Crushing It at Work, Missing It at Home: Balancing Work and Family – Bryan and & Stephanie Carter

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FamilyLife Today® with Dave and Ann Wilson – Web Version Transcript

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Crushing It at Work, Missing It at Home: Balancing Work and Family

Guests:Bryan and Stephanie Carter

From the series:Made to Last (Day 2 of 3)

Air date:March 24, 2026

Bryan (00:04):

We set goals for our family: “Where do we want our family—marriage and family—to go for the year?” We set goals as a couple; as parents; financially; the house, kind of what we’re trying to do around the house; spiritually. We’re looking at our lives probably through about the lens of six key categories. And we’re saying, “Okay, what does God want to do in our family this year?”

Ann (00:31):

Welcome to FamilyLife Today, where we want to help you pursue the relationships that matter most. I’m Ann Wilson.

Dave (00:38):

And I’m Dave Wilson. And you can find us at FamilyLifeToday.com. This is FamilyLife Today.

Dave: I recently read a book, where the opening paragraph—the first page of the book—I felt like I was reading my story.

Ann (00:59):

Oh.

Dave (00:59):

It was about a pastor. Things were going great at his church, and he felt empty. He sat down with a counselor; and I thought, “Wow; I went through the exact same thing.” It was the framework for what his life was about and his marriage. He’s sitting in the studio right now. Bryan and Stephanie Carter are back in the studio. Welcome back, guys.

Bryan: Thank you so much for having us.

Dave: That’s funny—you’re over there—and it was like, “I don’t know if he’s talking about me.”

Bryan: I remember that.

Stephanie: Oh, okay.

Dave: I know you wrote the book a little while ago, but you remember how you opened it.

Bryan (01:31):

I remember it well; I remember it well.

Dave (01:33):

It’s called Made to Last and it’s 8 Principles to Build Long Lasting Relationships. You’re pastor of a large church. I told Ann, when I read it, I said, “Oh, my goodness!” We wrote a book about Vertical Marriage; and the first two chapters are about this moment, when everything was going great at the church; but my heart, I said, “I lost my first love.”

Now, I’m not saying you did that, but walk us through it; because you framed that story to say: “This is the most important thing in your life and to even make a marriage to last.” So tell our listeners what I tried to tell them.

Bryan (02:06):

Sure, sure. Thank you. It was a unique season in our lives where our church was booming. We were adding services, three to four; we were in the midst of a building project. I succeeded, at our church, the founder; so he had been there 28 years. I’m coming behind him. It’s a lot of pressure to come through. Year, probably, seven or eight, God is just blessing everything. A lot of demands: preaching four different services, trying to build a new building, raising the money, designing it, trying to grow staff, reach people, reach our city.

Ann (02:41):

And how many years had you guys been married at that point?

Bryan (02:43):

At that point, we’ve probably been married about ten years.

Dave: Oh, boy.

Ann (02:46):

You had all your kids by then, so they were little.

Stephanie: They were little.

Bryan (02:49):

They were little: we had two—probably, seven and five—and a little two-year-old tagging around. I’m in seminary as well; I’m in Dallas Seminary. It’s a crazy, chaotic season; but on the outside, everything looks great. Young kids that we’re chasing around; booming church is happening.

But it was at that juncture—I’m 37 at the time—I ended up talking to Dennis. Actually, I talked to Dennis; and then, I said, “Dennis, I need a counselor.” He said, “What do you need?”

Ann (03:19):

—Dennis Rainey, you’re talking about.

Bryan (03:19):

Dennis Rainey; Dennis Rainey. I’m like, “I need a counselor.” He recommends a counselor. I’m talking to this counselor about trying to process what’s happening: “I have this emptiness that’s on the inside. With all this happening, somehow, I feel empty on the inside. Something is missing.”

Ann (03:35):

Stephanie, did you know about this?

Stephanie (03:37):

I did. He was just so busy. Like a typical pastor, he was a workaholic, and he loved ministry; he loved serving. I remember he would leave when it was dark, and he would come home when it was dark.

(03:52) We had resolved in our marriage, just through premarital [counseling], that we both can’t have two demanding jobs. At this time, I’m at home. I had been a school teacher; I taught third and fourth grade; I was an instructional specialist. And then, after the birth of our second child, I came home.

I think we were just in the routine of the busyness. But you could see the weight—I always saw the weight of ministry on him—but he just seemed like he thrived off of it, maybe, because we had been—I’d known him since college; we had met in college—he was a leader on his campus. So this was nothing new of how busy he was. But it wasn’t until later, after he talked to Dennis, and he was like, “I need to go spend a couple of days with a therapist.”

(04:45) Then I was kind of like, “Now, wait; now, why? What’s going on?” Because, during that season, it seemed like there were a lot of leaders who were falling and having integrity issues. I kind of was like, “Now, wait; now, what?” I kind of perked up a little bit, “Now, what? Now, what’s going on?” But then, he just assured me. So then, I was really proud of him that he wanted to go talk to someone—because you just don’t hear—just talking to different wives, you would hear wives talking about their husband’s not going to seek any type of counseling or talking to a therapist. And here it is: I have one who wants to go talk to a therapist; so of course, I’m going to be like, “Yes, go ahead; please.”

Ann (05:19):

And you knew, Bryan, that you needed that.

Bryan (05:21):

I knew something was missing.

Ann (05:23):

Yeah.

Bryan (05:23):

I just knew that there was something missing—and it wasn’t my wife; it wasn’t my kids—there was an emptiness inside that was happening, despite all the success—apparent success that seemed to be happening all around me. I just knew I needed to talk to somebody to try to process what I was feeling, what was happening.

I remember the conversation; she was like, “What’s going on?” I said, “Well, it’s not…” I had been seeing a lot of leaders fall in ministry; and I was like, “I don’t want to do that. So let me figure out what’s happening.” I think it’s in many of our lives—there is this temptation that we all face—if we don’t ask ourselves, sometimes, the tough questions; or have someone helping us to process through those moments.

When I began talking to my counselor, he told me I was going through a midlife crisis. I said, “I’m 37 now; what is that?! What, in the world, is that?!” I was like, “How am I going through it? I’m like a 37.” He began to describe success and significance—how we climb and climb—and try to achieve success, success, success. We think we have it; but even when we attain it, it doesn’t give us what we thought it would.

(06:35) There’s a distinction between success and significance. He began to unpack for me that: “You’ve been climbing, and achieving, and trying to have all these things; and you’ve gotten it. Now, that you have it, you’re like, ‘This is not what I want. It still doesn’t bring me the joy, and the satisfaction, and the fulfillment that I thought it would.’” He says, “What you’re really looking for is significance.”

He said, “Bryan, what’s happened is you’ve become a bit disconnected, as you mentioned, from your heart, from God. You’ve got so many things going on that you’ve forgotten your first love, which is God; which is, that relationship—cultivating that, spending time with Him—and serving others out of the overflow of your relationship with God.”

It was those sessions, and that conversation, and reassessing my life, that helped me to get reconnected back to God; so in turn, I could get reconnected back to my family and to the ministry that we were doing. I’d say I had gotten out of balance; I had gotten out of rhythm; my priorities were all mixed up. It required me getting back to my devotional time, getting back to my prayer time, getting back to my just alone-time with the Lord—and just being versus doing—just being in His presence versus performing. It was a recalibration of my life.

(07:46) And even now, I have to continue to remind myself of that. My church has blessed me with a sabbatical; and part of that, just me to get reconnected, reset time with the Lord: “Slow down,” “Take your time; it’s okay,” “Spend time: memorize; let’s review some of the verses; let’s Scripture memory. Let’s fast; let’s find some time to just be with God.”

I think that’s key to a lot of relationships. If I’m not connected to God well—if I’m not in His presence, if my relationship with God is not good—of course, I’m not going to get along with her, or get along with my kids, or get along with others. Every relationship—it’s foundational—begins with my relationship with God, and everything else flows from there.

Dave (08:45):

So when you did that, was it something that you saw? Honestly, it transformed you. How did it impact this? And of course, you were a dad of young kids at the time.

Bryan (08:55):

Yeah, I think it helped me to reset my priorities a bit. I think this pressure to perform consumes us —always on email, always looking at your to-do list, always trying to look at the next thing—it’s just constant. I think, at that juncture:

It meant, Mondays, I took my off day. It meant, Mondays, when I took the kids to the park. It meant, Mondays, “Babe, I got it. I’m going to do the drop off; I’ll do pickup. I’m going to go have lunch with them at school today.”

I think it meant our date nights were protected. It meant that I had to make sure that I was hearing her heart, hearing her passion, her desires for our family and marriage so that I wasn’t so consumed with public success.

Certain things can give you an esteem—preaching—everybody sees that; or leading the meetings; or organizing things in the life of the church. Everybody sees that; nobody sees the time with the kids like we do. Nobody sees, “Are we going on vacation this year? Let’s make sure we take care of that.” Just trying to build out the rhythms of our family so that we have a rhythm that is manageable, that cultivates the love and the care and the grace in our family. Whether it’s our vacations, whether it’s family time, it just helped me reset things a bit.

So now, every year, we set goals for our family: “Where do we want our family—marriage and family—to go for the year?” We set goals as a couple; as parents; financially; the house, kind of what we’re trying to do around the house; spiritually.

(10:37) We’re looking at our lives probably through about the lens of six key categories. We’re saying, “Okay, what does God want to do in our family this year?” By us doing that together, I hear her heart; and we can stay aligned. We can look back, and say, “Okay, this is where we’re going; this is how we’re going to get there…” We can work together to make it happen. I think that crash, or burning out, helps you to say this: “I don’t want that to happen; I don’t want that feeling, so how do I build in the rhythms and routines to protect my heart; but also, to regard the heart of our family?”

Ann (11:09):

So Stephanie, walk us through that. You sit down—do you guys—is this on a vacation, where you sit down and go through your goals?

Stephanie (11:15):

Sometimes, it’s on a vacation; but then, even before we get to that, we have a talk-time—our talk-time—it’s something, weekly, that we do, where we talk through the kids’ activities; we talk through what I’m doing this week.

Ann (11:29):

You’re looking at your schedules.

Stephanie (11:30):

He is the master scheduler, which is great; I love it. But basically, that talk-time starts every Sunday. When our kids were younger, they weren’t a part of talk-time; but now, as they got older—I’d probably say late elementary, early middle school—they were a part of talk-time.

During that talk-time, it’s kind of our family meeting. It might be: “Hey, how can I pray for you?” It could be something as: “Oh, I have a test this week,” or “Oh, I have to have a conversation with So-and-so; because they were mean to me. And I don’t know…”—just talking through that. Just giving an open dialogue with our children. I think that helped immensely.

And then, as far as the goal-setting, that was very essential; because sometimes, as husband and wife, we cannot be on the same page. I might want to do something—

Bryan: Curtains.

Stephanie: Yes, curtains.

Dave (12:23):

Curtains—you need them—you need some.

Stephanie (12:25):

Right now, our big thing in our house was wanting to do some things with our backyard. Anytime we’ve wanted to do something, like super expensive—whatever—he’ll be like, “Remember, the backyard.” “ That’s right; that’s right—the backyard—that’s our focus.”

Ann (12:41):

But when you start talking about marriage kind of stuff, what did that look like?—when you say, “What are our goals for our marriage this year?” Because most couples don’t do this—we just survive—we’re just getting through.

Stephanie (12:55):

We’re just trying to make it.

Our goals for our marriage might be: “We’re going to go to a marriage conference,” or “We’re going to have a date night consistently,” “We are going to pray for each other consistently,” “We’re going to have a devotion time.” What did I leave off?

Bryan (13:11):

That’s a good foundation.

Stephanie: There you go.

Bryan: It doesn’t have to—those three to four, right there—give us a rhythm that helps protect and strengthen our marriage. Marriage conference, as she mentioned—some years, we might do a married grow group, so a small group of couples that’s, not only going to help us, but help those other couples as well—normally, those fortify. That’s typically where we try to focus on, in terms of what we want to do for our marriage, specifically.

And then we’ll add others:

Around financial: “What was our plan?—financial?”

“Where are we going, together, as a couple?”

“Parenting: what activities do we want the kids involved in this year that grow them spiritually?” It might be going to a Christian camp. It might be: “This one here needs some extra tutoring,” or “This year, this one here; how do we help that child take their next step?”—based on if they have unique gifts and talents—”How do we develop those unique gifts and talents?”

(13:55) These six or seven categories help us. They help shape a vision for our house so that we stay aligned and stay connected.

The other thing that’s happened—my wife always says—we have two vacations every year: we have a vacation with the family; we take them somewhere; and then, we have a vacation for ourselves; that’s a couple goal. One time we told our mentor, “We’re going to Disney World.” He said, “No, no, no; where are you guys/where are the two of you going on vacation?”

Ann: “Because that’s not vacation.”

Bryan: He said, “That’s work! You guys need to plan a separate vacation, after you come back from that, for you guys.” We’ve learned stay-cations—we’ll stay right in Dallas—“Let’s get a hotel; have a great time.” We’ve learned how to have time together.

Oh, one more thing that we’ve learned: couple friends. We prayed—in our 30s, we were so lonely in ministry—we prayed for friends. It was hard; because you’re pastoring, you’re leading, you’re serving. We prayed, and God sent us two couples—two couples that we met, over ten years ago—we vacation together; we spend time together. It’s a safe space; we can be transparent. We can be—we don’t have to be pastor in this—no titles.

Ann (15:12):

Do they go to your church?

Bryan (15:13):

Neither one go to our church.

Stephanie: That’s what makes it great.

Ann (15:15):

Yeah, yeah.

Bryan (15:16):

That makes things better. But having friends—ooh, it’s been a blessing—to be able to just be you, and to be able to share, and be authentic, has probably been one of the biggest blessings in our lives.

Dave (15:32):

Well, we’ve been speakers at the Weekend to Remember Marriage getaway for 36 years. Every single conference we’re a part of, lives are changed.

Ann (15:41):

Oh, the stories are incredible. Where God meets couples, great things happen. And you know what? There’s a sale going on that you are not going to want to miss.

Dave (15:50):

Yeah, the sale is right now—between March 20 and 30—it’s 40 percent off. Who doesn’t want a deal like that?

Ann (15:57):

That’s a good deal.

Dave (15:58):

Not only will your marriage be changed, but your kids’ marriages and your legacy. I’m telling you: it’s transformational for your legacy. Go to WeekendToRemember.com and sign up there. You don’t need a promo code; just sign up. You’ll get 40 percent off between March 20 and 30.

Ann (16:12):

Again, that’s WeekendToRemember.com.

Dave (16:19):

So often, you hear a couple say, “God’s first”; but that’s all they say; there’s no action behind it. “What’s the most important thing in your marriage?”—”God first.” “Okay; what’s that look like?” “I don’t know.” “Do you go to church?” “Once or twice a month.” The average person, we pastors know, it’s like 1.3 [Sundays] a month now is the average for church.

When our book came out, we ended up somehow—don’t ask me how—on The Today Show. Craig Melvin, who didn’t know us, was the host. He looks at us; he asked a great question. He said, “Okay, read your book. So you bring God in your marriage and everything works out. Is that it?” I thought, “That’s a great question,” because that’s what it can look like.

(17:05) “God first”—you just said—“Here’s what ‘God first looks like: it’s in the calendar; it’s something we talk about; it’s something we pray about. We vacation; we have community.’” I just want to make sure our listeners heard that; because so many of us say the same thing, and there’s no action to it. You are—your relationship’s lasting 25 years in—because it isn’t just a motto: “God first,”—no; “This is what it looks like: ‘If you’re going to do it, it’s going to show up. If God’s first, it’s going to affect my bank account.’” We pastors know you’re going to see it in your calendar; you’re going to see it in your bank account.

I just want somebody listening to go back and listen to the last five or seven minutes; and then, have a conversation tonight with your wife, or your husband, and say, “What would that look like for the Smiths?” or “…the Wilsons,”—or [whomever]. “We’re not doing that, but we need to be doing some of these things,” or “…all of these things, if we want a relationship that’s going to last.”

Ann (17:51):

Talk-time; I like it!

Stephanie (17:51):

The talk-time is huge. I think it also helps your children to see it as well.

Dave (17:58):

Oh, yeah.

Stephanie (17:59):

Your children need to see you setting goals for your family. They need to see you setting goals for: “How am I going to grow spiritually?” For me, there was a season where I did Bible Study Fellowship. This is before I was a women’s ministry director and so on. I was so new to being a pastor’s wife, and I just needed a safe place. Bible Study Fellowship was that safe place for me; because you go to Bible Study Fellowship and they can’t ask you about church; or you can’t say, “Aren’t you…” I would love my little Bible study leader; she’d be like, “We don’t discuss that here.” I’m like, “Yes! We just do Jesus; nothing else.” That was my safe place.

For my kids to see me going off to Bible Study Fellowship; and then, that they’re staying with their dad instead of I’m getting a babysitter, or my mom is watching them. Them seeing their dad love me enough to say, “Hey, babe, I need you to go. I need you to grow, too; and I need you to get filled. I don’t want you to worry about the kids, and this, that, this, that.”

This is my advice to that wife, or that mom: “Let him do it. He’s not going to do it like you want him to do it. Just let him do it.”

Ann (19:10):

It doesn’t matter what they ate.

Stephanie (19:11):

It doesn’t matter; I don’t care.”

Ann: What they dress like.

Stephanie: You’re going to leave the house to go do what you need to do.

Dave (19:15):

Was that hard for you to do?

Stephanie (19:17):

Yes, but I learned a quick lesson—it was with our first child—I would just critique him, and I would nag him. I’m like, “No, that’s not…” “Bryan, please…” I’ll never forget, there was one time I was doing laundry. I was like, “If you can just watch Kaitlyn.” He was like, “Yeah, yeah. I’m watching the game.” I give him Kaitlyn—she’s laying on his chest—he’s eating Doritos. This is a bad-dad moment for you; he’s wiping the Dorito dust on the back of her onesie. I’m walking through, with the basket of clothes; and I’m like, “She’s a napkin?” “She’s a napkin?” He’s like, “What?! It’s not hurting her; it’s on her back.”

Dave: “You’re going to wash it later.”

Stephanie: “She can’t reach over. It’s not one of those fancy onesies you have for her; it’s just a plain onesie,”—using our child as a napkin.

Ann: And now, you would just let that go.

Stephanie: I would let it go. I learned: “Who cares? It is not hurting her.”

Ann: I’m with you; I’m with you. That’s some good advice.

Dave (20:19):

Well, I want to talk about Made to Last principles with parenting. But let me ask you one last thing. You mentioned a safe couple or couples. A lot of couples don’t have that. How do you get that, and why is it important? We have that, and it’s so critical; but coach some couples—they got to have that; that’s really important—so help us.

Bryan (20:42):

I think they start with prayer.

Stephanie: Yeah, you have to start with prayer.

Bryan: I think a couple has to start praying, now, for God to send that relationship. I think you got to pray for it; I don’t think they happen by accident. I think they happen as a result of God’s grace into our lives; they’re an expression of God on us.

I think you start out praying; and then, the Lord—you have to take chances—you have to spend some time together; try lunch together. You have to try dinner together; try the families together, and just be open to see how it goes. Sometimes, you got to see—you give it time, to figure out: “Is this the right fit?” It’s hard to get four people to really connect well.

Stephanie (21:21):

—and everybody likes each other

Bryan (21:22):

—and everybody likes each other. Those are rare situations.

Stephanie (21:25):

That’s rare; that’s why we only have two.

Bryan (21:27):

And we don’t necessarily mix the two; they are two distinct, separate relationships.

I would say, “Pray for it”; I would say, “Give it time.” I would say:

“You got to be open and honest.”

“Be willing to cultivate that relationship. You’ve got to protect that relationship; which means, ‘What happens there, stays there.’ You don’t take it outside it and violate that trust.”

“And then, you got to be willing to be friendly.” Sometimes you’re just like, “Well, I’m going to keep all our stuff—I’m not going to share anything,—I don’t know about them.” But you never really build a heart connection without being transparent.

Dave (22:00):

In those safe couples, you’re vulnerable. You’re sharing the junk.

Bryan (22:04):

—sharing the junk.

Dave (22:05):

You’re not doing that with everybody, but with those you feel like

Stephanie (22:08):

—with those, yes.

Dave (22:09):

And that’s what’s so important. Somebody—

Stephanie: Somebody that you can share with and that you do life with. Two of our couple friends—we each have three kids—and they’re all, pretty much, kind of going through the same season. I always believe that you should have someone in your life that’s walking ahead of you; walking beside you; and then, of course, somebody that you’re pulling up behind you.

We have a group of other friends—we forgot to mention them—that we/all our kids are older kids. We’re all in preschool together. We would go on vacations together, and we still do it; but we stopped taking our kids, because it’s like four [couples]. Two of us have three kids—no, we have the most kids—and then, there’s two couples who only have one kid. They were like, “Oh, we take them everywhere.” I’m like, “No, we’re done with this.” We took him to DC; remember that? We went to DC, and that was our last time. We were like—

Bryan (23:00):

—last trip, kids were too much.

Stephanie (23:01):

We were like, “No more kids,” “No more kids; this is not vacation for us, guys.” And they’re like, “No.” We’re like, “No, it’s not.” So anyway, we go on a couples’ trip with them and stuff; but our kids have been in pre-K together.

Bryan (23:13):

Every couple needs a place.

Stephanie: You have to have it.

Bryan: You crave it, where you can just be yourselves, where you can be honest. They don’t get mad when you say, “Well, Bryan is not doing this”; and Bryan—I don’t get bristled up; I don’t get resistant—I say, “You’re right. I probably could do better”; and we can talk through it. You need people to help you.

Dave (23:31):

And she says, “Not probably; you can do better.”

Bryan (23:36):

But the accountability of friendship is healthy for you; it’s healthy for me.

Dave: You got to have it.

Bryan: You got to have it. You just can’t do it in isolation; you can’t do it in isolation; it doesn’t work.

Ann (23:46):

This has been so rich, you guys; thank you.

Bryan: Thank you.

Stephanie: Thank you.

Ann: Lots of great things to apply.

Dave (23:56):

Well, it’s great having Bryan and Stephanie with us again. Just remember: you can get their book; it’s a great book.

Ann (24:03):

It’s called Made to Last: 8 Principles to Build Long Lasting Relationships.

Dave (24:08):

And you can get it at FamilyLifeToday.com; just click the link in the show notes. I’ll tell you what—a lot of people don’t know this—but we’re on YouTube.

Ann (24:16):

I love watching YouTube clips. You get a lot more out of it, I think, when you are watching people.

Dave (24:20):

And the next generation’s probably going to watch it rather than just listen to it; you can do either/or. But if you want to watch and enjoy it—youtube.com/FamilyLife—just go to youtube.com/FamilyLife. Or if you’re a big YouTube person, just go to YouTube and type in FamilyLife—one word.

Ann (24:37):

I put three words on there, and it still worked: FamilyLife Today.

Dave (24:45):

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