{"id":280562,"date":"2023-04-25T09:15:00","date_gmt":"2023-04-25T13:15:00","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/hope-when-life-goes-from-bad-to-worse-rachel-faulkner-brown\/"},"modified":"2025-04-17T10:59:19","modified_gmt":"2025-04-17T14:59:19","slug":"hope-when-life-goes-from-bad-to-worse-rachel-faulkner-brown","status":"publish","type":"podcast","link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/hope-when-life-goes-from-bad-to-worse-rachel-faulkner-brown\/","title":{"rendered":"Hope When Life Goes from Bad to Worse: Rachel Faulkner-Brown"},"content":{"rendered":"<p>After losing two husbands, author Rachel Faulkner-Brown couldn&#8217;t believe she might have found love again. Again, she collided with grief as life went from bad to worse. But God had more hope for Rachel.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>After losing two husbands, author Rachel Faulkner-Brown couldn&#8217;t believe she might have found love again. Again, she collided with grief as life went from bad to worse. But God had more hope for Rachel. Show Notes and Resources Learn More About How to Ble&#8230;<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":47000,"featured_media":280866,"menu_order":0,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"closed","template":"","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","inline_featured_image":false,"_uag_custom_page_level_css":"","episode_type":"audio","audio_file":"https:\/\/traffic.omny.fm\/d\/clips\/cbd16f10-ac60-4f09-b4df-b15400ce35aa\/33aaac7e-3581-4e21-a3df-b154011ba58c\/00f1bd20-d9b3-491b-8181-b154011f35e9\/audio.mp3","cover_image":"","cover_image_id":"","duration":"00:26:27","filesize":"24.25M","filesize_raw":"","date_recorded":"2023-04-25 09:15:00","explicit":"","block":""},"categories":[],"tags":[2344],"podcast_series":[8624],"cwp_profile":[9846],"series":[2101],"class_list":["post-280562","podcast","type-podcast","status-publish","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","tag-bad-to-worse","podcast_series-hope-in-my-nightmares-rachel-faulkner-brown","cwp_profile-rachel-faulkner-brown","series-familylife-today"],"acf":[],"episode_featured_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/04\/image-scaled.jpg?w=1024","episode_player_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2023\/02\/image-scaled.jpg","download_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-download\/280562\/hope-when-life-goes-from-bad-to-worse-rachel-faulkner-brown","player_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-player\/280562\/hope-when-life-goes-from-bad-to-worse-rachel-faulkner-brown","audio_player":null,"episode_data":{"playerMode":"light","subscribeUrls":{"apple_podcasts":{"key":"apple_podcasts","url":"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303?mt=2&app=podcast","label":"Apple Podcasts","class":"apple_podcasts","icon":"apple-podcasts.png"},"google_podcasts":{"key":"google_podcasts","url":"","label":"Google Podcasts","class":"google_podcasts","icon":"google-podcasts.png"},"spotify":{"key":"spotify","url":"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm","label":"Spotify","class":"spotify","icon":"spotify.png"},"youtube":{"key":"youtube","url":"","label":"YouTube","class":"youtube","icon":"youtube.png"}},"rssFeedUrl":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/feed\/podcast\/familylife-today","embedCode":"<blockquote class=\"wp-embedded-content\" data-secret=\"l9qfXUIqgS\"><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/hope-when-life-goes-from-bad-to-worse-rachel-faulkner-brown\/\">Hope When Life Goes from Bad to Worse: Rachel Faulkner-Brown<\/a><\/blockquote><iframe sandbox=\"allow-scripts\" security=\"restricted\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/hope-when-life-goes-from-bad-to-worse-rachel-faulkner-brown\/embed\/#?secret=l9qfXUIqgS\" width=\"500\" height=\"350\" title=\"&#8220;Hope When Life Goes from Bad to Worse: Rachel Faulkner-Brown&#8221; &#8212; FamilyLife\u00ae - A Cru Ministry\" data-secret=\"l9qfXUIqgS\" frameborder=\"0\" marginwidth=\"0\" marginheight=\"0\" scrolling=\"no\" class=\"wp-embedded-content\"><\/iframe><script>\n\/*! 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Find connection through Rachel's \"Be Still\" Ministry, along with resources for your grief and struggle at <a href=\"https:\/\/www.bestillministries.net\/\">bestillministries.net <\/a><\/li>\n<li>Grab Rachel's 30-day devotional, <a href=\"https:\/\/shop.familylife.com\/product\/his-name-our-hope-in-grief\/\">His Name: Our Hope in Grief<\/a>, or receive it free with <a href=\"https:\/\/donate.familylife.com\/april-2023\/his-name-our-hope-in-grief\/\">any donation this week. <\/a><\/li>\n<li>Find resources from this podcast at <a href=\"https:\/\/shop.familylife.com\/product-category\/radio-resources\/?orderby=date\">shop.familylife.com<\/a>.<\/li>\n<li>Find more content and resources on the <a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/app\/\">FamilyLife's app<\/a>!<\/li>\n<li>Help others find FamilyLife. Leave a review on <a href=\"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303\">Apple Podcast<\/a> or <a href=\"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm?si=d6dfa8d2415f4750\">Spotify<\/a>.<\/li>\n<li>Check out all the FamilyLife podcasts on the <a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/familylife-podcast-network\/\">FamilyLife Podcast Network<\/a><\/li>\n<\/ul>\n"],"_edit_lock":["1744902401:47000"],"_edit_last":["47000"],"theme_header_position":["Sticky"],"post_header_is_sticky":["default"],"is_header_overlay":["0"],"episode_type":["audio"],"date_recorded":["2023-04-25 09:15:00"],"enclosure":["https:\/\/traffic.omny.fm\/d\/clips\/cbd16f10-ac60-4f09-b4df-b15400ce35aa\/33aaac7e-3581-4e21-a3df-b154011ba58c\/00f1bd20-d9b3-491b-8181-b154011f35e9\/audio.mp3"],"transcript_content":["<p>FamilyLife Today\u00ae National Radio Version (time edited) Transcript<br \/>\nReferences to conferences, resources, or other special promotions may be obsolete.<\/p>\n<p>Hope When Life Goes from Bad to Worse<\/p>\n<p>Guest: Rachel Faulkner-Brown and Rod Brown<br \/>\nFrom the series: Hope in my Nightmare (Day 2 of 3)<br \/>\nAir date: April 25, 2023<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: We all have to live with a level of mystery. I think that\u2019s the biggest thing with suffering. When you go through things that are hard, to the degree that you can be okay with mystery is the degree that you will be able to really live.<\/p>\n<p>Shelby: Welcome to FamilyLife Today, where we want to help you pursue the relationships that matter most. I\u2019m Shelby Abbott, and your hosts are Dave and Ann Wilson. You can find us at FamilyLifeToday.com or on the FamilyLife\u00ae app.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: This is FamilyLife\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Dave: \u2014Today!<\/p>\n<p>So there\u2019s a question we ask when we\u2019re walking through the valley, through a really, really dark time. At least in my mind it\u2019s, \u201cGod are You here, and do You see? Do You know?\u201d I\u2019ve felt that many times.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Or \u201cWhere are You? I don\u2019t see You in this.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Dave: You don\u2019t feel Him, you feel alone, you\u2019re like, \u201cI know He\u2019s here. I know Scripture. I believe He\u2019s here, but I just don\u2019t feel it right now.\u201d You wonder if He\u2019s here.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: There are times\u2014I don\u2019t know if you do this\u2014I beg Him, like \u201cLord, I need to feel Your presence. I need to know that You\u2019re with me.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Yes. We are in day two of a story with Rachel Faulkner-Brown. She\u2019s back in the studio.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Which is a gripping story.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Yes. First of all, let\u2019s say, \u201cWelcome back.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Thank you.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Again, if you\u2019re a listener and you missed it\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Go back.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: \u2014hit pause right now, and go listen, because we can\u2019t go through everything that happened, but your story is full of \u201cGod, are You here,\u201d right? Losing two husbands before you\u2019re 31 years of age. Again, the listeners are like, \u201cWhat?\u201d Go listen to it. We\u2019re not going to go through the details. It\u2019s hard enough to go through one; to go through two! I was like, \u201cReally? You really felt God\u2019s presence that strong in it.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: That was so inspiring, Rachel.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: How can you ever know what He\u2019s doing until you look back in reverse? I could never have known that in the moment, what He was preparing me for, but it\u2019s funny. We went to Israel in 2019, and we were on this bus, like everybody does in Israel. I remember them looking out, right outside Galilee. They were like, \u201cCrops only grow in the valley.\u201d Man, y\u2019all, it was as if the God of the Universe said, \u201cThat\u2019s right.\u201d Because the mountain is not where you grow your crops. It\u2019s in the valley.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Where the rain comes.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Where the rain comes. I looked out on those date fields and all the beautiful things that they\u2019re growing, and I just thought, \u201cI\u2019m not going to despise my valley.\u201d Just don\u2019t despise your valley because you just don\u2019t know what He\u2019s doing.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes. We\u2019re talking about the book that you wrote called His Name. The subtitle is Our Hope in Grief. Tell us a little bit about what you do now.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Well, in 2017 I got together with some friends in Birmingham. There were nine widows in Birmingham, and a friend was like, \u201cI want to take them and get a massage, and then we\u2019re going to do a nice dinner, and then we want y\u2019all to come share,\u201d a friend of mine, Paige Knudsen.\u201d I was like, \u201cOh, we would love to come over and do this.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>On that drive home I looked at Paige, and was like, \u201cWe could do this. Somebody needs to be doing what we just did for widows, because young widows don\u2019t have anybody to look to.\u201d So after losing two husbands, I was like, \u201cI kind of feel like I know what I\u2019m doing. I\u2019ve lived enough life; I\u2019ve made enough mistakes. I want to help them not make mistakes financially and relationally, and with in-laws, and with their kids.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>I\u2019ve made enough mistakes that I was ready to help somebody else to not make those same mistakes. So we threw together in six weeks a retreat. I raised money; I raised $250 for each widow coming. We had twenty widows sign up. That was the beginning of Never Alone Widows.<\/p>\n<p>Out of that, our prayer team and the widows that served with us and women connected to the ministry we wrote this little spiral-bound devotional, called His Name: Our Hope in Grief. We all took a name of God that you related to specifically in your story. When they\u2019ve gone through a valley, they\u2019ve seen the crop, and they\u2019ve seen Who He wants to be in the valley. Because if you don\u2019t have Who He is right, you won\u2019t be able to get who you are right.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: And you have a podcast.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Yes, we do have a podcast. It\u2019s called There\u2019s More. We just listen to stories, very similar to y\u2019all. God has done amazing things. We\u2019ve helped around 3,000 widows, and then we\u2019re hosting a conference for 400 widows this year in 2023. Then we do three other retreats, and curriculum called How to Widow Well, which is a 20-video series targeted for a widow. It\u2019s different.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: It\u2019s different to lose a child than it is to lose a husband, to lose a grandmother. And widows really kind of want to be with other widows who get it, that \u201cI don\u2019t want to have to use words,\u201d those type of friends. God is just\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Ann: I remember hearing Chuck Swindoll years ago say, \u201cIf we trust God, He will never allow our pain to be in vain.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: That\u2019s what you\u2019ve done. You\u2019ve done that. We ended yesterday with the tragic death of your husband who was a fighter pilot.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Right.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: You were 31. How old was he when he passed away?<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: It was seven days before his 40th birthday. He was 39.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: So then did you ever think, \u201cI will never get married again?\u201d Were you afraid?<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: I would love to tell you, \u201cNo,\u201d but I was like, \u201cOh, yes. I will definitely get married again, because I\u2019m not raising these kids by myself.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: I didn\u2019t think that immediately, obviously, but\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Ann: You need help.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: \u2014I loved marriage. I\u2019m like a professional married person. I love marriage, love it so much.<\/p>\n<p>[Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: I love big, and I love hard, and I knew I wanted to give that away, and I wanted companionship. Honestly, this time I will say I wanted a ministry partner. I knew God was doing something in my life\u2014I shared my story for the first time a year after Blair died. It\u2019s still so crazy to me; the altar was just full that night. It was just like, \u201cWait, what is happening?\u201d I don\u2019t ever not want to do this. I just feel the pleasure of God when I share, and when I really invite people into a different life.<\/p>\n<p>That\u2019s what I was inviting those friends into. I was like, \u201cThis is serious.\u201d I shared Blair\u2019s surrender story, and I was just like, \u201cThere\u2019s no more playing. Look what happened. Life is short.\u201d That message, I always tell people, I\u2019m like the wreck on the side of the road that you have to look at,\u201d so that\u2019s why I get there. The reason people stay is because they\u2019re like, \u201cOh, she\u2019s happy. She\u2019s full of joy. She still loves God, and He\u2019s still good to her. He\u2019s not evil and mean,\u201d because He\u2019s not.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: How did she get there?<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Rod and I got introduced by a mutual friend.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Wait, wait, wait. People don\u2019t know who Rod is.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: We have to introduce Rod. He\u2019s here.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: He\u2019s the slacker over in the corner here.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: I know. It\u2019s so fun that Rod\u2019s here.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: So, Rod Brown is here. He\u2019s always been here, been sitting here listening to this whole thing. But our listeners didn\u2019t know that this is your third husband, and it\u2019s been ten years. Rod, welcome.<\/p>\n<p>Rod: Thank you. Great to be here.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: You have to tell us the story. How did this happen?<\/p>\n<p>Ann: How did you guys meet? What was going on?<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Oh, this is good. This is good.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Rod, you share.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: You start.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes, let\u2019s hear your\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Rod: A mutual friend. I was at a lake house one weekend with a lot of single people. One of the women that was there\u2014we just kind of bonded over smoothies, just talking. The next time I saw her she was like, \u201cHey, I have this woman I really would like you to meet. I was like, \u201cGreat! Introduce us.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: And how old were you at the time?<\/p>\n<p>Rod: I think I was 43, 44.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Okay.<\/p>\n<p>Rod: It took a while for this to happen, so the next time I see this person, six months later, \u201cHey, I have this person I really want you to meet.\u201d \u201cAlright, why don\u2019t you introduce us?\u201d I think it took a while, I think almost a year for it to finally happen.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: And you had never been married.<\/p>\n<p>Rod: I\u2019d never been married. She introduced us via email, and then we connected, and then she said to me, \u201cDid she tell you anything about me?\u201d I was like, \u201cNo.\u201d She\u2019s like, \u201cWell, I\u2019d like for you to watch this video before we talk.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>[Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: This is not typical.<\/p>\n<p>Rod: Yes, this is not normal. I never really was asked to watch a video before going out with somebody. So I was like, \u201cWow, what\u2019s this video going to be about?\u201d It was a video that her church in Columbus did, really talking about her life, what you guys just heard of her losing two husbands and going through all that. So I watched it. She said, \u201cWhat\u2019d you think?\u201d I was like, \u201cThat was a lot. That\u2019s a lot.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Did you tear up like you just did when you watched it the first time?<\/p>\n<p>Rod: Oh yes. Oh yes, for sure. It was powerful, tough to see and to hear someone go through that so young, and then have two children the second time.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Pass the Kleenex box over here. I need a tissue.<\/p>\n<p>[Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>Rod: So Rachel would say I was pretty weird, but I would say I was just trying to protect her, and I just said, \u201cHey, I really don\u2019t want to do email a lot or talk a lot on the phone. I\u2019d love to meet at some point,\u201d because over the years in dating and in the different things you can get pretty attached, and you really don\u2019t know the person. And then you meet them and you realize, \u201cWow, we\u2019ve kind of bonded somewhat and we really don\u2019t enjoy each other that much in person.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Really what you\u2019re saying is that you didn\u2019t enjoy them.<\/p>\n<p>Rod: Yes. Yes.<\/p>\n<p>[Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>Rod: It could be one-sided; it could have been two-sided. It could have been both. So we got together one day, beautiful fall day in Atlanta. I lived at the time right near Piedmont Park, which is one of the largest parks in Atlanta, in the Midtown area. We met to go for a walk, and that walk lasted for about seven hours.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: What?<\/p>\n<p>Rod: We walked and we talked.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: You got some steps in that day.<\/p>\n<p>[Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: I did. I totally wore the wrong shoes, too.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: You really just kept talking for seven hours.<\/p>\n<p>Rod: Yes. We stopped for coffee, stopped for lunch.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Stopped for brunch.<\/p>\n<p>Rod: I think we might have gone back for coffee again.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Was there immediate connection?<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Oh, yes. Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Rod: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: He was so fascinating. Rod is the most interesting man in the world.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: No! My husband is.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: I know, I know. He\u2019d been to 63 countries. He had traveled the world. He just worked for Chick-Fil-A for nine years. I was like, \u201cWhat have you not done?\u201d This was so fascinating. He wanted a ministry partner. He wanted to be married, he wanted to be a dad. I was like, \u201cIf this is an interview, you\u2019re in.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>[Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: And then I dreamed about him that night. I do not dream. I\u2019m not a dreamer, but that night I dreamed the very thing widows really miss, companionship, and then that comfort of pillow talk, just having that person just to be up in the crux of their arm.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Your friend.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Yes, your friend, your buddy. Having somebody know where you are all the time is probably one of the number one things that widows miss. I dreamed that night that I was in the crux of his arm, just having pillow talk. It was so real, y\u2019all. It was like it was truly happening, and I was mortified. I was like, \u201cOh, my goodness. I\u2019ve come home and I\u2019ve let this person in my bed.\u201d It was just real, and the Lord was just showing me, \u201cThis is your reality.\u201d Of course, praise the Lord, I did not tell Rod. He would have gone running.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: I was going to ask. You didn\u2019t tell him.<\/p>\n<p>Rod: No, she did not tell me. It wouldn\u2019t have been a wise thing to do, so I\u2019m glad\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Yes. You kept that to yourself.<\/p>\n<p>Rod: \u2014that the Holy Spirit and her friends were like, \u201cHey, hold back. Hold back. Hold back.\u201d So yes, we would get together in Atlanta some. She had several things that she probably didn\u2019t have to come to, but it was convenient, things she wanted to come to, and then she bought something at what\u2019s called \u201cScott\u2019s Antique Market,\u201d which is this big market in Atlanta. She needed it to make it to her in Huntsville, and I basically said, \u201cHey, I want to bring that, whether it\u2019s ready or not. I want to come see you.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>I think that was the night when I visited her that we talked more, kissed for the first time, talked more about being in relationship, where she challenged me of, \u201cHey, I have two kids. I know we\u2019re early, but is this a route that you can see yourself going?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Yes. I said, \u201cDon\u2019t kiss me, unless you want to be a dad.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Rod: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes, that\u2019s good.<\/p>\n<p>Rod: And then before I could answer, she kissed me, so I didn\u2019t know what that meant.<\/p>\n<p>[Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>Ann: But Rod, was there any part of you that thought, \u201cI haven\u2019t been married before. She\u2019s gone through a lot. She has two kids.\u201d Were you a little scared, or were you like, \u201cNo, this is a great challenge.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Rod: That\u2019s a good question. I think that I probably had both of that in me. I had \u201cThis is a great challenge and I really want to do this.\u201d At the same time, I am a little scared. So, I think all those were together. I think in the very beginning of a relationship is you start thinking about those when somebody is in another state. All of the sudden more details start coming, and it starts becoming a little overwhelming. \u201cOne of us needs to leave friends. One of us has to sell a house, or both of us have to. On my account, I would definitely need to,\u201d because mine was small.<\/p>\n<p>All these things start flooding, and it definitely increased over the months. Then we got married in June, and I was just feeling some things, feeling some things, feeling some things and I had no idea what it was. I think in years past I would have gone, \u201cOh, that\u2019s the Holy Spirit telling me slow down, or back up, or whatever. But I\u2019m like, \u201cNo, I\u2019m married.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>I think we were at an event in October of that year\u2014I\u2019ve been on the board of a ministry called Lighthouse Family Retreat, an amazing ministry that helps families that have a child with cancer just have a week at the beach, and we serve them. It\u2019s amazing. I couldn\u2019t wait to do that with my family. All of a sudden, that week I\u2019m just almost becoming like paralyzed in some sense, and called a friend and just told him what I was experiencing.<\/p>\n<p>He\u2019s like, \u201cYou have anxiety, and you probably have depression. It\u2019s probably that.\u201d So unfortunately, I have to tell Rachel that day, \u201cSomething\u2019s wrong with me,\u201d and here she is, husband number three, but this one has something else that\u2019s really different. So that started that journey for probably two and a half years of just working through that, counseling for both of us, counseling for me.<\/p>\n<p>I tell you, really the big part for me was even though being in ministry forever, and probably getting dribs and drabs of it over the years, and maybe even being really solid in it at some point, but not at this point. But it was really coming back to how God loves me. I\u2019m completely loved, completely forgiven, 100 percent, He can\u2019t like me any more tomorrow than He does today. It was really grabbing on to that identity in Christ that freed me from all of that.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: That\u2019s not an easy walk through, is it?<\/p>\n<p>Rod: No, it\u2019s not.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Do you think the marriage was something that brought that to the surface for you?<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Oh, 100 percent.<\/p>\n<p>Rod: Yes, I definitely think that it\u2019s something that I had experienced in small doses over the years, but I did not know what it was. Being single, you could manage that a little bit. I think with all of it coming together, you talk about the big things in your life, your spiritual life, finances, your home, your family life, career and all that\u2014things change. Same place of employment, but what I did really changed a lot.<\/p>\n<p>We moved about 20 miles north from this little place I had to a large home, neighborhood. All of a sudden, I have two children. There\u2019s no warmup; all of a sudden you come back from a honeymoon, there\u2019s two kids there, and you\u2019re a dad.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Yes. And they\u2019re young.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: And they\u2019re busy.<\/p>\n<p>Rod: Yes, right. And I\u2019m a husband for the first time. Rachel is strong and beautiful and wonderful and has the past of what she had to bring in, those things. So there are all these things that you look at, and you\u2019re like, \u201cNo wonder you were overwhelmed.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Rachel, how did you respond when\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Not well. I will tell you.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: \u2014the spouse going through something that their spouse is going\u2014that\u2019s often really hard.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: I always say, \u201cIf you skip one of the phases of grief, you will eventually find it. I skipped anger. I was mad. I was like, \u201cGod, You\u2018ve let me bury two husbands and You\u2019ve seen me through that, and then You let me marry a man who\u2019s sick.\u201d I will say for any wife who\u2019s listening that\u2019s going through this with their own husband: depression and anxiety feels like water in your hands. There\u2019s nothing to grab. It\u2019s not like you can just go, \u201cOh, your pancreas is failing. Let\u2019s just give you a shot.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>It\u2019s so multi-faceted an approach. Does this medicine, and this counselor, and this psychiatrist and this friend, are they going to all say the right things to make you better?\u201d It felt pretty hopeless. I\u2019m going to be really honest. It felt like, \u201cIs this what I\u2019ve signed up for?\u201d I was just mad, frankly, because I was like, \u201cCould you have not taken care of this before we got married? Could you have gone through this season?\u201d But that wasn\u2019t the plan.<\/p>\n<p>I will tell you, for someone who doesn\u2019t struggle with depression, and I\u2019ve woken up every morning of my life just happy to hear the birds singing, there is judgment for people. There is a judgment and a pride. When that has not been your story\u2014and this is embarrassing to say\u2014but you\u2019re like, \u201cWell, I\u2019ve been through a lot, and I didn\u2019t have that problem.\u201d I would never have articulated that. Hear me. But there was a level of judgment in my heart that the Lord was like, \u201cWe\u2019re done with this.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Probably something like, \u201cThat\u2019s nothing compared to what I\u2019ve been through.\u201d Even the comparison.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Well, it was almost like \u201cYou got kind of everything you wanted today. How could this create such unrest in your heart? Did you know this was coming?\u201d That\u2019s the thing with depression. A lot of times there\u2019s no trigger. You can look back and go, \u201cOh, there was a root there and there was a root there.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: As a mom, did you feel a protectiveness?<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Oh, my. The dog and pony show that I was doing to not make them look at Rod and the hard things he was going through. I was like, \u201cLook away, kids. Nothing to see here. He\u2019s an amazing dad. He\u2019s awesome.\u201d I was wanting them to just not see, because I know how kids are. They\u2019re going to think, \u201cI did this to Dad.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Oh.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Like he\u2019s in the bed and he can\u2019t function or whatever, and he was never\u2014it really wasn\u2019t that bad, but at the end of the day it was more like you felt like you were having a heart attack every day more than \u201cI\u2019m in the bed all the time.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Rod: Right.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: It wasn\u2019t that. It was just he lived with this level of an elephant on his chest, which made you more tired and not wanting to do life.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: I bet you felt incredible shame and guilt.<\/p>\n<p>Rod: Oh, yes.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Rod: Oh, tremendous. All of that. Which like she said, there\u2019s probably this judgment that you feel, and then you\u2019re already heaping your other stuff on top of yourself as well. I was speaking with somebody a few months ago whose child dealt with depression, and he said kind of like Rach did, \u201cI grew up every day, I couldn\u2019t wait for the day. I\u2019d wake up, ready to go. I couldn\u2019t understand when anybody\u2019d have depression I\u2019d say, \u201cGo exercise. Go outside. Go this. Go that.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: \u201cGo get some sun.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Rod: And then he said, \u201cOne time I had been put on this medication for a little bit.\u201d I can\u2019t remember what he said the issue was, but it put him in a state of depression. He said, \u201cI really thank God all the time for that, because it really changed my view of my daughter\u2019s deal, and anybody that ever tells me they have this, I have a whole another view, because there is no quick solution\u2014to go to the gym and work out\u2014endorphins or whatever. I\u2019ve now learned that that is not possible because I experienced it myself.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: I will say for the listener who is the wife like me: when you\u2019re one with your husband, I had unforgiveness towards Rod\u2019s body, and because we were one, we were one, we were married, I was impeding his healing with my unforgiveness, because I was literally holding his body hostage, like, \u201cDo better. Pull yourself up by your bootstraps,\u201d which is what I\u2019d done my whole life.<\/p>\n<p>I really learned to be honest, the power of communion. I remember I just sat down with the Lord, and I was just crying out. I can\u2019t remember. His mom was supposed to come over, and I was just like, \u201cI don\u2019t want to see anybody with the name of \u2018Brown.\u2019\u201d I was done. I was like \u201cBlehhhhh.\u201d The Lord\u2014it was so great. I was like, \u201cI just need to be in Your presence.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>I was just going back to what I knew. \u201cI\u2019m going back to Your presence,\u201d and He sat me down. He was like, \u201cI\u2019m going to teach you communion today.\u201d I just got schooled. I can\u2019t really tell you all the things that the Lord said to me that day, but as I broke the bread, I realized that it was like the Lord was just breaking off unforgiveness from my heart.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: What do you mean? Take us back to that room by yourself.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Here\u2019s what I want to say.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: I want to save that.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Sure.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: For tomorrow.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Sure.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Okay.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Because I really want you to explain that to us, because what I\u2019ve heard so far is we have this third marriage, and we have an angry woman and a depressed man. I think a lot of couples get there. My question is, \u201cOkay, how did you get out?\u201d and you\u2019re not going to be able to tell us that in one minute, but you can take a day to tell us. So let\u2019s push pause and say let\u2019s hear the rest of the story tomorrow.<\/p>\n<p>Shelby: I\u2019m Shelby Abbott, and you\u2019ve been listening to Dave and Ann Wilson with Rachel Faulkner-Brown and Rob Brown on FamilyLife Today.<\/p>\n<p>It can feel so exasperating when life seems to keep kicking you down, right when you think you\u2019ll be able to get back up. Rachel\u2019s story has certainly shown us a living, breathing example of that. In the midst of things in my life that have felt relentless in their kicking, I\u2019ve been a chronic pain patient for almost 14 years with a herniated disc in my back. I have often wondered, \u201cWhere is God? Where is He, and what is He doing?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Well maybe you\u2019re like Rachel and me. Can you relate to that? Have you ever wondered \u201cWhere is God and what is He doing?\u201d I\u2019ve genuinely appreciated this conversation today, because it helps me to feel like I\u2019m not the only one who struggles with this stuff.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel has written a book called His Name: Our Hope in Grief, and we want to send you a copy of that book as our thanks when you partner financially with us today and help more families hear more conversations like the one you just heard today, that are helpful to people like you and to me. So you can partner online at FamilyLifeToday.com, or by calling 800-358-6329. That can be a one-time gift, or it can be a recurring monthly gift.<\/p>\n<p>Again the number is 800- \u201cF\u201d as in family, \u201cL\u201d as in life, and then the word \u201cTODAY.\u201d And you can feel free to drop us a letter via snail mail. Our address is FamilyLife, 100 Lake Hart Drive, Orlando, Florida 32832.<\/p>\n<p>Coming up tomorrow we\u2019re going to hear more of Rachel\u2019s story about how when she finally surrendered everything over to God, it made it possible to forgive and extend kindness and love. That\u2019s coming up tomorrow. We hope you\u2019ll join us.<\/p>\n<p>On behalf of Dave and Ann Wilson, I\u2019m Shelby Abbott. We will see you back next time for another edition of FamilyLife Today.<\/p>\n<p>FamilyLife Today is a production of FamilyLife\u00ae, a Cru\u00ae Ministry.<br \/>\nHelping you pursue the relationships that matter most.<\/p>\n<p>We are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider donating today to help defray the costs?<\/p>\n<p>Copyright \u00a9 2023 FamilyLife\u00ae. All rights reserved.<\/p>\n<p>www.FamilyLife<\/p>\n"],"_g_feedback_shortcode_0fce6da8e5d079c7fb98f99d816ff016eb659521":["\n\t\t\t\t[contact-field label=\"Name\" type=\"name\"  required=\"true\" \/]\n\t\t\t\t[contact-field label=\"Email\" type=\"email\" required=\"true\" \/]\n\t\t\t\t[contact-field label=\"Website\" type=\"url\" \/]\n\t\t\t\t[contact-field label=\"Message\" type=\"textarea\" \/]"],"_g_feedback_shortcode_atts_0fce6da8e5d079c7fb98f99d816ff016eb659521":["a:17:{s:2:\"to\";s:29:\"margaret.coyle@familylife.com\";s:7:\"subject\";s:90:\"[FamilyLife - A Cru Ministry] Hope When Life Goes from Bad to Worse: Rachel Faulkner-Brown\";s:12:\"show_subject\";s:2:\"no\";s:6:\"widget\";i:0;s:14:\"block_template\";N;s:19:\"block_template_part\";N;s:2:\"id\";i:280562;s:18:\"submit_button_text\";s:6:\"Submit\";s:14:\"customThankyou\";s:0:\"\";s:21:\"customThankyouHeading\";s:26:\"Your message has been sent\";s:21:\"customThankyouMessage\";s:30:\"Thank you for your 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});\";s:18:\"current_block_list\";a:17:{i:0;s:14:\"uagb\/container\";i:1;s:12:\"core\/heading\";i:2;s:9:\"core\/html\";i:3;s:10:\"core\/group\";i:6;s:21:\"uagb\/advanced-heading\";i:7;s:14:\"uagb\/separator\";i:8;s:14:\"uagb\/icon-list\";i:9;s:20:\"uagb\/icon-list-child\";i:10;s:11:\"core\/search\";i:13;s:18:\"core\/legacy-widget\";i:16;s:10:\"uagb\/image\";i:17;s:17:\"core\/social-links\";i:18;s:16:\"core\/social-link\";i:19;s:14:\"core\/paragraph\";i:20;s:30:\"meta-box\/fl-conditional-blocks\";i:21;s:12:\"uagb\/buttons\";i:22;s:18:\"uagb\/buttons-child\";}s:8:\"uag_flag\";b:1;s:11:\"uag_version\";i:1776492196;s:6:\"gfonts\";a:1:{s:7:\"Default\";a:2:{s:10:\"fontfamily\";s:7:\"Default\";s:12:\"fontvariants\";a:0:{}}}s:10:\"gfonts_url\";s:71:\"\/\/fonts.googleapis.com\/css?family=Default&subset=latin&display=fallback\";s:12:\"gfonts_files\";a:0:{}s:14:\"uag_faq_layout\";b:0;}"]},"uagb_featured_image_src":{"full":["https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/04\/image-scaled.jpg",1024,1024,true]},"uagb_author_info":{"display_name":"Margaret","author_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/author\/margaret-coylefamilylife-com\/"},"uagb_comment_info":0,"uagb_excerpt":"After losing two husbands, author Rachel Faulkner-Brown couldn't believe she might have found love again. Again, she collided with grief as life went from bad to worse. But God had more hope for Rachel. Show Notes and Resources Learn More About How to Ble...","meta_box":{"show_notes":"<ul>\n<li>Learn More About <a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/familylifeblended\/blended-families\/\">How to Blend Your Family with Ron Deal<\/a>: FamilyLife Blended\u00ae provides biblically-based resources that help prevent re-divorce, strengthen stepfamilies, and help break the generational cycle of divorce.<\/li>\n<li>Don't widow alone. Find connection through Rachel's \"Be Still\" Ministry, along with resources for your grief and struggle at <a href=\"https:\/\/www.bestillministries.net\/\">bestillministries.net <\/a><\/li>\n<li>Grab Rachel's 30-day devotional, <a href=\"https:\/\/shop.familylife.com\/product\/his-name-our-hope-in-grief\/\">His Name: Our Hope in Grief<\/a>, or receive it free with <a href=\"https:\/\/donate.familylife.com\/april-2023\/his-name-our-hope-in-grief\/\">any donation this week. <\/a><\/li>\n<li>Find resources from this podcast at <a href=\"https:\/\/shop.familylife.com\/product-category\/radio-resources\/?orderby=date\">shop.familylife.com<\/a>.<\/li>\n<li>Find more content and resources on the <a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/app\/\">FamilyLife's app<\/a>!<\/li>\n<li>Help others find FamilyLife. Leave a review on <a href=\"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303\">Apple Podcast<\/a> or <a href=\"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm?si=d6dfa8d2415f4750\">Spotify<\/a>.<\/li>\n<li>Check out all the FamilyLife podcasts on the <a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/familylife-podcast-network\/\">FamilyLife Podcast Network<\/a><\/li>\n<\/ul>\n","transcript_url":"","transcript_content":"<p>FamilyLife Today\u00ae National Radio Version (time edited) Transcript<br \/>\nReferences to conferences, resources, or other special promotions may be obsolete.<\/p>\n<p>Hope When Life Goes from Bad to Worse<\/p>\n<p>Guest: Rachel Faulkner-Brown and Rod Brown<br \/>\nFrom the series: Hope in my Nightmare (Day 2 of 3)<br \/>\nAir date: April 25, 2023<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: We all have to live with a level of mystery. I think that\u2019s the biggest thing with suffering. When you go through things that are hard, to the degree that you can be okay with mystery is the degree that you will be able to really live.<\/p>\n<p>Shelby: Welcome to FamilyLife Today, where we want to help you pursue the relationships that matter most. I\u2019m Shelby Abbott, and your hosts are Dave and Ann Wilson. You can find us at FamilyLifeToday.com or on the FamilyLife\u00ae app.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: This is FamilyLife\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Dave: \u2014Today!<\/p>\n<p>So there\u2019s a question we ask when we\u2019re walking through the valley, through a really, really dark time. At least in my mind it\u2019s, \u201cGod are You here, and do You see? Do You know?\u201d I\u2019ve felt that many times.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Or \u201cWhere are You? I don\u2019t see You in this.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Dave: You don\u2019t feel Him, you feel alone, you\u2019re like, \u201cI know He\u2019s here. I know Scripture. I believe He\u2019s here, but I just don\u2019t feel it right now.\u201d You wonder if He\u2019s here.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: There are times\u2014I don\u2019t know if you do this\u2014I beg Him, like \u201cLord, I need to feel Your presence. I need to know that You\u2019re with me.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Yes. We are in day two of a story with Rachel Faulkner-Brown. She\u2019s back in the studio.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Which is a gripping story.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Yes. First of all, let\u2019s say, \u201cWelcome back.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Thank you.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Again, if you\u2019re a listener and you missed it\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Go back.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: \u2014hit pause right now, and go listen, because we can\u2019t go through everything that happened, but your story is full of \u201cGod, are You here,\u201d right? Losing two husbands before you\u2019re 31 years of age. Again, the listeners are like, \u201cWhat?\u201d Go listen to it. We\u2019re not going to go through the details. It\u2019s hard enough to go through one; to go through two! I was like, \u201cReally? You really felt God\u2019s presence that strong in it.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: That was so inspiring, Rachel.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: How can you ever know what He\u2019s doing until you look back in reverse? I could never have known that in the moment, what He was preparing me for, but it\u2019s funny. We went to Israel in 2019, and we were on this bus, like everybody does in Israel. I remember them looking out, right outside Galilee. They were like, \u201cCrops only grow in the valley.\u201d Man, y\u2019all, it was as if the God of the Universe said, \u201cThat\u2019s right.\u201d Because the mountain is not where you grow your crops. It\u2019s in the valley.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Where the rain comes.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Where the rain comes. I looked out on those date fields and all the beautiful things that they\u2019re growing, and I just thought, \u201cI\u2019m not going to despise my valley.\u201d Just don\u2019t despise your valley because you just don\u2019t know what He\u2019s doing.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes. We\u2019re talking about the book that you wrote called His Name. The subtitle is Our Hope in Grief. Tell us a little bit about what you do now.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Well, in 2017 I got together with some friends in Birmingham. There were nine widows in Birmingham, and a friend was like, \u201cI want to take them and get a massage, and then we\u2019re going to do a nice dinner, and then we want y\u2019all to come share,\u201d a friend of mine, Paige Knudsen.\u201d I was like, \u201cOh, we would love to come over and do this.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>On that drive home I looked at Paige, and was like, \u201cWe could do this. Somebody needs to be doing what we just did for widows, because young widows don\u2019t have anybody to look to.\u201d So after losing two husbands, I was like, \u201cI kind of feel like I know what I\u2019m doing. I\u2019ve lived enough life; I\u2019ve made enough mistakes. I want to help them not make mistakes financially and relationally, and with in-laws, and with their kids.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>I\u2019ve made enough mistakes that I was ready to help somebody else to not make those same mistakes. So we threw together in six weeks a retreat. I raised money; I raised $250 for each widow coming. We had twenty widows sign up. That was the beginning of Never Alone Widows.<\/p>\n<p>Out of that, our prayer team and the widows that served with us and women connected to the ministry we wrote this little spiral-bound devotional, called His Name: Our Hope in Grief. We all took a name of God that you related to specifically in your story. When they\u2019ve gone through a valley, they\u2019ve seen the crop, and they\u2019ve seen Who He wants to be in the valley. Because if you don\u2019t have Who He is right, you won\u2019t be able to get who you are right.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: And you have a podcast.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Yes, we do have a podcast. It\u2019s called There\u2019s More. We just listen to stories, very similar to y\u2019all. God has done amazing things. We\u2019ve helped around 3,000 widows, and then we\u2019re hosting a conference for 400 widows this year in 2023. Then we do three other retreats, and curriculum called How to Widow Well, which is a 20-video series targeted for a widow. It\u2019s different.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: It\u2019s different to lose a child than it is to lose a husband, to lose a grandmother. And widows really kind of want to be with other widows who get it, that \u201cI don\u2019t want to have to use words,\u201d those type of friends. God is just\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Ann: I remember hearing Chuck Swindoll years ago say, \u201cIf we trust God, He will never allow our pain to be in vain.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: That\u2019s what you\u2019ve done. You\u2019ve done that. We ended yesterday with the tragic death of your husband who was a fighter pilot.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Right.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: You were 31. How old was he when he passed away?<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: It was seven days before his 40th birthday. He was 39.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: So then did you ever think, \u201cI will never get married again?\u201d Were you afraid?<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: I would love to tell you, \u201cNo,\u201d but I was like, \u201cOh, yes. I will definitely get married again, because I\u2019m not raising these kids by myself.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: I didn\u2019t think that immediately, obviously, but\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Ann: You need help.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: \u2014I loved marriage. I\u2019m like a professional married person. I love marriage, love it so much.<\/p>\n<p>[Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: I love big, and I love hard, and I knew I wanted to give that away, and I wanted companionship. Honestly, this time I will say I wanted a ministry partner. I knew God was doing something in my life\u2014I shared my story for the first time a year after Blair died. It\u2019s still so crazy to me; the altar was just full that night. It was just like, \u201cWait, what is happening?\u201d I don\u2019t ever not want to do this. I just feel the pleasure of God when I share, and when I really invite people into a different life.<\/p>\n<p>That\u2019s what I was inviting those friends into. I was like, \u201cThis is serious.\u201d I shared Blair\u2019s surrender story, and I was just like, \u201cThere\u2019s no more playing. Look what happened. Life is short.\u201d That message, I always tell people, I\u2019m like the wreck on the side of the road that you have to look at,\u201d so that\u2019s why I get there. The reason people stay is because they\u2019re like, \u201cOh, she\u2019s happy. She\u2019s full of joy. She still loves God, and He\u2019s still good to her. He\u2019s not evil and mean,\u201d because He\u2019s not.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: How did she get there?<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Rod and I got introduced by a mutual friend.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Wait, wait, wait. People don\u2019t know who Rod is.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: We have to introduce Rod. He\u2019s here.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: He\u2019s the slacker over in the corner here.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: I know. It\u2019s so fun that Rod\u2019s here.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: So, Rod Brown is here. He\u2019s always been here, been sitting here listening to this whole thing. But our listeners didn\u2019t know that this is your third husband, and it\u2019s been ten years. Rod, welcome.<\/p>\n<p>Rod: Thank you. Great to be here.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: You have to tell us the story. How did this happen?<\/p>\n<p>Ann: How did you guys meet? What was going on?<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Oh, this is good. This is good.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Rod, you share.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: You start.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes, let\u2019s hear your\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Rod: A mutual friend. I was at a lake house one weekend with a lot of single people. One of the women that was there\u2014we just kind of bonded over smoothies, just talking. The next time I saw her she was like, \u201cHey, I have this woman I really would like you to meet. I was like, \u201cGreat! Introduce us.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: And how old were you at the time?<\/p>\n<p>Rod: I think I was 43, 44.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Okay.<\/p>\n<p>Rod: It took a while for this to happen, so the next time I see this person, six months later, \u201cHey, I have this person I really want you to meet.\u201d \u201cAlright, why don\u2019t you introduce us?\u201d I think it took a while, I think almost a year for it to finally happen.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: And you had never been married.<\/p>\n<p>Rod: I\u2019d never been married. She introduced us via email, and then we connected, and then she said to me, \u201cDid she tell you anything about me?\u201d I was like, \u201cNo.\u201d She\u2019s like, \u201cWell, I\u2019d like for you to watch this video before we talk.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>[Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: This is not typical.<\/p>\n<p>Rod: Yes, this is not normal. I never really was asked to watch a video before going out with somebody. So I was like, \u201cWow, what\u2019s this video going to be about?\u201d It was a video that her church in Columbus did, really talking about her life, what you guys just heard of her losing two husbands and going through all that. So I watched it. She said, \u201cWhat\u2019d you think?\u201d I was like, \u201cThat was a lot. That\u2019s a lot.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Did you tear up like you just did when you watched it the first time?<\/p>\n<p>Rod: Oh yes. Oh yes, for sure. It was powerful, tough to see and to hear someone go through that so young, and then have two children the second time.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Pass the Kleenex box over here. I need a tissue.<\/p>\n<p>[Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>Rod: So Rachel would say I was pretty weird, but I would say I was just trying to protect her, and I just said, \u201cHey, I really don\u2019t want to do email a lot or talk a lot on the phone. I\u2019d love to meet at some point,\u201d because over the years in dating and in the different things you can get pretty attached, and you really don\u2019t know the person. And then you meet them and you realize, \u201cWow, we\u2019ve kind of bonded somewhat and we really don\u2019t enjoy each other that much in person.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Really what you\u2019re saying is that you didn\u2019t enjoy them.<\/p>\n<p>Rod: Yes. Yes.<\/p>\n<p>[Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>Rod: It could be one-sided; it could have been two-sided. It could have been both. So we got together one day, beautiful fall day in Atlanta. I lived at the time right near Piedmont Park, which is one of the largest parks in Atlanta, in the Midtown area. We met to go for a walk, and that walk lasted for about seven hours.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: What?<\/p>\n<p>Rod: We walked and we talked.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: You got some steps in that day.<\/p>\n<p>[Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: I did. I totally wore the wrong shoes, too.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: You really just kept talking for seven hours.<\/p>\n<p>Rod: Yes. We stopped for coffee, stopped for lunch.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Stopped for brunch.<\/p>\n<p>Rod: I think we might have gone back for coffee again.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Was there immediate connection?<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Oh, yes. Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Rod: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: He was so fascinating. Rod is the most interesting man in the world.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: No! My husband is.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: I know, I know. He\u2019d been to 63 countries. He had traveled the world. He just worked for Chick-Fil-A for nine years. I was like, \u201cWhat have you not done?\u201d This was so fascinating. He wanted a ministry partner. He wanted to be married, he wanted to be a dad. I was like, \u201cIf this is an interview, you\u2019re in.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>[Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: And then I dreamed about him that night. I do not dream. I\u2019m not a dreamer, but that night I dreamed the very thing widows really miss, companionship, and then that comfort of pillow talk, just having that person just to be up in the crux of their arm.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Your friend.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Yes, your friend, your buddy. Having somebody know where you are all the time is probably one of the number one things that widows miss. I dreamed that night that I was in the crux of his arm, just having pillow talk. It was so real, y\u2019all. It was like it was truly happening, and I was mortified. I was like, \u201cOh, my goodness. I\u2019ve come home and I\u2019ve let this person in my bed.\u201d It was just real, and the Lord was just showing me, \u201cThis is your reality.\u201d Of course, praise the Lord, I did not tell Rod. He would have gone running.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: I was going to ask. You didn\u2019t tell him.<\/p>\n<p>Rod: No, she did not tell me. It wouldn\u2019t have been a wise thing to do, so I\u2019m glad\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Yes. You kept that to yourself.<\/p>\n<p>Rod: \u2014that the Holy Spirit and her friends were like, \u201cHey, hold back. Hold back. Hold back.\u201d So yes, we would get together in Atlanta some. She had several things that she probably didn\u2019t have to come to, but it was convenient, things she wanted to come to, and then she bought something at what\u2019s called \u201cScott\u2019s Antique Market,\u201d which is this big market in Atlanta. She needed it to make it to her in Huntsville, and I basically said, \u201cHey, I want to bring that, whether it\u2019s ready or not. I want to come see you.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>I think that was the night when I visited her that we talked more, kissed for the first time, talked more about being in relationship, where she challenged me of, \u201cHey, I have two kids. I know we\u2019re early, but is this a route that you can see yourself going?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Yes. I said, \u201cDon\u2019t kiss me, unless you want to be a dad.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Rod: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes, that\u2019s good.<\/p>\n<p>Rod: And then before I could answer, she kissed me, so I didn\u2019t know what that meant.<\/p>\n<p>[Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>Ann: But Rod, was there any part of you that thought, \u201cI haven\u2019t been married before. She\u2019s gone through a lot. She has two kids.\u201d Were you a little scared, or were you like, \u201cNo, this is a great challenge.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Rod: That\u2019s a good question. I think that I probably had both of that in me. I had \u201cThis is a great challenge and I really want to do this.\u201d At the same time, I am a little scared. So, I think all those were together. I think in the very beginning of a relationship is you start thinking about those when somebody is in another state. All of the sudden more details start coming, and it starts becoming a little overwhelming. \u201cOne of us needs to leave friends. One of us has to sell a house, or both of us have to. On my account, I would definitely need to,\u201d because mine was small.<\/p>\n<p>All these things start flooding, and it definitely increased over the months. Then we got married in June, and I was just feeling some things, feeling some things, feeling some things and I had no idea what it was. I think in years past I would have gone, \u201cOh, that\u2019s the Holy Spirit telling me slow down, or back up, or whatever. But I\u2019m like, \u201cNo, I\u2019m married.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>I think we were at an event in October of that year\u2014I\u2019ve been on the board of a ministry called Lighthouse Family Retreat, an amazing ministry that helps families that have a child with cancer just have a week at the beach, and we serve them. It\u2019s amazing. I couldn\u2019t wait to do that with my family. All of a sudden, that week I\u2019m just almost becoming like paralyzed in some sense, and called a friend and just told him what I was experiencing.<\/p>\n<p>He\u2019s like, \u201cYou have anxiety, and you probably have depression. It\u2019s probably that.\u201d So unfortunately, I have to tell Rachel that day, \u201cSomething\u2019s wrong with me,\u201d and here she is, husband number three, but this one has something else that\u2019s really different. So that started that journey for probably two and a half years of just working through that, counseling for both of us, counseling for me.<\/p>\n<p>I tell you, really the big part for me was even though being in ministry forever, and probably getting dribs and drabs of it over the years, and maybe even being really solid in it at some point, but not at this point. But it was really coming back to how God loves me. I\u2019m completely loved, completely forgiven, 100 percent, He can\u2019t like me any more tomorrow than He does today. It was really grabbing on to that identity in Christ that freed me from all of that.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: That\u2019s not an easy walk through, is it?<\/p>\n<p>Rod: No, it\u2019s not.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Do you think the marriage was something that brought that to the surface for you?<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Oh, 100 percent.<\/p>\n<p>Rod: Yes, I definitely think that it\u2019s something that I had experienced in small doses over the years, but I did not know what it was. Being single, you could manage that a little bit. I think with all of it coming together, you talk about the big things in your life, your spiritual life, finances, your home, your family life, career and all that\u2014things change. Same place of employment, but what I did really changed a lot.<\/p>\n<p>We moved about 20 miles north from this little place I had to a large home, neighborhood. All of a sudden, I have two children. There\u2019s no warmup; all of a sudden you come back from a honeymoon, there\u2019s two kids there, and you\u2019re a dad.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Yes. And they\u2019re young.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: And they\u2019re busy.<\/p>\n<p>Rod: Yes, right. And I\u2019m a husband for the first time. Rachel is strong and beautiful and wonderful and has the past of what she had to bring in, those things. So there are all these things that you look at, and you\u2019re like, \u201cNo wonder you were overwhelmed.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Rachel, how did you respond when\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Not well. I will tell you.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: \u2014the spouse going through something that their spouse is going\u2014that\u2019s often really hard.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: I always say, \u201cIf you skip one of the phases of grief, you will eventually find it. I skipped anger. I was mad. I was like, \u201cGod, You\u2018ve let me bury two husbands and You\u2019ve seen me through that, and then You let me marry a man who\u2019s sick.\u201d I will say for any wife who\u2019s listening that\u2019s going through this with their own husband: depression and anxiety feels like water in your hands. There\u2019s nothing to grab. It\u2019s not like you can just go, \u201cOh, your pancreas is failing. Let\u2019s just give you a shot.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>It\u2019s so multi-faceted an approach. Does this medicine, and this counselor, and this psychiatrist and this friend, are they going to all say the right things to make you better?\u201d It felt pretty hopeless. I\u2019m going to be really honest. It felt like, \u201cIs this what I\u2019ve signed up for?\u201d I was just mad, frankly, because I was like, \u201cCould you have not taken care of this before we got married? Could you have gone through this season?\u201d But that wasn\u2019t the plan.<\/p>\n<p>I will tell you, for someone who doesn\u2019t struggle with depression, and I\u2019ve woken up every morning of my life just happy to hear the birds singing, there is judgment for people. There is a judgment and a pride. When that has not been your story\u2014and this is embarrassing to say\u2014but you\u2019re like, \u201cWell, I\u2019ve been through a lot, and I didn\u2019t have that problem.\u201d I would never have articulated that. Hear me. But there was a level of judgment in my heart that the Lord was like, \u201cWe\u2019re done with this.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Probably something like, \u201cThat\u2019s nothing compared to what I\u2019ve been through.\u201d Even the comparison.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Well, it was almost like \u201cYou got kind of everything you wanted today. How could this create such unrest in your heart? Did you know this was coming?\u201d That\u2019s the thing with depression. A lot of times there\u2019s no trigger. You can look back and go, \u201cOh, there was a root there and there was a root there.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: As a mom, did you feel a protectiveness?<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Oh, my. The dog and pony show that I was doing to not make them look at Rod and the hard things he was going through. I was like, \u201cLook away, kids. Nothing to see here. He\u2019s an amazing dad. He\u2019s awesome.\u201d I was wanting them to just not see, because I know how kids are. They\u2019re going to think, \u201cI did this to Dad.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Oh.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Like he\u2019s in the bed and he can\u2019t function or whatever, and he was never\u2014it really wasn\u2019t that bad, but at the end of the day it was more like you felt like you were having a heart attack every day more than \u201cI\u2019m in the bed all the time.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Rod: Right.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: It wasn\u2019t that. It was just he lived with this level of an elephant on his chest, which made you more tired and not wanting to do life.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: I bet you felt incredible shame and guilt.<\/p>\n<p>Rod: Oh, yes.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Rod: Oh, tremendous. All of that. Which like she said, there\u2019s probably this judgment that you feel, and then you\u2019re already heaping your other stuff on top of yourself as well. I was speaking with somebody a few months ago whose child dealt with depression, and he said kind of like Rach did, \u201cI grew up every day, I couldn\u2019t wait for the day. I\u2019d wake up, ready to go. I couldn\u2019t understand when anybody\u2019d have depression I\u2019d say, \u201cGo exercise. Go outside. Go this. Go that.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: \u201cGo get some sun.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Rod: And then he said, \u201cOne time I had been put on this medication for a little bit.\u201d I can\u2019t remember what he said the issue was, but it put him in a state of depression. He said, \u201cI really thank God all the time for that, because it really changed my view of my daughter\u2019s deal, and anybody that ever tells me they have this, I have a whole another view, because there is no quick solution\u2014to go to the gym and work out\u2014endorphins or whatever. I\u2019ve now learned that that is not possible because I experienced it myself.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: I will say for the listener who is the wife like me: when you\u2019re one with your husband, I had unforgiveness towards Rod\u2019s body, and because we were one, we were one, we were married, I was impeding his healing with my unforgiveness, because I was literally holding his body hostage, like, \u201cDo better. Pull yourself up by your bootstraps,\u201d which is what I\u2019d done my whole life.<\/p>\n<p>I really learned to be honest, the power of communion. I remember I just sat down with the Lord, and I was just crying out. I can\u2019t remember. His mom was supposed to come over, and I was just like, \u201cI don\u2019t want to see anybody with the name of \u2018Brown.\u2019\u201d I was done. I was like \u201cBlehhhhh.\u201d The Lord\u2014it was so great. I was like, \u201cI just need to be in Your presence.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>I was just going back to what I knew. \u201cI\u2019m going back to Your presence,\u201d and He sat me down. He was like, \u201cI\u2019m going to teach you communion today.\u201d I just got schooled. I can\u2019t really tell you all the things that the Lord said to me that day, but as I broke the bread, I realized that it was like the Lord was just breaking off unforgiveness from my heart.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: What do you mean? Take us back to that room by yourself.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Here\u2019s what I want to say.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: I want to save that.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Sure.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: For tomorrow.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel: Sure.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Okay.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Because I really want you to explain that to us, because what I\u2019ve heard so far is we have this third marriage, and we have an angry woman and a depressed man. I think a lot of couples get there. My question is, \u201cOkay, how did you get out?\u201d and you\u2019re not going to be able to tell us that in one minute, but you can take a day to tell us. So let\u2019s push pause and say let\u2019s hear the rest of the story tomorrow.<\/p>\n<p>Shelby: I\u2019m Shelby Abbott, and you\u2019ve been listening to Dave and Ann Wilson with Rachel Faulkner-Brown and Rob Brown on FamilyLife Today.<\/p>\n<p>It can feel so exasperating when life seems to keep kicking you down, right when you think you\u2019ll be able to get back up. Rachel\u2019s story has certainly shown us a living, breathing example of that. In the midst of things in my life that have felt relentless in their kicking, I\u2019ve been a chronic pain patient for almost 14 years with a herniated disc in my back. I have often wondered, \u201cWhere is God? Where is He, and what is He doing?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Well maybe you\u2019re like Rachel and me. Can you relate to that? Have you ever wondered \u201cWhere is God and what is He doing?\u201d I\u2019ve genuinely appreciated this conversation today, because it helps me to feel like I\u2019m not the only one who struggles with this stuff.<\/p>\n<p>Rachel has written a book called His Name: Our Hope in Grief, and we want to send you a copy of that book as our thanks when you partner financially with us today and help more families hear more conversations like the one you just heard today, that are helpful to people like you and to me. So you can partner online at FamilyLifeToday.com, or by calling 800-358-6329. That can be a one-time gift, or it can be a recurring monthly gift.<\/p>\n<p>Again the number is 800- \u201cF\u201d as in family, \u201cL\u201d as in life, and then the word \u201cTODAY.\u201d And you can feel free to drop us a letter via snail mail. Our address is FamilyLife, 100 Lake Hart Drive, Orlando, Florida 32832.<\/p>\n<p>Coming up tomorrow we\u2019re going to hear more of Rachel\u2019s story about how when she finally surrendered everything over to God, it made it possible to forgive and extend kindness and love. That\u2019s coming up tomorrow. We hope you\u2019ll join us.<\/p>\n<p>On behalf of Dave and Ann Wilson, I\u2019m Shelby Abbott. We will see you back next time for another edition of FamilyLife Today.<\/p>\n<p>FamilyLife Today is a production of FamilyLife\u00ae, a Cru\u00ae Ministry.<br \/>\nHelping you pursue the relationships that matter most.<\/p>\n<p>We are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider donating today to help defray the costs?<\/p>\n<p>Copyright \u00a9 2023 FamilyLife\u00ae. All rights reserved.<\/p>\n<p>www.FamilyLife<\/p>\n","theme_header_position":"Sticky","post_header_is_sticky":"default","is_header_overlay":"0"},"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast\/280562","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/podcast"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/47000"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=280562"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/280866"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=280562"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=280562"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=280562"},{"taxonomy":"podcast_series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast_series?post=280562"},{"taxonomy":"cwp_profile","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/cwp_profile?post=280562"},{"taxonomy":"series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/series?post=280562"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}