{"id":301969,"date":"2010-01-26T12:00:00","date_gmt":"2010-01-26T17:00:00","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/%series%\/riding-the-wave-of-loss\/"},"modified":"2010-01-26T12:00:00","modified_gmt":"2010-01-26T17:00:00","slug":"riding-the-wave-of-loss","status":"publish","type":"podcast","link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/riding-the-wave-of-loss\/","title":{"rendered":"Riding the Wave of Loss"},"content":{"rendered":"","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Andy and Nikki Bray talk candidly about the tragic flash flood that took the life of the their oldest daughter, Natasha, at the age of 16.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":91,"featured_media":294104,"menu_order":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","template":"","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","inline_featured_image":false,"_uag_custom_page_level_css":"","episode_type":"","audio_file":"https:\/\/web.familylifetoday.com\/fl2010-01-26.mp3","cover_image":"","cover_image_id":"","duration":"00:","filesize":"14.88M","filesize_raw":"15603993","date_recorded":"","explicit":"","block":""},"categories":[2879],"tags":[5098,5099],"podcast_series":[7703],"cwp_profile":[9188],"series":[2101],"class_list":["post-301969","podcast","type-podcast","status-publish","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-loss-of-a-child","tag-death-of-daughter","tag-grieving","podcast_series-treasures-in-the-dark","cwp_profile-andy-and-nikki-bray","series-familylife-today"],"acf":[],"episode_featured_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/09\/FLT-Podcast-Cover-2-508x508-3.jpg?w=508","episode_player_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2023\/02\/image-scaled.jpg","download_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-download\/301969\/riding-the-wave-of-loss","player_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-player\/301969\/riding-the-wave-of-loss","audio_player":null,"episode_data":{"playerMode":"light","subscribeUrls":{"apple_podcasts":{"key":"apple_podcasts","url":"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303?mt=2&app=podcast","label":"Apple Podcasts","class":"apple_podcasts","icon":"apple-podcasts.png"},"google_podcasts":{"key":"google_podcasts","url":"","label":"Google Podcasts","class":"google_podcasts","icon":"google-podcasts.png"},"spotify":{"key":"spotify","url":"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm","label":"Spotify","class":"spotify","icon":"spotify.png"},"youtube":{"key":"youtube","url":"","label":"YouTube","class":"youtube","icon":"youtube.png"}},"rssFeedUrl":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/feed\/podcast\/familylife-today","embedCode":"<blockquote class=\"wp-embedded-content\" data-secret=\"8O60iZFSVE\"><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/riding-the-wave-of-loss\/\">Riding the Wave of Loss<\/a><\/blockquote><iframe sandbox=\"allow-scripts\" security=\"restricted\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/riding-the-wave-of-loss\/embed\/#?secret=8O60iZFSVE\" width=\"500\" height=\"350\" title=\"&#8220;Riding the Wave of Loss&#8221; &#8212; FamilyLife\u00ae - A Cru Ministry\" data-secret=\"8O60iZFSVE\" frameborder=\"0\" marginwidth=\"0\" marginheight=\"0\" scrolling=\"no\" class=\"wp-embedded-content\"><\/iframe><script>\n\/*! This file is auto-generated *\/\n!function(d,l){\"use strict\";l.querySelector&&d.addEventListener&&\"undefined\"!=typeof URL&&(d.wp=d.wp||{},d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage||(d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage=function(e){var t=e.data;if((t||t.secret||t.message||t.value)&&!\/[^a-zA-Z0-9]\/.test(t.secret)){for(var s,r,n,a=l.querySelectorAll('iframe[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),o=l.querySelectorAll('blockquote[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),c=new RegExp(\"^https?:$\",\"i\"),i=0;i<o.length;i++)o[i].style.display=\"none\";for(i=0;i<a.length;i++)s=a[i],e.source===s.contentWindow&&(s.removeAttribute(\"style\"),\"height\"===t.message?(1e3<(r=parseInt(t.value,10))?r=1e3:~~r<200&&(r=200),s.height=r):\"link\"===t.message&&(r=new URL(s.getAttribute(\"src\")),n=new URL(t.value),c.test(n.protocol))&&n.host===r.host&&l.activeElement===s&&(d.top.location.href=t.value))}},d.addEventListener(\"message\",d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage,!1),l.addEventListener(\"DOMContentLoaded\",function(){for(var e,t,s=l.querySelectorAll(\"iframe.wp-embedded-content\"),r=0;r<s.length;r++)(t=(e=s[r]).getAttribute(\"data-secret\"))||(t=Math.random().toString(36).substring(2,12),e.src+=\"#?secret=\"+t,e.setAttribute(\"data-secret\",t)),e.contentWindow.postMessage({message:\"ready\",secret:t},\"*\")},!1)))}(window,document);\n\/\/# sourceURL=https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-includes\/js\/wp-embed.min.js\n<\/script>\n"},"spectra_custom_meta":{"_wp_page_template":["default"],"transcript_url":["https:\/\/transcript.familylifetoday.com\/fl2010-01-26.pdf"],"audio_file":["https:\/\/web.familylifetoday.com\/fl2010-01-26.mp3"],"transcript_content":["<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>For a number of years now, Andy and Nikki Bray have given leadership to FamilyLife\u2019s ministry in New Zealand.\u00a0 In April of 2008 their marriage and their trust in God was put to the test when their daughter, Natasha was among a group of school students who died in a terrible flood.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Newscaster:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Six students and a teacher from the Elim Christian College in Auckland died when they were swept down a rugged bush gorge in a flooded stream.\u00a0 Search and rescue staff and police battled rugged terrain to recover bodies following the tragedy.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Account given:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>I understand they were on a shelf which is above the water level.\u00a0 They had to make a quick decision.\u00a0 They made a decision to jump from the shelf into the water.\u00a0 It is at that stage when the group got taken away rapidly and seven lives were lost.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rescue Worker:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>The first person we came across was Natasha.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Nikki:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>My heart goes out to people who don\u2019t have a strong marriage to get through something like this.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Andy:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>There was some tension in our marriage because of the way we handled the situation differently.\u00a0 For example, Nikki wanted to talk about Natasha <strong>all<\/strong> the time, every single moment of the day.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Nikki:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>I would get frustrated because all Andy wanted to do was if the media came knocking and they wanted to hear about her, Andy would give them everything; and he would write about her and be writing his articles.\u00a0 I wanted that more privately but Andy wanted the world to know so we were handling it very, very differently.\u00a0 Again, it is one of those times when we really had to ask the Lord to give us His grace to extend to one another because we were finding it hard.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>This is <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> for Tuesday, January 26<sup>th<\/sup>.\u00a0 Our host is the President of FamilyLife, Dennis Rainey; and I am Bob Lepine.\u00a0 Andy and Nikki Bray have had to learn how to lean on the grace of God in a number of settings over the last several months.\u00a0 They will talk about it with us today.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWelcome to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\u00a0 Thanks for joining us on the Tuesday edition.\u00a0 We are going to hear an account today of a dark chapter from a couple\u2019s life.\u00a0 You know, in the midst of those dark chapters, one of the things that sustains us is our relationship with Christ, who \u201cwalks through the valley of the shadow\u201d with us.\u00a0 We have been encouraging listeners all this month, Dennis, to spend time together in God\u2019s Word during 2010.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIn fact, we have been beginning our programs here in January by pointing to a particular passage.\u00a0 We have been going through your book, <em>Moments With You<\/em>, the devotional guide you wrote for couples because each of those devotions begins with a Scripture.\u00a0 What is the Scripture for the 26<sup>th<\/sup> of January?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>It is the last verse in the Old Testament\u2014Malachi4:6.\u00a0 It reads, \u201cAnd He will turn the hearts of the fathers to their children and the hearts of the children to their fathers, lest I come and smite the land with a curse.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThis is really all about the relationship of a father and his children.\u00a0 When Jesus Christ invades our lives as dads, we have to become attractive to our children and be, may I say it, almost god-like to them where they are getting a picture of what God is like because of how you love them, how you care for them, how you <strong>discipline <\/strong>them.\u00a0 I think what a couple can do after reading this verse is talk about, \u201cAs a father, how are you doing?\u201d\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 On a one-to-ten-point scale, how do you feel you are doing in being a daddy?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>And what score would your kids give you on that scale?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>That is what I was also going to advise is maybe if you are at the dinner table with them, could you dare ask them on a one-to-ten-point scale, \u201cHow is Daddy doing?\u201d\u00a0 That might be too tough for a daddy, but I think the question is worth asking.\u00a0 It was Socrates who said, \u201cThe unexamined life is not worth living.\u201d\u00a0 I think as dads we really need to come back to Scripture and evaluate, \u201cIs my heart connected to my sons, to my daughters?\u00a0 Am I living out a Christ-like love and forgiveness in relationship with each of my children?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Again, our hope is that you will be spending time together in God\u2019s Word throughout 2010.\u00a0 If we can help you do that by sending you an email, the <em>Moments With You<\/em> devotionals are available via email; or if you would like to get a copy of the book, go to our website FamilyLifeToday.com.\u00a0 Keep this habit going in your marriage and in your family throughout the year.\u00a0 I think you will find that that daily diet of spending time together in God\u2019s Word will pay dividends in your life.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIn fact, the couple we are going to meet today is a couple who had to lean on their confidence in God and their rootedness in their Christian faith to get through a tragedy that struck their family back in April of 2008 when their daughter, Natasha, was along with a group of her schoolmates, caught up in a flood in New Zealand that ultimately took her life and took their lives.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Yes.\u00a0 In fact, Bob, on the day that news occurred, I happened to have gotten up a bit early that morning\u2014it was about four o\u2019clock.\u00a0 I saw an email from my friends, Andy and Nikki Bray, in New Zealand.\u00a0 Andy and Nikki give leadership to FamilyLife there and have for a number of years.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe email was asking for prayer.\u00a0 It basically said, \u201cDennis, there has been a tragic accident.\u00a0 We fear for our daughter.\u00a0 Please pray.\u201d\u00a0 I immediately prayed and sent an email back to Andy.\u00a0 Through the miracle of the internet, here I was in Little Rock, Arkansas, chatting back and forth with a dad who was about to enter into a journey that has to be a parent\u2019s worst nightmare.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe wanted our listeners to hear this story and to hear the heart of how God worked in the lives of not only in a pair of parents, but in a family, and in a nation because of what took place there.\u00a0 So we asked Andy and Nikki Bray to join us.\u00a0 They are listening in right now from New Zealand.\u00a0 Andy, Nikki, welcome to the broadcast.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Andy:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Hi Dennis; hi Bob.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Nikki:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>\u00a0Hi Dennis.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Great to be with you guys today.\u00a0 I think back to when Dennis shared the news with the whole staff, and we were all praying for you guys.\u00a0 Take us back to the beginning of this account.\u00a0 Your daughter had gone with schoolmates for a, this was like a camping trip that they were all going on together, is that right?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Andy:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Each summer the Year-12 children from this particular school go off on an adventure trip to a place called the Outdoor Pursuit Center which is down in the middle of the north island.\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 It is a mountainous area\u2014lots of beautiful rivers.\u00a0 It is a lovely part of the country down there.\u00a0 The weekend of their going away, was just a tremendous terrible storm warning right around the country.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt was with bated breath that we sent them off.\u00a0 We remember having various conversations with Natasha before she left about the weather.\u00a0 We were all aware of bad the weather was.\u00a0 In fact, it was raining so hard on our ceiling of our roof that we could hardly hear ourselves in our own home.\u00a0 So that is how bad it was.\u00a0 We knew the weather was bad; but we sent these children off into the capable hands of the professionals, the outdoor instructors, believing that they would be safe.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe got the news very late in the night.\u00a0 Actually, we heard it first on the TV news that some Elim college students were missing on a river.\u00a0 We just thought they had been hiking and maybe had just lost their way and were resting on the side of the river, and searchers were trying to find them.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut this wasn\u2019t to be the case.\u00a0 Apparently an instructor had actually taken them into a river in this terrible weather, and a huge flood of water had come down and just washed them away to their death, all seven of these children.\u00a0 We heard that eventually, actually we heard it on the internet first, can you believe it, rather than from the police or anything like that, we heard this news that we did not want to hear.\u00a0 Eventually when the policeman did come to our door and knock to confirm it, there was a terrible moment that is still etched in our memories, of course.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>So what you heard on the internet and then on the television, that the accident had happened and that seven students had lost their lives in this flood?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Nikki:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>It was all very crazy.\u00a0 You know the media hears things, and it all comes out in different bits.\u00a0 Some things are true and some things are not true.\u00a0 Everyone was scrambling around trying to find out what had actually happened.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSo yes, we heard that some students had been lost.\u00a0 We didn\u2019t know it was our school.\u00a0 Then piece by piece, hour by hour, we found out it was our school.\u00a0 We were in discussion with the principal at the time.\u00a0 We didn\u2019t know who particularly, there were 40 children who had gone down.\u00a0 We didn\u2019t know which particular group it was, and then the principal told us, \u201cYes, it was our daughter\u2019s group.\u00a0 Yes, our daughter was one of the missing because four of them did get out alive.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThen, of course, we were hoping beyond anything.\u00a0 Then on the news, of course, we heard three deaths, and then we heard five deaths, and then it got to the stage where we didn\u2019t know who they were that had died.\u00a0 There were still two who were missing for a long time.\u00a0 Then, of course, when the policeman came to our door, we knew, of course, Natasha was not one of them alive.\u00a0 We found out that actually none of them were alive.\u00a0 That was the worst nightmare that we have ever, ever lived through.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>You have three children.\u00a0 Natasha was your oldest daughter.\u00a0 Share with our listeners a little about her.\u00a0 I know all of your children are special to you; but she was \u201cthe apple of your eye\u201d wasn\u2019t she, Andy?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Andy:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Yes, she certainly was!\u00a0 I\u2019m sorry.\u00a0 There is something about the first I guess.\u00a0 They are born with leadership.\u00a0 She had an incredible love for God.\u00a0 As a dad, I just was so intrigued by her amazing faith that I had actually never seen in anyone before.\u00a0 She so wanted to dedicate her life to wanting to please the Lord in every single way that she lived her life.\u00a0 She was an example to me.\u00a0 I was just intrigued to see how this faith was going to play itself as she grew up and became an adult.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Andy, when news like this comes, I tend to be an optimist and think, \u201cThings will work out.\u00a0 They will find the kids.\u00a0 Everything will be okay.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Andy:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>That is exactly right.\u00a0 Yes.\u00a0 I had everybody in the lounge with me, standing in a circle.\u00a0 There was still one person who hadn\u2019t been found, and I knew that had been Natasha.\u00a0 She will be fine; she will be the one who made it through.\u00a0 Let\u2019s pray that it is going to be her.\u00a0 So we had everybody in the lounge praying that Natasha would come through this.\u00a0 Of course, that wasn\u2019t to be.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Nikki, let me ask you.\u00a0 How did you as a mom help your kids process the loss of their sister, and how did you help them deal with faith in the middle of that?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Nikki:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>That is a very good question.\u00a0 I think helping them to deal with it is tremendous.\u00a0 They watched us go through incredible agony and incredible grief.\u00a0 I remember Olivia saying to me on my birthday, which was a couple of months later\u2014we give speeches to honor the birthday person when it is their birthday\u2014and she was speaking to me.\u00a0 She said to me, \u201cWhen Natasha died,\u201d she said, \u201cI just thought you would give up on life, and you would give up on us, and that we would never have our mother back again.\u00a0 But I just want to thank you for not doing that and for trusting God for the outcome of all of this.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Nikki, in the book that Andy has written, he shares a letter that your son Ben wrote about his sister\u2019s death.\u00a0 I\u2019m just wondering if you wouldn\u2019t mind sharing that letter with our listeners.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Nikki:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Sure.\u00a0 He says, \u201cI lay my tender red face down onto the seeping-wet pillow, waiting, wondering in a mental cloud of darkness, peering at the clock reading, \u201c16 April, 2:47 AM.\u201d\u00a0 I silently begged God to spare an older sister and also an amazing friend.\u00a0 Cries in the lounge made me spring to my feet.\u00a0 I steadily opened the door as light from the lounge crept into the somber room.\u00a0 Through the diminutive space, I wearily gazed across the lounge to see a mournful police officer, grasping a police hat in his shaky hand, surrounded by tearful, blood-shot eyes.\u00a0 Just at a slight glance, I knew.\u00a0 Suddenly I felt light-headed and confused.\u00a0 I felt like I was going to faint or completely lose it and pulverize everything in sight, but all I could do was flee, hide, and cry.\u00a0 Lying in bed, unable to sleep, I concealed myself in the covers, praying that this mournful night was just a horrible dream.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>You know, at that point you do wish you could wake up and discover it truly was a dream that hadn\u2019t happened; but it did.\u00a0 A couple of days after the event, I gave Andy a call to ask him how he was feeling and what was going on in his life.\u00a0 Andy and Nikki, I know you probably haven\u2019t heard this, but we actually recorded that phone call.\u00a0 I would like to play it right now just to be reminded of what you were feeling and experiencing there less than two days after Natasha\u2019s death.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t(Recorded phone conversation.)\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Andy:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>\u201cWe saw it on the news, you see, that some school children had been lost on a river.\u00a0 It was all we knew, seven kids lost on a river.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>\u201cOh, I am <strong>so <\/strong>sorry.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Andy:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>\u201cYes.\u00a0 Amazingly enough God has kept us really strong.\u00a0 We hurt all over inside, but we don\u2019t have too many questions.\u00a0 We have talked about the whole side of faith; and I said, \u2018If we really believe this, honey, we know that she is a much better place and we don\u2019t need to know the reasons why.\u00a0 If we are living our faith, we ultimately want to be with Jesus.\u2019\u00a0 Well, that is what happened.\u00a0 She is where she always wanted to be\u2014in worship.\u00a0 In worship\u2014she always wanted to be every day of her life, she would sing those songs.\u00a0 Ultimately our greatest wish has come true, really.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t(Broadcast conversation resumed)\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>You know, Andy, listening back to that, you had the opportunity in the days following Natasha\u2019s death to give testimony of your faith in God in a number of different settings, both of you did.\u00a0 The nation of New Zealand was fixed on this story.\u00a0 They got to hear you guys talking about \u201cjumping in puddles.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Andy:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>(Laughter)\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Nikki:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>The night before they left to go down to OPC--as Andy said before, it was raging a storm\u2014I said, \u201cHow will you feel, honey, if it is rains the whole time you are there?\u201d because they had been looking forward to this for so long.\u00a0 She said, \u201cOh, Mum, Portia and I have come up with a little saying.\u00a0 \u2018We are going to jump in puddles,\u2019 meaning that even if it gets really bad, we are going to make the most of whatever comes our way.\u201d\u00a0 That was kind of how she epitomized life, and that is how we have endeavored to face the days ahead without her.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut going back to what you said about Andy and addressing the media, so many people have said to us afterwards, Christians and non-Christians, how the country really did stop and take a look at the Lord that we worshipped.\u00a0 They wanted to know how a bunch of Christians were going to deal with this.\u00a0 They really got to see a glimpse of true faith, I think, in action.\u00a0 Murray Burton, the principal, did just a fantastic job.\u00a0 Andy represented the parents really well.\u00a0 I remember one of the media reporters saying, \u201cI don\u2019t know whatever it is they are drinking; but whatever it is, I want a sip of it.\u201d\u00a0 (Laughter)\u00a0 That is kind of the attitude of everybody.\u00a0 They really took the Lord seriously.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>One thing we haven\u2019t talked about here is how her death has impacted your marriage.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Andy:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Yes.\u00a0 We are really a strong couple.\u00a0 We have got an amazing marriage.\u00a0 I think maybe because of FamilyLife, because of their commitment to marriage.\u00a0 There has never been any doubt about our marriage being strong throughout all of this, but we did handle it differently.\u00a0\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI remember in the early days, soon after the tragedy, there was some tension in our marriage because of the way we handled the situation differently.\u00a0 For example, Nikki wanted to talk about Natasha <strong>all<\/strong> the time, every single moment of the day.\u00a0 You know, the hat that Olivia was wearing was Natasha\u2019s hat.\u00a0 \u201cThat is where Natasha used to go in the park.\u201d\u00a0 Every little bit of conversation that Nikki had was all about Natasha.\u00a0 That is how she processed it; that is just the way that she handled it.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhereas, for me, I would rather pull away, be more reflective, and sit alone.\u00a0 So it was just a different way we handled it.\u00a0\u00a0 There was tension around those areas because I would get sick of Nikki constantly talking about Natasha when I wasn\u2019t really strong enough to handle that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Nikki:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>I would get frustrated because all Andy wanted to do was if the media came knocking and they wanted to hear about her, Andy would give them everything; and he would write about her and be writing all these articles.\u00a0 I wanted that more private but Andy wanted the world to know so we were handling it very, very differently.\u00a0 Again, it is one of those times when we really had to ask the Lord to give us His grace to extend to one another because we were finding it hard.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>You know, in the opening night of the Weekend to Remember conference, we talk about the inevitable trials and difficulties that couples are going to face in a marriage relationship.\u00a0 We may not all face the trial and the difficulty that you guys faced in the loss of a daughter, but the reality is there are going to be moments in a marriage, there are going to be times in a life, when trial comes and the question is, \u201cDoes that press you towards isolation or does it press you toward oneness?\u201d\u00a0 If you are going to go toward oneness, you have to be purposeful, you have to be intentional, and you have to walk in faith.\u00a0 I think you guys have demonstrated that in the midst of this situation.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Andy:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>We have also seen the Weekend to Remember\u00ae, the FamilyLife conference, really come to the fore as a result of this tragedy too because the impact on some of those other couples, the other families that lost loved ones, on their marriages has been intense.\u00a0 We have seen some of the other marriages just fray at the edges of it.\u00a0 We have had to be in there and, in fact, offered them all a free conference.\u00a0 A number of them have attended, haven\u2019t they, darling?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Nikki:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Andy:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Just seeing that Weekend to Remember\u00ae, that FamilyLife conference, strengthen those couples that have been going through this crisis with us.\u00a0 It is an extraordinary weekend of just building couples up and strengthening them, re-motivating them, I guess, inspiring them to hang on, no matter what.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>You know, as I listen to your story again, I just have to say to both of you, Andy and Nikki, what a remarkable pair of Christ-followers you guys are.\u00a0 I know your book, <em>Treasures in the Darkness<\/em> is really written after Isaiah 45:3.\u00a0 It really exemplifies your lives here.\u00a0 I want to read this verse.\u00a0 It says, \u201cAnd I will give you treasures hidden in the darkness, secret riches.\u00a0 I will do this so you may know that I am the Lord, the God of Israel, the One who calls you by name.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI just want to thank you guys for being \u201cfinishers of your faith,\u201d and not merely just processing your trust in God for your own lives but being willing to be used throughout New Zealand, and really other countries as well.\u00a0 And now here in the United States as a great model of a couple who are building their house on the Rock and not on the sand.\u00a0 I love you guys.\u00a0 I am proud of you and count it a privilege to be in the spiritual battle for the family with you.\u00a0 I pray for God\u2019s favor on you.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Andy:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Thank you, Dennis.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Nikki:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Thank you so much.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Andy:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>You know, I think what those treasures are, Dennis as we close is, I think they are the experiences that God gives us as we travel the journey with Him.\u00a0 It is those little experiencing God along the way which are becoming the treasures in our lives.\u00a0 They may not be the things we necessarily want; but as we look back, we realize what a treasure they really are.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Dennis, I know that you and Barbara have recommended to a lot of people Gerry Sittser\u2019s book, <em>A Grace Disguised<\/em>, that God used in your own lives when your granddaughter Molly was born and lived for seven days.\u00a0\u00a0 That may be a book that our listeners want to get a hold of if they have been through the kind of tragedy that Andy and Nikki have gone through in the loss of their daughter Natasha.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe have that book in our FamilyLife Today Resource Center.\u00a0 It is a great book to pass along to someone you know who has been through any kind of personal grief or loss.\u00a0 Again, it is called <em>A Grace Disguised<\/em>.\u00a0 There is more information about the book on our website, FamilyLifeToday.com; or you can call for more information at 1-800-358-6329.\u00a0 That is 1-800-\u201cF\u201d as in family, \u201cL\u201d as in life, and then the word TODAY.\u00a0 We can let you know how we can get a copy of that book sent to you.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNow we want to take a minute and just say a word of thanks to those of you who help support the ministry of <em>FamilyLife <\/em>Today.\u00a0 Your donations keep our radio program on this station and on our network of stations all across the country.\u00a0 That is what it means to be a \u201clistener-supported program.\u201d\u00a0 We do appreciate your partnership with us.\u00a0 I know that some of our listeners simply make a donation as they are able from time-to-time.\u00a0 Others of you are Legacy Partners, who make a monthly donation to help support this ministry.\u00a0 In either case, we want you to know that you are appreciated.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIf you have never made a donation to support this ministry, we would like to invite you to be a part of the team that keeps <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> on the air in your community and in other communities.\u00a0 If you make a donation this month of any amount, we would like to say, \u201cThank you,\u201d by sending you a copy of a two CD set, interviews we recorded a while back with \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tDr. Emerson Eggerichs, the author of <em>Love and Respect.<\/em>\u00a0 We talked with him why it is so important for a wife to know she is loved in a marriage relationship and for a husband to feel respected in that same relationship.\u00a0 Again, the CDs are our way of saying, \u201cThank you,\u201d when you support <em>FamilyLife Today <\/em>with a donation of any amount.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIf you make your donation online at FamilyLifeToday.com, just type the word, \u201cRESPECT,\u201d in the key code box that you find on the online donation form, and we will know to send the CDs off to you; or call 1-800-FLTODAY.\u00a0 Make a donation over the phone and ask for the <em>Love and Respect<\/em> CDs, and we will get those out to you as well.\u00a0 Again, thanks for whatever you are able to do to help support this ministry.\u00a0 We do appreciate your partnership with us.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch, and our entire broadcast production team for all their work on today\u2019s program.\u00a0 Thanks to our guests, Andy and Nikki Bray.\u00a0 On behalf of our host, Dennis Rainey, I'm Bob Lepine.\u00a0 We'll see you back tomorrow for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHelp for Today.\u00a0 Hope for Tomorrow.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u00a9 2010 FamilyLife\n\t\t\t<\/p>"],"_seopress_titles_title":[""],"_seopress_titles_desc":[""],"_seopress_robots_index":[""],"duration":["00:"],"show_notes":[""],"_thumbnail_id":["294104"],"filesize":["14.88M"],"filesize_raw":["15603993"],"_uag_css_file_name":["uag-css-301969.css"],"_uag_js_file_name":["uag-js-301969.js"],"_uag_page_assets":["a:9:{s:3:\"css\";s:82560:\".wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape-top svg{width: calc( 100% + 1.3px );}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape.uagb-container__shape-top .uagb-container__shape-fill{fill: rgba(51,51,51,1);}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape-bottom svg{width: calc( 100% + 1.3px 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and Nikki Bray talk candidly about the tragic flash flood that took the life of the their oldest daughter, Natasha, at the age of 16.","meta_box":{"show_notes":"","transcript_url":"https:\/\/transcript.familylifetoday.com\/fl2010-01-26.pdf","transcript_content":"<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>For a number of years now, Andy and Nikki Bray have given leadership to FamilyLife\u2019s ministry in New Zealand.\u00a0 In April of 2008 their marriage and their trust in God was put to the test when their daughter, Natasha was among a group of school students who died in a terrible flood.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Newscaster:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Six students and a teacher from the Elim Christian College in Auckland died when they were swept down a rugged bush gorge in a flooded stream.\u00a0 Search and rescue staff and police battled rugged terrain to recover bodies following the tragedy.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Account given:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>I understand they were on a shelf which is above the water level.\u00a0 They had to make a quick decision.\u00a0 They made a decision to jump from the shelf into the water.\u00a0 It is at that stage when the group got taken away rapidly and seven lives were lost.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rescue Worker:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>The first person we came across was Natasha.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Nikki:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>My heart goes out to people who don\u2019t have a strong marriage to get through something like this.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Andy:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>There was some tension in our marriage because of the way we handled the situation differently.\u00a0 For example, Nikki wanted to talk about Natasha <strong>all<\/strong> the time, every single moment of the day.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Nikki:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>I would get frustrated because all Andy wanted to do was if the media came knocking and they wanted to hear about her, Andy would give them everything; and he would write about her and be writing his articles.\u00a0 I wanted that more privately but Andy wanted the world to know so we were handling it very, very differently.\u00a0 Again, it is one of those times when we really had to ask the Lord to give us His grace to extend to one another because we were finding it hard.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>This is <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> for Tuesday, January 26<sup>th<\/sup>.\u00a0 Our host is the President of FamilyLife, Dennis Rainey; and I am Bob Lepine.\u00a0 Andy and Nikki Bray have had to learn how to lean on the grace of God in a number of settings over the last several months.\u00a0 They will talk about it with us today.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWelcome to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>.\u00a0 Thanks for joining us on the Tuesday edition.\u00a0 We are going to hear an account today of a dark chapter from a couple\u2019s life.\u00a0 You know, in the midst of those dark chapters, one of the things that sustains us is our relationship with Christ, who \u201cwalks through the valley of the shadow\u201d with us.\u00a0 We have been encouraging listeners all this month, Dennis, to spend time together in God\u2019s Word during 2010.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIn fact, we have been beginning our programs here in January by pointing to a particular passage.\u00a0 We have been going through your book, <em>Moments With You<\/em>, the devotional guide you wrote for couples because each of those devotions begins with a Scripture.\u00a0 What is the Scripture for the 26<sup>th<\/sup> of January?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>It is the last verse in the Old Testament\u2014Malachi4:6.\u00a0 It reads, \u201cAnd He will turn the hearts of the fathers to their children and the hearts of the children to their fathers, lest I come and smite the land with a curse.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThis is really all about the relationship of a father and his children.\u00a0 When Jesus Christ invades our lives as dads, we have to become attractive to our children and be, may I say it, almost god-like to them where they are getting a picture of what God is like because of how you love them, how you care for them, how you <strong>discipline <\/strong>them.\u00a0 I think what a couple can do after reading this verse is talk about, \u201cAs a father, how are you doing?\u201d\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 On a one-to-ten-point scale, how do you feel you are doing in being a daddy?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>And what score would your kids give you on that scale?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>That is what I was also going to advise is maybe if you are at the dinner table with them, could you dare ask them on a one-to-ten-point scale, \u201cHow is Daddy doing?\u201d\u00a0 That might be too tough for a daddy, but I think the question is worth asking.\u00a0 It was Socrates who said, \u201cThe unexamined life is not worth living.\u201d\u00a0 I think as dads we really need to come back to Scripture and evaluate, \u201cIs my heart connected to my sons, to my daughters?\u00a0 Am I living out a Christ-like love and forgiveness in relationship with each of my children?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Again, our hope is that you will be spending time together in God\u2019s Word throughout 2010.\u00a0 If we can help you do that by sending you an email, the <em>Moments With You<\/em> devotionals are available via email; or if you would like to get a copy of the book, go to our website FamilyLifeToday.com.\u00a0 Keep this habit going in your marriage and in your family throughout the year.\u00a0 I think you will find that that daily diet of spending time together in God\u2019s Word will pay dividends in your life.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIn fact, the couple we are going to meet today is a couple who had to lean on their confidence in God and their rootedness in their Christian faith to get through a tragedy that struck their family back in April of 2008 when their daughter, Natasha, was along with a group of her schoolmates, caught up in a flood in New Zealand that ultimately took her life and took their lives.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Yes.\u00a0 In fact, Bob, on the day that news occurred, I happened to have gotten up a bit early that morning\u2014it was about four o\u2019clock.\u00a0 I saw an email from my friends, Andy and Nikki Bray, in New Zealand.\u00a0 Andy and Nikki give leadership to FamilyLife there and have for a number of years.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe email was asking for prayer.\u00a0 It basically said, \u201cDennis, there has been a tragic accident.\u00a0 We fear for our daughter.\u00a0 Please pray.\u201d\u00a0 I immediately prayed and sent an email back to Andy.\u00a0 Through the miracle of the internet, here I was in Little Rock, Arkansas, chatting back and forth with a dad who was about to enter into a journey that has to be a parent\u2019s worst nightmare.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe wanted our listeners to hear this story and to hear the heart of how God worked in the lives of not only in a pair of parents, but in a family, and in a nation because of what took place there.\u00a0 So we asked Andy and Nikki Bray to join us.\u00a0 They are listening in right now from New Zealand.\u00a0 Andy, Nikki, welcome to the broadcast.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Andy:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Hi Dennis; hi Bob.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Nikki:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>\u00a0Hi Dennis.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Great to be with you guys today.\u00a0 I think back to when Dennis shared the news with the whole staff, and we were all praying for you guys.\u00a0 Take us back to the beginning of this account.\u00a0 Your daughter had gone with schoolmates for a, this was like a camping trip that they were all going on together, is that right?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Andy:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Each summer the Year-12 children from this particular school go off on an adventure trip to a place called the Outdoor Pursuit Center which is down in the middle of the north island.\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 It is a mountainous area\u2014lots of beautiful rivers.\u00a0 It is a lovely part of the country down there.\u00a0 The weekend of their going away, was just a tremendous terrible storm warning right around the country.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt was with bated breath that we sent them off.\u00a0 We remember having various conversations with Natasha before she left about the weather.\u00a0 We were all aware of bad the weather was.\u00a0 In fact, it was raining so hard on our ceiling of our roof that we could hardly hear ourselves in our own home.\u00a0 So that is how bad it was.\u00a0 We knew the weather was bad; but we sent these children off into the capable hands of the professionals, the outdoor instructors, believing that they would be safe.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe got the news very late in the night.\u00a0 Actually, we heard it first on the TV news that some Elim college students were missing on a river.\u00a0 We just thought they had been hiking and maybe had just lost their way and were resting on the side of the river, and searchers were trying to find them.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut this wasn\u2019t to be the case.\u00a0 Apparently an instructor had actually taken them into a river in this terrible weather, and a huge flood of water had come down and just washed them away to their death, all seven of these children.\u00a0 We heard that eventually, actually we heard it on the internet first, can you believe it, rather than from the police or anything like that, we heard this news that we did not want to hear.\u00a0 Eventually when the policeman did come to our door and knock to confirm it, there was a terrible moment that is still etched in our memories, of course.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>So what you heard on the internet and then on the television, that the accident had happened and that seven students had lost their lives in this flood?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Nikki:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>It was all very crazy.\u00a0 You know the media hears things, and it all comes out in different bits.\u00a0 Some things are true and some things are not true.\u00a0 Everyone was scrambling around trying to find out what had actually happened.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSo yes, we heard that some students had been lost.\u00a0 We didn\u2019t know it was our school.\u00a0 Then piece by piece, hour by hour, we found out it was our school.\u00a0 We were in discussion with the principal at the time.\u00a0 We didn\u2019t know who particularly, there were 40 children who had gone down.\u00a0 We didn\u2019t know which particular group it was, and then the principal told us, \u201cYes, it was our daughter\u2019s group.\u00a0 Yes, our daughter was one of the missing because four of them did get out alive.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThen, of course, we were hoping beyond anything.\u00a0 Then on the news, of course, we heard three deaths, and then we heard five deaths, and then it got to the stage where we didn\u2019t know who they were that had died.\u00a0 There were still two who were missing for a long time.\u00a0 Then, of course, when the policeman came to our door, we knew, of course, Natasha was not one of them alive.\u00a0 We found out that actually none of them were alive.\u00a0 That was the worst nightmare that we have ever, ever lived through.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>You have three children.\u00a0 Natasha was your oldest daughter.\u00a0 Share with our listeners a little about her.\u00a0 I know all of your children are special to you; but she was \u201cthe apple of your eye\u201d wasn\u2019t she, Andy?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Andy:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Yes, she certainly was!\u00a0 I\u2019m sorry.\u00a0 There is something about the first I guess.\u00a0 They are born with leadership.\u00a0 She had an incredible love for God.\u00a0 As a dad, I just was so intrigued by her amazing faith that I had actually never seen in anyone before.\u00a0 She so wanted to dedicate her life to wanting to please the Lord in every single way that she lived her life.\u00a0 She was an example to me.\u00a0 I was just intrigued to see how this faith was going to play itself as she grew up and became an adult.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Andy, when news like this comes, I tend to be an optimist and think, \u201cThings will work out.\u00a0 They will find the kids.\u00a0 Everything will be okay.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Andy:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>That is exactly right.\u00a0 Yes.\u00a0 I had everybody in the lounge with me, standing in a circle.\u00a0 There was still one person who hadn\u2019t been found, and I knew that had been Natasha.\u00a0 She will be fine; she will be the one who made it through.\u00a0 Let\u2019s pray that it is going to be her.\u00a0 So we had everybody in the lounge praying that Natasha would come through this.\u00a0 Of course, that wasn\u2019t to be.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Nikki, let me ask you.\u00a0 How did you as a mom help your kids process the loss of their sister, and how did you help them deal with faith in the middle of that?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Nikki:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>That is a very good question.\u00a0 I think helping them to deal with it is tremendous.\u00a0 They watched us go through incredible agony and incredible grief.\u00a0 I remember Olivia saying to me on my birthday, which was a couple of months later\u2014we give speeches to honor the birthday person when it is their birthday\u2014and she was speaking to me.\u00a0 She said to me, \u201cWhen Natasha died,\u201d she said, \u201cI just thought you would give up on life, and you would give up on us, and that we would never have our mother back again.\u00a0 But I just want to thank you for not doing that and for trusting God for the outcome of all of this.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Nikki, in the book that Andy has written, he shares a letter that your son Ben wrote about his sister\u2019s death.\u00a0 I\u2019m just wondering if you wouldn\u2019t mind sharing that letter with our listeners.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Nikki:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Sure.\u00a0 He says, \u201cI lay my tender red face down onto the seeping-wet pillow, waiting, wondering in a mental cloud of darkness, peering at the clock reading, \u201c16 April, 2:47 AM.\u201d\u00a0 I silently begged God to spare an older sister and also an amazing friend.\u00a0 Cries in the lounge made me spring to my feet.\u00a0 I steadily opened the door as light from the lounge crept into the somber room.\u00a0 Through the diminutive space, I wearily gazed across the lounge to see a mournful police officer, grasping a police hat in his shaky hand, surrounded by tearful, blood-shot eyes.\u00a0 Just at a slight glance, I knew.\u00a0 Suddenly I felt light-headed and confused.\u00a0 I felt like I was going to faint or completely lose it and pulverize everything in sight, but all I could do was flee, hide, and cry.\u00a0 Lying in bed, unable to sleep, I concealed myself in the covers, praying that this mournful night was just a horrible dream.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>You know, at that point you do wish you could wake up and discover it truly was a dream that hadn\u2019t happened; but it did.\u00a0 A couple of days after the event, I gave Andy a call to ask him how he was feeling and what was going on in his life.\u00a0 Andy and Nikki, I know you probably haven\u2019t heard this, but we actually recorded that phone call.\u00a0 I would like to play it right now just to be reminded of what you were feeling and experiencing there less than two days after Natasha\u2019s death.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t(Recorded phone conversation.)\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Andy:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>\u201cWe saw it on the news, you see, that some school children had been lost on a river.\u00a0 It was all we knew, seven kids lost on a river.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>\u201cOh, I am <strong>so <\/strong>sorry.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Andy:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>\u201cYes.\u00a0 Amazingly enough God has kept us really strong.\u00a0 We hurt all over inside, but we don\u2019t have too many questions.\u00a0 We have talked about the whole side of faith; and I said, \u2018If we really believe this, honey, we know that she is a much better place and we don\u2019t need to know the reasons why.\u00a0 If we are living our faith, we ultimately want to be with Jesus.\u2019\u00a0 Well, that is what happened.\u00a0 She is where she always wanted to be\u2014in worship.\u00a0 In worship\u2014she always wanted to be every day of her life, she would sing those songs.\u00a0 Ultimately our greatest wish has come true, really.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t(Broadcast conversation resumed)\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>You know, Andy, listening back to that, you had the opportunity in the days following Natasha\u2019s death to give testimony of your faith in God in a number of different settings, both of you did.\u00a0 The nation of New Zealand was fixed on this story.\u00a0 They got to hear you guys talking about \u201cjumping in puddles.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Andy:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>(Laughter)\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Nikki:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>The night before they left to go down to OPC--as Andy said before, it was raging a storm\u2014I said, \u201cHow will you feel, honey, if it is rains the whole time you are there?\u201d because they had been looking forward to this for so long.\u00a0 She said, \u201cOh, Mum, Portia and I have come up with a little saying.\u00a0 \u2018We are going to jump in puddles,\u2019 meaning that even if it gets really bad, we are going to make the most of whatever comes our way.\u201d\u00a0 That was kind of how she epitomized life, and that is how we have endeavored to face the days ahead without her.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut going back to what you said about Andy and addressing the media, so many people have said to us afterwards, Christians and non-Christians, how the country really did stop and take a look at the Lord that we worshipped.\u00a0 They wanted to know how a bunch of Christians were going to deal with this.\u00a0 They really got to see a glimpse of true faith, I think, in action.\u00a0 Murray Burton, the principal, did just a fantastic job.\u00a0 Andy represented the parents really well.\u00a0 I remember one of the media reporters saying, \u201cI don\u2019t know whatever it is they are drinking; but whatever it is, I want a sip of it.\u201d\u00a0 (Laughter)\u00a0 That is kind of the attitude of everybody.\u00a0 They really took the Lord seriously.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>One thing we haven\u2019t talked about here is how her death has impacted your marriage.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Andy:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Yes.\u00a0 We are really a strong couple.\u00a0 We have got an amazing marriage.\u00a0 I think maybe because of FamilyLife, because of their commitment to marriage.\u00a0 There has never been any doubt about our marriage being strong throughout all of this, but we did handle it differently.\u00a0\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI remember in the early days, soon after the tragedy, there was some tension in our marriage because of the way we handled the situation differently.\u00a0 For example, Nikki wanted to talk about Natasha <strong>all<\/strong> the time, every single moment of the day.\u00a0 You know, the hat that Olivia was wearing was Natasha\u2019s hat.\u00a0 \u201cThat is where Natasha used to go in the park.\u201d\u00a0 Every little bit of conversation that Nikki had was all about Natasha.\u00a0 That is how she processed it; that is just the way that she handled it.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhereas, for me, I would rather pull away, be more reflective, and sit alone.\u00a0 So it was just a different way we handled it.\u00a0\u00a0 There was tension around those areas because I would get sick of Nikki constantly talking about Natasha when I wasn\u2019t really strong enough to handle that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Nikki:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>I would get frustrated because all Andy wanted to do was if the media came knocking and they wanted to hear about her, Andy would give them everything; and he would write about her and be writing all these articles.\u00a0 I wanted that more private but Andy wanted the world to know so we were handling it very, very differently.\u00a0 Again, it is one of those times when we really had to ask the Lord to give us His grace to extend to one another because we were finding it hard.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>You know, in the opening night of the Weekend to Remember conference, we talk about the inevitable trials and difficulties that couples are going to face in a marriage relationship.\u00a0 We may not all face the trial and the difficulty that you guys faced in the loss of a daughter, but the reality is there are going to be moments in a marriage, there are going to be times in a life, when trial comes and the question is, \u201cDoes that press you towards isolation or does it press you toward oneness?\u201d\u00a0 If you are going to go toward oneness, you have to be purposeful, you have to be intentional, and you have to walk in faith.\u00a0 I think you guys have demonstrated that in the midst of this situation.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Andy:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>We have also seen the Weekend to Remember\u00ae, the FamilyLife conference, really come to the fore as a result of this tragedy too because the impact on some of those other couples, the other families that lost loved ones, on their marriages has been intense.\u00a0 We have seen some of the other marriages just fray at the edges of it.\u00a0 We have had to be in there and, in fact, offered them all a free conference.\u00a0 A number of them have attended, haven\u2019t they, darling?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Nikki:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Andy:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Just seeing that Weekend to Remember\u00ae, that FamilyLife conference, strengthen those couples that have been going through this crisis with us.\u00a0 It is an extraordinary weekend of just building couples up and strengthening them, re-motivating them, I guess, inspiring them to hang on, no matter what.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>You know, as I listen to your story again, I just have to say to both of you, Andy and Nikki, what a remarkable pair of Christ-followers you guys are.\u00a0 I know your book, <em>Treasures in the Darkness<\/em> is really written after Isaiah 45:3.\u00a0 It really exemplifies your lives here.\u00a0 I want to read this verse.\u00a0 It says, \u201cAnd I will give you treasures hidden in the darkness, secret riches.\u00a0 I will do this so you may know that I am the Lord, the God of Israel, the One who calls you by name.\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI just want to thank you guys for being \u201cfinishers of your faith,\u201d and not merely just processing your trust in God for your own lives but being willing to be used throughout New Zealand, and really other countries as well.\u00a0 And now here in the United States as a great model of a couple who are building their house on the Rock and not on the sand.\u00a0 I love you guys.\u00a0 I am proud of you and count it a privilege to be in the spiritual battle for the family with you.\u00a0 I pray for God\u2019s favor on you.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Andy:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Thank you, Dennis.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Nikki:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Thank you so much.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Andy:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>You know, I think what those treasures are, Dennis as we close is, I think they are the experiences that God gives us as we travel the journey with Him.\u00a0 It is those little experiencing God along the way which are becoming the treasures in our lives.\u00a0 They may not be the things we necessarily want; but as we look back, we realize what a treasure they really are.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Dennis, I know that you and Barbara have recommended to a lot of people Gerry Sittser\u2019s book, <em>A Grace Disguised<\/em>, that God used in your own lives when your granddaughter Molly was born and lived for seven days.\u00a0\u00a0 That may be a book that our listeners want to get a hold of if they have been through the kind of tragedy that Andy and Nikki have gone through in the loss of their daughter Natasha.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe have that book in our FamilyLife Today Resource Center.\u00a0 It is a great book to pass along to someone you know who has been through any kind of personal grief or loss.\u00a0 Again, it is called <em>A Grace Disguised<\/em>.\u00a0 There is more information about the book on our website, FamilyLifeToday.com; or you can call for more information at 1-800-358-6329.\u00a0 That is 1-800-\u201cF\u201d as in family, \u201cL\u201d as in life, and then the word TODAY.\u00a0 We can let you know how we can get a copy of that book sent to you.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNow we want to take a minute and just say a word of thanks to those of you who help support the ministry of <em>FamilyLife <\/em>Today.\u00a0 Your donations keep our radio program on this station and on our network of stations all across the country.\u00a0 That is what it means to be a \u201clistener-supported program.\u201d\u00a0 We do appreciate your partnership with us.\u00a0 I know that some of our listeners simply make a donation as they are able from time-to-time.\u00a0 Others of you are Legacy Partners, who make a monthly donation to help support this ministry.\u00a0 In either case, we want you to know that you are appreciated.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIf you have never made a donation to support this ministry, we would like to invite you to be a part of the team that keeps <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> on the air in your community and in other communities.\u00a0 If you make a donation this month of any amount, we would like to say, \u201cThank you,\u201d by sending you a copy of a two CD set, interviews we recorded a while back with \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tDr. Emerson Eggerichs, the author of <em>Love and Respect.<\/em>\u00a0 We talked with him why it is so important for a wife to know she is loved in a marriage relationship and for a husband to feel respected in that same relationship.\u00a0 Again, the CDs are our way of saying, \u201cThank you,\u201d when you support <em>FamilyLife Today <\/em>with a donation of any amount.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIf you make your donation online at FamilyLifeToday.com, just type the word, \u201cRESPECT,\u201d in the key code box that you find on the online donation form, and we will know to send the CDs off to you; or call 1-800-FLTODAY.\u00a0 Make a donation over the phone and ask for the <em>Love and Respect<\/em> CDs, and we will get those out to you as well.\u00a0 Again, thanks for whatever you are able to do to help support this ministry.\u00a0 We do appreciate your partnership with us.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch, and our entire broadcast production team for all their work on today\u2019s program.\u00a0 Thanks to our guests, Andy and Nikki Bray.\u00a0 On behalf of our host, Dennis Rainey, I'm Bob Lepine.\u00a0 We'll see you back tomorrow for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHelp for Today.\u00a0 Hope for Tomorrow.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u00a9 2010 FamilyLife\n\t\t\t<\/p>","theme_header_position":"","post_header_is_sticky":"","is_header_overlay":""},"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast\/301969","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/podcast"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/91"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=301969"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/294104"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=301969"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=301969"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=301969"},{"taxonomy":"podcast_series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast_series?post=301969"},{"taxonomy":"cwp_profile","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/cwp_profile?post=301969"},{"taxonomy":"series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/series?post=301969"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}