{"id":285234,"date":"2024-08-06T08:00:00","date_gmt":"2024-08-06T11:06:38","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/conflict-styles-whats-yours-debra-fileta\/"},"modified":"2025-06-10T16:59:12","modified_gmt":"2025-06-10T20:59:12","slug":"conflict-styles-whats-yours-debra-fileta","status":"publish","type":"podcast","link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/conflict-styles-whats-yours-debra-fileta\/","title":{"rendered":"Conflict Styles: What&#8217;s Yours? Debra Fileta"},"content":{"rendered":"<p>If people need people, do you have yours? To stick to healthy change, we all need support systems. Join Debra Fileta for practical tips on personal growth.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Do you &#038; your spouse have different conflict styles? How&#8217;s that going for you? Join Debra Fileta for advice on healthy communication and conflict in marriage.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":47000,"featured_media":280865,"menu_order":0,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"closed","template":"","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","inline_featured_image":false,"_uag_custom_page_level_css":"","episode_type":"audio","audio_file":"https:\/\/traffic.omny.fm\/d\/clips\/cbd16f10-ac60-4f09-b4df-b15400ce35aa\/33aaac7e-3581-4e21-a3df-b154011ba58c\/64489157-1887-482d-97b2-b1b50147d631\/audio.mp3","cover_image":"","cover_image_id":"","duration":"00:30:03","filesize":"27.55M","filesize_raw":"","date_recorded":"2024-08-06 08:00:00","explicit":"","block":""},"categories":[2902],"tags":[2730],"podcast_series":[8783],"cwp_profile":[9748],"series":[2101],"class_list":["post-285234","podcast","type-podcast","status-publish","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-resolving-conflict","tag-conflict-styles","podcast_series-reset-powerful-habits-to-change-your-life-debra-fileta","cwp_profile-debra-fileta","series-familylife-today"],"acf":[],"episode_featured_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/06\/image-scaled.jpg?w=1024","episode_player_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2023\/02\/image-scaled.jpg","download_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-download\/285234\/conflict-styles-whats-yours-debra-fileta","player_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-player\/285234\/conflict-styles-whats-yours-debra-fileta","audio_player":null,"episode_data":{"playerMode":"light","subscribeUrls":{"apple_podcasts":{"key":"apple_podcasts","url":"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303?mt=2&app=podcast","label":"Apple Podcasts","class":"apple_podcasts","icon":"apple-podcasts.png"},"google_podcasts":{"key":"google_podcasts","url":"","label":"Google Podcasts","class":"google_podcasts","icon":"google-podcasts.png"},"spotify":{"key":"spotify","url":"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm","label":"Spotify","class":"spotify","icon":"spotify.png"},"youtube":{"key":"youtube","url":"","label":"YouTube","class":"youtube","icon":"youtube.png"}},"rssFeedUrl":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/feed\/podcast\/familylife-today","embedCode":"<blockquote class=\"wp-embedded-content\" data-secret=\"vvYBpPVRdm\"><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/conflict-styles-whats-yours-debra-fileta\/\">Conflict Styles: What&#8217;s Yours? 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This file is auto-generated *\/\n!function(d,l){\"use strict\";l.querySelector&&d.addEventListener&&\"undefined\"!=typeof URL&&(d.wp=d.wp||{},d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage||(d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage=function(e){var t=e.data;if((t||t.secret||t.message||t.value)&&!\/[^a-zA-Z0-9]\/.test(t.secret)){for(var s,r,n,a=l.querySelectorAll('iframe[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),o=l.querySelectorAll('blockquote[data-secret=\"'+t.secret+'\"]'),c=new RegExp(\"^https?:$\",\"i\"),i=0;i<o.length;i++)o[i].style.display=\"none\";for(i=0;i<a.length;i++)s=a[i],e.source===s.contentWindow&&(s.removeAttribute(\"style\"),\"height\"===t.message?(1e3<(r=parseInt(t.value,10))?r=1e3:~~r<200&&(r=200),s.height=r):\"link\"===t.message&&(r=new URL(s.getAttribute(\"src\")),n=new URL(t.value),c.test(n.protocol))&&n.host===r.host&&l.activeElement===s&&(d.top.location.href=t.value))}},d.addEventListener(\"message\",d.wp.receiveEmbedMessage,!1),l.addEventListener(\"DOMContentLoaded\",function(){for(var e,t,s=l.querySelectorAll(\"iframe.wp-embedded-content\"),r=0;r<s.length;r++)(t=(e=s[r]).getAttribute(\"data-secret\"))||(t=Math.random().toString(36).substring(2,12),e.src+=\"#?secret=\"+t,e.setAttribute(\"data-secret\",t)),e.contentWindow.postMessage({message:\"ready\",secret:t},\"*\")},!1)))}(window,document);\n\/\/# sourceURL=https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-includes\/js\/wp-embed.min.js\n<\/script>\n"},"spectra_custom_meta":{"secondline_imported_guid":["64489157-1887-482d-97b2-b1b50147d631"],"audio_file":["https:\/\/traffic.omny.fm\/d\/clips\/cbd16f10-ac60-4f09-b4df-b15400ce35aa\/33aaac7e-3581-4e21-a3df-b154011ba58c\/64489157-1887-482d-97b2-b1b50147d631\/audio.mp3"],"duration":["00:30:03"],"filesize":["27.55M"],"_thumbnail_id":["280865"],"show_notes":["<ul>\n<li>Help make YOUR mark: Your donation supports crucial resources for families and includes a special FamilyLife Pen and Brant Hansen's book, \"\"Unoffendable\"\"\u2014<a href=\"https:\/\/donate.familylife.com\/august-2024\/urgent-need\/?cru_source=FLTD24&amp;cru_medium=Icare&amp;cru_campaign=August2024\">join us today!<\/a><\/li>\n<li>Connect with Debra Fileta and catch more of their thoughts at <a href=\"https:\/\/debrafileta.com\/\">debrafileta.com<\/a>, and on Insta <a href=\"https:\/\/www.instagram.com\/DebraFileta\/\">@debrafileta<\/a> and catch other episodes on <a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/?s=debra+fileta\">FamilyLife Today<\/a>.<\/li>\n<li>And grab her book, \"<a href=\"https:\/\/shop.familylife.com\/product\/reset-powerful-habits-to-own-your-thoughts-understand-your-feelings-and-change-your-life\/\">Reset: Powerful Habits to Own Your Thoughts, Understand Your Feelings, and Change Your Life<\/a>,\" in our shop!<\/li>\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/shop.familylife.com\/product-category\/group-studies\/companion-workbooks\/\">Explore FamilyLife's diverse selection of workbooks<\/a>, including the new Art of Marriage\u2014perfect for small groups, marriage events, and personal growth journeys!<\/li>\n<li>Find resources from this podcast at <a href=\"https:\/\/shop.familylife.com\/product-category\/radio-resources\/\">shop.familylife.com<\/a>.<\/li>\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/shop.familylife.com\/product-category\/past-radio-resources\/\">See resources from our past podcasts.<\/a><\/li>\n<li>Find more content and resources on the <a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/app\/\">FamilyLife's app<\/a>!<\/li>\n<li>Help others find FamilyLife. Leave a review on <a href=\"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303\">Apple Podcast<\/a> or <a href=\"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm?si=d6dfa8d2415f4750\">Spotify<\/a>.<\/li>\n<li>Check out all the FamilyLife's podcasts on the <a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/familylife-podcast-network\/\">FamilyLife Podcast Network<\/a><\/li>\n<\/ul>\n"],"transcript_content":["<p>FamilyLife Today\u00ae National Radio Version (time edited) Transcript<\/p>\n<p>References to conferences, resources, or other special promotions may be obsolete.<\/p>\n<p>Conflict Styles: What\u2019s Yours?<\/p>\n<p>Guest:Debra Fileta<\/p>\n<p>From the series:Reset: Powerful Habits to Own Your Thoughts,<\/p>\n<p>Understand Your Feelings, and Change Your Life (Day 2 of 3)<\/p>\n<p>Air date:August 6, 2024<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Before we get started today, we have something special for you, our listeners. We have a sale.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Yes, on small group materials. When you are leading a small group, you are always looking for great stuff; and we\u2019ve got some great stuff.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes!<\/p>\n<p>Dave: The Art of Marriage\u2122, Vertical Marriage\u00ae, Love Like You Mean It\u00ae\u2014you name it\u2014we\u2019ve got great small group material for you, and it\u2019s on sale right now.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Twenty-five percent off for the whole month of August.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Go to FamilyLife.com\/shop, and get your discount, and get your stuff, and get ready; because God is going to change lives in your family room as you lead that small group.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: When we acknowledge our brokenness, we\u2019re acknowledging a need for a healer. He\u2019s offering us this invitation. I think, sometimes, we feel shame at all our sore spots when really we should hear Him saying, \u201cI\u2019m inviting you to heal.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Shelby: Welcome to FamilyLife Today, where we want to help you pursue the relationships that matter most. I\u2019m Shelby Abbott, and your hosts are Dave and Ann Wilson. You can find us at FamilyLifeToday.com.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: This is FamilyLife Today.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: I was thinking one of the most exciting parts of ministry, especially as a preacher or a speaker, and you give a message, where you are calling people to action\u2014and let\u2019s say people raise a hand or they come forward,\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: \u2014some kind of action\u2014you\u2019re thinking, \u201cThis is so exciting. People want to change; they\u2019re coming forward. That\u2019s awesome!\u201d<\/p>\n<p>And then, the most frustrating part of ministry is: they don\u2019t change. A week later\/a month later, the same thing.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: I think we, as people, going up and saying, \u201cYes, I want this to happen. I want God to change me,\u201d\u2014maybe, we\u2019ve repented of sin\u2014sometimes, we can think, because of that repentance and our surrender to Jesus, everything will be great; and we won\u2019t continue to sin or fall into these old habit patterns\u2014but then, we do; and we get super discouraged.<\/p>\n<p>And maybe, our spouse does, too. Maybe, he says, \u201cI\u2019ve struggled with porn; but I\u2019m never going to do that again, ever.\u201d And then, he does; so as a wife or a husband, you can feel betrayed.<\/p>\n<p>So why are we talking about that today?<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Today, we are going to get to the root of: \u201cWhy does this happen?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: It\u2019s a common problem. You can hear Debra\u2019s voice over there; she\u2019s back with us.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Debra Fileta is back, with her book, Reset. If you have not read Debra\u2019s books, you need to get them.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: As you hear us talking about this, I know this is a universal problem, not just in ministry, but in life.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: It\u2019s like: \u201cI want to change,\u201d \u201cI\u2019m going to change\u201d; and you change for a little bit. I\u2019m saying \u201cthey,\u201d\u2014but we do the same thing; I\u2019ve done this\u2014and then, they\u2019re back to the same old patterns.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: You just talked a little bit about being a pastor. You see people come up to the altar and crying\u2014and lives\u2014and \u201cThis is it!\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Genuine.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Genuine; honestly, so often, those people do change because the Holy Spirit can do whatever He wants to do.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Good point.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: I have seen drug addicts turn a corner overnight and start living their life in a healthy way.<\/p>\n<p>But the majority of the time, the problem is that we\u2019re giving them directions\u2014let\u2019s say we want them to get from point A to point B\u2014they come up there; we\u2019re saying, \u201cAnd the next step is to take a left.\u201d And they say, \u201cYes, we\u2019re going to do it; we\u2019re going to take a left.\u201d They take a left. It\u2019s Monday morning; \u201cOkay, which way do I go next? The pastor is not here anymore to help me. How do I know which way to go next?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>This is why the work of counseling\u2014we see such high levels of success and healing\u2014you were talking about: \u201cIt\u2019s hard to see people change\u201d; I see people change every single day of my life. It\u2019s because now they have a GPS: \u201cTurn left; then, turn right. Then go straight for 200 feet; and then, take a left over there.\u201d There is somebody who is helping guide them.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: So they have the Holy Spirit\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Debra: They have the Holy Spirit.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: \u2014who is the Helper, the Guide. But you are saying they also have another person.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Some practical steps.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes, that\u2019s good.<\/p>\n<p>Recap where we were yesterday, because we get in these situations like we talked about yesterday\u2014where we want to change; we want to be more healthy\u2014or to not be addicted to porn or to not be so angry\u2014we have all these different things; you said so many yesterday, beautifully. Recap that a little bit; and then, let\u2019s move on from where we were yesterday.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: The formula that you need to keep in your mind for healing is the idea that thoughts lead to feelings which, then, lead to your behaviors. You can\u2019t just start with the behaviors: \u201cHere\u2019s what I want to change: I\u2019m angry. My spouse and I have all this conflict.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>\u201cOkay, that\u2019s the behavior. What is the feeling underneath the surface?\u201d\u2014\u201cI\u2019m feeling unappreciated,\u201d \u201cI\u2019m feeling invaluable,\u201d \u201cI\u2019m feeling inadequate.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>\u201cAnd then, where does that come from? What is the thought under the surface?\u201d\u2014\u201cI\u2019m not good enough,\u201d \u201cMy spouse will never see me.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>There\u2019s thoughts under the surface there that are causing you to react, causing you to do what you do. No matter the behavior, you are going to find a feeling that triggers that behavior; and underneath that, you are going to find a thought process that God wants to replace with truth.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Recently, we did a conference. I had a young woman come up to me, saying that she had had an affair. She hasn\u2019t been married very long, maybe five years; they have a couple kids. She was sobbing, because she said that this has been going on for six months. I asked her: \u201cDo you want to leave him? Do you want to stay married? Where are you in this?\u201d She said, \u201cYes, I realized I want to stay married. I want to do what God wants me to do.\u201d On follow-up\u2014after she got back, what happened is\u2014she\u2019s like, \u201cNow, I don\u2019t know if I want to follow God; because this feels really good, what\u2019s happening.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>I\u2019m talking to more women right now, who are having affairs, than I\u2019ve seen in a long time. Let\u2019s get to that. Let\u2019s say somebody is saying, \u201cI\u2019m in this affair, because my husband: \u2018I am not seen,\u2019 \u2018He doesn\u2019t appreciate me,\u2019 \u2018He\u2019s not who I thought he was.\u2019\u201d These are things that we hear. What would you say to her, if you met her at that conference or maybe the day after, where she\u2019s like, \u201cI don\u2019t know if I want to do that\u2014go back to my husband\u201d?<\/p>\n<p>Debra: The tricky part is that, sometimes, our unhealthy coping mechanisms feel better peripherally\u2014\u201cOh, that feels good,\u201d\u2014but they always come at a cost. If they didn\u2019t feel good, we\u2019d be crazy to do them\u2014if alcohol didn\u2019t feel good, if overeating didn\u2019t feel good, if an affair didn\u2019t feel good, if porn didn\u2019t feel good\u2014we wouldn\u2019t do it!<\/p>\n<p>Ann: It wouldn\u2019t even be a struggle.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: We\u2019d be crazy, right?<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Right.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: There\u2019s some sort of reward that you are getting out of that behavior. \u201cWhat\u2019s the reward?\u201d\u2014that\u2019s where I would start with her We\u2019d be crazy, right?<\/p>\n<p>\u201cWhat\u2019s the reward?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: That\u2019s good.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: \u201cWhat is it that you are for in this? Why do you keep defaulting to this behavior?\u201d Maybe she\u2019ll say, \u201cThe reward is that I feel seen.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: \u201cI feel good,\u201d \u201cI feel seen,\u201d \u201cI feel loved.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Dave: \u201cI don\u2019t feel that in my marriage.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Yes; \u201cI don\u2019t feel that in my marriage.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Then, I would ask her to dig a little bit deeper: \u201cWhen do you not feel that in your marriage? Let\u2019s isolate that feeling: \u2018When?\u2019\u201d It could be something as small as: \u201cWhen my husband comes home, he barely says two words to me. He\u2019s so distracted by the kids, and I feel that I am not a priority to him.\u201d You are not a priority\u2014that\u2019s the underlying thought\u2014\u201cI\u2019m not a priority.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>If we take it a step further\u2014usually, people who are struggling with things that are this extreme, if you ask them, \u201cWhen have you felt like you are not a priority before you got married? Is there any time you can pinpoint feeling that you are not a priority?\u201d\u2014almost 99.9 percent of the time, they\u2019ll say, \u201cYes, I was neglected in my family. My mom and dad were so busy and distracted, and I felt like I had to raise myself.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>There\u2019s going to be some sort of a theme that is making this interaction with your spouse feel so painful; because for Betsy, it might not feel painful as it does for Sue. Her husband might come home, and he\u2019s distracted; and it doesn\u2019t feel that painful because: \u201cGuess what? He\u2019s helping with the kids, and he\u2019s running here and there\u201d; so she sees it differently. Whereas, for the first person, it\u2019s like, \u201cI feel so neglected\u201d; because he\u2019s pushing on a sore spot\/a trigger that she didn\u2019t even know existed.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: This is so good. Debra, when you talk about this in the book, I thought, \u201cOh! This is so good:\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Dave: \u2014emotional sore spots?<\/p>\n<p>Ann: \u2014\"emotional sore spots.\u201d You\u2019re saying, \u201cYou are pushing on that emotional sore spot\u201d; that happens to so many of us.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: And we don\u2019t even realize it\u2019s happening; and we are thinking, \u201cMy spouse is terrible.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: \u201cHe\u2019s awful; he\u2019s not prioritizing me.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>That doesn\u2019t mean that you shouldn\u2019t have a conversation with your spouse, and say, \u201cHey, I\u2019m feeling unappreciated. When you come home, it would mean a lot to me if you would look me in the eyes for five minutes and just give me your first few minutes to make me think that I\u2019m a priority.\u201d It\u2019s your responsibility to communicate that.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: I like that you gave a specific thing to do, too; because our husbands, or our wives, don\u2019t know what we need unless we tell them.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: They have no clue; they have no clue what is triggering us. They don\u2019t know our sore spots. I think of a time when [John and I] were leaving the house. He came over to put his arm around me, just to say, \u201cI love you\u201d; and he pushed on a sore spot. Earlier that day, I was going on an errand with the kids. You know how long it takes to get four kids out of the house? [Laughter] It\u2019s like an Olympic event.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: We\u2019ve watched our son and his wife do this with four kids.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: You get them out of the house\u2014it\u2019s so much work\u2014so many things. I was in a rush. I slammed my shoulder on a coat rack. I thought, \u201cOh, that\u2019s painful; that\u2019s going to leave a bruise.\u201d Later, when John came to put his arm around me\u2014he didn\u2019t know there was a sore spot there; he didn\u2019t cause it\u2014he pushed on it; and I reacted, \u201cOuch! You just hurt me.\u201d \u201cOh, sorry; I didn\u2019t know there was a sore spot there.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Think about that, emotionally. We could call those \u201cemotional sore spots\u201d; we can call them \u201ctriggers.\u201d But there is something there, when you find yourself reacting in a big way or feeling a big feeling: \u201cI feel so unloved,\u201d \u201cI feel so unappreciated.\u201d But when you actually look at the situation\u2014it\u2019s not like he had an affair; it\u2019s not like he\u2019s sitting there, doing cocaine\u2014he\u2019s not neglecting you to that level: \u201cWhy do you have such a strong response?\u201d It\u2019s usually coming from something else\u2014a sore spot\u2014that was caused before you even got married.<\/p>\n<p>If we could do some sort of a scan to figure out where all our sore spots were, wouldn\u2019t that be amazing? But guess what the scan is?\u2014our spouse. [Laughter] Because they push on them. And when they push on them, you have two options.<\/p>\n<p>Option number one is to pull away and blame them.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes, that\u2019s what most of us do.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Option number two is to heal: \u201cWhat\u2019s this? Why does this hurt so much? Where does this come from? God, how do You want me to heal from this feeling of being unseen?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Because only He can replace our trauma with truth: \u201cNo, you are seen; you are loved. I saw you even when you were a kid, and your parents weren\u2019t aware of you, and they were so busy and distracted. I saw you; I was there with you.\u201d When you can live out of a place of healing, it changes everything.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: \u2014everything.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: This describes, literally, our marriage for 30 years.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Oh, absolutely.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: And we did not know\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Ann: \u2014any of this.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: \u2014what was happening. It was Ann blaming me for being gone all the time. Of course, I don\u2019t even know why I\u2019m gone all the time.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Right, right.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Now, I do; we even talked about it yesterday. It wasn\u2019t until we sat with a counselor\u2014and he sort of did what you talked about: thoughts, feelings, behaviors\u2014he said, \u201cAnn, isn\u2019t this interesting? In your life, you were never seen.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Wow!<\/p>\n<p>Dave: I\u2019m sitting there, literally, beside her, thinking, \u201cThat\u2019s our story. She\u2019s mad at me\/upset with me, because I\u2019m rushing around;\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Ann: \u2014that\u2019s my sore spot\/my trigger.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: \u2014\"and she\u2019s not seen again.\u201d It was the same issue for us, often. It came back, always: \u201cI\u2019m rushing around doing this; she\u2019s home and not feeling seen.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>I just wonder how many other couples, right now, are listening to you, and thinking\u2014it may be the same issue we have in our marriage or a different one\u2014but it\u2019s a sore spot they didn\u2019t realize was there.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Right.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: The big question is: \u201cHow do you get to the root of that?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: You even said off-air\u2014and I think it\u2019s a really interesting discussion\u2014Romans 7 [v.15-20]: Paul, talking about his spiritual walk, says, \u201cI don\u2019t do the things I want to do. I do the things I don\u2019t want to do. I don\u2019t understand why.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Talk about that a little bit.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Yes, \u201cI don\u2019t understand why.\u201d So many Christians use that passage\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Right.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: \u2014to excuse their addiction.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: We did at church.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: I\u2019m not excusing it.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Oh, no, no, no; not us\u2014we never did, Ann\u2014not me.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: But it explains it.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Yes; never Dave.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Never me; some other pastor did.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Not to excuse; but explain: \u201cHey, we all struggle again, and again, and again, and again.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: So it\u2019s normal.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Right; it\u2019s normal.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Our sin nature; exactly. Even Paul struggled. But did you notice? He said, \u201cWhy? I don\u2019t understand.\u201d Why?\u2014maybe, if we could actually understand, things would begin to change.<\/p>\n<p>God wants us to have understanding\u2014Proverbs 20, verse 5, says: \u201cThe purposes of a person\u2019s heart are like deep waters, but a person of insight draws them out,\u201d\u2014if you want to be a wise person of insight, you go deep into that well. You draw up the waters. It\u2019s not easy. In ancient times, drawing up the deep waters wasn\u2019t like turning on a spigot.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes. [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>Debra: At our house, it\u2019s automatic; because my husband\u2019s a germaphobe, and he doesn\u2019t like to touch the spigot. You just put your hands underneath; and it just flows, like a laser beam.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: You\u2019ve got one of those?<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Yes, we\u2019ve got one of those.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Oh, really? Wow!<\/p>\n<p>Debra: But that\u2019s not what it was like to draw out water in ancient days; this took work.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: \u2014cranking.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: And the same for us\u2014to draw out that stuff\u2014it takes work; it takes time; it takes intentionality.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: You would know better than anybody: \u201cAren\u2019t a lot of us afraid of doing the work?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Yes, of course.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: It\u2019s as if to say, \u201cI\u2019m stuck in some ways.\u201d I\u2019m speaking for all of us in some ways: \u201cI\u2019m just afraid; I don\u2019t want to go in there.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Debra: We don\u2019t know what\u2019s going to come out of that well.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: It\u2019s so dark; yes.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: I think, too\u2014speaking for me, with sexual abuse in my background\u2014it feels better, sometimes, that the Band-Aid\u00ae is on there.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Right.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: But to take off the Band-Aid\u2014and start digging into the infection and the wound that\u2019s underneath\u2014it hurts.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: It does hurt.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: You don\u2019t want to feel those feelings again\u2014and feel the betrayal and feel so many things\u2014I think people wonder, \u201cCan I handle it?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Debra: You're right. Going with that analogy: if that wound is left untended to, it could cause some serious problems. You\u2019ve heard of wounds getting so infected that someone has to get amputated. This is the same thing in our life; we have to deal with it. It feels better for a while\u2014but like we said last time\u2014eventually, something will break down; and the cost of that is so much greater.<\/p>\n<p>I like to be practical. So for the couples listening, it\u2019s like, \u201cWhere do I even begin?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Step number one would be: \u201cTo identify your conflict cycle.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Every couple has a prominent conflict cycle. For you guts, it would be: \u201cHe keeps leaving. I keep feeling unprioritized; and then, we fight about it. He\u2019s so busy. I feel\u2014I\u2019m home; I\u2019m by myself\u2014he doesn\u2019t want to be here with me.\u201d And he is thinking, \u201cNo, I have so much going on.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Dave: \u201cI\u2019m providing for the family.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Debra: \u201cI\u2019m providing for the family; I\u2019m working hard.\u201d That\u2019s the conflict cycle.<\/p>\n<p>Every couple has a conflict cycle. Once you can map out the conflict cycle, you can start digging a little bit deeper and a little bit deeper. For some couples, they are going to listen to this, and they are going to be able to sit down, and say, \u201cWhat\u2019s our conflict cycle? Let\u2019s talk through it.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>\u201cOh, our conflict cycle is: every time I give you feedback, you freak out; that\u2019s our conflict cycle. And then, you feel offended; and then, I feel hurt that you are offended.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>It could be so many different things for different couples. Once you map it out, it can help you. Some couples are going to be able to map out their conflict cycle, and see:<\/p>\n<p>\u201cOh, maybe, it\u2019s rooted in that I was always criticized, as a kid; so I have a hard time receiving feedback from anybody.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>\u201cOr maybe it was rooted in the fact I was never criticized as a kid, and everybody loved me all the time, and my life was amazing. I was the star athlete, so I have a hard time handling feedback.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>You start mapping it out. But for other couples, they're going to need help. They are going to need a trained counselor, to say, \u201cOkay; let\u2019s figure this out. I\u2019m here to help you. Let\u2019s do the work: let\u2019s come up with your conflict cycle and get healed.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: People are listening. A wife is thinking, \u201cOkay, we are going to do this tonight; let\u2019s talk about our conflict cycle.\u201d How would she even bring it up?<\/p>\n<p>Debra: The best time to bring it up is not during a fight. [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Let\u2019s just start there. Bring it up when you are both calm: \u201cI just heard this radio program. They were talking about conflict cycles and how every couple has their go-to conflict cycle\u2014something that causes them to fight; something that causes tension\u2014I\u2019m curious what you think ours is.\u201d Let them start\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Good; that\u2019s good.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: \u2014instead of saying: \u201cHere\u2019s what I think ours is\u2026\u201d and \u201cHere\u2019s what I think you're doing...\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Let\u2019s say he says, \u201cI know what ours is: you are always on me. I can never do anything right, and you are always on me. And then, I get mad; and I leave,\u201d or \u201c\u2026I yell back.\u201d If he says that, what\u2019s her next step?<\/p>\n<p>Debra: To listen: \u201cThat\u2019s a really great start. Okay; you feel like I\u2019m always on you. When\u2014when does that come up?\u2014when I ask you to do something around the house?\u201d Let him continue to talk, and you listen. And then, you can share your perspective: \u201cHere\u2019s what I think our conflict cycle looks like; here\u2019s when I feel the most hurt\u2026\u201d<\/p>\n<p>You talk about it in a place when you are not both triggered. If you can\u2019t do that, that means you are not ready to do this. If you can\u2019t do that, that means you need a counselor\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: That\u2019s good.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: \u2014to help you walk through it.<\/p>\n<p>If you are thinking, \u201cOh, yes; that is not going to go well,\u201d then that\u2019s all the evidence you need to sign up to work with a counselor; because, honestly, it shouldn\u2019t be that hard. If it is, that means there are things on both sides of the equation that we need an objective party to help you work through; there are too many sore spots in that case.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes, yes.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Do people change before they have enough pain? I remember preaching this, years ago: \u201cPeople don\u2019t really change until the pain gets great enough.\u201d You don\u2019t change your diet until you look in the mirror, and think, \u201cI\u2019m done with this.\u201d Or you go to the heart doctor, and he says, \u201cYou have to stop eating this, because you are about to have a heart attack.\u201d Or you do have a heart attack\u2014and bam!\u2014change starts. Is that how it sort of works?<\/p>\n<p>Debra: In Reset, I talk about the five stages of change. That\u2019s something we refer to a lot, as counselors; it\u2019s the idea of: \u201cWhere is that point where the scale tips in the direction of healing?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>The first stage is precontemplation: \u201cI don\u2019t know. What\u2019s the point of change?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Contemplation is the second stage: \u201cI\u2019m starting to see more reasons why I should change.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Once you get there, that\u2019s when people start changing and coming up with a plan.<\/p>\n<p>And taking action.<\/p>\n<p>And then, you have to maintain the change.<\/p>\n<p>There are five different stages; but the question is: \u201cWhat\u2019s it going to take to tip that scale?\u201d And for each person, it\u2019s different. I\u2019ll tell you why, Dave: some people have a higher pain tolerance.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Oh, yes.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Right? You strike me as that kind of a guy.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: I was just going to say, \u201cThis is Dave.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Debra: You\u2019re running, running: \u201cI don\u2019t want to deal with that.\u201d You have a higher pain tolerance; so maybe, for someone like you, it would take something to break\u2014like you and Ann talk about\u2014\u201cIt got so bad.\u201d But maybe, for somebody else, it\u2019s: \u201cOoh; I feel that pain quickly,\u201d and \u201cI don\u2019t like how it feels, and I want this out of my life.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>I think people have different levels of emotional pain tolerance, [which] also comes from trauma.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Debra, as we close, how would you bring Jesus into this? Because in all that you do, He is always a part of it. And, as a couple, why is that so important?<\/p>\n<p>Debra: I would say we can\u2019t keep Him out of it. Even if we are trying to keep Him out of it, He is the great Healer. When we acknowledge our brokenness, we\u2019re acknowledging a need for a healer. He\u2019s offering us this invitation. I think, sometimes, we feel shame at all our sore spots when really we should hear Him saying, \u201cI\u2019m inviting you to heal. I am trusting you to heal, because I know what I have for you. I know the plans I have for you, and the purposes I have for you, and you need to be healed.\u201d When we see that God is bringing things up, we need to be grateful that He is inviting us into a deeper level with Him as well as a deeper level with our spouse.<\/p>\n<p>Shelby: Okay; we\u2019ll hear a really helpful response from Dave Wilson, here, in just a second. But first, I\u2019m Shelby Abbott; and you\u2019ve been listening to Dave and Ann Wilson, with Debra Fileta, on FamilyLife Today. Debra has written a book called Reset: Powerful Habits to Own Your Thoughts, Understand Your Feelings, and Change Your Life. You can get your copy, right now, by going online to FamilyLifeToday.com; or you can check I out in the show notes. Or feel free to give us a call at 800-358-6329; again, the number is 800-\u201cF\u201d as in family, \u201cL\u201d as in life, and then the word, \u201cTODAY.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>I know it\u2019s early August right now, but fall is coming up really soon. As you\u2019re getting ready for small groups that might be happening in your church, or wherever you might be leading a ministry, we wanted to let you know that all of our FamilyLife\u00ae workbooks are now 25 percent off through the end of this month. You can go to the show notes, at FamilyLifeToday.com, look around and pick out what might be best for you. Again, all our FamilyLife workbooks are going to be 25 percent off through the end of August.<\/p>\n<p>Okay, here\u2019s some reflections from Dave Wilson on what we\u2019ve heard today.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: You said, earlier, I thought was so profound: \u201cWhen your spouse says something, like a truth comment, it\u2019s\u201d\u2014like you just said\u2014\"an invitation.\u201d We see it as: \u201cYou\u2019re meddling in my life; you\u2019re critiquing me.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>If we could twist our perspective, it would be: \u201cWait, wait, wait, wait, wait; God just entered. He said, \u2018Hey, Dave. I want you to look at something\u2014I said it through Ann\u2014but I want you to look at something. By the way, I said this to three of your buddies in the last six months. There\u2019s a pattern here\u2014it\u2019s Me; I\u2019m in this\u2014I want to draw you into something deeper and better. You are going to change if you go there.\u2019\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Rather than: \u201cI don\u2019t want to hear this. I don\u2019t want you speaking this again to me. I\u2019m good; we\u2019re good. We should be happy.\u201d I\u2019ve said that: \u201cI\u2019m a good husband; you should be happy. I\u2019ve seen husbands that aren\u2019t good; I\u2019m better,\u201d\u2014rather than\u2014\u201cOh, my goodness; God is inviting me to a journey, which could be awesome.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Yes, our pain points are just an invitation.<\/p>\n<p>Shelby: Now, coming up tomorrow, Debra Fileta is back to talk about emotional recovery. She\u2019s going to specifically dive into healing from childhood trauma and how that trauma impacts our daily relationships. That\u2019s tomorrow; we hope you\u2019ll join us. On behalf of Dave and Ann Wilson, I\u2019m Shelby Abbott. We will see you back next time for another edition of FamilyLife Today.<\/p>\n<p>FamilyLife Today is a donor-supported production of FamilyLife, a Cru\u00ae Ministry.<\/p>\n<p>Helping you pursue the relationships that matter most.<\/p>\n<p>We are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider donating today to help defray the costs?<\/p>\n<p>Copyright \u00a9 2024 FamilyLife. All rights reserved.<\/p>\n<p>www.FamilyLife<\/p>\n"],"transcript_url":["https:\/\/transcript.familylife.com\/fl2024-08-06.pdf"],"_edit_lock":["1749590447:47000"],"_edit_last":["47000"],"theme_header_position":["Sticky"],"post_header_is_sticky":["default"],"is_header_overlay":["0"],"episode_type":["audio"],"date_recorded":["2024-08-06 08:00:00"],"enclosure":["https:\/\/traffic.omny.fm\/d\/clips\/cbd16f10-ac60-4f09-b4df-b15400ce35aa\/33aaac7e-3581-4e21-a3df-b154011ba58c\/64489157-1887-482d-97b2-b1b50147d631\/audio.mp3"],"_seopress_redirections_type":["301"],"_seopress_redirections_logged_status":["both"],"_seopress_analysis_target_kw":[""],"_g_feedback_shortcode_2588f18880247413f5fb6dba476fb1e65923ce50":["\n\t\t\t\t[contact-field label=\"Name\" type=\"name\"  required=\"true\" \/]\n\t\t\t\t[contact-field label=\"Email\" type=\"email\" required=\"true\" \/]\n\t\t\t\t[contact-field label=\"Website\" type=\"url\" \/]\n\t\t\t\t[contact-field label=\"Message\" type=\"textarea\" \/]"],"_g_feedback_shortcode_atts_2588f18880247413f5fb6dba476fb1e65923ce50":["a:17:{s:2:\"to\";s:29:\"margaret.coyle@familylife.com\";s:7:\"subject\";s:73:\"[FamilyLife - A Cru Ministry] Conflict Styles: What's Yours? 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you & your spouse have different conflict styles? How's that going for you? Join Debra Fileta for advice on healthy communication and conflict in marriage.","meta_box":{"show_notes":"<ul>\n<li>Help make YOUR mark: Your donation supports crucial resources for families and includes a special FamilyLife Pen and Brant Hansen's book, \"\"Unoffendable\"\"\u2014<a href=\"https:\/\/donate.familylife.com\/august-2024\/urgent-need\/?cru_source=FLTD24&amp;cru_medium=Icare&amp;cru_campaign=August2024\">join us today!<\/a><\/li>\n<li>Connect with Debra Fileta and catch more of their thoughts at <a href=\"https:\/\/debrafileta.com\/\">debrafileta.com<\/a>, and on Insta <a href=\"https:\/\/www.instagram.com\/DebraFileta\/\">@debrafileta<\/a> and catch other episodes on <a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/?s=debra+fileta\">FamilyLife Today<\/a>.<\/li>\n<li>And grab her book, \"<a href=\"https:\/\/shop.familylife.com\/product\/reset-powerful-habits-to-own-your-thoughts-understand-your-feelings-and-change-your-life\/\">Reset: Powerful Habits to Own Your Thoughts, Understand Your Feelings, and Change Your Life<\/a>,\" in our shop!<\/li>\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/shop.familylife.com\/product-category\/group-studies\/companion-workbooks\/\">Explore FamilyLife's diverse selection of workbooks<\/a>, including the new Art of Marriage\u2014perfect for small groups, marriage events, and personal growth journeys!<\/li>\n<li>Find resources from this podcast at <a href=\"https:\/\/shop.familylife.com\/product-category\/radio-resources\/\">shop.familylife.com<\/a>.<\/li>\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/shop.familylife.com\/product-category\/past-radio-resources\/\">See resources from our past podcasts.<\/a><\/li>\n<li>Find more content and resources on the <a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/app\/\">FamilyLife's app<\/a>!<\/li>\n<li>Help others find FamilyLife. Leave a review on <a href=\"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303\">Apple Podcast<\/a> or <a href=\"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm?si=d6dfa8d2415f4750\">Spotify<\/a>.<\/li>\n<li>Check out all the FamilyLife's podcasts on the <a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/familylife-podcast-network\/\">FamilyLife Podcast Network<\/a><\/li>\n<\/ul>\n","transcript_url":"https:\/\/transcript.familylife.com\/fl2024-08-06.pdf","transcript_content":"<p>FamilyLife Today\u00ae National Radio Version (time edited) Transcript<\/p>\n<p>References to conferences, resources, or other special promotions may be obsolete.<\/p>\n<p>Conflict Styles: What\u2019s Yours?<\/p>\n<p>Guest:Debra Fileta<\/p>\n<p>From the series:Reset: Powerful Habits to Own Your Thoughts,<\/p>\n<p>Understand Your Feelings, and Change Your Life (Day 2 of 3)<\/p>\n<p>Air date:August 6, 2024<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Before we get started today, we have something special for you, our listeners. We have a sale.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Yes, on small group materials. When you are leading a small group, you are always looking for great stuff; and we\u2019ve got some great stuff.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes!<\/p>\n<p>Dave: The Art of Marriage\u2122, Vertical Marriage\u00ae, Love Like You Mean It\u00ae\u2014you name it\u2014we\u2019ve got great small group material for you, and it\u2019s on sale right now.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Twenty-five percent off for the whole month of August.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Go to FamilyLife.com\/shop, and get your discount, and get your stuff, and get ready; because God is going to change lives in your family room as you lead that small group.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: When we acknowledge our brokenness, we\u2019re acknowledging a need for a healer. He\u2019s offering us this invitation. I think, sometimes, we feel shame at all our sore spots when really we should hear Him saying, \u201cI\u2019m inviting you to heal.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Shelby: Welcome to FamilyLife Today, where we want to help you pursue the relationships that matter most. I\u2019m Shelby Abbott, and your hosts are Dave and Ann Wilson. You can find us at FamilyLifeToday.com.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: This is FamilyLife Today.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: I was thinking one of the most exciting parts of ministry, especially as a preacher or a speaker, and you give a message, where you are calling people to action\u2014and let\u2019s say people raise a hand or they come forward,\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: \u2014some kind of action\u2014you\u2019re thinking, \u201cThis is so exciting. People want to change; they\u2019re coming forward. That\u2019s awesome!\u201d<\/p>\n<p>And then, the most frustrating part of ministry is: they don\u2019t change. A week later\/a month later, the same thing.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: I think we, as people, going up and saying, \u201cYes, I want this to happen. I want God to change me,\u201d\u2014maybe, we\u2019ve repented of sin\u2014sometimes, we can think, because of that repentance and our surrender to Jesus, everything will be great; and we won\u2019t continue to sin or fall into these old habit patterns\u2014but then, we do; and we get super discouraged.<\/p>\n<p>And maybe, our spouse does, too. Maybe, he says, \u201cI\u2019ve struggled with porn; but I\u2019m never going to do that again, ever.\u201d And then, he does; so as a wife or a husband, you can feel betrayed.<\/p>\n<p>So why are we talking about that today?<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Today, we are going to get to the root of: \u201cWhy does this happen?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: It\u2019s a common problem. You can hear Debra\u2019s voice over there; she\u2019s back with us.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Debra Fileta is back, with her book, Reset. If you have not read Debra\u2019s books, you need to get them.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: As you hear us talking about this, I know this is a universal problem, not just in ministry, but in life.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: It\u2019s like: \u201cI want to change,\u201d \u201cI\u2019m going to change\u201d; and you change for a little bit. I\u2019m saying \u201cthey,\u201d\u2014but we do the same thing; I\u2019ve done this\u2014and then, they\u2019re back to the same old patterns.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: You just talked a little bit about being a pastor. You see people come up to the altar and crying\u2014and lives\u2014and \u201cThis is it!\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Genuine.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Genuine; honestly, so often, those people do change because the Holy Spirit can do whatever He wants to do.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Good point.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: I have seen drug addicts turn a corner overnight and start living their life in a healthy way.<\/p>\n<p>But the majority of the time, the problem is that we\u2019re giving them directions\u2014let\u2019s say we want them to get from point A to point B\u2014they come up there; we\u2019re saying, \u201cAnd the next step is to take a left.\u201d And they say, \u201cYes, we\u2019re going to do it; we\u2019re going to take a left.\u201d They take a left. It\u2019s Monday morning; \u201cOkay, which way do I go next? The pastor is not here anymore to help me. How do I know which way to go next?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>This is why the work of counseling\u2014we see such high levels of success and healing\u2014you were talking about: \u201cIt\u2019s hard to see people change\u201d; I see people change every single day of my life. It\u2019s because now they have a GPS: \u201cTurn left; then, turn right. Then go straight for 200 feet; and then, take a left over there.\u201d There is somebody who is helping guide them.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: So they have the Holy Spirit\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Debra: They have the Holy Spirit.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: \u2014who is the Helper, the Guide. But you are saying they also have another person.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Some practical steps.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes, that\u2019s good.<\/p>\n<p>Recap where we were yesterday, because we get in these situations like we talked about yesterday\u2014where we want to change; we want to be more healthy\u2014or to not be addicted to porn or to not be so angry\u2014we have all these different things; you said so many yesterday, beautifully. Recap that a little bit; and then, let\u2019s move on from where we were yesterday.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: The formula that you need to keep in your mind for healing is the idea that thoughts lead to feelings which, then, lead to your behaviors. You can\u2019t just start with the behaviors: \u201cHere\u2019s what I want to change: I\u2019m angry. My spouse and I have all this conflict.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>\u201cOkay, that\u2019s the behavior. What is the feeling underneath the surface?\u201d\u2014\u201cI\u2019m feeling unappreciated,\u201d \u201cI\u2019m feeling invaluable,\u201d \u201cI\u2019m feeling inadequate.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>\u201cAnd then, where does that come from? What is the thought under the surface?\u201d\u2014\u201cI\u2019m not good enough,\u201d \u201cMy spouse will never see me.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>There\u2019s thoughts under the surface there that are causing you to react, causing you to do what you do. No matter the behavior, you are going to find a feeling that triggers that behavior; and underneath that, you are going to find a thought process that God wants to replace with truth.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Recently, we did a conference. I had a young woman come up to me, saying that she had had an affair. She hasn\u2019t been married very long, maybe five years; they have a couple kids. She was sobbing, because she said that this has been going on for six months. I asked her: \u201cDo you want to leave him? Do you want to stay married? Where are you in this?\u201d She said, \u201cYes, I realized I want to stay married. I want to do what God wants me to do.\u201d On follow-up\u2014after she got back, what happened is\u2014she\u2019s like, \u201cNow, I don\u2019t know if I want to follow God; because this feels really good, what\u2019s happening.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>I\u2019m talking to more women right now, who are having affairs, than I\u2019ve seen in a long time. Let\u2019s get to that. Let\u2019s say somebody is saying, \u201cI\u2019m in this affair, because my husband: \u2018I am not seen,\u2019 \u2018He doesn\u2019t appreciate me,\u2019 \u2018He\u2019s not who I thought he was.\u2019\u201d These are things that we hear. What would you say to her, if you met her at that conference or maybe the day after, where she\u2019s like, \u201cI don\u2019t know if I want to do that\u2014go back to my husband\u201d?<\/p>\n<p>Debra: The tricky part is that, sometimes, our unhealthy coping mechanisms feel better peripherally\u2014\u201cOh, that feels good,\u201d\u2014but they always come at a cost. If they didn\u2019t feel good, we\u2019d be crazy to do them\u2014if alcohol didn\u2019t feel good, if overeating didn\u2019t feel good, if an affair didn\u2019t feel good, if porn didn\u2019t feel good\u2014we wouldn\u2019t do it!<\/p>\n<p>Ann: It wouldn\u2019t even be a struggle.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: We\u2019d be crazy, right?<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Right.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: There\u2019s some sort of reward that you are getting out of that behavior. \u201cWhat\u2019s the reward?\u201d\u2014that\u2019s where I would start with her We\u2019d be crazy, right?<\/p>\n<p>\u201cWhat\u2019s the reward?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: That\u2019s good.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: \u201cWhat is it that you are for in this? Why do you keep defaulting to this behavior?\u201d Maybe she\u2019ll say, \u201cThe reward is that I feel seen.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: \u201cI feel good,\u201d \u201cI feel seen,\u201d \u201cI feel loved.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Dave: \u201cI don\u2019t feel that in my marriage.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Yes; \u201cI don\u2019t feel that in my marriage.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Then, I would ask her to dig a little bit deeper: \u201cWhen do you not feel that in your marriage? Let\u2019s isolate that feeling: \u2018When?\u2019\u201d It could be something as small as: \u201cWhen my husband comes home, he barely says two words to me. He\u2019s so distracted by the kids, and I feel that I am not a priority to him.\u201d You are not a priority\u2014that\u2019s the underlying thought\u2014\u201cI\u2019m not a priority.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>If we take it a step further\u2014usually, people who are struggling with things that are this extreme, if you ask them, \u201cWhen have you felt like you are not a priority before you got married? Is there any time you can pinpoint feeling that you are not a priority?\u201d\u2014almost 99.9 percent of the time, they\u2019ll say, \u201cYes, I was neglected in my family. My mom and dad were so busy and distracted, and I felt like I had to raise myself.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>There\u2019s going to be some sort of a theme that is making this interaction with your spouse feel so painful; because for Betsy, it might not feel painful as it does for Sue. Her husband might come home, and he\u2019s distracted; and it doesn\u2019t feel that painful because: \u201cGuess what? He\u2019s helping with the kids, and he\u2019s running here and there\u201d; so she sees it differently. Whereas, for the first person, it\u2019s like, \u201cI feel so neglected\u201d; because he\u2019s pushing on a sore spot\/a trigger that she didn\u2019t even know existed.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: This is so good. Debra, when you talk about this in the book, I thought, \u201cOh! This is so good:\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Dave: \u2014emotional sore spots?<\/p>\n<p>Ann: \u2014\"emotional sore spots.\u201d You\u2019re saying, \u201cYou are pushing on that emotional sore spot\u201d; that happens to so many of us.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: And we don\u2019t even realize it\u2019s happening; and we are thinking, \u201cMy spouse is terrible.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: \u201cHe\u2019s awful; he\u2019s not prioritizing me.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>That doesn\u2019t mean that you shouldn\u2019t have a conversation with your spouse, and say, \u201cHey, I\u2019m feeling unappreciated. When you come home, it would mean a lot to me if you would look me in the eyes for five minutes and just give me your first few minutes to make me think that I\u2019m a priority.\u201d It\u2019s your responsibility to communicate that.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: I like that you gave a specific thing to do, too; because our husbands, or our wives, don\u2019t know what we need unless we tell them.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: They have no clue; they have no clue what is triggering us. They don\u2019t know our sore spots. I think of a time when [John and I] were leaving the house. He came over to put his arm around me, just to say, \u201cI love you\u201d; and he pushed on a sore spot. Earlier that day, I was going on an errand with the kids. You know how long it takes to get four kids out of the house? [Laughter] It\u2019s like an Olympic event.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: We\u2019ve watched our son and his wife do this with four kids.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: You get them out of the house\u2014it\u2019s so much work\u2014so many things. I was in a rush. I slammed my shoulder on a coat rack. I thought, \u201cOh, that\u2019s painful; that\u2019s going to leave a bruise.\u201d Later, when John came to put his arm around me\u2014he didn\u2019t know there was a sore spot there; he didn\u2019t cause it\u2014he pushed on it; and I reacted, \u201cOuch! You just hurt me.\u201d \u201cOh, sorry; I didn\u2019t know there was a sore spot there.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Think about that, emotionally. We could call those \u201cemotional sore spots\u201d; we can call them \u201ctriggers.\u201d But there is something there, when you find yourself reacting in a big way or feeling a big feeling: \u201cI feel so unloved,\u201d \u201cI feel so unappreciated.\u201d But when you actually look at the situation\u2014it\u2019s not like he had an affair; it\u2019s not like he\u2019s sitting there, doing cocaine\u2014he\u2019s not neglecting you to that level: \u201cWhy do you have such a strong response?\u201d It\u2019s usually coming from something else\u2014a sore spot\u2014that was caused before you even got married.<\/p>\n<p>If we could do some sort of a scan to figure out where all our sore spots were, wouldn\u2019t that be amazing? But guess what the scan is?\u2014our spouse. [Laughter] Because they push on them. And when they push on them, you have two options.<\/p>\n<p>Option number one is to pull away and blame them.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes, that\u2019s what most of us do.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Option number two is to heal: \u201cWhat\u2019s this? Why does this hurt so much? Where does this come from? God, how do You want me to heal from this feeling of being unseen?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Because only He can replace our trauma with truth: \u201cNo, you are seen; you are loved. I saw you even when you were a kid, and your parents weren\u2019t aware of you, and they were so busy and distracted. I saw you; I was there with you.\u201d When you can live out of a place of healing, it changes everything.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: \u2014everything.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: This describes, literally, our marriage for 30 years.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Oh, absolutely.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: And we did not know\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Ann: \u2014any of this.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: \u2014what was happening. It was Ann blaming me for being gone all the time. Of course, I don\u2019t even know why I\u2019m gone all the time.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Right, right.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Now, I do; we even talked about it yesterday. It wasn\u2019t until we sat with a counselor\u2014and he sort of did what you talked about: thoughts, feelings, behaviors\u2014he said, \u201cAnn, isn\u2019t this interesting? In your life, you were never seen.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Wow!<\/p>\n<p>Dave: I\u2019m sitting there, literally, beside her, thinking, \u201cThat\u2019s our story. She\u2019s mad at me\/upset with me, because I\u2019m rushing around;\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Ann: \u2014that\u2019s my sore spot\/my trigger.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: \u2014\"and she\u2019s not seen again.\u201d It was the same issue for us, often. It came back, always: \u201cI\u2019m rushing around doing this; she\u2019s home and not feeling seen.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>I just wonder how many other couples, right now, are listening to you, and thinking\u2014it may be the same issue we have in our marriage or a different one\u2014but it\u2019s a sore spot they didn\u2019t realize was there.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Right.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: The big question is: \u201cHow do you get to the root of that?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: You even said off-air\u2014and I think it\u2019s a really interesting discussion\u2014Romans 7 [v.15-20]: Paul, talking about his spiritual walk, says, \u201cI don\u2019t do the things I want to do. I do the things I don\u2019t want to do. I don\u2019t understand why.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Talk about that a little bit.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Yes, \u201cI don\u2019t understand why.\u201d So many Christians use that passage\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Right.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: \u2014to excuse their addiction.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: We did at church.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: I\u2019m not excusing it.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Oh, no, no, no; not us\u2014we never did, Ann\u2014not me.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: But it explains it.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Yes; never Dave.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Never me; some other pastor did.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Not to excuse; but explain: \u201cHey, we all struggle again, and again, and again, and again.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: So it\u2019s normal.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Right; it\u2019s normal.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Our sin nature; exactly. Even Paul struggled. But did you notice? He said, \u201cWhy? I don\u2019t understand.\u201d Why?\u2014maybe, if we could actually understand, things would begin to change.<\/p>\n<p>God wants us to have understanding\u2014Proverbs 20, verse 5, says: \u201cThe purposes of a person\u2019s heart are like deep waters, but a person of insight draws them out,\u201d\u2014if you want to be a wise person of insight, you go deep into that well. You draw up the waters. It\u2019s not easy. In ancient times, drawing up the deep waters wasn\u2019t like turning on a spigot.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes. [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>Debra: At our house, it\u2019s automatic; because my husband\u2019s a germaphobe, and he doesn\u2019t like to touch the spigot. You just put your hands underneath; and it just flows, like a laser beam.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: You\u2019ve got one of those?<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Yes, we\u2019ve got one of those.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Oh, really? Wow!<\/p>\n<p>Debra: But that\u2019s not what it was like to draw out water in ancient days; this took work.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: \u2014cranking.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: And the same for us\u2014to draw out that stuff\u2014it takes work; it takes time; it takes intentionality.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: You would know better than anybody: \u201cAren\u2019t a lot of us afraid of doing the work?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Yes, of course.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: It\u2019s as if to say, \u201cI\u2019m stuck in some ways.\u201d I\u2019m speaking for all of us in some ways: \u201cI\u2019m just afraid; I don\u2019t want to go in there.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Debra: We don\u2019t know what\u2019s going to come out of that well.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: It\u2019s so dark; yes.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: I think, too\u2014speaking for me, with sexual abuse in my background\u2014it feels better, sometimes, that the Band-Aid\u00ae is on there.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Right.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: But to take off the Band-Aid\u2014and start digging into the infection and the wound that\u2019s underneath\u2014it hurts.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: It does hurt.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: You don\u2019t want to feel those feelings again\u2014and feel the betrayal and feel so many things\u2014I think people wonder, \u201cCan I handle it?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Debra: You're right. Going with that analogy: if that wound is left untended to, it could cause some serious problems. You\u2019ve heard of wounds getting so infected that someone has to get amputated. This is the same thing in our life; we have to deal with it. It feels better for a while\u2014but like we said last time\u2014eventually, something will break down; and the cost of that is so much greater.<\/p>\n<p>I like to be practical. So for the couples listening, it\u2019s like, \u201cWhere do I even begin?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Step number one would be: \u201cTo identify your conflict cycle.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Every couple has a prominent conflict cycle. For you guts, it would be: \u201cHe keeps leaving. I keep feeling unprioritized; and then, we fight about it. He\u2019s so busy. I feel\u2014I\u2019m home; I\u2019m by myself\u2014he doesn\u2019t want to be here with me.\u201d And he is thinking, \u201cNo, I have so much going on.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Dave: \u201cI\u2019m providing for the family.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Debra: \u201cI\u2019m providing for the family; I\u2019m working hard.\u201d That\u2019s the conflict cycle.<\/p>\n<p>Every couple has a conflict cycle. Once you can map out the conflict cycle, you can start digging a little bit deeper and a little bit deeper. For some couples, they are going to listen to this, and they are going to be able to sit down, and say, \u201cWhat\u2019s our conflict cycle? Let\u2019s talk through it.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>\u201cOh, our conflict cycle is: every time I give you feedback, you freak out; that\u2019s our conflict cycle. And then, you feel offended; and then, I feel hurt that you are offended.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>It could be so many different things for different couples. Once you map it out, it can help you. Some couples are going to be able to map out their conflict cycle, and see:<\/p>\n<p>\u201cOh, maybe, it\u2019s rooted in that I was always criticized, as a kid; so I have a hard time receiving feedback from anybody.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>\u201cOr maybe it was rooted in the fact I was never criticized as a kid, and everybody loved me all the time, and my life was amazing. I was the star athlete, so I have a hard time handling feedback.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>You start mapping it out. But for other couples, they're going to need help. They are going to need a trained counselor, to say, \u201cOkay; let\u2019s figure this out. I\u2019m here to help you. Let\u2019s do the work: let\u2019s come up with your conflict cycle and get healed.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: People are listening. A wife is thinking, \u201cOkay, we are going to do this tonight; let\u2019s talk about our conflict cycle.\u201d How would she even bring it up?<\/p>\n<p>Debra: The best time to bring it up is not during a fight. [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Let\u2019s just start there. Bring it up when you are both calm: \u201cI just heard this radio program. They were talking about conflict cycles and how every couple has their go-to conflict cycle\u2014something that causes them to fight; something that causes tension\u2014I\u2019m curious what you think ours is.\u201d Let them start\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Good; that\u2019s good.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: \u2014instead of saying: \u201cHere\u2019s what I think ours is\u2026\u201d and \u201cHere\u2019s what I think you're doing...\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Let\u2019s say he says, \u201cI know what ours is: you are always on me. I can never do anything right, and you are always on me. And then, I get mad; and I leave,\u201d or \u201c\u2026I yell back.\u201d If he says that, what\u2019s her next step?<\/p>\n<p>Debra: To listen: \u201cThat\u2019s a really great start. Okay; you feel like I\u2019m always on you. When\u2014when does that come up?\u2014when I ask you to do something around the house?\u201d Let him continue to talk, and you listen. And then, you can share your perspective: \u201cHere\u2019s what I think our conflict cycle looks like; here\u2019s when I feel the most hurt\u2026\u201d<\/p>\n<p>You talk about it in a place when you are not both triggered. If you can\u2019t do that, that means you are not ready to do this. If you can\u2019t do that, that means you need a counselor\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: That\u2019s good.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: \u2014to help you walk through it.<\/p>\n<p>If you are thinking, \u201cOh, yes; that is not going to go well,\u201d then that\u2019s all the evidence you need to sign up to work with a counselor; because, honestly, it shouldn\u2019t be that hard. If it is, that means there are things on both sides of the equation that we need an objective party to help you work through; there are too many sore spots in that case.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes, yes.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Do people change before they have enough pain? I remember preaching this, years ago: \u201cPeople don\u2019t really change until the pain gets great enough.\u201d You don\u2019t change your diet until you look in the mirror, and think, \u201cI\u2019m done with this.\u201d Or you go to the heart doctor, and he says, \u201cYou have to stop eating this, because you are about to have a heart attack.\u201d Or you do have a heart attack\u2014and bam!\u2014change starts. Is that how it sort of works?<\/p>\n<p>Debra: In Reset, I talk about the five stages of change. That\u2019s something we refer to a lot, as counselors; it\u2019s the idea of: \u201cWhere is that point where the scale tips in the direction of healing?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>The first stage is precontemplation: \u201cI don\u2019t know. What\u2019s the point of change?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Contemplation is the second stage: \u201cI\u2019m starting to see more reasons why I should change.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Once you get there, that\u2019s when people start changing and coming up with a plan.<\/p>\n<p>And taking action.<\/p>\n<p>And then, you have to maintain the change.<\/p>\n<p>There are five different stages; but the question is: \u201cWhat\u2019s it going to take to tip that scale?\u201d And for each person, it\u2019s different. I\u2019ll tell you why, Dave: some people have a higher pain tolerance.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Oh, yes.<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Right? You strike me as that kind of a guy.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: I was just going to say, \u201cThis is Dave.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Debra: You\u2019re running, running: \u201cI don\u2019t want to deal with that.\u201d You have a higher pain tolerance; so maybe, for someone like you, it would take something to break\u2014like you and Ann talk about\u2014\u201cIt got so bad.\u201d But maybe, for somebody else, it\u2019s: \u201cOoh; I feel that pain quickly,\u201d and \u201cI don\u2019t like how it feels, and I want this out of my life.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>I think people have different levels of emotional pain tolerance, [which] also comes from trauma.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Debra, as we close, how would you bring Jesus into this? Because in all that you do, He is always a part of it. And, as a couple, why is that so important?<\/p>\n<p>Debra: I would say we can\u2019t keep Him out of it. Even if we are trying to keep Him out of it, He is the great Healer. When we acknowledge our brokenness, we\u2019re acknowledging a need for a healer. He\u2019s offering us this invitation. I think, sometimes, we feel shame at all our sore spots when really we should hear Him saying, \u201cI\u2019m inviting you to heal. I am trusting you to heal, because I know what I have for you. I know the plans I have for you, and the purposes I have for you, and you need to be healed.\u201d When we see that God is bringing things up, we need to be grateful that He is inviting us into a deeper level with Him as well as a deeper level with our spouse.<\/p>\n<p>Shelby: Okay; we\u2019ll hear a really helpful response from Dave Wilson, here, in just a second. But first, I\u2019m Shelby Abbott; and you\u2019ve been listening to Dave and Ann Wilson, with Debra Fileta, on FamilyLife Today. Debra has written a book called Reset: Powerful Habits to Own Your Thoughts, Understand Your Feelings, and Change Your Life. You can get your copy, right now, by going online to FamilyLifeToday.com; or you can check I out in the show notes. Or feel free to give us a call at 800-358-6329; again, the number is 800-\u201cF\u201d as in family, \u201cL\u201d as in life, and then the word, \u201cTODAY.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>I know it\u2019s early August right now, but fall is coming up really soon. As you\u2019re getting ready for small groups that might be happening in your church, or wherever you might be leading a ministry, we wanted to let you know that all of our FamilyLife\u00ae workbooks are now 25 percent off through the end of this month. You can go to the show notes, at FamilyLifeToday.com, look around and pick out what might be best for you. Again, all our FamilyLife workbooks are going to be 25 percent off through the end of August.<\/p>\n<p>Okay, here\u2019s some reflections from Dave Wilson on what we\u2019ve heard today.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: You said, earlier, I thought was so profound: \u201cWhen your spouse says something, like a truth comment, it\u2019s\u201d\u2014like you just said\u2014\"an invitation.\u201d We see it as: \u201cYou\u2019re meddling in my life; you\u2019re critiquing me.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>If we could twist our perspective, it would be: \u201cWait, wait, wait, wait, wait; God just entered. He said, \u2018Hey, Dave. I want you to look at something\u2014I said it through Ann\u2014but I want you to look at something. By the way, I said this to three of your buddies in the last six months. There\u2019s a pattern here\u2014it\u2019s Me; I\u2019m in this\u2014I want to draw you into something deeper and better. You are going to change if you go there.\u2019\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Rather than: \u201cI don\u2019t want to hear this. I don\u2019t want you speaking this again to me. I\u2019m good; we\u2019re good. We should be happy.\u201d I\u2019ve said that: \u201cI\u2019m a good husband; you should be happy. I\u2019ve seen husbands that aren\u2019t good; I\u2019m better,\u201d\u2014rather than\u2014\u201cOh, my goodness; God is inviting me to a journey, which could be awesome.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Debra: Yes, our pain points are just an invitation.<\/p>\n<p>Shelby: Now, coming up tomorrow, Debra Fileta is back to talk about emotional recovery. She\u2019s going to specifically dive into healing from childhood trauma and how that trauma impacts our daily relationships. That\u2019s tomorrow; we hope you\u2019ll join us. On behalf of Dave and Ann Wilson, I\u2019m Shelby Abbott. We will see you back next time for another edition of FamilyLife Today.<\/p>\n<p>FamilyLife Today is a donor-supported production of FamilyLife, a Cru\u00ae Ministry.<\/p>\n<p>Helping you pursue the relationships that matter most.<\/p>\n<p>We are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider donating today to help defray the costs?<\/p>\n<p>Copyright \u00a9 2024 FamilyLife. All rights reserved.<\/p>\n<p>www.FamilyLife<\/p>\n","theme_header_position":"Sticky","post_header_is_sticky":"default","is_header_overlay":"0"},"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast\/285234","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/podcast"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/47000"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=285234"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/280865"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=285234"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=285234"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=285234"},{"taxonomy":"podcast_series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast_series?post=285234"},{"taxonomy":"cwp_profile","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/cwp_profile?post=285234"},{"taxonomy":"series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/series?post=285234"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}