{"id":302436,"date":"2012-01-05T12:00:00","date_gmt":"2012-01-05T17:00:00","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/%series%\/basking-in-gods-grace\/"},"modified":"2012-01-05T12:00:00","modified_gmt":"2012-01-05T17:00:00","slug":"basking-in-gods-grace","status":"publish","type":"podcast","link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/basking-in-gods-grace\/","title":{"rendered":"Basking in God&#8217;s Grace"},"content":{"rendered":"","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Marvin Olasky came to realize that there was more to these Christians than he first thought.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":91,"featured_media":294104,"menu_order":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","template":"","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","inline_featured_image":false,"_uag_custom_page_level_css":"","episode_type":"","audio_file":"https:\/\/web.familylifetoday.com\/fl2012-01-05.mp3","podmotor_file_id":"","podmotor_episode_id":"","cover_image":"","cover_image_id":"","duration":"00:","filesize":"23.01M","filesize_raw":"24127787","date_recorded":"","explicit":"","block":""},"categories":[2906],"tags":[4133,4134,4679],"podcast_series":[7849],"cwp_profile":[9254],"series":[2101],"class_list":["post-302436","podcast","type-podcast","status-publish","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-becoming-a-christian","tag-coming-to-christ","tag-life-change","tag-salvation","podcast_series-an-unmerited-mercy","cwp_profile-marvin-olasky","series-familylife-today"],"acf":[],"episode_featured_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/09\/FLT-Podcast-Cover-2-508x508-3.jpg?w=508","episode_player_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2023\/02\/image-scaled.jpg","download_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-download\/302436\/basking-in-gods-grace","player_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-player\/302436\/basking-in-gods-grace","audio_player":null,"episode_data":{"playerMode":"light","subscribeUrls":{"apple_podcasts":{"key":"apple_podcasts","url":"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303?mt=2&app=podcast","label":"Apple Podcasts","class":"apple_podcasts","icon":"apple-podcasts.png"},"google_podcasts":{"key":"google_podcasts","url":"","label":"Google Podcasts","class":"google_podcasts","icon":"google-podcasts.png"},"spotify":{"key":"spotify","url":"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm","label":"Spotify","class":"spotify","icon":"spotify.png"},"youtube":{"key":"youtube","url":"","label":"YouTube","class":"youtube","icon":"youtube.png"}},"rssFeedUrl":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/feed\/podcast\/familylife-today","embedCode":"<blockquote class=\"wp-embedded-content\" data-secret=\"7T7Liiuczz\"><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/basking-in-gods-grace\/\">Basking in God&#8217;s Grace<\/a><\/blockquote><iframe sandbox=\"allow-scripts\" security=\"restricted\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/basking-in-gods-grace\/embed\/#?secret=7T7Liiuczz\" width=\"500\" height=\"350\" title=\"&#8220;Basking in God&#8217;s Grace&#8221; &#8212; FamilyLife\u00ae - A Cru Ministry\" data-secret=\"7T7Liiuczz\" frameborder=\"0\" marginwidth=\"0\" marginheight=\"0\" scrolling=\"no\" class=\"wp-embedded-content\"><\/iframe><script>\n\/*! This file is auto-generated *\/\n!function(d,l){\"use strict\";l.querySelector&&d.addEventListener&&\"undefined\"!=typeof URL&&(d.wp=d.wp||{},d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage||(d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage=function(e){var t=e.data;if((t||t.secret||t.message||t.value)&&!\/[^a-zA-Z0-9]\/.test(t.secret)){for(var s,r,n,a=l.querySelectorAll('iframe[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),o=l.querySelectorAll('blockquote[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),c=new RegExp(\"^https?:$\",\"i\"),i=0;i<o.length;i++)o[i].style.display=\"none\";for(i=0;i<a.length;i++)s=a[i],e.source===s.contentWindow&&(s.removeAttribute(\"style\"),\"height\"===t.message?(1e3<(r=parseInt(t.value,10))?r=1e3:~~r<200&&(r=200),s.height=r):\"link\"===t.message&&(r=new URL(s.getAttribute(\"src\")),n=new URL(t.value),c.test(n.protocol))&&n.host===r.host&&l.activeElement===s&&(d.top.location.href=t.value))}},d.addEventListener(\"message\",d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage,!1),l.addEventListener(\"DOMContentLoaded\",function(){for(var e,t,s=l.querySelectorAll(\"iframe.wp-embedded-content\"),r=0;r<s.length;r++)(t=(e=s[r]).getAttribute(\"data-secret\"))||(t=Math.random().toString(36).substring(2,12),e.src+=\"#?secret=\"+t,e.setAttribute(\"data-secret\",t)),e.contentWindow.postMessage({message:\"ready\",secret:t},\"*\")},!1)))}(window,document);\n\/\/# sourceURL=https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-includes\/js\/wp-embed.min.js\n<\/script>\n"},"uagb_featured_image_src":{"full":["https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/09\/FLT-Podcast-Cover-2-508x508-3.jpg",508,508,false]},"uagb_author_info":{"display_name":"kfairris@familylife.com","author_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/author\/kfairrisfamilylife-com\/"},"uagb_comment_info":0,"uagb_excerpt":"Marvin Olasky came to realize that there was more to these Christians than he first thought.","meta_box":{"show_notes":"","transcript_url":"https:\/\/transcript.familylifetoday.com\/fl2012-01-05.pdf","transcript_content":"<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 You\u2019ve heard of people described as spiritual seekers; right?\u00a0 When Marvin Olasky was a graduate student at the University of Michigan, he was definitely not a spiritual seeker; but God was pursuing him.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Marvin:<\/strong>\u00a0 I\u2019d grown up with lots of prejudices against Christians.\u00a0 I thought\u2014and this is not unusual in Judaism\u2014I thought that Christians were rather silly, stupid people who worshiped Christmas trees.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSo, I was assigned, as a graduate student, to teach this course on Early American Literature, that no one else wanted to teach.\u00a0 I had never studied Early American Literature; but suddenly, I had to teach this.\u00a0 So, I just went through a crash course of reading.\u00a0 \u201cWhat\u2019s Early American Literature?\u201d\u00a0 It\u2019s lot of Puritan sermons.\u00a0 Here, finally, I encountered Jonathan Edwards\u2014after avoiding him when I was at Yale\u2014and all his papers were there.\u00a0 Then, people like Increase Mather and John Cotton and others\u2014reading their sermons, reading their writing.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tPeople sometimes talk about\u2014well, \u201cThe dead, white males from 300 years ago,\u201d and so forth.\u00a0 Well, these dead, white males were preaching to me.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u00a0<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 This is <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> for Thursday, January 5<sup>th<\/sup>.\u00a0 Our host is the President of FamilyLife\u00ae Dennis Rainey, and I\u2019m Bob Lepine.\u00a0 Marvin Olasky joins us today to share, not only how dead, white males were preaching to him while he was a college student, but how the Hound of Heaven was after him as well.\u00a0 Stay tuned.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd welcome to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\u00a0 Thanks for joining us on the Thursday edition.\u00a0 I think it is Winston Churchill who is the one who said\u2014somewhat famously\u2014\u201cIf any man is not a liberal at 20, he has no heart; and if he is not a conservative at age 30, he has no brain.\u201d\u00a0 I think that\u2019s what the quote was.\u00a0 (Laughter)\u00a0 Our guest may know the quote better than I do.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Undoubtedly.\u00a0 Dr. Marvin Olasky joins us again on <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\u00a0 Do you know the quote?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Marvin:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right.\u00a0 It\u2019s what you\u2019ve just said\u2014is that, \u201ca liberal at 20,\u201d and then, \u201cif you\u2019re not a conservative\u201d\u2014may have been by 40\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Marvin:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014has no brain.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Kind of fits your life a little bit; doesn\u2019t it?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Marvin:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, it does.\u00a0 I would like to think that it was all heart on my part.\u00a0 I mean, there was heart, but there was also a sinful heart.\u00a0 There was a lot of resentment, anger, and even murderous thoughts.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, Marvin Olasky is currently the holder of the Distinguished Chair in Journalism and Public Policy at Patrick Henry College.\u00a0 He\u2019s also currently the editor-in-chief of <em>WORLD Magazine;<\/em> but he is a former radical, a former card-carrying Communist, a former writer for <em>The Boston Globe<\/em>.\u00a0 He and his wife Susan live in Asheville, North Carolina.\u00a0 They have four sons.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI have to ask you this story because this goes back to my day when I was on the college campus, when they had massive demonstrations of college students.\u00a0 You were among the half million students who showed up at the Reflecting Pool in Washington, D.C.\u00a0 What in the world was that like in 1970?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Marvin:<\/strong>\u00a0 At Yale and many other colleges, classes were called off to give you time to go to demonstrations and so forth.\u00a0 We had the first week in May\u2014there were big demonstrations in New Haven, connected with Bobby Seale, one of the Black Panthers.\u00a0 There were 5,000 National Guard troops with live ammo there.\u00a0 This was three days before Kent State.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThere were thousands of students.\u00a0 Many had come from other colleges and so forth for these demonstrations.\u00a0 The nights were full of tear gas, as students were throwing rocks at the National Guardsmen; and they were shooting tear gas back.\u00a0 That\u2019s the one time I met Allen Ginsberg, the famous sort of beat poet, who was sitting as the tear gas was floating around and just chanting, \u201cOm, om, om.\u201d\u00a0 That was pretty impressive (Laughter); but that was one week\u2014tear gas, National Guard troops, and riots.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnother week\u2014and again, classes were called off\u2014another week, campaigning for peace candidates in various places.\u00a0 Spent five days in Philadelphia\u2014campaigning, going door to door, for a candidate\u2014and ended up getting kicked by a Congressman on primary day, which I probably deserved (although that was rather impolite for him to do that).\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThen, the following weekend with the 500,000 in Washington, D.C., in the Reflecting Pool; and it was party time.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Were you there throwing rocks with the others?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Marvin:<\/strong>\u00a0 No.\u00a0 One thing, with all my sinful tendencies and practice at times, I never did throw rocks; and I never boo baseball players, even when they deserve it.\u00a0 (Laughter)\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThese were just wild times, and it was\u2014there was excitement.\u00a0 I will tell you just one strange thing\u2014and this shows the level of security then compared to now.\u00a0 There was a former editor of the <em>Yale Daily News<\/em> who was working in the White House\u2014and he just gave my roommates and I a tour of the White House.\u00a0 Here, we were coming in this radical way to demonstrate\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Wow!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Marvin:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014but one evening, we\u2019re in the White House.\u00a0 He was showing us all around the place.\u00a0 There was\u2014I guess, since we came in with him, we weren\u2019t asked to show our drivers\u2019 licenses or anything like that.\u00a0 We could just sort of wander around\u2014very strange times.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 This was the Nixon White House?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Marvin:<\/strong>\u00a0 This was the Nixon White House.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>An editor from the <em>Yale Daily News<\/em> had a job in the Nixon White House?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Marvin:<\/strong>\u00a0 A job\u2014he was a conservative from several years back; but since we were working reporters on the <em>Yale Daily News<\/em>, he was kind enough to show us around.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Wow!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Marvin:<\/strong>\u00a0 Just strange\u2014this combination of being, in a sense, in power with the future leaders and having these connections and so forth; but at the same time, demonstrating and being very hateful and always writing America with three K\u2019s, K-K-K, and just full of hate.\u00a0 A spoiled group of haters\u2014it was really weird.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 As we mentioned earlier, you found yourself reading an essay by Lenin called <em>Socialism and Religion<\/em>.\u00a0 It was, in essence, a wake-up call from an atheist that God used in your life to say, \u201cWhat if Lenin is wrong?\u00a0 What if there is a God?\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Marvin:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 This is while you were at the University of Michigan, doing your graduate work; and Michigan was no bastion of conservativism or godliness; was it?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Marvin:<\/strong>\u00a0 No, not at all.\u00a0 The strange thing here was that in my first semester at the University of Michigan, while I was a Communist, the professors thought I was brilliant.\u00a0 A couple of years later, as I was becoming a Christian, one of the same professors, who was the chairman of the department, who had thought I was a genius, didn\u2019t understand that there had been a change in worldview\u2014that, here was a philosophical and theological battle.\u00a0 Instead, he thought that, for some reason, I had just become incredibly stupid.\u00a0 (Laughter)\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAt that time, it wasn\u2019t funny to me at all because he was the chairman of my dissertation committee.\u00a0 Just a month before I was supposed to be finished and defend the dissertation, he resigned from my committee\u2014just saying he would not countenance being on the committee of a person who had become a conservative and a Christian.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 You tell the story of how you started reading a Russian New Testament.\u00a0 You\u2019d become fluent in Russian.\u00a0 So\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Marvin:<\/strong>\u00a0 Not fluent, but able to read a little.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Why didn\u2019t you just read an English New Testament?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Marvin:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, again, this is the way God often works.\u00a0 I was not seeking God at that point\u2014I should have been.\u00a0 I mean, I knew that there was a god of some sort.\u00a0 I should have dropped everything and been searching, and finding, and reading, and so forth.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut, after several weeks, I had my term papers to write.\u00a0 I had my course work to do.\u00a0 I went back into the swing of things.\u00a0 I had left the Communist Party; but I was concerned, at that point, with developing my academic career.\u00a0 I wasn\u2019t pursuing God, as logically I should have; but in order to pursue my academic career, I had to have a very good reading knowledge of a foreign language.\u00a0 I had forgotten my childhood Hebrew and high school French\u2014so, Russian, at this point, was my language.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI had been reading lots of books in Russian\u2014foraging around in my bookcase one night just for something in Russian that I hadn\u2019t read.\u00a0 I had read some short stories and so forth.\u00a0 I ran across this New Testament in Russian that I had been given a couple of years before and had just held onto as a novelty item, a souvenir of a sort, from my time in Oregon\u2014didn\u2019t throw away books at all in those times, didn\u2019t give them away, throw them away.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI had it there in my bookcase and started reading, not as I logically should have been for thinking\u2014finding out about who God is\u2014but just for reading practice.\u00a0 It was just Russian language stuff that I hadn\u2019t read.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 So, as you read the New Testament?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Marvin:<\/strong>\u00a0 The\u2014in Matthew, the early part, with lots of \u201cbegats\u201d\u2014that a lot of people don\u2019t like\u2014was actually fun for me because I knew the words and got through that fairly quickly.\u00a0 By the time I got to the Sermon on the Mount in Chapters 5 and 6, I was thinking, \u201cWow!\u00a0 This is really something special.\u00a0 There\u2019s something extraordinary going on here.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI\u2019d read a little bit of Tolstoy and Dostoevsky, but this wasn\u2019t human.\u00a0 This was something that was God-inspired in some way.\u00a0 I needed to find out more about who this God is.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 A lot of us today want to ask someone, \u201cWhen did you become a follower of Christ?\u201d\u00a0 When did you become a Christian?\u00a0 As I\u2019m looking at your story, it\u2019s not altogether clear.\u00a0 I find, all of the sudden in 1975, at the University of Michigan, as you\u2019re doing your PhD work, that you run into this cute, co-ed named Susan.\u00a0 That ends up being a part of the story.\u00a0 She wasn\u2019t even a follower of Christ at this point.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Marvin:<\/strong>\u00a0 No.\u00a0 Here is what is strange.\u00a0 She came from a very liberal United Methodist background, Hillary Clinton-type background.\u00a0 Here, I was originally from a Jewish background and then atheism.\u00a0 I was a grad student; she was an undergraduate.\u00a0 So, of course, I felt in the position of a teacher and so forth.\u00a0 I was throwing books at her to read, and these were Christian books. It was very strange.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI didn\u2019t know I was a Christian, but nevertheless, this was the type\u2014this was what was appealing to me at the time.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 So, you think you were a believer in Christ at that point?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Marvin:<\/strong>\u00a0 I think I was a very weak believer at that point.\u00a0 The time when I made a profession of faith was about a year after that, in the fall of 1976; but there was this period from November 1, 1973 through the fall of 1976 where slowly, fighting every step of the way, with a lot of intellectual pride, I was gradually\u2014God was gradually moving me step by step toward Him in a way that\u2014by the time I met Susan\u2014here I was wanting her to read Christian books because I thought there was some wisdom there\u2014it is very strange.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 It\u2019s interesting as you describe it\u2014it sounds a lot like a book I read a number of years ago\u2014you probably read it as well\u2014the book, <em>A Severe Mercy, <\/em>where the author of the book describes his own wrestling with Christianity.\u00a0 He was a student at Oxford at the time and was corresponding with C.S. Lewis.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThere came a point in their correspondence when this student was asking Lewis questions; and Lewis finally wrote him back and said, \u201cI\u2019ve decided not to answer your questions anymore.\u00a0 It\u2019s obvious to me the Hound of Heaven is after you, and it\u2019s just a matter of time.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Marvin:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 That\u2019s really\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Marvin:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014where you were struggling and wrestling; but every step along the way, as you were reading, whatever it was you were reading, God was just opening your eyes.\u00a0 Dennis described\u2014you were passing along\u2014do you remember what some of the books you were giving to this young co-ed was?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Marvin:<\/strong>\u00a0 One of them was Whittaker Chambers\u2019 book, <em>Witness<\/em>.\u00a0 Chambers had been a Communist who became a Christian.\u00a0 Another was a book by Mark Hatfield.\u00a0 Now, Hatfield was liberal politically; but theologically, he was right on.\u00a0 This basically showed what he thought about God.\u00a0 So, I wanted her to read that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Were you passing these onto her because you were trying to influence her own thinking?\u00a0 She wasn\u2019t a Christian either, and you were just trying to bring her along?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Marvin:<\/strong>\u00a0 I thought, with my graduate student and general intellectual arrogance, that here was an undergraduate who had been taking a lot of mushy courses, as I had done as an undergraduate; and I needed to teach her some things.\u00a0 I needed to strengthen her intellectually.\u00a0 Probably, also, just wanting to impress her and be in the driver\u2019s seat in the relationship.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 You\u2019re saying there was more than an academic interest in this relationship.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Here\u2019s the way I would put it.\u00a0 He was feeding her some books and some lines\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Simultaneously.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014because you end up going out; and then, two weeks later\u2014what happened?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Marvin:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, I proposed to her.\u00a0 I\u2019m not sure how serious I was really in asking.\u00a0 I\u2019m not sure how serious she was in accepting, but yes.\u00a0 It did mean something.\u00a0 Then, later on, I had to re-propose to her, of course, when it was serious.\u00a0 She was and is an extraordinarily charming person.\u00a0 I liked every aspect of her and wanted her to be as beautiful intellectually, in my view, as she was in other ways.\u00a0 So, I had my ulterior motives in all this.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, in June, you married; and was she a believer at that point\u2014at the point you married her or still responding to God in her own way?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Marvin:<\/strong>\u00a0 I\u2019d say the latter, responding in her own way.\u00a0 Both of us were very close to being believers, but we had absolutely no experience in what this really means.\u00a0 We weren\u2019t going to church or anything.\u00a0 We had a lot to learn.\u00a0 We married and drove off to San Diego, where I was going to be teaching at a university.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAt that point, we agreed, \u201cWell, let\u2019s go to church and just find out if any people today still believe anything like what these Puritans, who had influenced me greatly, believed 300 years ago.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, I\u2019m curious\u2014where somebody who grows up in a Jewish home, becomes a Communist, then, goes to Yale and Michigan, and ultimately, starts drifting toward to Christianity\u2014where do you get married?\u00a0 What kind of ceremony was it?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Marvin:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, we were married in the living room of her parents.\u00a0 We would have had a justice of the peace, but there wasn\u2019t anyone available.\u00a0 So, we had a pastor from a very liberal denomination who lived down the street\u2014had never met us.\u00a0 We didn\u2019t have any marital counseling or pre-marital counseling or anything like that.\u00a0 He just did it because he was available on that particular day.\u00a0 We paid him, and that\u2019s the first and last we ever saw of him.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 What about your parents at this point?\u00a0 I mean, what are Jewish parents thinking about this Gentile you\u2019re about to marry?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Marvin:<\/strong>\u00a0 At least my father was not happy about it; but again, he had no belief what so ever.\u00a0 So, there wasn\u2019t any theological unhappiness about it.\u00a0 There was a certain cultural thing.\u00a0 In a sense, I think their attitude was, \u201cWell, we\u2019re members of the Mickey Mouse Club.\u00a0 Why should he marry someone from the Donald Duck club?\u201d\u00a0 (Laughter)\u00a0 So\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, you did end up moving to San Diego State, where you taught\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Marvin:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014and I thought the way you chose a church was interesting.\u00a0 I thought what Bob was about to ask you, \u201cBeing a Jewish person, how would you choose a church?\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Marvin:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 You had never been in one; had you?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Marvin:<\/strong>\u00a0 Never been in one.\u00a0 There were things in the old days called the <em>Yellow Pages<\/em> that people actually went to instead of looking online for stuff.\u00a0 (Laughter)\u00a0 I opened up the <em>Yellow Pages<\/em> to churches.\u00a0 There was a whole long list of Baptist churches; and I figured, \u201cYes, Baptist.\u00a0 I\u2019ve read in the New Testament that Christians baptize.\u00a0 I guess this is a real Christian church, and there are lots of them.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThen, looked at conservative Baptists and I thought, \u201cWell, I\u2019m no longer a Communist.\u00a0 I mean, I\u2019m conservative politically.\u00a0 I\u2019m for Ronald Reagan.\u00a0 So, I should go to a conservative Baptist church.\u201d\u00a0 (Laughter)\u00a0 It was just a few blocks from our home.\u00a0 It was simply a matter of convenience.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Then, Earl, the deacon, came visiting.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Marvin:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes.\u00a0 Earl, a very elderly deacon\u2014I don\u2019t know if he\u2019d ever gone to college or even graduated from high school.\u00a0 He was just a very dear man.\u00a0 He did not take me through any intellectual \u201crazz-ma-tazz\u201d, no arguments and things like that.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHe came over; and we sat in the bright, California sunshine in the fall.\u00a0 He asked, \u201cWell, you believe this stuff; don\u2019t you?\u201d\u00a0 Here\u2019s why I think that I was already becoming a Christian, even before I knew I was Christian.\u00a0 I thought about that for about a minute and said, \u201cYes, I do.\u00a0 I guess I do.\u201d\u00a0 He said, \u201cWell, then, you better sign up,\u201d which meant getting baptized and joining.\u00a0 I thought, \u201cWell, I guess I should.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThen, I went and told Susan that, \u201cHere, this is what I want to do.\u201d\u00a0 She said, \u201cWell, I want to do it, too.\u201d\u00a0 A week later, in this small, conservative Baptist church, where\u2014I mean, we were the only\u2014we were in our 20s, and I don\u2019t think there was anyone in the church who was younger than 50 at that point.\u00a0 We were baptized in front of them.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tFor weeks before that, they had been playing the famous hymn, <em>Just As I Am, <\/em>and kept playing it and playing it, hoping that we would come forward; but we did not.\u00a0 At that moment, we were actually asked, \u201cWhat do you believe?\u00a0 You believe this stuff; don\u2019t you?\u201d\u00a0 I had to say, \u201cYes.\u00a0 Yes, I do.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSo, it wasn\u2019t any huge moment of decision, then.\u00a0 It was really an acknowledgement of what God had already put in my heart and mind.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Okay.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 You signed up.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Marvin:<\/strong>\u00a0 Signed up.\u00a0 (Laughter)\u00a0 Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 You signed up.\u00a0 Okay, let\u2019s say there is a listener right now.\u00a0 In fact, there has to be many; but there is one who is listening\u2014and he or she has listened to your story.\u00a0 They are going, \u201cYes.\u00a0 I think I\u2019d like to do that.\u201d\u00a0 What exactly do you need to believe, Marvin, to become a follower of Christ?\u00a0 I want you to just take someone and just do with them what Earl should have affirmed with you in that California, fall sunshine.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Marvin:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Introduce them to Christ and explain how it works.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Marvin:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, J.I. Packer summarizes the Gospel in three words, \u201cGod saves sinners\u201d\u2014particularly, God, in the person of Jesus Christ.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSo, in my mind\u2014and this is what I would suggest to other people\u2014question number one:\u00a0 \u201cAre you a sinner?\u201d\u00a0 Do you understand in your heart that, in fact, you are in desperate need of being changed and that you don\u2019t have the power to do it yourself\u2014you are helpless in your sins?\u00a0 You need some external help.\u00a0 That\u2019s number one:\u00a0 \u201cAre you a sinner?\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWell, then, who\u2019s going to save you, at that point?\u00a0 You can\u2019t save yourself; you\u2019re not strong enough to do that.\u00a0 You\u2019re not powerful enough to do that.\u00a0 You\u2019re immersed in your sins, and you realize they are sins at this point\u2014at least some of\u2014you realize that some of them are sins.\u00a0 You want to change, but you know you can\u2019t change just by yourself.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI mean, here is the Good News\u2014that God saves sinners\u2014that Jesus Christ, by coming to earth and dying for our sins, has made it possible for you to go to heaven and for you to change your life.\u00a0 Apart from Christ\u2019s salvation, you are not going to really change your life.\u00a0 You may do a little thing, but you are going to sink back into your old mire and you\u2019re not going to go to heaven.\u00a0 If you have a desire to change your life and go to heaven, there\u2019s only one way to do that; and that\u2019s through Jesus Christ.\u00a0 So, Christ saves sinners.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Because Jesus Christ died on the cross for our sins and was raised on the third day, He is alive today; and He can pierce the darkest heart.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Marvin:<\/strong>\u00a0 He is alive to guide us, cheer us, and pierce our hearts.\u00a0 Since He is resurrected from the dead, we also have the hope of being resurrected from the dead.\u00a0 So, we have our hearts\u2014are pierced right now.\u00a0 It will change our lives, and it also gives us the hope of going to heaven.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 So, a person is listening right now and saying, \u201cMarvin, I believe that.\u00a0 I\u2019m ready.\u201d\u00a0 What do they need to do?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Sounds like they need to sign up.\u00a0 At least, that\u2019s what Earl told you to do.\u00a0 What would you tell them to do?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Marvin:<\/strong>\u00a0 I would say, \u201cPray to God.\u00a0 Pray wherever you are.\u00a0 Pray right now.\u00a0 Pray to Jesus Christ and ask Him to save you from your sins in the months and years to come\u2014to teach you more about Himself so that you\u2019ll be more and more ready to live as a follower of Christ and that you\u2019ll understand that, in fact, your faith will save you\u2014that Jesus Christ will pull you through all the way.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u201cThere may be times when you go backwards, and sideways, and all sort of that; but He will not abandon you.\u00a0 He loves you, has a purpose for you, and will take you all the way through.\u00a0 At this point, if He\u2019s telling you that He has chased you, and it is time for you to take the first step.\u00a0 Then, take that first step by praying to Him and asking Him to show you more, and more, and more.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Don\u2019t let the sun go down, or don\u2019t rest your head on a pillow\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Marvin:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014until you settle things with Him.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Marvin:<\/strong>\u00a0 Settle things with Him because you don\u2019t know how long you are going to live, and it\u2019s important to do this right away.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<br><strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 I always come back to three words.\u00a0 The three words are forgiveness, transformation, and hope.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tForgiveness:\u00a0 Do we realize that we have sinned against God, and that we need His forgiveness, and that He offers His forgiveness in what Christ has accomplished on the cross?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThen, transformation:\u00a0 Do we look at our lives and realize we are not living the way we <em>ought<\/em> to be living, the way we <em>want <\/em>to be living, the way <em>God<\/em> would have us live?\u00a0 Do we realize that we need His power to change us, to transform us?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThen, the last thing is hope.\u00a0 Do we look to the future with hope or with no hope?\u00a0 The Gospel addresses all three of those\u2014it provides forgiveness for our sin; transformation for our lives; and a hope for our future.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to encourage our listeners go online at FamilyLifeToday.com.\u00a0 You\u2019ll see a link there that says, \u201cTwo Ways to Live.\u201d\u00a0 That link will spell out for you what we\u2019ve talked about here today\u2014how you can have a personal relationship with God through Jesus Christ.\u00a0 Our website is FamilyLifeToday.com.\u00a0 Click the link that says, \u201cTwo Ways to Live.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIf you\u2019d like to receive a copy of the book, <em>Pursuing God\u2014<\/em>if you\u2019ve never trusted Christ and you\u2019d like to receive this book to help you understand what it means to have a relationship with God, call us or go online and ask for a copy of <em>Pursuing God<\/em>.\u00a0 Our website, again, is FamilyLifeToday.com; or call 1-800-FL-TODAY to ask for a copy of that booklet.\u00a0 We\u2019ll be happy to send it out to you at no cost.\u00a0 If you\u2019re somebody who is listening to this program and God has been kind of nudging you and saying, \u201cThis sounds like you and like what you need,\u201d then, get in touch with us and get a copy of this book.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tOf course, we\u2019ve got copies of the book that Marvin Olasky has written called <em>Unmerited Mercy: A Memoir<\/em> <em>from a card-carrying Communist to a Bible-carrying Christian<\/em>.\u00a0 That\u2019s the subtitle.\u00a0 You can request a copy of Marvin\u2019s book online at FamilyLifeToday.com or call if you need more information.\u00a0 1-800-FL-TODAY is our number.\u00a0 We can make arrangements to have a copy of Marvin\u2019s book sent to you.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAgain, we want to offer our thanks to those of you who at the end of 2011 made a year-end gift.\u00a0 We should also say a big, \u201cThank you,\u201d to those of you who during the past year have been Legacy Partners, monthly donors to help support <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\u00a0 Your donations, whether they come each month, or whether you make a donation from time-to-time\u2014those donations are what help cover the cost of producing and syndicating this daily radio program.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe appreciate those of you who either go online or give us a call to make a donation; and we were especially grateful for those of you who, at the end of the year, did just that.\u00a0 Of course, our needs continue month in and month out.\u00a0 If you\u2019d like to find out more about becoming a Legacy Partner, go to FamilyLifeToday.com.\u00a0 There\u2019s a link available there that will give you more information about how you can join the Legacy Partner team.\u00a0 Again, find that at FamilyLifeToday.com.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBe sure to be back with us again tomorrow.\u00a0 Marvin Olasky is going to be here again.\u00a0 We\u2019re going to talk about how we as Christians demonstrate compassion and caring for those who are the poor and the disenfranchised in our culture.\u00a0 That\u2019s something that has been on his heart, and something that he has looked at very carefully for many years.\u00a0 We\u2019ll talk about that tomorrow.\u00a0 I hope you can be here for that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch, and our entire broadcast production team.\u00a0 On behalf of our host, Dennis Rainey, I'm Bob Lepine.\u00a0 We will see you back tomorrow for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHelp for today.\u00a0 Hope for tomorrow.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you.\u00a0 However, there is a cost to produce them for our website.\u00a0 If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright \u00a9 2011 FamilyLife.\u00a0 All rights reserved.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/\">www.FamilyLife.com<\/a>\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\n\t\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\t1\n\t\t\t\t<\/p>","theme_header_position":"","post_header_is_sticky":"","is_header_overlay":""},"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast\/302436","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/podcast"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/91"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=302436"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/294104"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=302436"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=302436"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=302436"},{"taxonomy":"podcast_series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast_series?post=302436"},{"taxonomy":"cwp_profile","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/cwp_profile?post=302436"},{"taxonomy":"series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/series?post=302436"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}