{"id":301604,"date":"2008-06-12T11:00:00","date_gmt":"2008-06-12T15:00:00","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/%series%\/mentoring-the-next-generation\/"},"modified":"2008-06-12T11:00:00","modified_gmt":"2008-06-12T15:00:00","slug":"mentoring-the-next-generation","status":"publish","type":"podcast","link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/mentoring-the-next-generation\/","title":{"rendered":"Mentoring the Next Generation"},"content":{"rendered":"","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>\u201cEliminate the leader&#8211;the man from the home, and the family is up for grabs.\u201d<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":91,"featured_media":294104,"menu_order":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","template":"","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","inline_featured_image":false,"_uag_custom_page_level_css":"","episode_type":"","audio_file":"https:\/\/web.familylifetoday.com\/fl2008-06-12.mp3","cover_image":"","cover_image_id":"","duration":"00:","filesize":"10.5M","filesize_raw":"11012876","date_recorded":"","explicit":"","block":""},"categories":[2826],"tags":[4284,4868,4698],"podcast_series":[7588],"cwp_profile":[9129],"series":[2101],"class_list":["post-301604","podcast","type-podcast","status-publish","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-men","tag-father","tag-husband","tag-manhood","podcast_series-manhood-let-the-truth-be-told","cwp_profile-tom-and-toni-fortson","series-familylife-today"],"acf":[],"episode_featured_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/09\/FLT-Podcast-Cover-2-508x508-3.jpg?w=508","episode_player_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2023\/02\/image-scaled.jpg","download_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-download\/301604\/mentoring-the-next-generation","player_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-player\/301604\/mentoring-the-next-generation","audio_player":null,"episode_data":{"playerMode":"light","subscribeUrls":{"apple_podcasts":{"key":"apple_podcasts","url":"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303?mt=2&app=podcast","label":"Apple Podcasts","class":"apple_podcasts","icon":"apple-podcasts.png"},"google_podcasts":{"key":"google_podcasts","url":"","label":"Google Podcasts","class":"google_podcasts","icon":"google-podcasts.png"},"spotify":{"key":"spotify","url":"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm","label":"Spotify","class":"spotify","icon":"spotify.png"},"youtube":{"key":"youtube","url":"","label":"YouTube","class":"youtube","icon":"youtube.png"}},"rssFeedUrl":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/feed\/podcast\/familylife-today","embedCode":"<blockquote class=\"wp-embedded-content\" data-secret=\"Ut3Ku043e9\"><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/mentoring-the-next-generation\/\">Mentoring the Next Generation<\/a><\/blockquote><iframe sandbox=\"allow-scripts\" security=\"restricted\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/mentoring-the-next-generation\/embed\/#?secret=Ut3Ku043e9\" width=\"500\" height=\"350\" title=\"&#8220;Mentoring the Next Generation&#8221; &#8212; FamilyLife\u00ae - A Cru Ministry\" data-secret=\"Ut3Ku043e9\" frameborder=\"0\" marginwidth=\"0\" marginheight=\"0\" scrolling=\"no\" class=\"wp-embedded-content\"><\/iframe><script>\n\/*! This file is auto-generated *\/\n!function(d,l){\"use strict\";l.querySelector&&d.addEventListener&&\"undefined\"!=typeof URL&&(d.wp=d.wp||{},d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage||(d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage=function(e){var t=e.data;if((t||t.secret||t.message||t.value)&&!\/[^a-zA-Z0-9]\/.test(t.secret)){for(var s,r,n,a=l.querySelectorAll('iframe[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),o=l.querySelectorAll('blockquote[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),c=new RegExp(\"^https?:$\",\"i\"),i=0;i<o.length;i++)o[i].style.display=\"none\";for(i=0;i<a.length;i++)s=a[i],e.source===s.contentWindow&&(s.removeAttribute(\"style\"),\"height\"===t.message?(1e3<(r=parseInt(t.value,10))?r=1e3:~~r<200&&(r=200),s.height=r):\"link\"===t.message&&(r=new URL(s.getAttribute(\"src\")),n=new URL(t.value),c.test(n.protocol))&&n.host===r.host&&l.activeElement===s&&(d.top.location.href=t.value))}},d.addEventListener(\"message\",d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage,!1),l.addEventListener(\"DOMContentLoaded\",function(){for(var e,t,s=l.querySelectorAll(\"iframe.wp-embedded-content\"),r=0;r<s.length;r++)(t=(e=s[r]).getAttribute(\"data-secret\"))||(t=Math.random().toString(36).substring(2,12),e.src+=\"#?secret=\"+t,e.setAttribute(\"data-secret\",t)),e.contentWindow.postMessage({message:\"ready\",secret:t},\"*\")},!1)))}(window,document);\n\/\/# sourceURL=https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-includes\/js\/wp-embed.min.js\n<\/script>\n"},"spectra_custom_meta":{"_wp_page_template":["default"],"transcript_url":["https:\/\/transcript.familylifetoday.com\/fl2008-06-12.pdf"],"audio_file":["https:\/\/web.familylifetoday.com\/fl2008-06-12.mp3"],"transcript_content":["<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> If you wanted to destroy a culture, and you were putting together a game plan, where would you start first?\u00a0 Tom Fortson, who is the president of Promise Keepers, knows what he would do.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> Take out the leader.\u00a0 Take out the man.\u00a0 Eliminate him, and then the family is up for grabs.\u00a0 Mom is up for grabs, the children are up for grabs because the God-ordained leader has been removed.\u00a0 So if I were developing a battle plan to destroy the family, let me take out the husband, let me take out the father.\u00a0 Then I can pick off everybody else.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> This is FamilyLife Today for Thursday, June 12.\u00a0 Our host is the president of FamilyLife, Dennis Rainey, and I'm Bob Lepine.\u00a0 One way to take out a leader is to confuse him or have him be unsure of himself.\u00a0 We'll talk about how that's happening among men in our culture today.\u00a0 Stay tuned.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd welcome to FamilyLife Today, thanks for joining us.\u00a0 I've got a question for you and, I guess, for our guest as well today.\u00a0 Back 10 or 15 years ago, when the Promise Keepers movement was just getting started, we used to think there is a lot of confusion in the culture today among men about what it means to be a man.\u00a0 All right, now 15 years later, has that confusion been resolved?\u00a0 Do more guys understand what it means to be a man today than they did 15 years ago?\u00a0 Or do you think we still have a big problem in this area?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Well, I'm going to ask our guest on FamilyLife Today, Tom Fortson.\u00a0 Welcome back, Tom.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> Thank you, Dennis.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Glad to be here.\u00a0 Tom is the president of Promise Keepers.\u00a0 He and his wife, Toni, were speakers at our Weekend to Remember Marriage Conferences for a number of years, and he's a good friend.\u00a0 They've been married over 36 years; have three adult children and one grandchild, and Tom's been leading Promise Keepers for a number of years, and I'm going to let him take the first crack at this.\u00a0 I know what my opinion of this is, and I'll be surprised if it's not the same as Tom's.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Well, since Tom's just written a book called \"Manhood:\u00a0 Let the Truth Be Told,\" you should know the answer to this \u2013 do guys understand what it means to be a man today?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> Well, let me address the issue.\u00a0 I can't say that I have the answer.\u00a0 But I don't think so.\u00a0 One of the characteristics of men today is that they are confused over masculinity \u2013 what it means to be a man.\u00a0 Why is it that in some of our communities there are so many single parents?\u00a0 Where is the protection?\u00a0 Where is the commitment?\u00a0 We have a problem.\u00a0 It's ungodly.\u00a0 The consequences of what we see is men going their own way, doing their own thing, and the consequences are we have a redefinition of the family.\u00a0 There is confusion.\u00a0 God is not the author of confusion.\u00a0 So if God is not the author of confusion, then who is sending this confusion?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNow, we need to be loving, and we need to speak with grace, but I want to let the truth be told.\u00a0 It's a problem, Dennis, and it's spreading.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> And the thing is, Tom, is the hope for them recovering is the Christian community.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> And so they must understand that we will embrace them but with truth and with definition.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> So in spite of the fact that over the last 15 to 20 years, we've had more books on the subject, more conferences on the subject, more radio programs on the subject, we've been trying to send a message that says \"Here is what a man is, here is what a man looks like, here is what a man does.\"\u00a0 Somehow that message is not penetrating deeply into the culture.\u00a0 Is it because the culture is screaming back louder than we're shouting?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> I think you have a battle going on.\u00a0 I think that's a good pickup.\u00a0 There are kingdoms out here.\u00a0 If I can use a biblical term, there is the kingdom of darkness, and there is the kingdom of light.\u00a0 That's why Christ is the King of kings, and we proclaim Him as King.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut there is a battle going on here.\u00a0 There are demonic spirits out there, and I don't want to get \u2013 I want to use the right terms, but there is a battle, and it's almost like it's a standstill.\u00a0 As we intensify and bring clarity on what it means to be a man, don't think that there is going to be another force that counteracts that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSo it's almost like the game is being played on a front line, if you use a football illustration.\u00a0 The offensive and the defensive line, the game is being fought on the line of scrimmage.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> The volume has been turned up, there is no question about it.\u00a0 I mean, can you imagine seeing what we're seeing on television, hearing what's being taught in public education in high schools, colleges, universities across the country?\u00a0 Can you imagine that being taught 30 years ago?\u00a0 No, not at all, and so what you have is \u2013 if you had strong families, maybe you could counteract it, but the problem is the family has slowly been disintegrating along with all this where the family is not a proactive force.\u00a0 It's been neglectful and, at points, it's been abusive.\u00a0 There have been husbands and wives, moms and dads, who have had unhealthy relationships with their children that have added to the problem.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> So let me go back to the family \u2013 take out the leader.\u00a0 Take out the man.\u00a0 Eliminated him, and then the family is up for grabs because the God-ordained leader has been removed.\u00a0 So if I were developing a battle plan to destroy the family, let me take out the husband, let me take out the father.\u00a0 Then I can pick off everybody else.\u00a0 So I think we need to, in addition to Mom and Dad, we need to go after that man who does not know what it means to be a father, a husband, to be a provider, to be a protector.\u00a0 So he should not, as a young boy, as a young man who is obviously feeling out his oats, he needs to understand you don't get involved sexually with another young girl because you have violated her.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhen was the last time or who instructed him that's a violation of God's moral law?\u00a0 Well, a father should, a dad should do that, but we've already now begun to destroy that family that he is going to be a part of when he decides to say, \"I do\" when he gets married.\u00a0 Well, already he's entered into a relationship that's broken because of a pattern that he's developed prior to marriage.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> I think what you're saying is very important here.\u00a0 We can publish books, hold conferences, have radio programs, do weekend retreats for guys; we can sound this call, but if there is not a dad, a husband in place to model that, to instruct it, this is not the kind of thing that you can teach once and then a guy goes, \"Oh, manhood, okay, got it.\"\u00a0 It's the kind of thing that has to be learned repetitively, you've got to see it modeled, you've got to kind of imbibe it on a regular basis before it makes any sense, and the condition of the culture is not a healthy condition for the development of healthy manhood in the next generation.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Tom, you talk about in your book how men need to be modeling, as Bob was saying, but they also need to be mentoring and molding.\u00a0 What exactly do you mean by that as it's applied to this area of being the spiritual leader of your family?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> Well, for an example, my children had to see Toni and I in conflict.\u00a0 They had to see us resolve \u2026\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> They had to see that?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> Well, that's a good point.\u00a0 They did see it.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t[laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> They got the opportunity.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> They did see it. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> I know Toni, and she's no pushover.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> No.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> I've got a feeling that this came as a natural ebb and flow, and it's not that it would be all her fault, by the way.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> No, no.\u00a0 And so where is that modeled?\u00a0 How do you resolve conflict?\u00a0 Well, they have to see it.\u00a0 Or my son or daughter will enter into a relationship, well, they'll say, \"Well, this is not supposed to happen.\u00a0 Mom and dad didn't argue.\"\u00a0 Well, yes, they did, they had intense fellowship together, but they also saw Mom and Dad ask each other for forgiveness.\u00a0 It's modeling, and we knew we had to practice it.\u00a0 We knew that we didn't run from the kids when we had these discussions.\u00a0 We were aware that they were around.\u00a0 Maybe it was not as intense, you know, when they were around, but we knew they needed to see, \"How are we going to resolve this?\" Because they know Mom and Dad aren't getting along right now.\u00a0 So they need to hear, \"Honey, would you forgive me?\u00a0 I made a mistake.\"\u00a0 And were intentional about that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut what happens to a young man when he gets married?\u00a0 He is now a husband, and he does not know how to resolve conflict.\u00a0 He gets angry, he gets angry, and he slams his fist down.\u00a0 Well, that's because he's hurt.\u00a0 How does he resolve that issue and his wife doesn't know \"Well, why are you acting that way?\"\u00a0 She doesn't know that he's hurt, and he does not know how to say, \"Honey, would you forgive me?\u00a0 I've gone too far.\"\u00a0 He has not seen that modeled, and he goes into a relationship not understanding what it means to be a husband or a father, and he blows it.\u00a0 Why?\u00a0 Because where was his dad?\u00a0 He didn't have one.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Right.\u00a0 Now, you're the father of two daughters and a son, right?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> Correct.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> And so your kids had a chance to see you and Toni model healthy marriage, what biblical manhood looks like, but were you intentional with your son about doing some active mentoring?\u00a0 Did you take him out and have man-to-man talks with him?\u00a0 Did you take him to the Scriptures?\u00a0 How did you raise your son to be a man?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> You know, you can always look back and say, \"I wish I could have done it better.\"\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> \"I wish I'd done this,\" yeah?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> But he and I have had talks.\u00a0 We have walked together, talked together, we have run together.\u00a0 And many times he would say, \"Dad, well, you know, that's now how I think.\"\u00a0 Well, that's fine.\u00a0 What does the Bible say?\u00a0 See, go back to the source.\u00a0 I'm not going to always be around, but the Bible and truth was here before I ever came around.\u00a0 So he understood that in our home this was the source of truth.\u00a0 Dad could be wrong on his counsel, but let's see what does the Bible have to say about it?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd one thing about our home, they knew Dad wasn't perfect.\u00a0 They knew Mom wasn't perfect.\u00a0 We didn't live perfect lives, but they knew that we were going to stay together no matter what.\u00a0 There were no exit signs in our home.\u00a0 That allowed for security.\u00a0 That was taught to him.\u00a0 So we all look back in our Hall of Fame and in our Hall of Shame about raising children.\u00a0 There will be some things that I would do different.\u00a0 I was not necessarily close to my dad, but one thing that he did teach me \u2013 this is the source of truth. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> The Book, the Bible, right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> The Book.\u00a0 And so what do I do?\u00a0 I am modeling \u2013 he modeled it for me, that aspect of my home, I carry it into the next generation \u2013 no perfection, but we know that this is the final quarter of arbitration right here.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSo there are various stages of Tommy's life.\u00a0 One of the things that I wanted him to know that I did not hear from my father is that he loved me.\u00a0 So if you would ask Tommy about whether your dad loves him, he would say, \"Yeah, Dad always tells me.\"\u00a0 I want him to know he needs to tell his children that you love them, you love them.\u00a0 There should be no point in their life where they have to ask themselves, \"Did Dad ever say he loved me?\"\u00a0 Now, you make sure that you say it.\u00a0 That's a teaching moment, that's a mentoring moment.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Tom, we started out this conversation talking about how we create clarity for young men, and it's interesting where we've gone.\u00a0 We talked about the lack of clarity of the culture and what the culture has done and how it's created confusion.\u00a0 Then we came back to the source, and the definition of the standard of what it means to be a man \u2013 the Scriptures.\u00a0 And as we have talked about teaching and mentoring and molding our children with the Scriptures, we have now come to the area called \"relationship\" and loving.\u00a0 And you just said a second ago that your dad didn't tell you \u2026\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> \u2026 he loved you?\u00a0 Now, I want to ask you to do something intensely personal \u2013 what kind of impact did that have on a boy growing up \u2013 to not have a father express his affection both verbally, physically, emotionally, for his son?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> My dad worked three jobs when I was growing up.\u00a0 I clearly remember \u2013 when you talk about the emotional impact \u2013 I clearly remember him coming to a Little League game, and I just happened to hit a homerun.\u00a0 I remember clearly the count \u2013 three balls, two strikes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> You're smiling.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> I remember \u2013 I remember the coach saying, \"A walk is as good as a hit.\"\u00a0 Well, not when your dad is in the stands.\u00a0 I did not want to walk, and I remember \u2013 it just happened, I wasn't that good.\u00a0 I hit the ball, reached over the right side of the plate, it was obviously a ball, I hit that ball, it went over the right field fence.\u00a0 I remember coming around the base, it was a homerun.\u00a0 I was coming around second base, and I saw my dad in the stands saying to everybody, \"That's my boy, that's my boy.\"\u00a0 And I couldn't wait to get into the car so that my dad could tell me, \"Son, I'm really proud of you, I'm really proud of you.\"\u00a0 I got in the car, waiting and anticipating \u2026\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> You were how old?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> I was about 12 years old.\u00a0 Now, you talk about the impact \u2013 I'm 12 years old, I'm 60 now, I remember this very clearly \u2013 my dad didn't say anything.\u00a0 My dad didn't say anything.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> He didn't say \"Great hit?\"\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> No, he didn't say anything.\u00a0 I went to my mom, I believe I had tears in my eyes, I can't remember clearly whether I did or not, but I told her about it, and she said, \"Your dad loves you.\u00a0 You need to know your dad loves you.\"\u00a0 My dad was not emotional.\u00a0 Now, he taught me to love Scripture, but he was not emotional.\u00a0 So we're talking impact.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt had a great impact on my life that he never said it.\u00a0 I was 46 years old, I'm working for Promise Keepers, and my \u2013 I knew my dad did not have long to live.\u00a0 He died within a week of this incident I'm going to tell you.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI took him out in the car, and I'm with Promise Keepers.\u00a0 You know how you get emotional when you hear guys talk about their love for their dad or the absence or the affection, it wasn't there.\u00a0 And I'm in the car with my dad, and I said, \"Dad, I need to hear something from you.\"\u00a0 I'm 46 now.\u00a0 I said, \"Dad, I need for you to tell me you love me.\"\u00a0 I said, \"I need to hear that.\"\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNow, I didn't think I needed it, but I needed it, and I didn't have long with him, and I did not want to \u2013 I wish I had a moment.\u00a0 Here is my moment \u2013 what looked like eternity or seemed like eternity \u2013 he turned his head and said, \"Bubby\" \u2013 that's my nickname \u2013 he said, \"Bubby, I love you.\"\u00a0 I said, \"Okay, Dad, that's all.\u00a0 Thank you, I just needed you to say that.\"\u00a0 I needed it emotionally as an adult to know and to hear that he loved me.\u00a0 And I heard it.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNow, I have over-compensated that with my son, because I don't want him having that experience.\u00a0 He did teach me the Word of God.\u00a0 He did teach me that this is what he treasured.\u00a0 He did not know how to express it because he didn't have a dad.\u00a0 His dad died; was killed when he was a young man, but it was my mom who told me that he loved me.\u00a0 So through her eyes, through her voice, I knew it, but I wanted to hear it from the man in my life.\u00a0 And I heard it a week before he died.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> And what happened in your soul on that evening when you heard that?\u00a0 I mean, it looks to me like you've got some tears in your eyes right now.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> I didn't know what I needed.\u00a0 I needed a dad who said, \"Bubby, I love you.\"\u00a0 I needed to hear that.\u00a0 That was part \u2013 I was healed of something that I was longing for.\u00a0 Now, I knew it, I sensed it, I saw the work ethic, I saw the provision, but I think hearing it was a healing moment \u2013 so much so that I wanted to move on quickly.\u00a0 Maybe I should have just allowed it to flow and for the two of us just to sit there silently for a while, and I heard something I wanted to hear since I was small.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> I can imagine, Tom, that that moment felt a bit dangerous because of the power of those words.\u00a0 I mean, there are no more powerful words to hear from your father.\u00a0 You know, when Jesus was baptized, there was a voice \u2013 \"This is my beloved son in whom I am well pleased.\"\u00a0 I think there was some modeling taking place for all of us in that moment of the third person of the Trinity.\u00a0 I mean, my goodness, you wouldn't think He'd need to hear it, but the Father stepped out of eternity and made the statement publicly. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd I think our boys and our daughters, they need the truth of The Book just like you've said.\u00a0 That's where the confusion is going to be clarified.\u00a0 But it's like the confusion also needs to be clarified as well with a relationship of love and compassion and of two hearts knitted together, man to man.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> Yes, yes.\u00a0 And, you know, Dennis, as you and I dialog here \u2013 and Bob \u2013 as we sit here, I have a wife who is very patient and understanding, and she knows all of this.\u00a0 We grew up together.\u00a0 But I wonder how many wives don't know their husbands and don't know the relationship between her husband and his father?\u00a0 I think that's a key aspect of marriage because so much of that man's father is going to come into that relationship, and if he never heard his father say that \"I love you\" \u2013 what impact is that going to have in that relationship with his wife?\u00a0 And I would say it has an impact.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tShe needs to know the type of father her husband had, and the impact that he had on him because that's coming into the marriage.\u00a0 That's coming into the relationship, and that relationship needs healing.\u00a0 I encourage men to go back and reconcile with your father.\u00a0 If he has not told you he loves you, ask for it.\u00a0 Say, \"Dad, I never heard you tell me you love me, and I need that as an adult.\"\u00a0 Why?\u00a0 I experienced that.\u00a0 You know, I was the leader of Promise Keepers.\u00a0 I come in with that pain, and I can see it in other men.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> I think about the tens of thousands of men who this summer are going to be at one of your Promise Keepers events, and you've got them going on in different regions of the country all summer long.\u00a0 Guys can come to our website at FamilyLife.com to get information about where these events are being held and how they can attend one of these events and how they can bring their sons with them to these events.\u00a0 What a great moment for a father and son to be able to go to a PK event like this together.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> And maybe they've never said I love you?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Well, there may be some of that that goes on, yeah.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> To your son \u2013 what a great place for it to occur, in the midst of the worship, the preaching, the teaching, and the equipping that occurs of men encouraging men.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> And these events are going to cause guys to be challenged, to be stirred up.\u00a0 In fact, I was thinking, if a dad and a son were going to go to a PK event together, what they ought to do is get a copy of Robert Lewis's book, \"Raising a Modern Day Knight\" and maybe get the CD set of our interviews with Robert where we talk about dads raising sons to understand what's at the core of masculinity and listen to those together on your way, driving to or from the Promise Keepers conference.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe've got information on our website about how you can get a copy of Robert's book or how you can get the CDs.\u00a0 Go to FamilyLife.com, and on the right side of the home page, you'll see a box that says, \"Today's Broadcast.\"\u00a0 If you click that box, it will take you to an area of the site where there is more information about the book \"Raising a Modern Day Knight,\" about the CDs that go with that, and there's information about Tom Fortson's brand-new book, which is called \"Manhood.\"\u00a0 That would be another book that would be great for a father and son to read through together so that they can both gain clarity on what's at the core of what it means to be a man.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAgain, our website is FamilyLife.com, all the information about these resources is available there.\u00a0 When you get to the home page, look for the box in the right side of the screen that says \"Today's Broadcast,\" and click through there to get more information about these resources.\u00a0 Or call us at 1-800-FLTODAY, 1-800-358-6329.\u00a0 That's 1-800-F-as-in-family, L-as-in-life, and then the word TODAY, and we can make arrangements to have the books or the other resources you need sent out to you.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd you know what else would be good to listen to?\u00a0 This month we're making available a CD to our listeners as a way of saying thank you when you make a donation of any amount for the ministry of FamilyLife Today.\u00a0 It's a CD that features former Army Ranger and Green Beret, Stu Weber, talking about manhood and how you keep manhood in balance, what it means to be a man, and what it means to do it right.\u00a0 That CD would be another great CD for a father and son to listen to on the way to a Promise Keepers event, and we're happy to send it to you as our way of saying thank you this month when you support the ministry of FamilyLife Today with a donation of any amount.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou can request the CD when you donate online at FamilyLife.com.\u00a0 There is a keycode box on the donation form.\u00a0 Just type in the word \"Stu,\" s-t-u, and we'll know that you'd like a copy of the CD sent to you, and we're happy to get it to you.\u00a0 Or call and make a donation at 1-800-FLTODAY and mention that you'd like the CD on manhood with Stu Weber and, again, we're happy to get it out to you.\u00a0 It's our way of saying thanks for helping to support the ministry of FamilyLife Today with your donations.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNow, tomorrow Tom Fortson is going to be back with us, and we're going to talk about what manhood looks like in the face of adversity.\u00a0 I hope you can be with us for that.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch, and our entire broadcast production team.\u00a0 On behalf of our host, Dennis Rainey, I'm Bob Lepine.\u00a0 We'll see you back tomorrow for another edition of FamilyLife Today. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tFamilyLife Today is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas \u2013 help for today; hope for tomorrow.\u00a0\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t______________________________________________________________\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts for you. However, there is a cost to transcribe, create, and produce them for our website. If you've benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright \u00a9 FamilyLife. All rights reserved.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>www.FamilyLife.com<\/strong>\u00a0\u00a0\n\t\t\t<\/p>"],"_seopress_titles_title":[""],"_seopress_titles_desc":[""],"_seopress_robots_index":[""],"duration":["00:"],"show_notes":[""],"_thumbnail_id":["294104"],"filesize":["10.5M"],"filesize_raw":["11012876"],"_uag_css_file_name":["uag-css-301604.css"],"_uag_js_file_name":["uag-js-301604.js"],"_uag_page_assets":["a:9:{s:3:\"css\";s:82560:\".wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape-top svg{width: calc( 100% + 1.3px );}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape.uagb-container__shape-top .uagb-container__shape-fill{fill: rgba(51,51,51,1);}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape-bottom svg{width: calc( 100% + 1.3px );}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape.uagb-container__shape-bottom .uagb-container__shape-fill{fill: 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the leader--the man from the home, and the family is up for grabs.\u201d","meta_box":{"show_notes":"","transcript_url":"https:\/\/transcript.familylifetoday.com\/fl2008-06-12.pdf","transcript_content":"<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> If you wanted to destroy a culture, and you were putting together a game plan, where would you start first?\u00a0 Tom Fortson, who is the president of Promise Keepers, knows what he would do.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> Take out the leader.\u00a0 Take out the man.\u00a0 Eliminate him, and then the family is up for grabs.\u00a0 Mom is up for grabs, the children are up for grabs because the God-ordained leader has been removed.\u00a0 So if I were developing a battle plan to destroy the family, let me take out the husband, let me take out the father.\u00a0 Then I can pick off everybody else.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> This is FamilyLife Today for Thursday, June 12.\u00a0 Our host is the president of FamilyLife, Dennis Rainey, and I'm Bob Lepine.\u00a0 One way to take out a leader is to confuse him or have him be unsure of himself.\u00a0 We'll talk about how that's happening among men in our culture today.\u00a0 Stay tuned.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd welcome to FamilyLife Today, thanks for joining us.\u00a0 I've got a question for you and, I guess, for our guest as well today.\u00a0 Back 10 or 15 years ago, when the Promise Keepers movement was just getting started, we used to think there is a lot of confusion in the culture today among men about what it means to be a man.\u00a0 All right, now 15 years later, has that confusion been resolved?\u00a0 Do more guys understand what it means to be a man today than they did 15 years ago?\u00a0 Or do you think we still have a big problem in this area?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Well, I'm going to ask our guest on FamilyLife Today, Tom Fortson.\u00a0 Welcome back, Tom.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> Thank you, Dennis.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Glad to be here.\u00a0 Tom is the president of Promise Keepers.\u00a0 He and his wife, Toni, were speakers at our Weekend to Remember Marriage Conferences for a number of years, and he's a good friend.\u00a0 They've been married over 36 years; have three adult children and one grandchild, and Tom's been leading Promise Keepers for a number of years, and I'm going to let him take the first crack at this.\u00a0 I know what my opinion of this is, and I'll be surprised if it's not the same as Tom's.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Well, since Tom's just written a book called \"Manhood:\u00a0 Let the Truth Be Told,\" you should know the answer to this \u2013 do guys understand what it means to be a man today?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> Well, let me address the issue.\u00a0 I can't say that I have the answer.\u00a0 But I don't think so.\u00a0 One of the characteristics of men today is that they are confused over masculinity \u2013 what it means to be a man.\u00a0 Why is it that in some of our communities there are so many single parents?\u00a0 Where is the protection?\u00a0 Where is the commitment?\u00a0 We have a problem.\u00a0 It's ungodly.\u00a0 The consequences of what we see is men going their own way, doing their own thing, and the consequences are we have a redefinition of the family.\u00a0 There is confusion.\u00a0 God is not the author of confusion.\u00a0 So if God is not the author of confusion, then who is sending this confusion?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNow, we need to be loving, and we need to speak with grace, but I want to let the truth be told.\u00a0 It's a problem, Dennis, and it's spreading.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> And the thing is, Tom, is the hope for them recovering is the Christian community.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> And so they must understand that we will embrace them but with truth and with definition.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> So in spite of the fact that over the last 15 to 20 years, we've had more books on the subject, more conferences on the subject, more radio programs on the subject, we've been trying to send a message that says \"Here is what a man is, here is what a man looks like, here is what a man does.\"\u00a0 Somehow that message is not penetrating deeply into the culture.\u00a0 Is it because the culture is screaming back louder than we're shouting?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> I think you have a battle going on.\u00a0 I think that's a good pickup.\u00a0 There are kingdoms out here.\u00a0 If I can use a biblical term, there is the kingdom of darkness, and there is the kingdom of light.\u00a0 That's why Christ is the King of kings, and we proclaim Him as King.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut there is a battle going on here.\u00a0 There are demonic spirits out there, and I don't want to get \u2013 I want to use the right terms, but there is a battle, and it's almost like it's a standstill.\u00a0 As we intensify and bring clarity on what it means to be a man, don't think that there is going to be another force that counteracts that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSo it's almost like the game is being played on a front line, if you use a football illustration.\u00a0 The offensive and the defensive line, the game is being fought on the line of scrimmage.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> The volume has been turned up, there is no question about it.\u00a0 I mean, can you imagine seeing what we're seeing on television, hearing what's being taught in public education in high schools, colleges, universities across the country?\u00a0 Can you imagine that being taught 30 years ago?\u00a0 No, not at all, and so what you have is \u2013 if you had strong families, maybe you could counteract it, but the problem is the family has slowly been disintegrating along with all this where the family is not a proactive force.\u00a0 It's been neglectful and, at points, it's been abusive.\u00a0 There have been husbands and wives, moms and dads, who have had unhealthy relationships with their children that have added to the problem.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> So let me go back to the family \u2013 take out the leader.\u00a0 Take out the man.\u00a0 Eliminated him, and then the family is up for grabs because the God-ordained leader has been removed.\u00a0 So if I were developing a battle plan to destroy the family, let me take out the husband, let me take out the father.\u00a0 Then I can pick off everybody else.\u00a0 So I think we need to, in addition to Mom and Dad, we need to go after that man who does not know what it means to be a father, a husband, to be a provider, to be a protector.\u00a0 So he should not, as a young boy, as a young man who is obviously feeling out his oats, he needs to understand you don't get involved sexually with another young girl because you have violated her.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhen was the last time or who instructed him that's a violation of God's moral law?\u00a0 Well, a father should, a dad should do that, but we've already now begun to destroy that family that he is going to be a part of when he decides to say, \"I do\" when he gets married.\u00a0 Well, already he's entered into a relationship that's broken because of a pattern that he's developed prior to marriage.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> I think what you're saying is very important here.\u00a0 We can publish books, hold conferences, have radio programs, do weekend retreats for guys; we can sound this call, but if there is not a dad, a husband in place to model that, to instruct it, this is not the kind of thing that you can teach once and then a guy goes, \"Oh, manhood, okay, got it.\"\u00a0 It's the kind of thing that has to be learned repetitively, you've got to see it modeled, you've got to kind of imbibe it on a regular basis before it makes any sense, and the condition of the culture is not a healthy condition for the development of healthy manhood in the next generation.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Tom, you talk about in your book how men need to be modeling, as Bob was saying, but they also need to be mentoring and molding.\u00a0 What exactly do you mean by that as it's applied to this area of being the spiritual leader of your family?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> Well, for an example, my children had to see Toni and I in conflict.\u00a0 They had to see us resolve \u2026\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> They had to see that?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> Well, that's a good point.\u00a0 They did see it.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t[laughter] \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> They got the opportunity.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> They did see it. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> I know Toni, and she's no pushover.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> No.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> I've got a feeling that this came as a natural ebb and flow, and it's not that it would be all her fault, by the way.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> No, no.\u00a0 And so where is that modeled?\u00a0 How do you resolve conflict?\u00a0 Well, they have to see it.\u00a0 Or my son or daughter will enter into a relationship, well, they'll say, \"Well, this is not supposed to happen.\u00a0 Mom and dad didn't argue.\"\u00a0 Well, yes, they did, they had intense fellowship together, but they also saw Mom and Dad ask each other for forgiveness.\u00a0 It's modeling, and we knew we had to practice it.\u00a0 We knew that we didn't run from the kids when we had these discussions.\u00a0 We were aware that they were around.\u00a0 Maybe it was not as intense, you know, when they were around, but we knew they needed to see, \"How are we going to resolve this?\" Because they know Mom and Dad aren't getting along right now.\u00a0 So they need to hear, \"Honey, would you forgive me?\u00a0 I made a mistake.\"\u00a0 And were intentional about that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut what happens to a young man when he gets married?\u00a0 He is now a husband, and he does not know how to resolve conflict.\u00a0 He gets angry, he gets angry, and he slams his fist down.\u00a0 Well, that's because he's hurt.\u00a0 How does he resolve that issue and his wife doesn't know \"Well, why are you acting that way?\"\u00a0 She doesn't know that he's hurt, and he does not know how to say, \"Honey, would you forgive me?\u00a0 I've gone too far.\"\u00a0 He has not seen that modeled, and he goes into a relationship not understanding what it means to be a husband or a father, and he blows it.\u00a0 Why?\u00a0 Because where was his dad?\u00a0 He didn't have one.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Right.\u00a0 Now, you're the father of two daughters and a son, right?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> Correct.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> And so your kids had a chance to see you and Toni model healthy marriage, what biblical manhood looks like, but were you intentional with your son about doing some active mentoring?\u00a0 Did you take him out and have man-to-man talks with him?\u00a0 Did you take him to the Scriptures?\u00a0 How did you raise your son to be a man?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> You know, you can always look back and say, \"I wish I could have done it better.\"\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> \"I wish I'd done this,\" yeah?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> But he and I have had talks.\u00a0 We have walked together, talked together, we have run together.\u00a0 And many times he would say, \"Dad, well, you know, that's now how I think.\"\u00a0 Well, that's fine.\u00a0 What does the Bible say?\u00a0 See, go back to the source.\u00a0 I'm not going to always be around, but the Bible and truth was here before I ever came around.\u00a0 So he understood that in our home this was the source of truth.\u00a0 Dad could be wrong on his counsel, but let's see what does the Bible have to say about it?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd one thing about our home, they knew Dad wasn't perfect.\u00a0 They knew Mom wasn't perfect.\u00a0 We didn't live perfect lives, but they knew that we were going to stay together no matter what.\u00a0 There were no exit signs in our home.\u00a0 That allowed for security.\u00a0 That was taught to him.\u00a0 So we all look back in our Hall of Fame and in our Hall of Shame about raising children.\u00a0 There will be some things that I would do different.\u00a0 I was not necessarily close to my dad, but one thing that he did teach me \u2013 this is the source of truth. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> The Book, the Bible, right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> The Book.\u00a0 And so what do I do?\u00a0 I am modeling \u2013 he modeled it for me, that aspect of my home, I carry it into the next generation \u2013 no perfection, but we know that this is the final quarter of arbitration right here.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSo there are various stages of Tommy's life.\u00a0 One of the things that I wanted him to know that I did not hear from my father is that he loved me.\u00a0 So if you would ask Tommy about whether your dad loves him, he would say, \"Yeah, Dad always tells me.\"\u00a0 I want him to know he needs to tell his children that you love them, you love them.\u00a0 There should be no point in their life where they have to ask themselves, \"Did Dad ever say he loved me?\"\u00a0 Now, you make sure that you say it.\u00a0 That's a teaching moment, that's a mentoring moment.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Tom, we started out this conversation talking about how we create clarity for young men, and it's interesting where we've gone.\u00a0 We talked about the lack of clarity of the culture and what the culture has done and how it's created confusion.\u00a0 Then we came back to the source, and the definition of the standard of what it means to be a man \u2013 the Scriptures.\u00a0 And as we have talked about teaching and mentoring and molding our children with the Scriptures, we have now come to the area called \"relationship\" and loving.\u00a0 And you just said a second ago that your dad didn't tell you \u2026\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> \u2026 he loved you?\u00a0 Now, I want to ask you to do something intensely personal \u2013 what kind of impact did that have on a boy growing up \u2013 to not have a father express his affection both verbally, physically, emotionally, for his son?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> My dad worked three jobs when I was growing up.\u00a0 I clearly remember \u2013 when you talk about the emotional impact \u2013 I clearly remember him coming to a Little League game, and I just happened to hit a homerun.\u00a0 I remember clearly the count \u2013 three balls, two strikes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> You're smiling.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> I remember \u2013 I remember the coach saying, \"A walk is as good as a hit.\"\u00a0 Well, not when your dad is in the stands.\u00a0 I did not want to walk, and I remember \u2013 it just happened, I wasn't that good.\u00a0 I hit the ball, reached over the right side of the plate, it was obviously a ball, I hit that ball, it went over the right field fence.\u00a0 I remember coming around the base, it was a homerun.\u00a0 I was coming around second base, and I saw my dad in the stands saying to everybody, \"That's my boy, that's my boy.\"\u00a0 And I couldn't wait to get into the car so that my dad could tell me, \"Son, I'm really proud of you, I'm really proud of you.\"\u00a0 I got in the car, waiting and anticipating \u2026\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> You were how old?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> I was about 12 years old.\u00a0 Now, you talk about the impact \u2013 I'm 12 years old, I'm 60 now, I remember this very clearly \u2013 my dad didn't say anything.\u00a0 My dad didn't say anything.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> He didn't say \"Great hit?\"\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> No, he didn't say anything.\u00a0 I went to my mom, I believe I had tears in my eyes, I can't remember clearly whether I did or not, but I told her about it, and she said, \"Your dad loves you.\u00a0 You need to know your dad loves you.\"\u00a0 My dad was not emotional.\u00a0 Now, he taught me to love Scripture, but he was not emotional.\u00a0 So we're talking impact.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt had a great impact on my life that he never said it.\u00a0 I was 46 years old, I'm working for Promise Keepers, and my \u2013 I knew my dad did not have long to live.\u00a0 He died within a week of this incident I'm going to tell you.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI took him out in the car, and I'm with Promise Keepers.\u00a0 You know how you get emotional when you hear guys talk about their love for their dad or the absence or the affection, it wasn't there.\u00a0 And I'm in the car with my dad, and I said, \"Dad, I need to hear something from you.\"\u00a0 I'm 46 now.\u00a0 I said, \"Dad, I need for you to tell me you love me.\"\u00a0 I said, \"I need to hear that.\"\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNow, I didn't think I needed it, but I needed it, and I didn't have long with him, and I did not want to \u2013 I wish I had a moment.\u00a0 Here is my moment \u2013 what looked like eternity or seemed like eternity \u2013 he turned his head and said, \"Bubby\" \u2013 that's my nickname \u2013 he said, \"Bubby, I love you.\"\u00a0 I said, \"Okay, Dad, that's all.\u00a0 Thank you, I just needed you to say that.\"\u00a0 I needed it emotionally as an adult to know and to hear that he loved me.\u00a0 And I heard it.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNow, I have over-compensated that with my son, because I don't want him having that experience.\u00a0 He did teach me the Word of God.\u00a0 He did teach me that this is what he treasured.\u00a0 He did not know how to express it because he didn't have a dad.\u00a0 His dad died; was killed when he was a young man, but it was my mom who told me that he loved me.\u00a0 So through her eyes, through her voice, I knew it, but I wanted to hear it from the man in my life.\u00a0 And I heard it a week before he died.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> And what happened in your soul on that evening when you heard that?\u00a0 I mean, it looks to me like you've got some tears in your eyes right now.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> I didn't know what I needed.\u00a0 I needed a dad who said, \"Bubby, I love you.\"\u00a0 I needed to hear that.\u00a0 That was part \u2013 I was healed of something that I was longing for.\u00a0 Now, I knew it, I sensed it, I saw the work ethic, I saw the provision, but I think hearing it was a healing moment \u2013 so much so that I wanted to move on quickly.\u00a0 Maybe I should have just allowed it to flow and for the two of us just to sit there silently for a while, and I heard something I wanted to hear since I was small.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> I can imagine, Tom, that that moment felt a bit dangerous because of the power of those words.\u00a0 I mean, there are no more powerful words to hear from your father.\u00a0 You know, when Jesus was baptized, there was a voice \u2013 \"This is my beloved son in whom I am well pleased.\"\u00a0 I think there was some modeling taking place for all of us in that moment of the third person of the Trinity.\u00a0 I mean, my goodness, you wouldn't think He'd need to hear it, but the Father stepped out of eternity and made the statement publicly. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd I think our boys and our daughters, they need the truth of The Book just like you've said.\u00a0 That's where the confusion is going to be clarified.\u00a0 But it's like the confusion also needs to be clarified as well with a relationship of love and compassion and of two hearts knitted together, man to man.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Tom:<\/strong> Yes, yes.\u00a0 And, you know, Dennis, as you and I dialog here \u2013 and Bob \u2013 as we sit here, I have a wife who is very patient and understanding, and she knows all of this.\u00a0 We grew up together.\u00a0 But I wonder how many wives don't know their husbands and don't know the relationship between her husband and his father?\u00a0 I think that's a key aspect of marriage because so much of that man's father is going to come into that relationship, and if he never heard his father say that \"I love you\" \u2013 what impact is that going to have in that relationship with his wife?\u00a0 And I would say it has an impact.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tShe needs to know the type of father her husband had, and the impact that he had on him because that's coming into the marriage.\u00a0 That's coming into the relationship, and that relationship needs healing.\u00a0 I encourage men to go back and reconcile with your father.\u00a0 If he has not told you he loves you, ask for it.\u00a0 Say, \"Dad, I never heard you tell me you love me, and I need that as an adult.\"\u00a0 Why?\u00a0 I experienced that.\u00a0 You know, I was the leader of Promise Keepers.\u00a0 I come in with that pain, and I can see it in other men.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> I think about the tens of thousands of men who this summer are going to be at one of your Promise Keepers events, and you've got them going on in different regions of the country all summer long.\u00a0 Guys can come to our website at FamilyLife.com to get information about where these events are being held and how they can attend one of these events and how they can bring their sons with them to these events.\u00a0 What a great moment for a father and son to be able to go to a PK event like this together.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> And maybe they've never said I love you?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Well, there may be some of that that goes on, yeah.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> To your son \u2013 what a great place for it to occur, in the midst of the worship, the preaching, the teaching, and the equipping that occurs of men encouraging men.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> And these events are going to cause guys to be challenged, to be stirred up.\u00a0 In fact, I was thinking, if a dad and a son were going to go to a PK event together, what they ought to do is get a copy of Robert Lewis's book, \"Raising a Modern Day Knight\" and maybe get the CD set of our interviews with Robert where we talk about dads raising sons to understand what's at the core of masculinity and listen to those together on your way, driving to or from the Promise Keepers conference.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe've got information on our website about how you can get a copy of Robert's book or how you can get the CDs.\u00a0 Go to FamilyLife.com, and on the right side of the home page, you'll see a box that says, \"Today's Broadcast.\"\u00a0 If you click that box, it will take you to an area of the site where there is more information about the book \"Raising a Modern Day Knight,\" about the CDs that go with that, and there's information about Tom Fortson's brand-new book, which is called \"Manhood.\"\u00a0 That would be another book that would be great for a father and son to read through together so that they can both gain clarity on what's at the core of what it means to be a man.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAgain, our website is FamilyLife.com, all the information about these resources is available there.\u00a0 When you get to the home page, look for the box in the right side of the screen that says \"Today's Broadcast,\" and click through there to get more information about these resources.\u00a0 Or call us at 1-800-FLTODAY, 1-800-358-6329.\u00a0 That's 1-800-F-as-in-family, L-as-in-life, and then the word TODAY, and we can make arrangements to have the books or the other resources you need sent out to you.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd you know what else would be good to listen to?\u00a0 This month we're making available a CD to our listeners as a way of saying thank you when you make a donation of any amount for the ministry of FamilyLife Today.\u00a0 It's a CD that features former Army Ranger and Green Beret, Stu Weber, talking about manhood and how you keep manhood in balance, what it means to be a man, and what it means to do it right.\u00a0 That CD would be another great CD for a father and son to listen to on the way to a Promise Keepers event, and we're happy to send it to you as our way of saying thank you this month when you support the ministry of FamilyLife Today with a donation of any amount.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou can request the CD when you donate online at FamilyLife.com.\u00a0 There is a keycode box on the donation form.\u00a0 Just type in the word \"Stu,\" s-t-u, and we'll know that you'd like a copy of the CD sent to you, and we're happy to get it to you.\u00a0 Or call and make a donation at 1-800-FLTODAY and mention that you'd like the CD on manhood with Stu Weber and, again, we're happy to get it out to you.\u00a0 It's our way of saying thanks for helping to support the ministry of FamilyLife Today with your donations.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNow, tomorrow Tom Fortson is going to be back with us, and we're going to talk about what manhood looks like in the face of adversity.\u00a0 I hope you can be with us for that.\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch, and our entire broadcast production team.\u00a0 On behalf of our host, Dennis Rainey, I'm Bob Lepine.\u00a0 We'll see you back tomorrow for another edition of FamilyLife Today. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tFamilyLife Today is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas \u2013 help for today; hope for tomorrow.\u00a0\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t______________________________________________________________\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts for you. However, there is a cost to transcribe, create, and produce them for our website. If you've benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright \u00a9 FamilyLife. All rights reserved.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>www.FamilyLife.com<\/strong>\u00a0\u00a0\n\t\t\t<\/p>","theme_header_position":"","post_header_is_sticky":"","is_header_overlay":""},"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast\/301604","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/podcast"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/91"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=301604"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/294104"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=301604"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=301604"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=301604"},{"taxonomy":"podcast_series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast_series?post=301604"},{"taxonomy":"cwp_profile","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/cwp_profile?post=301604"},{"taxonomy":"series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/series?post=301604"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}