{"id":280313,"date":"2024-03-13T09:15:00","date_gmt":"2024-03-13T13:15:00","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/how-to-keep-the-romance-alive-dr-juli-slattery-and-dr-michael-sytsma\/"},"modified":"2025-05-06T13:07:50","modified_gmt":"2025-05-06T17:07:50","slug":"how-to-keep-the-romance-alive-dr-juli-slattery-and-dr-michael-sytsma","status":"publish","type":"podcast","link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/how-to-keep-the-romance-alive-dr-juli-slattery-and-dr-michael-sytsma\/","title":{"rendered":"How to Keep the Romance Alive:  Dr. Juli Slattery, and Dr. Michael Sytsma"},"content":{"rendered":"<p>What&#8217;s it look like to keep the romance alive when it things are flaming out? Well, Ron and Nan Deal, Juli Slattery, and Michael R. Sytsma, PhD are here to help. They&#8217;re talking about bringing back that love, having meaningful chats and noticing when things feel off.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>What&#8217;s it look like to keep the romance alive when it things are flaming out? Well, Ron and Nan Deal, Juli Slattery, and Michael R. Sytsma, PhD are here to help. They&#8217;re talking about bringing back that love, having meaningful chats and noticing when thin&#8230;<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":47000,"featured_media":280866,"menu_order":0,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"closed","template":"","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"_seopress_robots_primary_cat":"","_seopress_titles_title":"","_seopress_titles_desc":"","_seopress_robots_index":"","inline_featured_image":false,"_uag_custom_page_level_css":"","episode_type":"audio","audio_file":"https:\/\/traffic.omny.fm\/d\/clips\/cbd16f10-ac60-4f09-b4df-b15400ce35aa\/33aaac7e-3581-4e21-a3df-b154011ba58c\/a73cac8c-d3c1-41b9-b014-b154011bf5dc\/audio.mp3","podmotor_file_id":"","podmotor_episode_id":"","cover_image":"","cover_image_id":"","duration":"00:26:14","filesize":"24.05M","filesize_raw":"","date_recorded":"2024-03-13 09:15:00","explicit":"","block":""},"categories":[],"tags":[2159],"podcast_series":[],"cwp_profile":[3388,9627],"series":[2101],"class_list":["post-280313","podcast","type-podcast","status-publish","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","tag-how-to-keep-romance-alive","cwp_profile-juli-slattery","cwp_profile-michael-sytsma","series-familylife-today"],"acf":[],"episode_featured_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2024\/04\/image-scaled.jpg?w=1024","episode_player_image":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/1001\/2023\/02\/image-scaled.jpg","download_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-download\/280313\/how-to-keep-the-romance-alive-dr-juli-slattery-and-dr-michael-sytsma","player_link":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast-player\/280313\/how-to-keep-the-romance-alive-dr-juli-slattery-and-dr-michael-sytsma","audio_player":null,"episode_data":{"playerMode":"light","subscribeUrls":{"apple_podcasts":{"key":"apple_podcasts","url":"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303?mt=2&app=podcast","label":"Apple Podcasts","class":"apple_podcasts","icon":"apple-podcasts.png"},"google_podcasts":{"key":"google_podcasts","url":"","label":"Google Podcasts","class":"google_podcasts","icon":"google-podcasts.png"},"spotify":{"key":"spotify","url":"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm","label":"Spotify","class":"spotify","icon":"spotify.png"},"youtube":{"key":"youtube","url":"","label":"YouTube","class":"youtube","icon":"youtube.png"}},"rssFeedUrl":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/feed\/podcast\/familylife-today","embedCode":"<blockquote class=\"wp-embedded-content\" data-secret=\"7ICFYhgGmC\"><a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/how-to-keep-the-romance-alive-dr-juli-slattery-and-dr-michael-sytsma\/\">How to Keep the Romance Alive:  Dr. Juli Slattery, and Dr. Michael Sytsma<\/a><\/blockquote><iframe sandbox=\"allow-scripts\" security=\"restricted\" src=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/familylife-today\/how-to-keep-the-romance-alive-dr-juli-slattery-and-dr-michael-sytsma\/embed\/#?secret=7ICFYhgGmC\" width=\"500\" height=\"350\" title=\"&#8220;How to Keep the Romance Alive:  Dr. Juli Slattery, and Dr. Michael Sytsma&#8221; &#8212; FamilyLife\u00ae - A Cru Ministry\" data-secret=\"7ICFYhgGmC\" frameborder=\"0\" marginwidth=\"0\" marginheight=\"0\" scrolling=\"no\" class=\"wp-embedded-content\"><\/iframe><script>\n\/*! 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Well, Ron and Nan Deal, Juli Slattery, and Michael R. Sytsma, PhD are here to help. They're talking about bringing back that love, having meaningful chats and noticing when thin...","meta_box":{"show_notes":"<p>Want to hear more episodes by Ron Deal? Listen <a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/guest\/ron-deal\/\">here<\/a>! Catch more of his thoughts at <a href=\"https:\/\/rondeal.org\/\">rondeal.org<\/a>, and on X <a href=\"https:\/\/twitter.com\/RonLDeal\">@RonLDeal<\/a><br \/>\nWant to hear more episodes by Dr. Juli Slattery? Listen <a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/guest\/juli-slattery\/\">here<\/a>! Catch more of her thoughts at <a href=\"https:\/\/www.authenticintimacy.com\/\">authenticintimacy.com<\/a>, and on <a href=\"https:\/\/www.instagram.com\/authenticintimacy\">Instagram<\/a> and <a href=\"https:\/\/www.facebook.com\/AuthenticIntimacy\">Facebook<\/a> @authenticintimacy<br \/>\nWant to hear more episodes by Michael Sytsma? Listen <a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/podcast\/guest\/Michael-Sytsma\/\">here<\/a>! Catch more of their thoughts on Facebook <a href=\"https:\/\/www.facebook.com\/drsytsma\">@drsytsma<\/a><br \/>\nSet sail on the ultimate romantic getaway! Book now for the 2025 Love Like You Mean It Marriage Cruise, sailing from Miami, FL on February 8 - 15, 2025. Don't miss our LLYMI Cruise Madness Sale! Secure your spot at <a href=\"https:\/\/www.lovelikeyoumeanitcruise.com\/\">lovelikeyoumeanitcruise.com<\/a>.<br \/>\nFind resources from this podcast at <a href=\"https:\/\/shop.familylife.com\/product-category\/radio-resources\/\">shop.familylife.com<\/a>.<br \/>\n<a href=\"https:\/\/shop.familylife.com\/product-category\/past-radio-resources\/\">See resources from our past podcasts.<\/a><br \/>\nFind more content and resources on the <a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/app\/\">FamilyLife's app<\/a>!<br \/>\nHelp others find FamilyLife. Leave a review on <a href=\"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/familylife-today\/id212174303\">Apple Podcast<\/a> or <a href=\"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/0j5UaKdQOHQCuo1bt0ebEm?si=d6dfa8d2415f4750\">Spotify<\/a>.<br \/>\nCheck out all the FamilyLife's podcasts on the <a href=\"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/familylife-podcast-network\/\">FamilyLife Podcast Network<\/a><\/p>\n","transcript_url":"https:\/\/transcript.familylife.com\/fl2024-03-13.pdf","transcript_content":"<p>FamilyLife Today\u00ae National Radio Version (time edited) Transcript<\/p>\n<p>References to conferences, resources, or other special promotions may be obsolete.<\/p>\n<p>How to Keep the Romance Alive<\/p>\n<p>Guests:Ron and Nan Deal, Dr. Juli Slattery, and Dr. Michael Sytsma<\/p>\n<p>From the series:How to Keep the Romance Alive (Day 1 of 1)<\/p>\n<p>Air date:March 13, 2024<\/p>\n<p>Ron: Jesus always used His power to empower other people. They were always more because of how He treated them, never less. Just think about that for just a second. There have been many situations where I paused and stopped and thought, \u201cOkay, the way I\u2019ve been treating my wife, talking to her, the tone of my voice, the look in my eyes\u2014she is now less because of how I\u2019m treating her. That is not being a godly husband. She should be more because of how I treat her.<\/p>\n<p>Shelby: Welcome to FamilyLife Today, where we want to help you pursue the relationships that matter most. I\u2019m Shelby Abbott, and your hosts are Dave and Ann Wilson. You can find us at FamilyLifeToday.com. This is FamilyLife Today!<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Today we get to listen to a talk from the Love Like You Mean It\u00ae cruise that we were on just a few weeks ago.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Wasn\u2019t it fun?<\/p>\n<p>Dave: It was awesome! We left out of Miami, and we came back to the port in Miami just in time for the Super Bowl. [Laughter] It was awesome; it was incredible. We spoke, I think, seven times total. There were great breakout sessions, keynote sessions, comedians, singers, artists, you name it; almost 4,000 people on the boat.<\/p>\n<p>It was incredible, and you don\u2019t want to miss next year. You can sign up right now, FamilyLifeToday.com, and go on the Love Like You Mean It cruise.<\/p>\n<p>We were part of a panel that Ron and Nan Deal hosted\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Ann: \u2014yes.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: \u2014and you and I, with Dr. Juli Slattery and Dr. Michael Sytsma, talking about questions from the audience. We didn\u2019t even know what they were going to ask.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: I\u2019m not sure why we were on the panel. I was very nervous and scared. I feel like they were all experts in their field.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Yes, and their field is in the area of intimacy.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: And counselors and therapists.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Yes, so we were the non-counselors sitting in the middle of the stage. You\u2019re going to get to hear some of the questions we got to answer, so enjoy this.<\/p>\n<p>[Recorded Message]<\/p>\n<p>Nan: You asked. These are the questions that you submitted, and so we are going to start answering them. I\u2019m going to start off with a pretty easy one.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Oh, that\u2019s good.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Easy?<\/p>\n<p>Nan: Just to ease you in, you know?<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Oh, thanks, Nan.<\/p>\n<p>Nan: We\u2019re on this cruise. You\u2019ve been gone for a week. I think this is a great question to ask before you get off the boat. \u201cHow do we maintain the connection that we felt on the cruise once we get home? How do we recognize when we\u2019re getting off track, and how do we come back together?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Dave: I think a lot of us know that there\u2019s a real correlation between our walk with God and our relationships in our marriage. In the book of Revelation, there\u2019s a passage where John gets a revelation from Jesus, and he speaks to churches. Some of you recognize\u2014he says to a church, \u201cI love everything you\u2019re doing, but you\u2019ve lost your first love,\u201d and he says what? I think in our marriage we lose our first love. We lose that zeal and that passion. It could be in a month.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: That can be normal, I think.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: We\u2019re all doing this all the time.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Yes, and it happens in our walk with God. So, He says, \u201cRepent, and do the things you did at first.\u201d Ann and I wrote about this in Vertical Marriage. There\u2019s the repent part, which is turn, stop living the way you are. You have to turn and go 180 degrees back. But then, what were the things you used to do when you had passion, when you were dating, and you\u2019re going out, and when you\u2019re first married? Probably you were talking, you were listening, there was\u2014come on, give me a hand.<\/p>\n<p>There was non-sexual touch. [Laughter] No, none of that. [Ann rubbing Dave\u2019s head] I actually had hair then. She would rub her hands through my hair.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: It\u2019s better now.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Keep doing it. [Laughter] It might come back. Really, we\u2019re joking around, but it really was\u2014I know, for our marriage, and I bet you\u2019re doing the same thing\u2014those things go away. I rarely, but I\u2019m embarrassed to say this, we don\u2019t kiss like we used to kiss, right? And I know most couples don\u2019t. It may be a peck before you leave or come home, but when was the last time you grabbed her or grabbed him and just made out?<\/p>\n<p>Your kids hate it, but you made out. [Laughter] It wasn\u2019t sexual. It wasn\u2019t leading to anything else, but \u201cI really do love you, and I really want to hold you.\u201d And maybe not even kiss, but just hold. I went too far. But those are the things you used to do. Look at me. I\u2019m holding her hand this whole time.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: I know. I like it. This is fun.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Yes, are we going to do this?<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Is it because Juli and Michael are here, too? [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Trying to impress the counselors! [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>Nan: I do, too.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Go, honey. [Massaging Ann\u2019s feet] Here\u2019s what she loves right here. [Roaring laughter] Oh, when I touch her feet\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Nan: \u2014oh, yes, yes.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: \u2014I am not kidding.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: This is amazing! [Laughter] Many of you like this.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: This is foreplay right here.<\/p>\n<p>Nan: Forget the hands.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: This is like the late-night one. It could get a little\u2014[Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>I think, too, when we come back from anything significant, whether it be a vacation or a conference, I try\u2014we try\u2014to be intentional about our conversations. It\u2019s easy to talk about nothing but kids or grandkids.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Schedules.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes, schedules. But just to say, you have notes. Dave is really good at taking notes. Just even going back to what you learned or heard or something you might have jotted down in your mind or on your phone, just talking about, \u201cWhat did you think about that? What did you feel about that? What was your best session? What did you hear that you would like to really live out?\u201d I think those are always good\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Okay, we\u2019re done talking, but I will say this: when I say, \u201cLet\u2019s talk about what the speaker said tonight,\u201d I don\u2019t know if your wife is like this guys. It lights her up.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: It\u2019s like she\u2019s chasing me around the house after that. [Laughter] It\u2019s unbelievable, because it\u2019s spiritual in nature, and it\u2019s romantic to her. Is it true for you, ladies?<\/p>\n<p>Juli: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: What else are they going to say? [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>Nan: \u201cNo, not at all.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: \u201cThat\u2019s not attractive.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Nan: I think, too\u2014and I didn\u2019t say this one in the first session, but I think we can still be creative when we get home. I don\u2019t need to come on this cruise and wait for somebody else to hang a gift on my door. I can hang a gift on the door at home and surprise him.<\/p>\n<p>Juli: Wow.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Nan, this is good stuff!<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Way to go!<\/p>\n<p>Nan: I mean, I can get creative. We have not watched TV since we\u2019ve been here, and we will go home and get in a rut.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Nan: We could have a three-course meal\u2014not every night, sorry. [Laughter] But you know, why not cook something like that together? We could do those things, but we don\u2019t. We get in a rut, we get busy with all this and that, and we could still get creative. We don\u2019t have to wait for the FamilyLife cruise staff to hang something on our door, so whoo! I\u2019m on my soapbox.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Juli just got Mike a gift.<\/p>\n<p>Juli: I did, yes.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: And it wasn\u2019t hanging on the door.<\/p>\n<p>Ron: What was it?<\/p>\n<p>Dave: He\u2019s sitting right there.<\/p>\n<p>Juli: I wanted to surprise him. There was this thing he told me that he wanted, and I thought, \u201cI really want to surprise him,\u201d so I bought it last week, and I put it in one of the FamilyLife bags that they put on your door. [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Oh, nice.<\/p>\n<p>Juli: I was trying to arrange it so that I wouldn\u2019t be in the room when he got in the room, and it looked all official. I think I got you, surprised you, right? Yes, there you go.<\/p>\n<p>Ron: That was very nice, very nice.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Good job, Juli!<\/p>\n<p>Juli: Thanks, yes. Part of that question, too, was, \u201cHow do we know when we\u2019re getting off course?\u201d Boy, is that a great question.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Juli: You guys are from the Motor City, so I\u2019m going to use an example you\u2019ll like.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Alright!<\/p>\n<p>Juli: There you go. Is that good that I said that?<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Go, Juli. Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: The Motor City!<\/p>\n<p>Juli: Okay, so a lot of times you get a check engine light or a change the oil light on your dashboard. Sometimes, you ignore that, and you keep driving the car to the place that it breaks down.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: That would be me.<\/p>\n<p>Juli: Yes, that would be you, and it\u2019s the same way with your marriage. There are signs that say, \u201cHey, slow down.\u201d \u201cCheck the oil.\u201d There are signs like there\u2019s tension in your relationship, you\u2019re not communicating, sexual intimacy is not happening, you have frustration towards each other. Guys, sometimes your wife is the check engine light. She usually is going to be more sensitive to that lack of connection.<\/p>\n<p>If she says things like, \u201cI just don\u2019t feel close to you,\u201d or \u201cWe\u2019re not talking,\u201d you might just want to drive and say, \u201cOh, we\u2019re fine.\u201d But when you get those indications, don\u2019t wait until the crisis happens. Pull out those notes or even reach out to a counselor and say, \u201cHey, we have to get back to some of those basic things that got us into a better place.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Dave: That\u2019s good.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Let me ask you in a follow up\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Dave: \u2014look at that, look at that. She\u2019s just taking over. I love it.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: \u2014for you guys, if your wife said to you, \u201cI don\u2019t feel like we\u2019re connecting. I don\u2019t feel like we\u2019re doing well,\u201d what\u2019s the next step for the average guy? What should be the next step? [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>Michael: Those are two different questions.<\/p>\n<p>Juli: Yes. [Laughter]<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Which one do you want?<\/p>\n<p>Ron: That\u2019s exactly right. Go ahead, Michael.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Welcome to my life right there. What do you want, should?<\/p>\n<p>Michael: The answer to the first one is probably the wrong thing; the answer to the second one may be right.<\/p>\n<p>Ron: Well, I\u2019ll just tell you what I would do. My old self, my flesh, would get defensive, because what I would hear is blame, right?<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Ron: And that\u2019s the thing I have to manage in me. Now, I don\u2019t think this is necessarily every guy, but I do think it\u2019s easy for us to hear a complaint as criticism, and instead, we need to try to stay objective a little bit, step back from it personally, and listen and try to hear what\u2019s around it. What does it mean? What is it that you want? What do you desire instead of what\u2019s happening? and turn off my defenses, so I can turn on my ears. That\u2019s me, that\u2019s what I have to do.<\/p>\n<p>Michael: Juli and I will talk about curiosity tomorrow. It\u2019s shifting into a curious stance of, \u201cOkay, what\u2019s going on for you, and how can I understand that?\u201d Because if I step in to do what I think is right, it\u2019s probably not going to be, but the two of us can figure it out together.<\/p>\n<p>Ron: I think one of the oddest things about complaints that we have for one another in our relationship is this thought: if you can slow down yourself long enough to realize that when they make a complaint, whatever it is, it is really a request. They\u2019re looking for more of you, they\u2019re looking for more \u201cus-ness,\u201d more togetherness, safety, connection, touch, communication, heart-to-heart. Whatever that is, they\u2019re asking for more rather than saying, \u201cYou\u2019re bad.\u201d But if you don\u2019t put your defensiveness away, you never can get curious about what it is that they\u2019re really asking for.<\/p>\n<p>Michael: But that\u2019s really tough to do, though.<\/p>\n<p>Ron: Yes, it is.<\/p>\n<p>Michael: I don\u2019t know that that\u2019s very human. I\u2019m going to go into that defensive stance, and how do I shift into\u2014it requires me to believe; to believe in who you are and listen to the heart. I tell couples all the time, \u201cCan you listen to the heart of what your spouse is saying? Their skill is really bad. The skill in which they\u2019re trying to communicate it is not working. It often does come across critical and condemning, but what is their heart asking for?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ron: So, you\u2019re saying even though the packaging may be really ugly\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Michael: \u2014really bad.<\/p>\n<p>Ron: \u2014there may be something inside worth\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Michael: There\u2019s always something in there worth listening to. You wouldn\u2019t have married them if they weren\u2019t truly\u2014there\u2019s something precious in them. We lose track of that when my defensiveness and feeling criticized rises up. My humanness comes out. But if I can believe in them, then I can start to lean in and hear what they\u2019re saying, and then I can shift into a curious stance, create space that invites them to step in and unpack. That\u2019s tough to do. That\u2019s a lifetime of discipleship that I\u2019m still figuring out.<\/p>\n<p>Nan: We had a number of questions about submission; questions like, \u201cHow do you submit to a husband that doesn\u2019t seem to recognize his part, and his tone is harsh and disrespectful of his wife\u2019s voice?\u201d Or \u201cHe uses the Bible or his position in the home to get what he wants?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Juli: Yes. Boy, let me just preface this by saying this is such a complex and deep issue that we can\u2019t possibly do justice to the topic, even if we spent the rest of this panel time discussing it.<\/p>\n<p>Michael: Because we can\u2019t speak to the specifics of each case.<\/p>\n<p>Juli: Right, and not only the specifics of each case, but the complexity of what submission is in the Scripture\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Michael: \u2014right.<\/p>\n<p>Juli: \u2014and how that is played out today. So, I want to say that, for this couple that\u2019s asking a question like this, don\u2019t just take this one answer, but get some help. Get some resources. I wrote a book called, Finding the Hero in Your Husband that really deals with some of the complexity of this.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: A very, very good book.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: I love the book.<\/p>\n<p>Nan: It\u2019s a great book.<\/p>\n<p>Juli: So, here\u2019s what I will say: Submission is about power, okay? Submission is about asking the Lord, \u201cHow do I use my power wisely?\u201d I\u2019m going to talk to women in particular right now. In our flesh, it\u2019s natural for women to say, \u201cI want to use my power in such a way that becomes degrading to my husband.\u201d Proverbs 14:1 says, \u201cThe wise woman builds her house, but the foolish one tears hers down.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Left to our own devices, we as women sometimes will become very destructive in our words and in our posture and our attitude toward our husband. So, submission is counsel to us in the Scripture: \u201cBe wise how you use your power, because you can tear your husband down. You can tear down the potential that God has put within him.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>But notice that God wants you to use your power, and there are times in every marriage, and particularly in marriages where boundaries need to be set, that you need to stand up and stand for what\u2019s right. That\u2019s why this is such a complex topic. But I want to say that submission is more about the posture of your heart than it is a role or a particular thing.<\/p>\n<p>It's about first submitting to the Lord. \u201cGod, what is wise and godly in this situation?\u201d and then using your God-given power in a way that builds up rather than tearing down. But when it becomes as complicated as this kind of question, you really do need outside counsel to help you kind of tease out the specifics of the dynamics here.<\/p>\n<p>Michael: And to speak to the men in this kind of a case, if we are lording it over our wives and demanding her submission, we\u2019re missing the mark. We\u2019re living in sin, because that is not what Christ called for. He called for us to be submissive. We know the passage: \u201cHusbands, love your wives as Christ loved the church, and gave Himself up for her.\u201d So, if we are taking that stance, we\u2019re the one that is living in sin. But it\u2019s not her place to point out my sin. That\u2019s probably going to be done on her knees as she prays and God breaks me, but I have to allow myself to be broken.<\/p>\n<p>Juli: Yes, but it may be her job to set the boundary.<\/p>\n<p>Michael: It very likely is going to be, and it\u2019s the right thing to do.<\/p>\n<p>Ron: Yes. Mark 10: \u201cThey lord it over, but not so with you,\u201d is what Jesus said to His followers.<\/p>\n<p>Michael: Right.<\/p>\n<p>Ron: Jesus always used His power to empower other people. They were always more because of how He treated them, never less. Just think about that for just a second. There have been many situations where I paused and stopped and thought, \u201cOkay, the way I\u2019ve been treating my wife, talking to her, the tone of my voice, the look in my eyes, she is now less because of how I\u2019m treating her.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>That is not being a godly husband. She should be more because of how I treat her. That\u2019s always what happened when Jesus interacted with people; He used His power to make them more; what they couldn\u2019t be without what He did for them. We are all more. We have forgiveness, we have grace, we have hope. That\u2019s more, never less, so that\u2019s the test, guys. When we look in the mirror, [we] ask, \u201cHow am I treating my wife in this whole submission thing?\u201d I need to look at what I\u2019m doing and how that\u2019s impacting her.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: I would just add from a husband\u2019s side, I know Ann is going to talk about this tomorrow with the women, but she has done that for me, made me more, so it goes both ways.<\/p>\n<p>Ron: It does.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Many of you know our story, but for years it wasn\u2019t that way. It was more she tore me down and critiqued, and I deserved it, but I became less. I actually sort of pulled away to where people were saying I was a good man. This is the most incredible, life-giving woman in the world to me. I have become the man I think God has called me to be because of her belief in me, so it\u2019s a transformation.<\/p>\n<p>That\u2019s what she\u2019s going to talk about tomorrow. I want to come up on stage and say, \u201cLadies, listen! This is a journey that is hard to do, but man, it brings the best out of your man.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: I\u2019ll just add. That\u2019s really nice.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: It\u2019s true.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Thanks for saying that. [Rubbing Dave\u2019s head]<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Awww. [Laughter] You have a thing with my head right now!<\/p>\n<p>Ann: It\u2019s like I am strong, like super strong, and I will say Dave has been amazing. If he would go big on me and be demanding and say, \u201cThis is what we\u2019re going to do, because I\u2019m the head of the house and you need to submit,\u201d I would just buck against that so much, especially when I was younger, because I didn\u2019t know the Scripture, I didn\u2019t know Jesus, and I was worried. I was so fearful that I would become like my mom.<\/p>\n<p>There were so many fears behind that. But his love and his belief is what makes me want to follow him. It\u2019s so compelling when your spouse is listening, and you\u2019re partners. It's so beautiful and biblical.<\/p>\n<p>Ron: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: But it\u2019s hard. It\u2019s hard.<\/p>\n<p>Ron: Two words: gentle and lowly. Isn\u2019t there somebody on the boat who wrote a book about that?<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Oh, good one.<\/p>\n<p>Ron: That\u2019s the posture, right? Then the other one is the message we had last night from Brian and Stephanie about respect.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Ron: That whole I Peter 5 passage starts with, \u201cTreat each other with respect,\u201d and that may look a little bit different in different relationships, but that\u2019s the heart of it. Go back and listen to that message again and see if there\u2019s not something there.<\/p>\n<p>Michael: All of them are simply about reflecting who Christ is, being Him, acting like Him. Christ was profoundly invitational; we\u2019ll talk about this tomorrow. But the only people I see Him being harsh with were those that were using His word to wound others.<\/p>\n<p>Nan: Yes!<\/p>\n<p>Michael: He was harsh with them.<\/p>\n<p>Ron: Wow!<\/p>\n<p>Michael: But everybody else, He was profoundly invitational with.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes, that\u2019s good.<\/p>\n<p>Michael: And He was always creating space that drew them, that wooed them, to get them to follow Him.<\/p>\n<p>Nan: Yes.<\/p>\n<p>Michael: And a husband or a wife that tries to lord it over, those are the people that Christ was harshest with. Let us not be that person.<\/p>\n<p>Ron: Amen.<\/p>\n<p>[Studio]<\/p>\n<p>Dave: We\u2019ve been listening to a portion of a talk that we gave on a panel on the Love Like You Mean It cruise. Boy, I tell you, what Michael said right there at the end, I don\u2019t want to be that person.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: They had so much wisdom with the questions that were presented to them. I just appreciate them giving some clarity, because so often, we don\u2019t know the steps to take, we don\u2019t know the answers to the questions that we have about our marriage, about our intimacy; so the wisdom that they brought was helpful, not only to our audience but to you and to me.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Yes, I think the audience was very appreciative of the wisdom. A lot of it, not all of it, but a lot of it was in the area of intimacy, and this is a topic that\u2019s often hard to talk about. It\u2019s easy to make jokes about.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: We were joking about it, because it\u2019s so awkward sometimes, especially as we even talked about, getting older and what that looks like.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: I don\u2019t know how much our audience or our listeners want to hear about that, but it\u2019s real, and some of our listeners are struggling with those issues as well. So, all I can say is\u2014<\/p>\n<p>Ann: \u2014sign up for next year?<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Yes. I was going to say, if you missed it, you missed it. It\u2019s one thing to hear it today on our broadcast, but it\u2019s a whole different deal to sit in that room and to walk on those decks and get off at ports of call around the country.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Yes! Don\u2019t you want to sit and hear that talk, and then the next day you\u2019re in the Bahamas?<\/p>\n<p>Dave: With that iced tea, sitting with the sun coming\u2014and the other great thing that happens on the cruise is, you meet some incredible people. I can\u2019t tell you how many people I ran into that were with another couple and said, \u201cWe met five years ago on the cruise. We live in different states, but we\u2019re still best friends and talk every month, and we do this cruise together.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Ann: Every year.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: Every year. Again, you can sign up. FamilyLifeToday.com is where you can find the link to sign up for the Love Like You Mean It cruise in 2025.<\/p>\n<p>Ann: I think 30 percent of the cruise ship is already filled, so call today; go online today at FamilyLifeToday.com. Sign up for the Love Like You Mean It marriage cruise.<\/p>\n<p>Dave: We will be there, and we hope to see you.<\/p>\n<p>Shelby: I\u2019m Shelby Abbott, and you\u2019ve been listening to Dave and Ann Wilson on FamilyLife Today. They give glowing reviews, obviously, for the Love Like You Mean It cruise. I\u2019ve been on it, too. It\u2019s incredible! So, what if today, right now today in mid-March, you did something that covered you, that booked you for Valentines Day in 2025? What if you had next year\u2019s Valentine\u2019s Day already covered? Do you think your spouse would appreciate an eight-day cruise over that period of time?<\/p>\n<p>I don\u2019t know your spouse, but I\u2019m guessing that would be a total win for Valentine\u2019s Day, unless of course they\u2019re afraid of luxury cruise liners, the ocean, warm weather and all-you-can-eat soft-serve ice cream. But for everybody else, we\u2019re sailing from February 8 to 15, 2025 out of Miami, Florida. Like Dave said, you can book right now at FamilyLifeToday.com.<\/p>\n<p>This is going to be the lowest price that will be available for this sailing, and we expect it to sell out. So, don\u2019t delay. You can go the link that\u2019s available in the show notes or you can go to FamilyLifeToday.com and click on the \u201cLove Like You Mean It\u201d banner. Or you could give us a call to make your reservation at 800-358-6329. That\u2019s 800-\u201cF\u201d as in family, \u201cL\u201d as in life, and then the word, \u201cTODAY.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Did you know that Jesus consistently cares for you, regardless of how you might be doing right now? Good or bad, apathetic or sincere, Christ loves and pursues you right here, right now. Tomorrow, Dane Ortlund is going to be unpacking what that means for you, and I can\u2019t wait to hear more from him. That\u2019s coming up tomorrow. We hope you\u2019ll join us.<\/p>\n<p>On behalf of Dave and Ann Wilson, I\u2019m Shelby Abbott. We will see you back next time for another edition of FamilyLife Today.<\/p>\n<p>FamilyLife Today is a donor-supported production of FamilyLife\u00ae, a Cru\u00ae ministry.<\/p>\n<p>Helping you pursue the relationships that matter most.<\/p>\n<p>We are so happy to provide these transcripts to you. However, there is a cost to produce them for our website. If you\u2019ve benefited from the broadcast transcripts, would you consider donating today to help defray the costs?<\/p>\n<p>Copyright \u00a9 2024 FamilyLife. All rights reserved.<\/p>\n<p>www.FamilyLife<\/p>\n","theme_header_position":"Sticky","post_header_is_sticky":"default","is_header_overlay":"0"},"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast\/280313","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/podcast"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/47000"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=280313"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/280866"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=280313"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=280313"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=280313"},{"taxonomy":"podcast_series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/podcast_series?post=280313"},{"taxonomy":"cwp_profile","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/cwp_profile?post=280313"},{"taxonomy":"series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/wp-stage.familylife.com\/www\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/series?post=280313"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}