{"id":302500,"date":"2012-04-12T11:00:00","date_gmt":"2012-04-12T15:00:00","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/%series%\/even-the-wounded-can-help-to-heal-others\/"},"modified":"2012-04-12T11:00:00","modified_gmt":"2012-04-12T15:00:00","slug":"even-the-wounded-can-help-to-heal-others","status":"publish","type":"podcast","link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/even-the-wounded-can-help-to-heal-others\/","title":{"rendered":"Even the Wounded Can Help to Heal Others"},"content":{"rendered":"","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Donald Miller talks openly about how his &#8220;lack of an earthly father&#8221; marked him growing up, and still affects him today.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":91,"featured_media":294104,"menu_order":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","template":"","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","inline_featured_image":false,"_uag_custom_page_level_css":"","episode_type":"","audio_file":"https:\/\/web.familylifetoday.com\/fl2012-04-12.mp3","cover_image":"","cover_image_id":"","duration":"00:","filesize":"23.41M","filesize_raw":"24546796","date_recorded":"","explicit":"","block":""},"categories":[2826],"tags":[5205,4698],"podcast_series":[7483],"cwp_profile":[9037],"series":[2101],"class_list":["post-302500","podcast","type-podcast","status-publish","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-men","tag-fatherless","tag-manhood","podcast_series-to-own-a-dragon","cwp_profile-donald-miller","series-familylife-today"],"acf":[],"episode_featured_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/09\/FLT-Podcast-Cover-2-508x508-3.jpg?w=508","episode_player_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2023\/02\/image-scaled.jpg","download_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-download\/302500\/even-the-wounded-can-help-to-heal-others","player_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-player\/302500\/even-the-wounded-can-help-to-heal-others","audio_player":null,"episode_data":{"playerMode":"light","subscribeUrls":{"apple_podcasts":{"key":"apple_podcasts","url":"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303?mt=2&app=podcast","label":"Apple Podcasts","class":"apple_podcasts","icon":"apple-podcasts.png"},"google_podcasts":{"key":"google_podcasts","url":"","label":"Google Podcasts","class":"google_podcasts","icon":"google-podcasts.png"},"spotify":{"key":"spotify","url":"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm","label":"Spotify","class":"spotify","icon":"spotify.png"},"youtube":{"key":"youtube","url":"","label":"YouTube","class":"youtube","icon":"youtube.png"}},"rssFeedUrl":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/feed\/podcast\/familylife-today","embedCode":"<blockquote class=\"wp-embedded-content\" data-secret=\"4w9o4nuDUS\"><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/even-the-wounded-can-help-to-heal-others\/\">Even the Wounded Can Help to Heal Others<\/a><\/blockquote><iframe sandbox=\"allow-scripts\" security=\"restricted\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/even-the-wounded-can-help-to-heal-others\/embed\/#?secret=4w9o4nuDUS\" width=\"500\" height=\"350\" title=\"&#8220;Even the Wounded Can Help to Heal Others&#8221; &#8212; FamilyLife\u00ae - A Cru Ministry\" data-secret=\"4w9o4nuDUS\" frameborder=\"0\" marginwidth=\"0\" marginheight=\"0\" scrolling=\"no\" class=\"wp-embedded-content\"><\/iframe><script>\n\/*! This file is auto-generated *\/\n!function(d,l){\"use strict\";l.querySelector&&d.addEventListener&&\"undefined\"!=typeof URL&&(d.wp=d.wp||{},d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage||(d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage=function(e){var t=e.data;if((t||t.secret||t.message||t.value)&&!\/[^a-zA-Z0-9]\/.test(t.secret)){for(var s,r,n,a=l.querySelectorAll('iframe[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),o=l.querySelectorAll('blockquote[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),c=new RegExp(\"^https?:$\",\"i\"),i=0;i<o.length;i++)o[i].style.display=\"none\";for(i=0;i<a.length;i++)s=a[i],e.source===s.contentWindow&&(s.removeAttribute(\"style\"),\"height\"===t.message?(1e3<(r=parseInt(t.value,10))?r=1e3:~~r<200&&(r=200),s.height=r):\"link\"===t.message&&(r=new URL(s.getAttribute(\"src\")),n=new URL(t.value),c.test(n.protocol))&&n.host===r.host&&l.activeElement===s&&(d.top.location.href=t.value))}},d.addEventListener(\"message\",d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage,!1),l.addEventListener(\"DOMContentLoaded\",function(){for(var e,t,s=l.querySelectorAll(\"iframe.wp-embedded-content\"),r=0;r<s.length;r++)(t=(e=s[r]).getAttribute(\"data-secret\"))||(t=Math.random().toString(36).substring(2,12),e.src+=\"#?secret=\"+t,e.setAttribute(\"data-secret\",t)),e.contentWindow.postMessage({message:\"ready\",secret:t},\"*\")},!1)))}(window,document);\n\/\/# sourceURL=https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-includes\/js\/wp-embed.min.js\n<\/script>\n"},"spectra_custom_meta":{"_wp_page_template":["default"],"transcript_url":["https:\/\/transcript.familylifetoday.com\/fl2012-04-12.pdf"],"audio_file":["https:\/\/web.familylifetoday.com\/fl2012-04-12.mp3"],"transcript_content":["<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 There is a longing, deep in the heart of a boy, for his father\u2019s approval.\u00a0 Here\u2019s Donald Miller.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0Being a writer, there are times you\u2019re really alone.\u00a0 You\u2019re five chapters into a book\u2014nobody else has read it\u2014all the voices are saying, \u201cYou\u2019ve gone down the wrong trail,\u201d \u201cIt\u2019s not working out,\u201d \u201cIt\u2019s not going to be good.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI remember writing this book.\u00a0 It was late one night\u2014shut down the computer.\u00a0 I wanted my dad to walk through the door, right then, and say it was going to be okay, and say that I was good at this, and that I needed to keep working on it\u2014and realized, very deep, emotionally, \u201cThis will never, ever happen,\u201d\u2014that he wasn't going to.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 This is <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> for Thursday, April 12<sup>th<\/sup>.\u00a0 Our host is the President of FamilyLife<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>, Dennis Rainey, and I\u2019m Bob Lepine.\u00a0 What do you do, as a young man, when you grew up, never having heard your father say, \u201cWell done, son\u201d?\u00a0 We\u2019ll find out today.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd welcome to <em>FamilyLife Today.<\/em><em>\u00a0 <\/em>Thanks for joining us.\u00a0 You know, you can\u2019t just point to two things happening at the same time and say, \u201cWell, one caused the other\u201d; right?\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014but you do have to look at kind of our social pathologies, as a nation today, and the fact that there are a lot of absent dads in homes today.\u00a0 Then, you have to look at Malachi, Chapter 4, where God says, \u201cThe hearts of the fathers are going to be turned back to their sons; lest I come and smite the land with a curse.\u201d\u00a0 It leaves you scratching your head and saying, \u201cAre we reaping the bitter fruit of dads who have left their assignment, left their post, and this is what we\u2019ve got?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Bob, I was in a briefing at the White House\u2014I don't know, it\u2019s been a couple of years ago now.\u00a0 I had some of those same thoughts as I listened to why government has put together, and all of the things government is trying to patch, and prevent, and protect, and keep wired together all because of the family breakdown\u2014and a good part of them because dads are not dads and fathers to their children.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe ran across a book and invited the author of that book, Don Miller, to join us.\u00a0 I want to welcome you back, Don.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 It\u2019s good to be back!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Don, you grew up in a home without a father.\u00a0 To supplement that, or to try to fit together the pieces that were missing in your life, you connected with a handful of mentors over your adult life.\u00a0 One of the families was the McMurray family\u2014John McMurray co-authored this book with you\u2014and you spent about four years with them.\u00a0 You write a paragraph\u2014and I want you to answer this question, though, that you write about in your book.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou said, \u201cThe McMurray family dynamics allowed me to picture what should have existed in my own life.\u00a0 It\u2019s not that I wanted John to pick me up and set me on his lap, but it did make me wonder why God would allow me to grow up without a father saying he loved me or was glad I was around.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to ask you, Don\u2014you\u2019ve now written a book.\u00a0 You\u2019ve now spent a couple of years, reflecting on your lack of a relationship with your father.\u00a0 What\u2019s your answer to that question?\u00a0 Why did God allow that?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, that\u2019s one of the toughest questions that we deal with.\u00a0 I can only tell you what comforted me, in my not getting an answer to that question.\u00a0 It was a year ago, Father\u2019s Day.\u00a0 It was a very, very difficult time for me.\u00a0 I was wrapping up this book\u2014had spent a year thinking about all the stuff that I didn\u2019t know because I grew up without a dad\u2014and the ways I was trying to deal with that\u2014and offering hope to people, and\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Let\u2019s say, at this point, your father stepped out of your life, when you were about two\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014when I was about two.\u00a0 So, it had been a long time.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI was reading a book\u2014now, remember, I\u2019m having a difficult time.\u00a0 You know, just before Father\u2019s Day\u2014and I was reading a book by Antjie Krog called <em>Country of My Skull.<\/em><em>\u00a0 <\/em>The book was about the Truth and Reconciliation Commission in South Africa.\u00a0 Bishop Tutu was asked by the government, \u201cWho should be on this Truth and Reconciliation Commission?\u201d (the commission that was going to reconcile the government, post-Apartheid).\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThese people, who had been oppressed, many of them murdered, horrible things had taken place\u2014and Bishop Tutu said\u2014he said, \u201cThe people who should be on this commission should be victims, legitimate victims, who have had their lives ripped apart by the atrocities of Apartheid\u2014but not arrogant victims, instead, wounded healers.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe difference between an arrogant victim and a wounded healer is what has happened to them spiritually.\u00a0 A wounded healer has a deeply-buttressed spiritual life, and I was done at that point because the book sets up pages and pages of descriptions of these awful things that\u2014the atrocities that had happened to these people.\u00a0 Here is Bishop Tutu\u2014and he comes in, and he says, \u201cDo not be an arrogant victim.\u00a0 I\u2019m going to call you out of that.\u00a0 God does not want you to stay there.\u00a0 You offend God if you stay a victim.\u00a0 He is giving you hope, and you slap Him in the face if you don\u2019t take that hope.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhile there is a reality of having grown up without a father\u2014and this is not to be compared to the atrocities that were faced in the Apartheid regime but\u2014I'm sitting here, going, \u201cBoy, I can\u2019t believe I\u2019m sitting here, feeling like a victim, having grown up without a dad, when God offers me mentors, He offers me relationships, He offers me wisdom through the church, He offers me wisdom in Scripture, He offers me His own Fatherhood, His own guidance.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAll of this hope is offered to me by God.\u00a0 \u201cWhy God would let this happen?\u201d\u00a0 I still don\u2019t have an answer to that.\u00a0 Of course, it goes into free will and some pretty deep theological ideas.\u00a0 However, the question becomes less pointed to me in the face of the hope in the answers that He offers.\u00a0 Does that make sense?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Mmm-Hmm.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>I think I hit that point, and the question wasn\u2019t as important.\u00a0 I mean, there was so much goodness being offered by God that I just said, \u201cMan, I\u2019m taking advantage of that.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 It\u2019s all about the Gospel\u2014that the Gospel came for broken people\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014and we\u2019re all broken at certain levels, some more visible than others.\u00a0 It\u2019s just more public that you grew up in a home where your father wasn\u2019t there, and you suffered certain wounds as a result of that.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Frankly, I love the illustration you just made because I believe that\u2019s what the Gospel calls us out of.\u00a0 He calls us out of our arrogance and calls us to submit to Him.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Who would have thought that sitting there and saying, \u201cI grew up without a dad, and this is awful,\u201d was arrogance?\u00a0 But as soon as you embrace the hope that God offers you, you look back and you go, \u201cMan!\u00a0 That was arrogance.\u00a0 That was a form of pride.\u201d\u00a0 You wouldn't think of it, in the moment; but it was to me.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 If you think of us, as a nation, that has, at many points, become a nation of victims, there is a degree of\u2014and you hate to say this because\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014because people have been wounded deeply.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, they have.\u00a0 The things that have occurred to them are not right\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014but to hold onto that and to not forgive is ultimately to be a prisoner; isn\u2019t it?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 You actually wrote about that in a chapter in your book\u2014how you had to forgive.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes, you can\u2019t\u2014I just saw a billboard, past a church, the other day, right by my house\u2014the billboard simply said, \u201cHatred is too heavy a burden to carry.\u201d\u00a0 I thought, \u201cThat\u2019s so very true of so many things;\u201d but ultimately, yes, I had to forgive.\u00a0 I had to let go. I had to move on.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThen, what I loved about what Tutu said was, \u201cHe gave me dignity in the pain.\u201d\u00a0 I mean, he said, \u201cThere are two camps here.\u00a0 One is arrogant victim; the other is wounded healer.\u00a0 Choose.\u00a0 Choose which one you're going to become.\u201d\u00a0 I just said, \u201cI don\u2019t want to be an arrogant victim.\u00a0 I don\u2019t want to sit around and say, \u2018I grew up without a dad; so, I\u2019m going to go mess up my life.\u2019\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to be the wounded healer, which means a couple of things.\u00a0 It means\u2014one:\u00a0 that I deal with reality.\u00a0 \u201cThis actually happened to me.\u00a0 There\u2019s stuff that I\u2019m missing.\u00a0 I need to figure out what I'm missing.\u00a0 I\u2019m going to be very intentional and aggressive about doing so.\u201d\u00a0 Then, also, \u201cI need to turn around, and I need to help somebody who is dealing with this same thing.\u00a0 As people have helped me, I need to turn around and help other people.\u201d\u00a0 That\u2019s what a wounded healer does.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe wonderful thing that Tutu said was, \u201cThese people have an education toward empathy.\u00a0 They are the only people who actually understand the pain\u201d\u2014of Apartheid, he's talking about.\u00a0 Then, I thought, \u201cBoy, what a beautiful thing that God would say, \u2018Don, I'm going to give you an education about what it feels like, means\u2019\u201d\u2014the whole bit\u2014\u201c\u2018of growing up without a father so that I can raise you up in the wisdom of the church and wisdom of mentors\u2019\u201d\u2014not that I'm perfect, I\u2019m about ten years behind, usually\u2014\u201c\u2018but then, turn around, and you\u2019re going to be able to give, from a position of authority, wisdom, and counsel to those who are in that same situation.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Second Corinthians, Chapter 1, talks about how we are to comfort one another with the comfort that we\u2019ve received from God.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 That\u2019s what you\u2019re talking about here.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 That\u2019s exactly what I\u2019m talking about.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 As you were sharing that story, I couldn\u2019t help but think back to the question, \u201cWhy would God allow it?\u201d\u00a0 We can\u2019t always answer all the \u201cwhy\u201d questions; but Romans 8:28\u2014and I don\u2019t want to apply, and slap this verse, and laminate it, as many Christians can\u2014almost like a trite Christian saying\u2014but it does say, \u201cAll things work together for good to those who love God and are called according to His purpose.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI\u2019m thinking of your life, Don, after reading of the pain and of the loss, and I can\u2019t even\u2014I have to tell you\u2014I can\u2019t even imagine 22 years of silence. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 You\u2019ve already said that your dad left when you were two.\u00a0 You last saw him when you were 12.\u00a0 There were just a few encounters between two and 12.\u00a0 Now, when he left at two, you didn\u2019t know he\u2019d been around.\u00a0 I mean, you\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 No, I have no memory of him in the house.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 What happened in those few encounters?\u00a0 Who were you meeting with?\u00a0 What did you know about this guy?\u00a0 That last encounter, when you were 12 years old, how were you processing that, as a young man?\u00a0 What was going on?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, there was a big difference between the last encounter and the previous encounters.\u00a0 I really adored my dad, early on.\u00a0 I mean, I loved the fact that he had this really rough beard; and he would buy us the best Christmas presents.\u00a0 Of course, he was never around for rest of the year, but you don\u2019t process that as a kid.\u00a0 You just process this great guy who comes in.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNot the greatest figure\u2014I have a memory of being in a bar.\u00a0 My sister and I, only six and seven years old, sitting in a bar, while my dad was drinking\u2014I have that memory.\u00a0 I have a memory of sitting on his lap, steering his car.\u00a0 If you were steering the car, you got to drink from his beer, driving down the road.\u00a0 These are memories that I have of my father.\u00a0 I think, getting older, there were only two or three visits.\u00a0 Those were the memories from those visits.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThen, the last visit, when I was in junior high.\u00a0 I\u2019m getting a little older.\u00a0 I\u2019m realizing there\u2019s not a lot of safety and security here.\u00a0 I just remember driving out to this restaurant, my sister and I, to have lunch with my dad\u2014and the whole time, kind of looking out the window for the nearest pay phone or for an escape route if something\u2014if he were to try to kidnap me or something like that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHe brought us home, and it was fine.\u00a0 We never heard from him again after that.\u00a0 Part of me thinks that one of the reasons I never heard from him again was because of that moment\u2014this sense of, \u201cMy kids are actually old enough to realize that this isn\u2019t good or normal,\u201d and that, maybe, \u201cI\u2019m not a good guy.\u201d\u00a0\u00a0 We just never heard from him again.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 He didn\u2019t say, \u201cI'm moving.\u00a0 I\u2019m going to\u201d\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>No, nothing, not to my mom, not to anybody.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 That was just the last lunch?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 That was it.\u00a0 That was the last\u2014I never saw him again.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Did you ever think, at 13 or 14, \u201cI wonder why Dad hasn\u2019t called?\u201d<br>\u00a0\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Not at 13 or 14, more like 24 or 25.\u00a0 It was a long\u2014again, it\u2019s hard for people to understand that only having hours\u2014I mean two\/three days with my father my whole life\u2014you don\u2019t\u2014you miss him\u2014but you miss him more in biochemical ways, in the elephant sense of not figuring\u2014not knowing how to do\u2014but you don\u2019t connect that to the fact that you grew up without a dad.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt wasn\u2019t until\u2014again, I was in my mid-20s and moved in with John that I realized my father wasn\u2019t there.\u00a0 That\u2019s when I began processing and wondering, \u201cI wonder where he is, and I wonder why he never called?\u00a0 Well, if he doesn\u2019t want anything to do with me, I don\u2019t want anything to do with him.\u201d\u00a0 Those sorts of ideas occurred to me later.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 There are a lot of our listeners who have heard you describe this and you kind of touch on this, Don; but I want to ask you to go to the very core, if you can.\u00a0 What do you miss most about not having a dad, growing up?\u00a0 I\u2019m not talking about writing the checkbook.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 You know what I mean?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 I\u2019m talking about in the soul.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 It hit home writing this book in a very deep, pretty painful way.\u00a0 It was the week before Father\u2019s Day.\u00a0 I\u2019m working on a book about growing up without a dad.\u00a0 You know, being a writer, it\u2019s a great life.\u00a0 I don\u2019t want any other life, but there are times you\u2019re really alone.\u00a0 You\u2019re five chapters into a book\u2014nobody else has read it\u2014all the voices are saying, \u201cYou\u2019ve gone down the wrong trail,\u201d \u201cIt\u2019s not working out,\u201d\u00a0 \u201cIt\u2019s not going to be good.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI remember writing this book about growing up without a dad.\u00a0 It was late one night\u2014shut down the computer.\u00a0 I\u2019m not a big weep-guy\u2014you know, maybe once every few years or something\u2014and realized, very deep, emotionally, that I wanted my dad to walk through the door, right then, and say that it was going to be okay, and say that I was good at this, and that I needed to keep working on it.\u00a0 It was a realization that he wasn\u2019t going to.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI mean, that was it.\u00a0 This will never, ever happen.\u00a0 That struck pretty deep.\u00a0 I laid on my bed, and put my head on my pillow, and I just wept.\u00a0 I probably wept for an hour\u2014an hour-and-a-half.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 A true cry of anguish?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Of loss?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes, I mean, beyond\u2014it\u2019s beyond self-pity.\u00a0 It was this sense of, \u201cYou will live with this for all eternity,\u201d kind of a feeling, you know\u2014I mean, a very hopeless place.\u00a0 I think God had to bring me there in order for me to read the words of Bishop Tutu to say, \u201cDon, now, that you realize what you\u2019re without, you have a choice.\u00a0 You can be an arrogant victim or a wounded healer.\u00a0 What do you choose?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 You\u2019ve had people say to you that the deficit in a relationship with an earthly father\u2014which all of us have had\u2014nobody had a perfect earthly father\u2014but that God is the One Who is our perfect Heavenly Father.\u00a0 The deficit of the earthly father is compensated for\u2014it\u2019s made up for\u2014by the Heavenly Father.\u00a0 Do you think that\u2019s right?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 No, I don\u2019t think it\u2019s right\u2014anymore than, I think, that the deficit of a marriage relationship for us men\u2014a marriage relationship with a woman is made up for by God.\u00a0 It isn\u2019t.\u00a0 Neither is the relationship you can have with a dog, or the relationship you can have with a piece of turkey, you know, or something.\u00a0 (Laughter)\u00a0 It just isn\u2019t.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tGod has created these things.\u00a0 One of the metaphors we can use to understand God, as He has instructed us in Scripture, is the metaphor of a father.\u00a0 God says, \u201cI will father you.\u00a0 I am fathering you.\u201d\u00a0 \u201cOur Father, Who art in heaven,\u201d Jesus tells us to pray.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhat happens is my earthly dad becomes a metaphor for me to understand who God is\u2014as does, my wife, if I am married.\u00a0 Then, I look at this and say, \u201cWell, this helps me understand this relationship that I have with Jesus\u2014this whole relationship with the Trinity.\u00a0 Our sons, our daughters, become ways that we understand from God\u2019s perspective about how He feels about us.\u00a0 There are all of these living metaphors that take place, but you can\u2019t replace an earthly father.\u00a0 You can\u2019t do it.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think that there\u2019s a lot of hope in Scripture\u2014God fathering us.\u00a0 There\u2019s a lot of hope in mentoring relationships; but ultimately, there will always be that wound there.\u00a0 If the wound isn\u2019t there, then, fathers really aren\u2019t that important in the first place; are they?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 As I listen to you talk, I reflect back on just what you said a few moments ago about\u2014that you\u2019ll never, ever hear the words of affirmation\u2014that, \u201cIt\u2019s going to be okay,\u201d from your dad.\u00a0 It\u2019s interesting that the first words heard about Jesus Christ from His Heavenly Father occurred when He was being baptized by John the Baptist, \u201cThis is My Beloved Son\u201d\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014\u201cin whom I am well pleased.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014\u201cin whom I am well pleased.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Words of affirmation.\u00a0 You know, you don\u2019t think of Jesus needing to hear that from His Father; but His Heavenly Father did say it.\u00a0 Didn\u2019t He?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 He did.\u00a0 It\u2019s interesting that we would say, \u201cWe don\u2019t think of Jesus needing to hear that,\u201d because the assumption is that if Jesus needs affirmation from God, then, He\u2019s not perfect\u2014because perfect is independence; but God doesn\u2019t live in independence.\u00a0 He lives in community.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tGod\u2019s idea of perfection is\u2014\u201cNo, no, no.\u00a0 Perfection is not isolation and independence\u201d\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 There you go.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014\u201cPerfection is marriage and relational dynamics.\u201d\u00a0 You know, for the guys who are growing up without dads, who grew up without dads, who are listening to this\u2014I think that the thing I want to say to you is, \u201cIndependence and, \u2018I can make it on my own, and I\u2019m not going to trust authority\u2019 is not perfect.\u00a0 It\u2019s not a good system.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe have to realize that we missed something when we grew up without a dad.\u00a0 We have to take responsibility and do something about that so that we don\u2019t do this to our own children.\u00a0 Because if it is modeled for me\u2014that what happens in a marriage\u2014\u201cWhen it gets tough, is you leave\u201d\u2014then, \u201cWhen I get into a marriage and it gets tough, I\u2019m going to leave.\u201d\u00a0 That\u2019s what was modeled.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 I have to be very intentional about breaking that cycle.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>One of the greatest risks a man ever takes is relationships.\u00a0 No doubt about it, but the greater risk\u2014even greater than a relationship\u2014is living alone.\u00a0 I\u2019m telling you, \u201cIsolation for any man\u201d\u2014whether single or married, whether he is married and has no children, or he is married and has children\u2014\u201cthe greater risk is to go alone and to cut your heart off from your children.\u201d\u00a0 Instead, you need to take a simpler risk.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt\u2019s still a risk.\u00a0 It involves great fear and great challenge.\u00a0 For many men, I\u2019m convinced terror; but they need to risk a relationship with their sons and their daughters because their children need those words of affirmation, like you longed to hear from your earthly father.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Typically, when a writer is working on a book like this, he has somebody in mind that he\u2019s writing to or for.\u00a0 Were you writing this in hopes that other guys who grew up without a father could say, \u201cYes, somebody understands;\u201d or were you writing this so that fathers could understand the impact they can have\u2014that your father didn\u2019t have in your life?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 I\u2019m amazed at how much response I\u2019ve received from fathers telling me that they have learned something from the book or learned the importance of their role in their kids\u2019 life.\u00a0 I\u2019m blessed by that.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI wrote the book, however, to young men, growing up without dads.\u00a0 In fact, specifically, kind of a neat story\u2014I had read this statistic that 85 percent of the guys in prison grow up without dads.\u00a0 I wrote the book for guys in prison.\u00a0 I mean, I sat down and said, \u201cOkay, if I\u2019m in a jail cell, and I\u2019ve got nothing to do for the next 20 years, \u2018What do I need to hear?\u2019\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI wrote the book for those guys.\u00a0 Interestingly enough, I went into this relationship with NAV Press<sup>\u00ae<\/sup> saying, \u201cHey, if there is anything that we can do to get many, many copies of these books into prison for free, let\u2019s do it.\u201d\u00a0 Of course, there\u2019s a lot of bureaucracy involved in that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWell, we went\u2014I e-mailed the book to the publisher.\u00a0 We went to press and printed 45,000 copies of the book, with the wrong last chapter.\u00a0 The publisher decided, \u201cIt\u2019s important enough that we throw these books away\u201d\u201445,000 books\u2014\u201cand reprint and get it right.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tJohn and I, the co-author, were able to call them and say, \u201cHey, you know, these 45,000 books?\u00a0 I mean, it\u2019s just a couple of pages, but there\u2019s some stuff in there that we wanted to cut out for efficiency\u2019s sake.\u00a0 What if we were able to give those to prisons?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe publisher, you know, a light bulb went off and said, \u201cThat\u2019s exactly what we\u2019ll do.\u201d\u00a0 They boxed them up and were able to distribute the book for free.\u00a0 Before anybody else could get their hands on it, prisoners got their hands on it. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe whole time I\u2019m writing, I\u2019m praying, \u201cGod, get this into the hands of prisoners.\u201d\u00a0 You know, it\u2019s great that people are going to be able to walk into a bookstore and get it.\u00a0 I\u2019m very glad, but what about these guys who just\u2014they are not going to be able to do that.\u00a0 \u201cCan we get this book into their hands?\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 I don\u2019t want to stretch the metaphor, but there\u2019s a sense in which a lot of guys, who didn\u2019t grow up with a dad\u2014they may not be behind bars, but they may still be prisoners to some of the emotions that they have wrestled with.\u00a0 You\u2019ve addressed it in a new book, as well.\u00a0 You wrote a book called <em>Father Fiction<\/em> that is now available, and we\u2019ve got it in our <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> Resource Center.\u00a0 You can go online at FamilyLifeToday.com for more information on the book that Don has written.\u00a0 Again, it\u2019s called <em>Father Fiction<\/em>.\u00a0 Go to FamilyLifeToday.com for more information.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI should also mention that the book that you are probably best-known for, <em>Blue Like Jazz<\/em>, has just been made into a major motion picture that is releasing in theaters this weekend.\u00a0 I haven\u2019t had a chance to see it yet, but I\u2019ll be anxious to see what the response to that movie is.\u00a0 Again, if folks want more information on your book, <em>Father Fiction<\/em>, go to our website, FamilyLifeToday.com; or give us a call toll-free at 1-800-358-6329.\u00a0 That\u2019s 1-800- \u201cF\u201d as in family, \u201cL\u201d as in life, and then, the word, \u201cTODAY\u201d.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI was thinking about the subject we\u2019ve been talking about today and the subject of your book.\u00a0 Dennis, I was thinking about the devotional guide that your wife Barbara just finished writing, called <em>Growing Together in Forgiveness<\/em>.\u00a0 The reality is all of us are going to have to deal with the issue of forgiveness in our lifetime.\u00a0 There are going to be people who wrong us, and we\u2019re going to have to forgive them because that\u2019s what the Bible calls us to.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBarbara has put together a devotional so that families can read seven very compelling stories about the subject of forgiveness and see what it looks like and understand the nobility of forgiving someone else.\u00a0 Barbara\u2019s devotional guide is our gift to you this week when you help support the ministry of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> with a donation.\u00a0 We are listener-supported.\u00a0 We appreciate your financial support of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou can make a donation online at FamilyLifeToday.com.\u00a0 Click the button that says, \u201cI Care\u201d.\u00a0\u00a0 When you make an online donation, we\u2019ll automatically send you a copy of Barbara\u2019s new devotional book; or call us toll-free at 1-800-FL-TODAY.\u00a0 Make a donation over the phone; and be sure to request a copy of the book, <em>Growing Together in Forgiveness<\/em>, when you get in touch with us.\u00a0 Let me say, \u201cThanks,\u201d in advance for your support.\u00a0 We really do appreciate your partnership with us, here in the ministry of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe want to encourage you to be back with us again tomorrow.\u00a0 We are going to talk with Donald Miller about how, when a young boy grows up without a dad helping to point him in the right direction, he can wind up being confused about what it means to be a man.\u00a0 We\u2019ll talk about that tomorrow.\u00a0 Hope you can tune in.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch, and our entire broadcast production team.\u00a0 On behalf of our host, Dennis Rainey, I'm Bob Lepine.\u00a0 We will see you back next time for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHelp for today.\u00a0 Hope for tomorrow.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you.\u00a0 However, there is a cost to produce them for our website.\u00a0 If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright \u00a9 2012 FamilyLife.\u00a0 All rights reserved.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/\">www.FamilyLife.com<\/a>\u00a0 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Miller talks openly about how his \"lack of an earthly father\" marked him growing up, and still affects him today.","meta_box":{"show_notes":"","transcript_url":"https:\/\/transcript.familylifetoday.com\/fl2012-04-12.pdf","transcript_content":"<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 There is a longing, deep in the heart of a boy, for his father\u2019s approval.\u00a0 Here\u2019s Donald Miller.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0Being a writer, there are times you\u2019re really alone.\u00a0 You\u2019re five chapters into a book\u2014nobody else has read it\u2014all the voices are saying, \u201cYou\u2019ve gone down the wrong trail,\u201d \u201cIt\u2019s not working out,\u201d \u201cIt\u2019s not going to be good.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI remember writing this book.\u00a0 It was late one night\u2014shut down the computer.\u00a0 I wanted my dad to walk through the door, right then, and say it was going to be okay, and say that I was good at this, and that I needed to keep working on it\u2014and realized, very deep, emotionally, \u201cThis will never, ever happen,\u201d\u2014that he wasn't going to.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 This is <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> for Thursday, April 12<sup>th<\/sup>.\u00a0 Our host is the President of FamilyLife<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>, Dennis Rainey, and I\u2019m Bob Lepine.\u00a0 What do you do, as a young man, when you grew up, never having heard your father say, \u201cWell done, son\u201d?\u00a0 We\u2019ll find out today.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd welcome to <em>FamilyLife Today.<\/em><em>\u00a0 <\/em>Thanks for joining us.\u00a0 You know, you can\u2019t just point to two things happening at the same time and say, \u201cWell, one caused the other\u201d; right?\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014but you do have to look at kind of our social pathologies, as a nation today, and the fact that there are a lot of absent dads in homes today.\u00a0 Then, you have to look at Malachi, Chapter 4, where God says, \u201cThe hearts of the fathers are going to be turned back to their sons; lest I come and smite the land with a curse.\u201d\u00a0 It leaves you scratching your head and saying, \u201cAre we reaping the bitter fruit of dads who have left their assignment, left their post, and this is what we\u2019ve got?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Bob, I was in a briefing at the White House\u2014I don't know, it\u2019s been a couple of years ago now.\u00a0 I had some of those same thoughts as I listened to why government has put together, and all of the things government is trying to patch, and prevent, and protect, and keep wired together all because of the family breakdown\u2014and a good part of them because dads are not dads and fathers to their children.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe ran across a book and invited the author of that book, Don Miller, to join us.\u00a0 I want to welcome you back, Don.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 It\u2019s good to be back!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Don, you grew up in a home without a father.\u00a0 To supplement that, or to try to fit together the pieces that were missing in your life, you connected with a handful of mentors over your adult life.\u00a0 One of the families was the McMurray family\u2014John McMurray co-authored this book with you\u2014and you spent about four years with them.\u00a0 You write a paragraph\u2014and I want you to answer this question, though, that you write about in your book.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou said, \u201cThe McMurray family dynamics allowed me to picture what should have existed in my own life.\u00a0 It\u2019s not that I wanted John to pick me up and set me on his lap, but it did make me wonder why God would allow me to grow up without a father saying he loved me or was glad I was around.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to ask you, Don\u2014you\u2019ve now written a book.\u00a0 You\u2019ve now spent a couple of years, reflecting on your lack of a relationship with your father.\u00a0 What\u2019s your answer to that question?\u00a0 Why did God allow that?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, that\u2019s one of the toughest questions that we deal with.\u00a0 I can only tell you what comforted me, in my not getting an answer to that question.\u00a0 It was a year ago, Father\u2019s Day.\u00a0 It was a very, very difficult time for me.\u00a0 I was wrapping up this book\u2014had spent a year thinking about all the stuff that I didn\u2019t know because I grew up without a dad\u2014and the ways I was trying to deal with that\u2014and offering hope to people, and\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Let\u2019s say, at this point, your father stepped out of your life, when you were about two\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014when I was about two.\u00a0 So, it had been a long time.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI was reading a book\u2014now, remember, I\u2019m having a difficult time.\u00a0 You know, just before Father\u2019s Day\u2014and I was reading a book by Antjie Krog called <em>Country of My Skull.<\/em><em>\u00a0 <\/em>The book was about the Truth and Reconciliation Commission in South Africa.\u00a0 Bishop Tutu was asked by the government, \u201cWho should be on this Truth and Reconciliation Commission?\u201d (the commission that was going to reconcile the government, post-Apartheid).\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThese people, who had been oppressed, many of them murdered, horrible things had taken place\u2014and Bishop Tutu said\u2014he said, \u201cThe people who should be on this commission should be victims, legitimate victims, who have had their lives ripped apart by the atrocities of Apartheid\u2014but not arrogant victims, instead, wounded healers.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe difference between an arrogant victim and a wounded healer is what has happened to them spiritually.\u00a0 A wounded healer has a deeply-buttressed spiritual life, and I was done at that point because the book sets up pages and pages of descriptions of these awful things that\u2014the atrocities that had happened to these people.\u00a0 Here is Bishop Tutu\u2014and he comes in, and he says, \u201cDo not be an arrogant victim.\u00a0 I\u2019m going to call you out of that.\u00a0 God does not want you to stay there.\u00a0 You offend God if you stay a victim.\u00a0 He is giving you hope, and you slap Him in the face if you don\u2019t take that hope.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhile there is a reality of having grown up without a father\u2014and this is not to be compared to the atrocities that were faced in the Apartheid regime but\u2014I'm sitting here, going, \u201cBoy, I can\u2019t believe I\u2019m sitting here, feeling like a victim, having grown up without a dad, when God offers me mentors, He offers me relationships, He offers me wisdom through the church, He offers me wisdom in Scripture, He offers me His own Fatherhood, His own guidance.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAll of this hope is offered to me by God.\u00a0 \u201cWhy God would let this happen?\u201d\u00a0 I still don\u2019t have an answer to that.\u00a0 Of course, it goes into free will and some pretty deep theological ideas.\u00a0 However, the question becomes less pointed to me in the face of the hope in the answers that He offers.\u00a0 Does that make sense?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Mmm-Hmm.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>I think I hit that point, and the question wasn\u2019t as important.\u00a0 I mean, there was so much goodness being offered by God that I just said, \u201cMan, I\u2019m taking advantage of that.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 It\u2019s all about the Gospel\u2014that the Gospel came for broken people\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014and we\u2019re all broken at certain levels, some more visible than others.\u00a0 It\u2019s just more public that you grew up in a home where your father wasn\u2019t there, and you suffered certain wounds as a result of that.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Frankly, I love the illustration you just made because I believe that\u2019s what the Gospel calls us out of.\u00a0 He calls us out of our arrogance and calls us to submit to Him.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Who would have thought that sitting there and saying, \u201cI grew up without a dad, and this is awful,\u201d was arrogance?\u00a0 But as soon as you embrace the hope that God offers you, you look back and you go, \u201cMan!\u00a0 That was arrogance.\u00a0 That was a form of pride.\u201d\u00a0 You wouldn't think of it, in the moment; but it was to me.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 If you think of us, as a nation, that has, at many points, become a nation of victims, there is a degree of\u2014and you hate to say this because\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014because people have been wounded deeply.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, they have.\u00a0 The things that have occurred to them are not right\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014but to hold onto that and to not forgive is ultimately to be a prisoner; isn\u2019t it?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 You actually wrote about that in a chapter in your book\u2014how you had to forgive.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes, you can\u2019t\u2014I just saw a billboard, past a church, the other day, right by my house\u2014the billboard simply said, \u201cHatred is too heavy a burden to carry.\u201d\u00a0 I thought, \u201cThat\u2019s so very true of so many things;\u201d but ultimately, yes, I had to forgive.\u00a0 I had to let go. I had to move on.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThen, what I loved about what Tutu said was, \u201cHe gave me dignity in the pain.\u201d\u00a0 I mean, he said, \u201cThere are two camps here.\u00a0 One is arrogant victim; the other is wounded healer.\u00a0 Choose.\u00a0 Choose which one you're going to become.\u201d\u00a0 I just said, \u201cI don\u2019t want to be an arrogant victim.\u00a0 I don\u2019t want to sit around and say, \u2018I grew up without a dad; so, I\u2019m going to go mess up my life.\u2019\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to be the wounded healer, which means a couple of things.\u00a0 It means\u2014one:\u00a0 that I deal with reality.\u00a0 \u201cThis actually happened to me.\u00a0 There\u2019s stuff that I\u2019m missing.\u00a0 I need to figure out what I'm missing.\u00a0 I\u2019m going to be very intentional and aggressive about doing so.\u201d\u00a0 Then, also, \u201cI need to turn around, and I need to help somebody who is dealing with this same thing.\u00a0 As people have helped me, I need to turn around and help other people.\u201d\u00a0 That\u2019s what a wounded healer does.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe wonderful thing that Tutu said was, \u201cThese people have an education toward empathy.\u00a0 They are the only people who actually understand the pain\u201d\u2014of Apartheid, he's talking about.\u00a0 Then, I thought, \u201cBoy, what a beautiful thing that God would say, \u2018Don, I'm going to give you an education about what it feels like, means\u2019\u201d\u2014the whole bit\u2014\u201c\u2018of growing up without a father so that I can raise you up in the wisdom of the church and wisdom of mentors\u2019\u201d\u2014not that I'm perfect, I\u2019m about ten years behind, usually\u2014\u201c\u2018but then, turn around, and you\u2019re going to be able to give, from a position of authority, wisdom, and counsel to those who are in that same situation.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Second Corinthians, Chapter 1, talks about how we are to comfort one another with the comfort that we\u2019ve received from God.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 That\u2019s what you\u2019re talking about here.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 That\u2019s exactly what I\u2019m talking about.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 As you were sharing that story, I couldn\u2019t help but think back to the question, \u201cWhy would God allow it?\u201d\u00a0 We can\u2019t always answer all the \u201cwhy\u201d questions; but Romans 8:28\u2014and I don\u2019t want to apply, and slap this verse, and laminate it, as many Christians can\u2014almost like a trite Christian saying\u2014but it does say, \u201cAll things work together for good to those who love God and are called according to His purpose.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI\u2019m thinking of your life, Don, after reading of the pain and of the loss, and I can\u2019t even\u2014I have to tell you\u2014I can\u2019t even imagine 22 years of silence. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 You\u2019ve already said that your dad left when you were two.\u00a0 You last saw him when you were 12.\u00a0 There were just a few encounters between two and 12.\u00a0 Now, when he left at two, you didn\u2019t know he\u2019d been around.\u00a0 I mean, you\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 No, I have no memory of him in the house.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 What happened in those few encounters?\u00a0 Who were you meeting with?\u00a0 What did you know about this guy?\u00a0 That last encounter, when you were 12 years old, how were you processing that, as a young man?\u00a0 What was going on?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, there was a big difference between the last encounter and the previous encounters.\u00a0 I really adored my dad, early on.\u00a0 I mean, I loved the fact that he had this really rough beard; and he would buy us the best Christmas presents.\u00a0 Of course, he was never around for rest of the year, but you don\u2019t process that as a kid.\u00a0 You just process this great guy who comes in.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNot the greatest figure\u2014I have a memory of being in a bar.\u00a0 My sister and I, only six and seven years old, sitting in a bar, while my dad was drinking\u2014I have that memory.\u00a0 I have a memory of sitting on his lap, steering his car.\u00a0 If you were steering the car, you got to drink from his beer, driving down the road.\u00a0 These are memories that I have of my father.\u00a0 I think, getting older, there were only two or three visits.\u00a0 Those were the memories from those visits.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThen, the last visit, when I was in junior high.\u00a0 I\u2019m getting a little older.\u00a0 I\u2019m realizing there\u2019s not a lot of safety and security here.\u00a0 I just remember driving out to this restaurant, my sister and I, to have lunch with my dad\u2014and the whole time, kind of looking out the window for the nearest pay phone or for an escape route if something\u2014if he were to try to kidnap me or something like that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHe brought us home, and it was fine.\u00a0 We never heard from him again after that.\u00a0 Part of me thinks that one of the reasons I never heard from him again was because of that moment\u2014this sense of, \u201cMy kids are actually old enough to realize that this isn\u2019t good or normal,\u201d and that, maybe, \u201cI\u2019m not a good guy.\u201d\u00a0\u00a0 We just never heard from him again.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 He didn\u2019t say, \u201cI'm moving.\u00a0 I\u2019m going to\u201d\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>No, nothing, not to my mom, not to anybody.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 That was just the last lunch?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 That was it.\u00a0 That was the last\u2014I never saw him again.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Did you ever think, at 13 or 14, \u201cI wonder why Dad hasn\u2019t called?\u201d<br>\u00a0\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Not at 13 or 14, more like 24 or 25.\u00a0 It was a long\u2014again, it\u2019s hard for people to understand that only having hours\u2014I mean two\/three days with my father my whole life\u2014you don\u2019t\u2014you miss him\u2014but you miss him more in biochemical ways, in the elephant sense of not figuring\u2014not knowing how to do\u2014but you don\u2019t connect that to the fact that you grew up without a dad.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt wasn\u2019t until\u2014again, I was in my mid-20s and moved in with John that I realized my father wasn\u2019t there.\u00a0 That\u2019s when I began processing and wondering, \u201cI wonder where he is, and I wonder why he never called?\u00a0 Well, if he doesn\u2019t want anything to do with me, I don\u2019t want anything to do with him.\u201d\u00a0 Those sorts of ideas occurred to me later.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 There are a lot of our listeners who have heard you describe this and you kind of touch on this, Don; but I want to ask you to go to the very core, if you can.\u00a0 What do you miss most about not having a dad, growing up?\u00a0 I\u2019m not talking about writing the checkbook.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 You know what I mean?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 I\u2019m talking about in the soul.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 It hit home writing this book in a very deep, pretty painful way.\u00a0 It was the week before Father\u2019s Day.\u00a0 I\u2019m working on a book about growing up without a dad.\u00a0 You know, being a writer, it\u2019s a great life.\u00a0 I don\u2019t want any other life, but there are times you\u2019re really alone.\u00a0 You\u2019re five chapters into a book\u2014nobody else has read it\u2014all the voices are saying, \u201cYou\u2019ve gone down the wrong trail,\u201d \u201cIt\u2019s not working out,\u201d\u00a0 \u201cIt\u2019s not going to be good.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI remember writing this book about growing up without a dad.\u00a0 It was late one night\u2014shut down the computer.\u00a0 I\u2019m not a big weep-guy\u2014you know, maybe once every few years or something\u2014and realized, very deep, emotionally, that I wanted my dad to walk through the door, right then, and say that it was going to be okay, and say that I was good at this, and that I needed to keep working on it.\u00a0 It was a realization that he wasn\u2019t going to.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI mean, that was it.\u00a0 This will never, ever happen.\u00a0 That struck pretty deep.\u00a0 I laid on my bed, and put my head on my pillow, and I just wept.\u00a0 I probably wept for an hour\u2014an hour-and-a-half.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 A true cry of anguish?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Of loss?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes, I mean, beyond\u2014it\u2019s beyond self-pity.\u00a0 It was this sense of, \u201cYou will live with this for all eternity,\u201d kind of a feeling, you know\u2014I mean, a very hopeless place.\u00a0 I think God had to bring me there in order for me to read the words of Bishop Tutu to say, \u201cDon, now, that you realize what you\u2019re without, you have a choice.\u00a0 You can be an arrogant victim or a wounded healer.\u00a0 What do you choose?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 You\u2019ve had people say to you that the deficit in a relationship with an earthly father\u2014which all of us have had\u2014nobody had a perfect earthly father\u2014but that God is the One Who is our perfect Heavenly Father.\u00a0 The deficit of the earthly father is compensated for\u2014it\u2019s made up for\u2014by the Heavenly Father.\u00a0 Do you think that\u2019s right?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 No, I don\u2019t think it\u2019s right\u2014anymore than, I think, that the deficit of a marriage relationship for us men\u2014a marriage relationship with a woman is made up for by God.\u00a0 It isn\u2019t.\u00a0 Neither is the relationship you can have with a dog, or the relationship you can have with a piece of turkey, you know, or something.\u00a0 (Laughter)\u00a0 It just isn\u2019t.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tGod has created these things.\u00a0 One of the metaphors we can use to understand God, as He has instructed us in Scripture, is the metaphor of a father.\u00a0 God says, \u201cI will father you.\u00a0 I am fathering you.\u201d\u00a0 \u201cOur Father, Who art in heaven,\u201d Jesus tells us to pray.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhat happens is my earthly dad becomes a metaphor for me to understand who God is\u2014as does, my wife, if I am married.\u00a0 Then, I look at this and say, \u201cWell, this helps me understand this relationship that I have with Jesus\u2014this whole relationship with the Trinity.\u00a0 Our sons, our daughters, become ways that we understand from God\u2019s perspective about how He feels about us.\u00a0 There are all of these living metaphors that take place, but you can\u2019t replace an earthly father.\u00a0 You can\u2019t do it.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think that there\u2019s a lot of hope in Scripture\u2014God fathering us.\u00a0 There\u2019s a lot of hope in mentoring relationships; but ultimately, there will always be that wound there.\u00a0 If the wound isn\u2019t there, then, fathers really aren\u2019t that important in the first place; are they?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 As I listen to you talk, I reflect back on just what you said a few moments ago about\u2014that you\u2019ll never, ever hear the words of affirmation\u2014that, \u201cIt\u2019s going to be okay,\u201d from your dad.\u00a0 It\u2019s interesting that the first words heard about Jesus Christ from His Heavenly Father occurred when He was being baptized by John the Baptist, \u201cThis is My Beloved Son\u201d\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014\u201cin whom I am well pleased.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014\u201cin whom I am well pleased.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Words of affirmation.\u00a0 You know, you don\u2019t think of Jesus needing to hear that from His Father; but His Heavenly Father did say it.\u00a0 Didn\u2019t He?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 He did.\u00a0 It\u2019s interesting that we would say, \u201cWe don\u2019t think of Jesus needing to hear that,\u201d because the assumption is that if Jesus needs affirmation from God, then, He\u2019s not perfect\u2014because perfect is independence; but God doesn\u2019t live in independence.\u00a0 He lives in community.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tGod\u2019s idea of perfection is\u2014\u201cNo, no, no.\u00a0 Perfection is not isolation and independence\u201d\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 There you go.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014\u201cPerfection is marriage and relational dynamics.\u201d\u00a0 You know, for the guys who are growing up without dads, who grew up without dads, who are listening to this\u2014I think that the thing I want to say to you is, \u201cIndependence and, \u2018I can make it on my own, and I\u2019m not going to trust authority\u2019 is not perfect.\u00a0 It\u2019s not a good system.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe have to realize that we missed something when we grew up without a dad.\u00a0 We have to take responsibility and do something about that so that we don\u2019t do this to our own children.\u00a0 Because if it is modeled for me\u2014that what happens in a marriage\u2014\u201cWhen it gets tough, is you leave\u201d\u2014then, \u201cWhen I get into a marriage and it gets tough, I\u2019m going to leave.\u201d\u00a0 That\u2019s what was modeled.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 I have to be very intentional about breaking that cycle.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>One of the greatest risks a man ever takes is relationships.\u00a0 No doubt about it, but the greater risk\u2014even greater than a relationship\u2014is living alone.\u00a0 I\u2019m telling you, \u201cIsolation for any man\u201d\u2014whether single or married, whether he is married and has no children, or he is married and has children\u2014\u201cthe greater risk is to go alone and to cut your heart off from your children.\u201d\u00a0 Instead, you need to take a simpler risk.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt\u2019s still a risk.\u00a0 It involves great fear and great challenge.\u00a0 For many men, I\u2019m convinced terror; but they need to risk a relationship with their sons and their daughters because their children need those words of affirmation, like you longed to hear from your earthly father.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Typically, when a writer is working on a book like this, he has somebody in mind that he\u2019s writing to or for.\u00a0 Were you writing this in hopes that other guys who grew up without a father could say, \u201cYes, somebody understands;\u201d or were you writing this so that fathers could understand the impact they can have\u2014that your father didn\u2019t have in your life?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 I\u2019m amazed at how much response I\u2019ve received from fathers telling me that they have learned something from the book or learned the importance of their role in their kids\u2019 life.\u00a0 I\u2019m blessed by that.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI wrote the book, however, to young men, growing up without dads.\u00a0 In fact, specifically, kind of a neat story\u2014I had read this statistic that 85 percent of the guys in prison grow up without dads.\u00a0 I wrote the book for guys in prison.\u00a0 I mean, I sat down and said, \u201cOkay, if I\u2019m in a jail cell, and I\u2019ve got nothing to do for the next 20 years, \u2018What do I need to hear?\u2019\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI wrote the book for those guys.\u00a0 Interestingly enough, I went into this relationship with NAV Press<sup>\u00ae<\/sup> saying, \u201cHey, if there is anything that we can do to get many, many copies of these books into prison for free, let\u2019s do it.\u201d\u00a0 Of course, there\u2019s a lot of bureaucracy involved in that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWell, we went\u2014I e-mailed the book to the publisher.\u00a0 We went to press and printed 45,000 copies of the book, with the wrong last chapter.\u00a0 The publisher decided, \u201cIt\u2019s important enough that we throw these books away\u201d\u201445,000 books\u2014\u201cand reprint and get it right.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tJohn and I, the co-author, were able to call them and say, \u201cHey, you know, these 45,000 books?\u00a0 I mean, it\u2019s just a couple of pages, but there\u2019s some stuff in there that we wanted to cut out for efficiency\u2019s sake.\u00a0 What if we were able to give those to prisons?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe publisher, you know, a light bulb went off and said, \u201cThat\u2019s exactly what we\u2019ll do.\u201d\u00a0 They boxed them up and were able to distribute the book for free.\u00a0 Before anybody else could get their hands on it, prisoners got their hands on it. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe whole time I\u2019m writing, I\u2019m praying, \u201cGod, get this into the hands of prisoners.\u201d\u00a0 You know, it\u2019s great that people are going to be able to walk into a bookstore and get it.\u00a0 I\u2019m very glad, but what about these guys who just\u2014they are not going to be able to do that.\u00a0 \u201cCan we get this book into their hands?\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 I don\u2019t want to stretch the metaphor, but there\u2019s a sense in which a lot of guys, who didn\u2019t grow up with a dad\u2014they may not be behind bars, but they may still be prisoners to some of the emotions that they have wrestled with.\u00a0 You\u2019ve addressed it in a new book, as well.\u00a0 You wrote a book called <em>Father Fiction<\/em> that is now available, and we\u2019ve got it in our <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> Resource Center.\u00a0 You can go online at FamilyLifeToday.com for more information on the book that Don has written.\u00a0 Again, it\u2019s called <em>Father Fiction<\/em>.\u00a0 Go to FamilyLifeToday.com for more information.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI should also mention that the book that you are probably best-known for, <em>Blue Like Jazz<\/em>, has just been made into a major motion picture that is releasing in theaters this weekend.\u00a0 I haven\u2019t had a chance to see it yet, but I\u2019ll be anxious to see what the response to that movie is.\u00a0 Again, if folks want more information on your book, <em>Father Fiction<\/em>, go to our website, FamilyLifeToday.com; or give us a call toll-free at 1-800-358-6329.\u00a0 That\u2019s 1-800- \u201cF\u201d as in family, \u201cL\u201d as in life, and then, the word, \u201cTODAY\u201d.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI was thinking about the subject we\u2019ve been talking about today and the subject of your book.\u00a0 Dennis, I was thinking about the devotional guide that your wife Barbara just finished writing, called <em>Growing Together in Forgiveness<\/em>.\u00a0 The reality is all of us are going to have to deal with the issue of forgiveness in our lifetime.\u00a0 There are going to be people who wrong us, and we\u2019re going to have to forgive them because that\u2019s what the Bible calls us to.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBarbara has put together a devotional so that families can read seven very compelling stories about the subject of forgiveness and see what it looks like and understand the nobility of forgiving someone else.\u00a0 Barbara\u2019s devotional guide is our gift to you this week when you help support the ministry of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> with a donation.\u00a0 We are listener-supported.\u00a0 We appreciate your financial support of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou can make a donation online at FamilyLifeToday.com.\u00a0 Click the button that says, \u201cI Care\u201d.\u00a0\u00a0 When you make an online donation, we\u2019ll automatically send you a copy of Barbara\u2019s new devotional book; or call us toll-free at 1-800-FL-TODAY.\u00a0 Make a donation over the phone; and be sure to request a copy of the book, <em>Growing Together in Forgiveness<\/em>, when you get in touch with us.\u00a0 Let me say, \u201cThanks,\u201d in advance for your support.\u00a0 We really do appreciate your partnership with us, here in the ministry of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe want to encourage you to be back with us again tomorrow.\u00a0 We are going to talk with Donald Miller about how, when a young boy grows up without a dad helping to point him in the right direction, he can wind up being confused about what it means to be a man.\u00a0 We\u2019ll talk about that tomorrow.\u00a0 Hope you can tune in.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch, and our entire broadcast production team.\u00a0 On behalf of our host, Dennis Rainey, I'm Bob Lepine.\u00a0 We will see you back next time for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHelp for today.\u00a0 Hope for tomorrow.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you.\u00a0 However, there is a cost to produce them for our website.\u00a0 If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright \u00a9 2012 FamilyLife.\u00a0 All rights reserved.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/\">www.FamilyLife.com<\/a>\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\n\t\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\t1\n\t\t\t\t<\/p>","theme_header_position":"","post_header_is_sticky":"","is_header_overlay":""},"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast\/302500","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/podcast"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/91"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=302500"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/294104"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=302500"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=302500"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=302500"},{"taxonomy":"podcast_series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast_series?post=302500"},{"taxonomy":"cwp_profile","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/cwp_profile?post=302500"},{"taxonomy":"series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/series?post=302500"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}