{"id":302283,"date":"2011-06-06T11:00:00","date_gmt":"2011-06-06T15:00:00","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/%series%\/liberated-by-confession\/"},"modified":"2011-06-06T11:00:00","modified_gmt":"2011-06-06T15:00:00","slug":"liberated-by-confession","status":"publish","type":"podcast","link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/liberated-by-confession\/","title":{"rendered":"Liberated by Confession"},"content":{"rendered":"","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Who really knows you?<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":91,"featured_media":294104,"menu_order":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","template":"","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","inline_featured_image":false,"_uag_custom_page_level_css":"","episode_type":"","audio_file":"https:\/\/web.familylifetoday.com\/fl2011-06-06.mp3","cover_image":"","cover_image_id":"","duration":"00:","filesize":"25.97M","filesize_raw":"27228674","date_recorded":"","explicit":"","block":""},"categories":[2826],"tags":[4698,2916],"podcast_series":[7807],"cwp_profile":[9235],"series":[2101],"class_list":["post-302283","podcast","type-podcast","status-publish","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-men","tag-manhood","tag-men","podcast_series-bond-of-brothers","cwp_profile-wes-yoder","series-familylife-today"],"acf":[],"episode_featured_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/09\/FLT-Podcast-Cover-2-508x508-3.jpg?w=508","episode_player_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2023\/02\/image-scaled.jpg","download_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-download\/302283\/liberated-by-confession","player_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-player\/302283\/liberated-by-confession","audio_player":null,"episode_data":{"playerMode":"light","subscribeUrls":{"apple_podcasts":{"key":"apple_podcasts","url":"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303?mt=2&app=podcast","label":"Apple Podcasts","class":"apple_podcasts","icon":"apple-podcasts.png"},"google_podcasts":{"key":"google_podcasts","url":"","label":"Google Podcasts","class":"google_podcasts","icon":"google-podcasts.png"},"spotify":{"key":"spotify","url":"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm","label":"Spotify","class":"spotify","icon":"spotify.png"},"youtube":{"key":"youtube","url":"","label":"YouTube","class":"youtube","icon":"youtube.png"}},"rssFeedUrl":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/feed\/podcast\/familylife-today","embedCode":"<blockquote class=\"wp-embedded-content\" data-secret=\"DyB7yuHigg\"><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/liberated-by-confession\/\">Liberated by Confession<\/a><\/blockquote><iframe sandbox=\"allow-scripts\" security=\"restricted\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/liberated-by-confession\/embed\/#?secret=DyB7yuHigg\" width=\"500\" height=\"350\" title=\"&#8220;Liberated by Confession&#8221; &#8212; FamilyLife\u00ae - A Cru Ministry\" data-secret=\"DyB7yuHigg\" frameborder=\"0\" marginwidth=\"0\" marginheight=\"0\" scrolling=\"no\" class=\"wp-embedded-content\"><\/iframe><script>\n\/*! This file is auto-generated *\/\n!function(d,l){\"use strict\";l.querySelector&&d.addEventListener&&\"undefined\"!=typeof URL&&(d.wp=d.wp||{},d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage||(d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage=function(e){var t=e.data;if((t||t.secret||t.message||t.value)&&!\/[^a-zA-Z0-9]\/.test(t.secret)){for(var s,r,n,a=l.querySelectorAll('iframe[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),o=l.querySelectorAll('blockquote[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),c=new RegExp(\"^https?:$\",\"i\"),i=0;i<o.length;i++)o[i].style.display=\"none\";for(i=0;i<a.length;i++)s=a[i],e.source===s.contentWindow&&(s.removeAttribute(\"style\"),\"height\"===t.message?(1e3<(r=parseInt(t.value,10))?r=1e3:~~r<200&&(r=200),s.height=r):\"link\"===t.message&&(r=new URL(s.getAttribute(\"src\")),n=new URL(t.value),c.test(n.protocol))&&n.host===r.host&&l.activeElement===s&&(d.top.location.href=t.value))}},d.addEventListener(\"message\",d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage,!1),l.addEventListener(\"DOMContentLoaded\",function(){for(var e,t,s=l.querySelectorAll(\"iframe.wp-embedded-content\"),r=0;r<s.length;r++)(t=(e=s[r]).getAttribute(\"data-secret\"))||(t=Math.random().toString(36).substring(2,12),e.src+=\"#?secret=\"+t,e.setAttribute(\"data-secret\",t)),e.contentWindow.postMessage({message:\"ready\",secret:t},\"*\")},!1)))}(window,document);\n\/\/# sourceURL=https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-includes\/js\/wp-embed.min.js\n<\/script>\n"},"spectra_custom_meta":{"_wp_page_template":["default"],"transcript_url":["https:\/\/transcript.familylifetoday.com\/fl2011-06-06.pdf"],"audio_file":["https:\/\/web.familylifetoday.com\/fl2011-06-06.mp3"],"transcript_content":["<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Let me ask you a question, guys.\u00a0 How many really good guy friends do you have?\u00a0 Wes Yoder says that we need to capture a vision for how transformation occurs in relationship.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Wes:<\/strong>\u00a0 Jesus isn\u2019t exactly interested in our modern form of Christian behavioral science.\u00a0 He\u2019s really interested in radical heart transformation, and when we get to the point where we no longer have to have all the right answers, we no longer have to fix somebody, but I can just be with you, Bob, or I can be with you, Dennis, and we\u2019re going to let Jesus come into this mix and show us how to live, and let him bring with his presence healing to us.\u00a0 He completely transforms the way you live.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 This is <em>FamilyLifeToday<\/em> for Monday, June 6<sup>th<\/sup>.\u00a0 Our host is the President of FamilyLife, Dennis Rainey, and I\u2019m Bob Lepine.\u00a0 We\u2019re going to talk today about why spiritual friendships are the central life-giving core of all healthy relationships among men.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd welcome to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\u00a0 Thanks for joining us.\u00a0\u00a0 What is it about us \u2013 and I say \u201cus\u201d -- I mean us guys.\u00a0 What is it about guys in general that makes it tough for us to be as relational as women are?\u00a0 I mean, it\u2019s easy for a group of women to get together and to kind of know each other instantly and connect.\u00a0 For guys it\u2019s a little harder.\u00a0 Why is that?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 It\u2019s a lot harder.\u00a0 It\u2019s part of the DNA of how God made us as male and female.\u00a0 He made us so we\u2019d need each other.\u00a0 He didn\u2019t make male and female equal in every possible way; he made us so we would need each other.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tMen need friendships over a lifetime.\u00a0 They really do, and since you\u2019ve got a friendship with today\u2019s guest that goes way back, -- and you just need to keep it in line, Bob, as you start reliving the past with this buddy of yours -- I want to give you the privilege of introducing our guest to our listeners.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, I want our listeners to get to know Wes Yoder.\u00a0 Wes and I \u2013 we were reminiscing \u2013 we first met in the early \u201880s.\u00a0 You were involved in working with artists and musicians and touring and recording, and I was involved in Christian radio at the time, right?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Wes:<\/strong>\u00a0 That\u2019s correct.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Over the years our paths crossed in a number of different settings, and then years later you shifted your focus away from music and started working with authors and speakers, set up the Ambassador Speakers Bureau, and that\u2019s been at the heart of your career for the last 15, 20 years?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Wes:<\/strong>\u00a0 That\u2019s right, ever since \u201984 when the shift started taking place.\u00a0 I became concerned about what I saw in the lack of biblical worldview thinking among speakers who were in the general marketplace.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSo in 1984, in addition to what we were doing with the music agency, started Ambassador Speakers Bureau, which was the first Christian-oriented speaker\u2019s bureau in the world, specifically to try to do something about that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 And you have, in that process, been able to get a number of Christian writers and speakers in some very prominent places, representing biblical thinking.\u00a0 Wes and his wife live in Nashville, Tennessee, and how many kids?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Wes:<\/strong>\u00a0 We have two children, a 31-year-old son and a 29-year-old daughter, and two grandbabies.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 So you\u2019ve been empty-nesters for a little while.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Wes:<\/strong>\u00a0 Our daughter went to college in 2000, and all of a sudden it was dead quiet, and we had to \u2013\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 I\u2019ve heard that quiet before, by the way.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Wes:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes, dead quiet.\u00a0 It has a voice all of its own.\u00a0 We had to start thinking about our life, who we were and what was our purpose for living beyond this together.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes.\u00a0 You\u2019ve written a book called <em>Bond of Brothers,<\/em> which is about men and friendships.\u00a0 I\u2019m just curious here at the start, when you sat down to write, why this subject?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Wes:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, the silence that was a part of our life together when the kids left pervaded into some other areas.\u00a0 I had been a part of a group of men that met on my porch that we called an accountability group, and there are many such groups around the country.\u00a0 We had a fallacy in our group, that we could keep each other accountable, and that we could do this while lying to each other.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt doesn\u2019t work really well.\u00a0 I mean, it\u2019s just not a very good idea.\u00a0 And as guys started falling off the porch right and left with all kinds of things, I remember sitting on my porch literally crying and going, \u201cThis is what friendship is.\u00a0 This is what accountability is.\u00a0 Where are my friends?\u201d\u00a0 And I said, \u201cIf we\u2019re not talking as men about that most important thing together, what else are we not talking about?\u201d\u00a0 And that\u2019s where the book came from.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Let\u2019s go back to Bob\u2019s question that he asked at the beginning of the broadcast, just about men being different than women in terms of their friendships.\u00a0 We are really different, aren\u2019t we?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Wes:<\/strong>\u00a0 We\u2019re very different.\u00a0 We\u2019re wired differently.\u00a0 Our first relationship naturally, speaking in the flesh, speaking in the natural world, is to our work.\u00a0 Part of that goes back to the Garden of Eden, when you look at the curse that was pronounced when Adam and Eve disobeyed God.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe curse that came to man was that he would be relegated to the ground from which he came.\u00a0 In this, his most direct relationship is with the ground.\u00a0 So we\u2019re all about work.\u00a0 We\u2019re all about performance.\u00a0 We\u2019re all about rules.\u00a0 That\u2019s one of the reasons that we love what the guys do down at the stadium because we see them achieve and perform and accomplish things. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u00a0Women are more relational, and they were taken from our side in the creation story, from our rib, so they immediately have a relational context with a person.\u00a0 We have our first relational context with the dirt.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 And as a man growing up, a young man, would you say you grasped the importance of male friendships in your life as you were starting out your marriage with Linda, beginning to have children?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Wes:<\/strong>\u00a0 We had friends as couples, but I did not understand the value of friendships with other men.\u00a0 I think it\u2019s incredibly important, and I\u2019ll drop this one into the early part of the conversation, I don\u2019t think it\u2019s possible for a man to be a healthy husband and a healthy father in the way that he was meant to be, unless he has healthy relationships with other men.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, you described having this accountability group, so you were attempting to have healthy relationships with other guys, but you said you were meeting together and lying to each other, and guys were falling off the porch.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Wes:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes, we were even saying, \u201cLook, let\u2019s ask each other these questions,\u201d \u2013 the list of questions \u2013 \u201care you doing this, are you doing that?\u201d\u00a0 \u201cI\u2019m fine, I\u2019m fine, I\u2019m fine.\u201d\u00a0 And we were anything but fine.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tOne guy, who had been the President of a Christian college and had an affair with a student had come back and relocated in our community.\u00a0 We\u2019re friends, and he and his wife had decided that they were going to go through the counseling and the restoration, which they did.\u00a0 They were then asked to come speak at a marriage retreat weekend for some young couples.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt turns out that while they were having that talk and doing that, at the same time period he had started yet another affair.\u00a0 So he was the first one to, what I refer to in the book, is he \u201cfell off the porch.\u201d\u00a0 We brought him back to the group one time.\u00a0 We said, \u201cLook, we beg of you.\u00a0 Please repent; please go back home, and we will get you the kind of help that will help you live with your family, with your wife.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u201cWe\u2019ll help restore you.\u00a0 But if you go up this driveway this morning and turn left and go down the open road, we will never see you again \u2013 not because you wouldn\u2019t be welcome here, but you will feel so uncomfortable.\u00a0 We\u2019re just pleading with you, we\u2019re begging with you, brother, to not do this.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd he said, \u201cI can\u2019t do it.\u201d\u00a0 He got in his car, got up the road and turned left instead of turning right to go home.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Wow.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yeah, and as I\u2019m listening to you tell that story, I\u2019m reflecting on three men right now whose lives I\u2019m involved with, and they\u2019re at the bottom of the hill.\u00a0 Haven\u2019t decided whether or not to get in their car and leave and take the left turn and be gone.\u00a0 It\u2019s not always clear how we\u2019re to engage other men.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to kind of go all the way back to you as a boy growing up.\u00a0 I just finished a book for men called <em>Stepping Up.<\/em>\u00a0 It\u2019s a call to men to be courageous and truly step up around the issues they\u2019re facing, and that\u2019s what you\u2019re calling men to do around male friendships.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut you write in your book that your dad had a father who only gave him one affirmation, one compliment.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Wes:<\/strong>\u00a0 One compliment in life.\u00a0 I asked Dad about his father a lot as I was writing the book.\u00a0 His father was a very stern Amish man.\u00a0 My parents on both sides grew up in Amish families, and then they became very conservative Mennonites about the time that I was born, and discovered grace, which was a whole another part of a story to tell later. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tMy father\u2019s father was very stern, and I asked my dad, I said, \u201cDad, did you ever hear your father say to you, \u2018I love you,\u2019\u201d and he said, \u201cNo, I never heard those words.\u201d\u00a0 And I said, \u201cWell, did he love you?\u00a0 How did you know he loved you?\u201d\u00a0 And he said, \u201cI knew my dad loved me.\u201d\u00a0 I said, \u201cHow do you know?\u201d\u00a0 \u201cWell, he took care of us and all that,\u201d and he said, \u201cWhen I turned 21 and was drafted in World War II,\u201d\u00a0 he said, \u201cMy father told me that he wished that he could go in my place,\u201d and I knew through that that he really did love me.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI said, \u201cWell, did he ever compliment you?\u201d\u00a0 He said, \u201cYes, he did.\u201d\u00a0 I said, \u201cWell, what was the compliment that you remember?\u201d\u00a0 He said, \u201cI stacked the sheaves of wheat on the wagon better than any of my eight brothers,\u201d and he was beaming at 88 years old like a little kid who had just heard the compliment for the first time from his father.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI said to him, \u201cDid he ever compliment you on anything else?\u201d\u00a0 He said, \u201cNo, never.\u201d\u00a0 I said, \u201cDad, what do you think it would have been like if you\u2019d heard your father at least compliment you, say, ten times?\u201d\u00a0 And he had no concept, no context whatsoever for what it would have been like to receive that kind of affirmation from his father.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 So what do you sense that does to a man in terms of how he relates to other men if he grows up with that absence of an affirming relationship with a dad?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Wes:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, I think what happened in my father\u2019s life is he wound up, because of his personality, having a lot of people who were friends of the family, friends of Mom and Dad together, but no men that would sit on the porch and just talk as guys, and no men that would talk about all the battles that men face individually with lust and with temptation or any of that kind of thing.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI\u2019ll bet Dad never had one private conversation like that with another man.\u00a0 And so what was cut off from him was this idea that you could actually have a relationship with another man, starting, as it should have, with his father.\u00a0 So consequently, a lot of things that he learned he learned in really, really tough ways.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 And so what about your relationship with your dad?\u00a0 Did you have those conversations with him?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Wes:<\/strong>\u00a0 Not so much.\u00a0 Not until there was an incident in his life when he was just about 72 years old.\u00a0 I was 41 or 42 at the time.\u00a0 Growing up, we were close.\u00a0 I would help him with the milking in the barn, but there was never the conversation that went with it.\u00a0 It was always quiet.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut when he turned in his 70s, we get a call one day from Dad and said, \u201cI need to come to Tennessee and meet with you and Linda, and I need to meet with your brother, Nate, and his wife.\u201d\u00a0 And he said, \u201cBy the way, we\u2019re going to all the different states to visit all seven kids, and there\u2019s something I need to talk about.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe had dinner that night with Mom and Dad and the four of us, and we sat there, and after dinner there\u2019s this incredibly awkward silence.\u00a0 We know it\u2019s time for Dad to talk.\u00a0 He literally, for a couple of minutes sits there in silence, and the first thing that he can get out of his mouth is, \u201cI\u2019ve done something that in the Old Testament they would have stoned me for.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd he cannot talk anymore.\u00a0 He just cannot say another word.\u00a0 I finally put my hand over on his arm and I said, \u201cDad, it\u2019s okay.\u00a0 You can talk.\u00a0 I have also done things for which they would have stoned me in the Old Testament.\u00a0 Please tell us.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd he starts telling this sad and sorrowful story, starting from when he was 16 back on the farm, when there\u2019s a sexual addiction that begins in his life, a stronghold that the enemy starts bringing into his life.\u00a0 It culminates in him hurting someone, and this thing has bubbled to the surface and it\u2019s going to come out, and either he gets to tell the story or somebody else is going to tell the story.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd he said, \u201cNow it\u2019s time for me to speak.\u00a0 It\u2019s time for me to tell the story.\u201d\u00a0 After that happened, we didn\u2019t even know whether we could trust Dad.\u00a0 We had no idea \u2013 there was no category for us to put our father into after he told us the story.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tA year later he and I are driving around Pennsylvania in his pickup truck, and drove up to a shop, and he turns the motor off.\u00a0 I said, \u201cDad, can I talk to you for a bit?\u201d\u00a0 He says, \u201cSure.\u201d\u00a0 I said, \u201cRemember last year when you had the courage to confess your worst sin to the family?\u201d and he just slumped over the steering wheel, just like \u2013 it was painful to see it.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI said, \u201cDad, I have always thought that I needed to hide from you.\u00a0 I could never be honest about my own sin, my own failure.\u00a0 But you had the courage a year ago to come to the family and tell us your sins.\u00a0 Would it be okay if I confessed the sins of my youth to you?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHe looked up, and I started telling him everything I could think of.\u00a0 I said, \u201cDad, I don\u2019t want to hide anymore.\u201d\u00a0 And we sat in the truck that day and cried like men, and from that day forward we were just as tight as could be and we could talk about anything.\u00a0 But it didn\u2019t start until I was in my 40s.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 How did that impact your friendships with other men?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Wes:<\/strong>\u00a0 I started realizing through that experience and another experience when I was in my 20s when I came to a place of repentance, that I no longer had to hide my weaknesses from other people.\u00a0 In fact, if I were to tell you my weaknesses, and you\u2019re not a follower of Christ, perhaps that\u2019s the best way for you to actually see that God transforms people and that he changes people\u2019s lives, because he changed my life.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThat\u2019s one of the things that so many churches are missing, where we are no longer talking about our weaknesses.\u00a0 We have this idea of a perfect Christianity, and because we don\u2019t have very many leaders that are willing to tell us about how God is transforming them, we have a powerless Christianity.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI learned early on a lot about this wonderful place of freedom that I didn\u2019t have to hide.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 What I hear you saying in that, that as you engage the soul of another man, being transparent, talking about your own brokenness and how Christ has met you there, there\u2019s tremendous freedom for that other person to reciprocate and to share the grace of God in his life.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Wes:<\/strong>\u00a0 You can actually laugh again as a man.\u00a0 You can actually come to a place where, if you don\u2019t think that you\u2019ve got to fix the guy who\u2019s got the problem, but you can become present with them and bring the presence of Christ into that environment, Jesus is going to be the one who heals and changes.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tJesus isn\u2019t exactly interested in our modern form of Christian behavioral science.\u00a0\u00a0 He\u2019s really interested in radical heart transformation, and when we get to the point where we no longer have to have all the right answers, we no longer have to fix somebody, but I can just be with you, Bob, or I can be with you, Dennis, and we\u2019re going to let Jesus come into this mix and show us how to live, and let him bring with his presence healing to us, it completely transforms the way you live.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 You know, I want to be liked.\u00a0 I want to be admired, I want to be respected.\u00a0 I mean I think most guys do.\u00a0 I think there\u2019s something in all of us that that\u2019s a part of how we\u2019re wired.\u00a0 If I come clean, that puts all of that at risk.\u00a0 There\u2019s such a threat to saying, \u201cI\u2019m going to tell you the truth,\u201d because you may not like me, admire me or respect me when I\u2019m done.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Wes:<\/strong>\u00a0 Of course, but even our Lord was tempted in all points like as we are, \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0\u00a0 Sure.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Wes:<\/strong>\u00a0 -- and the temptations that every man faces are common to all the brothers.\u00a0 Therefore, I\u2019m a big proponent of it\u2019s really time that stop pretending that we don\u2019t know each other.\u00a0 That\u2019s what\u2019s wrong with a lot of what we do. We get men in these groups.\u00a0 We pretend we don\u2019t know each other.\u00a0 There are these incredibly awkward conversations.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhy don\u2019t we just start with the fact that we are these broken-down guys who really need Jesus, and if we don\u2019t need Jesus, I don\u2019t know why we\u2019re in this group in the first place, but I need Jesus.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 I\u2019m thinking of Bob\u2019s statement, and I\u2019m thinking the reason why most men are caught up in wondering what you\u2019re thinking of me is they don\u2019t consider that relationship safe.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Wes:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 They don\u2019t know someone like a Wes Yoder who, hey he\u2019s already said he\u2019s broken.\u00a0 He\u2019s already said he\u2019s broken God\u2019s laws.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, they\u2019ve seen the broken get tossed out, discarded, left along the side of the road.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well the Christian community \u2013 I\u2019m sorry, but all of us are really good at being very judgmental.\u00a0 I mean, we\u2019re experts in this.\u00a0 But what you\u2019re calling men to, I believe, is an act of love that we don\u2019t necessarily think of as an act of love.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThere\u2019s a passage in 1 Corinthians chapter 16, verse 13 and 14 that says, \u201cBe on the alert,\u201d so it\u2019s a warning about spiritual battle.\u00a0 \u201cStand firm in the faith,\u201c \u2013 so you\u2019ve got your theology right.\u00a0 \u201cAct like men.\u00a0 Be strong.\u201d\u00a0 And then it says, \u201cLet all that you do be done in love.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt seems to me that what you\u2019re talking about, Wes, in terms of two men relating to one another in their brokenness and their despair of their selfishness, their sinfulness, their baggage, their thought life, we don\u2019t think about that being covered by another man who says, \u201cYou know what?\u00a0 It\u2019s okay. I love you with the love of Christ.\u201d\u00a0 That\u2019s really what you\u2019re talking about here.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Wes:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes, I\u2019m talking about that.\u00a0 I\u2019m talking, in addition to that, about men coming to the point where they really know that they are loved by the Father.\u00a0 I think the greatest problem with American men who are Christians \u2013 they don\u2019t really believe that God loves them because they still see how they mess up.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThey still see how they\u2019re tempted, they still see how they lust, they still see all these things about themselves, and they go, \u201cI don\u2019t really believe that God would love me.\u00a0 I believe he would love Dennis and Bob, but not Wes.\u201d\u00a0 I could spend all day convincing you that you are loved by God and not believe it myself.\u00a0 So I think that\u2019s an important thing.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe other thing about the Scripture that you just mentioned is this whole idea that we are to carry one another\u2019s burdens.\u00a0\u00a0 Now, we need a new way of thinking about that.\u00a0 What it really means is that I am to enter into your sorrow.\u00a0 So when you come to me with a confession, if I am taking the view that, \u201cOh, I\u2019m so glad that Dennis has finally said \u2013 I\u2019m going to check that off the list; he\u2019s going to be fine now.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIf I receive you in that way you\u2019re not going to get healed at all, because you\u2019re going to get healed in community.\u00a0 We get healed at the foot of the cross with other people.\u00a0 So if I\u2019m simply receiving your confession without entering into the sorrow, without understanding why you had this temptation in the first place \u2013 How did the Devil begin to rob and kill and destroy your life? \u2013 and I can\u2019t weep over your sorrow, you\u2019re not going to get healed.\u00a0 You\u2019re going to say, \u201cWhy did I tell that jerk that?\u00a0 I didn\u2019t have to confess it to him to be forgiven by the Father.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 And unfortunately there are too many stories of betrayal, like you\u2019re talking about there, which makes men retreat rather than open up their hearts to a few who will express the love of the Father.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tFor me, I just have to say at this point, there have been two main avenues that I have learned the love of the Father.\u00a0 One from my wife in marital love; the other is from friends who have expressed the love of the Father, still imperfectly.\u00a0 I mean, no way another\u00a0 human being is going to reflect the love of almighty God, but nonetheless, just allow for that moment like you\u2019re talking about to be sorrowful with you in the midst of your failures, but at the same time not reject you.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Wes:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right, to actually receive you as a brother.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yeah, and not go, \u201cYou did that?\u201d or \u201cYou thought that?\u201d or \u201cYou\u2019re that way?\u201d\u00a0 That\u2019s what we\u2019re really calling men to experience.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 It\u2019s not always, I don\u2019t think, rejection and betrayal.\u00a0 It may be that a guy who hears somebody share from the deepest part of him isn\u2019t really sure how to respond, what to say to that, and that\u2019s where I think in the book, Wes, you coach us as men to know what these kinds of authentic friendships can and ought to look like.\u00a0 Not only that, but how these kinds of friendships can be liberating and spiritually invigorating for the men who enter in.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe\u2019ve got copies of your book in our FamilyLife Today Resource Center.\u00a0 It\u2019s called <em>Bond of Brothers.<\/em>\u00a0 It\u2019s by Wes Yoder.\u00a0 Again, the title of the book is <em>Bond of Brothers<\/em>, and you can find it at FamilyLifeToday.com.\u00a0\u00a0 That\u2019s our website, FamilyLifeToday.com.\u00a0 Or call 800-FLTODAY, 1-800-358-6329, that's 1-800 \u201cF\u201d as in Family, \u201cL\u201d as in Life, and then the word \u201cToday.\u201d\u00a0 Ask about the book <em>Bond of Brothers<\/em> when you get in touch with us.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd ask about Dennis\u2019 new book, too, called <em>Stepping Up: A Call to Courageous Manhood.<\/em>\u00a0 I just had a guy come up to me at church this past weekend, and he said, \u201cI have been reading Dennis\u2019 book.\u00a0 It is really good.\u00a0 In fact,\u201d he said, \u201cI think the guys at our church ought to go through the book.\u201d\u00a0 <br><br>Of course, it\u2019s available at our FamilyLife Today Resource Center as well.\u00a0 Look online at FamilyLifeToday.com for a copy of Dennis\u2019 new book called <em>Stepping Up: A Call to Courageous Manhood<\/em>, or give us a call toll-free at 800-FLTODAY, that\u2019s 1-800 \u201cF\u201d as in Family, \u201cL\u201d as in Life, and then the word \u201cTODAY.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNow I want to say a quick word of thanks to those of you who not only listen to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>, but to those of you who help support the ministry.\u00a0 Some of you are Legacy Partners with us; you make a monthly contribution to help keep <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> on the air on this station, on the internet, and on our network of stations all across the country.\u00a0 We appreciate you.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSome of you make a donation from time to time, as you\u2019re able to do that.\u00a0 We\u2019re very grateful for those of you who do that as well.\u00a0 This month, if you\u2019re able to help with a donation to support <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>, we\u2019d like to send you as a thank you gift a copy of a book by John Yates, called <em>How a Man Prays for His Family.<\/em>\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAlong with the book we\u2019re going to send an audio CD that features a conversation we had with John Yates on that subject, and two cards that a husband and wife can each take one, or a man can use both of them in different locations around the house or at the office, cards that help you know how to specifically pray for your children throughout the day.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAgain, when you make a donation online at FamilyLifeToday.com, you are welcome to request these resources.\u00a0 Just type the word \u201cpray\u201d into the key code box that you find on the online donation form, or call us at 1-800-FLTODAY.\u00a0 You can make a donation over the phone and just ask for the book and the CD on prayer, and we\u2019ll send those resources out to you.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAgain, thanks for your support of the ministry.\u00a0 We appreciate it, we depend on it, and we are grateful for your financial gifts.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd we want to encourage you to be back with us tomorrow.\u00a0 Wes Yoder is going to be here again.\u00a0 We\u2019re going to talk more about men and relationships and friendships.\u00a0 I hope you can join us for that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch, and our entire broadcast production team.\u00a0 On behalf of our host, Dennis Rainey, I'm Bob Lepine.\u00a0 We will see you back next time for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHelp for today.\u00a0 Hope for tomorrow.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you.\u00a0 However, there is a cost to produce them for our website.\u00a0 If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/site\/c.dnJHKLNnFoG\/b.3782043\/k.384D\/Support_Us.htm\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright \u00a9 2011 FamilyLife.\u00a0 All rights reserved.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/\">www.FamilyLife.com<\/a>\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>"],"_seopress_titles_title":[""],"_seopress_titles_desc":[""],"_seopress_robots_index":[""],"duration":["00:"],"show_notes":[""],"_thumbnail_id":["294104"],"filesize":["25.97M"],"filesize_raw":["27228674"],"_uag_css_file_name":["uag-css-302283.css"],"_uag_js_file_name":["uag-js-302283.js"],"_uag_page_assets":["a:9:{s:3:\"css\";s:82560:\".wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape-top svg{width: calc( 100% + 1.3px );}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f 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really knows you?","meta_box":{"show_notes":"","transcript_url":"https:\/\/transcript.familylifetoday.com\/fl2011-06-06.pdf","transcript_content":"<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Let me ask you a question, guys.\u00a0 How many really good guy friends do you have?\u00a0 Wes Yoder says that we need to capture a vision for how transformation occurs in relationship.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Wes:<\/strong>\u00a0 Jesus isn\u2019t exactly interested in our modern form of Christian behavioral science.\u00a0 He\u2019s really interested in radical heart transformation, and when we get to the point where we no longer have to have all the right answers, we no longer have to fix somebody, but I can just be with you, Bob, or I can be with you, Dennis, and we\u2019re going to let Jesus come into this mix and show us how to live, and let him bring with his presence healing to us.\u00a0 He completely transforms the way you live.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 This is <em>FamilyLifeToday<\/em> for Monday, June 6<sup>th<\/sup>.\u00a0 Our host is the President of FamilyLife, Dennis Rainey, and I\u2019m Bob Lepine.\u00a0 We\u2019re going to talk today about why spiritual friendships are the central life-giving core of all healthy relationships among men.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd welcome to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\u00a0 Thanks for joining us.\u00a0\u00a0 What is it about us \u2013 and I say \u201cus\u201d -- I mean us guys.\u00a0 What is it about guys in general that makes it tough for us to be as relational as women are?\u00a0 I mean, it\u2019s easy for a group of women to get together and to kind of know each other instantly and connect.\u00a0 For guys it\u2019s a little harder.\u00a0 Why is that?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 It\u2019s a lot harder.\u00a0 It\u2019s part of the DNA of how God made us as male and female.\u00a0 He made us so we\u2019d need each other.\u00a0 He didn\u2019t make male and female equal in every possible way; he made us so we would need each other.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tMen need friendships over a lifetime.\u00a0 They really do, and since you\u2019ve got a friendship with today\u2019s guest that goes way back, -- and you just need to keep it in line, Bob, as you start reliving the past with this buddy of yours -- I want to give you the privilege of introducing our guest to our listeners.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, I want our listeners to get to know Wes Yoder.\u00a0 Wes and I \u2013 we were reminiscing \u2013 we first met in the early \u201880s.\u00a0 You were involved in working with artists and musicians and touring and recording, and I was involved in Christian radio at the time, right?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Wes:<\/strong>\u00a0 That\u2019s correct.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Over the years our paths crossed in a number of different settings, and then years later you shifted your focus away from music and started working with authors and speakers, set up the Ambassador Speakers Bureau, and that\u2019s been at the heart of your career for the last 15, 20 years?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Wes:<\/strong>\u00a0 That\u2019s right, ever since \u201984 when the shift started taking place.\u00a0 I became concerned about what I saw in the lack of biblical worldview thinking among speakers who were in the general marketplace.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSo in 1984, in addition to what we were doing with the music agency, started Ambassador Speakers Bureau, which was the first Christian-oriented speaker\u2019s bureau in the world, specifically to try to do something about that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 And you have, in that process, been able to get a number of Christian writers and speakers in some very prominent places, representing biblical thinking.\u00a0 Wes and his wife live in Nashville, Tennessee, and how many kids?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Wes:<\/strong>\u00a0 We have two children, a 31-year-old son and a 29-year-old daughter, and two grandbabies.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 So you\u2019ve been empty-nesters for a little while.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Wes:<\/strong>\u00a0 Our daughter went to college in 2000, and all of a sudden it was dead quiet, and we had to \u2013\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 I\u2019ve heard that quiet before, by the way.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Wes:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes, dead quiet.\u00a0 It has a voice all of its own.\u00a0 We had to start thinking about our life, who we were and what was our purpose for living beyond this together.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes.\u00a0 You\u2019ve written a book called <em>Bond of Brothers,<\/em> which is about men and friendships.\u00a0 I\u2019m just curious here at the start, when you sat down to write, why this subject?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Wes:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, the silence that was a part of our life together when the kids left pervaded into some other areas.\u00a0 I had been a part of a group of men that met on my porch that we called an accountability group, and there are many such groups around the country.\u00a0 We had a fallacy in our group, that we could keep each other accountable, and that we could do this while lying to each other.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt doesn\u2019t work really well.\u00a0 I mean, it\u2019s just not a very good idea.\u00a0 And as guys started falling off the porch right and left with all kinds of things, I remember sitting on my porch literally crying and going, \u201cThis is what friendship is.\u00a0 This is what accountability is.\u00a0 Where are my friends?\u201d\u00a0 And I said, \u201cIf we\u2019re not talking as men about that most important thing together, what else are we not talking about?\u201d\u00a0 And that\u2019s where the book came from.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Let\u2019s go back to Bob\u2019s question that he asked at the beginning of the broadcast, just about men being different than women in terms of their friendships.\u00a0 We are really different, aren\u2019t we?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Wes:<\/strong>\u00a0 We\u2019re very different.\u00a0 We\u2019re wired differently.\u00a0 Our first relationship naturally, speaking in the flesh, speaking in the natural world, is to our work.\u00a0 Part of that goes back to the Garden of Eden, when you look at the curse that was pronounced when Adam and Eve disobeyed God.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe curse that came to man was that he would be relegated to the ground from which he came.\u00a0 In this, his most direct relationship is with the ground.\u00a0 So we\u2019re all about work.\u00a0 We\u2019re all about performance.\u00a0 We\u2019re all about rules.\u00a0 That\u2019s one of the reasons that we love what the guys do down at the stadium because we see them achieve and perform and accomplish things. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u00a0Women are more relational, and they were taken from our side in the creation story, from our rib, so they immediately have a relational context with a person.\u00a0 We have our first relational context with the dirt.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 And as a man growing up, a young man, would you say you grasped the importance of male friendships in your life as you were starting out your marriage with Linda, beginning to have children?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Wes:<\/strong>\u00a0 We had friends as couples, but I did not understand the value of friendships with other men.\u00a0 I think it\u2019s incredibly important, and I\u2019ll drop this one into the early part of the conversation, I don\u2019t think it\u2019s possible for a man to be a healthy husband and a healthy father in the way that he was meant to be, unless he has healthy relationships with other men.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, you described having this accountability group, so you were attempting to have healthy relationships with other guys, but you said you were meeting together and lying to each other, and guys were falling off the porch.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Wes:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes, we were even saying, \u201cLook, let\u2019s ask each other these questions,\u201d \u2013 the list of questions \u2013 \u201care you doing this, are you doing that?\u201d\u00a0 \u201cI\u2019m fine, I\u2019m fine, I\u2019m fine.\u201d\u00a0 And we were anything but fine.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tOne guy, who had been the President of a Christian college and had an affair with a student had come back and relocated in our community.\u00a0 We\u2019re friends, and he and his wife had decided that they were going to go through the counseling and the restoration, which they did.\u00a0 They were then asked to come speak at a marriage retreat weekend for some young couples.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt turns out that while they were having that talk and doing that, at the same time period he had started yet another affair.\u00a0 So he was the first one to, what I refer to in the book, is he \u201cfell off the porch.\u201d\u00a0 We brought him back to the group one time.\u00a0 We said, \u201cLook, we beg of you.\u00a0 Please repent; please go back home, and we will get you the kind of help that will help you live with your family, with your wife.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u201cWe\u2019ll help restore you.\u00a0 But if you go up this driveway this morning and turn left and go down the open road, we will never see you again \u2013 not because you wouldn\u2019t be welcome here, but you will feel so uncomfortable.\u00a0 We\u2019re just pleading with you, we\u2019re begging with you, brother, to not do this.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd he said, \u201cI can\u2019t do it.\u201d\u00a0 He got in his car, got up the road and turned left instead of turning right to go home.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Wow.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yeah, and as I\u2019m listening to you tell that story, I\u2019m reflecting on three men right now whose lives I\u2019m involved with, and they\u2019re at the bottom of the hill.\u00a0 Haven\u2019t decided whether or not to get in their car and leave and take the left turn and be gone.\u00a0 It\u2019s not always clear how we\u2019re to engage other men.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to kind of go all the way back to you as a boy growing up.\u00a0 I just finished a book for men called <em>Stepping Up.<\/em>\u00a0 It\u2019s a call to men to be courageous and truly step up around the issues they\u2019re facing, and that\u2019s what you\u2019re calling men to do around male friendships.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut you write in your book that your dad had a father who only gave him one affirmation, one compliment.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Wes:<\/strong>\u00a0 One compliment in life.\u00a0 I asked Dad about his father a lot as I was writing the book.\u00a0 His father was a very stern Amish man.\u00a0 My parents on both sides grew up in Amish families, and then they became very conservative Mennonites about the time that I was born, and discovered grace, which was a whole another part of a story to tell later. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tMy father\u2019s father was very stern, and I asked my dad, I said, \u201cDad, did you ever hear your father say to you, \u2018I love you,\u2019\u201d and he said, \u201cNo, I never heard those words.\u201d\u00a0 And I said, \u201cWell, did he love you?\u00a0 How did you know he loved you?\u201d\u00a0 And he said, \u201cI knew my dad loved me.\u201d\u00a0 I said, \u201cHow do you know?\u201d\u00a0 \u201cWell, he took care of us and all that,\u201d and he said, \u201cWhen I turned 21 and was drafted in World War II,\u201d\u00a0 he said, \u201cMy father told me that he wished that he could go in my place,\u201d and I knew through that that he really did love me.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI said, \u201cWell, did he ever compliment you?\u201d\u00a0 He said, \u201cYes, he did.\u201d\u00a0 I said, \u201cWell, what was the compliment that you remember?\u201d\u00a0 He said, \u201cI stacked the sheaves of wheat on the wagon better than any of my eight brothers,\u201d and he was beaming at 88 years old like a little kid who had just heard the compliment for the first time from his father.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI said to him, \u201cDid he ever compliment you on anything else?\u201d\u00a0 He said, \u201cNo, never.\u201d\u00a0 I said, \u201cDad, what do you think it would have been like if you\u2019d heard your father at least compliment you, say, ten times?\u201d\u00a0 And he had no concept, no context whatsoever for what it would have been like to receive that kind of affirmation from his father.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 So what do you sense that does to a man in terms of how he relates to other men if he grows up with that absence of an affirming relationship with a dad?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Wes:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, I think what happened in my father\u2019s life is he wound up, because of his personality, having a lot of people who were friends of the family, friends of Mom and Dad together, but no men that would sit on the porch and just talk as guys, and no men that would talk about all the battles that men face individually with lust and with temptation or any of that kind of thing.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI\u2019ll bet Dad never had one private conversation like that with another man.\u00a0 And so what was cut off from him was this idea that you could actually have a relationship with another man, starting, as it should have, with his father.\u00a0 So consequently, a lot of things that he learned he learned in really, really tough ways.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 And so what about your relationship with your dad?\u00a0 Did you have those conversations with him?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Wes:<\/strong>\u00a0 Not so much.\u00a0 Not until there was an incident in his life when he was just about 72 years old.\u00a0 I was 41 or 42 at the time.\u00a0 Growing up, we were close.\u00a0 I would help him with the milking in the barn, but there was never the conversation that went with it.\u00a0 It was always quiet.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut when he turned in his 70s, we get a call one day from Dad and said, \u201cI need to come to Tennessee and meet with you and Linda, and I need to meet with your brother, Nate, and his wife.\u201d\u00a0 And he said, \u201cBy the way, we\u2019re going to all the different states to visit all seven kids, and there\u2019s something I need to talk about.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe had dinner that night with Mom and Dad and the four of us, and we sat there, and after dinner there\u2019s this incredibly awkward silence.\u00a0 We know it\u2019s time for Dad to talk.\u00a0 He literally, for a couple of minutes sits there in silence, and the first thing that he can get out of his mouth is, \u201cI\u2019ve done something that in the Old Testament they would have stoned me for.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd he cannot talk anymore.\u00a0 He just cannot say another word.\u00a0 I finally put my hand over on his arm and I said, \u201cDad, it\u2019s okay.\u00a0 You can talk.\u00a0 I have also done things for which they would have stoned me in the Old Testament.\u00a0 Please tell us.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd he starts telling this sad and sorrowful story, starting from when he was 16 back on the farm, when there\u2019s a sexual addiction that begins in his life, a stronghold that the enemy starts bringing into his life.\u00a0 It culminates in him hurting someone, and this thing has bubbled to the surface and it\u2019s going to come out, and either he gets to tell the story or somebody else is going to tell the story.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd he said, \u201cNow it\u2019s time for me to speak.\u00a0 It\u2019s time for me to tell the story.\u201d\u00a0 After that happened, we didn\u2019t even know whether we could trust Dad.\u00a0 We had no idea \u2013 there was no category for us to put our father into after he told us the story.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tA year later he and I are driving around Pennsylvania in his pickup truck, and drove up to a shop, and he turns the motor off.\u00a0 I said, \u201cDad, can I talk to you for a bit?\u201d\u00a0 He says, \u201cSure.\u201d\u00a0 I said, \u201cRemember last year when you had the courage to confess your worst sin to the family?\u201d and he just slumped over the steering wheel, just like \u2013 it was painful to see it.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI said, \u201cDad, I have always thought that I needed to hide from you.\u00a0 I could never be honest about my own sin, my own failure.\u00a0 But you had the courage a year ago to come to the family and tell us your sins.\u00a0 Would it be okay if I confessed the sins of my youth to you?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHe looked up, and I started telling him everything I could think of.\u00a0 I said, \u201cDad, I don\u2019t want to hide anymore.\u201d\u00a0 And we sat in the truck that day and cried like men, and from that day forward we were just as tight as could be and we could talk about anything.\u00a0 But it didn\u2019t start until I was in my 40s.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 How did that impact your friendships with other men?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Wes:<\/strong>\u00a0 I started realizing through that experience and another experience when I was in my 20s when I came to a place of repentance, that I no longer had to hide my weaknesses from other people.\u00a0 In fact, if I were to tell you my weaknesses, and you\u2019re not a follower of Christ, perhaps that\u2019s the best way for you to actually see that God transforms people and that he changes people\u2019s lives, because he changed my life.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThat\u2019s one of the things that so many churches are missing, where we are no longer talking about our weaknesses.\u00a0 We have this idea of a perfect Christianity, and because we don\u2019t have very many leaders that are willing to tell us about how God is transforming them, we have a powerless Christianity.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI learned early on a lot about this wonderful place of freedom that I didn\u2019t have to hide.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 What I hear you saying in that, that as you engage the soul of another man, being transparent, talking about your own brokenness and how Christ has met you there, there\u2019s tremendous freedom for that other person to reciprocate and to share the grace of God in his life.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Wes:<\/strong>\u00a0 You can actually laugh again as a man.\u00a0 You can actually come to a place where, if you don\u2019t think that you\u2019ve got to fix the guy who\u2019s got the problem, but you can become present with them and bring the presence of Christ into that environment, Jesus is going to be the one who heals and changes.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tJesus isn\u2019t exactly interested in our modern form of Christian behavioral science.\u00a0\u00a0 He\u2019s really interested in radical heart transformation, and when we get to the point where we no longer have to have all the right answers, we no longer have to fix somebody, but I can just be with you, Bob, or I can be with you, Dennis, and we\u2019re going to let Jesus come into this mix and show us how to live, and let him bring with his presence healing to us, it completely transforms the way you live.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 You know, I want to be liked.\u00a0 I want to be admired, I want to be respected.\u00a0 I mean I think most guys do.\u00a0 I think there\u2019s something in all of us that that\u2019s a part of how we\u2019re wired.\u00a0 If I come clean, that puts all of that at risk.\u00a0 There\u2019s such a threat to saying, \u201cI\u2019m going to tell you the truth,\u201d because you may not like me, admire me or respect me when I\u2019m done.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Wes:<\/strong>\u00a0 Of course, but even our Lord was tempted in all points like as we are, \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0\u00a0 Sure.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Wes:<\/strong>\u00a0 -- and the temptations that every man faces are common to all the brothers.\u00a0 Therefore, I\u2019m a big proponent of it\u2019s really time that stop pretending that we don\u2019t know each other.\u00a0 That\u2019s what\u2019s wrong with a lot of what we do. We get men in these groups.\u00a0 We pretend we don\u2019t know each other.\u00a0 There are these incredibly awkward conversations.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhy don\u2019t we just start with the fact that we are these broken-down guys who really need Jesus, and if we don\u2019t need Jesus, I don\u2019t know why we\u2019re in this group in the first place, but I need Jesus.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 I\u2019m thinking of Bob\u2019s statement, and I\u2019m thinking the reason why most men are caught up in wondering what you\u2019re thinking of me is they don\u2019t consider that relationship safe.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Wes:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 They don\u2019t know someone like a Wes Yoder who, hey he\u2019s already said he\u2019s broken.\u00a0 He\u2019s already said he\u2019s broken God\u2019s laws.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, they\u2019ve seen the broken get tossed out, discarded, left along the side of the road.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well the Christian community \u2013 I\u2019m sorry, but all of us are really good at being very judgmental.\u00a0 I mean, we\u2019re experts in this.\u00a0 But what you\u2019re calling men to, I believe, is an act of love that we don\u2019t necessarily think of as an act of love.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThere\u2019s a passage in 1 Corinthians chapter 16, verse 13 and 14 that says, \u201cBe on the alert,\u201d so it\u2019s a warning about spiritual battle.\u00a0 \u201cStand firm in the faith,\u201c \u2013 so you\u2019ve got your theology right.\u00a0 \u201cAct like men.\u00a0 Be strong.\u201d\u00a0 And then it says, \u201cLet all that you do be done in love.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt seems to me that what you\u2019re talking about, Wes, in terms of two men relating to one another in their brokenness and their despair of their selfishness, their sinfulness, their baggage, their thought life, we don\u2019t think about that being covered by another man who says, \u201cYou know what?\u00a0 It\u2019s okay. I love you with the love of Christ.\u201d\u00a0 That\u2019s really what you\u2019re talking about here.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Wes:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes, I\u2019m talking about that.\u00a0 I\u2019m talking, in addition to that, about men coming to the point where they really know that they are loved by the Father.\u00a0 I think the greatest problem with American men who are Christians \u2013 they don\u2019t really believe that God loves them because they still see how they mess up.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThey still see how they\u2019re tempted, they still see how they lust, they still see all these things about themselves, and they go, \u201cI don\u2019t really believe that God would love me.\u00a0 I believe he would love Dennis and Bob, but not Wes.\u201d\u00a0 I could spend all day convincing you that you are loved by God and not believe it myself.\u00a0 So I think that\u2019s an important thing.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe other thing about the Scripture that you just mentioned is this whole idea that we are to carry one another\u2019s burdens.\u00a0\u00a0 Now, we need a new way of thinking about that.\u00a0 What it really means is that I am to enter into your sorrow.\u00a0 So when you come to me with a confession, if I am taking the view that, \u201cOh, I\u2019m so glad that Dennis has finally said \u2013 I\u2019m going to check that off the list; he\u2019s going to be fine now.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIf I receive you in that way you\u2019re not going to get healed at all, because you\u2019re going to get healed in community.\u00a0 We get healed at the foot of the cross with other people.\u00a0 So if I\u2019m simply receiving your confession without entering into the sorrow, without understanding why you had this temptation in the first place \u2013 How did the Devil begin to rob and kill and destroy your life? \u2013 and I can\u2019t weep over your sorrow, you\u2019re not going to get healed.\u00a0 You\u2019re going to say, \u201cWhy did I tell that jerk that?\u00a0 I didn\u2019t have to confess it to him to be forgiven by the Father.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 And unfortunately there are too many stories of betrayal, like you\u2019re talking about there, which makes men retreat rather than open up their hearts to a few who will express the love of the Father.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tFor me, I just have to say at this point, there have been two main avenues that I have learned the love of the Father.\u00a0 One from my wife in marital love; the other is from friends who have expressed the love of the Father, still imperfectly.\u00a0 I mean, no way another\u00a0 human being is going to reflect the love of almighty God, but nonetheless, just allow for that moment like you\u2019re talking about to be sorrowful with you in the midst of your failures, but at the same time not reject you.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Wes:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right, to actually receive you as a brother.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yeah, and not go, \u201cYou did that?\u201d or \u201cYou thought that?\u201d or \u201cYou\u2019re that way?\u201d\u00a0 That\u2019s what we\u2019re really calling men to experience.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 It\u2019s not always, I don\u2019t think, rejection and betrayal.\u00a0 It may be that a guy who hears somebody share from the deepest part of him isn\u2019t really sure how to respond, what to say to that, and that\u2019s where I think in the book, Wes, you coach us as men to know what these kinds of authentic friendships can and ought to look like.\u00a0 Not only that, but how these kinds of friendships can be liberating and spiritually invigorating for the men who enter in.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe\u2019ve got copies of your book in our FamilyLife Today Resource Center.\u00a0 It\u2019s called <em>Bond of Brothers.<\/em>\u00a0 It\u2019s by Wes Yoder.\u00a0 Again, the title of the book is <em>Bond of Brothers<\/em>, and you can find it at FamilyLifeToday.com.\u00a0\u00a0 That\u2019s our website, FamilyLifeToday.com.\u00a0 Or call 800-FLTODAY, 1-800-358-6329, that's 1-800 \u201cF\u201d as in Family, \u201cL\u201d as in Life, and then the word \u201cToday.\u201d\u00a0 Ask about the book <em>Bond of Brothers<\/em> when you get in touch with us.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd ask about Dennis\u2019 new book, too, called <em>Stepping Up: A Call to Courageous Manhood.<\/em>\u00a0 I just had a guy come up to me at church this past weekend, and he said, \u201cI have been reading Dennis\u2019 book.\u00a0 It is really good.\u00a0 In fact,\u201d he said, \u201cI think the guys at our church ought to go through the book.\u201d\u00a0 <br><br>Of course, it\u2019s available at our FamilyLife Today Resource Center as well.\u00a0 Look online at FamilyLifeToday.com for a copy of Dennis\u2019 new book called <em>Stepping Up: A Call to Courageous Manhood<\/em>, or give us a call toll-free at 800-FLTODAY, that\u2019s 1-800 \u201cF\u201d as in Family, \u201cL\u201d as in Life, and then the word \u201cTODAY.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNow I want to say a quick word of thanks to those of you who not only listen to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>, but to those of you who help support the ministry.\u00a0 Some of you are Legacy Partners with us; you make a monthly contribution to help keep <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> on the air on this station, on the internet, and on our network of stations all across the country.\u00a0 We appreciate you.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSome of you make a donation from time to time, as you\u2019re able to do that.\u00a0 We\u2019re very grateful for those of you who do that as well.\u00a0 This month, if you\u2019re able to help with a donation to support <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>, we\u2019d like to send you as a thank you gift a copy of a book by John Yates, called <em>How a Man Prays for His Family.<\/em>\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAlong with the book we\u2019re going to send an audio CD that features a conversation we had with John Yates on that subject, and two cards that a husband and wife can each take one, or a man can use both of them in different locations around the house or at the office, cards that help you know how to specifically pray for your children throughout the day.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAgain, when you make a donation online at FamilyLifeToday.com, you are welcome to request these resources.\u00a0 Just type the word \u201cpray\u201d into the key code box that you find on the online donation form, or call us at 1-800-FLTODAY.\u00a0 You can make a donation over the phone and just ask for the book and the CD on prayer, and we\u2019ll send those resources out to you.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAgain, thanks for your support of the ministry.\u00a0 We appreciate it, we depend on it, and we are grateful for your financial gifts.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd we want to encourage you to be back with us tomorrow.\u00a0 Wes Yoder is going to be here again.\u00a0 We\u2019re going to talk more about men and relationships and friendships.\u00a0 I hope you can join us for that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch, and our entire broadcast production team.\u00a0 On behalf of our host, Dennis Rainey, I'm Bob Lepine.\u00a0 We will see you back next time for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHelp for today.\u00a0 Hope for tomorrow.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you.\u00a0 However, there is a cost to produce them for our website.\u00a0 If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/site\/c.dnJHKLNnFoG\/b.3782043\/k.384D\/Support_Us.htm\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright \u00a9 2011 FamilyLife.\u00a0 All rights reserved.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/\">www.FamilyLife.com<\/a>\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>","theme_header_position":"","post_header_is_sticky":"","is_header_overlay":""},"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast\/302283","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/podcast"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/91"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=302283"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/294104"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=302283"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=302283"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=302283"},{"taxonomy":"podcast_series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast_series?post=302283"},{"taxonomy":"cwp_profile","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/cwp_profile?post=302283"},{"taxonomy":"series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/series?post=302283"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}