{"id":302883,"date":"2013-12-18T12:00:00","date_gmt":"2013-12-18T17:00:00","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/%series%\/jesus-solution-to-shame\/"},"modified":"2013-12-18T12:00:00","modified_gmt":"2013-12-18T17:00:00","slug":"jesus-solution-to-shame","status":"publish","type":"podcast","link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/jesus-solution-to-shame\/","title":{"rendered":"Jesus&#8217;  Solution to Shame"},"content":{"rendered":"","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>How does Christ handle our shame? Ed Welch delves into John 4 to explain.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":91,"featured_media":294104,"menu_order":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","template":"","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","inline_featured_image":false,"_uag_custom_page_level_css":"","episode_type":"","audio_file":"https:\/\/web.familylifetoday.com\/fl2013-12-18.mp3","podmotor_file_id":"","podmotor_episode_id":"","cover_image":"","cover_image_id":"","duration":"00:","filesize":"22.79M","filesize_raw":"23898543","date_recorded":"","explicit":"","block":""},"categories":[2822],"tags":[2385],"podcast_series":[7988],"cwp_profile":[9004],"series":[2101],"class_list":["post-302883","podcast","type-podcast","status-publish","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-growing-in-your-faith","tag-shame","podcast_series-shame-interrupted","cwp_profile-ed-welch","series-familylife-today"],"acf":[],"episode_featured_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/09\/FLT-Podcast-Cover-2-508x508-3.jpg?w=508","episode_player_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2023\/02\/image-scaled.jpg","download_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-download\/302883\/jesus-solution-to-shame","player_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-player\/302883\/jesus-solution-to-shame","audio_player":null,"episode_data":{"playerMode":"light","subscribeUrls":{"apple_podcasts":{"key":"apple_podcasts","url":"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303?mt=2&app=podcast","label":"Apple Podcasts","class":"apple_podcasts","icon":"apple-podcasts.png"},"google_podcasts":{"key":"google_podcasts","url":"","label":"Google Podcasts","class":"google_podcasts","icon":"google-podcasts.png"},"spotify":{"key":"spotify","url":"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm","label":"Spotify","class":"spotify","icon":"spotify.png"},"youtube":{"key":"youtube","url":"","label":"YouTube","class":"youtube","icon":"youtube.png"}},"rssFeedUrl":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/feed\/podcast\/familylife-today","embedCode":"<blockquote class=\"wp-embedded-content\" data-secret=\"yU0wDDJMrQ\"><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/jesus-solution-to-shame\/\">Jesus&#8217;  Solution to Shame<\/a><\/blockquote><iframe sandbox=\"allow-scripts\" security=\"restricted\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/jesus-solution-to-shame\/embed\/#?secret=yU0wDDJMrQ\" width=\"500\" height=\"350\" title=\"&#8220;Jesus&#8217;  Solution to Shame&#8221; &#8212; FamilyLife\u00ae - A Cru Ministry\" data-secret=\"yU0wDDJMrQ\" frameborder=\"0\" marginwidth=\"0\" marginheight=\"0\" scrolling=\"no\" class=\"wp-embedded-content\"><\/iframe><script>\n\/*! This file is auto-generated *\/\n!function(d,l){\"use strict\";l.querySelector&&d.addEventListener&&\"undefined\"!=typeof URL&&(d.wp=d.wp||{},d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage||(d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage=function(e){var t=e.data;if((t||t.secret||t.message||t.value)&&!\/[^a-zA-Z0-9]\/.test(t.secret)){for(var s,r,n,a=l.querySelectorAll('iframe[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),o=l.querySelectorAll('blockquote[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),c=new RegExp(\"^https?:$\",\"i\"),i=0;i<o.length;i++)o[i].style.display=\"none\";for(i=0;i<a.length;i++)s=a[i],e.source===s.contentWindow&&(s.removeAttribute(\"style\"),\"height\"===t.message?(1e3<(r=parseInt(t.value,10))?r=1e3:~~r<200&&(r=200),s.height=r):\"link\"===t.message&&(r=new URL(s.getAttribute(\"src\")),n=new URL(t.value),c.test(n.protocol))&&n.host===r.host&&l.activeElement===s&&(d.top.location.href=t.value))}},d.addEventListener(\"message\",d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage,!1),l.addEventListener(\"DOMContentLoaded\",function(){for(var e,t,s=l.querySelectorAll(\"iframe.wp-embedded-content\"),r=0;r<s.length;r++)(t=(e=s[r]).getAttribute(\"data-secret\"))||(t=Math.random().toString(36).substring(2,12),e.src+=\"#?secret=\"+t,e.setAttribute(\"data-secret\",t)),e.contentWindow.postMessage({message:\"ready\",secret:t},\"*\")},!1)))}(window,document);\n\/\/# sourceURL=https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-includes\/js\/wp-embed.min.js\n<\/script>\n"},"uagb_featured_image_src":{"full":["https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/09\/FLT-Podcast-Cover-2-508x508-3.jpg",508,508,false]},"uagb_author_info":{"display_name":"kfairris@familylife.com","author_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/author\/kfairrisfamilylife-com\/"},"uagb_comment_info":0,"uagb_excerpt":"How does Christ handle our shame? Ed Welch delves into John 4 to explain.","meta_box":{"show_notes":"","transcript_url":"https:\/\/transcript.familylifetoday.com\/fl2013-12-18.pdf","transcript_content":"<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Do you know what you have in common with the great patriarchs of Israel\u2014Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, Joseph, or with King David, or with the Apostle Paul, or Peter? You, along with them, have a shameful past. Here\u2019s Dr. Ed Welch.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ed:<\/strong> Doesn\u2019t that demonstrate to us the divine nature of Scripture? Because if you\u2019re going to write the story of your past, you\u2019re going to sanitize it; and everybody is going to look utterly heroic\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ed:<\/strong> \u2014but for Scripture to show that these are people, who are just like us\u2014who have all of these shameful episodes\u2014it just draws us in and suggests: \u201cMaybe\u2014maybe, they are my people; and the word that was directed to them is also directed to me.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>This is <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> for Wednesday, December 18<sup>th<\/sup>. Our host is the President of FamilyLife<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>, Dennis Rainey, and I'm Bob Lepine. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>1:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHow did Jesus respond to people who had a shameful history, and how does He respond to us? We\u2019ll explore that today with Dr. Ed Welch. Stay tuned.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd welcome to <em>FamilyLife Today. <\/em>Thanks for joining us on the Wednesday edition. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou know, I don\u2019t know that I ever really stopped to think that much about the subject of shame until I had the opportunity to talk with Dr. Ed Welch about it, not long ago, on a day when he arrived; and you could not be here because of recent surgery that you\u2019d had. The doctors said, \u201cNo, don\u2019t go in.\u201d You said, \u201cI\u2019m kind of loopy, anyway;\u201d right?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Well, you know, shoulder surgery is interesting to go through because there\u2019s enough pain after you deal with it, but the anesthesia can whack you out! [Laughter] If you\u2019d had me behind a microphone that day\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> We\u2019d be ashamed of what\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> We might be dealing with our shame\u2014no doubt about it. [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>2:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Well, the point that Ed made in the conversation that we had was how Jesus sought out people who were ashamed. He intentionally sought them out.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> I don\u2019t think that I had ever stopped to think about the nature of His ministry\u2014going to find people who had shameful issues in their lives.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Yes. I think of the woman who was caught in adultery, and He confronted the Pharisees.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> He just told her to \u201cgo and sin no more.\u201d I\u2019m thinking also about Zacchaeus, who was\u2014 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> He\u2019d been dishonest; he\u2019d been a thief.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Right. And He went and had lunch with him.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> And then, He\u2019s going to share with us about the woman at the well who had, what was it, five husbands\u2014six?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> He met her at her point of need, and talked about her past, and showed her a way out of her past. As a result, she brought the whole town out to meet Him.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> I think our listeners are going to appreciate Dr. Welch\u2019s perspective on the subject of shame.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>3:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBefore we hear Part Three of the conversation that I had with him, not long ago, we want to remind listeners of how important the month of December is for ministries like <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> and encourage them to help <em>FamilyLife Today <\/em>be able to face 2014 in a healthy spot.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> That\u2019s right, Bob. This December\u2014right now\u2014is really an urgent time that we really need you to give. I think there are those forces today that would like to silence what we do here on <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. I don\u2019t think our enemy\u2014the enemy of our souls\u2014wants us to be proclaiming what the Scriptures say about marriage and family in this day and at this point in our nation\u2019s history. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe\u2019re in a tough spot. Back, last fall, we had a number of the donors who weren\u2019t able to give. We\u2019re kind of limping our way to the end of the year here and needing to make up some ground in a hurry.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>4:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Here\u2019s one of the reasons why that\u2019s so important\u2014because, as we plan ahead for 2014, we either have to plan to cut back because the funds aren\u2019t there\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> \u2014or we can actually turn up the game and try to make some advances in the year to come. It really all depends on what happens, here, in the next couple of weeks.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> It does. Fortunately, we have some families who also really believe in this ministry. They said, \u201cWe\u2019ll give you a matching fund where you can turn $1 into $4.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes, this is really interesting. They came and they said: \u201cWe\u2019d like to match every donation that comes in, during the month of December, three-to-one. So, if a listener gives a gift of $100, it\u2019s a $400 donation. If they give $10, it\u2019s a $40 donation .Whatever the amount, we\u2019ll match it three-to-one, up to a total of, now, $800,000.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThey\u2019ve actually come along and increased the amount that they will match. So we\u2019re trying to take full advantage of that matching gift. If we can, it puts us in a much better position as we look at our priorities for 2014.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>5:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Yes, and personally, I count it a privilege to be able to link arms with you and make a difference\u2014not only in your marriage and family\u2014but also in the lives of millions of others throughout the United States.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Well, if you\u2019d like to help with a year-end donation, go to FamilyLifeToday.com. Click the button that says, \u201cI CARE\u201d, and you can make an online donation. Or call 1-800-FL-TODAY. Make your donation over the phone. You can also mail a check to <em>FamilyLife Today <\/em>at P O Box 7111, Little Rock, AR. Our zip code is 72223. You can find those phone numbers and addresses online, again, at FamilyLifeToday.com. I\u2019ll repeat them at the end of today\u2019s radio program.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNow, we\u2019re going to talk about the subject of shame with Dr. Ed Welch. He is a counselor with more than 30 years of experience. He works with the Christian Counseling and Education Foundation in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania. He has written a book called <em>Shame Interrupted.<\/em>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>\u00a0<\/em>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>6:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHere is Part Three of a conversation I had with him recently.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Let\u2019s talk, for just a minute, about the woman at the well in John, Chapter 4. The conversation that Jesus had with her did not start well. If this was a woman who was daily confronted by the shame of her life, here comes Jesus to pull all out into the open and say, \u201cLet\u2019s talk about your shame.\u201d As you think through this whole idea of God\u2019s grace, what do you do with that account of the woman at the well?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ed:<\/strong> See, what you\u2019re doing is you said: \u201cLet\u2019s look at the life of Jesus through the lens of shame. Let\u2019s assume that Jesus is targeting people, familiar with shame, from start to finish.\u201d All of a sudden, John, Chapter 4, is a very, very different story.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>7:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tJesus could have taken the normal route around the Samaritan area because you didn\u2019t want to get sullied by these unclean people. He makes a beeline for that particular person, at that particular time of day. She\u2019s a woman, which is bad news in that particular culture.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Shameful; right?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ed:<\/strong> Right; absolutely. She is one of the sinners known by her sin. This should almost be enough. I think it\u2019s the longest conversation that Jesus has in the New Testament. So, if you\u2019re really onto that story, you\u2019re going to say\u2014like everybody else who watched Jesus, early in His ministry: \u201cI think He\u2019s inviting me to go along with Him. I think He understands me. I think He\u2019s speaking to me. I think I\u2019m one of His people.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHe develops this following\u2014the following are all the marginalized ones. They\u2019re the ones who \u201cgot it.\u201d He starts with John, Chapter 4.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Shame says: \u201cIf you really knew me, and you knew everything about me,\u2014\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>8:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ed:<\/strong> \u201cYou would turn away quick and run!\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> And Jesus says, \u201cI know everything about you, and I invite you into relationship.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ed:<\/strong> Bob, you mentioned: \u201cThat shame is not an identifiable feature of my\u2014a palpable feature of my life every single moment.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ed:<\/strong> Yet, I certainly know my sins well enough to think, \u201cWhy would Jesus ever put up with me?\u201d My experience of life has often been, \u201cIf I\u2019m in on the kingdom of heaven\u2014and I believe I am\u2014I\u2019m in on a technicality.\u201d [Laughter] You know, I show up at the gate\u2014and Jesus says, \u201cHey, if it was up to Me, I would have said, \u2018No,\u2019 but it was not up to me. It was a Triune decision. You did the right thing\u2014so you\u2019re in\u2014but I want you to know you\u2019re in by the skin of your teeth.\u201d Sometimes, that can be my experience of life. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>9:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAs I began to see\u2014over, and over, and over\u2014that the God of Scripture is after the person who feels like they\u2019re on the out and says, \u201cI am yours and you are Mine.\u201d There\u2019s so much involved in that. As I began to see that over and over again, one of the things that it left me with was: \u201cOkay, sometimes, I feel like I\u2019m a wretch\u2014I\u2019m an outcast; I don\u2019t belong; I am too unclean.\u201d It just so happens that that\u2019s the qualification for being part of the kingdom of heaven. They\u2019re the people that Jesus goes after.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> In fact, that\u2019s how Jesus starts His most famous sermon\u2014in talking about: \u201cWho are the people whom God has chosen to bless;\u201d right?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ed:<\/strong> Well, you know, the Sermon on the Mount\u2014let\u2019s do the same thing. Sermon on the Mount: \u201cBlah, blah, blah\u2014blessed are this \/ blessed are that.\u201d It\u2019s all very nice; but now, let\u2019s go back and say, \u201cAll of Scripture\u2014it is all directed to the underdog, to the outcast, to the unclean.\u201d All of a sudden, you see that Jesus\u2014those who mourn, for example\u2014those who mourn\u2014from the perspective of a good Jew\u2014they are under the judgment of God. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>10:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ed:<\/strong> They\u2019re going through hard things because they\u2019re really messed up. You have Job, obviously, to counteract that and all kinds of other things in the Scriptures. But that was the experience\u2014the more suffering you had, the worse the shame you\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> It was a sign of God\u2019s judgment.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ed:<\/strong> Absolutely.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> If you were suffering, or if you were poor, or if you were hungry\u2014all of these things are just evidence that God had turned His face away from you.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ed:<\/strong> So, the poor\u2014the destitute\u2014the one who\u2019s in tears\u2014Jesus is saying, \u201cYou are the one.\u201d Let\u2019s take the word \u201cblessed\u201d and punch it up just a little bit in a way, I think, is very appropriate. Jesus is saying: \u201cLet Me tell you who the honored people are in the culture,\u201d because you look around and you see the Pharisees\u2014they\u2019re the ones who are honored. They\u2019re the ones who keep the Law. They\u2019re the ones who have the prestige. \u201cYou will never be one of them, but let me tell you who the honored people are.\u201d That\u2019s where you see Jesus\u2019 ministry just capturing so many hearts, early on, because they\u2019d never, ever heard such a thing.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>11:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe underdog and the outcast\u2014nobody cared about them.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Peter understood shame; especially, in the final hours of Jesus\u2019 life; didn\u2019t he?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ed:<\/strong> There are a couple of stories in the Bible that just have really stuck with me as I\u2019ve thought of the issue of shame. One is the woman in Luke, Chapter 8. She\u2019s the one with the bleeding. She\u2019s the one who\u2014obviously, she had an infirmity\u2014she was known by her infirmity. Somehow, you get this sense that she watched Him, and she heard about Him. She got the message that: \u201cHe hears you. He knows you. You\u2019re His people.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tShe\u2019s the one who goes and, obviously, she touches Jesus. What happened, if you really know the details there, is Jesus says, \u201cSomething has gone from Me.\u201d He washed away her shame and cleansed her. Meanwhile, her contamination was given to Jesus. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>12:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt was this exchange, where He gave her everything He had, and she gave Him the uncleanness. This was almost as if Jesus went around absorbing that uncleanness and took it to the cross. She\u2019s a hero.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ed:<\/strong> And the tax collector is a hero; but this particular woman is, I think, the second person\u2014the second woman\u2014identified as a woman of faith, which is really high praise. I think of that particular person\u2014then, I think of Peter\u2014like you are saying. I think Peter\u2019s sin is above and beyond. I mean, to say, \u201cI don\u2019t even know this guy!\u201d I can\u2019t imagine saying that. \u201cI don\u2019t even know this person\u2019s name.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ed:<\/strong> It\u2019s\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Here\u2019s a guy who, by all rights, should be court-martialed and dishonorably discharged. Jesus says: \u201cI\u2019ve got work for you. You\u2019re still in the battle.\u201d That had to be amazing to Peter\u2014that there was still opportunity for him to serve, and to love, and to know Jesus\u2014given what he had done.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>13:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ed:<\/strong> Sometimes, I\u2019ll look at First and Second Peter and say, \u201cLet me find hints of this atrocious past.\u201d You don\u2019t really find it.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ed:<\/strong> It is just this Jesus-intoxicated book, but he does have this one passage that I think is a bit of a giveaway. What does he say? It is First Peter 5\u2014a beautiful passage: \u201cWe are a chosen people. We are this royal priesthood\u2014a holy nation.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBob, it goes back to your earlier question: \u201cWhat\u2019s the opposite of shame?\u201d Well, Peter gives the perfect opposite: \u201ca chosen people, a royal priesthood, and a holy nation.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> You have talked with people who have gone from being under the weight of shame to being liberated from that weight and the experience is almost like rebirth; isn\u2019t it?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>14:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt\u2019s almost like\u2014well, it\u2019s just that that burden is completely gone!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ed:<\/strong> Rebirth is an interesting way to put it\u2014rebirth\u2014where you finally feel like the humans that God intended us to be.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ed:<\/strong> This is the way God intended true life to be. I have seen liberation with people; but I think, more often, what I find is\u2014liberation and, then, drifting back into this experience of shame\u2014another liberation and, then, drifting back into the experience of shame. That\u2019s what I find more often. I think people can feel like they\u2019re missing something in that\u2014but for us to recognize that is called progressive sanctification. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ed:<\/strong> It\u2019s just this gradual growth\u2014we all go through it. We have these glimpses of\u2014you know, we hear these amazing words from the Lord, and our hearts are built up. Then, we can forget them so quickly. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>15:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhat do we do? We have hope and continue to pray: \u201cLord, for Your\u2026\u201d\u2014here\u2019s sort of a bold way\u2014and shameful people are not bold, by any means\u2014but here\u2019s a bold way to begin to pray: \u201cLord, for Your sake, I want to know honor\u2014for <em>Your<\/em> sake\u2014because I\u2019m connected,\u201d\u2014it\u2019s not our own honor that we have earned ourselves. It\u2019s honor because we are connected to the Honorable One. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt\u2019s all about who you\u2019re connected to, of course. If you\u2019re connected to somebody who has shamed you, you experience the disgrace that is, ultimately, that person\u2019s. If you\u2019re connected to the Holy One, you experience the honor of their holiness. \u201cLord, for <em>Your <\/em>name\u2019s sake\u2014to magnify <em>Your<\/em> name\u2014would You give me the honor that goes with being Your royal priesthood?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ed:<\/strong> That\u2019s a biblical way to pray. We can be confident that as we pray those ways, we are praying, certainly, according to the will of God.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>16:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSo, our struggle with shame is going to feel different, a month from now, than it does today.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> I think it\u2019s fair to say that shame really does hold us hostage\u2014and that to bring it to light\u2014to go before the Lord and to bring it before others\u2014we are\u2014the ransom\u2019s paid\u2014we\u2019re set free. We may get dragged back into a hostage situation again, but the liberation that comes. Again, I can\u2019t think of anything that is more freeing\u2014more\u2014I can\u2019t even find the word for it\u2014that you could raise your hands and kind of do that <em>Rocky<\/em>\u2014\u201cLook!\u201d\u00a0 There\u2019s almost nothing like being liberated from your past and from the shame; is there? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ed:<\/strong> That would be another way to pray: \u201cLord, would You give me knowledge of Your cleansing from shame and the honor that You give me as Your royal child? Would you give that to me in such a way that I can proclaim it to the assembly?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>17:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou see, I\u2019m just using Psalm-like language.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ed:<\/strong> I\u2019m so enthusiastic about it that I can\u2019t help but speak of it to other people who need to hear it.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> And that brings me to a final area I want to explore with you\u2014and that is those folks\u2014because we\u2019ve got some listening, who are saying: \u201cYou know\u2014I tried. I went to the Lord; and then, I went to somebody I thought I could trust; and it didn\u2019t go well. It came up in front of the church; and instead of them rejoicing in my liberation, I became an outcast. No one wanted anything to do with me. I was driven deeper into my shame.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ed:<\/strong> That\u2019s horrible; isn\u2019t it?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> You\u2019ve heard stories like that. What does that person do?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ed:<\/strong> [Long pause] It happens too often and just leaves me speechless in some ways.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>18:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut here\u2019s one way that I think Scripture might approach it. Obviously, we can talk about forgiving those who have done shameful things; but here\u2019s what we\u2019re anticipating: \u201cWe have been brought into union with the Holy One, and everything has changed; but do we expect\u2014having become one with Christ\u2014that the way of exaltation is going to go through experiences of shame?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think one of the features of Scripture that we miss is\u2014when you\u2019re hooked to the King\u2014you experience the King\u2019s autobiography. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ed:<\/strong> He doesn\u2019t take you away from shame. He takes you into His autobiography. His autobiography is one\u2014and the disciples, I think, understood this\u2014they recognized that one of the key features of their ministry is they were going to experience shame. The Apostle Paul, in Second Corinthians\u2014it wasn\u2019t simply the shame that he experienced from those outside the church\u2014who certainly rejected him\u2014his own people.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>19:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIn Second Corinthians, he\u2019s being rejected by the very people he was used to convert. How shameful! You know: \u201cI love you. I hold nothing back in my love for you. Please, I beg of you\u2014don\u2019t resist loving me in return.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Ed:<\/strong> That is\u2014what a shameful thing to be able to say! My point is that, as we walk with Christ, we anticipate that we will experience that kind of rejection from people outside of the church; <em>and <\/em>it\u2019s not a surprise to experience it inside the church. There are ways that the rejection and shame of Christ is just going to be dotted through our life.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhat do we do? We go to a God who understands shame by His own very experience. And then, perhaps, we go back to some of the Psalms: \u201cWhy have You forsaken me?\u201d kinds of Psalms\u2014the Psalms where the inner circle has rejected us. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>20:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tUltimately, they\u2019re the Psalms of Jesus. Jesus is saying: \u201cSing this one, along with Me. Now, it\u2019s your Psalm, as well.\u201d It doesn\u2019t take away the rejection and shame of what they experience, but it does transform it; doesn\u2019t it? It puts our eyes on Jesus rather than putting our eyes on the person who was so cruel.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Well, again today, we\u2019ve been listening to a conversation with Dr. Ed Welch on the subject of shame. I appreciate what he shared there. God does not remove from us the sting of shame\u2014He transforms it. He takes it and makes it something different in our lives than the sting that it has been.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> I\u2019ll never forget having lunch with a couple where the husband had committed adultery. He was dealing with a <em>massive<\/em> amount of shame.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> He\u2019d been an elder in his church. He\u2019d had to confess it before the church, and he was just completely defined around his shame.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>21:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI told him\u2014I said, \u201cSomeday\u2014someday, you\u2019re going to experience what it means for God\u2019s grace to cover your sin. You\u2019re going to make your marriage a trophy of God\u2019s grace.\u201d I want to tell you\u2014that was about ten years ago. That couple has now led\u2014I don\u2019t know\u2014eight, nine, or ten <em>Art of Marriage<\/em><sup>\u00ae<\/sup> events.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> They have impacted 50 couples from all over the country. Their marriage is a statement of God\u2019s grace. I\u2019m reminded of the old hymn we used to sing: \u201cGrace, grace, God\u2019s grace; Grace that is greater than all my sin.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes, that\u2019s the message. And that\u2019s what\u2019s at the heart of Ed Welch\u2019s book that he has written\u2014called <em>Shame Interrupted<\/em>\u2014which we have in our <em>FamilyLife Today <\/em>Resource Center. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>22:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think there may be some of our listeners who have been paralyzed by the shame of the past and who need to read a book like this in order to realize the reality of grace\u2014that God\u2019s grace is liberating.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tGo to FamilyLifeToday.com to order a copy of Ed Welch\u2019s book. Again, the title is <em>Shame Interrupted: How God Lifts the Pain of Worthlessness and Rejection. <\/em>You can order from us, online, at FamilyLifeToday.com; or you can call, toll-free, at 1-800-FL-TODAY; 1-800-358-6329. That\u2019s 1-800-\u201cF\u201d as in family, \u201cL\u201d as in life, and then, the word, \u201cTODAY\u201d. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNow, Dennis mentioned earlier\u2014and I hope you haven\u2019t forgotten\u2014about the matching-gift opportunity that we have available to us, here at <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. This is the month of the year when many listeners decide to make an end-of-the-year contribution to support <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. We hope you are considering that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>23:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe\u2019ve had some friends offer a little extra incentive for you to make a year-end contribution. They have agreed to match every donation we receive this month, three-to-one. So, your $50 donation becomes a $200 value to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. They will match, again, all donations up to a total of $800,000. We have not yet reached that full value of the matching gift. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSo, we\u2019re asking listeners to go to FamilyLifeToday.com. Click the button that says, \u201cI CARE\u201d, and make as generous a contribution as you possible can. Again, the website: FamilyLifeToday.com. Click the button that says, \u201cI CARE\u201d. Or you can call 1-800-FL-TODAY. Make a donation over the phone.\u00a0 If you\u2019d prefer to write a check, our mailing address is <em>FamilyLife Today, <\/em>P O Box 7111, Little Rock, AR. Our zip code is 72223. We hope to hear from you; and we want to say, \u201cThanks,\u201d in advance, for your financial support. Please pray for us that we are able to take full advantage of this matching-gift opportunity.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>24:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tTomorrow, we want to talk to the moms and dads who are raising boys\u2014maybe a few of the grandmas and grandpas, too. Dr. Meg Meeker is going to join us, and we\u2019re going to talk about what parents can do to make sure that boys grow up to be men. We\u2019ll talk about that tomorrow, and I hope you can join us for that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch, and our entire broadcast production team. On behalf of our host, Dennis Rainey, I'm Bob Lepine. We will see you back next time for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHelp for today.\u00a0 Hope for tomorrow.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you.\u00a0 However, there is a cost to produce them for our website.\u00a0 If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright <sup>\u00a9<\/sup> 2013 FamilyLife.\u00a0 All rights reserved.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/\">www.FamilyLife.com<\/a>\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\n\t\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\t1\n\t\t\t\t<\/p>","theme_header_position":"","post_header_is_sticky":"","is_header_overlay":""},"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast\/302883","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/podcast"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/91"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=302883"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/294104"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=302883"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=302883"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=302883"},{"taxonomy":"podcast_series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast_series?post=302883"},{"taxonomy":"cwp_profile","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/cwp_profile?post=302883"},{"taxonomy":"series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/series?post=302883"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}