{"id":301842,"date":"2009-06-22T11:00:00","date_gmt":"2009-06-22T15:00:00","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/%series%\/facing-job-loss\/"},"modified":"2009-06-22T11:00:00","modified_gmt":"2009-06-22T15:00:00","slug":"facing-job-loss","status":"publish","type":"podcast","link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/facing-job-loss\/","title":{"rendered":"Facing Job Loss"},"content":{"rendered":"","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Where do you turn when life gets tough?<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":91,"featured_media":294104,"menu_order":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","template":"","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","inline_featured_image":false,"_uag_custom_page_level_css":"","episode_type":"","audio_file":"https:\/\/web.familylifetoday.com\/fl2009-06-22.mp3","cover_image":"","cover_image_id":"","duration":"00:","filesize":"12.18M","filesize_raw":"12774336","date_recorded":"","explicit":"","block":""},"categories":[2867,2848,2851,2901],"tags":[5066],"podcast_series":[7654],"cwp_profile":[3295],"series":[2101],"class_list":["post-301842","podcast","type-podcast","status-publish","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-church-involvement","category-cultural-issues","category-finances","category-husbands","tag-unemployment","podcast_series-being-the-church-in-tough-times","cwp_profile-dave-wilson","series-familylife-today"],"acf":[],"episode_featured_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/09\/FLT-Podcast-Cover-2-508x508-3.jpg?w=508","episode_player_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2023\/02\/image-scaled.jpg","download_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-download\/301842\/facing-job-loss","player_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-player\/301842\/facing-job-loss","audio_player":null,"episode_data":{"playerMode":"light","subscribeUrls":{"apple_podcasts":{"key":"apple_podcasts","url":"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303?mt=2&app=podcast","label":"Apple Podcasts","class":"apple_podcasts","icon":"apple-podcasts.png"},"google_podcasts":{"key":"google_podcasts","url":"","label":"Google Podcasts","class":"google_podcasts","icon":"google-podcasts.png"},"spotify":{"key":"spotify","url":"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm","label":"Spotify","class":"spotify","icon":"spotify.png"},"youtube":{"key":"youtube","url":"","label":"YouTube","class":"youtube","icon":"youtube.png"}},"rssFeedUrl":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/feed\/podcast\/familylife-today","embedCode":"<blockquote class=\"wp-embedded-content\" data-secret=\"N4To2Qojej\"><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/facing-job-loss\/\">Facing Job Loss<\/a><\/blockquote><iframe sandbox=\"allow-scripts\" security=\"restricted\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/facing-job-loss\/embed\/#?secret=N4To2Qojej\" width=\"500\" height=\"350\" title=\"&#8220;Facing Job Loss&#8221; &#8212; FamilyLife\u00ae - A Cru Ministry\" data-secret=\"N4To2Qojej\" frameborder=\"0\" marginwidth=\"0\" marginheight=\"0\" scrolling=\"no\" class=\"wp-embedded-content\"><\/iframe><script>\n\/*! This file is auto-generated *\/\n!function(d,l){\"use strict\";l.querySelector&&d.addEventListener&&\"undefined\"!=typeof URL&&(d.wp=d.wp||{},d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage||(d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage=function(e){var t=e.data;if((t||t.secret||t.message||t.value)&&!\/[^a-zA-Z0-9]\/.test(t.secret)){for(var s,r,n,a=l.querySelectorAll('iframe[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),o=l.querySelectorAll('blockquote[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),c=new RegExp(\"^https?:$\",\"i\"),i=0;i<o.length;i++)o[i].style.display=\"none\";for(i=0;i<a.length;i++)s=a[i],e.source===s.contentWindow&&(s.removeAttribute(\"style\"),\"height\"===t.message?(1e3<(r=parseInt(t.value,10))?r=1e3:~~r<200&&(r=200),s.height=r):\"link\"===t.message&&(r=new URL(s.getAttribute(\"src\")),n=new URL(t.value),c.test(n.protocol))&&n.host===r.host&&l.activeElement===s&&(d.top.location.href=t.value))}},d.addEventListener(\"message\",d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage,!1),l.addEventListener(\"DOMContentLoaded\",function(){for(var e,t,s=l.querySelectorAll(\"iframe.wp-embedded-content\"),r=0;r<s.length;r++)(t=(e=s[r]).getAttribute(\"data-secret\"))||(t=Math.random().toString(36).substring(2,12),e.src+=\"#?secret=\"+t,e.setAttribute(\"data-secret\",t)),e.contentWindow.postMessage({message:\"ready\",secret:t},\"*\")},!1)))}(window,document);\n\/\/# sourceURL=https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-includes\/js\/wp-embed.min.js\n<\/script>\n"},"spectra_custom_meta":{"_wp_page_template":["default"],"transcript_url":["https:\/\/transcript.familylifetoday.com\/fl2009-06-22.pdf"],"audio_file":["https:\/\/web.familylifetoday.com\/fl2009-06-22.mp3"],"transcript_content":["<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u00a0That\u2019s right and when they are brought onto the team\u2026\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 It\u2019s called hazing.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 They have to do an introductory skit.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 And you know what my year was the first year you ever did this.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t(laughter)\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 You\u2019re still bitter.\u00a0\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes, I am bitter but I still think it was the best skit ever done.\u00a0 When I saw your face when I was standing up there I thought I was fired.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 It was a great skit.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, who knows.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 I mean you pushed the boundaries out to the edge.\u00a0 I was a little tight.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes, you were.\u00a0\u00a0 Probably still are.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t(laughter)\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Here comes Dave and Ann you were both dressed in like teenie bopper outfits or something.\u00a0 I forget and you did this dance where you threw her over your head and around your back.\u00a0 I mean it was \u2026what\u2019s the new dance show that\u2019s on tv now?...\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Dancing with the stars.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0\u00a0 He was the original.\u00a0 Dave Wilson was the original.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t(laughter)\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson: <\/strong>\u00a0I learned that night that Dennis Rainey hates rap.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t(laughter)\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>This was the 1988 or 1989 and we decided to put our life story in a rap.\u00a0 We\u2019re from the motor city.\u00a0 We\u2019re from Mo Town. Come on you got to rap.\u00a0 So that\u2019s what we did and as I got in the rap with the one glove Michael Jackson look oh, Dennis, you were sitting there.\u00a0\u00a0 You\u2019re jaw was on the floor.\u00a0 I\u2019m like okay we\u2019re fired.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 I was dying in laughter absolutely.\u00a0 Well as God would have it he would guide this rapper ultimately into becoming a pastor.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 That\u2019s right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 And this has amazed many I know in the Detroit area.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t(laughter)\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 But Dave went on to be the teaching pastor of the Kenningston Community Church which is now a church of 11,000 rappers\u2026\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t(laughter)\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 Very few rappers in this church.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 You have three sons and Dave is also the chaplain of the Detroit Lions and has been for over 20 years.\u00a0 Dave, Bob and I just wanted to talk with you about what\u2019s happening in the Detroit area because unemployment there has gone way past 15 percent.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0\u00a0 Yes, I would imagine that pretty much every week you\u2019re hearing about somebody in your congregation\u2026\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Oh, definitely.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 And you get the phone call and it\u2019s guess what so and so just got laid off.\u00a0 What do you do?\u00a0 How do you respond to that not just as a pastor but as a friend?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 You\u2019re right.\u00a0 Probably about a year ago that started happening weekly almost daily.\u00a0 Even as I flew down here yesterday there were 1600 layoffs at GM.\u00a0 I\u2019m guessing 50 maybe 100 people in our congregation are a part of that.\u00a0 Some of our staff wives there husbands\u2019 work there.\u00a0 Yesterday I was in a meeting and she literally sat in our meeting looking at her cell phone the entire morning waiting for the call.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt\u2019s a scary time.\u00a0 I think one of the biggest things and you guys know this is community.\u00a0 Community is huge in that moment.\u00a0 If you\u2019re not connected in a smaller group some kind of family group you are all alone.\u00a0 Having people to rub shoulders with and lock arms with maybe those that have jobs maybe those going through the same thing is key to sustaining through that scary time.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Having that community is important for emotional support and prayer support but again I\u2019m just thinking if somebody called and said I just lost my job for me to say we\u2019ll be praying for you feels a little like that passage in James 2 where somebody comes and says here\u2019s my deal and you say be warm and filled.\u00a0 Not to minimize the importance of prayer in that moment.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right.\u00a0 Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 I do think we need to be praying for one another and engage in that but is there more that we ought to be doing for those who have lost their jobs?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes.\u00a0 What is the first response that a believer ought to have to someone who has lost their job?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 I think it\u2019s a great opportunity as scary as it is for the church to be the church.\u00a0 For the community of Christ to be the community of Christ which means be there.\u00a0 Be present.\u00a0 It may mean move in my basement and that\u2019s happened.\u00a0\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tA good buddy of mine in my small group has had several different people go through his basement.\u00a0 It\u2019s not a slab basement but a finished basement with a bedroom and a bathroom down there.\u00a0 He puts them down there.\u00a0 He feeds them.\u00a0 He takes care of them as they try to get back on their feet.\u00a0 This is sometimes a couple and sometimes a family with three or four kids.\u00a0 I think that\u2019s the biggest response.\u00a0 Obviously like Bob said pray.\u00a0 You have to pray.\u00a0 You can pray with them.\u00a0 Lay your hands on them.\u00a0 And you may have the whole community pray.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut bigger than that is the presence of Jesus in a human being.\u00a0 Flesh to flesh\u2026Be there.\u00a0 Welcome them in your house.\u00a0 We\u2019ve bought meals for them or taken meals over to their house.\u00a0 We\u2019ve shown up with grocery bags.\u00a0 I mean that\u2019s happening all over our community.\u00a0 And again I think it\u2019s an opportunity for the church to be the church.\u00a0 I think the non church world looks out there and they expect that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou know.\u00a0 Is the church going to show up and for their own?\u00a0 And even for those who are not a part of their church?\u00a0 I think it\u2019s a great opportunity as scary as it is.\u00a0 I don\u2019t want it.\u00a0 None of us want it.\u00a0 We hate it.\u00a0 But yet it\u2019s an opportunity for the church to show up and be the church.\u00a0 And you know this isn\u2019t the first time this has happened.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tFirst century church that\u2019s what the church was.\u00a0 A community of people sharing goods and their possessions.\u00a0 And it\u2019s a chance for us as the community of Christ to be Acts 2.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Is there a place in the local church now I know you have a huge congregation you have how many services on a Sunday?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 We do campusing so we do 14 or 15 services counting the five different campuses.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 So you have audiences from a few hundred to several thousand meeting together.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Is there ever a time when you call for the community of believers just to say if some of you here have lost a job hold your hand up if you need a job and you need prayer and you\u2019d like for someone to contact you about helping put together a resume and a game plan for where you go as a man as a woman as a family.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Does that happen in your church?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Yes, it happens not so much on the weekend service but we provide opportunities outside a weekend service.\u00a0 Come to a seminar.\u00a0 We\u2019ve had business people come in and help people with resumes.\u00a0 Help them network.\u00a0 We can do it on a weekend service.\u00a0 We literally are sitting with about 2000 people in each service so it\u2019s hard to do.\u00a0 So we try to do it in a smaller setting but you\u2019re exactly right.\u00a0 And even hearing you say that why wouldn\u2019t we do that with 2000 people?\u00a0 Have people stand up and yell come up to the stage whatever.\u00a0 Pray for them.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 But you think about that 2000 people if you have a sampling of your community that\u2019s 300 people.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 That\u2019s 300 people standing up needing prayer.\u00a0 But it seems to me it\u2019s rally time for those who have a job.\u00a0 Who can help and may need to give sacrificially and in fact I think it\u2019s what the Christian community ought to be facilitating.\u00a0 That connectivity that prayer for that person.\u00a0 The help as your church is providing.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 And like we said before it\u2019s don\u2019t go to church be the church.\u00a0 It\u2019s one of our mantras.\u00a0 Be the church.\u00a0 What would be the church look like in an economic crises.\u00a0 We would be putting our arms around people and doing what you said.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 The spiritual dimension in all of this.\u00a0 To be able to go to someone and pray for them to remind them of what is true.\u00a0 God is your provider.\u00a0 Again you can say all of that but even as I\u2019m saying all of that there\u2019s this little thing in the back of my mind going that sounds hollow to the guy who is going I know God is my provider but GM used to mail the check and God\u2019s not mailing checks today at least as far as I know.\u00a0 There\u2019s part of me that thinks that even reminding people of what\u2019s true spiritually does that really buoy their faith or does it cause them to go how come I\u2019m not seeing it happen then.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 I think they need to hear truth like you just said from the word of God.\u00a0 So even on a weekend we\u2019ve done a series.\u00a0 We\u2019ve done a series called uncertain times where we were trying to communicate truth.\u00a0 They have to be reminded.\u00a0 I have to be reminded who is God and where is God?\u00a0 He\u2019s still sovereign.\u00a0 He\u2019s still in control.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI can look at a ticker tape every day or I can look at God\u2019s ticker tape and it says the same thing it said before this economic crisis.\u00a0 He is the rock.\u00a0 He has not moved.\u00a0 Where is he?\u00a0 He\u2019s on the throne.\u00a0 Where is he?\u00a0 He\u2019s with me.\u00a0 But it\u2019s like you said.\u00a0 It is empty.\u00a0 It reminds me of the Keith Green line.\u00a0 You guys remember this one, God bless you be at peace and all of heaven just weeps. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 It\u2019s that line where you can say one thing but if you don\u2019t stick your hand out and help someone or if you don\u2019t invite someone into your home or walk beside them on a lonely road it\u2019s just empty words.\u00a0 So truth with a body with a personal presence of Christ made known through the person of Christ is both needed.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 So you\u2019re seeing people opening their homes\u2026\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 And other folks just moving in with them.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 I\u2019ll tell you what.\u00a0 We\u2019ve talked about it on our own staff.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Really.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 In some ways it\u2019s tongue in cheek but I don\u2019t\u2019 think it\u2019s as tongue in cheek now as it was six or eight months ago as we started talking about layoffs in our own staff and pay cuts we\u2019ve already taken.\u00a0 Looking at our budget and our finances as a church that has people losing their jobs who can\u2019t give or who are struggling to give.\u00a0 We have literally looked at each other and said maybe you\u2019re moving into my basement maybe I\u2019m moving into yours.\u00a0 We\u2019re not going to stop the mission but maybe it\u2019s going to be done differently because we don\u2019t\u2019 have the resources to do it the way we\u2019ve done it.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 When you think about that I mean thinking about the possibility that budget cuts or even job loss might put you in a position to where you\u2019d have to put the house up for sale and I\u2019m guessing there\u2019s a lot of houses up for sale.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 Nobody is buying.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u00a0<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 You\u2019re trying to figure out how to pay the mortgage.\u00a0 Moving in with somebody down the street in their basement you and Ann.\u00a0 I mean if you actually thought that that might be a possibility in a couple of months wouldn\u2019t there be part of you going\u2026no I need to look for another job somewhere else in another part of the country.\u00a0 I have to find another way to fix it other than that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 And every person I\u2019ve talked to has done just that.\u00a0\u00a0 They are leaving the state of Michigan.\u00a0 It\u2019s not a lot better out there but it is better than where they are right now.\u00a0\u00a0 I\u2019ve laid in bed many times in the last several months with my eyes wide open looking at the ceiling feeling the sweat\u2026I\u2019m a person who stands up there on weekends and say trust God and here I am struggling myself to trust God.\u00a0 I haven\u2019t lost my job and I\u2019ve only taken a 5 percent pay cut at this point.\u00a0\u00a0 It may be 10 percent by next week but God is still faithful and still providing and yet I\u2019m scared.\u00a0 I can feel it in my soul.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 But what do you think about God to that very point?\u00a0 I mean honestly I think there needs to be that kind of transparency.\u00a0 What do you think about God in those moments of doubt, fear, anxiety, and worry?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 Let\u2019s say it\u2019s a 30 minute anxiety attack.\u00a0 The first 20 -25 minutes is fear thinking what am I going to do?\u00a0 Where should I go?\u00a0 Should I start looking at other opportunities?\u00a0 What am I good at?\u00a0 What can I do?\u00a0 Where\u2019s the possibility of some extra income?\u00a0 Can I take some speaking you know whatever.\u00a0 That\u2019s probably 20-25 minutes of a 30 minute fear.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Trying to fix it yourself.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 Oh, yes.\u00a0 Literally laying there looking over at Ann thinking is she awake?\u00a0 I don\u2019t even want to share this I\u2019m just going to stay alone in my own man world and I\u2019m just going to struggle and maybe not sleep.\u00a0 There have been times where I didn\u2019t sleep the whole night.\u00a0 The last five minutes\u2026\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0\u00a0 Now wait a minute.\u00a0 Before you get to the last five minutes I want the ladies to understand this is the way a man thinks.\u00a0 He wants to figure out how to solve the problem.\u00a0 And these problems today they are not easily solved.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 No.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 It\u2019s not a matter of dialing up a number or calling a friend.\u00a0 In some cases like General Motors the problem is even bigger than the federal government is going to solve.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 Exactly.\u00a0 There is no solution on the horizon.\u00a0 That\u2019s the scariest part of it.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 So take us to the five minutes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 The five minutes.\u00a0\u00a0 I wish I could say it was five minutes of fear and 25 minutes of comfort but the last five minutes is God has always been faithful.\u00a0 I\u2019m sure a lot of people can do this but I know for Dave Wilson I can literally go back through my life year after year, month after month and see God faithfulness.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt\u2019s laughable that I\u2019m laying there in fear and stress when you look at my life and the way he\u2019s provided.\u00a0 From financial to a job the whole thing.\u00a0 It\u2019s laughable that I could have any fear because he has absolutely been so\u2026he has blessed us beyond measure and yet I\u2019m still scared.\u00a0 But the last five minutes it\u2019s like okay God what\u2019s true?\u00a0 Who are you?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI\u2019ve seen it.\u00a0 I know it.\u00a0 I can recite the verses that say who you are and your track record says you did it in the past.\u00a0 I don\u2019t know how you are going to do it.\u00a0 I don\u2019t know what the future looks like but I know this.\u00a0 You are immovable.\u00a0 You are solid.\u00a0 You care for me.\u00a0 You will provide.\u00a0 I don\u2019t know what it looks like.\u00a0 I can\u2019t figure that out and I don\u2019t think God wants me to but I can rest and close my eyes and go to sleep with a sense of peace knowing that God\u2019s in control.\u00a0 He always has been and he will be tomorrow.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Psalm 31:14 says But I trust in you oh Lord.\u00a0 I say you are my God.\u00a0 My times are in your hand. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Now wait that\u2019s Psalm \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Psalm 31:14\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 So have there been a bunch of anxiety verses before you get to 31:14?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Oh, there are tons in there.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 That\u2019s what I\u2019m thinking.\u00a0 What you\u2019ve just described is the pattern that\u2019s all the way through the Psalms.\u00a0 I went right to Psalm 13 where David writes, how long oh Lord.\u00a0 Will you forget me forever?\u00a0 How long will you hide your face from me?\u00a0 How long must I take counsel\u00a0 in my soul and have sorrow in my heart all day?\u00a0 How long shall my enemy be exalted over me?\u00a0 Consider and answer me oh Lord my God.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI mean you keep reading and then finally you read.\u00a0 But I have trusted in your steadfast love.\u00a0 My heart shall rejoice in your salvation I will sing to the Lord because he has dealt bountiful with me.\u00a0 So there is this great out crying of how long is this going to go on but then the last five minutes I need to remember what\u2019s true about God.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes.\u00a0 So I\u2019m in good company.\u00a0\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes, you and David.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 You really are and yet it is the process we go through and the idea of rehearsing God\u2019s goodness.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 I wish I could say every time that my five minutes of faith causes the 25 minutes of fear to flee but sometimes it doesn\u2019t.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 I\u2019m impressed that your moments of fear and faith only last 30 minutes.\u00a0 Some of mine have lasted a bit longer than that.\u00a0 You know what I mean.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, I\u2019m just a lion\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t(laughter)\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 That\u2019s what pastors do, right?\u00a0 Honestly there have been nights I couldn\u2019t sleep.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNot just this last year but many times in my life in some ways for Dave Wilson it\u2019s a stronghold.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 You\u2019re worried that you\u2019re going to have enough to pay the next bill.\u00a0 Is that what it is?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 The next bill.\u00a0 The mortgage.\u00a0 The future.\u00a0 The 401k\u2026will I ever retire?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Yes, but this is in the face of having a savings account.\u00a0 You have a savings account I\u2019m sure. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes, but my fear is that my trust is in a number and an account not in God.\u00a0 If that number gets lower even $15 or $1000\u2026there I am.\u00a0 There\u2019s a savings account some people don\u2019t even have that.\u00a0 Being honest that I\u2019m trusting that what if that savings was gone and in this economy it could be in a year.\u00a0 Is God no longer faithful.\u00a0 He\u2019s still faithful but it\u2019s a stronghold.\u00a0 It\u2019s a struggle.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0\u00a0 So could you be content in somebody\u2019s basement?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>I don\u2019t know.\u00a0\u00a0 I hope so.\u00a0 I hope they are in my basement.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 I think you answered the question.\u00a0 Right now it doesn\u2019t feel comfortable.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>No.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 But if it\u2019s the assignment then you choke down the shame.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>And God gives the grace.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>And he gives the contentment.\u00a0 And I think just in terms of the church coming around people who lost jobs who may be enveloped in fear.\u00a0\u00a0 I think it\u2019s very important for us to understand the nature of shame.\u00a0 It causes people to flee and implode and not want to hold their hand up on a Sunday morning to say I lost my job I need prayer.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIf we do that I think we have to couch our words encouraging people to come public with the need to say you know this is a safe place.\u00a0 If there is any place on the planet in this moment right now of any day of the week there shouldn\u2019t be a safer place anywhere else.\u00a0 Think about it.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Exactly.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 The Christian community or the community of faith who follow Jesus Christ they ought to be people who welcome those who have fallen and been hurt and been wounded in battle.\u00a0 And say, come on let me pray with you.\u00a0 Let me help you.\u00a0 Let me give you my basement and at that moment to your point which I thought was really excellent Dave.\u00a0 At that moment we do express the love of Jesus Christ.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 In action.\u00a0 Don\u2019t go to church.\u00a0 Be the church.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 And at the same time I think this is an opportunity we have to not only reach out with compassion but to start to be ready for the days ahead.\u00a0 It\u2019s what you did with your church taking people through Dave Ramsey\u2019s Financial Peace material.\u00a0 Start to get smarter about how we interact with money.\u00a0 Start to think more biblically about our stewarding responsibilities with our finances.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tFor years we have recommended that families get a copy of Larry Burkett\u2019s <em>Family Financial Workbook.<\/em>\u00a0 It\u2019s designed to be a very practical tool that helps families keep from being in financial bondage and helps get them better prepared for some of the challenges we are facing right now.\u00a0 And you know there are folks who have been wise stewards who are still experiencing challenges.\u00a0 I\u2019m not trying to say that everybody who is going through a hard time has somehow not followed good sound biblical principles but part of the reason we\u2019re in the mess we\u2019re in as a country is because we as a country haven\u2019t followed good sound biblical principles.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe\u2019ve been spending more than we make.\u00a0 We\u2019ve been too caught up in materialism.\u00a0 The kinds of things that get addressed in the <em>Family Financial Workbook<\/em> and I mention that because if folks are interested in getting a copy of that you can go to our web site FamilyLifeToday.com.\u00a0 The information you need about the <em>Family Financial Workbook<\/em> is available there.\u00a0 He\u2019s got all kinds of worksheets that you can follow that help you structure and maintain a family budget.\u00a0 It\u2019s a very practical tool that you can return to year in and year out.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAgain you\u2019ll find more information about the <em>Family Financial Workbook<\/em> on our web site FamilyLifeToday.com or you can call 1 800 FLTODAY and order it over the phone. That\u2019s 1 800 \u201cF\u201das in family \u201cL\u201d as in life and then the word TODAY.\u00a0 That\u2019s 1 800 358-6329.\u00a0 When you do get in touch with us we\u2019ll make arrangements to have one of these workbooks sent to you.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou know Dennis earlier you mentioned a number of passages that deal with how we counsel our own heart and soul in the midst of any adversity.\u00a0 It made me think about a message that you shared with our staff not long ago based on Psalm 34 several months ago.\u00a0 It is called <em>Trials and Tribulations Finding Encouragement Hope and Help in Psalm 34.<\/em>\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe\u2019re making CDs of that message available to listeners this month who can help support the ministry of FamilyLife Today with a donation of any amount.\u00a0 We are listener supported and we do appreciate those of you who have been generous in providing financial support for this ministry during these difficult economic times.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThis month if you can make a $5, $10, $20 donation whatever you can do to support the ministry of FamilyLife Today we want you to feel free to request a copy of this CD\u2014A message from Dennis from Psalm 34.\u00a0 If you\u2019re making your donation online at FamilyLifeToday.com just type the word \u201ctrials\u201d in the key code box that you find on the donation form so that we\u2019ll know to send you a copy of this CD or call toll-free 1 800 FLTODAY.\u00a0 That\u2019s 1 800 358-6329.\u00a0 Make your donation over the phone and just ask for a copy of the message on trials by Dennis or the message from Psalm 34.\u00a0 We\u2019re happy to send it out to you and we so much appreciate your financial faithfulness and your support of this ministry.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNow tomorrow we\u2019re going to talk more with Pastor Dave Wilson from Detroit about how we counsel our own hearts and souls in the midst of economic adversity.\u00a0 That\u2019s coming up tomorrow.\u00a0 I hope you can be back with us.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to thank our engineer today Keith Lynch and our entire broadcast production team on behalf of our host Dennis Rainey I\u2019m Bob Lepine.\u00a0 We will see you tomorrow for another edition of FamilyLife Today.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tFamilyLife Today is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock Arkansas.\u00a0 Help for today.\u00a0 Hope for tomorrow.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts for you. However, there is a cost to transcribe, create, and produce them for our website. If you've benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright \u00a9 FamilyLife. All rights reserved.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>www.FamilyLife.com<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>"],"_seopress_titles_title":[""],"_seopress_titles_desc":[""],"_seopress_robots_index":[""],"duration":["00:"],"show_notes":[""],"_thumbnail_id":["294104"],"filesize":["12.18M"],"filesize_raw":["12774336"],"_uag_css_file_name":["uag-css-301842.css"],"_uag_js_file_name":["uag-js-301842.js"],"_uag_page_assets":["a:9:{s:3:\"css\";s:82560:\".wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape-top svg{width: calc( 100% + 1.3px );}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape.uagb-container__shape-top .uagb-container__shape-fill{fill: rgba(51,51,51,1);}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape-bottom svg{width: calc( 100% + 1.3px );}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape.uagb-container__shape-bottom .uagb-container__shape-fill{fill: rgba(51,51,51,1);}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f 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do you turn when life gets tough?","meta_box":{"show_notes":"","transcript_url":"https:\/\/transcript.familylifetoday.com\/fl2009-06-22.pdf","transcript_content":"<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u00a0That\u2019s right and when they are brought onto the team\u2026\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 It\u2019s called hazing.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 They have to do an introductory skit.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 And you know what my year was the first year you ever did this.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t(laughter)\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 You\u2019re still bitter.\u00a0\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes, I am bitter but I still think it was the best skit ever done.\u00a0 When I saw your face when I was standing up there I thought I was fired.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 It was a great skit.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, who knows.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 I mean you pushed the boundaries out to the edge.\u00a0 I was a little tight.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes, you were.\u00a0\u00a0 Probably still are.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t(laughter)\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Here comes Dave and Ann you were both dressed in like teenie bopper outfits or something.\u00a0 I forget and you did this dance where you threw her over your head and around your back.\u00a0 I mean it was \u2026what\u2019s the new dance show that\u2019s on tv now?...\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Dancing with the stars.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0\u00a0 He was the original.\u00a0 Dave Wilson was the original.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t(laughter)\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson: <\/strong>\u00a0I learned that night that Dennis Rainey hates rap.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t(laughter)\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>This was the 1988 or 1989 and we decided to put our life story in a rap.\u00a0 We\u2019re from the motor city.\u00a0 We\u2019re from Mo Town. Come on you got to rap.\u00a0 So that\u2019s what we did and as I got in the rap with the one glove Michael Jackson look oh, Dennis, you were sitting there.\u00a0\u00a0 You\u2019re jaw was on the floor.\u00a0 I\u2019m like okay we\u2019re fired.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 I was dying in laughter absolutely.\u00a0 Well as God would have it he would guide this rapper ultimately into becoming a pastor.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 That\u2019s right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 And this has amazed many I know in the Detroit area.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t(laughter)\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 But Dave went on to be the teaching pastor of the Kenningston Community Church which is now a church of 11,000 rappers\u2026\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t(laughter)\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 Very few rappers in this church.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 You have three sons and Dave is also the chaplain of the Detroit Lions and has been for over 20 years.\u00a0 Dave, Bob and I just wanted to talk with you about what\u2019s happening in the Detroit area because unemployment there has gone way past 15 percent.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0\u00a0 Yes, I would imagine that pretty much every week you\u2019re hearing about somebody in your congregation\u2026\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Oh, definitely.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 And you get the phone call and it\u2019s guess what so and so just got laid off.\u00a0 What do you do?\u00a0 How do you respond to that not just as a pastor but as a friend?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 You\u2019re right.\u00a0 Probably about a year ago that started happening weekly almost daily.\u00a0 Even as I flew down here yesterday there were 1600 layoffs at GM.\u00a0 I\u2019m guessing 50 maybe 100 people in our congregation are a part of that.\u00a0 Some of our staff wives there husbands\u2019 work there.\u00a0 Yesterday I was in a meeting and she literally sat in our meeting looking at her cell phone the entire morning waiting for the call.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt\u2019s a scary time.\u00a0 I think one of the biggest things and you guys know this is community.\u00a0 Community is huge in that moment.\u00a0 If you\u2019re not connected in a smaller group some kind of family group you are all alone.\u00a0 Having people to rub shoulders with and lock arms with maybe those that have jobs maybe those going through the same thing is key to sustaining through that scary time.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Having that community is important for emotional support and prayer support but again I\u2019m just thinking if somebody called and said I just lost my job for me to say we\u2019ll be praying for you feels a little like that passage in James 2 where somebody comes and says here\u2019s my deal and you say be warm and filled.\u00a0 Not to minimize the importance of prayer in that moment.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right.\u00a0 Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 I do think we need to be praying for one another and engage in that but is there more that we ought to be doing for those who have lost their jobs?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes.\u00a0 What is the first response that a believer ought to have to someone who has lost their job?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 I think it\u2019s a great opportunity as scary as it is for the church to be the church.\u00a0 For the community of Christ to be the community of Christ which means be there.\u00a0 Be present.\u00a0 It may mean move in my basement and that\u2019s happened.\u00a0\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tA good buddy of mine in my small group has had several different people go through his basement.\u00a0 It\u2019s not a slab basement but a finished basement with a bedroom and a bathroom down there.\u00a0 He puts them down there.\u00a0 He feeds them.\u00a0 He takes care of them as they try to get back on their feet.\u00a0 This is sometimes a couple and sometimes a family with three or four kids.\u00a0 I think that\u2019s the biggest response.\u00a0 Obviously like Bob said pray.\u00a0 You have to pray.\u00a0 You can pray with them.\u00a0 Lay your hands on them.\u00a0 And you may have the whole community pray.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut bigger than that is the presence of Jesus in a human being.\u00a0 Flesh to flesh\u2026Be there.\u00a0 Welcome them in your house.\u00a0 We\u2019ve bought meals for them or taken meals over to their house.\u00a0 We\u2019ve shown up with grocery bags.\u00a0 I mean that\u2019s happening all over our community.\u00a0 And again I think it\u2019s an opportunity for the church to be the church.\u00a0 I think the non church world looks out there and they expect that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou know.\u00a0 Is the church going to show up and for their own?\u00a0 And even for those who are not a part of their church?\u00a0 I think it\u2019s a great opportunity as scary as it is.\u00a0 I don\u2019t want it.\u00a0 None of us want it.\u00a0 We hate it.\u00a0 But yet it\u2019s an opportunity for the church to show up and be the church.\u00a0 And you know this isn\u2019t the first time this has happened.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tFirst century church that\u2019s what the church was.\u00a0 A community of people sharing goods and their possessions.\u00a0 And it\u2019s a chance for us as the community of Christ to be Acts 2.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Is there a place in the local church now I know you have a huge congregation you have how many services on a Sunday?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 We do campusing so we do 14 or 15 services counting the five different campuses.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 So you have audiences from a few hundred to several thousand meeting together.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Is there ever a time when you call for the community of believers just to say if some of you here have lost a job hold your hand up if you need a job and you need prayer and you\u2019d like for someone to contact you about helping put together a resume and a game plan for where you go as a man as a woman as a family.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Does that happen in your church?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Yes, it happens not so much on the weekend service but we provide opportunities outside a weekend service.\u00a0 Come to a seminar.\u00a0 We\u2019ve had business people come in and help people with resumes.\u00a0 Help them network.\u00a0 We can do it on a weekend service.\u00a0 We literally are sitting with about 2000 people in each service so it\u2019s hard to do.\u00a0 So we try to do it in a smaller setting but you\u2019re exactly right.\u00a0 And even hearing you say that why wouldn\u2019t we do that with 2000 people?\u00a0 Have people stand up and yell come up to the stage whatever.\u00a0 Pray for them.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 But you think about that 2000 people if you have a sampling of your community that\u2019s 300 people.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 That\u2019s 300 people standing up needing prayer.\u00a0 But it seems to me it\u2019s rally time for those who have a job.\u00a0 Who can help and may need to give sacrificially and in fact I think it\u2019s what the Christian community ought to be facilitating.\u00a0 That connectivity that prayer for that person.\u00a0 The help as your church is providing.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 And like we said before it\u2019s don\u2019t go to church be the church.\u00a0 It\u2019s one of our mantras.\u00a0 Be the church.\u00a0 What would be the church look like in an economic crises.\u00a0 We would be putting our arms around people and doing what you said.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 The spiritual dimension in all of this.\u00a0 To be able to go to someone and pray for them to remind them of what is true.\u00a0 God is your provider.\u00a0 Again you can say all of that but even as I\u2019m saying all of that there\u2019s this little thing in the back of my mind going that sounds hollow to the guy who is going I know God is my provider but GM used to mail the check and God\u2019s not mailing checks today at least as far as I know.\u00a0 There\u2019s part of me that thinks that even reminding people of what\u2019s true spiritually does that really buoy their faith or does it cause them to go how come I\u2019m not seeing it happen then.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 I think they need to hear truth like you just said from the word of God.\u00a0 So even on a weekend we\u2019ve done a series.\u00a0 We\u2019ve done a series called uncertain times where we were trying to communicate truth.\u00a0 They have to be reminded.\u00a0 I have to be reminded who is God and where is God?\u00a0 He\u2019s still sovereign.\u00a0 He\u2019s still in control.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI can look at a ticker tape every day or I can look at God\u2019s ticker tape and it says the same thing it said before this economic crisis.\u00a0 He is the rock.\u00a0 He has not moved.\u00a0 Where is he?\u00a0 He\u2019s on the throne.\u00a0 Where is he?\u00a0 He\u2019s with me.\u00a0 But it\u2019s like you said.\u00a0 It is empty.\u00a0 It reminds me of the Keith Green line.\u00a0 You guys remember this one, God bless you be at peace and all of heaven just weeps. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 It\u2019s that line where you can say one thing but if you don\u2019t stick your hand out and help someone or if you don\u2019t invite someone into your home or walk beside them on a lonely road it\u2019s just empty words.\u00a0 So truth with a body with a personal presence of Christ made known through the person of Christ is both needed.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 So you\u2019re seeing people opening their homes\u2026\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 And other folks just moving in with them.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 I\u2019ll tell you what.\u00a0 We\u2019ve talked about it on our own staff.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Really.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 In some ways it\u2019s tongue in cheek but I don\u2019t\u2019 think it\u2019s as tongue in cheek now as it was six or eight months ago as we started talking about layoffs in our own staff and pay cuts we\u2019ve already taken.\u00a0 Looking at our budget and our finances as a church that has people losing their jobs who can\u2019t give or who are struggling to give.\u00a0 We have literally looked at each other and said maybe you\u2019re moving into my basement maybe I\u2019m moving into yours.\u00a0 We\u2019re not going to stop the mission but maybe it\u2019s going to be done differently because we don\u2019t\u2019 have the resources to do it the way we\u2019ve done it.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 When you think about that I mean thinking about the possibility that budget cuts or even job loss might put you in a position to where you\u2019d have to put the house up for sale and I\u2019m guessing there\u2019s a lot of houses up for sale.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 Nobody is buying.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u00a0<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 You\u2019re trying to figure out how to pay the mortgage.\u00a0 Moving in with somebody down the street in their basement you and Ann.\u00a0 I mean if you actually thought that that might be a possibility in a couple of months wouldn\u2019t there be part of you going\u2026no I need to look for another job somewhere else in another part of the country.\u00a0 I have to find another way to fix it other than that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 And every person I\u2019ve talked to has done just that.\u00a0\u00a0 They are leaving the state of Michigan.\u00a0 It\u2019s not a lot better out there but it is better than where they are right now.\u00a0\u00a0 I\u2019ve laid in bed many times in the last several months with my eyes wide open looking at the ceiling feeling the sweat\u2026I\u2019m a person who stands up there on weekends and say trust God and here I am struggling myself to trust God.\u00a0 I haven\u2019t lost my job and I\u2019ve only taken a 5 percent pay cut at this point.\u00a0\u00a0 It may be 10 percent by next week but God is still faithful and still providing and yet I\u2019m scared.\u00a0 I can feel it in my soul.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 But what do you think about God to that very point?\u00a0 I mean honestly I think there needs to be that kind of transparency.\u00a0 What do you think about God in those moments of doubt, fear, anxiety, and worry?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 Let\u2019s say it\u2019s a 30 minute anxiety attack.\u00a0 The first 20 -25 minutes is fear thinking what am I going to do?\u00a0 Where should I go?\u00a0 Should I start looking at other opportunities?\u00a0 What am I good at?\u00a0 What can I do?\u00a0 Where\u2019s the possibility of some extra income?\u00a0 Can I take some speaking you know whatever.\u00a0 That\u2019s probably 20-25 minutes of a 30 minute fear.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Trying to fix it yourself.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 Oh, yes.\u00a0 Literally laying there looking over at Ann thinking is she awake?\u00a0 I don\u2019t even want to share this I\u2019m just going to stay alone in my own man world and I\u2019m just going to struggle and maybe not sleep.\u00a0 There have been times where I didn\u2019t sleep the whole night.\u00a0 The last five minutes\u2026\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0\u00a0 Now wait a minute.\u00a0 Before you get to the last five minutes I want the ladies to understand this is the way a man thinks.\u00a0 He wants to figure out how to solve the problem.\u00a0 And these problems today they are not easily solved.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 No.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 It\u2019s not a matter of dialing up a number or calling a friend.\u00a0 In some cases like General Motors the problem is even bigger than the federal government is going to solve.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 Exactly.\u00a0 There is no solution on the horizon.\u00a0 That\u2019s the scariest part of it.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 So take us to the five minutes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 The five minutes.\u00a0\u00a0 I wish I could say it was five minutes of fear and 25 minutes of comfort but the last five minutes is God has always been faithful.\u00a0 I\u2019m sure a lot of people can do this but I know for Dave Wilson I can literally go back through my life year after year, month after month and see God faithfulness.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt\u2019s laughable that I\u2019m laying there in fear and stress when you look at my life and the way he\u2019s provided.\u00a0 From financial to a job the whole thing.\u00a0 It\u2019s laughable that I could have any fear because he has absolutely been so\u2026he has blessed us beyond measure and yet I\u2019m still scared.\u00a0 But the last five minutes it\u2019s like okay God what\u2019s true?\u00a0 Who are you?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI\u2019ve seen it.\u00a0 I know it.\u00a0 I can recite the verses that say who you are and your track record says you did it in the past.\u00a0 I don\u2019t know how you are going to do it.\u00a0 I don\u2019t know what the future looks like but I know this.\u00a0 You are immovable.\u00a0 You are solid.\u00a0 You care for me.\u00a0 You will provide.\u00a0 I don\u2019t know what it looks like.\u00a0 I can\u2019t figure that out and I don\u2019t think God wants me to but I can rest and close my eyes and go to sleep with a sense of peace knowing that God\u2019s in control.\u00a0 He always has been and he will be tomorrow.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Psalm 31:14 says But I trust in you oh Lord.\u00a0 I say you are my God.\u00a0 My times are in your hand. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Now wait that\u2019s Psalm \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Psalm 31:14\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 So have there been a bunch of anxiety verses before you get to 31:14?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 Oh, there are tons in there.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 That\u2019s what I\u2019m thinking.\u00a0 What you\u2019ve just described is the pattern that\u2019s all the way through the Psalms.\u00a0 I went right to Psalm 13 where David writes, how long oh Lord.\u00a0 Will you forget me forever?\u00a0 How long will you hide your face from me?\u00a0 How long must I take counsel\u00a0 in my soul and have sorrow in my heart all day?\u00a0 How long shall my enemy be exalted over me?\u00a0 Consider and answer me oh Lord my God.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI mean you keep reading and then finally you read.\u00a0 But I have trusted in your steadfast love.\u00a0 My heart shall rejoice in your salvation I will sing to the Lord because he has dealt bountiful with me.\u00a0 So there is this great out crying of how long is this going to go on but then the last five minutes I need to remember what\u2019s true about God.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes.\u00a0 So I\u2019m in good company.\u00a0\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes, you and David.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 You really are and yet it is the process we go through and the idea of rehearsing God\u2019s goodness.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 I wish I could say every time that my five minutes of faith causes the 25 minutes of fear to flee but sometimes it doesn\u2019t.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 I\u2019m impressed that your moments of fear and faith only last 30 minutes.\u00a0 Some of mine have lasted a bit longer than that.\u00a0 You know what I mean.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, I\u2019m just a lion\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t(laughter)\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 That\u2019s what pastors do, right?\u00a0 Honestly there have been nights I couldn\u2019t sleep.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNot just this last year but many times in my life in some ways for Dave Wilson it\u2019s a stronghold.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 You\u2019re worried that you\u2019re going to have enough to pay the next bill.\u00a0 Is that what it is?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 The next bill.\u00a0 The mortgage.\u00a0 The future.\u00a0 The 401k\u2026will I ever retire?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Yes, but this is in the face of having a savings account.\u00a0 You have a savings account I\u2019m sure. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes, but my fear is that my trust is in a number and an account not in God.\u00a0 If that number gets lower even $15 or $1000\u2026there I am.\u00a0 There\u2019s a savings account some people don\u2019t even have that.\u00a0 Being honest that I\u2019m trusting that what if that savings was gone and in this economy it could be in a year.\u00a0 Is God no longer faithful.\u00a0 He\u2019s still faithful but it\u2019s a stronghold.\u00a0 It\u2019s a struggle.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0\u00a0 So could you be content in somebody\u2019s basement?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>I don\u2019t know.\u00a0\u00a0 I hope so.\u00a0 I hope they are in my basement.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 I think you answered the question.\u00a0 Right now it doesn\u2019t feel comfortable.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>No.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 But if it\u2019s the assignment then you choke down the shame.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>And God gives the grace.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>And he gives the contentment.\u00a0 And I think just in terms of the church coming around people who lost jobs who may be enveloped in fear.\u00a0\u00a0 I think it\u2019s very important for us to understand the nature of shame.\u00a0 It causes people to flee and implode and not want to hold their hand up on a Sunday morning to say I lost my job I need prayer.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIf we do that I think we have to couch our words encouraging people to come public with the need to say you know this is a safe place.\u00a0 If there is any place on the planet in this moment right now of any day of the week there shouldn\u2019t be a safer place anywhere else.\u00a0 Think about it.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong><strong>\u00a0 <\/strong>Exactly.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong>\u00a0 The Christian community or the community of faith who follow Jesus Christ they ought to be people who welcome those who have fallen and been hurt and been wounded in battle.\u00a0 And say, come on let me pray with you.\u00a0 Let me help you.\u00a0 Let me give you my basement and at that moment to your point which I thought was really excellent Dave.\u00a0 At that moment we do express the love of Jesus Christ.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dave Wilson:<\/strong>\u00a0 In action.\u00a0 Don\u2019t go to church.\u00a0 Be the church.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong>\u00a0 And at the same time I think this is an opportunity we have to not only reach out with compassion but to start to be ready for the days ahead.\u00a0 It\u2019s what you did with your church taking people through Dave Ramsey\u2019s Financial Peace material.\u00a0 Start to get smarter about how we interact with money.\u00a0 Start to think more biblically about our stewarding responsibilities with our finances.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tFor years we have recommended that families get a copy of Larry Burkett\u2019s <em>Family Financial Workbook.<\/em>\u00a0 It\u2019s designed to be a very practical tool that helps families keep from being in financial bondage and helps get them better prepared for some of the challenges we are facing right now.\u00a0 And you know there are folks who have been wise stewards who are still experiencing challenges.\u00a0 I\u2019m not trying to say that everybody who is going through a hard time has somehow not followed good sound biblical principles but part of the reason we\u2019re in the mess we\u2019re in as a country is because we as a country haven\u2019t followed good sound biblical principles.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe\u2019ve been spending more than we make.\u00a0 We\u2019ve been too caught up in materialism.\u00a0 The kinds of things that get addressed in the <em>Family Financial Workbook<\/em> and I mention that because if folks are interested in getting a copy of that you can go to our web site FamilyLifeToday.com.\u00a0 The information you need about the <em>Family Financial Workbook<\/em> is available there.\u00a0 He\u2019s got all kinds of worksheets that you can follow that help you structure and maintain a family budget.\u00a0 It\u2019s a very practical tool that you can return to year in and year out.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAgain you\u2019ll find more information about the <em>Family Financial Workbook<\/em> on our web site FamilyLifeToday.com or you can call 1 800 FLTODAY and order it over the phone. That\u2019s 1 800 \u201cF\u201das in family \u201cL\u201d as in life and then the word TODAY.\u00a0 That\u2019s 1 800 358-6329.\u00a0 When you do get in touch with us we\u2019ll make arrangements to have one of these workbooks sent to you.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou know Dennis earlier you mentioned a number of passages that deal with how we counsel our own heart and soul in the midst of any adversity.\u00a0 It made me think about a message that you shared with our staff not long ago based on Psalm 34 several months ago.\u00a0 It is called <em>Trials and Tribulations Finding Encouragement Hope and Help in Psalm 34.<\/em>\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe\u2019re making CDs of that message available to listeners this month who can help support the ministry of FamilyLife Today with a donation of any amount.\u00a0 We are listener supported and we do appreciate those of you who have been generous in providing financial support for this ministry during these difficult economic times.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThis month if you can make a $5, $10, $20 donation whatever you can do to support the ministry of FamilyLife Today we want you to feel free to request a copy of this CD\u2014A message from Dennis from Psalm 34.\u00a0 If you\u2019re making your donation online at FamilyLifeToday.com just type the word \u201ctrials\u201d in the key code box that you find on the donation form so that we\u2019ll know to send you a copy of this CD or call toll-free 1 800 FLTODAY.\u00a0 That\u2019s 1 800 358-6329.\u00a0 Make your donation over the phone and just ask for a copy of the message on trials by Dennis or the message from Psalm 34.\u00a0 We\u2019re happy to send it out to you and we so much appreciate your financial faithfulness and your support of this ministry.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNow tomorrow we\u2019re going to talk more with Pastor Dave Wilson from Detroit about how we counsel our own hearts and souls in the midst of economic adversity.\u00a0 That\u2019s coming up tomorrow.\u00a0 I hope you can be back with us.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to thank our engineer today Keith Lynch and our entire broadcast production team on behalf of our host Dennis Rainey I\u2019m Bob Lepine.\u00a0 We will see you tomorrow for another edition of FamilyLife Today.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tFamilyLife Today is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock Arkansas.\u00a0 Help for today.\u00a0 Hope for tomorrow.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts for you. However, there is a cost to transcribe, create, and produce them for our website. If you've benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright \u00a9 FamilyLife. 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