Resentment in Marriage: When “I’m Fine” Isn’t Fine–FamilyLife Panel Discussion

Episode Transcript

FamilyLife Today® with Dave and Ann Wilson – Web Version Transcript

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Resentment in Marriage: When “I’m Fine” Isn’t Fine—FamilyLife Panel Discussion

Guests:Dave and Ann Wilson, Chris and Yodit Brooks,

Montell and Kristin Jordan, Samuel and Stephanie Rainey,

Ron Deal, and Juli Slattery

From the series:Resentment in Marriage: When “I’m Fine” Isn’t Fine—

FamilyLife Panel Discussion (Day 1 of 1)

Air date:March 17, 2026

Stephanie (00:04):

When I tried not to nag—because I was like, “I’m not going to nag,”—then, I became resentful. I swallowed the grenades, daily, in a week. Samuel was like, “So how many fights did we have today?” And I said, “About ten.” He said, “How many did I win?” I said, “None.”

Ann (00:27):

Welcome to FamilyLife Today, where we want to help you pursue the relationships that matter most. I’m Ann Wilson.

Dave (00:33):

And I’m Dave Wilson, and you can find us at FamilyLifeToday.com.

Ann (00:37):

This is FamilyLife Today.

Ann: Welcome to FamilyLife Today. You’re in for a treat today, because we are going to be playing a panel of women that we had on the cruise.

Dave (00:56):

—and men.

Ann: —and men.

Dave: Not just you women.

Ann (00:58):

We’re going to do the men first.

Dave (01:00):

Okay.

Ann (01:00):

I think this was one of my favorite times on the Love Like You Mean It marriage cruise, 2026.

Dave (01:06):

Ann and I got to host. I hosted the men’s panel; Ann hosted the women’s panel. I had Chris Brooks, Montell Jordan, Samuel Rainey, and Ron Deal.

Ann (01:16):

And I had Yodit Brooks, Kristin Jordan, Stephanie Rainey, and Juli Slattery. That is a powerhouse group of men and women.

Dave (01:24):

Now, we got into some stuff.

Ann (01:26):

—real stuff.

Dave (01:26):

I would just say, “…stuff that we all deal with.” Enjoy the men’s panel as we jump into talking about passivity.

Ann (01:36):

And we’re going to be back in a few minutes to tell you how you can sign up for the 2027 Love Like You Mean It marriage cruise.

[Cruise Panel]

Dave (01:46):

Yeah, it’s interesting. We had Brant Hansen on FamilyLife Today. Brant actually did the men’s session, a couple years ago, on the cruise. One of the comments he made—and I want to hear your comments on this—is: “We don’t have a toxic masculinity problem in our country,”—which we’ve heard a lot about; and of course, there is some of that—he said, “We have a toxic passivity problem in our country.”

When I look at “Act like men: be strong; stand firm,” there’s a part of me that—one of the pillars that Robert Lewis talked about, way back, where he talks about/ even writes a passage in—what’s his book?

Samuel (02:21):

Men’s Fraternity:—

Dave (02:22):

Yeah, Men’s Fraternity.

Samuel (02:25):

—Raising a Modern-Day Knight.

Dave (02:26):

—Raising a Modern-Day Knight; that’s it. “A real man”—the way I phrase it—”rejects passivity.” I do a four-pillar R-E-A-L: “A real man Rejects passivity.” I used to look at that passage—maybe, you have as well—where Adam and Eve are in the garden. Satan comes, as a snake, to tempt. Adam is right there; Eve’s here. He’s sitting there, or standing on a stump, or whatever; and he does nothing.

There’s a part of me that has looked at Adam, and goes, “Dude, step up! How could you not say what God told you to say?” And then I look in the mirror, and I’m like, “Uh-oh. How many times have I done that?” So talk about passivity.

Ron (03:04):

Okay; I don’t know about you guys—I’ll talk about me—I can be very intentional and proactive, as a dad, as a husband. I can be thoughtful; I can be: “What do I need to do? How do I get this…”—da, da, da, da. It is, when I face my insecurities, that’s when I become passive. In other words, when Eve looked at Adam, and said, “Hey, honey, this is the thing.” And he’s like, “Oh, I guess I need to be what you want me to be in this moment”; he goes passive.

(03:35) When my wife looks at me with criticism, I get all discombobulated. All of a sudden, I think: “I can’t be sober-minded,” “I can’t be self-controlled anymore. I’ve got to react and tell her what for, because I don’t want to embrace her criticism.” Are you with me? It’s sort of like—when other people look at us, and don’t affirm, and don’t build up, and don’t tell us that we’re okay—that’s when we become the people—we don’t act like men anymore—we act like boys.

I think that’s the trick—is learning—“What is it in me that is stuck? Why do I have this insecurity? What’s that about?” It’s my job to put on self-control when those moments happen so that I don’t just become reactive to somebody’s criticism, or somebody’s dirty look, or whatever it is. I still need to be who I’m called to be.

Dave (04:24):

Have any of you guys ever identified passivity in your marriage for you?

Ron (04:29):

Oh, absolutely; absolutely.

Dave (04:31):

What area? Your wife has probably told you what it is; mine has! So what has she said?—is there an area?

Samuel (04:40):

Name it: spiritual leadership, financial leadership.

Dave: You’ve done it.

Samuel: Yeah, I’ve done it; absolutely.

Dave: How do you step out?

Ron (04:46):

In 40 years, I’ve done it all; I’ve been passive in all of it.

Dave (04:52):

And what do you do when you realize: “I’m not leading”?

Ron (04:56):

You go back into humility. You go back on your knees, and you say, “Lord, I need You. I don’t have it all—I need to grow; I need to learn; I need You to bring people into my life; I need Your Word; I need to figure…” You go right back to the basics, and you ask for help.

Montell (05:10):

I think, when it comes to passivity, I think a lot of times men, if they don’t know how to deal with that, we become passive/aggressive instead, which is where we allow our manhood and our male-hood to give off the acting out of strength as opposed to us actually leaning into the idea: “Hey, maybe, I don’t know how to do this. And if the Bible’s telling us that it’s, in my weakness, I’m made strong, then I think that becomes the place I can lean into.” Maybe, I don’t know; but I’m willing to figure it out. I’m man enough to be able to say, “I don’t know how we’re going to get through this. I don’t know how we get through this financial challenge. But because I’m the leader, and because God is looking to me to take the headship of this, I’m willing to go; and I’m willing to even fail; and I’m willing to figure it out”; so it doesn’t fall on the shoulders of our wives.

Ron (05:59):

And there is a huge, awesome paradox in what he just said; and that is, the world says: “Manhood is: you stand up; you take charge—you got all the answers; you direct everybody—because you’re the one who knows everything.” No, no, no, no, no. The weakness—the acknowledgement of my need for God—my humility is the standing up. That’s the thing—now, I’m a teachable leader; now, I’m joining you in: “Let’s figure this out,”—I don’t have to stand tall and act like I know everything; that’s intimidating.

Chris (06:31):

I think we all know that none of us like doing things that we can’t win at. I don’t like doing things that I can’t have success at. So the areas where I’m passive are going to be areas where I’m not seeing success. For years, in our marriage—and this may be a surprise, because I’m a pastor—it was spiritual leadership. This is an area for most wives, who are married to guys, who are in ministry; they kind of expect: “Man, you’re going to bring that home. You’re giving out, publicly, and so bringing it home.”

I had this picture in my mind: “Man, I was such a great parent,”—before I had kids. I had this picture in my mind of how family devotions were going to go: “Man, I was going to walk in my smoking jacket, ascot on, open up our family heritage Bible. There’d be a light shining on the perfect verse. My kids will be—

Ron (07:30):

—and all your children are going to be like—

Chris (07:31):

—”well-groomed; they’re well-groomed. They’re on the couch: ‘Father, teach us your wisdom.’”

And man, reality was nothing like that: my kids are at each other, and it’s like pure chaos. I’m like, “This is not how a family devotion is supposed to go.” It took me a while to realize: “Sometimes, the definition of success is: ‘Just showing up.’ Other times, it’s: ‘Just being faithful. It’s just being faithful and letting God handle the rest.’”

I’ve had to learn to give myself grace. Sometimes, it’s easier to give that grace out to others; but I’ve had to learn how to look in the mirror, and give myself grace, too.

Samuel (08:17):

One thing I want to say about the 1 Corinthians passage is: it says, “Be watchful; act like men.” I think something that a lot of men sorely lack is somebody that they can watch, and somebody that they can learn from, to know what it means to be a man. Because you’re watching television; you’re watching social media; you’re watching the media; you’re watching all these public figures, and you’re absorbing all of the messages from them that are telling you: “This is what it means to be a man.”

They’re not telling you what it means to be a man. You need people in your life that you can go to, and you can ask questions. You need people/you need men in your life you can go to, and say: “Teach me what it means to respond better to my wife,” “Teach me what it means to respond better to my kids, so that I can learn how to be a man; and I’m not having to make it up on my own.”

Dave (09:05):

Did you have somebody you could look for? You know who his dad is, right?

I want to get your comment on—you’ve already said it—but I realized, for me, I was leading strong at the job; for me, it was ministry. And something you said, Chris—I was like, “I think I know how to do this [ministry]. I don’t know how to lead her; I don’t think I’m really good at leading my boys.” They were young at that time; and so I felt like: “I can bring it here [ministry], because I’ve got skills; and people are saying, ‘You’re good.’” I come home; I’m hearing, “You’re not so good, and you don’t do a good job.” And she wanted what you wanted—she wanted the halo, and the Bible, and “Give the sermon tonight that you gave this morning,”—I’m like, “That doesn’t work.”

But I realized I just needed to flip energy. I brought a lot of energy there; I wasn’t bringing it here. So talk about that.

Ron (09:51):

I think there’s something to what you’re saying; and absolutely, there’s: “Do I need to flip my energy?” “How do I need to bring a better me?” But I actually think the story is a really good example of: “Okay, what’s mirrored back to me is not telling me I’m good enough,”—I become a boy.

Dave (10:09):

See, he’s counseling me right now. There we go. Want me to lay down, Ron? You can go at it. You’re right; you’re right.

Ron (10:20):

So I want to shift the question from: “How do I show up in a way that proves to her that she’s important?” See, what I just did is I gave you a different question. The different question is: “What is she really saying?” What she’s saying in that moment of criticism—is not: “I need you to show up and do more, and be more in the…”—what she’s saying is: “Are we as important? Because when you bring that much energy to the work world, I don’t see that much energy to our world; so are we important?” It’s a question of love and significance. That’s the thing I need to tune into; that’s the thing.

It’s not about: “I’m a failure as a husband, and I got to prove myself that I’m successful, better than she thinks”; no, that’s not it. The issue is: “Huh, she needs to feel important. I got to tune into that, and register that, and wonder that—pray over that—’How can I bring some energy to the equation?’ And at the same time, realize: ‘I’m never going to get that insecurity out of her heart,’—that’s something she’s going to have to work on—but ‘We’re going to be a team,’ or ‘We’re going to try to do this together.’”

Shift the question away from: “What does this say about me?” to “How can I attune to her?” or “…us?”

[Studio]

Dave (11:33):

This is FamilyLife Today, and we are listening to a panel that we did on the Love Like Yo Mean It cruise. That was the men’s panel; coming up is the women’s panel. But let me tell you: you need to be on the cruise with us next year.

Ann (11:45):

Yes, for sure! If you’ve never been on the Love Like You Me It marriage cruise, I’m telling you: there’s nothing quite like it in the country. You’re, seven days, on a cruise; you’re having fun; you’re eating well; you’re going off on ports—but you’re also getting this—biblical marriage tools and training, and time to talk about it and process it together.

Dave (12:06):

We didn’t even say anything about the pool, and the sun, and the water slides.

Ann (12:10):

—the saunas.

Dave (12:11):

I went down every water slide—

Ann (12:13):

You did.

Dave (12:13):

—and the music and the comedians. It’s a marriage conference on a boat for a week; and it’s refreshing, and it’s awesome. It’s February 13-20, 2027; and you can save big, now through March 31st.

Ann (12:27):

All you have to do is click the banner at FamilyLifeToday.com to learn more about the cruise. And you have to book before March 31st to get this sale deal, and it sells out quickly.

Dave (12:37):

Alright. Let’s get back to the panel.

Ann (12:39):

Oh, to the women’s panel.

Dave: Okay.

[Cruise Panel]

Ann: What do you wish you would have done or known—or maybe, something—is there something you wish you wouldn’t have done, walking into marriage?

Kristin (12:57):

I think, for me, I was the quintessential businesswoman; I was about: “I’m going to take authority; I got this,”—very counterculture to marriage, and very counterculture to the way that it should be done in a good way. For me, I didn’t learn how to submit. I was one of those that took the hard route. God says, “Humble yourself or be humbled.”

Ann (13:22):

How many of you have taken the hard route?

Kristin (13:24):

“Oh, dear God.” Always pick ‘A.’ In case you’re new at this: ‘Always pick “A”: humble yourself.”

I had the awesome privilege of learning the hard way; and God would redeem the time, if you would, and allow me to cook breakfast, lunch, and dinner, and speak blessings over my husband every day, which seems crazy; but the truth is: I didn’t learn how to humble myself. God was teaching me how to speak life over him, how to speak blessings over him, whether he was acting like that or not.

Ann (14:08):

That’s what our breakout’s on, actually—acting like that—I get that.

How do we know?—we’re getting into that conflict—of when to bring something up or when to just let it go?

Kristin (14:22):

So I have the auspice and the thought process—and I had to learn this—be clear: I did not arrive here; I’m a work in progress. I used to be very—

Ann: —confrontational?

Kristin: Yeah, yeah. But that would only cause arguments. So what I—

Ann (14:41):

I only know because that’s what I did.

Kristin (14:43):

Man, we learned the hard way. But what I learned is that 95 percent of the things that I need to talk to him about, I need to pray about first. So I pray first, and I only say if the Holy Spirit tells me to say. That’s really the key; because the truth is that, when we say—if we haven’t prayed first, then that’s you; and you’re bringing your own stuff—whereas, if the Holy Spirit covers what you’re about to say, it’s going to come off way better. The eloquence will come over me when I don’t really have the eloquence, especially if it’s something that’s a nagging issue, or a reoccurring issue, or something that’s a hot topic. And so—100 percent—pray about it before you say it.

Stephanie (15:28):

Now, I forgot the question! Okay: “How do you know when to bring it up?”

Ann: —”or when to let it go?”

Stephanie: This is something that’s kind of cute: when we go to wedding showers, a lot of times people go: “Don’t sweat the small stuff,” “Don’t say the little things. Just don’t worry about the toothpaste.” And they get to Samuel and me—and we both kind of grin—and we’re like, “Sweat the small stuff.”

Let me elaborate on that. What we mean, when we say, “Sweat the small stuff,” is: the small stuff become bigger stuff if resentment is wrapped in it.

Ann: Oh, preach.

Stephanie (15:56):

Does that make sense? If the small stuff matters—so going back to his clothes being the blessing on the floor—and he doesn’t get it; he doesn’t see it. I don’t know how, but he doesn’t. When I say, “Samuel, I feel so unloved when you don’t pick those clothes up off the floor. There’s six of us here. Could you help me out by picking those clothes up? It just makes me feel loved.” He’s like, “Oh, yeah, sweetie, thank you for telling me that.” I set him up to win; and I win, too, because my love language is acts of service.

One of the resentment things that I always carried was—the bed wasn’t made and I had all these things—”What can I do to help you in the morning?” I said, “Honey, if you could just make the bed in the morning, that would be great; so when I walk into our room, when I get dressed, there’s this love letter.”

(16:34) And the other thing—

Ann: Such a good way to say it.

Kristin: Wow, a great way to say it.

Stephanie: Yeah; you’re saying that because what we want to do, when we’re speaking to our husbands, we want desperately to be heard. And when we’re in this fight or flight—and we’re yelling at them—they shut us down. But if we speak in a way that they can hear us—which we all want—they become the men we want them to be instead of the boys that we think they are. If you want your man to be a man, you got to treat him like a man.

Kristin: Amen!

Stephanie: I think that’s the biggest thing—like Yodit was saying—“This is my one man for the rest of my life. I want him to be the best version of him.”

Yodit: That’s right.

(17:20) Stephanie: I want to set him up to win. When I do that, I don’t resent: “Oh, he didn’t make the bed today. He probably was in a hurry”; because I put those grace-glasses on.

Y’all, this is not from me; this is, literally, the Holy Spirit keeping my mouth shut and teaching me these things; because my flesh wants to fight, wants to—but when I pray, and say,” Okay, how can I set him up to win?” and when I text him—which is his love language; which is, words—”Thank you for my love letter,” he’s like, “Oh!”; he gets it in a way. Y’all, my bed’s made 90 percent of the time! Yay for praise!

Ann (17:54):

That is genius.

Stephanie: Isn’t it?! And that was God.

Ann: Did you hear the wording of that? This is where we need to go, as women, and even to pray, like what you’re saying. James says: “If any of you lacks wisdom,”—what should they do?—“Ask,”—pray, because God answers; you’re praying.

“Honey, when you make the bed, it’s like a love letter to me,”—instead of—”Why can’t you make the bed in the morning?!”

Stephanie: Yes!

Ann (18:19):

“I do everything around here.”

Stephanie: I tried that for ten years. For ten years, I did that; it didn’t work. And so I was like, ” Okay, fine; I’ll pray. ‘Oh, here’s some words’—that wasn’t for me; that was from the Lord—it was like, “Oh, thank You.” Y’all, it’s the little things; they do matter. They do matter.

Yodit (18:37):

Thank you for that, because you’re giving language; because a lot of us have this thing in our mind that we don’t want to be the nagging wife.

Kristin (18:44):

Correct.

Yodit (18:45):

It’s kind of like the opposite of the Proverbs 31 wife. We feel like she’s awesome and amazing, but we could never be her: “Please don’t expect me to be that.” But we also don’t want to be the nagging wife either. A lot of times, we don’t know: “How do I do that?” “How do I handle that?” “How do I take what I’m thinking in my head, and take it through a filtering process, that helps me to bless my husband in a moment where I could be throwing daggers?”

Stephanie (19:15):

Because when I tried not to nag—because I was like, “I’m not going to nag,”—then, I became resentful. I swallowed the grenades, daily, in a week. Samuel was like, “So how many fights did we have today?” I said, “About ten.” He said,” How many did I win?” I said, “None.” That’s what happened inside me; I needed Jesus so badly. I’m so glad you came.

Ann: So do I—desperation.

Stephanie: Right—desperately, desperately—it doesn’t come natural. This kindness isn’t a natural thing!

Juli (19:45):

I noticed some of the—like you guys are saying—you’re the fighters. There are women in here who are fighters. For me, I, by nature, am more the peacemaker, which has a strength and a weakness; because early in my marriage, I wouldn’t bring things up that I needed to. There are women in here who feel that way—like you don’t know how to fight—you’re not that strong, you sense. Sometimes, you feel maybe your husband is stronger than you. You need to hear that there are times that you have to bring things up, and it takes courage to do that.

Ann (20:19):

Has that happened for you, Juli, that you’ve had to really work through: “I’m going to bring this up”?

Juli (20:23):

Yes; and so for me, it’s prayer. When I see patterns—when I notice patterns of, not just the little things—but what do those little things represent? If I ever feel afraid, or I feel unheard, or unloved—and it’s a pattern—for me, I have to really pray for the courage and the wisdom to know how to bring it up; because it’s going to cause a conflict, and I don’t want the conflict. I know there’s probably women sitting here, that it’s not natural for you to step into conflict; but we need to.

Ann: We need to.

Kristin (20:54):

It’s interesting that you said that. As I hear you saying that, one of the things I want them to hear you say is: “No matter if you’re a strong personality, or a non-strong personality, in a non-hot time, bring that up.” I think one of the problems that we have, as wives sometimes, is that, when we’re in the midst of the situation, we want to bring up: “And you did this, and you did this, and you did this.”

In a non-hot time—let me preface—“This is how this made me feel.” It’s not about “You did this,” “You did this,” “You did this.” “When this happened, this is how this made me feel.” If you take it down a notch, in a non-hot time, what you’re saying will be received—with kindness; with love; and actually, curiosity—when he’s doing something that’s a pattern, that he’s done over and over again, lean into it with curiosity: “Why do you do that? Why is that important for this to happen this way?” When we lean in, with curiosity, it makes him have to stop—instead of fight—and now, he’s got to think. That disarms that fight pattern.

Ann (22:09):

And I think, too—that’s so practical and good—I think, too, as a couple: “Don’t forget: we’re a team”; and so you’re going to focus on—I just did this last week, where I had a beach ball on my lap—I wrote the word, “Problem”; he is not the problem. You have to figure out: “What is the problem?” “Is it the clothes on the floor?” “What is the problem?” Because the enemy is constantly telling us: “He’s the problem. You could be happy if he would just get his problem under control.”

And the truth is: we all have problems that we carry; so focus in on one problem at a time, when the problem’s not escalating in the moment.

Kristin: Yeah, non-hot time.

Ann: Yeah, non-hot time; I like that.

[Studio]

Ann: You’re listening to FamilyLife Today. Man, I don’t know what you thought; but I love those men and women’s panels, because of the honesty, the realness; but also, the practicality of how we can live these biblical truths out.

Dave (23:09):

Well, what’s interesting is your women’s panel was right after my men’s panel on the boat; so I went up to the room and watched it.

Ann (23:17):

You watched the women’s panel?

Dave (23:18):

Yeah, I felt like I was sneaking around, like, “Hey, I’m watching the women’s panel.” We’re not in there, but we can watch it on our TV in the room. I tell you what: it was phenomenal. I remember talking to another husband, who said he cried at the end, watching.

Ann (23:34):

—of the women’s panel?

Dave (23:35):

Yeah; he said, “Just watching you women talk, and how you challenged the women, and really spoke into them at the end; it was powerful.” And I’m telling you what: that was just a snippet of what happens on the Love Like You Mean It cruise.

Ann (23:50):

Well, let me add: I’ve heard so many things, even still, from men who were on that cruise panel, and who were in the room, listening, like, “Man, I just needed to be reminded that: ‘God is with me,’ ‘…of the power we have as men and how we influence our families and our kids.” So well done, Davey.

Dave (24:09):

The whole cruise was worth just those two men and women’s panels.

Ann (24:12):

Honestly.

Dave (24:13):

And just let us say, again: “You can join us next year, February 13-20, 2027. We’ll be out in the water again on the boat. You’ll hear more talks just like that. And there’s a sale going on, right now, until March 31st. Click on the banner at FamilyLifeToday.com and learn more. I hope you sign up and join us next year.

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