{"id":302499,"date":"2012-04-11T11:00:00","date_gmt":"2012-04-11T15:00:00","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/%series%\/fathers-a-loving-fact-or-unbelievable-fairy-tale\/"},"modified":"2012-04-11T11:00:00","modified_gmt":"2012-04-11T15:00:00","slug":"fathers-a-loving-fact-or-unbelievable-fairy-tale","status":"publish","type":"podcast","link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/fathers-a-loving-fact-or-unbelievable-fairy-tale\/","title":{"rendered":"Fathers&#8211;A Loving Fact or Unbelievable Fairy Tale?"},"content":{"rendered":"","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Author Donald Miller talks about the challenges and disillusionment he faced growing up without a father.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":91,"featured_media":294104,"menu_order":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","template":"","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","inline_featured_image":false,"_uag_custom_page_level_css":"","episode_type":"","audio_file":"https:\/\/web.familylifetoday.com\/fl2012-04-11.mp3","cover_image":"","cover_image_id":"","duration":"00:","filesize":"21.95M","filesize_raw":"23016306","date_recorded":"","explicit":"","block":""},"categories":[2826],"tags":[5205,4698],"podcast_series":[7483],"cwp_profile":[9037],"series":[2101],"class_list":["post-302499","podcast","type-podcast","status-publish","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-men","tag-fatherless","tag-manhood","podcast_series-to-own-a-dragon","cwp_profile-donald-miller","series-familylife-today"],"acf":[],"episode_featured_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/09\/FLT-Podcast-Cover-2-508x508-3.jpg?w=508","episode_player_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2023\/02\/image-scaled.jpg","download_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-download\/302499\/fathers-a-loving-fact-or-unbelievable-fairy-tale","player_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-player\/302499\/fathers-a-loving-fact-or-unbelievable-fairy-tale","audio_player":null,"episode_data":{"playerMode":"light","subscribeUrls":{"apple_podcasts":{"key":"apple_podcasts","url":"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303?mt=2&app=podcast","label":"Apple Podcasts","class":"apple_podcasts","icon":"apple-podcasts.png"},"google_podcasts":{"key":"google_podcasts","url":"","label":"Google Podcasts","class":"google_podcasts","icon":"google-podcasts.png"},"spotify":{"key":"spotify","url":"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm","label":"Spotify","class":"spotify","icon":"spotify.png"},"youtube":{"key":"youtube","url":"","label":"YouTube","class":"youtube","icon":"youtube.png"}},"rssFeedUrl":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/feed\/podcast\/familylife-today","embedCode":"<blockquote class=\"wp-embedded-content\" data-secret=\"9nMI8c9cvo\"><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/fathers-a-loving-fact-or-unbelievable-fairy-tale\/\">Fathers&#8211;A Loving Fact or Unbelievable Fairy Tale?<\/a><\/blockquote><iframe sandbox=\"allow-scripts\" security=\"restricted\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/fathers-a-loving-fact-or-unbelievable-fairy-tale\/embed\/#?secret=9nMI8c9cvo\" width=\"500\" height=\"350\" title=\"&#8220;Fathers&#8211;A Loving Fact or Unbelievable Fairy Tale?&#8221; &#8212; FamilyLife\u00ae - A Cru Ministry\" data-secret=\"9nMI8c9cvo\" frameborder=\"0\" marginwidth=\"0\" marginheight=\"0\" scrolling=\"no\" class=\"wp-embedded-content\"><\/iframe><script>\n\/*! This file is auto-generated *\/\n!function(d,l){\"use strict\";l.querySelector&&d.addEventListener&&\"undefined\"!=typeof URL&&(d.wp=d.wp||{},d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage||(d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage=function(e){var t=e.data;if((t||t.secret||t.message||t.value)&&!\/[^a-zA-Z0-9]\/.test(t.secret)){for(var s,r,n,a=l.querySelectorAll('iframe[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),o=l.querySelectorAll('blockquote[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),c=new RegExp(\"^https?:$\",\"i\"),i=0;i<o.length;i++)o[i].style.display=\"none\";for(i=0;i<a.length;i++)s=a[i],e.source===s.contentWindow&&(s.removeAttribute(\"style\"),\"height\"===t.message?(1e3<(r=parseInt(t.value,10))?r=1e3:~~r<200&&(r=200),s.height=r):\"link\"===t.message&&(r=new URL(s.getAttribute(\"src\")),n=new URL(t.value),c.test(n.protocol))&&n.host===r.host&&l.activeElement===s&&(d.top.location.href=t.value))}},d.addEventListener(\"message\",d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage,!1),l.addEventListener(\"DOMContentLoaded\",function(){for(var e,t,s=l.querySelectorAll(\"iframe.wp-embedded-content\"),r=0;r<s.length;r++)(t=(e=s[r]).getAttribute(\"data-secret\"))||(t=Math.random().toString(36).substring(2,12),e.src+=\"#?secret=\"+t,e.setAttribute(\"data-secret\",t)),e.contentWindow.postMessage({message:\"ready\",secret:t},\"*\")},!1)))}(window,document);\n\/\/# sourceURL=https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-includes\/js\/wp-embed.min.js\n<\/script>\n"},"spectra_custom_meta":{"_wp_page_template":["default"],"transcript_url":["https:\/\/transcript.familylifetoday.com\/fl2012-04-11.pdf"],"audio_file":["https:\/\/web.familylifetoday.com\/fl2012-04-11.mp3"],"transcript_content":["<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Donald Miller grew up with a deficit.\u00a0 It's a deficit that many young men experience today as they're growing up.\u00a0 He grew up without a dad, and it marked his life.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Donald:<\/strong>\u00a0 When I was a kid, my mom did a great job of trying to plug me into communities that existed with father figures and those sorts of things.\u00a0 One of those communities was Cub Scouts<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>.\u00a0 I went to Cub Scouts.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe had to make these pinewood cars, and all the guys' dads were supposed to help me, but they were busy helping their own sons.\u00a0 I couldn't make a car; I couldn't make the car work right; I couldn't figure that out.\u00a0 I don't even think my car had wheels on it.\u00a0 (Laughter)\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI never, ever felt like this was because I didn't have a dad.\u00a0 That never crossed my mind.\u00a0 That was too complicated to put that together.\u00a0 I guess the assumption was that, intuitively, other boys my age knew that stuff.\u00a0 I did not make the connection that they had fathers helping them.\u00a0 I felt like there was something wrong with me.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 This is <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> for Wednesday, April 11<sup>th<\/sup>.\u00a0 Our host is the President of FamilyLife<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>, Dennis Rainey, and I'm Bob Lepine.\u00a0 There is a lot about what it means to be a man that Donald Miller missed out on by growing up without a dad.\u00a0 We\u2019ll hear from him about that today.\u00a0 Stay tuned.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd welcome to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\u00a0 Thanks for joining us.\u00a0 I'm just sitting here thinking about the fact that, in the room today, we really have probably three different pictures of a father\/son relationship represented.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 We do; we do.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 You had a close relationship with your dad; didn't you?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 I did.\u00a0 My dad's nickname was \"Hook,\"\u2014\u201cHook\" Rainey.\u00a0 I was thinking what a great dad I had; and even though he wasn't perfect and didn't do it all, he was a man of integrity and a man who was there for me.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 I grew up in a home where I was, I would say, emotionally distant from my dad.\u00a0 He was a good family provider but not really relationally-connected very much with the kids.\u00a0 I knew he was there, and knew he was part of the family.\u00a0 We didn't have any real struggles; we just didn't have much going on.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right; and, Bob, the third part of the picture is Don Miller, whose father\u2014well, really left you and your family when you were a toddler.\u00a0 Is that right, Don?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes, I was two or three years old when he took off.\u00a0 I only saw him two or three times from that time until junior high.\u00a0 Then, after junior high, I never saw him again.\u00a0 You know, maybe 48 hours is all that I spent with my dad.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 That really is a picture, Bob, of what you're talking about\u2014a good relationship with a father, a distant one and\u2014how would you describe, Don, your relationship with your father\u2014non-existent?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, yes, non-existent physically; non-existent.\u00a0 I think we all have these sorts of relationships with our dads\u2014as a tangled kind of web in there\u2014with even if we didn't have a dad, that affects us, since there are all those relational dynamics that are there.\u00a0 But, yes, non-existent would be the way I'd describe it.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 You're a writer.\u00a0 You live in Portland, Oregon; and you've established a unique foundation called the Belmont Foundation.\u00a0 Is that right?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right, the Belmont Foundation.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 That's really to help single moms and help mentor the fatherless.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes, the Belmont Foundation is going to take ten young men every year from ages nine to 12.\u00a0 We're going to provide ten mentors from our home church.\u00a0 Then, we've established a curriculum\u2014that we are going to take those ten young men through.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tFor one year, they'll look at finances; character; spirituality, in terms of introducing them to their true Father, God\u2014all sorts of other stuff.\u00a0 They'll actually graduate from that program at the end of the year.\u00a0 Then, those ten mentors, that we've provided\u2014they'll stay with them for the rest of their lives\u2014you know, even up into college and all that\u2014as long as the friendship is there.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThen, we'll pick ten new mentors and provide ten more young men.\u00a0 We just want to keep doing that every year\u2014just ten a year, one church doing ten a year.\u00a0 Then, we want to be able to clone that program on hundreds, if not thousands, of churches, all over the country.\u00a0 Hopefully, 10,000 young men every year would be provided with mentors through the local church.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 You get that model created and come back.\u00a0 We\u2019ll help you pick up a few hundred, if not a few thousand churches\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 There you go.\u00a0 Give us a couple of years.\u00a0 We\u2019ll be knocking on your door.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014because that\u2019s a much-needed ministry.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou've written a book, and I want to read just a section of this.\u00a0 Then, I want you to explain this to our listeners because you said, \u201cIn some ways, writing thoughts about a father, or not having a father, I feel as though I am writing a book about a dragon or a troll under a bridge.\u00a0 For me, a father is nothing more than a character in a fairy tale.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNow, can you explain what you're trying to say there?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, I think I was trying to point to the reality of the fact that, growing up without a dad, I was constantly asked the question, or people would look at me with sympathetic eyes, or something.\u00a0 I\u2019d say, \u201cWell, I didn't have a dad.\u201d\u00a0 Their response taught me that there was something odd about that.\u00a0 I wouldn\u2019t have known that there was something odd about that were it not for those responses.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt was that kind of a picture that I was trying to paint for people, who grew up with dads, to try to understand, \u201cHere is what it kind of looks like.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 There's a sense in which whatever we grow up in is our own definition of normal; right?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Exactly.\u00a0 That\u2019s exactly it.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 So, for you, growing up without a dad was normal.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Normal in the sense that it was my experience.\u00a0 Of course, part of the point of the whole discussion is to say that it\u2019s not normal.\u00a0 I had to come to grips with the idea that this was not perfect or even good, you know, or healthy.\u00a0 Now, God breaks into dark reality all over the place.\u00a0 That's the whole point of Scripture is to show God breaking into a dark reality; but at the same time, there has to be this admission of dark reality.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSo, yes, having grown up without a dad, I had to step out of myself and look back and say, \u201cNow, what were the things that I missed?\u201d\u00a0 You know, now that I realize that I was supposed to have a dad\u2014\u201cWhat did I miss in the process of growing up without a father?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 When do you think you first became aware of the fact that your normal wasn\u2019t normal and that there was a deficit as a result of that?\u00a0 Do you remember a time or a place, where you went\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 I remember a season.\u00a0 It was my mid-20s.\u00a0 A guy named John McMurray invited me to move in with him and his family.\u00a0 John was leading a college Bible study at the church I was going to.\u00a0 He invited me to come in and live with his wife and their kids, Chris, Elle, and Cassy.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt was during that season\u2014it was four years\u2014but it was the first year that I realized such a thing exists as a father because moving in with John and Terri\u2014I thought the system was very strange.\u00a0 I mean, here you have a perfectly normal family\u2014by that, I mean, a woman and her three children.\u00a0 Then, you have this man who fixes the washing machine and still spends the night every night.\u00a0 I didn't understand that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSo, you're just kind of going, \u201cThis is a bit weird.\u201d\u00a0 Then, it was that first year of realizing, \u201cNo, this is actually a very good system.\u00a0 I get it.\u00a0 I see how this works and how these people work together.\u201d\u00a0 They actually have a very healthy family.\u00a0 It was really nice that I was able to see that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThen, the secondary question is, \u201cWait a second, I grew up without this.\u00a0 What did I miss?\u00a0 What did I miss out on?\u201d\u00a0 Without having moved in with a family, I would have never probably asked that question.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 I want to challenge you on that for a second.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 You said that was the season when you finally came to the conclusion that there was something missing.\u00a0 Now, as a young lad growing up in a home\u2014going to all kinds of events around school, and athletics, and all the things in childhood and boyhood\u2014weren't there moments in that where you turned around and you noticed, \u201cEvery other boy here as got a dad to help him, but I don\u2019t\u201d?\u00a0 In fact, you alluded to it when\u2014was it Boy Scouts\u2014no one helped you fix the derby car?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 There were countless moments like that.\u00a0 The realization was, \u201cI don't have a dad\u201d, but never the assumption that, \u201cI should have.\u201d\u00a0 \u201cI was made different,\u201d you know?\u00a0 That's a very sad kind of reality to think about; but, yes, when I was a kid, my mom did a great job of trying to plug me into communities that existed with father figures and those sorts of things.\u00a0 One of those communities was Cub Scouts\u2014I went to Cub Scouts, and we had to make these pine box\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes, the Pinewood Derby.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 The Pinewood Derby; right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 I was in that; yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 All the guys\u2019 dads were supposed to help me, but they were busy helping their own sons.\u00a0 My mom would just drop me off at meeting, you know?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 She was making the assumption that there would be\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014somebody was there helping me.\u00a0 I write about, in the book, how I don't even think my car had wheels on it.\u00a0 There was just a lot of WD-40 on the bottom of a block of wood.\u00a0 (Laughing)\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Now\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 So, it wasn't\u2014but that was a very sad\u2014I mean, we laugh now, but that was very, very sad.\u00a0 I remember that being a very sad evening.\u00a0 It was not a happy time.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes, that's where I was going to take you on that.\u00a0 We're laughing about that; but, for a boy, he's looking at his buddies\u2019 cars, which are\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014at least finishing.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014painted.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 They're at least rolling.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes, yes\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014and yours doesn't even have hardly any wheels on it.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 What did you feel at that moment?\u00a0 Do you recall?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 No, I do recall.\u00a0 The way I felt was\u2014and this was a constant feeling, having grown up with those situations, consistently happening\u2014I felt like there was something wrong with me.\u00a0 I never, ever felt like this was because I didn't have a dad.\u00a0 That never crossed my mind.\u00a0 That was too complicated to put that together.\u00a0 \u201cThere was just something wrong with me.\u00a0 I couldn\u2019t make a car.\u00a0 I couldn\u2019t make the car work right.\u00a0 I couldn\u2019t figure that out.\u201d\u00a0 I guess the assumption was that, intuitively, other boys my age knew that stuff.\u00a0 They were just good at making Pinewood cars, and I was not good at making a Pinewood car.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAt the time, I did not make the connection that they had fathers helping them.\u00a0 You know, just way too insecure to make that connection.\u00a0 You\u2019re just\u2014at this point, you\u2019re just\u2014you\u2019re sort of fending for your life, you know?\u00a0 You\u2019re just trying to matter, you\u2019re trying to\u2014you know, those kinds of things, and\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>You know, Don, I want to just hitchhike off the point you\u2019re making there because it\u2019s so simple; and yet, it\u2019s so profound.\u00a0 Boys were made by God to have daddies.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Oh, yes, yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 They really were.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 And girls too; right?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 And girls too, absolutely; but in this culture, where six out of ten young people today are spending part of their first 18 years of life with one parent, that\u2019s not an assumption that we necessarily embrace as a culture.\u00a0 The last verse in the Old Testament talks about the coming of the Messiah; and to me, it\u2019s a great statement of a value\u2014the value of being a father to your child.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tMalachi, Chapter 4, verse 6, \u201cAnd He will restore the hearts of the fathers to their children, and the hearts of the children to their fathers; lest I come and smite the land with a curse.\u201d\u00a0 This connection, this\u2014I can\u2019t even describe it\u2014it\u2019s a mysterious connection of a father\/son, father\/daughter, relationship.\u00a0 Somehow, it\u2019s a preventative to a nation, some kind of protection for the longevity of the ability of a nation to continue.\u00a0 It\u2019s that vital.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhat we\u2019re speaking to today\u2014and the reason we wanted you to share your story with our listeners\u2014Bob, we have a nation full of young men and women, who like Don, reflect back on their childhood.\u00a0 It really is like the troll and the dragon\u2014it\u2019s a fairy tale.\u00a0 There was no father in their lives.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 So, your sense was, \u201cSomething\u2019s wrong with me.\u201d\u00a0 You look back on it and say, \u201cWell, what was wrong was I didn\u2019t have somebody helping me understand what manhood is all about.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Exactly; and I really understood that only a couple of years ago, when I started this book.\u00a0 I was watching a documentary\u2014I think it was on <em>Animal Planet<\/em><em><sup>\u00ae<\/sup><\/em>, or the <em>Discovery Channel<\/em><em><sup>\u00ae<\/sup><\/em>, something like that\u2014and it was about these elephants in Africa.\u00a0 There's a wildlife refuge where they have taken\u201415 or 20 years ago, they took 25 orphaned, very young elephants.\u00a0 They rescued them.\u00a0 They brought them to this wildlife refuge in Africa.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tTwenty years later, the male elephants are reaching adolescence.\u00a0 It's a slower process in elephants.\u00a0 When this happens to them, the elephant routine is they'll enter into a musk cycle.\u00a0 That musk cycle will last a few days.\u00a0 Then, it will be over; and that's sort of their entry into adulthood.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThese elephants entered into musk cycle\u2014the young men\u2014and did not come out of it.\u00a0 It was three days, and then a week, and then two weeks, and then a month.\u00a0 It never stopped.\u00a0 They began to behave extremely aggressively, which is not like an elephant at all.\u00a0 They began to kill rhinos.\u00a0 They were isolated from the community.\u00a0 They fought with each other in very violent ways.\u00a0 The people that worked the refuge were trying to figure it out.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThey went back, and they studied why the elephants are doing this.\u00a0 They discovered that this musk cycle lasts for three days in the young men until they enter into a mentoring relationship with an older elephant.\u00a0 It's upon\u2014that musk cycle is a cue for the older elephant to come alongside that younger elephant and teach them how to be a man elephant\u2014how to be a grown elephant\u2014what the muscle is for, what the strength is for, how to protect the community\u2014these kinds of things.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBiochemically, the musk cycle ends upon the relationship with the older mentoring elephant.\u00a0 There were no older, mentoring elephants on the wildlife refuge.\u00a0 These were all young elephants, growing up together.\u00a0 There was nothing there to stop the musk cycle.\u00a0 They actually brought in some older elephants, a couple of older elephants.\u00a0 Immediately, the bonding sort of took place.\u00a0 The musk cycles ended, and everything turned out fine.\u00a0 It was watching that that made me realize that it was probably more than just, \u201cI didn't learn to make a pinewood car.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThere is something actually that we learn relationally by having an older, stronger, more-together, wise man, around in our lives that we just sort of\u2014there's a feeling of security there, a feeling of comfort.\u00a0 There's a kind of an adoration and sense of, \u201cI want to be like this man.\u00a0 I want to\u201d\u2014and there's a kind of guiding principle.\u00a0 A lot of it has nothing to do with sitting down and learning to throw a baseball.\u00a0 It's just intrinsic in the family dynamic that is created.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI began to wonder if it wasn't also true for humans, the way it's true for an elephant.\u00a0 It's something like that.\u00a0 Then, you find out, you know\u2014I went on and read this very academic book about the fatherless crisis in our country.\u00a0 It talked about 85 percent of men in prison grew up in homes completely without a father\u201485 percent.\u00a0 Another 10 percent or so had very bad role models, in terms of father figures.\u00a0 So, 95 percent of the people in prison did not have good fathers or fathers at all.\u00a0 I thought, \u201cThat's a very real picture of this sort of elephant analogy.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou know, I had mentors and mentoring relationships in my life.\u00a0 John McMurray was one of those guys, but I wonder where my life would be without even that little bit of father-figure mentoring stuff.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 You also compared the hand-off that occurs, father to son, to an airplane trip you took\u2014where you plugged in and listened to the pilots talk to one another, back and forth\u2014because I think this further illustrates the very point you\u2019re talking about.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes, yes.\u00a0 I had, for years, had a problem with authority and didn't realize I had a problem with authority.\u00a0 I just thought people were wrong.\u00a0 (Laughter)\u00a0 I mean, that's very important\u2014as comical as it is.\u00a0 I think there are probably a lot of people who will identify with that.\u00a0 \u201cI don't have a problem with authority.\u00a0 They're just wrong.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Rules are\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Rules are not correct.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 No, they're meant to be broken.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Exactly.\u00a0 I had a problem with that for years and was on a flight, out of Chicago flying to Portland.\u00a0 You know, how sometimes they'll let you plug in and listen to pilots talking to each other?\u00a0 The pilots\u2014they still have this system, where on a popular route like that, where there is a lot of plane traffic.\u00a0 There are planes flying to Portland all the time.\u00a0 They will call back weather patterns to the plane that's behind them, and they will receive calls from the plane that's in front of them, by an hour or so.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThey\u2019re constantly receiving signals from the people in front of them saying, \u201cHey, there\u2019s choppy air.\u00a0 You're going to want to go up a couple of thousand feet and get over this storm,\u201d or whatever it is.\u00a0 Then, the pilot, who was flying my plane, will then call back, an hour or so behind, and say, \u201cHey, everything looks smooth here.\u00a0 We\u2019re getting some disturbances an hour ahead, but we\u2019ll keep you posted on that when we get there.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI really thought, \u201cWell, that\u2019s such a beautiful picture of what I\u2019m missing in my life.\u00a0 Nobody is calling back to me by 20, 25 years and saying, \u2018Hey, you know, work ethic looks like this,\u201d and, \u201cHere is how you should manage money\u2019\u201d\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014\u201cand this is how you care for a woman.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014\u201chere is how you care for a woman, and here is how you raise kids.\u201d\u00a0 That was simply not happening because of my distrust and dislike for authority, which all stems from father stuff.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHere is what I mean.\u00a0 If you didn\u2019t have a dad, you kind of hang out at the Pinewood Derby car race; and you feel like you don\u2019t belong.\u00a0 The thing that makes you feel like you don\u2019t belong are these other older males.\u00a0 Well, if these older males are giving you signals that, \u201cYou don\u2019t belong,\u201d you tend not to like them.\u00a0 I mean, you tend to go, \u201cWell, if I don\u2019t belong, you don\u2019t belong,\u201d or, \u201cIf you don't like me, I don't like you.\u201d\u00a0 There you have the whole establishment of not trusting, or liking, or wanting authority.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSo, if somebody comes in and says, \u201cHey, I want you to do this,\u201d you've kind of got this feeling, \u201cMan, you\u2019ve told me\u201d\u2014even if you never met this guy\u2014\u201cYou've told me, all my life, I don\u2019t matter.\u00a0 Now, you want me to do this?\u00a0 You\u2019re just using me.\u00a0 I\u2019m not going to do it.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Not only that, but you wind up hanging around with other young men\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014who feel the same way.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 So, that herd, that elephant herd, now is on the loose.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes, it can be.\u00a0 I mean, when I was in junior high, we were already breaking into houses, stealing loose change and stuff from people\u2019s dressers.\u00a0 That would have escalated\u2014I\u2019m pretty confident it would have escalated\u2014but there was a man named David Gentiles.\u00a0 He\u2019s the first guy who kind of took me under his wing, in a way, and provided a mentoring relationship.\u00a0 It was at that very critical time.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou know, I don't know if it was all Dave or what it was; but there was just this sense of, \u201cI kind of want to be like that guy,\u201d and, \u201cThat guy isn\u2019t breaking into houses, stealing loose change off of people\u2019s dressers.\u00a0 That guy has a job, and a family, and he seems to be a pretty well-together kind of guy.\u201d\u00a0 That is what rescued me from\u2014and ultimately, it was God because Scripture tells us that He is going to provide for us.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>You know, when my sons have been in junior high and high school, one of the questions I\u2019ve asked them is\u2014I\u2019ve said, \u201cLook ahead of you, four or five years, and just pick somebody\u2014who would it be?\u00a0 Pick somebody that you think, \u2018Five years from now, that\u2019s the kind of guy I\u2019d like to be like.\u2019\u201d\u00a0 You know, they are doing that, whether they are doing it intentionally or not.\u00a0 I\u2019m just trying to make sure that they\u2019re thinking about who they would like to be like rather than just deciding; you know?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Or getting their marching orders from the herd\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014as we\u2019ve just been talking about here.\u00a0 I think there are a couple of key applications here, for a father, that I don\u2019t want to miss. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNumber one:\u00a0 Your children need a relationship with you.\u00a0 They don\u2019t just need your presence at the games.\u00a0 They don\u2019t just need you to show up.\u00a0 They need a heart-to-heart, soul-to-soul, intentional relationship with you, where you tell them, \u201cYou love them,\u201d you tell them, \u201cYou are proud of them,\u201d you communicate that , \u201cYou\u2019re glad and you\u2019re privileged to be their father.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br>Secondly\u2014and I think this is what I got from your book, Don, as I was reading it.\u00a0 Dads today have to be intentional with young men and with young ladies around issues of masculinity and femininity.\u00a0 They need to define, for their sons, what a real man is, and what a real man does, and how a real man behaves.\u00a0 They need to do that, not once, but over, and over, and over again.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAs we do that\u2014as we, as fathers, do that, even so imperfectly through our own mistakes\u2014I think that\u2019s where the hand-off occurs, like you talked about from the lead airplane calling back to the next airplane that\u2019s 25 years younger and affirming those things that are found in Scripture.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBob, I think today, men, more than ever, need training, they need encouragement, they need help.\u00a0 For many, they may need\u2014they may need to reflect upon their own relationship, or lack of relationship, with their father like Don has written about in his book.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 The book is called <em>Father Fiction<\/em>.\u00a0 It\u2019s a book we\u2019ve got in our <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> Resource Center.\u00a0 If our listeners are interested, they can go to FamilyLifeToday.com for more information on the book and on how you have reflected on this issue, as one who grew up without a dad.\u00a0 Again, the title of the book is <em>Father Fiction<\/em>.\u00a0 Go to FamilyLifeToday.com for more information on the book.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI should probably mention here that the book, <em>Blue Like Jazz<\/em>, which is probably your best-known book, has just been turned into a movie and is coming to theaters this weekend.\u00a0 I haven\u2019t had a chance to see it, but I know a lot of people are curious about the film and how your story in <em>Blue Like Jazz<\/em> gets translated to the movie theater screen.\u00a0 We want to let people know about that, as well.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAgain, for more information about the book, <em>Father Fiction<\/em>, go to FamilyLifeToday.com.\u00a0 You can order from us online, or you can call 1-800-FL-TODAY to order.\u00a0 That\u2019s 1-800- \u201cF\u201d as in family, \u201cL\u201d as in life, and then the word, \u201cTODAY\u201d.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNow, let me take just a minute and say, \u201cThanks,\u201d to the folks who help support the ministry of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> by making a donation from time to time to support what we\u2019re doing.\u00a0 We are listener-supported, and it\u2019s your donations that help cover the cost of producing and syndicating this daily radio program.\u00a0 We appreciate your help with that and your participation in this ministry.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThis week, if you are able to help with a donation of any amount, we\u2019d like to send you as a thank-you gift a copy of Barbara Rainey\u2019s brand-new devotional guide for families.\u00a0 It\u2019s called <em>Growing Together in <\/em>Forgiveness\u2014seven stories about what it means to forgive and to be forgiven\u2014designed to help foster and cultivate an attitude of forgiveness in your home.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe had a number of you get in touch with us recently to request a copy of this book.\u00a0 We still have copies available, and again, it\u2019s our thank-you gift to you when you help support the ministry of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> this week.\u00a0 If you can make a donation online at FamilyLifeToday.com, all you have to do is click the button that says, \u201cI Care\u201d.\u00a0 When you make your online donation, we\u2019ll send the book out to you automatically; or call 1-800-FL-TODAY.\u00a0 Make a donation over the phone; and ask for your copy of the book, <em>Growing Together in Forgiveness<\/em>, by Barbara Rainey, when you get in touch with us.\u00a0 We do appreciate your support.\u00a0 Glad to have you on the team, and we appreciate your listening to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br>I want to encourage you to be back with us again tomorrow when we\u2019re going to hear again from Donald Miller\u2014find out more about what it was like for him, growing up without a dad.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch, and our entire broadcast production team.\u00a0 On behalf of our host, Dennis Rainey, I'm Bob Lepine.\u00a0 We will see you back next time for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHelp for today.\u00a0 Hope for tomorrow.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you.\u00a0 However, there is a cost to produce them for our website.\u00a0 If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright \u00a9 2012 FamilyLife.\u00a0 All rights reserved.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/\">www.FamilyLife.com<\/a>\u00a0 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Donald Miller talks about the challenges and disillusionment he faced growing up without a father.","meta_box":{"show_notes":"","transcript_url":"https:\/\/transcript.familylifetoday.com\/fl2012-04-11.pdf","transcript_content":"<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Donald Miller grew up with a deficit.\u00a0 It's a deficit that many young men experience today as they're growing up.\u00a0 He grew up without a dad, and it marked his life.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Donald:<\/strong>\u00a0 When I was a kid, my mom did a great job of trying to plug me into communities that existed with father figures and those sorts of things.\u00a0 One of those communities was Cub Scouts<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>.\u00a0 I went to Cub Scouts.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe had to make these pinewood cars, and all the guys' dads were supposed to help me, but they were busy helping their own sons.\u00a0 I couldn't make a car; I couldn't make the car work right; I couldn't figure that out.\u00a0 I don't even think my car had wheels on it.\u00a0 (Laughter)\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI never, ever felt like this was because I didn't have a dad.\u00a0 That never crossed my mind.\u00a0 That was too complicated to put that together.\u00a0 I guess the assumption was that, intuitively, other boys my age knew that stuff.\u00a0 I did not make the connection that they had fathers helping them.\u00a0 I felt like there was something wrong with me.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 This is <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> for Wednesday, April 11<sup>th<\/sup>.\u00a0 Our host is the President of FamilyLife<sup>\u00ae<\/sup>, Dennis Rainey, and I'm Bob Lepine.\u00a0 There is a lot about what it means to be a man that Donald Miller missed out on by growing up without a dad.\u00a0 We\u2019ll hear from him about that today.\u00a0 Stay tuned.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd welcome to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\u00a0 Thanks for joining us.\u00a0 I'm just sitting here thinking about the fact that, in the room today, we really have probably three different pictures of a father\/son relationship represented.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 We do; we do.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 You had a close relationship with your dad; didn't you?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 I did.\u00a0 My dad's nickname was \"Hook,\"\u2014\u201cHook\" Rainey.\u00a0 I was thinking what a great dad I had; and even though he wasn't perfect and didn't do it all, he was a man of integrity and a man who was there for me.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 I grew up in a home where I was, I would say, emotionally distant from my dad.\u00a0 He was a good family provider but not really relationally-connected very much with the kids.\u00a0 I knew he was there, and knew he was part of the family.\u00a0 We didn't have any real struggles; we just didn't have much going on.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right; and, Bob, the third part of the picture is Don Miller, whose father\u2014well, really left you and your family when you were a toddler.\u00a0 Is that right, Don?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes, I was two or three years old when he took off.\u00a0 I only saw him two or three times from that time until junior high.\u00a0 Then, after junior high, I never saw him again.\u00a0 You know, maybe 48 hours is all that I spent with my dad.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 That really is a picture, Bob, of what you're talking about\u2014a good relationship with a father, a distant one and\u2014how would you describe, Don, your relationship with your father\u2014non-existent?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, yes, non-existent physically; non-existent.\u00a0 I think we all have these sorts of relationships with our dads\u2014as a tangled kind of web in there\u2014with even if we didn't have a dad, that affects us, since there are all those relational dynamics that are there.\u00a0 But, yes, non-existent would be the way I'd describe it.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 You're a writer.\u00a0 You live in Portland, Oregon; and you've established a unique foundation called the Belmont Foundation.\u00a0 Is that right?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right, the Belmont Foundation.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 That's really to help single moms and help mentor the fatherless.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes, the Belmont Foundation is going to take ten young men every year from ages nine to 12.\u00a0 We're going to provide ten mentors from our home church.\u00a0 Then, we've established a curriculum\u2014that we are going to take those ten young men through.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tFor one year, they'll look at finances; character; spirituality, in terms of introducing them to their true Father, God\u2014all sorts of other stuff.\u00a0 They'll actually graduate from that program at the end of the year.\u00a0 Then, those ten mentors, that we've provided\u2014they'll stay with them for the rest of their lives\u2014you know, even up into college and all that\u2014as long as the friendship is there.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThen, we'll pick ten new mentors and provide ten more young men.\u00a0 We just want to keep doing that every year\u2014just ten a year, one church doing ten a year.\u00a0 Then, we want to be able to clone that program on hundreds, if not thousands, of churches, all over the country.\u00a0 Hopefully, 10,000 young men every year would be provided with mentors through the local church.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 You get that model created and come back.\u00a0 We\u2019ll help you pick up a few hundred, if not a few thousand churches\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 There you go.\u00a0 Give us a couple of years.\u00a0 We\u2019ll be knocking on your door.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014because that\u2019s a much-needed ministry.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou've written a book, and I want to read just a section of this.\u00a0 Then, I want you to explain this to our listeners because you said, \u201cIn some ways, writing thoughts about a father, or not having a father, I feel as though I am writing a book about a dragon or a troll under a bridge.\u00a0 For me, a father is nothing more than a character in a fairy tale.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNow, can you explain what you're trying to say there?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, I think I was trying to point to the reality of the fact that, growing up without a dad, I was constantly asked the question, or people would look at me with sympathetic eyes, or something.\u00a0 I\u2019d say, \u201cWell, I didn't have a dad.\u201d\u00a0 Their response taught me that there was something odd about that.\u00a0 I wouldn\u2019t have known that there was something odd about that were it not for those responses.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt was that kind of a picture that I was trying to paint for people, who grew up with dads, to try to understand, \u201cHere is what it kind of looks like.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 There's a sense in which whatever we grow up in is our own definition of normal; right?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Exactly.\u00a0 That\u2019s exactly it.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 So, for you, growing up without a dad was normal.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Normal in the sense that it was my experience.\u00a0 Of course, part of the point of the whole discussion is to say that it\u2019s not normal.\u00a0 I had to come to grips with the idea that this was not perfect or even good, you know, or healthy.\u00a0 Now, God breaks into dark reality all over the place.\u00a0 That's the whole point of Scripture is to show God breaking into a dark reality; but at the same time, there has to be this admission of dark reality.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSo, yes, having grown up without a dad, I had to step out of myself and look back and say, \u201cNow, what were the things that I missed?\u201d\u00a0 You know, now that I realize that I was supposed to have a dad\u2014\u201cWhat did I miss in the process of growing up without a father?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 When do you think you first became aware of the fact that your normal wasn\u2019t normal and that there was a deficit as a result of that?\u00a0 Do you remember a time or a place, where you went\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 I remember a season.\u00a0 It was my mid-20s.\u00a0 A guy named John McMurray invited me to move in with him and his family.\u00a0 John was leading a college Bible study at the church I was going to.\u00a0 He invited me to come in and live with his wife and their kids, Chris, Elle, and Cassy.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt was during that season\u2014it was four years\u2014but it was the first year that I realized such a thing exists as a father because moving in with John and Terri\u2014I thought the system was very strange.\u00a0 I mean, here you have a perfectly normal family\u2014by that, I mean, a woman and her three children.\u00a0 Then, you have this man who fixes the washing machine and still spends the night every night.\u00a0 I didn't understand that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSo, you're just kind of going, \u201cThis is a bit weird.\u201d\u00a0 Then, it was that first year of realizing, \u201cNo, this is actually a very good system.\u00a0 I get it.\u00a0 I see how this works and how these people work together.\u201d\u00a0 They actually have a very healthy family.\u00a0 It was really nice that I was able to see that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThen, the secondary question is, \u201cWait a second, I grew up without this.\u00a0 What did I miss?\u00a0 What did I miss out on?\u201d\u00a0 Without having moved in with a family, I would have never probably asked that question.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 I want to challenge you on that for a second.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 You said that was the season when you finally came to the conclusion that there was something missing.\u00a0 Now, as a young lad growing up in a home\u2014going to all kinds of events around school, and athletics, and all the things in childhood and boyhood\u2014weren't there moments in that where you turned around and you noticed, \u201cEvery other boy here as got a dad to help him, but I don\u2019t\u201d?\u00a0 In fact, you alluded to it when\u2014was it Boy Scouts\u2014no one helped you fix the derby car?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 There were countless moments like that.\u00a0 The realization was, \u201cI don't have a dad\u201d, but never the assumption that, \u201cI should have.\u201d\u00a0 \u201cI was made different,\u201d you know?\u00a0 That's a very sad kind of reality to think about; but, yes, when I was a kid, my mom did a great job of trying to plug me into communities that existed with father figures and those sorts of things.\u00a0 One of those communities was Cub Scouts\u2014I went to Cub Scouts, and we had to make these pine box\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes, the Pinewood Derby.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 The Pinewood Derby; right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 I was in that; yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 All the guys\u2019 dads were supposed to help me, but they were busy helping their own sons.\u00a0 My mom would just drop me off at meeting, you know?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 She was making the assumption that there would be\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014somebody was there helping me.\u00a0 I write about, in the book, how I don't even think my car had wheels on it.\u00a0 There was just a lot of WD-40 on the bottom of a block of wood.\u00a0 (Laughing)\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Now\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 So, it wasn't\u2014but that was a very sad\u2014I mean, we laugh now, but that was very, very sad.\u00a0 I remember that being a very sad evening.\u00a0 It was not a happy time.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes, that's where I was going to take you on that.\u00a0 We're laughing about that; but, for a boy, he's looking at his buddies\u2019 cars, which are\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014at least finishing.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014painted.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 They're at least rolling.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes, yes\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014and yours doesn't even have hardly any wheels on it.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 What did you feel at that moment?\u00a0 Do you recall?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 No, I do recall.\u00a0 The way I felt was\u2014and this was a constant feeling, having grown up with those situations, consistently happening\u2014I felt like there was something wrong with me.\u00a0 I never, ever felt like this was because I didn't have a dad.\u00a0 That never crossed my mind.\u00a0 That was too complicated to put that together.\u00a0 \u201cThere was just something wrong with me.\u00a0 I couldn\u2019t make a car.\u00a0 I couldn\u2019t make the car work right.\u00a0 I couldn\u2019t figure that out.\u201d\u00a0 I guess the assumption was that, intuitively, other boys my age knew that stuff.\u00a0 They were just good at making Pinewood cars, and I was not good at making a Pinewood car.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAt the time, I did not make the connection that they had fathers helping them.\u00a0 You know, just way too insecure to make that connection.\u00a0 You\u2019re just\u2014at this point, you\u2019re just\u2014you\u2019re sort of fending for your life, you know?\u00a0 You\u2019re just trying to matter, you\u2019re trying to\u2014you know, those kinds of things, and\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>You know, Don, I want to just hitchhike off the point you\u2019re making there because it\u2019s so simple; and yet, it\u2019s so profound.\u00a0 Boys were made by God to have daddies.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Oh, yes, yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 They really were.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 And girls too; right?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 And girls too, absolutely; but in this culture, where six out of ten young people today are spending part of their first 18 years of life with one parent, that\u2019s not an assumption that we necessarily embrace as a culture.\u00a0 The last verse in the Old Testament talks about the coming of the Messiah; and to me, it\u2019s a great statement of a value\u2014the value of being a father to your child.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tMalachi, Chapter 4, verse 6, \u201cAnd He will restore the hearts of the fathers to their children, and the hearts of the children to their fathers; lest I come and smite the land with a curse.\u201d\u00a0 This connection, this\u2014I can\u2019t even describe it\u2014it\u2019s a mysterious connection of a father\/son, father\/daughter, relationship.\u00a0 Somehow, it\u2019s a preventative to a nation, some kind of protection for the longevity of the ability of a nation to continue.\u00a0 It\u2019s that vital.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhat we\u2019re speaking to today\u2014and the reason we wanted you to share your story with our listeners\u2014Bob, we have a nation full of young men and women, who like Don, reflect back on their childhood.\u00a0 It really is like the troll and the dragon\u2014it\u2019s a fairy tale.\u00a0 There was no father in their lives.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 So, your sense was, \u201cSomething\u2019s wrong with me.\u201d\u00a0 You look back on it and say, \u201cWell, what was wrong was I didn\u2019t have somebody helping me understand what manhood is all about.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Exactly; and I really understood that only a couple of years ago, when I started this book.\u00a0 I was watching a documentary\u2014I think it was on <em>Animal Planet<\/em><em><sup>\u00ae<\/sup><\/em>, or the <em>Discovery Channel<\/em><em><sup>\u00ae<\/sup><\/em>, something like that\u2014and it was about these elephants in Africa.\u00a0 There's a wildlife refuge where they have taken\u201415 or 20 years ago, they took 25 orphaned, very young elephants.\u00a0 They rescued them.\u00a0 They brought them to this wildlife refuge in Africa.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tTwenty years later, the male elephants are reaching adolescence.\u00a0 It's a slower process in elephants.\u00a0 When this happens to them, the elephant routine is they'll enter into a musk cycle.\u00a0 That musk cycle will last a few days.\u00a0 Then, it will be over; and that's sort of their entry into adulthood.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThese elephants entered into musk cycle\u2014the young men\u2014and did not come out of it.\u00a0 It was three days, and then a week, and then two weeks, and then a month.\u00a0 It never stopped.\u00a0 They began to behave extremely aggressively, which is not like an elephant at all.\u00a0 They began to kill rhinos.\u00a0 They were isolated from the community.\u00a0 They fought with each other in very violent ways.\u00a0 The people that worked the refuge were trying to figure it out.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThey went back, and they studied why the elephants are doing this.\u00a0 They discovered that this musk cycle lasts for three days in the young men until they enter into a mentoring relationship with an older elephant.\u00a0 It's upon\u2014that musk cycle is a cue for the older elephant to come alongside that younger elephant and teach them how to be a man elephant\u2014how to be a grown elephant\u2014what the muscle is for, what the strength is for, how to protect the community\u2014these kinds of things.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBiochemically, the musk cycle ends upon the relationship with the older mentoring elephant.\u00a0 There were no older, mentoring elephants on the wildlife refuge.\u00a0 These were all young elephants, growing up together.\u00a0 There was nothing there to stop the musk cycle.\u00a0 They actually brought in some older elephants, a couple of older elephants.\u00a0 Immediately, the bonding sort of took place.\u00a0 The musk cycles ended, and everything turned out fine.\u00a0 It was watching that that made me realize that it was probably more than just, \u201cI didn't learn to make a pinewood car.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThere is something actually that we learn relationally by having an older, stronger, more-together, wise man, around in our lives that we just sort of\u2014there's a feeling of security there, a feeling of comfort.\u00a0 There's a kind of an adoration and sense of, \u201cI want to be like this man.\u00a0 I want to\u201d\u2014and there's a kind of guiding principle.\u00a0 A lot of it has nothing to do with sitting down and learning to throw a baseball.\u00a0 It's just intrinsic in the family dynamic that is created.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI began to wonder if it wasn't also true for humans, the way it's true for an elephant.\u00a0 It's something like that.\u00a0 Then, you find out, you know\u2014I went on and read this very academic book about the fatherless crisis in our country.\u00a0 It talked about 85 percent of men in prison grew up in homes completely without a father\u201485 percent.\u00a0 Another 10 percent or so had very bad role models, in terms of father figures.\u00a0 So, 95 percent of the people in prison did not have good fathers or fathers at all.\u00a0 I thought, \u201cThat's a very real picture of this sort of elephant analogy.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou know, I had mentors and mentoring relationships in my life.\u00a0 John McMurray was one of those guys, but I wonder where my life would be without even that little bit of father-figure mentoring stuff.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 You also compared the hand-off that occurs, father to son, to an airplane trip you took\u2014where you plugged in and listened to the pilots talk to one another, back and forth\u2014because I think this further illustrates the very point you\u2019re talking about.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes, yes.\u00a0 I had, for years, had a problem with authority and didn't realize I had a problem with authority.\u00a0 I just thought people were wrong.\u00a0 (Laughter)\u00a0 I mean, that's very important\u2014as comical as it is.\u00a0 I think there are probably a lot of people who will identify with that.\u00a0 \u201cI don't have a problem with authority.\u00a0 They're just wrong.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Rules are\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Rules are not correct.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 No, they're meant to be broken.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Exactly.\u00a0 I had a problem with that for years and was on a flight, out of Chicago flying to Portland.\u00a0 You know, how sometimes they'll let you plug in and listen to pilots talking to each other?\u00a0 The pilots\u2014they still have this system, where on a popular route like that, where there is a lot of plane traffic.\u00a0 There are planes flying to Portland all the time.\u00a0 They will call back weather patterns to the plane that's behind them, and they will receive calls from the plane that's in front of them, by an hour or so.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThey\u2019re constantly receiving signals from the people in front of them saying, \u201cHey, there\u2019s choppy air.\u00a0 You're going to want to go up a couple of thousand feet and get over this storm,\u201d or whatever it is.\u00a0 Then, the pilot, who was flying my plane, will then call back, an hour or so behind, and say, \u201cHey, everything looks smooth here.\u00a0 We\u2019re getting some disturbances an hour ahead, but we\u2019ll keep you posted on that when we get there.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI really thought, \u201cWell, that\u2019s such a beautiful picture of what I\u2019m missing in my life.\u00a0 Nobody is calling back to me by 20, 25 years and saying, \u2018Hey, you know, work ethic looks like this,\u201d and, \u201cHere is how you should manage money\u2019\u201d\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014\u201cand this is how you care for a woman.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014\u201chere is how you care for a woman, and here is how you raise kids.\u201d\u00a0 That was simply not happening because of my distrust and dislike for authority, which all stems from father stuff.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHere is what I mean.\u00a0 If you didn\u2019t have a dad, you kind of hang out at the Pinewood Derby car race; and you feel like you don\u2019t belong.\u00a0 The thing that makes you feel like you don\u2019t belong are these other older males.\u00a0 Well, if these older males are giving you signals that, \u201cYou don\u2019t belong,\u201d you tend not to like them.\u00a0 I mean, you tend to go, \u201cWell, if I don\u2019t belong, you don\u2019t belong,\u201d or, \u201cIf you don't like me, I don't like you.\u201d\u00a0 There you have the whole establishment of not trusting, or liking, or wanting authority.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSo, if somebody comes in and says, \u201cHey, I want you to do this,\u201d you've kind of got this feeling, \u201cMan, you\u2019ve told me\u201d\u2014even if you never met this guy\u2014\u201cYou've told me, all my life, I don\u2019t matter.\u00a0 Now, you want me to do this?\u00a0 You\u2019re just using me.\u00a0 I\u2019m not going to do it.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Not only that, but you wind up hanging around with other young men\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014who feel the same way.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 So, that herd, that elephant herd, now is on the loose.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Don:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes, it can be.\u00a0 I mean, when I was in junior high, we were already breaking into houses, stealing loose change and stuff from people\u2019s dressers.\u00a0 That would have escalated\u2014I\u2019m pretty confident it would have escalated\u2014but there was a man named David Gentiles.\u00a0 He\u2019s the first guy who kind of took me under his wing, in a way, and provided a mentoring relationship.\u00a0 It was at that very critical time.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou know, I don't know if it was all Dave or what it was; but there was just this sense of, \u201cI kind of want to be like that guy,\u201d and, \u201cThat guy isn\u2019t breaking into houses, stealing loose change off of people\u2019s dressers.\u00a0 That guy has a job, and a family, and he seems to be a pretty well-together kind of guy.\u201d\u00a0 That is what rescued me from\u2014and ultimately, it was God because Scripture tells us that He is going to provide for us.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>You know, when my sons have been in junior high and high school, one of the questions I\u2019ve asked them is\u2014I\u2019ve said, \u201cLook ahead of you, four or five years, and just pick somebody\u2014who would it be?\u00a0 Pick somebody that you think, \u2018Five years from now, that\u2019s the kind of guy I\u2019d like to be like.\u2019\u201d\u00a0 You know, they are doing that, whether they are doing it intentionally or not.\u00a0 I\u2019m just trying to make sure that they\u2019re thinking about who they would like to be like rather than just deciding; you know?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Or getting their marching orders from the herd\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014as we\u2019ve just been talking about here.\u00a0 I think there are a couple of key applications here, for a father, that I don\u2019t want to miss. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNumber one:\u00a0 Your children need a relationship with you.\u00a0 They don\u2019t just need your presence at the games.\u00a0 They don\u2019t just need you to show up.\u00a0 They need a heart-to-heart, soul-to-soul, intentional relationship with you, where you tell them, \u201cYou love them,\u201d you tell them, \u201cYou are proud of them,\u201d you communicate that , \u201cYou\u2019re glad and you\u2019re privileged to be their father.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br>Secondly\u2014and I think this is what I got from your book, Don, as I was reading it.\u00a0 Dads today have to be intentional with young men and with young ladies around issues of masculinity and femininity.\u00a0 They need to define, for their sons, what a real man is, and what a real man does, and how a real man behaves.\u00a0 They need to do that, not once, but over, and over, and over again.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAs we do that\u2014as we, as fathers, do that, even so imperfectly through our own mistakes\u2014I think that\u2019s where the hand-off occurs, like you talked about from the lead airplane calling back to the next airplane that\u2019s 25 years younger and affirming those things that are found in Scripture.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBob, I think today, men, more than ever, need training, they need encouragement, they need help.\u00a0 For many, they may need\u2014they may need to reflect upon their own relationship, or lack of relationship, with their father like Don has written about in his book.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 The book is called <em>Father Fiction<\/em>.\u00a0 It\u2019s a book we\u2019ve got in our <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> Resource Center.\u00a0 If our listeners are interested, they can go to FamilyLifeToday.com for more information on the book and on how you have reflected on this issue, as one who grew up without a dad.\u00a0 Again, the title of the book is <em>Father Fiction<\/em>.\u00a0 Go to FamilyLifeToday.com for more information on the book.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI should probably mention here that the book, <em>Blue Like Jazz<\/em>, which is probably your best-known book, has just been turned into a movie and is coming to theaters this weekend.\u00a0 I haven\u2019t had a chance to see it, but I know a lot of people are curious about the film and how your story in <em>Blue Like Jazz<\/em> gets translated to the movie theater screen.\u00a0 We want to let people know about that, as well.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAgain, for more information about the book, <em>Father Fiction<\/em>, go to FamilyLifeToday.com.\u00a0 You can order from us online, or you can call 1-800-FL-TODAY to order.\u00a0 That\u2019s 1-800- \u201cF\u201d as in family, \u201cL\u201d as in life, and then the word, \u201cTODAY\u201d.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNow, let me take just a minute and say, \u201cThanks,\u201d to the folks who help support the ministry of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> by making a donation from time to time to support what we\u2019re doing.\u00a0 We are listener-supported, and it\u2019s your donations that help cover the cost of producing and syndicating this daily radio program.\u00a0 We appreciate your help with that and your participation in this ministry.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThis week, if you are able to help with a donation of any amount, we\u2019d like to send you as a thank-you gift a copy of Barbara Rainey\u2019s brand-new devotional guide for families.\u00a0 It\u2019s called <em>Growing Together in <\/em>Forgiveness\u2014seven stories about what it means to forgive and to be forgiven\u2014designed to help foster and cultivate an attitude of forgiveness in your home.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe had a number of you get in touch with us recently to request a copy of this book.\u00a0 We still have copies available, and again, it\u2019s our thank-you gift to you when you help support the ministry of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> this week.\u00a0 If you can make a donation online at FamilyLifeToday.com, all you have to do is click the button that says, \u201cI Care\u201d.\u00a0 When you make your online donation, we\u2019ll send the book out to you automatically; or call 1-800-FL-TODAY.\u00a0 Make a donation over the phone; and ask for your copy of the book, <em>Growing Together in Forgiveness<\/em>, by Barbara Rainey, when you get in touch with us.\u00a0 We do appreciate your support.\u00a0 Glad to have you on the team, and we appreciate your listening to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br>I want to encourage you to be back with us again tomorrow when we\u2019re going to hear again from Donald Miller\u2014find out more about what it was like for him, growing up without a dad.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch, and our entire broadcast production team.\u00a0 On behalf of our host, Dennis Rainey, I'm Bob Lepine.\u00a0 We will see you back next time for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHelp for today.\u00a0 Hope for tomorrow.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you.\u00a0 However, there is a cost to produce them for our website.\u00a0 If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright \u00a9 2012 FamilyLife.\u00a0 All rights reserved.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/\">www.FamilyLife.com<\/a>\u00a0 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