as, by faith, saying: \u201cI receive the gift. You\u2019ve forgiven me. And more than forgiven me\u2014now, that I\u2019m Your child\u2014You\u2019ve given me\u201d\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>19:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014and this is crucial\u2014\u201cYou\u2019ve given me a new heart.\u201d Ezekiel 36 talks about a new heart. He says that, in this new heart, \u201cYou\u2019re going to be moved to keep My decree.\u201d What I think that means is\u2014you\u2019re going to discover, not the obligation to be others-centered\u2014although it is an obligation\u2014you\u2019re going to discover the <em>desire<\/em> to be others-centered. You\u2019re not just\u2014just being obedient as a grudging sort of a thing\u2014but it\u2019s what you <em>want<\/em> to do with your life. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> It\u2019s not a matter of cleaning up your act first before you come to Christ. It\u2019s a matter of coming as you are. Then, let Him begin to clean up your act in you. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> You don\u2019t take the bath before you come to Jesus because you can\u2019t find the water to clean yourself with. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Well, here\u2019s my challenge to the listener who isn\u2019t sure he or she is a true follower\u2014a believer in Jesus Christ. I don\u2019t know what you are doing or where you are, but don\u2019t let the sun go down today until you\u2019ve settled the issue with the Lord God Almighty. We\u2019re talking\u2014we\u2019re talking about something that\u2019s really serious. If you didn\u2019t hear what Larry said, he said\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>20:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u201cMisery that lasts for eternity.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> It\u2019s not just misery for a lifetime of being selfish. It\u2019s that you\u2019re making a determinative choice on your eternal destination. That\u2019s why Christ went to the cross\u2014is to redeem us from the punishment and judgment of sin, and to give us a name, a family, and a home in heaven with Him some day. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> Everything our soul was designed to enjoy is available in Jesus. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Bob:<\/strong> And I would think, if a listener is not fully persuaded of the reality of his or her own selfishness, they ought to get a copy of <em>Men and Women: Enjoying the Difference<\/em>. Just read the first 118 pages because Larry\u2014of course, now, who is going to want to buy this book now; right? One hundred eighteen pages on how selfish I am\u2014who wants to read that? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> That would be good for them; and it would be good for their spouse, too. And I want to say, \u201cI did not get back to the question that I asked at the beginning of the broadcast\u201d\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Well, we\u2019ll still have time this week for\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> And we\u2019ll do it. We\u2019ll do that this week. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Alright, so, in the meantime, if folks want to dig deeper on this subject of gender\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>21:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tget a copy of Larry Crabb\u2019s book, <em>Men and Women: Enjoying the Difference<\/em>. And a second book that you\u2019ve written on the same subject called <em>Fully Alive:<\/em>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Larry:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> \u2014<em>A Biblical Vision of Gender That Frees Men and Women to Live Beyond Stereotypes<\/em>. We\u2019ve got both of these books in our <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> Resource Center. I think our listeners will benefit from hearing what Larry adds to this conversation about gender and sexuality. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tGo to FamilyLifeToday.com to get a copy of either or both of Larry Crabb\u2019s books, <em>Men and Women: Enjoying the Difference<\/em> and <em>Fully Alive: A Biblical Vision of Gender That Frees Men and Women to Live Beyond Stereotypes<\/em>. Again, our website is FamilyLifeToday.com; or call, toll-free, at 1-800-FL-TODAY to ask about how to get a copy of either of these books. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tLet me also mention\u2014if in listening to today\u2019s program, you thought to yourself, \u201cI\u2019m not sure that I really understand what it means to be a follower of Jesus,\u201d\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>22:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tor maybe, it occurred to you, for the first time, that this is something that you want to pursue\u2014on our website at FamilyLifeToday.com, we have a link that says, \u201cTWO WAYS TO LIVE.\u201d I want to encourage you to click on that link and get more information about what it means to have a relationship with God by trusting in His Son, Jesus. Again, go to FamilyLifeToday.com. Click on the link that you see there for \u201cTWO WAYS TO LIVE\u201d. Then, jot us a note. Let us know how God has used today\u2019s program in your life. We\u2019d love to hear from you. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd we also want to say, \u201cThanks,\u201d to those of you who make our program possible\u2014those of you who link arms with us in the mission of providing practical, biblical help for marriages and families. You look around, as we do, and see the condition of marriages and families in our culture. You recognize there is a need for dialogue, like we\u2019ve had today, to address the issues we\u2019re talking about here. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>23:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe appreciate your prayerful, financial support of this ministry. That\u2019s what makes <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> possible. In fact, your donations make up about 60 percent of what it costs us to produce and syndicate this program and operate the ministry of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. We do appreciate your generosity. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIn fact, we\u2019d like to say, \u201cThank you,\u201d this month, for your support by sending you some CDs with a conversation we had, a while back, with Pastor Mark Driscoll and his wife Grace on the subject of marriage. It was a candid and transparent conversation. I think you\u2019ll benefit from hearing their story and from hearing their thoughts about how husbands and wives can pursue harmony in the marriage relationship. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tGo to FamilyLifeToday.com to make an online donation. Click the button that says, \u201cI CARE,\u201d and make your donation online. We\u2019ll send these CDs with Mark and Grace Driscoll out to you. Or call 1-800-FL-TODAY. Make a donation over the phone and be sure to ask for the CDs with the Driscolls. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>24:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tOr you can mail a check to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> and request these CDs. Our mailing address is: P O Box 7111, Little Rock, AR. Our zip code is 72223. <br>\u00a0\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd we hope you can be back with us again tomorrow. Larry Crabb is going to be back. We\u2019re going to continue to talk about men, and women, and God\u2014and differences, and marriage, and how all of that fits together. Hope you can tune in. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch, and our entire broadcast production team. On behalf of our host, Dennis Rainey, I\u2019m Bob Lepine. We will see you back next time for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHelp for today. Hope for tomorrow.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright <sup>\u00a9<\/sup> 2014 FamilyLife. 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