{"id":300395,"date":"2018-10-02T11:00:00","date_gmt":"2018-10-02T15:00:00","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/%series%\/a-daily-battle\/"},"modified":"2024-10-07T22:41:34","modified_gmt":"2024-10-08T02:41:34","slug":"a-daily-battle","status":"publish","type":"podcast","link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/a-daily-battle\/","title":{"rendered":"A Daily Battle"},"content":{"rendered":"","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Rick Van Warner talks about his son&#8217;s first trip to rehab, and his sorrow over his actions once he got out. But Tommy was hooked, and his behavior escalated. It&#8217;s a &#8220;cycle of madness&#8221; for the Van Warner family.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":91,"featured_media":294104,"menu_order":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","template":"","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","inline_featured_image":false,"_uag_custom_page_level_css":"","episode_type":"","audio_file":"https:\/\/web.familylifetoday.com\/fl2018-10-02.mp3","cover_image":"","cover_image_id":"","duration":"00:24:30","filesize":"22.44M","filesize_raw":"23526326","date_recorded":"","explicit":"","block":""},"categories":[2840,2841],"tags":[2872,4561,4560,4517,4558,4559],"podcast_series":[7252],"cwp_profile":[8853],"series":[2101],"class_list":["post-300395","podcast","type-podcast","status-publish","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-addiction","category-anger-and-rebellion","tag-addiction","tag-brokeness","tag-detox","tag-hope-for-parents","tag-opioid-addiction","tag-pain-killer-pills-addiction","podcast_series-on-pills-and-needles","cwp_profile-rick-van-warner","series-familylife-today"],"acf":[],"episode_featured_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/09\/FLT-Podcast-Cover-2-508x508-3.jpg?w=508","episode_player_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2023\/02\/image-scaled.jpg","download_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-download\/300395\/a-daily-battle","player_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-player\/300395\/a-daily-battle","audio_player":null,"episode_data":{"playerMode":"light","subscribeUrls":{"apple_podcasts":{"key":"apple_podcasts","url":"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303?mt=2&app=podcast","label":"Apple Podcasts","class":"apple_podcasts","icon":"apple-podcasts.png"},"google_podcasts":{"key":"google_podcasts","url":"","label":"Google Podcasts","class":"google_podcasts","icon":"google-podcasts.png"},"spotify":{"key":"spotify","url":"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm","label":"Spotify","class":"spotify","icon":"spotify.png"},"youtube":{"key":"youtube","url":"","label":"YouTube","class":"youtube","icon":"youtube.png"}},"rssFeedUrl":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/feed\/podcast\/familylife-today","embedCode":"<blockquote class=\"wp-embedded-content\" data-secret=\"pG63R8wvyN\"><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/a-daily-battle\/\">A Daily Battle<\/a><\/blockquote><iframe sandbox=\"allow-scripts\" security=\"restricted\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/a-daily-battle\/embed\/#?secret=pG63R8wvyN\" width=\"500\" height=\"350\" title=\"&#8220;A Daily Battle&#8221; &#8212; FamilyLife\u00ae - A Cru Ministry\" data-secret=\"pG63R8wvyN\" frameborder=\"0\" marginwidth=\"0\" marginheight=\"0\" scrolling=\"no\" class=\"wp-embedded-content\"><\/iframe><script>\n\/*! This file is auto-generated *\/\n!function(d,l){\"use strict\";l.querySelector&&d.addEventListener&&\"undefined\"!=typeof URL&&(d.wp=d.wp||{},d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage||(d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage=function(e){var t=e.data;if((t||t.secret||t.message||t.value)&&!\/[^a-zA-Z0-9]\/.test(t.secret)){for(var s,r,n,a=l.querySelectorAll('iframe[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),o=l.querySelectorAll('blockquote[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),c=new RegExp(\"^https?:$\",\"i\"),i=0;i<o.length;i++)o[i].style.display=\"none\";for(i=0;i<a.length;i++)s=a[i],e.source===s.contentWindow&&(s.removeAttribute(\"style\"),\"height\"===t.message?(1e3<(r=parseInt(t.value,10))?r=1e3:~~r<200&&(r=200),s.height=r):\"link\"===t.message&&(r=new URL(s.getAttribute(\"src\")),n=new URL(t.value),c.test(n.protocol))&&n.host===r.host&&l.activeElement===s&&(d.top.location.href=t.value))}},d.addEventListener(\"message\",d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage,!1),l.addEventListener(\"DOMContentLoaded\",function(){for(var e,t,s=l.querySelectorAll(\"iframe.wp-embedded-content\"),r=0;r<s.length;r++)(t=(e=s[r]).getAttribute(\"data-secret\"))||(t=Math.random().toString(36).substring(2,12),e.src+=\"#?secret=\"+t,e.setAttribute(\"data-secret\",t)),e.contentWindow.postMessage({message:\"ready\",secret:t},\"*\")},!1)))}(window,document);\n\/\/# sourceURL=https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-includes\/js\/wp-embed.min.js\n<\/script>\n"},"spectra_custom_meta":{"_wp_page_template":["default"],"transcript_url":["https:\/\/transcript.familylifetoday.com\/fl2018-10-02.pdf"],"audio_file":["https:\/\/web.familylifetoday.com\/fl2018-10-02.mp3"],"transcript_content":["<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Why are so many people in our culture today addicted to opioids? That\u2019s a question Rick Van Warner began to explore when his son started abusing drugs.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> At the end of the day, the person who is seeking escape through opioids is trying to numb emotional pain. As my son described it to me once, \u201cI use when I don\u2019t want to feel any more\u2014I don\u2019t want to feel pain.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhen you put that together with the fact that there\u2019s a very inextricable link between opioid addiction and, in most cases, mental health as well\u2014in our son\u2019s case, he\u2019s got mild depression and been diagnosed with social anxiety. You put those two together, and the drugs are an escape from pain. It\u2019s a drug of isolation\u2014it\u2019s not a drug they do with their friends to go to a concert\u2014it\u2019s a drug that they do alone and then withdraw to a dark room. You know, what I mean? It\u2019s a drug of withdrawing from whatever psychological pain someone is facing.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>1:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> This is <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> for Tuesday, October 2<sup>nd<\/sup>. Our host is Dennis Rainey, and I'm Bob Lepine. What often looks like an escape from pain to an addict is really a pathway to destruction, as we\u2019ll learn more about today. Stay with us.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd welcome to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. Thanks for joining us. You know, when a family goes through a desperate season, like the one we\u2019re hearing about this week\u2014I think a lot of us\u2014our impulse is to want to hide this away and not let anybody know what we\u2019re experiencing, because there\u2019s shame tied to this.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> There is. What the Christian community needs to <em>really<\/em> understand\u2014when a family is dealing with\u2014a son, a daughter, or an extended family member, who is struggling with a drug addiction, or alcohol addiction, or maybe a porn addiction\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>2:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014<em>they<\/em> need a community, at that point, more than at any point in their lives. Honestly, Bob, the Christian community ought to be the one place\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> \u2014that they can turn to for encouragement, help, hope, and prayer\u2014and just a hug, occasionally. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> We have the author of a new book called <em>On Pills and Needles. <\/em>Rick Van Warner joins us again on <em>FamilyLife Today. <\/em>Rick, welcome back.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Thank you.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Rick tells the story, in this book, of his son, Tommy, who, for no apparent reason, just completely ended up being missing for four days\u2014finally found him in a corner of an abandoned building on the fourth or fifth day, and took him away to a rehab unit, and began the process of realizing they had a son, who had been addicted, at the age of 16, to narcotics. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tRick, you began to explain in your book how that was just the beginning of the story. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>3:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHow long was he in the rehab unit?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Well, the first one was only a few days\u2014it was only about a week before he was asked to leave that one; because he wasn\u2019t interested in being clean; he wasn\u2019t interested in complying with the rules. He had been convinced by some older people in the clinic to sneak out and buy them some cigarettes at a nearby convenience store in the middle of the night. He got caught and was asked to leave that facility.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think that, when we first found him and got him into that first detox facility, at that point, we had that hope that he would get it; and that this would\u2014we couldn\u2019t have even <em>fathomed<\/em>, at that point, that this would go on, now, for another decade, and that he would go through 14 relapses; that he would be, twice, resuscitated from death by overdose; that he would end up in jail on a couple of occasions for possession of drugs; that he would be homeless when we realized that we could no longer have him in our house, at certain points.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>4:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe tragedy and the journey has been long and treacherous; but I think you touched on something very important, which is the stigma that exists, particularly with opioids, which most people think of as heroin. Again, pill-form heroin is OxyContin and similar drugs. Because of that stigma that exists, a lot of people do keep that within the house. They try to hide this, as well as other family problems; because there are a lot of other problems that parents and families go through, and they try to withdraw and keep it in the house. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHonestly, that\u2019s about the worst thing you can do; because the more you share, the more you realize that other families are going through very similar struggles. If it\u2019s not drug addiction, it could be other addictions \/ it could be other problems.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhen you took Tommy to rehab\u2014I mean, he was stoned when you picked him up; right? He was still under the influence.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Sure.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>5:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> So, when he started to come out from under the influence, was he aware of what was going on? Was there any contrition? Was there any sense of: \u201cOh, man! What have I gotten myself into?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> He was always sorry\/always thankful; you know, his lovingness and his nature was there. These drugs rewire the brain chemistry in such a way that it takes almost a year of sobriety or more to start to repair and get those wirings back in order. It\u2019s tough for them, in that period, to understand the implications of their actions and of what they\u2019re doing to the others around them.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think that the more I\u2019ve read research on this\u2014on what opioids do to the brain\u2014and the more research that has been done\u2014frankly, you know, there\u2019s more research going on every day. If you consider that the brain is the last frontier of medical science, there\u2019s still so much that we don\u2019t know about how this works. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>6:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut I have come to understand that he cannot even begin to fathom what the impact is; because his brain is still in the place where he\u2019s got that craving, constantly, to relapse. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>There\u2019s something inside of him, even in the hospital \/ even in rehab, where he\u2019s just going, \u201cI\u2019ve got to get another\u2026\u201c\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Even as far as when you\u2019re sober for a year.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Wow!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> He had a full year of sobriety before he lost an old girlfriend to an overdose, and that set him off the deep end. That physical yearning for that drug\u2014once it\u2019s hijacked the brain once\u2014it remains for a long, long time.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> I think a lot of people don\u2019t realize that these rehab units really are effective in helping a young person\u2014or for that matter, an older person as well\u2014to deal with their issues and to come, face to face, with the kind of calamity they\u2019re causing. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhat most of us don\u2019t realize is that 80 percent of those who go through a rehab program end up relapsing. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Right; and they say\u2014there\u2019s an old saying that I\u2019ve learned, becoming a default expert on this subject, which is that: \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>7:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u201cRelapse is part of recovery.\u201d If you really look at the nature of the rehab programs, the success rates on alcoholics is said to be 15-20 percent\u2014can stay clean for a year. With drug addicts, it\u2019s 8-10 percent. And, supposedly, with opioid addicts\u2014and there is no hard, fast evidence on this\u2014it\u2019s probably less than 5 percent. It\u2019s a different animal, if you will, than even alcohol. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThere are a lot of good rehabs out there that do their best, and there are some that are effective. It\u2019s really up to the person, though\u2014it\u2019s person by person. And there are quite a few rehabs we\u2019ve run across, where they\u2019re clearly in it for the business.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Talk for a moment about the behavior of a person, who\u2019s an addict. One of the ways I\u2019ve heard them described is \u201c\u2026a liar, a deceiver, a manipulator\u201d\u2014always trying to figure out a way around any boundary that\u2019s put in their place.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Master manipulators; absolutely.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>8:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThey\u2019re absolute, pathological liars. When somebody is in the grips of opioid addiction, there isn\u2019t a word that they can say that you can trust. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> And the interesting thing is\u2014a parent has a heart full of love and hope for their child.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> So he or she is set up to believe the best about their son or daughter. The reality is\u2014that addict knows how to use that to his advantage.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Inherently, they know how to manipulate and deceive\u2014stealing from all of us. I mean, he stole from all of us in the family.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Well, you had an encounter with Tommy and a therapist, where you were believing your son and she wasn\u2019t; right?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Yes; we had one meeting with a therapist, a while back, who felt that he was just snowing us. My wife and I were both there; he challenged us to drug test him on the spot. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>9:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI left the therapy office\u2014and my wife was still there with him\u2014and went down to the Walgreens, and got a drug test kit. Sure enough, she was correct!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> \u2014in the midst of it?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> \u2014in the midst of it!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> What can\u2019t be described is the amount of chaos.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> It completely causes the family to be in a constant swirl.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> It is complete chaos in the house. You know, it creates dysfunction. You\u2019ve got three other children that you\u2019re trying to raise\u2014and are in the middle of it\u2014and exposed to things they shouldn\u2019t be exposed to. There\u2019s the bickering and the divide it puts between the spouses. It is just difficult. It was just\u2014it\u2019s like living in a cycle of madness\u2014is what I\u2019ve described it as, in a sense. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt\u2019s a miracle that our marriage survived, and we\u2019ve come through it; but we\u2019re both strong, and we never lost our faith. We continued to do what was best. I think it would have been a lot harder if we didn\u2019t have three other children, because we knew we had to do right by the three other children. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>10:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThat kept us in a normal life as much as possible; but there was always that issue of the addiction in our middle son, which kind of took all of the air out of the room.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Did you have a burden-bearer? Did you and your wife have another couple with whom you could go and share: \u201cYou know what? We think we\u2019re going crazy. We\u2019re at each other; the kids are at each other. This chaos is driving us mad. Would you just talk to us for a moment and breathe some truth into us?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Well, we had friends that we were willing to share with. Again, the worst thing is to carry this burden alone. When we started going to Nar-Anon meetings\u2014Narcotics Anonymous for families with addiction in them\u2014we started realizing we didn\u2019t feel so alone anymore. All of a sudden, the rooms were full\u2014and bigger and bigger\u2014with more and more people going through the same things. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAs time went by, we found ourselves in the role of counselors; because we were so much more experienced with it, at this point, than others. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>11:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThat first year of chaos is when it\u2019s the worst; because you just think: \u201cHow are we going to get through this? How are we going to survive?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> And this is the kind of thing that, in normal life, you don\u2019t want anybody to know this is going on in your family. So, if somebody says: \u201cOh, so you\u2019ve got four kids. Tell me about your kids!\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> \u201cWell, we\u2019ve got one off at university; and we\u2019ve got the one, who is addicted to Oxy, and has been in and out of rehab.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Exactly.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> I mean, you don\u2019t want to even talk about this. Every time it comes up, you just want to go home and hide.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> It\u2019s the worst. And that is the worst approach too\u2014to try to just hide it. By going through these support groups and sharing with other families\u2014that was extremely helpful. We had some close friends. I had a brother in Christ that I happened to go through <em>The Man in the Mirror<\/em> with, right in the midst of all of this. That was <em>tremendously<\/em> helpful\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> \u2014to have somebody that <em>knew<\/em> all the pain and the despair we were in the midst of\u2014and how we\u2019re in this life-and-death struggle with trying to keep our son afloat. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>12:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou know, having that support\u2014and I had a men\u2019s small group that I would go to on a weekly basis as well. All of those interactions, collectively, were <em>tremendously<\/em> helpful to get through this.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> It\u2019s interesting\u2014in the midst of all this, you never stop being a parent.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Nope!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> You\u2019re still trying to help your child\u2014trying to figure out how to do that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou opened the door, just a moment ago, for a crack; and then you kind of shut it. You said you and your wife switched roles.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> One parent can be an enabler, rescuing the child over and over again; the other parent can be solid and say, \u201cNo; this is not the right thing.\u201d You\u2019re at odds with each other in the midst of that; right?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Absolutely; and it was very interesting, to me, how we would switch roles. I mean, again, it wasn\u2019t contrived like a \u201cgood cop\/bad cop.\u201d There wasn\u2019t some script or some drama around it, but it did come out that way. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI would reach the end of the road, where I just couldn\u2019t take him anymore, and just said, \u201cHe can\u2019t be in our house.\u201d You know, \u201cIt\u2019s too detrimental to the rest of the children.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>13:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u201cOh, no!\u201d\u2014you know, my wife would be in the loving spot. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut then, we would flip\u2014six months might go by\u2014and the next time, she\u2019d be done with him; and I would say: \u201cNo; no! You don\u2019t understand.\u201d I think that yin and yang between the two of us is what allowed the family to survive\u2014and what really allowed our son to survive\u2014because the longer that time went by, the more I understood this concept of enabling. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhile I understand it and it makes sense\u2014this tough love concept\u2014they don\u2019t <em>really<\/em> apply when you\u2019re dealing with someone who\u2019s in the throes of opioid addiction\u2014and,\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI suspect, other types of narcotics that rewire the brain as well.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Explain why they don\u2019t apply.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Well, at the end of the day, the person who is seeking escape through opioids is trying to numb emotional pain. As my son described it to me once, \u201cI use when I don\u2019t want to feel any more\u2014I don\u2019t want to feel pain.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>14:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhen you put that together with the fact that there\u2019s a very inextricable link between opioid addiction and, in most cases, mental health as well\u2014in our son\u2019s case, he\u2019s got mild depression and been diagnosed with social anxiety. You put those two together, and the drugs are an escape from pain. It\u2019s a drug of isolation\u2014it\u2019s not a drug they do with their friends to go to a concert\u2014it\u2019s a drug that they do alone and then withdraw to a dark room. You know, it\u2019s a drug of withdrawing from whatever psychological pain someone is facing.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIf you stop there for a minute, what are we doing by just pushing them into the next rehab? We\u2019re kicking the can down the road; and we\u2019re making the person\u2014that we\u2019re throwing into the next facility\u2014even more isolated and feeling even more of a failure than they already are. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Rick, this was not your first encounter with an addict; because your brother had been a substance abuser; right?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>15:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> That\u2019s right. My brother fell into cocaine, although that was when he was in his 20s; and I didn\u2019t live with him. We didn\u2019t live in the same state, even.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> So I didn\u2019t really witness it much, but he did fall into cocaine abuse. He got clean and sober at 24, I think it was\u2014and is clean and sober to this day.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> There was a point in your progression with Tommy, where you thought, \u201cMaybe if he went and lived with his uncle, maybe they could get things worked out.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> We did. We sent him up there for a couple of different occasions, where my brother was generous enough to open his home to him. Having been down that road\u2014and \u201c90 meetings in 90 days\u201d\u2014and showed him that you can have a sober life, and still have fun, and these sorts of things\u2014that is tougher to get through when my son was, say, 19 or 20.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut again, I think that\u2014back to the tough love concept\u2014I think the point is\u2014you\u2019re further isolating somebody when you\u2019re kicking them out, and when you\u2019re putting them out on the street, or you\u2019re putting them into a rehab program. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>16:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCertainly, underage, we were able to do that\u2014he didn\u2019t have to stay once he was 18. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut, when you look at those approaches versus the approach that worked better for us in the end\u2014which was, essentially, detoxing and giving him the family\u2019s love and support at home\u2014worked out a lot better. He would recover quicker, and he would stay sober longer.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Rick, you mentioned, at the beginning of the broadcast\u2014and I almost gasped when you said it\u2014that this journey, in and out of rehab facilities, lasted a <em>decade<\/em>\u2014ten years! Comment, if you would, on the subculture of relapsing addicts, who go in and out of these rehab units. It really is like the passage of Scripture that warns us, \u201cBad company corrupts good morals.\u201d It\u2019s like your child\u2014even though he or she may be an adult or an emerging adult\u2014is going to be around other people, battling the same addiction.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>17:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Right; and it\u2019s not just the company they keep\u2014although it\u2019s <em>worse<\/em> if you\u2019re at a social system rehab\u2014then, there are people that are ordered there by the law. They have to be there, and they have no interest in staying clean. There are certainly people, who want to stay clean in rehabs, and those who don\u2019t. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think the bigger thing is\u2014you\u2019re not going to cure somebody, who has a chronic brain disease like addiction from opioids, by just putting them in a program that teaches them how to look at the world differently in 30, 60, to 90 days. It just doesn\u2019t really\u2014it\u2019s an overly simplistic approach to a very complex problem. There\u2019s a reason that the success rates for opioid addicts in rehab is so low. Again, there are rehab facilities that are in it for the business.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Okay; so we\u2019ve got to talk about this; because there are folks, who are listening, who are right in the throes of this. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Sure.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>18:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> They\u2019ve got kids at home, who are disrupting everything about the household. The parents can hardly function in life because of all that this is presenting. They\u2019re hearing you say: \u201cYeah, rehab may not be the solution. Having them at home\u2014that is what worked for us.\u201d These parents are going: \u201cIt\u2019s not <em>safe<\/em> to have him at home! We can\u2019t function and have him at home!\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAre you saying, \u201cThat\u2019s the solution that we\u2019ve got to toughen up and go to\u201d?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> I\u2019m saying that there\u2019s no right or wrong\u2014or silver bullet\u2014on any of it. I think that rehab works for some; it doesn\u2019t work for a lot. I think that we have to fight and not give up. I think that some people\u2014it\u2019s a lot easier to just: \u201cOut of sight; out of mind. Let\u2019s just ship him off to a military school,\u201d \/ \u201cShip him off to a rehab facility.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSo you start to say, \u201cThere has got to be a deeper problem here.\u201d That\u2019s when I really got into the understanding that this is\u2014you know, addiction is not only a substance problem\u2014it\u2019s also a deep psychological and brain problem.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>19:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> And it\u2019s also a heart issue of the child too.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Sure.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Spiritually speaking, talk about where Tommy was during this decade.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Well, he\u2019s spiritually connected with nature; but he has <em>never<\/em> connected with Christ.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> So, if I had met him at 15, he would not have said he was a Christian at that point?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Well, he would have at that point; but I think that he\u2019s become disillusioned with organized religion, basically.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> He meditates; and he has a belief in a sense of spiritual connection with the world\u2014not so much with a particular doctrine.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Did you get him in the Bible at all? Could you get him to read the Scriptures?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Not really. He\u2019s never really gone down that road. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Even today?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Even today. He\u2019s read some things, but he just\u2014that\u2019s part of the problem.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> He\u2019s still on a journey too.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> He is; he is. And I tell him, all of the time, that, you know: \u201cHe wouldn\u2019t be alive if God didn\u2019t have a plan for him,\u201d\u2014as many times as he\u2019s been on the brink of death from this addiction.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>20:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> And I would just say\u2014to the parents, who are dealing with this personally: \u201cThis is where you must stick to the church and people in the church\u2014not the institution\u2014but those who walk with God, who can remind you of the truth of the Bible. God is near the broken-hearted, and He does give wisdom to those who ask in faith.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tParents, like Rick and Maria, who go through this over a decade\u2014they are going to need some strong believers standing with them in the midst of this. Just because a young man doesn\u2019t respond does not mean he\u2019s hopeless! God is fully capable of getting this young man\u2019s attention.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> And He\u2019s also capable of getting your child\u2019s attention as well. You just hope that it will occur sooner rather than later. But in the midst of this\u2014you know, I\u2019m just thinking of you, Rick and Maria\u2014ten years is a <em>long <\/em>time.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> It is, but he\u2019s better today than he was then. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>21:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> I know you would tell people, who are in this situation\u2014that you need to have other people around you. You need to be hearing the stories of others, who have been through this or are going through it, so you don\u2019t feel isolated \/ you don\u2019t feel alone. That\u2019s one of the things I think is so helpful about your book, because it takes people into your story. I think families that are dealing with this are going to benefit from just hearing how another family has gone through a very difficult season of time. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIf that\u2019s your family, or if you know someone\u2014you\u2019d like to get a copy of this book and pass it on to them\u2014go to FamilyLifeToday.com. You can order the book from us online. Again, our website is FamilyLifeToday.com. You can also order by calling 1-800-FL-TODAY. The title of the book, again, is <em>On Pills and Needles<\/em>: <em>The Relentless Fight to Save My Son from Opioid Addiction <\/em>by Rick Van Warner. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>22:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tOrder, online, at FamilyLifeToday.com; or call 1-800-358-6329\u2014that\u2019s 1-800-\u201cF\u201d as in family, \u201cL\u201d as in life, and then the word, \u201cTODAY.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou know, I think of the number of families that are struggling with situations like this\u2014whether it\u2019s opioid addiction or other kinds of drug addiction \/ alcohol addition\u2014things that happen in families that often leave us isolated from other people. One of the reasons we wanted to talk about this on <em>FamilyLife Today <\/em>is because we\u2019re committed to providing practical biblical help and hope for the issues facing marriages and families in our culture today.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe\u2019re grateful that there\u2019s a team of allies\u2014a team of you, who not only listen to this program, but who have said\u2014\u201cThis is important; and I want to be a part of helping to make this kind of information\/this kind of programming available for young couples, young families\u2014others who are going through this.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>23:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThose of you who support this ministry\u2014you are helping hundreds of thousands of people, every day, by making this program possible to be heard on local radio stations, on the internet, through our mobile app. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd now, you can tell Alexa to \u201cPlay <em>FamilyLife Today.<\/em>\u201d Build that skill into your Alexa app; and anytime you want to hear today\u2019s program, just ask Alexa to play it for you. If you need help setting that up, go to FamilyLifeToday.com; and we\u2019ve got information available there that can help you. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd if you want to help with a donation so that this program can continue to be available for your family and for other families, you can donate online at FamilyLifeToday.com; or you can call to donate: 1-800-FL-TODAY. Or you can mail your donation to <em>FamilyLife Today <\/em>at PO Box 7111, Little Rock, AR; and our zip code is 72223. By the way, when you donate, ask for your copy of the new 2019 FamilyLife<sup>\u00ae<\/sup> calendar. It\u2019s all about helping to build family togetherness in the new year\u2014 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>24:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014we\u2019ve got lots of togetherness tips. We\u2019ll just keep Scriptures and ideas for building togetherness in front of you, all year long. Ask for your copy of the calendar when you make a donation today. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd I hope you\u2019ll be back with us again tomorrow when we\u2019re going to talk about what families need to keep in mind if they\u2019re on a journey like the one the Van Warners have been on, with someone in the family addicted to opioids. We\u2019ll talk about that tomorrow. I hope you can join us.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch, along with our entire broadcast production team. On behalf of our host, Dennis Rainey, I'm Bob Lepine. We will see you back next time for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas; a Cru<sup>\u00ae <\/sup>Ministry. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\n\t\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\tHelp for today. Hope for tomorrow.\n\t\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright <sup>\u00a9<\/sup> 2018 FamilyLife. 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Van Warner talks about his son's first trip to rehab, and his sorrow over his actions once he got out. But Tommy was hooked, and his behavior escalated. It's a \"cycle of madness\" for the Van Warner family.","meta_box":{"show_notes":"","transcript_url":"https:\/\/transcript.familylifetoday.com\/fl2018-10-02.pdf","transcript_content":"<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Why are so many people in our culture today addicted to opioids? That\u2019s a question Rick Van Warner began to explore when his son started abusing drugs.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> At the end of the day, the person who is seeking escape through opioids is trying to numb emotional pain. As my son described it to me once, \u201cI use when I don\u2019t want to feel any more\u2014I don\u2019t want to feel pain.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhen you put that together with the fact that there\u2019s a very inextricable link between opioid addiction and, in most cases, mental health as well\u2014in our son\u2019s case, he\u2019s got mild depression and been diagnosed with social anxiety. You put those two together, and the drugs are an escape from pain. It\u2019s a drug of isolation\u2014it\u2019s not a drug they do with their friends to go to a concert\u2014it\u2019s a drug that they do alone and then withdraw to a dark room. You know, what I mean? It\u2019s a drug of withdrawing from whatever psychological pain someone is facing.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>1:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> This is <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> for Tuesday, October 2<sup>nd<\/sup>. Our host is Dennis Rainey, and I'm Bob Lepine. What often looks like an escape from pain to an addict is really a pathway to destruction, as we\u2019ll learn more about today. Stay with us.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd welcome to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. Thanks for joining us. You know, when a family goes through a desperate season, like the one we\u2019re hearing about this week\u2014I think a lot of us\u2014our impulse is to want to hide this away and not let anybody know what we\u2019re experiencing, because there\u2019s shame tied to this.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> There is. What the Christian community needs to <em>really<\/em> understand\u2014when a family is dealing with\u2014a son, a daughter, or an extended family member, who is struggling with a drug addiction, or alcohol addiction, or maybe a porn addiction\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>2:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014<em>they<\/em> need a community, at that point, more than at any point in their lives. Honestly, Bob, the Christian community ought to be the one place\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> \u2014that they can turn to for encouragement, help, hope, and prayer\u2014and just a hug, occasionally. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> We have the author of a new book called <em>On Pills and Needles. <\/em>Rick Van Warner joins us again on <em>FamilyLife Today. <\/em>Rick, welcome back.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Thank you.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Rick tells the story, in this book, of his son, Tommy, who, for no apparent reason, just completely ended up being missing for four days\u2014finally found him in a corner of an abandoned building on the fourth or fifth day, and took him away to a rehab unit, and began the process of realizing they had a son, who had been addicted, at the age of 16, to narcotics. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tRick, you began to explain in your book how that was just the beginning of the story. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>3:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHow long was he in the rehab unit?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Well, the first one was only a few days\u2014it was only about a week before he was asked to leave that one; because he wasn\u2019t interested in being clean; he wasn\u2019t interested in complying with the rules. He had been convinced by some older people in the clinic to sneak out and buy them some cigarettes at a nearby convenience store in the middle of the night. He got caught and was asked to leave that facility.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think that, when we first found him and got him into that first detox facility, at that point, we had that hope that he would get it; and that this would\u2014we couldn\u2019t have even <em>fathomed<\/em>, at that point, that this would go on, now, for another decade, and that he would go through 14 relapses; that he would be, twice, resuscitated from death by overdose; that he would end up in jail on a couple of occasions for possession of drugs; that he would be homeless when we realized that we could no longer have him in our house, at certain points.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>4:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe tragedy and the journey has been long and treacherous; but I think you touched on something very important, which is the stigma that exists, particularly with opioids, which most people think of as heroin. Again, pill-form heroin is OxyContin and similar drugs. Because of that stigma that exists, a lot of people do keep that within the house. They try to hide this, as well as other family problems; because there are a lot of other problems that parents and families go through, and they try to withdraw and keep it in the house. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHonestly, that\u2019s about the worst thing you can do; because the more you share, the more you realize that other families are going through very similar struggles. If it\u2019s not drug addiction, it could be other addictions \/ it could be other problems.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhen you took Tommy to rehab\u2014I mean, he was stoned when you picked him up; right? He was still under the influence.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Sure.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>5:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> So, when he started to come out from under the influence, was he aware of what was going on? Was there any contrition? Was there any sense of: \u201cOh, man! What have I gotten myself into?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> He was always sorry\/always thankful; you know, his lovingness and his nature was there. These drugs rewire the brain chemistry in such a way that it takes almost a year of sobriety or more to start to repair and get those wirings back in order. It\u2019s tough for them, in that period, to understand the implications of their actions and of what they\u2019re doing to the others around them.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think that the more I\u2019ve read research on this\u2014on what opioids do to the brain\u2014and the more research that has been done\u2014frankly, you know, there\u2019s more research going on every day. If you consider that the brain is the last frontier of medical science, there\u2019s still so much that we don\u2019t know about how this works. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>6:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut I have come to understand that he cannot even begin to fathom what the impact is; because his brain is still in the place where he\u2019s got that craving, constantly, to relapse. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>There\u2019s something inside of him, even in the hospital \/ even in rehab, where he\u2019s just going, \u201cI\u2019ve got to get another\u2026\u201c\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Even as far as when you\u2019re sober for a year.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Wow!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> He had a full year of sobriety before he lost an old girlfriend to an overdose, and that set him off the deep end. That physical yearning for that drug\u2014once it\u2019s hijacked the brain once\u2014it remains for a long, long time.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> I think a lot of people don\u2019t realize that these rehab units really are effective in helping a young person\u2014or for that matter, an older person as well\u2014to deal with their issues and to come, face to face, with the kind of calamity they\u2019re causing. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhat most of us don\u2019t realize is that 80 percent of those who go through a rehab program end up relapsing. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Right; and they say\u2014there\u2019s an old saying that I\u2019ve learned, becoming a default expert on this subject, which is that: \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>7:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u201cRelapse is part of recovery.\u201d If you really look at the nature of the rehab programs, the success rates on alcoholics is said to be 15-20 percent\u2014can stay clean for a year. With drug addicts, it\u2019s 8-10 percent. And, supposedly, with opioid addicts\u2014and there is no hard, fast evidence on this\u2014it\u2019s probably less than 5 percent. It\u2019s a different animal, if you will, than even alcohol. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThere are a lot of good rehabs out there that do their best, and there are some that are effective. It\u2019s really up to the person, though\u2014it\u2019s person by person. And there are quite a few rehabs we\u2019ve run across, where they\u2019re clearly in it for the business.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Talk for a moment about the behavior of a person, who\u2019s an addict. One of the ways I\u2019ve heard them described is \u201c\u2026a liar, a deceiver, a manipulator\u201d\u2014always trying to figure out a way around any boundary that\u2019s put in their place.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Master manipulators; absolutely.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>8:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThey\u2019re absolute, pathological liars. When somebody is in the grips of opioid addiction, there isn\u2019t a word that they can say that you can trust. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> And the interesting thing is\u2014a parent has a heart full of love and hope for their child.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> So he or she is set up to believe the best about their son or daughter. The reality is\u2014that addict knows how to use that to his advantage.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Inherently, they know how to manipulate and deceive\u2014stealing from all of us. I mean, he stole from all of us in the family.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Well, you had an encounter with Tommy and a therapist, where you were believing your son and she wasn\u2019t; right?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Yes; we had one meeting with a therapist, a while back, who felt that he was just snowing us. My wife and I were both there; he challenged us to drug test him on the spot. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>9:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI left the therapy office\u2014and my wife was still there with him\u2014and went down to the Walgreens, and got a drug test kit. Sure enough, she was correct!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> \u2014in the midst of it?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> \u2014in the midst of it!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> What can\u2019t be described is the amount of chaos.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> It completely causes the family to be in a constant swirl.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> It is complete chaos in the house. You know, it creates dysfunction. You\u2019ve got three other children that you\u2019re trying to raise\u2014and are in the middle of it\u2014and exposed to things they shouldn\u2019t be exposed to. There\u2019s the bickering and the divide it puts between the spouses. It is just difficult. It was just\u2014it\u2019s like living in a cycle of madness\u2014is what I\u2019ve described it as, in a sense. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt\u2019s a miracle that our marriage survived, and we\u2019ve come through it; but we\u2019re both strong, and we never lost our faith. We continued to do what was best. I think it would have been a lot harder if we didn\u2019t have three other children, because we knew we had to do right by the three other children. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>10:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThat kept us in a normal life as much as possible; but there was always that issue of the addiction in our middle son, which kind of took all of the air out of the room.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Did you have a burden-bearer? Did you and your wife have another couple with whom you could go and share: \u201cYou know what? We think we\u2019re going crazy. We\u2019re at each other; the kids are at each other. This chaos is driving us mad. Would you just talk to us for a moment and breathe some truth into us?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Well, we had friends that we were willing to share with. Again, the worst thing is to carry this burden alone. When we started going to Nar-Anon meetings\u2014Narcotics Anonymous for families with addiction in them\u2014we started realizing we didn\u2019t feel so alone anymore. All of a sudden, the rooms were full\u2014and bigger and bigger\u2014with more and more people going through the same things. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAs time went by, we found ourselves in the role of counselors; because we were so much more experienced with it, at this point, than others. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>11:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThat first year of chaos is when it\u2019s the worst; because you just think: \u201cHow are we going to get through this? How are we going to survive?\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> And this is the kind of thing that, in normal life, you don\u2019t want anybody to know this is going on in your family. So, if somebody says: \u201cOh, so you\u2019ve got four kids. Tell me about your kids!\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> \u201cWell, we\u2019ve got one off at university; and we\u2019ve got the one, who is addicted to Oxy, and has been in and out of rehab.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Exactly.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> I mean, you don\u2019t want to even talk about this. Every time it comes up, you just want to go home and hide.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> It\u2019s the worst. And that is the worst approach too\u2014to try to just hide it. By going through these support groups and sharing with other families\u2014that was extremely helpful. We had some close friends. I had a brother in Christ that I happened to go through <em>The Man in the Mirror<\/em> with, right in the midst of all of this. That was <em>tremendously<\/em> helpful\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> \u2014to have somebody that <em>knew<\/em> all the pain and the despair we were in the midst of\u2014and how we\u2019re in this life-and-death struggle with trying to keep our son afloat. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>12:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou know, having that support\u2014and I had a men\u2019s small group that I would go to on a weekly basis as well. All of those interactions, collectively, were <em>tremendously<\/em> helpful to get through this.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> It\u2019s interesting\u2014in the midst of all this, you never stop being a parent.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Nope!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> You\u2019re still trying to help your child\u2014trying to figure out how to do that. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou opened the door, just a moment ago, for a crack; and then you kind of shut it. You said you and your wife switched roles.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> One parent can be an enabler, rescuing the child over and over again; the other parent can be solid and say, \u201cNo; this is not the right thing.\u201d You\u2019re at odds with each other in the midst of that; right?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Absolutely; and it was very interesting, to me, how we would switch roles. I mean, again, it wasn\u2019t contrived like a \u201cgood cop\/bad cop.\u201d There wasn\u2019t some script or some drama around it, but it did come out that way. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI would reach the end of the road, where I just couldn\u2019t take him anymore, and just said, \u201cHe can\u2019t be in our house.\u201d You know, \u201cIt\u2019s too detrimental to the rest of the children.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>13:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u201cOh, no!\u201d\u2014you know, my wife would be in the loving spot. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut then, we would flip\u2014six months might go by\u2014and the next time, she\u2019d be done with him; and I would say: \u201cNo; no! You don\u2019t understand.\u201d I think that yin and yang between the two of us is what allowed the family to survive\u2014and what really allowed our son to survive\u2014because the longer that time went by, the more I understood this concept of enabling. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhile I understand it and it makes sense\u2014this tough love concept\u2014they don\u2019t <em>really<\/em> apply when you\u2019re dealing with someone who\u2019s in the throes of opioid addiction\u2014and,\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI suspect, other types of narcotics that rewire the brain as well.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Explain why they don\u2019t apply.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Well, at the end of the day, the person who is seeking escape through opioids is trying to numb emotional pain. As my son described it to me once, \u201cI use when I don\u2019t want to feel any more\u2014I don\u2019t want to feel pain.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>14:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhen you put that together with the fact that there\u2019s a very inextricable link between opioid addiction and, in most cases, mental health as well\u2014in our son\u2019s case, he\u2019s got mild depression and been diagnosed with social anxiety. You put those two together, and the drugs are an escape from pain. It\u2019s a drug of isolation\u2014it\u2019s not a drug they do with their friends to go to a concert\u2014it\u2019s a drug that they do alone and then withdraw to a dark room. You know, it\u2019s a drug of withdrawing from whatever psychological pain someone is facing.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIf you stop there for a minute, what are we doing by just pushing them into the next rehab? We\u2019re kicking the can down the road; and we\u2019re making the person\u2014that we\u2019re throwing into the next facility\u2014even more isolated and feeling even more of a failure than they already are. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Rick, this was not your first encounter with an addict; because your brother had been a substance abuser; right?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>15:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> That\u2019s right. My brother fell into cocaine, although that was when he was in his 20s; and I didn\u2019t live with him. We didn\u2019t live in the same state, even.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> So I didn\u2019t really witness it much, but he did fall into cocaine abuse. He got clean and sober at 24, I think it was\u2014and is clean and sober to this day.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> There was a point in your progression with Tommy, where you thought, \u201cMaybe if he went and lived with his uncle, maybe they could get things worked out.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> We did. We sent him up there for a couple of different occasions, where my brother was generous enough to open his home to him. Having been down that road\u2014and \u201c90 meetings in 90 days\u201d\u2014and showed him that you can have a sober life, and still have fun, and these sorts of things\u2014that is tougher to get through when my son was, say, 19 or 20.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut again, I think that\u2014back to the tough love concept\u2014I think the point is\u2014you\u2019re further isolating somebody when you\u2019re kicking them out, and when you\u2019re putting them out on the street, or you\u2019re putting them into a rehab program. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>16:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCertainly, underage, we were able to do that\u2014he didn\u2019t have to stay once he was 18. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut, when you look at those approaches versus the approach that worked better for us in the end\u2014which was, essentially, detoxing and giving him the family\u2019s love and support at home\u2014worked out a lot better. He would recover quicker, and he would stay sober longer.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Rick, you mentioned, at the beginning of the broadcast\u2014and I almost gasped when you said it\u2014that this journey, in and out of rehab facilities, lasted a <em>decade<\/em>\u2014ten years! Comment, if you would, on the subculture of relapsing addicts, who go in and out of these rehab units. It really is like the passage of Scripture that warns us, \u201cBad company corrupts good morals.\u201d It\u2019s like your child\u2014even though he or she may be an adult or an emerging adult\u2014is going to be around other people, battling the same addiction.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>17:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Right; and it\u2019s not just the company they keep\u2014although it\u2019s <em>worse<\/em> if you\u2019re at a social system rehab\u2014then, there are people that are ordered there by the law. They have to be there, and they have no interest in staying clean. There are certainly people, who want to stay clean in rehabs, and those who don\u2019t. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI think the bigger thing is\u2014you\u2019re not going to cure somebody, who has a chronic brain disease like addiction from opioids, by just putting them in a program that teaches them how to look at the world differently in 30, 60, to 90 days. It just doesn\u2019t really\u2014it\u2019s an overly simplistic approach to a very complex problem. There\u2019s a reason that the success rates for opioid addicts in rehab is so low. Again, there are rehab facilities that are in it for the business.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Okay; so we\u2019ve got to talk about this; because there are folks, who are listening, who are right in the throes of this. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Sure.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>18:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> They\u2019ve got kids at home, who are disrupting everything about the household. The parents can hardly function in life because of all that this is presenting. They\u2019re hearing you say: \u201cYeah, rehab may not be the solution. Having them at home\u2014that is what worked for us.\u201d These parents are going: \u201cIt\u2019s not <em>safe<\/em> to have him at home! We can\u2019t function and have him at home!\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAre you saying, \u201cThat\u2019s the solution that we\u2019ve got to toughen up and go to\u201d?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> I\u2019m saying that there\u2019s no right or wrong\u2014or silver bullet\u2014on any of it. I think that rehab works for some; it doesn\u2019t work for a lot. I think that we have to fight and not give up. I think that some people\u2014it\u2019s a lot easier to just: \u201cOut of sight; out of mind. Let\u2019s just ship him off to a military school,\u201d \/ \u201cShip him off to a rehab facility.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tSo you start to say, \u201cThere has got to be a deeper problem here.\u201d That\u2019s when I really got into the understanding that this is\u2014you know, addiction is not only a substance problem\u2014it\u2019s also a deep psychological and brain problem.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>19:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> And it\u2019s also a heart issue of the child too.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Sure.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Spiritually speaking, talk about where Tommy was during this decade.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Well, he\u2019s spiritually connected with nature; but he has <em>never<\/em> connected with Christ.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> So, if I had met him at 15, he would not have said he was a Christian at that point?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Well, he would have at that point; but I think that he\u2019s become disillusioned with organized religion, basically.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> He meditates; and he has a belief in a sense of spiritual connection with the world\u2014not so much with a particular doctrine.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Did you get him in the Bible at all? Could you get him to read the Scriptures?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Not really. He\u2019s never really gone down that road. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> Even today?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> Even today. He\u2019s read some things, but he just\u2014that\u2019s part of the problem.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> He\u2019s still on a journey too.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> He is; he is. And I tell him, all of the time, that, you know: \u201cHe wouldn\u2019t be alive if God didn\u2019t have a plan for him,\u201d\u2014as many times as he\u2019s been on the brink of death from this addiction.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>20:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> And I would just say\u2014to the parents, who are dealing with this personally: \u201cThis is where you must stick to the church and people in the church\u2014not the institution\u2014but those who walk with God, who can remind you of the truth of the Bible. God is near the broken-hearted, and He does give wisdom to those who ask in faith.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tParents, like Rick and Maria, who go through this over a decade\u2014they are going to need some strong believers standing with them in the midst of this. Just because a young man doesn\u2019t respond does not mean he\u2019s hopeless! God is fully capable of getting this young man\u2019s attention.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis:<\/strong> And He\u2019s also capable of getting your child\u2019s attention as well. You just hope that it will occur sooner rather than later. But in the midst of this\u2014you know, I\u2019m just thinking of you, Rick and Maria\u2014ten years is a <em>long <\/em>time.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Rick:<\/strong> It is, but he\u2019s better today than he was then. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>21:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob:<\/strong> I know you would tell people, who are in this situation\u2014that you need to have other people around you. You need to be hearing the stories of others, who have been through this or are going through it, so you don\u2019t feel isolated \/ you don\u2019t feel alone. That\u2019s one of the things I think is so helpful about your book, because it takes people into your story. I think families that are dealing with this are going to benefit from just hearing how another family has gone through a very difficult season of time. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIf that\u2019s your family, or if you know someone\u2014you\u2019d like to get a copy of this book and pass it on to them\u2014go to FamilyLifeToday.com. You can order the book from us online. Again, our website is FamilyLifeToday.com. You can also order by calling 1-800-FL-TODAY. The title of the book, again, is <em>On Pills and Needles<\/em>: <em>The Relentless Fight to Save My Son from Opioid Addiction <\/em>by Rick Van Warner. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>22:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tOrder, online, at FamilyLifeToday.com; or call 1-800-358-6329\u2014that\u2019s 1-800-\u201cF\u201d as in family, \u201cL\u201d as in life, and then the word, \u201cTODAY.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou know, I think of the number of families that are struggling with situations like this\u2014whether it\u2019s opioid addiction or other kinds of drug addiction \/ alcohol addition\u2014things that happen in families that often leave us isolated from other people. One of the reasons we wanted to talk about this on <em>FamilyLife Today <\/em>is because we\u2019re committed to providing practical biblical help and hope for the issues facing marriages and families in our culture today.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe\u2019re grateful that there\u2019s a team of allies\u2014a team of you, who not only listen to this program, but who have said\u2014\u201cThis is important; and I want to be a part of helping to make this kind of information\/this kind of programming available for young couples, young families\u2014others who are going through this.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>23:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThose of you who support this ministry\u2014you are helping hundreds of thousands of people, every day, by making this program possible to be heard on local radio stations, on the internet, through our mobile app. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd now, you can tell Alexa to \u201cPlay <em>FamilyLife Today.<\/em>\u201d Build that skill into your Alexa app; and anytime you want to hear today\u2019s program, just ask Alexa to play it for you. If you need help setting that up, go to FamilyLifeToday.com; and we\u2019ve got information available there that can help you. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd if you want to help with a donation so that this program can continue to be available for your family and for other families, you can donate online at FamilyLifeToday.com; or you can call to donate: 1-800-FL-TODAY. Or you can mail your donation to <em>FamilyLife Today <\/em>at PO Box 7111, Little Rock, AR; and our zip code is 72223. By the way, when you donate, ask for your copy of the new 2019 FamilyLife<sup>\u00ae<\/sup> calendar. It\u2019s all about helping to build family togetherness in the new year\u2014 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>24:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014we\u2019ve got lots of togetherness tips. We\u2019ll just keep Scriptures and ideas for building togetherness in front of you, all year long. Ask for your copy of the calendar when you make a donation today. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd I hope you\u2019ll be back with us again tomorrow when we\u2019re going to talk about what families need to keep in mind if they\u2019re on a journey like the one the Van Warners have been on, with someone in the family addicted to opioids. We\u2019ll talk about that tomorrow. I hope you can join us.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch, along with our entire broadcast production team. On behalf of our host, Dennis Rainey, I'm Bob Lepine. We will see you back next time for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas; a Cru<sup>\u00ae <\/sup>Ministry. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\n\t\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\tHelp for today. Hope for tomorrow.\n\t\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright <sup>\u00a9<\/sup> 2018 FamilyLife. 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