{"id":300259,"date":"2018-06-11T11:00:00","date_gmt":"2018-06-11T15:00:00","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/%series%\/what-does-the-bible-say-about-sexuality\/"},"modified":"2024-10-07T22:41:25","modified_gmt":"2024-10-08T02:41:25","slug":"what-does-the-bible-say-about-sexuality","status":"publish","type":"podcast","link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/what-does-the-bible-say-about-sexuality\/","title":{"rendered":"What Does the Bible Say About Sexuality?"},"content":{"rendered":"","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Pastor Todd Wilson talks about God&#8217;s design for sexuality. Wilson challenges listeners to consider what God was doing when He intentionally created humans male and female.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":91,"featured_media":294104,"menu_order":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","template":"","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","inline_featured_image":false,"_uag_custom_page_level_css":"","episode_type":"","audio_file":"https:\/\/web.familylifetoday.com\/fl2018-06-11.mp3","cover_image":"","cover_image_id":"","duration":"00:24:55","filesize":"22.81M","filesize_raw":"23916098","date_recorded":"","explicit":"","block":""},"categories":[2848,2896,2815],"tags":[4414,4019,2976,4415],"podcast_series":[7221],"cwp_profile":[8835],"series":[2101],"class_list":["post-300259","podcast","type-podcast","status-publish","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-cultural-issues","category-lgbt","category-sexual-wholeness","tag-bible-verses-about-marriage","tag-biblical-marriage","tag-christian-marriage","tag-creationism","podcast_series-mere-sexuality","cwp_profile-todd-wilson","series-familylife-today"],"acf":[],"episode_featured_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/09\/FLT-Podcast-Cover-2-508x508-3.jpg?w=508","episode_player_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2023\/02\/image-scaled.jpg","download_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-download\/300259\/what-does-the-bible-say-about-sexuality","player_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-player\/300259\/what-does-the-bible-say-about-sexuality","audio_player":null,"episode_data":{"playerMode":"light","subscribeUrls":{"apple_podcasts":{"key":"apple_podcasts","url":"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303?mt=2&app=podcast","label":"Apple Podcasts","class":"apple_podcasts","icon":"apple-podcasts.png"},"google_podcasts":{"key":"google_podcasts","url":"","label":"Google Podcasts","class":"google_podcasts","icon":"google-podcasts.png"},"spotify":{"key":"spotify","url":"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm","label":"Spotify","class":"spotify","icon":"spotify.png"},"youtube":{"key":"youtube","url":"","label":"YouTube","class":"youtube","icon":"youtube.png"}},"rssFeedUrl":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/feed\/podcast\/familylife-today","embedCode":"<blockquote class=\"wp-embedded-content\" data-secret=\"b74yuVDLlm\"><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/what-does-the-bible-say-about-sexuality\/\">What Does the Bible Say About Sexuality?<\/a><\/blockquote><iframe sandbox=\"allow-scripts\" security=\"restricted\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/what-does-the-bible-say-about-sexuality\/embed\/#?secret=b74yuVDLlm\" width=\"500\" height=\"350\" title=\"&#8220;What Does the Bible Say About Sexuality?&#8221; &#8212; FamilyLife\u00ae - A Cru Ministry\" data-secret=\"b74yuVDLlm\" frameborder=\"0\" marginwidth=\"0\" marginheight=\"0\" scrolling=\"no\" class=\"wp-embedded-content\"><\/iframe><script>\n\/*! This file is auto-generated *\/\n!function(d,l){\"use strict\";l.querySelector&&d.addEventListener&&\"undefined\"!=typeof URL&&(d.wp=d.wp||{},d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage||(d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage=function(e){var t=e.data;if((t||t.secret||t.message||t.value)&&!\/[^a-zA-Z0-9]\/.test(t.secret)){for(var s,r,n,a=l.querySelectorAll('iframe[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),o=l.querySelectorAll('blockquote[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),c=new RegExp(\"^https?:$\",\"i\"),i=0;i<o.length;i++)o[i].style.display=\"none\";for(i=0;i<a.length;i++)s=a[i],e.source===s.contentWindow&&(s.removeAttribute(\"style\"),\"height\"===t.message?(1e3<(r=parseInt(t.value,10))?r=1e3:~~r<200&&(r=200),s.height=r):\"link\"===t.message&&(r=new URL(s.getAttribute(\"src\")),n=new URL(t.value),c.test(n.protocol))&&n.host===r.host&&l.activeElement===s&&(d.top.location.href=t.value))}},d.addEventListener(\"message\",d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage,!1),l.addEventListener(\"DOMContentLoaded\",function(){for(var e,t,s=l.querySelectorAll(\"iframe.wp-embedded-content\"),r=0;r<s.length;r++)(t=(e=s[r]).getAttribute(\"data-secret\"))||(t=Math.random().toString(36).substring(2,12),e.src+=\"#?secret=\"+t,e.setAttribute(\"data-secret\",t)),e.contentWindow.postMessage({message:\"ready\",secret:t},\"*\")},!1)))}(window,document);\n\/\/# sourceURL=https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-includes\/js\/wp-embed.min.js\n<\/script>\n"},"spectra_custom_meta":{"_wp_page_template":["default"],"transcript_url":["https:\/\/transcript.familylifetoday.com\/fl2018-06-11.pdf"],"audio_file":["https:\/\/web.familylifetoday.com\/fl2018-06-11.mp3"],"transcript_content":["<strong>Bob: <\/strong>In the midst of the current cultural debate over gender and sexuality, Pastor Todd Wilson says there is foundational, fundamental truth that needs to be held to firmly.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Being male and female\u2014having male- and female-sexed bodies, biologically\u2014is theologically significant and morally significant; that is to say, theologically, it matters to God\u2014God has a design in that that\u2019s significant. We should understand that it impacts everything about who we are in the world, and it\u2019s morally significant. It ought to shape our behavior; it ought to shape our interactions; shape our community; of course, shapes marriage. It\u2019s taking seriously this idea that we have been created in the image of God as male and female\u2014that\u2019s the essence of the Christian vision.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>This is <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> for Monday, June 11<sup>th<\/sup>. Our host is Dennis Rainey; I'm Bob Lepine. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>1:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhen the culture and the historic Christian church disagree on issues of gender and sexuality, where should we land? We\u2019ll talk about today. Stay with us.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd welcome to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. Thanks for joining us. I don\u2019t think we ever imagined we\u2019d be spending as much time exploring this subject as we have spent over the last couple of years and that we have to continue to spend; wouldn\u2019t you agree?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>I agree. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>2:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIn fact, who would have thought, when this ministry was started back in 1976\u2014that the battle would come, not only to marriage and family, but also to issues around male and female sexual identity. That\u2019s what our guest on today\u2019s program has written about. He\u2019s written a book called <em>Mere Sexuality<\/em>. Todd Wilson joins us on <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. Welcome, Todd.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Thank you; great to be here.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>We\u2019re thrilled to have you here. Todd\u2019s married to Katie for 21 years\u2014has seven children\u2014three bios and four adopted children from Ethiopia. There has to be a story you can tell quickly of\u2014did you get all four at once?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>No; we got them in pairs. There were two sets of siblings: two twin boys that we adopted when they were six months old; and then, when we were in Ethiopia to adopt the first pair, we were so overwhelmed with the needs to adopt older kids that we decided, as soon as we got back, that we needed to go back. A couple years later, we went back and adopted a six-year-old and an eight-year-old.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Well, Bob and I are pro-life and pro-adoption, which, by the way, I think are two sides of the same coin.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>3:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes; I agree.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>If you\u2019re going to be pro-life, you better be pro-adoption; because if you honor life, there are going to be some orphans who need a mom and a dad to care for [them].\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou\u2019re a senior pastor of Calvary Memorial Church in Oak Park, Illinois.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>You\u2019re in a big city, and you\u2019re taking on a big issue in a big city.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes; yes. It\u2019s a risky thing to do\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>It is. Why\u2019d you go after\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>\u2014particularly in Chicago and, especially, in Oak Park.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Exactly!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>It\u2019s not like you\u2019re in Wheaton; right? [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd:<\/strong> No, no, no; exactly; exactly. I used to be a Wheaton right before I came\u2014for a couple of years, pastoring a church in Wheaton before I was called to Calvary.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>So, why\u2019d you tackle the subject?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes; great question. When I came to Calvary\u2014let me lay this out, and I hope this isn\u2019t going to take too much time\u2014but when I originally came to Calvary, Calvary was known\u2014well, before I was even called and I was initially contacted, I did what any good person would do. I didn\u2019t exactly know about Calvary Memorial Church, and I didn\u2019t even know where Oak Park was. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>4:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI got online and I \u201cgoogled.\u201d And what I discovered was that\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Did you discover then that Paul Harvey went to church there?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>I didn\u2019t discover that till later. But what I discovered, after a little Google<sup>\u00ae<\/sup> searching about Oak Park and Calvary, is that Calvary was known, I don\u2019t think entirely fairly, but known as the \u201cgay-hating church\u201d in Oak Park\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Oh, wow.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>\u2014because my predecessor, to his credit, took some bold stands on sexuality in this <em>very<\/em> progressive community. The community reacted in a pretty hostile way. I could go into that story, but I won\u2019t; but anyway, so the church was sort of branded this way\u2014as this very large, conservative church in the heart of Oak Park that was the \u201cgay-hating\u201d church. This was the word out on the street, among the high school kids.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhen I came, I made the decision\u2014and some people disagreed with it\u2014I made the decision to not speak on the issue of homosexuality, even though I knew it was, obviously, a culturally-pressing issue, for a number of years\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>5:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014a kind of moratorium, personally imposed, on speaking to this issue until the demographic started changing in the congregation from boomers and some Gen-Xers to being filled with millennials. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhat I realized was that these younger Christians\u2014they didn\u2019t need to be told, \u201cHey, we should love homosexuals the way Jesus does.\u201d They needed to be told, \u201cHey, the historic Christian view on these things actually matters,\u201d because there was just such confusion and lack of awareness of the importance of the Christian vision\u2014theological vision of sexuality\u2014and even what the Bible taught. That was very arresting to me\u2014as a pastor, seeing the shift in my congregation\u2014and I thought, \u201cNow\u2019s the time to speak to this issue.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe book originally began as a sermon series I preached back in\u2014maybe it was 2015, I think; 2014?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>And you went back, in the sermon series and in the book, to kind of foundational issues\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>That\u2019s right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>6:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u2014rather than saying, \u201cLet\u2019s dive right in and talk about contemporary homosexuality.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>That\u2019s right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>You said, \u201cLet\u2019s talk about God\u2019s design for sexuality in the first place.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>That\u2019s exactly right. What I sensed was that what Christians needed was\u2014they needed a theological vision of human sexuality. There were a number of books out on the market at the time\u2014you know, a couple years ago\u2014on how to relate to homosexuals, which were helpful\u2014Chad Thompson being one of them. And then there were very good books; for example, Kevin DeYoung\u2019s onwhat the Bible really says about homosexuality. So, a kind of approach to it, pastorally\u2014you might say, relationally\u2014and then a biblical approach. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhat was missing was a theological vision of how\u2014not just what Leviticus says, or Romans says, or 1 Corinthians says\u2014but \u201cHow does Jesus\u2019s sexed-body relate to my sexed-body?\u201d and \u201cHow does male and female relate to my personal identity?\u201d and \u201cHow does sex relate to babies?\u201d \u201c\u2026relate to\u2026\u201d\u2014so on and so forth; so on and so forth\u2014all hugely important theological questions. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>7:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThat, it seemed to me, was missing. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhy that was important was\u2014what I saw with the younger millennial Christians that I was interacting with was what I call, in the book, a \u201closs of functional biblical authority,\u201d which is a way of saying that younger Christians are growing up in a world of \u201cpervasive, interpretive pluralism\u201d\u2014is the word that Christian Smith, the sociologist, uses\u2014which is to say, they know that there are good, Bible-believing, godly, Bible teachers who hold this view and then good folks that hold the <em>opposite<\/em> view; so they kind of, as it were, cancel each other out; so the Bible doesn\u2019t have any functional authority anymore. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u201cWhat does the Bible teach about homosexuality?\u201d If you ask a millennial, they\u2019ll say, \u201cWell, some people say it condemns it; other people say it condones it.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>So it\u2019s theology by multiple choice.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes; yes, or biblical exegesis by multiple choice. What needed to be brought to bear, in my view, was theology;\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Correct.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>8:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>\u2014because there are <em>compelling<\/em> <em>theological<\/em> reasons\u2014there\u2019s a compelling theological rationale for the traditional view of marriage and sex, and so on\u2014that\u2019s what I wanted to lay out.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Just to make sure that our listeners are clear on this, when you talk about the difference between looking at something biblically and looking at something theologically, explain that difference; because a lot of people say, \u201cAren\u2019t those the same thing?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes; great question. So, to look at the issue\u2014let\u2019s say, of homosexuality, biblically\u2014would be to say: \u201cWhat does the Bible <em>teach<\/em> about this question?\u201d\u2014\u201cWhere does the Bible speak to it, and what does the Bible teach about it?\u201d or \u201cWhere does the Bible indirectly speak to it, and what does the Bible teach about it?\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u201cSo let\u2019s look at Romans 1,\u201d \u201cLet\u2019s look at 1 Corinthians 6,\u201d\u2014that kind of thing; right?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Exactly. \u201cLet\u2019s do an exegesis of Genesis 1,\u201d and there are very good books that have covered that landscape.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tTo approach it, theologically, is to ask a little bit more about that deeper logic of: \u201cWhy do we have sexed bodies? What is God\u2019s design and purpose in all of this? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>9:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u201cWhy is it, when God created human beings in His image, He created them male and female?\u201d I mean, that\u2019s such a given for us; but that is <em>spectacular<\/em>, theologically.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u201cWhy not one\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>That\u2019s exactly right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u2014\u201cor why not seven?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>\u201cWhy are we not angels? Why are we not asexual beings? What\u2019s God up to?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tTo ask a theological question is more to ask, \u201cWhat is God up to?\u201d Of course, the Bible speaks to that, and the Bible has theology embedded everywhere; right? And the Bible is our starting point and our norm and guide for theological reflection, but it\u2019s asking slightly different questions.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>It\u2019s looking at something 30,000 feet as opposed to looking at something, walking through the forest, and looking at each tree; right?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes; yes. And what I wanted to help millennials see is\u2014you might even put it this way: \u201cOnce you understand the way Christians have thought, theologically, about human sexuality, then the question of gay marriage or the viability of homosexuality should be a no-brainer to you. Once you <em>see<\/em> the theological vision, it should be a no-brainer what the answer to it is.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>10:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>So, when you preached this, did people go: \u201cWell, duh! Okay; that makes perfect sense. Now that you\u2019ve explained it to us, we all get it; and\u2026\u201d\u2014because, if that\u2019s the case, let\u2019s go ahead and just put you on\u2014we\u2019ll buy some TV time tonight and<strong>\u2014<\/strong>[Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>That\u2019s right. I could be rich and famous!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>That\u2019s right! [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>It wasn\u2019t <em>quite<\/em> that simple, because sexuality is such a deeply personal issue. We can wax eloquent, theologically, about it all day long; we can talk about what the Bible teaches; but at the end of the day, this is <em>profoundly<\/em> personal for all of us.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Let\u2019s talk about that for a moment.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>What is a Christian view of sexuality?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes; great question.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>The reason I\u2019m asking this question is\u2014we have listeners who couldn\u2019t articulate that; but we have some parents who desperately need to know the answer to that question so they can help teach their sons and daughters\u2014maybe some grandparents who need to instruct their grandkids\u2014about \u201cWhat does the Bible say about this?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes; that\u2019s the essence of the book, Dennis. It\u2019s what I\u2019m trying to capture with the title, <em>Mere Sexuality<\/em>\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>11:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014that there has been an historic Christian consensus on this question for 2,000 years. Sometimes, you hear people say, \u201cChristians have always disagreed about this issue.\u201d That\u2019s patently not the case\u2014not since about the 1960s have Christians really disagreed about this. There\u2019s been a long-standing historic Christian consensus, rooted in the Bible, on the <em>essence<\/em> of what sexuality is\u2014a Christian view of sexuality. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt comes down to this: That being male and female\u2014having male- and female-sexed bodies, biologically\u2014is theologically significant and morally significant; that is to say, theologically, it matters to God\u2014God has a design in that that\u2019s significant. We should understand that it impacts everything about who we are in the world, and it\u2019s morally significant. It ought to shape our behavior; it ought to shape our interactions; shape our community; of course, shapes marriage. It\u2019s taking seriously this idea that we have been created in the image of God as male and female\u2014that\u2019s the essence of the Christian vision.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>12:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>So, if your son or your daughter came and asked this question: \u201cDaddy, what\u2019s it mean to be a girl and not a boy?\u201d or \u201cWhat\u2019s it mean to be a boy and not a girl, from a theological perspective, Daddy?\u201d\u2014how would you answer the question?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>That\u2019s a great question! I have three girls and four boys; so this has come up on more than one occasion, as you can imagine. I think I would begin, with a kid, very concretely, with your body.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>\u201cYour body, as a girl, is different than the body of a boy; and Mommy\u2019s body is different than Daddy\u2019s body,\u201d and \u201cI have facial hair,\u201d\u2014and so on. You know, you speak in age-appropriate ways, of course. I would start there, and ground their sense of identity and the way they approach this\u2014this is really key\u2014in something <em>objective<\/em>; that is to say, the physicality of our <em>bodies<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThis has been why our culture\u2019s in such a state of confusion\u2014is we have distanced ourselves from this <em>objective<\/em> reality of our physical bodies; and [today] the preeminent thing \/ the most important thing for people in trying to figure out what it means to be a man or a woman is how you feel inside.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>13:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Right. In fact, as you say that\u2014I read something earlier this year, and this had a profound shaping of how I\u2019ve been thinking about these issues and other issues. This author was saying that:\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYears ago, we said: \u201cWhat is true is what science reveals to us.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIn the modern age: \u201cWhat is true is what technology can demonstrate.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHe said,\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIn a post-modern age: \u201cWhat is true is, \u2018How do I feel about these things?\u2019\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u2014\u201cat the deepest, most profound level, that is true; so what science says is less true than how I feel about it.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>But this author said: \u201cNeither is as true as revelation; and as Christians, we begin with a presupposition that what science teaches, or what I think,\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>\u2014\u201cor what I feel\u201d\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u2014\u201cor what I feel are both subservient to what revelation says.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u201cMy thinking and my feeling are less true than what God has revealed.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>14:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIf we don\u2019t start with that as a framework, then we\u2019re going to be tossed to and fro by every wind of doctrine or emotion.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes, yes; I agree entirely. I would just want to add, with what God has revealed is where we start\u2014that God has revealed Himself in two books\u2014the book, the Bible, and the book of nature\u2014and that our bodies are part of the book of nature.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>I mean, again, Genesis 1:27\u2014we were created \u201cin the image of God; male and female He created them.\u201d Male and female\u2014the sexual distinction and complementarity of being a man and a woman\u2014is right at the heart of what it means to reflect the image of God; that\u2019s <em>amazing<\/em>. I don\u2019t think we\u2019ve reflected deeply enough on what that actually means and the implications of all of that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>And how are you helping your children to live, and to think, and to love people who aren\u2019t like them and who don\u2019t <em>think<\/em> like them?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Well, that\u2019s a big question. I\u2019ll just take a couple of stabs at the things that are coming right off the top of my head. I mean, one of the things we try to do, Dennis, is parent, not from a place of fear, but from a place of confidence. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>15:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt seems like a lot of parenting is motivated by fear, particularly as the Christian faith intersects with the secular world. You have a kid, who\u2019s in high school and all the rest of it; and mom and dad are at home worrying about what they\u2019re learning in science class, or sociology class, or whatever.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u2014or on the playground!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>\u2014or on the playground; yes, that\u2019s right; exactly.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>And let me just stop you there. That\u2019s what this broadcast is all about\u2014is giving parents the confidence to speak into their children\u2019s lives and say: \u201cYou know what? The Bible is not this ancient book that is irrelevant to today\u2019s issues! It speaks to them. Listen carefully to what it says!\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes. I love that; that\u2019s the burden behind the book I wrote, <em>Mere Sexuality<\/em>\u2014is to say: \u201cChristians do not need to be coy, or bashful, or embarrassed about what we hold to be true. It is <em>so compelling<\/em>; actually, it is so powerful, beautiful, compelling.\u201d We just need to cast a vision for it to help our own people\u2014our own families, and congregations, and so on\u2014see it and then commend it to the culture.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>16:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe\u2019ve tried to parent, not from a place of fear, but from a place of confidence. We try to prioritize people, and people\u2019s stories, and the complexity of their experiences alongside teaching truth. Now, this is the grace-truth balance. There are folks that are really strong on the truth side, but the grace side suffers. When the grace side suffers, people\u2014and their stories and their lived experiences\u2014it seems, to me, gets marginalized and suffers. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe try to wade in, you might say, to people\u2019s stories and experiences so that someone\u2014you know, one of our high school kids would come home and talk about [how] one of their friends declared themselves to be gay, or bisexual, or transgender\u2014let\u2019s say. Rather than\u2014with our body language or snide kind of exasperated comments\u2014doing this sort of thing in communicating to our kids\u2014we try to sort of wade into that and talk about the complexity of what that must be like for that child, and why that\u2019s difficult, and \u201cHow does Jesus enter into that?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>17:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThis is the kind of posture that we\u2019re trying to demonstrate to our kids.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe bigger vision for discipleship is\u2014we\u2019re trying to help our children be a faithful presence in the world\u2014not defensive against, as the primary posture\u2014but faithfully present within. They need to have confidence, and a willingness, and humility to enter into the <em>messiness<\/em> of life.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCan I say one other thing on this? The other thing we try to do is\u2014speak, very candidly, about sex\/sexuality\u2014and try to commend the beauty of all of it.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>We had a guest who said that moms and dads need to practice\u2014and I think this is right\u2014you need to practice your \u201cnot-shocked\u201d face\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes; yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u2014when your kids come home and say, \u201cSo this happened at school today\u2026\u201d You have to practice going, \u201cTell me more,\u201d\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes. I love it\u2014love that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u2014as opposed to, \u201cWhat?!\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>I love that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>I think that\u2019s exactly right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>The thing I like about what you\u2019re doing and what you\u2019re saying there is\u2014and you point this out in your book\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>18:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014you said the reason our attitudes have changed about homosexuality, so dramatically, is that people now know homosexuals\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>\u2014especially teenagers\u2014they have a face to it. And for a lot of baby boomers, who grew up in a conservative community, who didn\u2019t have a face\u2014they didn\u2019t know someone\u2014they didn\u2019t know the story\/the context. So, for many of us, it\u2019s been a lesson in loving.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes; yes!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>And I think this is really an opportunity for the church to show up\u2014and especially for parents to engage their kids to know how to practically love someone, who doesn\u2019t believe like you believe \/ doesn\u2019t behave like you behave\u2014and not be pious in it but genuinely engage in their story.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes; I agree entirely with that. I think our temptation, as Christians\u2014who are concerned with the truth of the Bible, and want to maintain orthodox convictions, and see the assault of the culture on those\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>19:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014I think we sometimes slip into thinking, \u201cIf I engage with humility and with a listening heart with someone I disagree with, I might compromise,\u201d or even doing that itself is a compromise. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut, I don\u2019t think the gospel is going to advance\u2014we\u2019re not going to commend the beauty of the gospel if we don\u2019t have a more humble, listening posture: \u201cHow do we love people we disagree with and disagree with us?\u201d\u00a0 I think the starting point for that is in humility, listening to their stories and their perspective rather than coming in, all guns blazing with <em>Mere Sexuality<\/em> and, \u201cYou have to get your stuff sorted out.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Tim Keller says our starting place on cultural engagement ought to be, \u201cThere is something I can learn from the culture.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Beautiful.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>When we start with that\u2014as opposed to, \u201cThe culture needs to learn from me,\u201d\u2014\u201cThere\u2019s something I can learn from the culture,\u201d\u2014that foundation of humility really does open up dialogue in a way that just coming in and saying, \u201cYou guys need to sit down and listen, because I have truth to unload for you,\u201d\u2014that\u2019s not going to work.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>I agree.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>20:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Todd, you see my Bible here. I have a very odd habit. I collect funeral programs of friends and family members that I\u2019ve been to their funerals, to remind me of how to live as long God gives me life. You can see this one; you recognize who that is on\u2014that one?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Oh, yes, of course; wow.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Chuck Colson.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>The reason I bring this up is really this topic of what we\u2019re talking about here. At his memorial service, which was in the heart of Washington, DC\u2014they stood up and shared about his life and the values and faith that marked his life. Here are four things that I wrote down about Chuck Colson\u2019s life that I think have application to us today around this subject, with our children, our grandchildren, and with our coworkers, and with people we relate to in the community.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tChuck Colson defended the weak. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>21:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHe lived a courageous life. He did his duty. He said, \u201cThere\u2019s work to be done,\u201d\u2014he was on mission.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>And then the last thing\u2014and this is what hit me as you were talking\u2014he was a friend of sinners, and even ate with them. [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>That is beautiful! [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Isn\u2019t that a great statement?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>That sounds like Jesus!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>It does; doesn\u2019t it? And of course, his life was marked by a ministry to prisoners.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Marvelous.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>And our lives ought to be marked by a ministry to prisoners too. We\u2019re <em>all<\/em> relating to people who are prisoners\u2014of addictions, of different sins, of a past\u2014who need to meet the Savior. You may be the closest thing to the love of God that they get next to in their lifetimes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>So the question is: \u201cWill they see Jesus in your life? Will they see the love of Christ and hear about the redemption of Christ and forgiveness of Christ?\u201d\u2014that\u2019s our message!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Amen.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>22:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>And will your grace and your love be grounded in an understanding of truth?\u2014just as you were saying. Are grace and truth both robust in your life, so that people can\u2019t deny either one about you because of the other? That\u2019s where I think to have your book, <em>Mere Sexuality<\/em>, is so helpful for people to frame this subject in a way where truth and grace are held up together. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe have copies of the book, <em>Mere Sexuality<\/em>, by our guest, Todd Wilson. You can order it from us online at FamilyLifeToday.com, or call to order: 1-800-FL-TODAY. Again, the title of the book, <em>Mere Sexuality: Rediscovering the Christian Vision of Sexuality<\/em>, by Todd Wilson. Order online at FamilyLifeToday.com, or call to order: 1-800-358-6329\u2014that\u2019s 1-800-\u201cF\u201d as in family, \u201cL\u201d as in life, and then the word, \u201cTODAY.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou know, this subject of intimacy and romance in marriage is something that your wife, Barbara, wrote about in the book that she wrote: <em>Letters to My Daughters<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>23:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt\u2019s a book that actually began as letters that Barbara was writing to daughters and daughters-in-law on the subject of marriage. It got expanded out into a book for, not just your daughters, but for all of our daughters. We\u2019re making that book available this month to any of our listeners who can help us with a donation to support the ongoing work of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>\u2014the cost of producing and distributing this program\u2014in fact, the cost of all that we do, here, at FamilyLife<sup>\u00ae<\/sup> is underwritten by those of you who are partners with us in making all of this happen. Every time you give a gift, you are helping extend the reach of this ministry so that more people can more regularly receive practical, biblical help and hope for their marriages and their families.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAgain, if you can help with a gift today, we\u2019d love to send you a copy of Barbara Rainey\u2019s book <em>Letters to My Daughters<\/em>. You can make your donation, online, at FamilyLifeToday.com; or call 1-800-FL-TODAY. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>24:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBe sure to request the book when you call us; or request the book when you write to us with a donation at <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>, PO Box 7111, Little Rock, AR; and our zip code is 72223.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNow, tomorrow, we\u2019re going to continue our conversation about the Christian vision of human sexuality and why it\u2019s so important for us in our day. Todd Wilson will be back with us tomorrow. I hope you can be back as well.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch, along with our entire broadcast production team. On behalf of our host, Dennis Rainey, I'm Bob Lepine. We will see you back next time for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas; a Cru<sup>\u00ae <\/sup>Ministry. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\n\t\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\tHelp for today. Hope for tomorrow.\n\t\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright <sup>\u00a9<\/sup> 2018 FamilyLife. All rights reserved.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/\">www.FamilyLife.com<\/a>\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\n\t\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\t1\n\t\t\t\t<\/p>"],"_seopress_titles_title":[""],"_seopress_titles_desc":[""],"_seopress_robots_index":[""],"duration":["00:24:55"],"show_notes":[""],"_thumbnail_id":["294104"],"filesize":["22.81M"],"filesize_raw":["23916098"],"_uag_css_file_name":["uag-css-300259.css"],"_uag_js_file_name":["uag-js-300259.js"],"_uag_page_assets":["a:9:{s:3:\"css\";s:82560:\".wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape-top svg{width: calc( 100% + 1.3px );}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape.uagb-container__shape-top .uagb-container__shape-fill{fill: rgba(51,51,51,1);}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape-bottom svg{width: calc( 100% + 1.3px );}.wp-block-uagb-container.uagb-block-e11dbe9f .uagb-container__shape.uagb-container__shape-bottom 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});\";s:18:\"current_block_list\";a:17:{i:0;s:14:\"uagb\/container\";i:1;s:12:\"core\/heading\";i:2;s:9:\"core\/html\";i:3;s:10:\"core\/group\";i:6;s:21:\"uagb\/advanced-heading\";i:7;s:14:\"uagb\/separator\";i:8;s:14:\"uagb\/icon-list\";i:9;s:20:\"uagb\/icon-list-child\";i:10;s:11:\"core\/search\";i:13;s:18:\"core\/legacy-widget\";i:16;s:10:\"uagb\/image\";i:17;s:17:\"core\/social-links\";i:18;s:16:\"core\/social-link\";i:19;s:14:\"core\/paragraph\";i:20;s:30:\"meta-box\/fl-conditional-blocks\";i:21;s:12:\"uagb\/buttons\";i:22;s:18:\"uagb\/buttons-child\";}s:8:\"uag_flag\";b:1;s:11:\"uag_version\";i:1776449018;s:6:\"gfonts\";a:1:{s:7:\"Default\";a:2:{s:10:\"fontfamily\";s:7:\"Default\";s:12:\"fontvariants\";a:0:{}}}s:10:\"gfonts_url\";s:71:\"\/\/fonts.googleapis.com\/css?family=Default&subset=latin&display=fallback\";s:12:\"gfonts_files\";a:0:{}s:14:\"uag_faq_layout\";b:0;}"]},"uagb_featured_image_src":{"full":["https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/09\/FLT-Podcast-Cover-2-508x508-3.jpg",508,508,false]},"uagb_author_info":{"display_name":"kfairris@familylife.com","author_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/author\/kfairrisfamilylife-com\/"},"uagb_comment_info":0,"uagb_excerpt":"Pastor Todd Wilson talks about God's design for sexuality. Wilson challenges listeners to consider what God was doing when He intentionally created humans male and female.","meta_box":{"show_notes":"","transcript_url":"https:\/\/transcript.familylifetoday.com\/fl2018-06-11.pdf","transcript_content":"<strong>Bob: <\/strong>In the midst of the current cultural debate over gender and sexuality, Pastor Todd Wilson says there is foundational, fundamental truth that needs to be held to firmly.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Being male and female\u2014having male- and female-sexed bodies, biologically\u2014is theologically significant and morally significant; that is to say, theologically, it matters to God\u2014God has a design in that that\u2019s significant. We should understand that it impacts everything about who we are in the world, and it\u2019s morally significant. It ought to shape our behavior; it ought to shape our interactions; shape our community; of course, shapes marriage. It\u2019s taking seriously this idea that we have been created in the image of God as male and female\u2014that\u2019s the essence of the Christian vision.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>This is <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> for Monday, June 11<sup>th<\/sup>. Our host is Dennis Rainey; I'm Bob Lepine. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>1:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhen the culture and the historic Christian church disagree on issues of gender and sexuality, where should we land? We\u2019ll talk about today. Stay with us.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAnd welcome to <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. Thanks for joining us. I don\u2019t think we ever imagined we\u2019d be spending as much time exploring this subject as we have spent over the last couple of years and that we have to continue to spend; wouldn\u2019t you agree?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>I agree. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>2:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIn fact, who would have thought, when this ministry was started back in 1976\u2014that the battle would come, not only to marriage and family, but also to issues around male and female sexual identity. That\u2019s what our guest on today\u2019s program has written about. He\u2019s written a book called <em>Mere Sexuality<\/em>. Todd Wilson joins us on <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. Welcome, Todd.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Thank you; great to be here.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>We\u2019re thrilled to have you here. Todd\u2019s married to Katie for 21 years\u2014has seven children\u2014three bios and four adopted children from Ethiopia. There has to be a story you can tell quickly of\u2014did you get all four at once?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>No; we got them in pairs. There were two sets of siblings: two twin boys that we adopted when they were six months old; and then, when we were in Ethiopia to adopt the first pair, we were so overwhelmed with the needs to adopt older kids that we decided, as soon as we got back, that we needed to go back. A couple years later, we went back and adopted a six-year-old and an eight-year-old.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Well, Bob and I are pro-life and pro-adoption, which, by the way, I think are two sides of the same coin.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>3:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes; I agree.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>If you\u2019re going to be pro-life, you better be pro-adoption; because if you honor life, there are going to be some orphans who need a mom and a dad to care for [them].\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou\u2019re a senior pastor of Calvary Memorial Church in Oak Park, Illinois.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>You\u2019re in a big city, and you\u2019re taking on a big issue in a big city.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes; yes. It\u2019s a risky thing to do\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>It is. Why\u2019d you go after\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>\u2014particularly in Chicago and, especially, in Oak Park.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Exactly!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>It\u2019s not like you\u2019re in Wheaton; right? [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd:<\/strong> No, no, no; exactly; exactly. I used to be a Wheaton right before I came\u2014for a couple of years, pastoring a church in Wheaton before I was called to Calvary.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>So, why\u2019d you tackle the subject?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes; great question. When I came to Calvary\u2014let me lay this out, and I hope this isn\u2019t going to take too much time\u2014but when I originally came to Calvary, Calvary was known\u2014well, before I was even called and I was initially contacted, I did what any good person would do. I didn\u2019t exactly know about Calvary Memorial Church, and I didn\u2019t even know where Oak Park was. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>4:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI got online and I \u201cgoogled.\u201d And what I discovered was that\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Did you discover then that Paul Harvey went to church there?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>I didn\u2019t discover that till later. But what I discovered, after a little Google<sup>\u00ae<\/sup> searching about Oak Park and Calvary, is that Calvary was known, I don\u2019t think entirely fairly, but known as the \u201cgay-hating church\u201d in Oak Park\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Oh, wow.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>\u2014because my predecessor, to his credit, took some bold stands on sexuality in this <em>very<\/em> progressive community. The community reacted in a pretty hostile way. I could go into that story, but I won\u2019t; but anyway, so the church was sort of branded this way\u2014as this very large, conservative church in the heart of Oak Park that was the \u201cgay-hating\u201d church. This was the word out on the street, among the high school kids.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhen I came, I made the decision\u2014and some people disagreed with it\u2014I made the decision to not speak on the issue of homosexuality, even though I knew it was, obviously, a culturally-pressing issue, for a number of years\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>5:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014a kind of moratorium, personally imposed, on speaking to this issue until the demographic started changing in the congregation from boomers and some Gen-Xers to being filled with millennials. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhat I realized was that these younger Christians\u2014they didn\u2019t need to be told, \u201cHey, we should love homosexuals the way Jesus does.\u201d They needed to be told, \u201cHey, the historic Christian view on these things actually matters,\u201d because there was just such confusion and lack of awareness of the importance of the Christian vision\u2014theological vision of sexuality\u2014and even what the Bible taught. That was very arresting to me\u2014as a pastor, seeing the shift in my congregation\u2014and I thought, \u201cNow\u2019s the time to speak to this issue.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe book originally began as a sermon series I preached back in\u2014maybe it was 2015, I think; 2014?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>And you went back, in the sermon series and in the book, to kind of foundational issues\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>That\u2019s right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>6:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u2014rather than saying, \u201cLet\u2019s dive right in and talk about contemporary homosexuality.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>That\u2019s right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>You said, \u201cLet\u2019s talk about God\u2019s design for sexuality in the first place.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>That\u2019s exactly right. What I sensed was that what Christians needed was\u2014they needed a theological vision of human sexuality. There were a number of books out on the market at the time\u2014you know, a couple years ago\u2014on how to relate to homosexuals, which were helpful\u2014Chad Thompson being one of them. And then there were very good books; for example, Kevin DeYoung\u2019s onwhat the Bible really says about homosexuality. So, a kind of approach to it, pastorally\u2014you might say, relationally\u2014and then a biblical approach. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhat was missing was a theological vision of how\u2014not just what Leviticus says, or Romans says, or 1 Corinthians says\u2014but \u201cHow does Jesus\u2019s sexed-body relate to my sexed-body?\u201d and \u201cHow does male and female relate to my personal identity?\u201d and \u201cHow does sex relate to babies?\u201d \u201c\u2026relate to\u2026\u201d\u2014so on and so forth; so on and so forth\u2014all hugely important theological questions. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>7:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThat, it seemed to me, was missing. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWhy that was important was\u2014what I saw with the younger millennial Christians that I was interacting with was what I call, in the book, a \u201closs of functional biblical authority,\u201d which is a way of saying that younger Christians are growing up in a world of \u201cpervasive, interpretive pluralism\u201d\u2014is the word that Christian Smith, the sociologist, uses\u2014which is to say, they know that there are good, Bible-believing, godly, Bible teachers who hold this view and then good folks that hold the <em>opposite<\/em> view; so they kind of, as it were, cancel each other out; so the Bible doesn\u2019t have any functional authority anymore. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u201cWhat does the Bible teach about homosexuality?\u201d If you ask a millennial, they\u2019ll say, \u201cWell, some people say it condemns it; other people say it condones it.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>So it\u2019s theology by multiple choice.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes; yes, or biblical exegesis by multiple choice. What needed to be brought to bear, in my view, was theology;\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Correct.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>8:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>\u2014because there are <em>compelling<\/em> <em>theological<\/em> reasons\u2014there\u2019s a compelling theological rationale for the traditional view of marriage and sex, and so on\u2014that\u2019s what I wanted to lay out.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Just to make sure that our listeners are clear on this, when you talk about the difference between looking at something biblically and looking at something theologically, explain that difference; because a lot of people say, \u201cAren\u2019t those the same thing?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes; great question. So, to look at the issue\u2014let\u2019s say, of homosexuality, biblically\u2014would be to say: \u201cWhat does the Bible <em>teach<\/em> about this question?\u201d\u2014\u201cWhere does the Bible speak to it, and what does the Bible teach about it?\u201d or \u201cWhere does the Bible indirectly speak to it, and what does the Bible teach about it?\u201d\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u201cSo let\u2019s look at Romans 1,\u201d \u201cLet\u2019s look at 1 Corinthians 6,\u201d\u2014that kind of thing; right?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Exactly. \u201cLet\u2019s do an exegesis of Genesis 1,\u201d and there are very good books that have covered that landscape.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tTo approach it, theologically, is to ask a little bit more about that deeper logic of: \u201cWhy do we have sexed bodies? What is God\u2019s design and purpose in all of this? \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>9:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u201cWhy is it, when God created human beings in His image, He created them male and female?\u201d I mean, that\u2019s such a given for us; but that is <em>spectacular<\/em>, theologically.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u201cWhy not one\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>That\u2019s exactly right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u2014\u201cor why not seven?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>\u201cWhy are we not angels? Why are we not asexual beings? What\u2019s God up to?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tTo ask a theological question is more to ask, \u201cWhat is God up to?\u201d Of course, the Bible speaks to that, and the Bible has theology embedded everywhere; right? And the Bible is our starting point and our norm and guide for theological reflection, but it\u2019s asking slightly different questions.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>It\u2019s looking at something 30,000 feet as opposed to looking at something, walking through the forest, and looking at each tree; right?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes; yes. And what I wanted to help millennials see is\u2014you might even put it this way: \u201cOnce you understand the way Christians have thought, theologically, about human sexuality, then the question of gay marriage or the viability of homosexuality should be a no-brainer to you. Once you <em>see<\/em> the theological vision, it should be a no-brainer what the answer to it is.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>10:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>So, when you preached this, did people go: \u201cWell, duh! Okay; that makes perfect sense. Now that you\u2019ve explained it to us, we all get it; and\u2026\u201d\u2014because, if that\u2019s the case, let\u2019s go ahead and just put you on\u2014we\u2019ll buy some TV time tonight and<strong>\u2014<\/strong>[Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>That\u2019s right. I could be rich and famous!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>That\u2019s right! [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>It wasn\u2019t <em>quite<\/em> that simple, because sexuality is such a deeply personal issue. We can wax eloquent, theologically, about it all day long; we can talk about what the Bible teaches; but at the end of the day, this is <em>profoundly<\/em> personal for all of us.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Let\u2019s talk about that for a moment.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>What is a Christian view of sexuality?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes; great question.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>The reason I\u2019m asking this question is\u2014we have listeners who couldn\u2019t articulate that; but we have some parents who desperately need to know the answer to that question so they can help teach their sons and daughters\u2014maybe some grandparents who need to instruct their grandkids\u2014about \u201cWhat does the Bible say about this?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes; that\u2019s the essence of the book, Dennis. It\u2019s what I\u2019m trying to capture with the title, <em>Mere Sexuality<\/em>\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>11:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014that there has been an historic Christian consensus on this question for 2,000 years. Sometimes, you hear people say, \u201cChristians have always disagreed about this issue.\u201d That\u2019s patently not the case\u2014not since about the 1960s have Christians really disagreed about this. There\u2019s been a long-standing historic Christian consensus, rooted in the Bible, on the <em>essence<\/em> of what sexuality is\u2014a Christian view of sexuality. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt comes down to this: That being male and female\u2014having male- and female-sexed bodies, biologically\u2014is theologically significant and morally significant; that is to say, theologically, it matters to God\u2014God has a design in that that\u2019s significant. We should understand that it impacts everything about who we are in the world, and it\u2019s morally significant. It ought to shape our behavior; it ought to shape our interactions; shape our community; of course, shapes marriage. It\u2019s taking seriously this idea that we have been created in the image of God as male and female\u2014that\u2019s the essence of the Christian vision.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>12:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>So, if your son or your daughter came and asked this question: \u201cDaddy, what\u2019s it mean to be a girl and not a boy?\u201d or \u201cWhat\u2019s it mean to be a boy and not a girl, from a theological perspective, Daddy?\u201d\u2014how would you answer the question?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>That\u2019s a great question! I have three girls and four boys; so this has come up on more than one occasion, as you can imagine. I think I would begin, with a kid, very concretely, with your body.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>\u201cYour body, as a girl, is different than the body of a boy; and Mommy\u2019s body is different than Daddy\u2019s body,\u201d and \u201cI have facial hair,\u201d\u2014and so on. You know, you speak in age-appropriate ways, of course. I would start there, and ground their sense of identity and the way they approach this\u2014this is really key\u2014in something <em>objective<\/em>; that is to say, the physicality of our <em>bodies<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThis has been why our culture\u2019s in such a state of confusion\u2014is we have distanced ourselves from this <em>objective<\/em> reality of our physical bodies; and [today] the preeminent thing \/ the most important thing for people in trying to figure out what it means to be a man or a woman is how you feel inside.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>13:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Right. In fact, as you say that\u2014I read something earlier this year, and this had a profound shaping of how I\u2019ve been thinking about these issues and other issues. This author was saying that:\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYears ago, we said: \u201cWhat is true is what science reveals to us.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIn the modern age: \u201cWhat is true is what technology can demonstrate.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHe said,\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIn a post-modern age: \u201cWhat is true is, \u2018How do I feel about these things?\u2019\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u2014\u201cat the deepest, most profound level, that is true; so what science says is less true than how I feel about it.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>But this author said: \u201cNeither is as true as revelation; and as Christians, we begin with a presupposition that what science teaches, or what I think,\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>\u2014\u201cor what I feel\u201d\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u2014\u201cor what I feel are both subservient to what revelation says.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u201cMy thinking and my feeling are less true than what God has revealed.\u201d \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>14:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIf we don\u2019t start with that as a framework, then we\u2019re going to be tossed to and fro by every wind of doctrine or emotion.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes, yes; I agree entirely. I would just want to add, with what God has revealed is where we start\u2014that God has revealed Himself in two books\u2014the book, the Bible, and the book of nature\u2014and that our bodies are part of the book of nature.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>I mean, again, Genesis 1:27\u2014we were created \u201cin the image of God; male and female He created them.\u201d Male and female\u2014the sexual distinction and complementarity of being a man and a woman\u2014is right at the heart of what it means to reflect the image of God; that\u2019s <em>amazing<\/em>. I don\u2019t think we\u2019ve reflected deeply enough on what that actually means and the implications of all of that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>And how are you helping your children to live, and to think, and to love people who aren\u2019t like them and who don\u2019t <em>think<\/em> like them?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Well, that\u2019s a big question. I\u2019ll just take a couple of stabs at the things that are coming right off the top of my head. I mean, one of the things we try to do, Dennis, is parent, not from a place of fear, but from a place of confidence. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>15:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt seems like a lot of parenting is motivated by fear, particularly as the Christian faith intersects with the secular world. You have a kid, who\u2019s in high school and all the rest of it; and mom and dad are at home worrying about what they\u2019re learning in science class, or sociology class, or whatever.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u2014or on the playground!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>\u2014or on the playground; yes, that\u2019s right; exactly.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>And let me just stop you there. That\u2019s what this broadcast is all about\u2014is giving parents the confidence to speak into their children\u2019s lives and say: \u201cYou know what? The Bible is not this ancient book that is irrelevant to today\u2019s issues! It speaks to them. Listen carefully to what it says!\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes. I love that; that\u2019s the burden behind the book I wrote, <em>Mere Sexuality<\/em>\u2014is to say: \u201cChristians do not need to be coy, or bashful, or embarrassed about what we hold to be true. It is <em>so compelling<\/em>; actually, it is so powerful, beautiful, compelling.\u201d We just need to cast a vision for it to help our own people\u2014our own families, and congregations, and so on\u2014see it and then commend it to the culture.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>16:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe\u2019ve tried to parent, not from a place of fear, but from a place of confidence. We try to prioritize people, and people\u2019s stories, and the complexity of their experiences alongside teaching truth. Now, this is the grace-truth balance. There are folks that are really strong on the truth side, but the grace side suffers. When the grace side suffers, people\u2014and their stories and their lived experiences\u2014it seems, to me, gets marginalized and suffers. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe try to wade in, you might say, to people\u2019s stories and experiences so that someone\u2014you know, one of our high school kids would come home and talk about [how] one of their friends declared themselves to be gay, or bisexual, or transgender\u2014let\u2019s say. Rather than\u2014with our body language or snide kind of exasperated comments\u2014doing this sort of thing in communicating to our kids\u2014we try to sort of wade into that and talk about the complexity of what that must be like for that child, and why that\u2019s difficult, and \u201cHow does Jesus enter into that?\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>17:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThis is the kind of posture that we\u2019re trying to demonstrate to our kids.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tThe bigger vision for discipleship is\u2014we\u2019re trying to help our children be a faithful presence in the world\u2014not defensive against, as the primary posture\u2014but faithfully present within. They need to have confidence, and a willingness, and humility to enter into the <em>messiness<\/em> of life.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCan I say one other thing on this? The other thing we try to do is\u2014speak, very candidly, about sex\/sexuality\u2014and try to commend the beauty of all of it.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>We had a guest who said that moms and dads need to practice\u2014and I think this is right\u2014you need to practice your \u201cnot-shocked\u201d face\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes; yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u2014when your kids come home and say, \u201cSo this happened at school today\u2026\u201d You have to practice going, \u201cTell me more,\u201d\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes. I love it\u2014love that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>\u2014as opposed to, \u201cWhat?!\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>I love that.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>I think that\u2019s exactly right.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>The thing I like about what you\u2019re doing and what you\u2019re saying there is\u2014and you point this out in your book\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>18:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014you said the reason our attitudes have changed about homosexuality, so dramatically, is that people now know homosexuals\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>\u2014especially teenagers\u2014they have a face to it. And for a lot of baby boomers, who grew up in a conservative community, who didn\u2019t have a face\u2014they didn\u2019t know someone\u2014they didn\u2019t know the story\/the context. So, for many of us, it\u2019s been a lesson in loving.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes; yes!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>And I think this is really an opportunity for the church to show up\u2014and especially for parents to engage their kids to know how to practically love someone, who doesn\u2019t believe like you believe \/ doesn\u2019t behave like you behave\u2014and not be pious in it but genuinely engage in their story.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes; I agree entirely with that. I think our temptation, as Christians\u2014who are concerned with the truth of the Bible, and want to maintain orthodox convictions, and see the assault of the culture on those\u2014\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>19:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\u2014I think we sometimes slip into thinking, \u201cIf I engage with humility and with a listening heart with someone I disagree with, I might compromise,\u201d or even doing that itself is a compromise. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBut, I don\u2019t think the gospel is going to advance\u2014we\u2019re not going to commend the beauty of the gospel if we don\u2019t have a more humble, listening posture: \u201cHow do we love people we disagree with and disagree with us?\u201d\u00a0 I think the starting point for that is in humility, listening to their stories and their perspective rather than coming in, all guns blazing with <em>Mere Sexuality<\/em> and, \u201cYou have to get your stuff sorted out.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>Tim Keller says our starting place on cultural engagement ought to be, \u201cThere is something I can learn from the culture.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Beautiful.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>When we start with that\u2014as opposed to, \u201cThe culture needs to learn from me,\u201d\u2014\u201cThere\u2019s something I can learn from the culture,\u201d\u2014that foundation of humility really does open up dialogue in a way that just coming in and saying, \u201cYou guys need to sit down and listen, because I have truth to unload for you,\u201d\u2014that\u2019s not going to work.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>I agree.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>20:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Todd, you see my Bible here. I have a very odd habit. I collect funeral programs of friends and family members that I\u2019ve been to their funerals, to remind me of how to live as long God gives me life. You can see this one; you recognize who that is on\u2014that one?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Oh, yes, of course; wow.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Chuck Colson.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>The reason I bring this up is really this topic of what we\u2019re talking about here. At his memorial service, which was in the heart of Washington, DC\u2014they stood up and shared about his life and the values and faith that marked his life. Here are four things that I wrote down about Chuck Colson\u2019s life that I think have application to us today around this subject, with our children, our grandchildren, and with our coworkers, and with people we relate to in the community.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tChuck Colson defended the weak. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>21:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tHe lived a courageous life. He did his duty. He said, \u201cThere\u2019s work to be done,\u201d\u2014he was on mission.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>And then the last thing\u2014and this is what hit me as you were talking\u2014he was a friend of sinners, and even ate with them. [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>That is beautiful! [Laughter]\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>Isn\u2019t that a great statement?\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>That sounds like Jesus!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>It does; doesn\u2019t it? And of course, his life was marked by a ministry to prisoners.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Marvelous.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>And our lives ought to be marked by a ministry to prisoners too. We\u2019re <em>all<\/em> relating to people who are prisoners\u2014of addictions, of different sins, of a past\u2014who need to meet the Savior. You may be the closest thing to the love of God that they get next to in their lifetimes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Yes.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Dennis: <\/strong>So the question is: \u201cWill they see Jesus in your life? Will they see the love of Christ and hear about the redemption of Christ and forgiveness of Christ?\u201d\u2014that\u2019s our message!\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Todd: <\/strong>Amen.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>22:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>Bob: <\/strong>And will your grace and your love be grounded in an understanding of truth?\u2014just as you were saying. Are grace and truth both robust in your life, so that people can\u2019t deny either one about you because of the other? That\u2019s where I think to have your book, <em>Mere Sexuality<\/em>, is so helpful for people to frame this subject in a way where truth and grace are held up together. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe have copies of the book, <em>Mere Sexuality<\/em>, by our guest, Todd Wilson. You can order it from us online at FamilyLifeToday.com, or call to order: 1-800-FL-TODAY. Again, the title of the book, <em>Mere Sexuality: Rediscovering the Christian Vision of Sexuality<\/em>, by Todd Wilson. Order online at FamilyLifeToday.com, or call to order: 1-800-358-6329\u2014that\u2019s 1-800-\u201cF\u201d as in family, \u201cL\u201d as in life, and then the word, \u201cTODAY.\u201d\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tYou know, this subject of intimacy and romance in marriage is something that your wife, Barbara, wrote about in the book that she wrote: <em>Letters to My Daughters<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>23:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tIt\u2019s a book that actually began as letters that Barbara was writing to daughters and daughters-in-law on the subject of marriage. It got expanded out into a book for, not just your daughters, but for all of our daughters. We\u2019re making that book available this month to any of our listeners who can help us with a donation to support the ongoing work of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>\u2014the cost of producing and distributing this program\u2014in fact, the cost of all that we do, here, at FamilyLife<sup>\u00ae<\/sup> is underwritten by those of you who are partners with us in making all of this happen. Every time you give a gift, you are helping extend the reach of this ministry so that more people can more regularly receive practical, biblical help and hope for their marriages and their families.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tAgain, if you can help with a gift today, we\u2019d love to send you a copy of Barbara Rainey\u2019s book <em>Letters to My Daughters<\/em>. You can make your donation, online, at FamilyLifeToday.com; or call 1-800-FL-TODAY. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>24:00<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tBe sure to request the book when you call us; or request the book when you write to us with a donation at <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>, PO Box 7111, Little Rock, AR; and our zip code is 72223.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tNow, tomorrow, we\u2019re going to continue our conversation about the Christian vision of human sexuality and why it\u2019s so important for us in our day. Todd Wilson will be back with us tomorrow. I hope you can be back as well.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tI want to thank our engineer today, Keith Lynch, along with our entire broadcast production team. On behalf of our host, Dennis Rainey, I'm Bob Lepine. We will see you back next time for another edition of <em>FamilyLife Today<\/em>. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<em>FamilyLife Today<\/em> is a production of FamilyLife of Little Rock, Arkansas; a Cru<sup>\u00ae <\/sup>Ministry. \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\n\t\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\tHelp for today. Hope for tomorrow.\n\t\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\t<strong>\u00a0<\/strong>\n\t\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tWe are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider <a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/donate\">donating today<\/a> to help defray the costs?\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\tCopyright <sup>\u00a9<\/sup> 2018 FamilyLife. All rights reserved.\n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t<a href=\"http:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/\">www.FamilyLife.com<\/a>\u00a0 \n\t\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\n\t\t\t\t<p>\n\t\t\t\t\t1\n\t\t\t\t<\/p>","theme_header_position":"","post_header_is_sticky":"","is_header_overlay":""},"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast\/300259","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/podcast"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/91"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=300259"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/294104"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=300259"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=300259"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=300259"},{"taxonomy":"podcast_series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast_series?post=300259"},{"taxonomy":"cwp_profile","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/cwp_profile?post=300259"},{"taxonomy":"series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/series?post=300259"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}