{"id":302652,"date":"2012-12-19T12:00:00","date_gmt":"2012-12-19T17:00:00","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/%series%\/in-praise-of-large-families\/"},"modified":"2025-01-09T13:58:27","modified_gmt":"2025-01-09T18:58:27","slug":"in-praise-of-large-families","status":"publish","type":"podcast","link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/in-praise-of-large-families\/","title":{"rendered":"In Praise of Large Families"},"content":{"rendered":"\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">How many children does it take to make a large family? Four? Six? Eight?<\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>How many children does it take to make a large family? Four? Six? Eight?<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":91,"featured_media":294104,"menu_order":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","template":"","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","inline_featured_image":false,"_uag_custom_page_level_css":"","episode_type":"audio","audio_file":"https:\/\/web.familylifetoday.com\/fl2012-12-19.mp3","podmotor_file_id":"","podmotor_episode_id":"","cover_image":"","cover_image_id":"","duration":"00:","filesize":"21.99M","filesize_raw":"23054038","date_recorded":"2012-12-19 12:00:00","explicit":"","block":""},"categories":[2855,2870,2881],"tags":[4292],"podcast_series":[],"cwp_profile":[3067],"series":[2101],"class_list":["post-302652","podcast","type-podcast","status-publish","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-teens","category-tweens","category-young-children","tag-children","cwp_profile-leslie-leyland-fields","series-familylife-today"],"acf":[],"episode_featured_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/09\/FLT-Podcast-Cover-2-508x508-3.jpg?w=508","episode_player_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2023\/02\/image-scaled.jpg","download_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-download\/302652\/in-praise-of-large-families","player_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-player\/302652\/in-praise-of-large-families","audio_player":null,"episode_data":{"playerMode":"light","subscribeUrls":{"apple_podcasts":{"key":"apple_podcasts","url":"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303?mt=2&app=podcast","label":"Apple Podcasts","class":"apple_podcasts","icon":"apple-podcasts.png"},"google_podcasts":{"key":"google_podcasts","url":"","label":"Google Podcasts","class":"google_podcasts","icon":"google-podcasts.png"},"spotify":{"key":"spotify","url":"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm","label":"Spotify","class":"spotify","icon":"spotify.png"},"youtube":{"key":"youtube","url":"","label":"YouTube","class":"youtube","icon":"youtube.png"}},"rssFeedUrl":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/feed\/podcast\/familylife-today","embedCode":"<blockquote class=\"wp-embedded-content\" data-secret=\"B01LubeNrI\"><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/in-praise-of-large-families\/\">In Praise of Large Families<\/a><\/blockquote><iframe sandbox=\"allow-scripts\" security=\"restricted\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/in-praise-of-large-families\/embed\/#?secret=B01LubeNrI\" width=\"500\" height=\"350\" title=\"&#8220;In Praise of Large Families&#8221; &#8212; FamilyLife\u00ae - A Cru Ministry\" data-secret=\"B01LubeNrI\" frameborder=\"0\" marginwidth=\"0\" marginheight=\"0\" scrolling=\"no\" class=\"wp-embedded-content\"><\/iframe><script>\n\/*! This file is auto-generated *\/\n!function(d,l){\"use strict\";l.querySelector&&d.addEventListener&&\"undefined\"!=typeof URL&&(d.wp=d.wp||{},d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage||(d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage=function(e){var t=e.data;if((t||t.secret||t.message||t.value)&&!\/[^a-zA-Z0-9]\/.test(t.secret)){for(var s,r,n,a=l.querySelectorAll('iframe[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),o=l.querySelectorAll('blockquote[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),c=new RegExp(\"^https?:$\",\"i\"),i=0;i<o.length;i++)o[i].style.display=\"none\";for(i=0;i<a.length;i++)s=a[i],e.source===s.contentWindow&&(s.removeAttribute(\"style\"),\"height\"===t.message?(1e3<(r=parseInt(t.value,10))?r=1e3:~~r<200&&(r=200),s.height=r):\"link\"===t.message&&(r=new URL(s.getAttribute(\"src\")),n=new URL(t.value),c.test(n.protocol))&&n.host===r.host&&l.activeElement===s&&(d.top.location.href=t.value))}},d.addEventListener(\"message\",d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage,!1),l.addEventListener(\"DOMContentLoaded\",function(){for(var e,t,s=l.querySelectorAll(\"iframe.wp-embedded-content\"),r=0;r<s.length;r++)(t=(e=s[r]).getAttribute(\"data-secret\"))||(t=Math.random().toString(36).substring(2,12),e.src+=\"#?secret=\"+t,e.setAttribute(\"data-secret\",t)),e.contentWindow.postMessage({message:\"ready\",secret:t},\"*\")},!1)))}(window,document);\n\/\/# sourceURL=https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-includes\/js\/wp-embed.min.js\n<\/script>\n"},"spectra_custom_meta":{"_wp_page_template":["default"],"transcript_url":["https:\/\/transcript.familylifetoday.com\/fl2012-12-19.pdf"],"audio_file":["https:\/\/web.familylifetoday.com\/fl2012-12-19.mp3"],"transcript_content":["<p><strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u00a0I love the title of this.\u00a0 It says, \"The Case for Kids:\u00a0 A Defense of the Large Family by a Six-Time 'Breeder.'\"<\/p>\n<p><strong>Leslie:<\/strong>\u00a0 Mm-hm, that's me\u2014okay, the \"Breeder\" is in quotation marks.\u00a0 You have to know that.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 But you had people kind of refer to you with disparaging comments like that; right?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Leslie:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes, right; that's right.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 And in your class, one day, you actually had one student refer to herself as a non-breeder?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Leslie:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes, and that's when I decided I had to write this article.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Tell me about that classroom.\u00a0 In what context does the student say, \"I'm a non-breeder\"?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Leslie:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, it was the first day of class in a writing class.\u00a0 I typically go around the room, and we start to get to know one another.\u00a0 \"What's your name, where do you work, what do you do?\"\u00a0 There were several women before her.\u00a0 They had said, \"I'm a mom, I have two kids, I work here, and I do this.\"\u00a0 By the time it came to this woman, she described herself as, \"Hi, I'm Rosa.\u00a0 I've been a truck driver, a commercial fisherwoman, and I'm <em>not<\/em> a breeder.\"<\/p>\n<p>The class went dead quiet.\u00a0 Everyone is looking at me with <em>big eyes<\/em> because everyone knows I have five children, at that point.\u00a0 You could have bottled that silence and sold it to noisy places.\u00a0 [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 She was saying it with a chip on her shoulder?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Leslie:<\/strong>\u00a0 Oh, absolutely.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 And your administrator\u2014when you told him you were pregnant with, what, number six\u2014had a real bad comment to make, at that point?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Leslie:<\/strong>\u00a0 Oh, yes; oh, yes.\u00a0 He just kind of laughed, you know, out the side of his mouth, and said, \"What?\u00a0 This is your\u2014what, ninth or tenth?\"<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes.\u00a0 So, what's the genesis, do you think, of this hostility toward children, or big families, or people like us in this room who have had five or six kids?\u00a0 Why are people so upset about it?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Leslie:<\/strong>\u00a0 I think there are a number of reasons.\u00a0 One is that there is sort of a general assumption that people who have large families are uneducated, and are sort of backward, and having lots of children simply because they don't know any better.<\/p>\n<p>I think there's a lot of attention and a lot of awareness\u2014sensitivity, now, to, of course, environmental issues.\u00a0 I think those are important issues that we need to attend to; but the fears of over-population, I think, are a very major part of that.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 I think the further our nation drifts from Christianity, the less we are going to view children from a biblical viewpoint\u2014that children are valuable; that lots of children in a family can be a blessing and were intended, by God, to be a blessing; and that children represent the future\u2014they represent our legacy\u2014they represent the spiritual leadership of the nation for the next generation.<\/p>\n<p>In fact, we don't need to look very far to see where this has led Europe.\u00a0 Europe is in a declining population where the replacement\u2014the number of children who are being born in many European countries is actually less than what it takes to sustain that nation.\u00a0 You have to ask the question, \u201cHow will that country exist, long-haul?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Throughout history, Christianity has been used to bring a right perspective about children\u2014not only protecting children\u2014but also valuing them for who they are.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 They are a blessing\u2014they are an inheritance from the Lord.\u00a0 I mean, the Scriptures never look at children as a liability.\u00a0 You can't find scriptural support for there being a liability to children, and having many is considered a blessing of God.\u00a0 Yet, when you are pregnant with your third, or your fourth, or your fifth, or your sixth\u2014especially in a culture that has been influenced heavily by feminism\u2014you had to feel some of the sting that you had violated your womanhood.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Leslie:<\/strong>\u00a0 Oh, absolutely.\u00a0 I had violated a number of social contracts.\u00a0 In an academic environment, of course, you don't have a lot of children.\u00a0 Often, I go to conferences, and I speak, and I travel to academic conferences.\u00a0 I will be the only woman, on the whole floor of the dorm\u2014I'll be, oftentimes, the only woman who has more than one child or more than two children.\u00a0 Many women will not have children or maybe they have one.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 And have you felt scorn toward you for a long period of time about that or was it\u2014did it get to five or six before you started feeling the scorn?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Leslie:<\/strong>\u00a0 No, you know, I have to say I've never felt <em>scorned<\/em> because once I get to know someone, and they get to know me\u2014when we're at that point in the conversation when they find out how many children I have, there is sort of a mutual respect.\u00a0 I think there's great curiosity.<\/p>\n<p>I remember one time at a conference, when I had four children.\u00a0 I became friends with a woman who was a poet.\u00a0 I found out later, over dinner, she was a lesbian.\u00a0 She found out, over dinner, that I had four children.\u00a0 She asked me, just in the most genuine way possible, she asked, \"Why do you have four children?\u00a0 Why do you have so many children?\"\u00a0 It wasn't a judgment; it was, like, \u201cExplain this to me.\u201d<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u201cI don't understand.\u201d<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u201cHelp me understand;\u201d yes.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Leslie:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u201cI don't understand.\u00a0 Help me understand this.\u201d\u00a0 My response, at the time\u2014you know, I had never thought this through to actually have a response\u2014but I think God gave me the words to say.\u00a0 I said something like, \"I love it when we sit down to eat.\u00a0 We hold hands around the table, and the circle is wide.\"\u00a0 She nodded.\u00a0 She understood what that meant about love, and fellowship, and about the strength in numbers.\u00a0 As a woman who lived alone\u2014who was alone\u2014I'm sure that that was something that she probably longed for and was trying to find in another way.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 You wrote, in the article that we've mentioned, that\u2014called \"The Case for Kids\"\u2014that there are movements afloat called \"Child-Free\" and \"Only One Child\".\u00a0 When we don't begin to value children for what they are\u2014a gift from God\u2014I think it really leads\u2014can lead a nation or a society to all kinds of abnormalities when it comes to their valuing children; don't you think?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Leslie:<\/strong>\u00a0 Oh, absolutely.\u00a0 If we look at our own lives and look at who we were before we had children and look at who we are now\u2014the transformation that occurs through the process of having children\u2014you know, in some ways, our lives feel as though they shrink because it requires so much energy and so much of yourself.\u00a0 You know, it's just this daily sort of pouring out of yourself to your children.\u00a0 In some ways, it feels like the boundaries\u2014the horizons of your life shrink; but in many other ways, you are so expanded.\u00a0 You are not a single person anymore.\u00a0 There are eight of you.\u00a0 You are this larger, deeper, wiser person because of having children.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 There may be some shrinking boundaries; but there is an enlarged heart, no doubt about it.\u00a0 [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 I\u2019m thinking about two scenes that stick out for me in the movie, <em>It\u2019s a Wonderful <\/em>Life\u2014my all-time favorite movie; right?\u00a0 Jimmy Stewart\u2019s had a lousy day.\u00a0 He\u2019s at the end of his rope.\u00a0 He comes home, and there are four kids around the house.\u00a0 One\u2019s practicing the piano, and another one is following him around, asking him questions.\u00a0 There\u2019s a point where he looks at his wife and he says, \u201cWhy did we have all these kids, anyway?\u201d\u00a0\u00a0 It is just that moment of frustration.<\/p>\n<p>Mary Ann and I have had those moments in our marriage where we\u2019ve looked at each other and said, \u201cWhy did we have all these kids anyway?\u201d\u00a0 We just recite the line from the movie.\u00a0 We do it really to just inject some humor into an otherwise tense situation and remind ourselves that, \u201cGod is in the midst of all of this and that these are a gift from God.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>But I also remember this\u2014I remember hearing John MacArthur, a number of years ago, talk about the difference in the family dynamic when there is one child versus five kids.\u00a0 He said if there is one child in the home, the day begins with Mom coming into the child's bedroom, and sitting down on the bed, and rubbing the child's back and saying, \"It's time to wake up, Sweetheart.\u00a0 What do you want Mommy to make you for breakfast today;\" you know?\u00a0 He said, \u201cWhen there are five kids, you're sitting around the table.\u00a0 You look at what you've got for dinner and you go, \"I don't like this.\"\u00a0 The kid next to you goes, \"Good!\" and starts eating off your plate.\u00a0 [Laughter]\u00a0 Or you come down.\u00a0 There are five bags of lunch to take to school.\u00a0 You go, \"Which one is mine?\"\u00a0 They say, \"It doesn't matter.\u00a0 Just take one.\"<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Right.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Now, obviously, parents can raise a single child to be a giving, generous person; but, boy, there is something about the dynamic of having four or five brothers and sisters\u2014where you have to learn what selflessness and sharing looks like.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Leslie:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right, it is a school of hard knocks, you know, for everyone; but what a wonderful school that is.\u00a0 In our family, we have an extra benefit; and that is we commercial fish in the summers.\u00a0 My kids all work together out in the ocean.\u00a0 You know, they run their own skiffs; and they\u2014one is the skipper, and one is the crew.<\/p>\n<p>You look at what my kids have learned by working together, by being together\u2014all the give and take that goes on\u2014and this whole blend of personalities, and quirks, and eccentricities, and strengths\u2014and it all\u2014in one sense, I'm sure an outsider looks in and they see chaos.\u00a0 But you know what?\u00a0 It all does make a kind of sense.\u00a0 We are all learning from each other\u2014even through the thick, the thin, the good, the bad\u2014the whole mass it is\u2014we are all being shaped and formed into who\u2014the kind of person\u2014God wants us to be.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Toffler wrote in his book called <em>The Third Wave<\/em> that one of the problems for teenage rebellion or causes of teenage rebellion was that children don't feel needed anymore.\u00a0 Your children are needed; they're valued; they are appreciated for how they help the family succeed in the family endeavor.\u00a0 Years ago, Bob, that would have happened on a farm.\u00a0 In your case, it happens on the ocean.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Leslie:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 But children really are valuable, and I have a confession to make.\u00a0 I don't think I've ever admitted this on the broadcast, Bob; but years ago, when we started FamilyLife, I rejected any photograph that had a husband and a wife with one child or two children.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 You're saying if there was going to be something in a brochure or something representing FamilyLife\u2014you didn't want the standard Photoshop<sup>\u00ae<\/sup> picture.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 I felt like the Christian community had\u2014hook, line, and sinker\u2014swallowed the bait of the culture of the world's view of children\u2014\u201cTwo and no more.\u201d\u00a0 The Bible speaks of children being a blessing, \u201cBlessed is he whose quiver is full of children.\"<\/p>\n<p>When I chose pictures, they didn't all have to have six or, you know, seven or eight.\u00a0 I\u2019m not saying that; and we're not saying, here on this broadcast, that every person is being called by God to have a large or big family; but we do think we need to all take a step back and say, \"What's your perspective of what God thinks about children and what should you think about them?\"<\/p>\n<p>When I got married to Barbara, I'd really never thought about children.\u00a0 I didn't even think about how many we'd have.\u00a0 I didn't really like children.\u00a0 When we started having them, I realized how much\u2014as you've said, Leslie\u2014they cause you to have to die to self\u2014and how with each child, there is more of self that has to yield to God and submit to Him so that you can love, and you can lead, and you can nurture, and you can pour your life into them.<\/p>\n<p>I'd have to say, \u201cBarbara and I have a lot of accomplishments.\u00a0 There is no greater privilege than being called \u2018Daddy\".\u00a0 None!\u00a0 I think, as we've chosen those pictures, Bob, that's what we're trying to convey.<\/p>\n<p>You got some negative fan mail, so to speak?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Hate mail\u2014<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 People didn't care for what you said in this article about having a large family.\u00a0 They thought you were saying everybody should have a large family.\u00a0 That's not what we're saying here.\u00a0 Why do you think people reacted so against your article?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Leslie:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, you know, I did get my very first piece of hate mail from this article.\u00a0 It was a very angry, vitriolic letter\u2014and the woman\u2014she actually misread the article and thought that I was\u2014yes, that I was saying <em>every<\/em> family should have six children\u2014every family should be like me.\u00a0 I would never make that argument because I don't think you can support that argument from Scripture even.<\/p>\n<p>But it was clear to me\u2014as I read the article\u2014and that she's calling me names, that she didn't have children.\u00a0 This was a place of great hurt in her life.\u00a0 So, I think that's really key\u2014when someone attacks you for this position, it's really easy to just sort of respond back in kind; but sometimes, people are not understanding what we're saying.\u00a0 Sometimes, people are coming from a place of great hurt in their own lives.\u00a0 We need to be compassionate and, I think, respond from compassion and kindness.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong> I've gotten to a point where, whenever I'm introducing myself and talking about my family, I'll say Mary Ann and I have been married for this number of years.\u00a0 I'll say we only had five children and just kind of go on, matter-of-factly\u2014but I'm just slipping in this, \"We only had five children.\"\u00a0 You'll hear a little snicker, out in the audience; and I'm not trying to suggest, either, that we need to have a dozen; right?\u00a0 But I am trying to say\u2014I know that sounds absurd, but you know what?\u00a0 There is a great joy.\u00a0 I mean, if God should bless you with that\u2014if that's what He calls you to\u2014here is what you'll miss. You'll miss\u2014<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 You can't even begin to get into the list!<\/p>\n<p><strong>Leslie:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>I know it!<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 If you have a lot of kids, you'll miss more meals out at restaurants because you just can't afford it.\u00a0 You'll miss your kids having the nicest shoes\u2014the nicest athletic shoes because you can't buy $100-a-pair shoes for six kids; right?\u00a0 You'll miss a lot of economic benefit that you might otherwise accrue\u2014some vacations that you go on that you stay in the Super 8<sup>\u00ae<\/sup> instead of in a nicer hotel, or you find somebody who can put you up\u2014right? \u2014because you just can't afford\u2014<\/p>\n<p>But what you gain is relationship.\u00a0 At the end of the day, when you sit down and say, \"Okay, here's the pros and here's the cons,\" \u2014the tennis shoes?\u00a0 Come on!\u00a0 The relationships, the love, the family, and the joy\u2014I mean, that's what you want in your retirement and your old age; isn't it?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Last summer we had our family get-together.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 This is your children, their spouses, and your grandchildren.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 And our grandchildren.\u00a0 And the next time we get together\u2014<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 You'll have to rent an island.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, truthfully, how do you get that many people together?\u00a0 But you know what?\u00a0 The place we stayed had some pinball machines, some little basketball goals, card games going on.\u00a0 That was so much life taking place in the lives of those children and grandchildren.\u00a0 One of the great times we were together was Cousins Camp\u2014where we got all the cousins.\u00a0 I mean, it was all those ages three and older.\u00a0 We went on a wildflower-gathering trip, we got finger paints, we sat around, and Papa told a continuing story\u2014one of my favorites.\u00a0 You know? \u2014what fun to celebrate these great moments.<\/p>\n<p>I'm going to encourage our listeners to go to FamilyLife.com.\u00a0 There is a link on our website to this article at <em>Christianity Today<\/em>.\u00a0 In closing, Leslie, I want to read your last paragraph because it really is worth stating\u2014how you conclude your article.<\/p>\n<p>You say: \"Perhaps we need to hope that some of those in charge, some of those upon whom we will be dependent, will have been raised in large families.\u00a0 We will need to hope that these providers, caregivers, and government leaders can resist our culture's obsession with self and remember their families' lessons of tolerance and sympathy extended to all, especially those less able than themselves, knowing that, above all, the universe is not theirs alone.\"<\/p>\n<p>Well stated.\u00a0 Thanks for writing this article, and thanks for being obedient to fulfill God's call in your life and having six children.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Leslie:<\/strong>\u00a0 It's been a joy.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 I just want to be careful to make sure that our listeners understand what we\u2019re saying and what we\u2019re not saying here.\u00a0 We\u2019re not saying that we know how many children every family ought to have, or that you ought to have as many children as you possibly can.\u00a0 We\u2019re just saying children are a blessing, and we ought to have that mindset when it comes to our children.\u00a0 When it comes to being husbands and wives, we ought to see our children as a blessing rather than a liability or a limitation.\u00a0 I think that\u2019s clear.<\/p>\n<p>In fact, if folks would like to read the article you wrote, we\u2019ve got a link to it on our website at FamilyLifeToday.com.\u00a0 I\u2019m just going to mention the title of the article again.\u00a0 It\u2019s called \u201cThe Case for Kids: A Defense of the Large Family by a Six-Time \u2018Breeder\u2019.\u201d\u00a0 Again, go to FamilyLifeToday.com to link to that article written by Leslie Fields\u2014at FamilyLifeToday.com.<\/p>\n<p>Let me just say, we\u2019ve also got a book I want to encourage those of you who are younger married couples\u2014you\u2019ve been married a couple of years\u2014you haven\u2019t started your family yet\u2014I want to challenge you to read a book by Candice Watters called <em>Start Your Family.<\/em><em>\u00a0 <\/em>It\u2019s a book where she makes a case, and I think a solid case, for why young couples should step out and start having kids.<\/p>\n<p>Again, you can find out more about that book when you go to FamilyLifeToday.com, as well; or you can call to order a copy from us:\u00a0 1-800-FL-TODAY is our number.\u00a0 That\u2019s 1-800-FL-TODAY.\u00a0 Let me just say this is not a book that I would encourage mothers and fathers to give to their adult children as a Christmas gift.\u00a0 Don\u2019t give them a copy of the book <em>Start Your Family.<\/em>\u00a0 Just let them find that one on their own; okay? \u2014alright.<\/p>\n<p>I want to read to you an email we got from a listener, not long ago\u2014a listener in Arizona\u2014who said:<\/p>\n<p>You guys have ministered to me a lot over the last six months.\u00a0 We have two children; and I have been in a sort of survival mode for the last several months\u2014many days just making sure everybody is fed, loved, diapers changed.\u00a0 Then, I plop into bed, at the first opportunity, and get as much sleep as possible.<\/p>\n<p>When our son was just a few weeks old, I found your program on the radio; and it\u2019s been a great blessing.\u00a0 In fact, recently, my local radio station accidentally played another program in your time slot; and I immediately called the program manager, almost in a panic, thinking you might have discontinued airing your program.\u00a0 <em>FamilyLife Today <\/em>is my bread and butter\u2014constant encouragement and input every weekday.\u00a0 You guys keep me going.<\/p>\n<p>I just thought you\u2019d want to know that there are some young moms out here who almost panic at the thought of not having your program on the station every day.\u00a0 You are making a difference.<\/p>\n<p>Well, I tell you, we had to smile when we got that email\u2014just the picture it conjured up, in our minds, about what\u2019s going on in a lot of homes\u2014but it also sobered us a little bit because, in recent days, <em>FamilyLife Today <\/em>has seen a decline in donations from radio listeners.\u00a0 As a result, we are having to make some tough decisions about things to slow down on, things to stop, some things we\u2019re going to have to discontinue or set aside for a while.<\/p>\n<p>Depending on what happens, here at the end of 2012, we may have to make some tough decisions about whether <em>FamilyLife Today <\/em>can continue on some of the stations that are currently airing the program. That\u2019s why we want to ask you, at the end of this year, to be as generous as you can be in making a yearend donation to support <em>FamilyLife Today. <\/em>Not only will it help us out, but there is also an opportunity for your donation to be doubled, between now and the end of the year.<\/p>\n<p>We have some friends who have come forward and have put together a matching-gift fund.\u00a0 They are matching every donation we receive, dollar-for-dollar, up to a total of $3.6 million, between now and the end of the year. That matching fund, in fact, may be growing.\u00a0 We\u2019ve been approached recently by some folks who would like to increase the size of the matching fund.\u00a0 So, we\u2019ll keep you posted on that; but the good news is that, right now, when you make a donation, it will be doubled.<\/p>\n<p>Consider going online at FamilyLifeToday.com; click the button that says, \u201cI CARE\u201d, to make an online donation.\u00a0 Or call us at 1-800-FL-TODAY.\u00a0 Make a donation over the phone.\u00a0 We just want you to know how much we appreciate your joining with us, and we look forward to hearing from you.<\/p>\n<p>We hope you can join us back again tomorrow.\u00a0 Author and speaker Jim Keller is going to be with us.\u00a0 We\u2019re going to talk about an upside down marriage.\u00a0 He says that\u2019s a good thing.\u00a0 So, it may be different than what you\u2019re thinking about when you think about an upside down marriage.\u00a0 We\u2019ll talk it about it tomorrow.\u00a0 Hope you can tune in for that.<\/p>\n<p>I want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch, and our entire broadcast production team.\u00a0 On behalf of our host, Dennis Rainey, I'm Bob Lepine.\u00a0 We will see you back next time for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.<\/p>\n<p><em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas.<\/p>\n<p>Help for today.\u00a0 Hope for tomorrow.<\/p>\n<p>We are so happy to provide these transcripts to you.\u00a0 However, there is a cost to produce them for our website.\u00a0 If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?<\/p>\n<p>Copyright <sup>\u00a9<\/sup> 2012 FamilyLife.\u00a0 All rights reserved.<\/p>\n<p><a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/\">www.FamilyLife.com<\/a><\/p>\n<p>1<\/p>\n"],"duration":["00:"],"_thumbnail_id":["294104"],"filesize":["21.99M"],"filesize_raw":["23054038"],"_edit_lock":["1736449115:47000"],"_edit_last":["47000"],"theme_header_position":["Sticky"],"post_header_is_sticky":["default"],"is_header_overlay":["0"],"episode_type":["audio"],"date_recorded":["2012-12-19 12:00:00"],"enclosure":["https:\/\/web.familylifetoday.com\/fl2012-12-19.mp3"],"_seopress_redirections_type":["301"],"_seopress_redirections_logged_status":["both"],"_seopress_analysis_target_kw":[""],"_uag_css_file_name":["uag-css-302652.css"],"_uag_js_file_name":["uag-js-302652.js"],"_uag_page_assets":["a:9:{s:3:\"css\";s:82560:\".wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape-top svg{width: calc( 100% + 1.3px );}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape.uagb-container__shape-top .uagb-container__shape-fill{fill: 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many children does it take to make a large family? Four? Six? Eight?","meta_box":{"show_notes":"","transcript_url":"https:\/\/transcript.familylifetoday.com\/fl2012-12-19.pdf","transcript_content":"<p><strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u00a0I love the title of this.\u00a0 It says, \"The Case for Kids:\u00a0 A Defense of the Large Family by a Six-Time 'Breeder.'\"<\/p>\n<p><strong>Leslie:<\/strong>\u00a0 Mm-hm, that's me\u2014okay, the \"Breeder\" is in quotation marks.\u00a0 You have to know that.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 But you had people kind of refer to you with disparaging comments like that; right?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Leslie:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes, right; that's right.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 And in your class, one day, you actually had one student refer to herself as a non-breeder?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Leslie:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes, and that's when I decided I had to write this article.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Tell me about that classroom.\u00a0 In what context does the student say, \"I'm a non-breeder\"?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Leslie:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, it was the first day of class in a writing class.\u00a0 I typically go around the room, and we start to get to know one another.\u00a0 \"What's your name, where do you work, what do you do?\"\u00a0 There were several women before her.\u00a0 They had said, \"I'm a mom, I have two kids, I work here, and I do this.\"\u00a0 By the time it came to this woman, she described herself as, \"Hi, I'm Rosa.\u00a0 I've been a truck driver, a commercial fisherwoman, and I'm <em>not<\/em> a breeder.\"<\/p>\n<p>The class went dead quiet.\u00a0 Everyone is looking at me with <em>big eyes<\/em> because everyone knows I have five children, at that point.\u00a0 You could have bottled that silence and sold it to noisy places.\u00a0 [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 She was saying it with a chip on her shoulder?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Leslie:<\/strong>\u00a0 Oh, absolutely.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 And your administrator\u2014when you told him you were pregnant with, what, number six\u2014had a real bad comment to make, at that point?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Leslie:<\/strong>\u00a0 Oh, yes; oh, yes.\u00a0 He just kind of laughed, you know, out the side of his mouth, and said, \"What?\u00a0 This is your\u2014what, ninth or tenth?\"<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes.\u00a0 So, what's the genesis, do you think, of this hostility toward children, or big families, or people like us in this room who have had five or six kids?\u00a0 Why are people so upset about it?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Leslie:<\/strong>\u00a0 I think there are a number of reasons.\u00a0 One is that there is sort of a general assumption that people who have large families are uneducated, and are sort of backward, and having lots of children simply because they don't know any better.<\/p>\n<p>I think there's a lot of attention and a lot of awareness\u2014sensitivity, now, to, of course, environmental issues.\u00a0 I think those are important issues that we need to attend to; but the fears of over-population, I think, are a very major part of that.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 I think the further our nation drifts from Christianity, the less we are going to view children from a biblical viewpoint\u2014that children are valuable; that lots of children in a family can be a blessing and were intended, by God, to be a blessing; and that children represent the future\u2014they represent our legacy\u2014they represent the spiritual leadership of the nation for the next generation.<\/p>\n<p>In fact, we don't need to look very far to see where this has led Europe.\u00a0 Europe is in a declining population where the replacement\u2014the number of children who are being born in many European countries is actually less than what it takes to sustain that nation.\u00a0 You have to ask the question, \u201cHow will that country exist, long-haul?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Throughout history, Christianity has been used to bring a right perspective about children\u2014not only protecting children\u2014but also valuing them for who they are.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 They are a blessing\u2014they are an inheritance from the Lord.\u00a0 I mean, the Scriptures never look at children as a liability.\u00a0 You can't find scriptural support for there being a liability to children, and having many is considered a blessing of God.\u00a0 Yet, when you are pregnant with your third, or your fourth, or your fifth, or your sixth\u2014especially in a culture that has been influenced heavily by feminism\u2014you had to feel some of the sting that you had violated your womanhood.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Leslie:<\/strong>\u00a0 Oh, absolutely.\u00a0 I had violated a number of social contracts.\u00a0 In an academic environment, of course, you don't have a lot of children.\u00a0 Often, I go to conferences, and I speak, and I travel to academic conferences.\u00a0 I will be the only woman, on the whole floor of the dorm\u2014I'll be, oftentimes, the only woman who has more than one child or more than two children.\u00a0 Many women will not have children or maybe they have one.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 And have you felt scorn toward you for a long period of time about that or was it\u2014did it get to five or six before you started feeling the scorn?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Leslie:<\/strong>\u00a0 No, you know, I have to say I've never felt <em>scorned<\/em> because once I get to know someone, and they get to know me\u2014when we're at that point in the conversation when they find out how many children I have, there is sort of a mutual respect.\u00a0 I think there's great curiosity.<\/p>\n<p>I remember one time at a conference, when I had four children.\u00a0 I became friends with a woman who was a poet.\u00a0 I found out later, over dinner, she was a lesbian.\u00a0 She found out, over dinner, that I had four children.\u00a0 She asked me, just in the most genuine way possible, she asked, \"Why do you have four children?\u00a0 Why do you have so many children?\"\u00a0 It wasn't a judgment; it was, like, \u201cExplain this to me.\u201d<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u201cI don't understand.\u201d<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u201cHelp me understand;\u201d yes.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Leslie:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u201cI don't understand.\u00a0 Help me understand this.\u201d\u00a0 My response, at the time\u2014you know, I had never thought this through to actually have a response\u2014but I think God gave me the words to say.\u00a0 I said something like, \"I love it when we sit down to eat.\u00a0 We hold hands around the table, and the circle is wide.\"\u00a0 She nodded.\u00a0 She understood what that meant about love, and fellowship, and about the strength in numbers.\u00a0 As a woman who lived alone\u2014who was alone\u2014I'm sure that that was something that she probably longed for and was trying to find in another way.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 You wrote, in the article that we've mentioned, that\u2014called \"The Case for Kids\"\u2014that there are movements afloat called \"Child-Free\" and \"Only One Child\".\u00a0 When we don't begin to value children for what they are\u2014a gift from God\u2014I think it really leads\u2014can lead a nation or a society to all kinds of abnormalities when it comes to their valuing children; don't you think?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Leslie:<\/strong>\u00a0 Oh, absolutely.\u00a0 If we look at our own lives and look at who we were before we had children and look at who we are now\u2014the transformation that occurs through the process of having children\u2014you know, in some ways, our lives feel as though they shrink because it requires so much energy and so much of yourself.\u00a0 You know, it's just this daily sort of pouring out of yourself to your children.\u00a0 In some ways, it feels like the boundaries\u2014the horizons of your life shrink; but in many other ways, you are so expanded.\u00a0 You are not a single person anymore.\u00a0 There are eight of you.\u00a0 You are this larger, deeper, wiser person because of having children.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 There may be some shrinking boundaries; but there is an enlarged heart, no doubt about it.\u00a0 [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 I\u2019m thinking about two scenes that stick out for me in the movie, <em>It\u2019s a Wonderful <\/em>Life\u2014my all-time favorite movie; right?\u00a0 Jimmy Stewart\u2019s had a lousy day.\u00a0 He\u2019s at the end of his rope.\u00a0 He comes home, and there are four kids around the house.\u00a0 One\u2019s practicing the piano, and another one is following him around, asking him questions.\u00a0 There\u2019s a point where he looks at his wife and he says, \u201cWhy did we have all these kids, anyway?\u201d\u00a0\u00a0 It is just that moment of frustration.<\/p>\n<p>Mary Ann and I have had those moments in our marriage where we\u2019ve looked at each other and said, \u201cWhy did we have all these kids anyway?\u201d\u00a0 We just recite the line from the movie.\u00a0 We do it really to just inject some humor into an otherwise tense situation and remind ourselves that, \u201cGod is in the midst of all of this and that these are a gift from God.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>But I also remember this\u2014I remember hearing John MacArthur, a number of years ago, talk about the difference in the family dynamic when there is one child versus five kids.\u00a0 He said if there is one child in the home, the day begins with Mom coming into the child's bedroom, and sitting down on the bed, and rubbing the child's back and saying, \"It's time to wake up, Sweetheart.\u00a0 What do you want Mommy to make you for breakfast today;\" you know?\u00a0 He said, \u201cWhen there are five kids, you're sitting around the table.\u00a0 You look at what you've got for dinner and you go, \"I don't like this.\"\u00a0 The kid next to you goes, \"Good!\" and starts eating off your plate.\u00a0 [Laughter]\u00a0 Or you come down.\u00a0 There are five bags of lunch to take to school.\u00a0 You go, \"Which one is mine?\"\u00a0 They say, \"It doesn't matter.\u00a0 Just take one.\"<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Right.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Now, obviously, parents can raise a single child to be a giving, generous person; but, boy, there is something about the dynamic of having four or five brothers and sisters\u2014where you have to learn what selflessness and sharing looks like.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Leslie:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right, it is a school of hard knocks, you know, for everyone; but what a wonderful school that is.\u00a0 In our family, we have an extra benefit; and that is we commercial fish in the summers.\u00a0 My kids all work together out in the ocean.\u00a0 You know, they run their own skiffs; and they\u2014one is the skipper, and one is the crew.<\/p>\n<p>You look at what my kids have learned by working together, by being together\u2014all the give and take that goes on\u2014and this whole blend of personalities, and quirks, and eccentricities, and strengths\u2014and it all\u2014in one sense, I'm sure an outsider looks in and they see chaos.\u00a0 But you know what?\u00a0 It all does make a kind of sense.\u00a0 We are all learning from each other\u2014even through the thick, the thin, the good, the bad\u2014the whole mass it is\u2014we are all being shaped and formed into who\u2014the kind of person\u2014God wants us to be.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Toffler wrote in his book called <em>The Third Wave<\/em> that one of the problems for teenage rebellion or causes of teenage rebellion was that children don't feel needed anymore.\u00a0 Your children are needed; they're valued; they are appreciated for how they help the family succeed in the family endeavor.\u00a0 Years ago, Bob, that would have happened on a farm.\u00a0 In your case, it happens on the ocean.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Leslie:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 But children really are valuable, and I have a confession to make.\u00a0 I don't think I've ever admitted this on the broadcast, Bob; but years ago, when we started FamilyLife, I rejected any photograph that had a husband and a wife with one child or two children.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 You're saying if there was going to be something in a brochure or something representing FamilyLife\u2014you didn't want the standard Photoshop<sup>\u00ae<\/sup> picture.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 I felt like the Christian community had\u2014hook, line, and sinker\u2014swallowed the bait of the culture of the world's view of children\u2014\u201cTwo and no more.\u201d\u00a0 The Bible speaks of children being a blessing, \u201cBlessed is he whose quiver is full of children.\"<\/p>\n<p>When I chose pictures, they didn't all have to have six or, you know, seven or eight.\u00a0 I\u2019m not saying that; and we're not saying, here on this broadcast, that every person is being called by God to have a large or big family; but we do think we need to all take a step back and say, \"What's your perspective of what God thinks about children and what should you think about them?\"<\/p>\n<p>When I got married to Barbara, I'd really never thought about children.\u00a0 I didn't even think about how many we'd have.\u00a0 I didn't really like children.\u00a0 When we started having them, I realized how much\u2014as you've said, Leslie\u2014they cause you to have to die to self\u2014and how with each child, there is more of self that has to yield to God and submit to Him so that you can love, and you can lead, and you can nurture, and you can pour your life into them.<\/p>\n<p>I'd have to say, \u201cBarbara and I have a lot of accomplishments.\u00a0 There is no greater privilege than being called \u2018Daddy\".\u00a0 None!\u00a0 I think, as we've chosen those pictures, Bob, that's what we're trying to convey.<\/p>\n<p>You got some negative fan mail, so to speak?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Hate mail\u2014<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 People didn't care for what you said in this article about having a large family.\u00a0 They thought you were saying everybody should have a large family.\u00a0 That's not what we're saying here.\u00a0 Why do you think people reacted so against your article?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Leslie:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, you know, I did get my very first piece of hate mail from this article.\u00a0 It was a very angry, vitriolic letter\u2014and the woman\u2014she actually misread the article and thought that I was\u2014yes, that I was saying <em>every<\/em> family should have six children\u2014every family should be like me.\u00a0 I would never make that argument because I don't think you can support that argument from Scripture even.<\/p>\n<p>But it was clear to me\u2014as I read the article\u2014and that she's calling me names, that she didn't have children.\u00a0 This was a place of great hurt in her life.\u00a0 So, I think that's really key\u2014when someone attacks you for this position, it's really easy to just sort of respond back in kind; but sometimes, people are not understanding what we're saying.\u00a0 Sometimes, people are coming from a place of great hurt in their own lives.\u00a0 We need to be compassionate and, I think, respond from compassion and kindness.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong> I've gotten to a point where, whenever I'm introducing myself and talking about my family, I'll say Mary Ann and I have been married for this number of years.\u00a0 I'll say we only had five children and just kind of go on, matter-of-factly\u2014but I'm just slipping in this, \"We only had five children.\"\u00a0 You'll hear a little snicker, out in the audience; and I'm not trying to suggest, either, that we need to have a dozen; right?\u00a0 But I am trying to say\u2014I know that sounds absurd, but you know what?\u00a0 There is a great joy.\u00a0 I mean, if God should bless you with that\u2014if that's what He calls you to\u2014here is what you'll miss. You'll miss\u2014<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 You can't even begin to get into the list!<\/p>\n<p><strong>Leslie:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>I know it!<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 If you have a lot of kids, you'll miss more meals out at restaurants because you just can't afford it.\u00a0 You'll miss your kids having the nicest shoes\u2014the nicest athletic shoes because you can't buy $100-a-pair shoes for six kids; right?\u00a0 You'll miss a lot of economic benefit that you might otherwise accrue\u2014some vacations that you go on that you stay in the Super 8<sup>\u00ae<\/sup> instead of in a nicer hotel, or you find somebody who can put you up\u2014right? \u2014because you just can't afford\u2014<\/p>\n<p>But what you gain is relationship.\u00a0 At the end of the day, when you sit down and say, \"Okay, here's the pros and here's the cons,\" \u2014the tennis shoes?\u00a0 Come on!\u00a0 The relationships, the love, the family, and the joy\u2014I mean, that's what you want in your retirement and your old age; isn't it?<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Last summer we had our family get-together.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 This is your children, their spouses, and your grandchildren.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 And our grandchildren.\u00a0 And the next time we get together\u2014<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 You'll have to rent an island.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, truthfully, how do you get that many people together?\u00a0 But you know what?\u00a0 The place we stayed had some pinball machines, some little basketball goals, card games going on.\u00a0 That was so much life taking place in the lives of those children and grandchildren.\u00a0 One of the great times we were together was Cousins Camp\u2014where we got all the cousins.\u00a0 I mean, it was all those ages three and older.\u00a0 We went on a wildflower-gathering trip, we got finger paints, we sat around, and Papa told a continuing story\u2014one of my favorites.\u00a0 You know? \u2014what fun to celebrate these great moments.<\/p>\n<p>I'm going to encourage our listeners to go to FamilyLife.com.\u00a0 There is a link on our website to this article at <em>Christianity Today<\/em>.\u00a0 In closing, Leslie, I want to read your last paragraph because it really is worth stating\u2014how you conclude your article.<\/p>\n<p>You say: \"Perhaps we need to hope that some of those in charge, some of those upon whom we will be dependent, will have been raised in large families.\u00a0 We will need to hope that these providers, caregivers, and government leaders can resist our culture's obsession with self and remember their families' lessons of tolerance and sympathy extended to all, especially those less able than themselves, knowing that, above all, the universe is not theirs alone.\"<\/p>\n<p>Well stated.\u00a0 Thanks for writing this article, and thanks for being obedient to fulfill God's call in your life and having six children.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Leslie:<\/strong>\u00a0 It's been a joy.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 I just want to be careful to make sure that our listeners understand what we\u2019re saying and what we\u2019re not saying here.\u00a0 We\u2019re not saying that we know how many children every family ought to have, or that you ought to have as many children as you possibly can.\u00a0 We\u2019re just saying children are a blessing, and we ought to have that mindset when it comes to our children.\u00a0 When it comes to being husbands and wives, we ought to see our children as a blessing rather than a liability or a limitation.\u00a0 I think that\u2019s clear.<\/p>\n<p>In fact, if folks would like to read the article you wrote, we\u2019ve got a link to it on our website at FamilyLifeToday.com.\u00a0 I\u2019m just going to mention the title of the article again.\u00a0 It\u2019s called \u201cThe Case for Kids: A Defense of the Large Family by a Six-Time \u2018Breeder\u2019.\u201d\u00a0 Again, go to FamilyLifeToday.com to link to that article written by Leslie Fields\u2014at FamilyLifeToday.com.<\/p>\n<p>Let me just say, we\u2019ve also got a book I want to encourage those of you who are younger married couples\u2014you\u2019ve been married a couple of years\u2014you haven\u2019t started your family yet\u2014I want to challenge you to read a book by Candice Watters called <em>Start Your Family.<\/em><em>\u00a0 <\/em>It\u2019s a book where she makes a case, and I think a solid case, for why young couples should step out and start having kids.<\/p>\n<p>Again, you can find out more about that book when you go to FamilyLifeToday.com, as well; or you can call to order a copy from us:\u00a0 1-800-FL-TODAY is our number.\u00a0 That\u2019s 1-800-FL-TODAY.\u00a0 Let me just say this is not a book that I would encourage mothers and fathers to give to their adult children as a Christmas gift.\u00a0 Don\u2019t give them a copy of the book <em>Start Your Family.<\/em>\u00a0 Just let them find that one on their own; okay? \u2014alright.<\/p>\n<p>I want to read to you an email we got from a listener, not long ago\u2014a listener in Arizona\u2014who said:<\/p>\n<p>You guys have ministered to me a lot over the last six months.\u00a0 We have two children; and I have been in a sort of survival mode for the last several months\u2014many days just making sure everybody is fed, loved, diapers changed.\u00a0 Then, I plop into bed, at the first opportunity, and get as much sleep as possible.<\/p>\n<p>When our son was just a few weeks old, I found your program on the radio; and it\u2019s been a great blessing.\u00a0 In fact, recently, my local radio station accidentally played another program in your time slot; and I immediately called the program manager, almost in a panic, thinking you might have discontinued airing your program.\u00a0 <em>FamilyLife Today <\/em>is my bread and butter\u2014constant encouragement and input every weekday.\u00a0 You guys keep me going.<\/p>\n<p>I just thought you\u2019d want to know that there are some young moms out here who almost panic at the thought of not having your program on the station every day.\u00a0 You are making a difference.<\/p>\n<p>Well, I tell you, we had to smile when we got that email\u2014just the picture it conjured up, in our minds, about what\u2019s going on in a lot of homes\u2014but it also sobered us a little bit because, in recent days, <em>FamilyLife Today <\/em>has seen a decline in donations from radio listeners.\u00a0 As a result, we are having to make some tough decisions about things to slow down on, things to stop, some things we\u2019re going to have to discontinue or set aside for a while.<\/p>\n<p>Depending on what happens, here at the end of 2012, we may have to make some tough decisions about whether <em>FamilyLife Today <\/em>can continue on some of the stations that are currently airing the program. That\u2019s why we want to ask you, at the end of this year, to be as generous as you can be in making a yearend donation to support <em>FamilyLife Today. <\/em>Not only will it help us out, but there is also an opportunity for your donation to be doubled, between now and the end of the year.<\/p>\n<p>We have some friends who have come forward and have put together a matching-gift fund.\u00a0 They are matching every donation we receive, dollar-for-dollar, up to a total of $3.6 million, between now and the end of the year. That matching fund, in fact, may be growing.\u00a0 We\u2019ve been approached recently by some folks who would like to increase the size of the matching fund.\u00a0 So, we\u2019ll keep you posted on that; but the good news is that, right now, when you make a donation, it will be doubled.<\/p>\n<p>Consider going online at FamilyLifeToday.com; click the button that says, \u201cI CARE\u201d, to make an online donation.\u00a0 Or call us at 1-800-FL-TODAY.\u00a0 Make a donation over the phone.\u00a0 We just want you to know how much we appreciate your joining with us, and we look forward to hearing from you.<\/p>\n<p>We hope you can join us back again tomorrow.\u00a0 Author and speaker Jim Keller is going to be with us.\u00a0 We\u2019re going to talk about an upside down marriage.\u00a0 He says that\u2019s a good thing.\u00a0 So, it may be different than what you\u2019re thinking about when you think about an upside down marriage.\u00a0 We\u2019ll talk it about it tomorrow.\u00a0 Hope you can tune in for that.<\/p>\n<p>I want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch, and our entire broadcast production team.\u00a0 On behalf of our host, Dennis Rainey, I'm Bob Lepine.\u00a0 We will see you back next time for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.<\/p>\n<p><em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas.<\/p>\n<p>Help for today.\u00a0 Hope for tomorrow.<\/p>\n<p>We are so happy to provide these transcripts to you.\u00a0 However, there is a cost to produce them for our website.\u00a0 If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?<\/p>\n<p>Copyright <sup>\u00a9<\/sup> 2012 FamilyLife.\u00a0 All rights reserved.<\/p>\n<p><a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/\">www.FamilyLife.com<\/a><\/p>\n<p>1<\/p>\n","theme_header_position":"Sticky","post_header_is_sticky":"default","is_header_overlay":"0"},"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast\/302652","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/podcast"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/91"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=302652"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/294104"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=302652"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=302652"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=302652"},{"taxonomy":"podcast_series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast_series?post=302652"},{"taxonomy":"cwp_profile","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/cwp_profile?post=302652"},{"taxonomy":"series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/series?post=302652"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}