{"id":286834,"date":"2024-08-16T08:00:00","date_gmt":"2024-08-16T08:42:57","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/no-fear-in-death-dennis-barbara-rainey\/"},"modified":"2025-06-10T16:53:01","modified_gmt":"2025-06-10T20:53:01","slug":"no-fear-in-death-dennis-barbara-rainey","status":"publish","type":"podcast","link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/no-fear-in-death-dennis-barbara-rainey\/","title":{"rendered":"No Fear in Death: Dennis &#038; Barbara Rainey"},"content":{"rendered":"<p>Do you fear getting older? Tune in as Dennis &#038; Barbara Rainey share how &#8220;no fear in death&#8221; fuels their desire to live purposefully.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Do you fear getting older? Tune in as Dennis &#038; Barbara Rainey share how &#8220;no fear in death&#8221; fuels their desire to live purposefully.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":47000,"featured_media":280865,"menu_order":0,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"closed","template":"","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","inline_featured_image":false,"_uag_custom_page_level_css":"","episode_type":"audio","audio_file":"https:\/\/traffic.omny.fm\/d\/clips\/cbd16f10-ac60-4f09-b4df-b15400ce35aa\/33aaac7e-3581-4e21-a3df-b154011ba58c\/7cb75dfa-eed2-4a42-bb4e-b1c90152cf19\/audio.mp3","cover_image":"","cover_image_id":"","duration":"00:27:02","filesize":"24.79M","filesize_raw":"","date_recorded":"2024-08-16 08:00:00","explicit":"","block":""},"categories":[2847,2913],"tags":[2794],"podcast_series":[8786],"cwp_profile":[3051],"series":[2101],"class_list":["post-286834","podcast","type-podcast","status-publish","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-death-and-dying","category-empty-nest-and-midlife","tag-fear-in-death","podcast_series-growing-older-without-growing-old-dennis-barbara-rainey","cwp_profile-dennis-and-barbara-rainey","series-familylife-today"],"acf":[],"episode_featured_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/06\/image-scaled.jpg?w=1024","episode_player_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2023\/02\/image-scaled.jpg","download_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-download\/286834\/no-fear-in-death-dennis-barbara-rainey","player_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-player\/286834\/no-fear-in-death-dennis-barbara-rainey","audio_player":null,"episode_data":{"playerMode":"light","subscribeUrls":{"apple_podcasts":{"key":"apple_podcasts","url":"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303?mt=2&app=podcast","label":"Apple Podcasts","class":"apple_podcasts","icon":"apple-podcasts.png"},"google_podcasts":{"key":"google_podcasts","url":"","label":"Google Podcasts","class":"google_podcasts","icon":"google-podcasts.png"},"spotify":{"key":"spotify","url":"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm","label":"Spotify","class":"spotify","icon":"spotify.png"},"youtube":{"key":"youtube","url":"","label":"YouTube","class":"youtube","icon":"youtube.png"}},"rssFeedUrl":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/feed\/podcast\/familylife-today","embedCode":"<blockquote class=\"wp-embedded-content\" data-secret=\"ZIrlneYqGT\"><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/no-fear-in-death-dennis-barbara-rainey\/\">No Fear in Death: Dennis &#038; Barbara Rainey<\/a><\/blockquote><iframe sandbox=\"allow-scripts\" security=\"restricted\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/no-fear-in-death-dennis-barbara-rainey\/embed\/#?secret=ZIrlneYqGT\" width=\"500\" height=\"350\" title=\"&#8220;No Fear in Death: Dennis &#038; Barbara Rainey&#8221; &#8212; FamilyLife\u00ae - A Cru Ministry\" data-secret=\"ZIrlneYqGT\" frameborder=\"0\" marginwidth=\"0\" marginheight=\"0\" scrolling=\"no\" class=\"wp-embedded-content\"><\/iframe><script>\n\/*! This file is auto-generated *\/\n!function(d,l){\"use strict\";l.querySelector&&d.addEventListener&&\"undefined\"!=typeof URL&&(d.wp=d.wp||{},d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage||(d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage=function(e){var t=e.data;if((t||t.secret||t.message||t.value)&&!\/[^a-zA-Z0-9]\/.test(t.secret)){for(var s,r,n,a=l.querySelectorAll('iframe[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),o=l.querySelectorAll('blockquote[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),c=new RegExp(\"^https?:$\",\"i\"),i=0;i<o.length;i++)o[i].style.display=\"none\";for(i=0;i<a.length;i++)s=a[i],e.source===s.contentWindow&&(s.removeAttribute(\"style\"),\"height\"===t.message?(1e3<(r=parseInt(t.value,10))?r=1e3:~~r<200&&(r=200),s.height=r):\"link\"===t.message&&(r=new URL(s.getAttribute(\"src\")),n=new URL(t.value),c.test(n.protocol))&&n.host===r.host&&l.activeElement===s&&(d.top.location.href=t.value))}},d.addEventListener(\"message\",d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage,!1),l.addEventListener(\"DOMContentLoaded\",function(){for(var e,t,s=l.querySelectorAll(\"iframe.wp-embedded-content\"),r=0;r<s.length;r++)(t=(e=s[r]).getAttribute(\"data-secret\"))||(t=Math.random().toString(36).substring(2,12),e.src+=\"#?secret=\"+t,e.setAttribute(\"data-secret\",t)),e.contentWindow.postMessage({message:\"ready\",secret:t},\"*\")},!1)))}(window,document);\n\/\/# sourceURL=https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-includes\/js\/wp-embed.min.js\n<\/script>\n"},"spectra_custom_meta":{"secondline_imported_guid":["7cb75dfa-eed2-4a42-bb4e-b1c90152cf19"],"audio_file":["https:\/\/traffic.omny.fm\/d\/clips\/cbd16f10-ac60-4f09-b4df-b15400ce35aa\/33aaac7e-3581-4e21-a3df-b154011ba58c\/7cb75dfa-eed2-4a42-bb4e-b1c90152cf19\/audio.mp3"],"duration":["00:27:02"],"filesize":["24.79M"],"_thumbnail_id":["280865"],"show_notes":["<ul>\n<li>Help make YOUR mark: Your donation supports crucial resources for families and includes a special FamilyLife Pen and <a href=\"https:\/\/donate.familylife.com\/august-2024\/urgent-need\/?cru_source=FLTD24&amp;cru_medium=Icare&amp;cru_campaign=August2024&amp;_gl=1*i7nrhi*_gcl_aw*R0NMLjE3MTcwMTQ3ODQuQ2owS0NRandwTnV5QmhDdUFSSXNBTkpxTDlOZnNmVlp5TUhEOU55WG14QjFTbVhFb3FLTUFlM3dsRGZlLUUtaTh5U2NjN0hfSnNVQnNZc2FBbVhnRUFMd193Y0I.*_gcl_au*MTk2MDk5NjM3Mi4xNzE4NjM0NDIz*_ga*OTI3MTAyODQ4LjE2OTUxMjkzOTk.*_ga_85G8JM3S5D*MTcyMzQwNzQ5MC42MzkuMS4xNzIzNDA5NDc2LjQ2LjAuMTI4NjI3MTUzNg..&amp;_ga=2.4838195.1899240771.1723407491-927102848.1695129399\">Brant Hansen's book, \"Unoffendable\"\u2014join us today!<\/a><\/li>\n<li>Connect with Dennis and Barbara Rainey at their <a href=\"https:\/\/www.theraineys.org\/post\/do-you-need-hope-have-you-been-disappointed-with-god\">website<\/a>.<\/li>\n<li>If you enjoyed this episode, check out previous podcast\u00a0episodes featuring the <a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/guest\/dennis-and-barbara-rainey\/\">Raineys<\/a>.<\/li>\n<li>Don't miss out on the \"<a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/weekend-to-remember\/\">Weekend to Remember<\/a>\" events happening nationwide!<\/li>\n<li>Find the new Homebuilders series, newly redesigned as <a href=\"http:\/\/www.artofmarriage.com\/\">FamilyLife's Art of Marriage<\/a>!<\/li>\n<li>Find resources from this podcast at <a href=\"https:\/\/shop.familylife.com\/product-category\/radio-resources\/\">shop.familylife.com<\/a>.<\/li>\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/shop.familylife.com\/product-category\/past-radio-resources\/\">See resources from our past podcasts.<\/a><\/li>\n<li>Find more content and resources on the <a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/app\/\">FamilyLife's app<\/a>!<\/li>\n<li>Help others find FamilyLife. Leave a review on <a href=\"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303\">Apple Podcast<\/a> or <a href=\"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm?si=d6dfa8d2415f4750\">Spotify<\/a>.<\/li>\n<li>Check out all the FamilyLife's podcasts on the <a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/familylife-podcast-network\/\">FamilyLife Podcast Network<\/a><\/li>\n<\/ul>\n"],"transcript_content":["<p>FamilyLife Today\u00ae National Radio Version (time edited) Transcript<\/p>\n<p>References to conferences, resources, or other special promotions may be obsolete.<\/p>\n<p>No Fear in Death<\/p>\n<p>Guests:Dennis and Barbara Rainey<\/p>\n<p>From the series:Growing Older Without Growing Old (Day 3 of 3)<\/p>\n<p>Air date:August 16, 2024<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Hey, I want to take just a second to let you know how important you are to us. In fact, we couldn\u2019t do this without your prayer support, without your financial support. We need you.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: You are our partners. FamilyLife and our ministry [would] not exist without donors and listeners who say, \u201cI don\u2019t want to just be a spectator. I want to play. I want to be a partner with FamilyLife, prayerfully.\u201d That means you\u2019re praying for us; but I tell you what, I don\u2019t if you understand this, but we need your financial support as well.<\/p>\n<p>This is a listener-supported ministry. We actually have a goal right now, in the month of August, to raise $250,000, which is a lot of money.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: I know. It sounds like a lot, doesn\u2019t it? But we want you to partner with us to make a difference in marriages and families with the gospel.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: So, let\u2019s jump in together and make a mark. You can do that. Just go to FamilyLifeToday.com and make a donation there. Because you\u2019re making a mark, we\u2019re going to give you a pen\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Ann: \u2014yes!<\/p>\n<p>Dave: \u2014that makes a mark on paper. [Laughter] You get the connection. It\u2019s a FamilyLife limited-edition pen. If you give a donation today or tomorrow, or anytime, you become our partner, and we can change the world together.<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: We need to be thinking back, \u201cWhen\u2019s the last time we talked to a person about their eternal destiny?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Right.<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: Because everybody\u2019s got one. The Bible teaches there are two: heaven and hell. All eternity depends upon who we choose to give us life.<\/p>\n<p>Shelby: Welcome to FamilyLife Today, where we want to help you pursue the relationships that matter most. I\u2019m Shelby Abbott, and your hosts are Dave and Ann Wilson. You can find us at FamilyLifeToday.com.<\/p>\n<p>This is FamilyLife Today!<\/p>\n<p>Dave: We\u2019ve got some older people in the studio today, [Laughter] but they\u2019re not old.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: We\u2019re not old!<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: No.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: We have never opened\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: \u2014that\u2019s an accurate statement. [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Actually, they are on both sides of the table. It isn\u2019t like we\u2019re looking at [people] older, much older than us. But we\u2019ve got Dennis and Barbara back\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Ann: \u2014our friends.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: \u2014Rainey.<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: We were. [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Yes. That just ended about 30 seconds ago.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes, yes. [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>Dave: But if you haven\u2019t been listening the past couple of days, those have been rich, deep conversations about how to grow older but not become old. The key word there is grow.<\/p>\n<p>We want to keep this conversation going. Again, I\u2019m not going to review everything, but one of the biggest things you said in the last couple of days is \u201ckeep growing and keep becoming a disciple.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Never stop learning, right? Live on purpose. Surround yourself with some younger people that you are pouring into that keep you young. Surround yourself with older people that you are doing life with, right?<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: Right.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Today, let\u2019s talk about where we\u2019re headed; let\u2019s talk about the future; let\u2019s talk about heaven.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Not many people talk about heaven.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: That\u2019s what I was going to say: how many conversations have you had recently about heaven?<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Why don\u2019t we talk about heaven? What do you think?<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: I think [it\u2019s] because we\u2019re afraid of death, and that\u2019s how we get there. I think we avoid it because it\u2019s unpleasant to think about what we might have to go through. We are pain avoidant at all costs, most of us.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: That has some pain associated with it. But I\u2019ll tell you a story about a conversation Dennis and I had. A few years ago, we were in Colorado visiting our kids. We went for a walk one night, just the two of us. At some point while we were out walking, somehow the conversation turned to heaven. I don\u2019t remember, to this day, how we got there. I have no idea; maybe the Spirit of God led us to talk about it, but I remember asking Dennis, \u201cDo you think about heaven very much?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>He said, \u201cWell, not really.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>I said, \u201cWhen you think about it, what do you think?\u201d I can\u2019t remember what he said, and I said, \u201cYou know. I\u2019ve been thinking about it lately, and here\u2019s what I think.\u201d I\u2019m sure this was inspired by some verse in Psalms. There\u2019s the verse where God said He made His wonders to be remembered. The concept is [that] God wants us to remember what He\u2019s done. There\u2019s a lot about remembering in Scripture.<\/p>\n<p>So, I said, \u201cI\u2019ve been thinking about heaven, and I wonder if, when we get to heaven\u2014because there\u2019s no time; time is only for earth, there\u2019s not time in heaven\u2014might we be able to see some of the things that God has done, that we\u2019ve read about in Scripture; might we be able to see them real time?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Oh, Barbara!<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Wouldn\u2019t that be fascinating?<\/p>\n<p>Ann: I always talk about this.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: Do you? I thought I was the only one. That\u2019s so great.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Don\u2019t you want to see it all?<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: Yes!<\/p>\n<p>Ann: I want to see it all.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: Why would God not want us to see the Red Sea parting\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Ann: \u2014yes!<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: \u2014one of the greatest things He\u2019s done, that we\u2019ve all read about?<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes!<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: Just imagine, why wouldn\u2019t He want us to see the real thing and then praise Him afterwards, because now we know what it was really like?<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Surely, we will all get to see it, whether we go back or\u2014we watch movies today; there\u2019s probably something a lot better.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: I think there are movies, too.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Me, too.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: I think there [will be] instant replay or movies or some combination of all of the above. Nothing is too hard for God.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Right.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: Right?<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Don\u2019t you want to see it all? I want to see every bit of it.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: I would love to see it all. I want to meet everybody.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Me, too.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: I want to hear their stories because I do think that God has made His wonders to be remembered. He wants us to worship Him for all that He has done for us and for everyone else. We all rejoice when we talk to someone who has had something great that God has done, and we celebrate that with one another.<\/p>\n<p>I think heaven is going to be this ongoing celebration of what God has done in our lives and what He\u2019s done for other people. I think we will be able to see all these things.<\/p>\n<p>That started us talking, and we just kept talking that night, as we walked, about \u201cwhat ifs?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: Then, a couple of months ago, I believe it was (or maybe it was back in the fall), we had friends over for dinner. Somehow, after dinner, we started talking about heaven, and the same thing happened. I shared with them about movie theaters and instant replays [Laughter] and seeing some of this. They kind of looked at me funny. Then they thought, \u201cWell, I suppose that\u2019s possible.\u201d We just started talking again more about heaven.<\/p>\n<p>The reason I\u2019m telling you this is because I think we need to be talking about it more. I think we imagine\u2014like for instance, if you are going on a trip to some place you\u2019ve never been, you get travel journals, you talk to people who have been there, you read what you can read about it, because you want to know where you are going so you can anticipate it.<\/p>\n<p>Well, why wouldn\u2019t we do the same for heaven? I think it\u2019s great for our faith to talk about what\u2019s waiting for us. One of the things we have done recently\u2014I haven\u2019t finished reading it\u2014is, Dennis pulled out Randy Alcorn\u2019s book on heaven, which is like a textbook.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Oh, yes, it is.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes, but it\u2019s good.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: It\u2019s not quick reading, but it\u2019s very good. He read the whole thing. Every morning, he would say, \u201cListen to this, what I\u2019ve just read.\u201d He loved it, so now I\u2019ve started reading it again.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: I need to read that again. Take us there, Dennis. What are you learning? What\u2019s intriguing you?<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: Randy Alcorn was talking about how the gospel doesn\u2019t just redeem sinners and give them new bodies, but there is going to be a new earth and a new heaven.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes!<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: A new creation.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Wow!<\/p>\n<p>Ann: I can\u2019t wait to see that!<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: I know, right?<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: There may not be three primary colors; there may be three billion primary colors. [Laughter] Sound that we hear\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: \u2014will be so much better.<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: \u2014a fraction of real sound and beauty. Beauty is one of the greatest apologetics for the existence of God.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: Barbara has taught me that. I think we\u2019re going to see things so beautiful in heaven that it is going to be\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Ann: \u2014we will bow.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: Yes, we will.<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: \u201cWhat is there to expect and to explore today?\u201d Does that mean that is all going to happen? I can\u2019t point to a chapter and verse in the Bible where it is; but my point is, if God loves us\u2014and He is love, and He says He is, and He says He does\u2014then He has prepared a place for us that where He is, we may be also. [John 14:3, Paraphrased] He said, \u201cEye hath not seen nor ear hath heard\u2014beauty, sound\u2014all of what God has created for those who know Jesus Christ and have placed their faith in Him.\u201d [1 Corinthians 2:9, Paraphrased]<\/p>\n<p>It's not so much just that the gospel saves us from hell, but it gets us into an entrance of something so grand and so wonderful\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: \u2014another thing, speaking of that, is that I think, often, \u201cWhat must Adam and Eve have been like before they sinned?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes, before the fall.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: Before the fall? When you think about our abilities, and [how] different ones have different exceptional abilities. There are a lot of people that have to wear glasses like we do now, but there are some people who have exceptional eyesight.<\/p>\n<p>Twenty\/twenty is what we consider normal and perfect eyesight, but what do you think our eyesight really will be? We think about hearing in a certain way. What do you think our hearing really will be? Then we watch these exceptional athletes who can jump so high off the floor and most of us can\u2019t jump six inches, but what if we\u2019re all like that?<\/p>\n<p>Ann: \u2014and brain capacity.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: \u2014and brain capacity, yes. They say we only use a small percentage of our brain. I think even that leads us to worship, because I think our bodies are going to be so much better than we can possibly imagine because of what we lost in the fall. If we think about what we lost, then the resurrected body is going to be so much better.<\/p>\n<p>It\u2019s another reason that looking forward to heaven is an exciting prospect; not a dull, boring, \u201cOh, I don\u2019t want to go there.\u201d I think there is so much to look forward to.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Now, how does that motivate you to grow older?<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: My mentor, teacher, and professor at Dallas Seminary, Howard Hendricks, said\u2014and it was said of him at his memorial service after he died (with his boots still on, by the way) having taught more than 13 thousand students at Dallas [Theological] Seminary\u2014he said: \u201cThe day your past is more exciting than the future is the day you start to die.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>The rearview mirror is good to look at in and glance at occasionally, but eyes transfixed on where you\u2019ve been, the regrets, the mistakes, the errors, etcetera\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: \u2014you are going nowhere when you\u2019re looking backwards, but if you are looking forward to heaven and to what God has waiting for us\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Ann: \u2014yes.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Yes, I have often thought in my Christian walk, if all my stories of God\u2019s miracles in my life or sharing Christ with a neighbor or a stranger are all five years ago\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: \u2014yes, all past tense\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Dave: \u2014or even a year ago, what am I doing?<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: I know.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: Exactly.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: They need to be fresh, which means I haven\u2019t quit.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: Right.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: I\u2019m not apathetic. I\u2019m thinking, \u201cI\u2019m going.\u201d I\u2019ve got my eyes open, and I\u2019m asking, \u201cGod, use me,\u201d and He will!<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: He will.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: If we are willing to say, \u201cUse me. Here I am; send me,\u201d He\u2019ll send you.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: Absolutely.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: And you\u2019ll have a fresh story today or yesterday, rather than 10 years ago.<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: I started thinking about going to heaven, and I thought, \u201cIf we were going on a vacation, what would you do?\u201d You would look for some travel guides. You\u2019d call a travel agent who had been there.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>We went to Italy as a result of leading FamilyLife for a number of years. [We] finally got away, so I called a woman who had been there 20 times. We had all this travel experience that we went to. If you are going to go to heaven, wouldn\u2019t you want to be reading about what heaven is, and what we\u2019ll do in heaven?<\/p>\n<p>Ann: I told my dad this same thing! I said, \u201cDad, I don\u2019t know a better planner for vacations than you.\u201d He\u2019d sit down; he\u2019d have everything laid out, maps,\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: \u2014mapped out.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: \u2014what we can do. He had it all calculated. I said, \u201cYou\u2019re such a good planner. You couldn\u2019t wait for the next vacation. Don\u2019t you want to know about heaven? There is going to be nothing that compares to heaven that you\u2019ve done. The Bible talks about it. There are books written about it.\u201d But he was scared.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: That\u2019s the thing.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: He said, \u201cIf I start talking about it, I feel like, maybe, I\u2019ll be there too soon,\u201d that fear part.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: I think the fear is real.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: But I think the opposite is true. I think if we talk about it, it makes us excited about going.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: It gives life to our todays. If you have anticipation for the future and hope for the future, you are going to be more alive today.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes. I remember talking to a lady in a nursing home. She was well into her 90\u2019s; she couldn\u2019t get out of bed. She told me\u2014I was sitting beside her bed, and she said: \u201cWhen I woke up this morning, I took a breath, and I said, \u2018I\u2019m still here. God must have something for me today.\u2019\u201d<\/p>\n<p>I thought, \u201cOh boy, I need that attitude.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: Yes, isn\u2019t that great?<\/p>\n<p>Ann: \u201cOh, I\u2019m still here. He must have a purpose for me today.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: I love that.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Me, too.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: I love that.<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: When Billy Graham died, I went to his memorial service, and the program had some words about heaven. Billy Graham said, \u201cDon\u2019t mourn for me and where I am, because I\u2019m going to be breathing celestial air.\u201d [Laughter] Bill Bright said the same thing; [he was] the founder of Campus Crusade for Christ and Cru.<\/p>\n<p>I think we need to be talking more about heaven, and I think we need to go near people who have knowledge, like Randy Alcorn, of a book that\u2019s like a travel guide about going to heaven.<\/p>\n<p>One guy that we ran across, who had some great words about heaven, [is] Dallas Willard. He was an author, professor, and thought leader on the West Coast. When he was two, his mother died. Her final words on her death bed to her husband, Dallas Willard\u2019s dad, were these: \u201cKeep eternity before the children.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Whoa!<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: Isn\u2019t that amazing?<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes!<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: When I first read that, I thought, \u201cMy lost words as a mom would have been, \u2018Make sure they know I love them,\u2019 and \u2018Take care of them.\u2019\u201d I would have never thought to say that, but isn\u2019t that amazing? \u201cKeep eternity in front of the children.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: I would have never thought of that.<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: Listen to what Dallas Willard said near the end of his life\u2014he said this about heaven: \u201cYour eternal destiny is not cosmic retirement. It is to be a part of a tremendously creative project under unimaginably splendid leadership on an inconceivably vast scale with an ever-increasing cycle of fruitfulness and enjoyment. This is the prophetic vision, which eye hath not seen nor ear hath heard.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Wow!<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: Isn\u2019t that great?<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: If you start talking about that, it makes living life now even all that much more important that we make deposits in heaven, where rust, where moths can\u2019t destroy. [Matthew 6:19, Paraphrased] We\u2019re taking people with us to heaven.<\/p>\n<p>Jim Dobson, founder of Focus on the Family, said, \u201cMy goal in life is to share Christ with as many people as possible and take as many with me to heaven as I possibly can.\u201d That\u2019s pretty crystal clear. [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>We need to be thinking back, \u201cWhen\u2019s the last time we talked to a person about their eternal destiny?\u201d because everybody\u2019s got one.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Right.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: The Bible teaches there are two: heaven and hell. All of eternity depends upon who we choose to give us life. Jesus Christ, He\u2019s the Savior; He came to redeem us. He died for our sins to satisfy a righteous God who can\u2019t let us in in our current, sinful state.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: I know one of the privileges, actually, of being a pastor and doing funerals\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: \u2014oh, yes\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Dave: \u2014is, it keeps heaven right in your face, whether it\u2019s an older person or a younger one, it doesn\u2019t matter.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: You get the privilege of doing a wedding, which is the beginning (and usually younger [people]). Then you walk up, and you have to deliver words to a family and friends who have just lost a loved one. You get in your car, and you drive home, and you\u2019re reminded: \u201cToday matters. How I live today matters,\u201d because we\u2019re all going there. It\u2019s not a matter of if, it\u2019s when; so, I want to live today full out, because when I go there it [will be] glorious; it [will be] incredible.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: It\u2019s interesting, too, because we\u2019ve gone to a lot of weddings, and we\u2019ll say, \u201cThat was great,\u201d but when you\u2019ve gone to the funeral of someone who has impacted lives for eternity, those are the ones you are talking about on the way home.<\/p>\n<p>We\u2019ve had many of those discussions of person after person who stood up testifying, \u201cThis man changed my life,\u201d \u201cThis woman led me to Christ,\u201d (or taught me or mentored me). We\u2019ve come home in the car and said, \u201cWe want to do that! We want to be that, instead of just growing old and living for ourselves.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: Yes; right. Dave: I\u2019ve done a few funerals. I usually try to encourage the family to do an open mic, saying, \u201cI\u2019m going to give you a moment. I can lead it. We\u2019ll keep it brief, but I\u2019d love to have people stand.\u201d And you don\u2019t even have to do a mic; just say some words.<\/p>\n<p>I\u2019ve done a few where nobody said a word. There was nothing to say. Dennis: No impact.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: That\u2019s sobering, isn\u2019t it?<\/p>\n<p>Dave: There was no impact. I\u2019ve done others where you have to stop it after 20 minutes, saying, \u201cOkay, we can\u2019t just keep going. This has been amazing.\u201d Even if I didn\u2019t know the guy or the gal, they were just somebody that I was doing the funeral for, and they\u2019re a stranger, [I walked] out thinking, \u201cThat\u2019s a life of impact. I don\u2019t know who they were, but they literally changed people for the Kingdom.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Okay, you\u2019ve got the person listening who is saying, \u201cBut do we really know if we can go to heaven? Do we really know?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: The metaphor that Jesus used is: \u201cBehold, I stand at the door and knock. If any hears my voice and bids me to come in to him, I will come in with him and sup with him and have fellowship with him.\u201d [Revelation 3:20, Paraphrased]<\/p>\n<p>I think people are listening right now who have heard Christ knock at the door, but they didn\u2019t do anything. They paused; they got distracted; they thought there was a life somewhere else, better, that they could live than this life that Christ has.<\/p>\n<p>I would say [to] just take Him at His word and say, \u201cLord, be merciful to me, a sinner. I\u2019m opening the door and inviting You to come into my messy life, and take my mess and make it Your life, purposeful, meaningful, all the way to the finish line. May I be used by You to take a lot of people to heaven with me.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Yes, that\u2019s the goal.<\/p>\n<p>I\u2019ll finish with this. I heard this quote, I\u2019ll bet, over 20 years ago. I don\u2019t know who Hunter S. Thompson is, but I\u2019ll bet you\u2019ve heard this quote. He said, \u201cLife should not be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well-preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside in a cloud of smoke, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming: \u2018Wow! What a Ride!\u2019\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: Really?<\/p>\n<p>Dave: That\u2019s the way to end it.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: That\u2019s cool. I\u2019ve never heard that.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: You haven\u2019t? Isn\u2019t it great?<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: I like that.<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: I\u2019ve heard that one.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: That is great.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: I heard it years ago, and I thought, \u201cThat\u2019s the goal.\u201d To the last breath\u2014Bill Bright, to the last breath: Billy Graham.<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: May our kids and our great grandkids say about Nani and Poppi, or whatever they call you guys, right? \u201cThey ran to the very end.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: That\u2019s what I want to hear.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Me, too.<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: When I attended Billy Graham\u2019s funeral\u2014I\u2019ve only had this happen one time in my life, and I\u2019ve been to a lot of funerals like you have\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Dave: \u2014I can imagine.<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: \u2014I actually collect the programs and save them and summarize on the outside of the program.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: You brought them to the pheasant hunt.<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: I did; I showed the guys a few of those.<\/p>\n<p>But at the end of some incredible stories of the grace Billy Graham gave his daughter, who was divorced twice and how she was so ashamed, but he was standing at the top of the driveway with his arms out like this when she came home. He was waiting on her. What a picture of the love of God and the grace of God!<\/p>\n<p>After [hearing] all these stories, and his coffin was made by prisoners in a prison in Louisiana\u2014oak, as I recall\u2014his coffin was put on these rollers, and they rolled it out of the tent there in Charlotte where we were meeting. They pushed it across the road and up a sidewalk, going up to where he was going to be laid.<\/p>\n<p>I still regret to this day that I didn\u2019t do what I wanted to do which was clap; to stand and give a standing ovation to the man who did it.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: That\u2019s how you do it.<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: He wasn\u2019t perfect. I heard him say some clumsy things near the end of his life, you know? It happens to all of us; but he did it; he ran the race all the way to the finish line.<\/p>\n<p>I was with another friend\u2014Kimmons was his name. I leaned over to him, and I said, \u201cI feel like standing and applauding while they are rolling this thing along.\u201d It was total silence, though, in awe of God, I believe, ultimately, but also a life well-lived.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: I\u2019ll tell you where they were clapping, when he entered into the gates of heaven\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: \u2014of heaven, yes\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Ann: \u2014and the people who he had led to Christ were standing there. I bet they gave him a standing ovation.<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: I have a feeling you are right. I hadn\u2019t thought of that, but that\u2019s good.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Thank you.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: We love you guys. Thank you so much.<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: We love you, too.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: We really do.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: [You are] our heroes and our mentors, and we\u2019re watching. [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>Dave: We are following. That\u2019s what we\u2019re doing.<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Wasn\u2019t it fun to be with the Raineys today?<\/p>\n<p>Dave: It was awesome. I\u2019m inspired\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Ann: \u2014me, too.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: \u2014just hearing stories of how God worked in our Founder and former President, Dennis, and Barbara and what they are doing now. I tell you what, every time I\u2019m around them\u2014they\u2019re our mentors\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Ann: \u2014yes\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Dave: \u2014I\u2019m fired up spiritually.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: That\u2019s what I was thinking, too. I thought, \u201cThese guys have mentored us from close and afar for years.\u201d I don\u2019t know about some of you as a listener: do you have a mentor? We\u2019re hoping that this program could help mentor you, but also that you would find somebody from afar, or somebody close, that could really pour life and inspiration into you.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: One of the amazing things that mentors do is they help you to, [as] Psalm 34 [says], \u201cTaste and see that the Lord is good.\u201d I\u2019ve felt that way with Dennis and Barbara.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Me, too.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: I\u2019ll tell you what, if you jump in and become a partner financially with us, you can help others taste and see that the Lord is good by sharing this program with your neighbors.<\/p>\n<p>Shelby: I\u2019m Shelby Abbott, and you\u2019ve been listening to Dave and Ann Wilson with Dennis and Barbara Rainey on FamilyLife Today.<\/p>\n<p>As Dave and Ann were talking there at the end, the easiest way to partner with us is simply by going online to FamilyLifeToday.com to make your donation, or you can give us a call at 800-358-6329 to make your donation. Again, that number is \u201cF\u201d as in family, \u201cL\u201d as in life, and then the word, \u201cTODAY.\u201d Or feel free to drop us a donation in the mail, if you\u2019d like. Our address is FamilyLife, 100 Lake Hart Drive, Orlando, Florida 32832.<\/p>\n<p>Now, coming up next week, Daniel Nayeri is with us to talk about his memoir, Everything Sad is Untrue. It\u2019s the story of him growing up [through] his childhood in Iran, and then escaping to America, and how God used that to shape his life. That\u2019s coming up next week. We hope you will join us.<\/p>\n<p>On behalf of Dave and Ann Wilson, I\u2019m Shelby Abbott. We will see you back next time for another edition of FamilyLife Today.<\/p>\n<p>FamilyLife Today is a donor-supported production of FamilyLife\u00ae, a Cru\u00ae Ministry.<\/p>\n<p>Helping you pursue the relationships that matter most.<\/p>\n<p>We are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider donating today to help defray the costs? Copyright \u00a9 2024 FamilyLife. 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you fear getting older? Tune in as Dennis & Barbara Rainey share how \"no fear in death\" fuels their desire to live purposefully.","meta_box":{"show_notes":"<ul>\n<li>Help make YOUR mark: Your donation supports crucial resources for families and includes a special FamilyLife Pen and <a href=\"https:\/\/donate.familylife.com\/august-2024\/urgent-need\/?cru_source=FLTD24&amp;cru_medium=Icare&amp;cru_campaign=August2024&amp;_gl=1*i7nrhi*_gcl_aw*R0NMLjE3MTcwMTQ3ODQuQ2owS0NRandwTnV5QmhDdUFSSXNBTkpxTDlOZnNmVlp5TUhEOU55WG14QjFTbVhFb3FLTUFlM3dsRGZlLUUtaTh5U2NjN0hfSnNVQnNZc2FBbVhnRUFMd193Y0I.*_gcl_au*MTk2MDk5NjM3Mi4xNzE4NjM0NDIz*_ga*OTI3MTAyODQ4LjE2OTUxMjkzOTk.*_ga_85G8JM3S5D*MTcyMzQwNzQ5MC42MzkuMS4xNzIzNDA5NDc2LjQ2LjAuMTI4NjI3MTUzNg..&amp;_ga=2.4838195.1899240771.1723407491-927102848.1695129399\">Brant Hansen's book, \"Unoffendable\"\u2014join us today!<\/a><\/li>\n<li>Connect with Dennis and Barbara Rainey at their <a href=\"https:\/\/www.theraineys.org\/post\/do-you-need-hope-have-you-been-disappointed-with-god\">website<\/a>.<\/li>\n<li>If you enjoyed this episode, check out previous podcast\u00a0episodes featuring the <a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/guest\/dennis-and-barbara-rainey\/\">Raineys<\/a>.<\/li>\n<li>Don't miss out on the \"<a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/weekend-to-remember\/\">Weekend to Remember<\/a>\" events happening nationwide!<\/li>\n<li>Find the new Homebuilders series, newly redesigned as <a href=\"http:\/\/www.artofmarriage.com\/\">FamilyLife's Art of Marriage<\/a>!<\/li>\n<li>Find resources from this podcast at <a href=\"https:\/\/shop.familylife.com\/product-category\/radio-resources\/\">shop.familylife.com<\/a>.<\/li>\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/shop.familylife.com\/product-category\/past-radio-resources\/\">See resources from our past podcasts.<\/a><\/li>\n<li>Find more content and resources on the <a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/app\/\">FamilyLife's app<\/a>!<\/li>\n<li>Help others find FamilyLife. Leave a review on <a href=\"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303\">Apple Podcast<\/a> or <a href=\"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm?si=d6dfa8d2415f4750\">Spotify<\/a>.<\/li>\n<li>Check out all the FamilyLife's podcasts on the <a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/familylife-podcast-network\/\">FamilyLife Podcast Network<\/a><\/li>\n<\/ul>\n","transcript_url":"https:\/\/transcript.familylife.com\/fl2024-08-16.pdf","transcript_content":"<p>FamilyLife Today\u00ae National Radio Version (time edited) Transcript<\/p>\n<p>References to conferences, resources, or other special promotions may be obsolete.<\/p>\n<p>No Fear in Death<\/p>\n<p>Guests:Dennis and Barbara Rainey<\/p>\n<p>From the series:Growing Older Without Growing Old (Day 3 of 3)<\/p>\n<p>Air date:August 16, 2024<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Hey, I want to take just a second to let you know how important you are to us. In fact, we couldn\u2019t do this without your prayer support, without your financial support. We need you.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: You are our partners. FamilyLife and our ministry [would] not exist without donors and listeners who say, \u201cI don\u2019t want to just be a spectator. I want to play. I want to be a partner with FamilyLife, prayerfully.\u201d That means you\u2019re praying for us; but I tell you what, I don\u2019t if you understand this, but we need your financial support as well.<\/p>\n<p>This is a listener-supported ministry. We actually have a goal right now, in the month of August, to raise $250,000, which is a lot of money.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: I know. It sounds like a lot, doesn\u2019t it? But we want you to partner with us to make a difference in marriages and families with the gospel.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: So, let\u2019s jump in together and make a mark. You can do that. Just go to FamilyLifeToday.com and make a donation there. Because you\u2019re making a mark, we\u2019re going to give you a pen\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Ann: \u2014yes!<\/p>\n<p>Dave: \u2014that makes a mark on paper. [Laughter] You get the connection. It\u2019s a FamilyLife limited-edition pen. If you give a donation today or tomorrow, or anytime, you become our partner, and we can change the world together.<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: We need to be thinking back, \u201cWhen\u2019s the last time we talked to a person about their eternal destiny?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Right.<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: Because everybody\u2019s got one. The Bible teaches there are two: heaven and hell. All eternity depends upon who we choose to give us life.<\/p>\n<p>Shelby: Welcome to FamilyLife Today, where we want to help you pursue the relationships that matter most. I\u2019m Shelby Abbott, and your hosts are Dave and Ann Wilson. You can find us at FamilyLifeToday.com.<\/p>\n<p>This is FamilyLife Today!<\/p>\n<p>Dave: We\u2019ve got some older people in the studio today, [Laughter] but they\u2019re not old.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: We\u2019re not old!<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: No.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: We have never opened\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: \u2014that\u2019s an accurate statement. [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Actually, they are on both sides of the table. It isn\u2019t like we\u2019re looking at [people] older, much older than us. But we\u2019ve got Dennis and Barbara back\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Ann: \u2014our friends.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: \u2014Rainey.<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: We were. [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Yes. That just ended about 30 seconds ago.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes, yes. [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>Dave: But if you haven\u2019t been listening the past couple of days, those have been rich, deep conversations about how to grow older but not become old. The key word there is grow.<\/p>\n<p>We want to keep this conversation going. Again, I\u2019m not going to review everything, but one of the biggest things you said in the last couple of days is \u201ckeep growing and keep becoming a disciple.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Never stop learning, right? Live on purpose. Surround yourself with some younger people that you are pouring into that keep you young. Surround yourself with older people that you are doing life with, right?<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: Right.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Today, let\u2019s talk about where we\u2019re headed; let\u2019s talk about the future; let\u2019s talk about heaven.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Not many people talk about heaven.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: That\u2019s what I was going to say: how many conversations have you had recently about heaven?<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Why don\u2019t we talk about heaven? What do you think?<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: I think [it\u2019s] because we\u2019re afraid of death, and that\u2019s how we get there. I think we avoid it because it\u2019s unpleasant to think about what we might have to go through. We are pain avoidant at all costs, most of us.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: That has some pain associated with it. But I\u2019ll tell you a story about a conversation Dennis and I had. A few years ago, we were in Colorado visiting our kids. We went for a walk one night, just the two of us. At some point while we were out walking, somehow the conversation turned to heaven. I don\u2019t remember, to this day, how we got there. I have no idea; maybe the Spirit of God led us to talk about it, but I remember asking Dennis, \u201cDo you think about heaven very much?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>He said, \u201cWell, not really.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>I said, \u201cWhen you think about it, what do you think?\u201d I can\u2019t remember what he said, and I said, \u201cYou know. I\u2019ve been thinking about it lately, and here\u2019s what I think.\u201d I\u2019m sure this was inspired by some verse in Psalms. There\u2019s the verse where God said He made His wonders to be remembered. The concept is [that] God wants us to remember what He\u2019s done. There\u2019s a lot about remembering in Scripture.<\/p>\n<p>So, I said, \u201cI\u2019ve been thinking about heaven, and I wonder if, when we get to heaven\u2014because there\u2019s no time; time is only for earth, there\u2019s not time in heaven\u2014might we be able to see some of the things that God has done, that we\u2019ve read about in Scripture; might we be able to see them real time?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Oh, Barbara!<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Wouldn\u2019t that be fascinating?<\/p>\n<p>Ann: I always talk about this.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: Do you? I thought I was the only one. That\u2019s so great.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Don\u2019t you want to see it all?<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: Yes!<\/p>\n<p>Ann: I want to see it all.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: Why would God not want us to see the Red Sea parting\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Ann: \u2014yes!<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: \u2014one of the greatest things He\u2019s done, that we\u2019ve all read about?<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes!<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: Just imagine, why wouldn\u2019t He want us to see the real thing and then praise Him afterwards, because now we know what it was really like?<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Surely, we will all get to see it, whether we go back or\u2014we watch movies today; there\u2019s probably something a lot better.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: I think there are movies, too.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Me, too.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: I think there [will be] instant replay or movies or some combination of all of the above. Nothing is too hard for God.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Right.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: Right?<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Don\u2019t you want to see it all? I want to see every bit of it.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: I would love to see it all. I want to meet everybody.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Me, too.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: I want to hear their stories because I do think that God has made His wonders to be remembered. He wants us to worship Him for all that He has done for us and for everyone else. We all rejoice when we talk to someone who has had something great that God has done, and we celebrate that with one another.<\/p>\n<p>I think heaven is going to be this ongoing celebration of what God has done in our lives and what He\u2019s done for other people. I think we will be able to see all these things.<\/p>\n<p>That started us talking, and we just kept talking that night, as we walked, about \u201cwhat ifs?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: Then, a couple of months ago, I believe it was (or maybe it was back in the fall), we had friends over for dinner. Somehow, after dinner, we started talking about heaven, and the same thing happened. I shared with them about movie theaters and instant replays [Laughter] and seeing some of this. They kind of looked at me funny. Then they thought, \u201cWell, I suppose that\u2019s possible.\u201d We just started talking again more about heaven.<\/p>\n<p>The reason I\u2019m telling you this is because I think we need to be talking about it more. I think we imagine\u2014like for instance, if you are going on a trip to some place you\u2019ve never been, you get travel journals, you talk to people who have been there, you read what you can read about it, because you want to know where you are going so you can anticipate it.<\/p>\n<p>Well, why wouldn\u2019t we do the same for heaven? I think it\u2019s great for our faith to talk about what\u2019s waiting for us. One of the things we have done recently\u2014I haven\u2019t finished reading it\u2014is, Dennis pulled out Randy Alcorn\u2019s book on heaven, which is like a textbook.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Oh, yes, it is.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes, but it\u2019s good.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: It\u2019s not quick reading, but it\u2019s very good. He read the whole thing. Every morning, he would say, \u201cListen to this, what I\u2019ve just read.\u201d He loved it, so now I\u2019ve started reading it again.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: I need to read that again. Take us there, Dennis. What are you learning? What\u2019s intriguing you?<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: Randy Alcorn was talking about how the gospel doesn\u2019t just redeem sinners and give them new bodies, but there is going to be a new earth and a new heaven.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes!<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: A new creation.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Wow!<\/p>\n<p>Ann: I can\u2019t wait to see that!<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: I know, right?<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: There may not be three primary colors; there may be three billion primary colors. [Laughter] Sound that we hear\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: \u2014will be so much better.<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: \u2014a fraction of real sound and beauty. Beauty is one of the greatest apologetics for the existence of God.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: Barbara has taught me that. I think we\u2019re going to see things so beautiful in heaven that it is going to be\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Ann: \u2014we will bow.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: Yes, we will.<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: \u201cWhat is there to expect and to explore today?\u201d Does that mean that is all going to happen? I can\u2019t point to a chapter and verse in the Bible where it is; but my point is, if God loves us\u2014and He is love, and He says He is, and He says He does\u2014then He has prepared a place for us that where He is, we may be also. [John 14:3, Paraphrased] He said, \u201cEye hath not seen nor ear hath heard\u2014beauty, sound\u2014all of what God has created for those who know Jesus Christ and have placed their faith in Him.\u201d [1 Corinthians 2:9, Paraphrased]<\/p>\n<p>It's not so much just that the gospel saves us from hell, but it gets us into an entrance of something so grand and so wonderful\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: \u2014another thing, speaking of that, is that I think, often, \u201cWhat must Adam and Eve have been like before they sinned?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes, before the fall.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: Before the fall? When you think about our abilities, and [how] different ones have different exceptional abilities. There are a lot of people that have to wear glasses like we do now, but there are some people who have exceptional eyesight.<\/p>\n<p>Twenty\/twenty is what we consider normal and perfect eyesight, but what do you think our eyesight really will be? We think about hearing in a certain way. What do you think our hearing really will be? Then we watch these exceptional athletes who can jump so high off the floor and most of us can\u2019t jump six inches, but what if we\u2019re all like that?<\/p>\n<p>Ann: \u2014and brain capacity.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: \u2014and brain capacity, yes. They say we only use a small percentage of our brain. I think even that leads us to worship, because I think our bodies are going to be so much better than we can possibly imagine because of what we lost in the fall. If we think about what we lost, then the resurrected body is going to be so much better.<\/p>\n<p>It\u2019s another reason that looking forward to heaven is an exciting prospect; not a dull, boring, \u201cOh, I don\u2019t want to go there.\u201d I think there is so much to look forward to.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Now, how does that motivate you to grow older?<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: My mentor, teacher, and professor at Dallas Seminary, Howard Hendricks, said\u2014and it was said of him at his memorial service after he died (with his boots still on, by the way) having taught more than 13 thousand students at Dallas [Theological] Seminary\u2014he said: \u201cThe day your past is more exciting than the future is the day you start to die.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>The rearview mirror is good to look at in and glance at occasionally, but eyes transfixed on where you\u2019ve been, the regrets, the mistakes, the errors, etcetera\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: \u2014you are going nowhere when you\u2019re looking backwards, but if you are looking forward to heaven and to what God has waiting for us\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Ann: \u2014yes.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Yes, I have often thought in my Christian walk, if all my stories of God\u2019s miracles in my life or sharing Christ with a neighbor or a stranger are all five years ago\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: \u2014yes, all past tense\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Dave: \u2014or even a year ago, what am I doing?<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: I know.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: Exactly.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: They need to be fresh, which means I haven\u2019t quit.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: Right.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: I\u2019m not apathetic. I\u2019m thinking, \u201cI\u2019m going.\u201d I\u2019ve got my eyes open, and I\u2019m asking, \u201cGod, use me,\u201d and He will!<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: He will.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: If we are willing to say, \u201cUse me. Here I am; send me,\u201d He\u2019ll send you.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: Absolutely.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: And you\u2019ll have a fresh story today or yesterday, rather than 10 years ago.<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: I started thinking about going to heaven, and I thought, \u201cIf we were going on a vacation, what would you do?\u201d You would look for some travel guides. You\u2019d call a travel agent who had been there.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>We went to Italy as a result of leading FamilyLife for a number of years. [We] finally got away, so I called a woman who had been there 20 times. We had all this travel experience that we went to. If you are going to go to heaven, wouldn\u2019t you want to be reading about what heaven is, and what we\u2019ll do in heaven?<\/p>\n<p>Ann: I told my dad this same thing! I said, \u201cDad, I don\u2019t know a better planner for vacations than you.\u201d He\u2019d sit down; he\u2019d have everything laid out, maps,\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: \u2014mapped out.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: \u2014what we can do. He had it all calculated. I said, \u201cYou\u2019re such a good planner. You couldn\u2019t wait for the next vacation. Don\u2019t you want to know about heaven? There is going to be nothing that compares to heaven that you\u2019ve done. The Bible talks about it. There are books written about it.\u201d But he was scared.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: That\u2019s the thing.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: He said, \u201cIf I start talking about it, I feel like, maybe, I\u2019ll be there too soon,\u201d that fear part.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: I think the fear is real.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: But I think the opposite is true. I think if we talk about it, it makes us excited about going.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: It gives life to our todays. If you have anticipation for the future and hope for the future, you are going to be more alive today.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes. I remember talking to a lady in a nursing home. She was well into her 90\u2019s; she couldn\u2019t get out of bed. She told me\u2014I was sitting beside her bed, and she said: \u201cWhen I woke up this morning, I took a breath, and I said, \u2018I\u2019m still here. God must have something for me today.\u2019\u201d<\/p>\n<p>I thought, \u201cOh boy, I need that attitude.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: Yes, isn\u2019t that great?<\/p>\n<p>Ann: \u201cOh, I\u2019m still here. He must have a purpose for me today.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: I love that.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Me, too.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: I love that.<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: When Billy Graham died, I went to his memorial service, and the program had some words about heaven. Billy Graham said, \u201cDon\u2019t mourn for me and where I am, because I\u2019m going to be breathing celestial air.\u201d [Laughter] Bill Bright said the same thing; [he was] the founder of Campus Crusade for Christ and Cru.<\/p>\n<p>I think we need to be talking more about heaven, and I think we need to go near people who have knowledge, like Randy Alcorn, of a book that\u2019s like a travel guide about going to heaven.<\/p>\n<p>One guy that we ran across, who had some great words about heaven, [is] Dallas Willard. He was an author, professor, and thought leader on the West Coast. When he was two, his mother died. Her final words on her death bed to her husband, Dallas Willard\u2019s dad, were these: \u201cKeep eternity before the children.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Whoa!<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: Isn\u2019t that amazing?<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes!<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: When I first read that, I thought, \u201cMy lost words as a mom would have been, \u2018Make sure they know I love them,\u2019 and \u2018Take care of them.\u2019\u201d I would have never thought to say that, but isn\u2019t that amazing? \u201cKeep eternity in front of the children.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: I would have never thought of that.<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: Listen to what Dallas Willard said near the end of his life\u2014he said this about heaven: \u201cYour eternal destiny is not cosmic retirement. It is to be a part of a tremendously creative project under unimaginably splendid leadership on an inconceivably vast scale with an ever-increasing cycle of fruitfulness and enjoyment. This is the prophetic vision, which eye hath not seen nor ear hath heard.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Wow!<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: Isn\u2019t that great?<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: If you start talking about that, it makes living life now even all that much more important that we make deposits in heaven, where rust, where moths can\u2019t destroy. [Matthew 6:19, Paraphrased] We\u2019re taking people with us to heaven.<\/p>\n<p>Jim Dobson, founder of Focus on the Family, said, \u201cMy goal in life is to share Christ with as many people as possible and take as many with me to heaven as I possibly can.\u201d That\u2019s pretty crystal clear. [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>We need to be thinking back, \u201cWhen\u2019s the last time we talked to a person about their eternal destiny?\u201d because everybody\u2019s got one.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Right.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: The Bible teaches there are two: heaven and hell. All of eternity depends upon who we choose to give us life. Jesus Christ, He\u2019s the Savior; He came to redeem us. He died for our sins to satisfy a righteous God who can\u2019t let us in in our current, sinful state.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: I know one of the privileges, actually, of being a pastor and doing funerals\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: \u2014oh, yes\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Dave: \u2014is, it keeps heaven right in your face, whether it\u2019s an older person or a younger one, it doesn\u2019t matter.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: You get the privilege of doing a wedding, which is the beginning (and usually younger [people]). Then you walk up, and you have to deliver words to a family and friends who have just lost a loved one. You get in your car, and you drive home, and you\u2019re reminded: \u201cToday matters. How I live today matters,\u201d because we\u2019re all going there. It\u2019s not a matter of if, it\u2019s when; so, I want to live today full out, because when I go there it [will be] glorious; it [will be] incredible.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: It\u2019s interesting, too, because we\u2019ve gone to a lot of weddings, and we\u2019ll say, \u201cThat was great,\u201d but when you\u2019ve gone to the funeral of someone who has impacted lives for eternity, those are the ones you are talking about on the way home.<\/p>\n<p>We\u2019ve had many of those discussions of person after person who stood up testifying, \u201cThis man changed my life,\u201d \u201cThis woman led me to Christ,\u201d (or taught me or mentored me). We\u2019ve come home in the car and said, \u201cWe want to do that! We want to be that, instead of just growing old and living for ourselves.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: Yes; right. Dave: I\u2019ve done a few funerals. I usually try to encourage the family to do an open mic, saying, \u201cI\u2019m going to give you a moment. I can lead it. We\u2019ll keep it brief, but I\u2019d love to have people stand.\u201d And you don\u2019t even have to do a mic; just say some words.<\/p>\n<p>I\u2019ve done a few where nobody said a word. There was nothing to say. Dennis: No impact.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: That\u2019s sobering, isn\u2019t it?<\/p>\n<p>Dave: There was no impact. I\u2019ve done others where you have to stop it after 20 minutes, saying, \u201cOkay, we can\u2019t just keep going. This has been amazing.\u201d Even if I didn\u2019t know the guy or the gal, they were just somebody that I was doing the funeral for, and they\u2019re a stranger, [I walked] out thinking, \u201cThat\u2019s a life of impact. I don\u2019t know who they were, but they literally changed people for the Kingdom.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Okay, you\u2019ve got the person listening who is saying, \u201cBut do we really know if we can go to heaven? Do we really know?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: The metaphor that Jesus used is: \u201cBehold, I stand at the door and knock. If any hears my voice and bids me to come in to him, I will come in with him and sup with him and have fellowship with him.\u201d [Revelation 3:20, Paraphrased]<\/p>\n<p>I think people are listening right now who have heard Christ knock at the door, but they didn\u2019t do anything. They paused; they got distracted; they thought there was a life somewhere else, better, that they could live than this life that Christ has.<\/p>\n<p>I would say [to] just take Him at His word and say, \u201cLord, be merciful to me, a sinner. I\u2019m opening the door and inviting You to come into my messy life, and take my mess and make it Your life, purposeful, meaningful, all the way to the finish line. May I be used by You to take a lot of people to heaven with me.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Yes, that\u2019s the goal.<\/p>\n<p>I\u2019ll finish with this. I heard this quote, I\u2019ll bet, over 20 years ago. I don\u2019t know who Hunter S. Thompson is, but I\u2019ll bet you\u2019ve heard this quote. He said, \u201cLife should not be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well-preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside in a cloud of smoke, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming: \u2018Wow! What a Ride!\u2019\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: Really?<\/p>\n<p>Dave: That\u2019s the way to end it.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: That\u2019s cool. I\u2019ve never heard that.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: You haven\u2019t? Isn\u2019t it great?<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: I like that.<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: I\u2019ve heard that one.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: That is great.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: I heard it years ago, and I thought, \u201cThat\u2019s the goal.\u201d To the last breath\u2014Bill Bright, to the last breath: Billy Graham.<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: May our kids and our great grandkids say about Nani and Poppi, or whatever they call you guys, right? \u201cThey ran to the very end.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: That\u2019s what I want to hear.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Me, too.<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: When I attended Billy Graham\u2019s funeral\u2014I\u2019ve only had this happen one time in my life, and I\u2019ve been to a lot of funerals like you have\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Dave: \u2014I can imagine.<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: \u2014I actually collect the programs and save them and summarize on the outside of the program.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: You brought them to the pheasant hunt.<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: I did; I showed the guys a few of those.<\/p>\n<p>But at the end of some incredible stories of the grace Billy Graham gave his daughter, who was divorced twice and how she was so ashamed, but he was standing at the top of the driveway with his arms out like this when she came home. He was waiting on her. What a picture of the love of God and the grace of God!<\/p>\n<p>After [hearing] all these stories, and his coffin was made by prisoners in a prison in Louisiana\u2014oak, as I recall\u2014his coffin was put on these rollers, and they rolled it out of the tent there in Charlotte where we were meeting. They pushed it across the road and up a sidewalk, going up to where he was going to be laid.<\/p>\n<p>I still regret to this day that I didn\u2019t do what I wanted to do which was clap; to stand and give a standing ovation to the man who did it.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: That\u2019s how you do it.<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: He wasn\u2019t perfect. I heard him say some clumsy things near the end of his life, you know? It happens to all of us; but he did it; he ran the race all the way to the finish line.<\/p>\n<p>I was with another friend\u2014Kimmons was his name. I leaned over to him, and I said, \u201cI feel like standing and applauding while they are rolling this thing along.\u201d It was total silence, though, in awe of God, I believe, ultimately, but also a life well-lived.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: I\u2019ll tell you where they were clapping, when he entered into the gates of heaven\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: \u2014of heaven, yes\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Ann: \u2014and the people who he had led to Christ were standing there. I bet they gave him a standing ovation.<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: I have a feeling you are right. I hadn\u2019t thought of that, but that\u2019s good.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Thank you.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: We love you guys. Thank you so much.<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: We love you, too.<\/p>\n<p>Barbara: We really do.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: [You are] our heroes and our mentors, and we\u2019re watching. [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>Dave: We are following. That\u2019s what we\u2019re doing.<\/p>\n<p>Dennis: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Wasn\u2019t it fun to be with the Raineys today?<\/p>\n<p>Dave: It was awesome. I\u2019m inspired\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Ann: \u2014me, too.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: \u2014just hearing stories of how God worked in our Founder and former President, Dennis, and Barbara and what they are doing now. I tell you what, every time I\u2019m around them\u2014they\u2019re our mentors\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Ann: \u2014yes\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Dave: \u2014I\u2019m fired up spiritually.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: That\u2019s what I was thinking, too. I thought, \u201cThese guys have mentored us from close and afar for years.\u201d I don\u2019t know about some of you as a listener: do you have a mentor? We\u2019re hoping that this program could help mentor you, but also that you would find somebody from afar, or somebody close, that could really pour life and inspiration into you.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: One of the amazing things that mentors do is they help you to, [as] Psalm 34 [says], \u201cTaste and see that the Lord is good.\u201d I\u2019ve felt that way with Dennis and Barbara.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Me, too.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: I\u2019ll tell you what, if you jump in and become a partner financially with us, you can help others taste and see that the Lord is good by sharing this program with your neighbors.<\/p>\n<p>Shelby: I\u2019m Shelby Abbott, and you\u2019ve been listening to Dave and Ann Wilson with Dennis and Barbara Rainey on FamilyLife Today.<\/p>\n<p>As Dave and Ann were talking there at the end, the easiest way to partner with us is simply by going online to FamilyLifeToday.com to make your donation, or you can give us a call at 800-358-6329 to make your donation. Again, that number is \u201cF\u201d as in family, \u201cL\u201d as in life, and then the word, \u201cTODAY.\u201d Or feel free to drop us a donation in the mail, if you\u2019d like. Our address is FamilyLife, 100 Lake Hart Drive, Orlando, Florida 32832.<\/p>\n<p>Now, coming up next week, Daniel Nayeri is with us to talk about his memoir, Everything Sad is Untrue. It\u2019s the story of him growing up [through] his childhood in Iran, and then escaping to America, and how God used that to shape his life. That\u2019s coming up next week. We hope you will join us.<\/p>\n<p>On behalf of Dave and Ann Wilson, I\u2019m Shelby Abbott. We will see you back next time for another edition of FamilyLife Today.<\/p>\n<p>FamilyLife Today is a donor-supported production of FamilyLife\u00ae, a Cru\u00ae Ministry.<\/p>\n<p>Helping you pursue the relationships that matter most.<\/p>\n<p>We are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider donating today to help defray the costs? Copyright \u00a9 2024 FamilyLife. All rights reserved.<\/p>\n<p>www.FamilyLife<\/p>\n","theme_header_position":"Sticky","post_header_is_sticky":"default","is_header_overlay":"0"},"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast\/286834","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/podcast"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/47000"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=286834"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/280865"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=286834"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=286834"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=286834"},{"taxonomy":"podcast_series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast_series?post=286834"},{"taxonomy":"cwp_profile","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/cwp_profile?post=286834"},{"taxonomy":"series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/series?post=286834"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}