How to Follow God’s Will (Without a Map): Levi & Jennie Lusko

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How to Follow God’s Will (Without a Map) : Levi & Jennie Lusko

Guests:Levi and Jennie Lusko

From the series:When God Doesn’t Stop the Worst: Levi & Jennie Lusko

(Day 1 of 3)

Air date:October 26, 2026

Dave (00:04):

All right. So as you think back on marrying me, your biggest thought was, I will never marry—what?

Ann (00:13):

A pastor and go to Detroit.

Dave (00:16):

And a bald guy.

Ann (00:18):

Well, I never thought about that, but that could have been one too.

Dave (00:22):

So how did that work out?

Ann (00:30):

Welcome to FamilyLife Today, where we want to help you pursue the relationships that matter most. I’m Ann Wilson.

Dave (00:37):

And I’m Dave Wilson, and you can find us at FamilyLifeToday.com. This is FamilyLife Today.

So how did that work out?

Ann (00:52):

It’s so funny because I thought these are the things that would be horrible if I did them, and now I’m living it. And it has been the greatest journey of my life.

Dave (01:01):

It’s been an amazing journey.

Ann (01:03):

And it’s because of Jesus, because He’s taken us and we—

Dave (01:06):

No, it’s because of me. Come on.

Ann (01:07):

Oh, I’m sorry. That’s right. That’s you, honey.

Dave (01:10):

Yeah, it’s because of Jesus. I bring that up because we’ve got a couple today that’s lived a similar journey in terms of Levi and Jennie Lusko have started a church in Montana.

Ann (01:20):

And welcome to FamilyLife Today, you guys.

Jennie (01:23):

Thank you. Thanks for having us.

Levi:

Thank you. So fun.

Dave (01:25):

By the way, as many people know, not only are you pastors of Fresh Life Church in Montana and Wyoming and Utah and all kinds of different places, which you’ll have to tell us how that happened, but also authors, prolific authors of incredible books. We’re going to talk today about Through the Eyes of a Lion.

Ann (01:42):

So take us back, Levi. You’re a PK. Your dad was a pastor. Where did that begin? Did they grow up in the church? Take us back to that.

Levi (01:52):

My parents were both radically saved in the midst of the hippie movement. They’re both first generation believers. Their families before them: atheism and secular intellectual. And my mom’s mom was married and divorced three times. My dad was raised by his stepfather and his mother. He never knew his dad. And he was told by his stepfather—he called him his dad—he put a $20 bill down on the table one day and said, “That’s the only god you ever need to worry about.” Basically, that was the only education in spirituality he was given is the “almighty dollar.” So no upbringing of faith to speak of, or really love or affection for either of them, on both sides. And so they just had to find their own way in the world. My dad got saved in Hawaii. He was there to join the Greenpeace, saving the whales.

(02:43):

And my mom got saved, I believe through Intervarsity. And she and him had dated before they were, and lived together, before they got saved, went their separate ways, both found Jesus, ended up coming back together, got married, super involved in church ministry and church planning. They ended up later getting divorced. Some things surfaced from both of them had lots of, of course, trauma, especially my mom from things that she faced before they came together. So they’re no longer together. But I had a very happy life, grew up in the church, knowing Jesus my whole life as a second-generation Christian, and so very different than them. And since I was two years old, felt a call of God on my life to be a pastor, like my dad is how I used to always say it. And I’ve never really done anything else but that.

Dave (03:29):

So if we would’ve seen you in high school or maybe college, would we look at you and go, “Oh, there’s a future pastor. You’re living a life that would make me think he’s going into ministry.”

Levi (03:39):

Well, I mean, I was not without my dips in the sanctification journey to be sure, but I preached my first sermon at 14. I mean, I would get dropped off after school at church and serve in the youth ministry, help plan summer camps and mission trips. And I had a real significant challenge, a crisis of faith my senior year in high school where for a few months—I mean, I was the chaplain of my Christian high school as a volunteer. So I mean, I was literally, you would’ve thought future pastor for sure, but for about a three- or four-month period, I really wandered away and thought—it was kind of one of those proving times. I had been giving my whole life up to this and it kind of had to come to do I really believe this? Is this really what I want to do?

(04:20):

And dabbled in drinking a little bit during that period and really had a wakeup call of this is—I was running. It was my Jonah moment. I think it was mostly just feeling like that panic that maybe I made a mistake and maybe I missed out. And I realized through those few moments of sin, it was kind of like a prodigal son coming to my senses, realizing how good I had it at the Father’s table and really kind of never looked back from following wholeheartedly Jesus.

Ann (04:46):

And Jennie, what about your faith? When did that become really important to you?

Jennie (04:51):

I grew up in a Christian home, and I remember when I was seven and I had seen the gospel presentation at church with Psalty the Singing Songbook.

Ann (05:00):

Yes. Psalty. Our kids loved Psalty.

Jennie (05:03):

Yes. And I remember that night, I remember my dad praying with me and I accepted Jesus, understood that I was a sinner and I needed—and Jesus died on the cross for my sins and rose from the dead. I remember understanding that to some extent when I was seven and then it’s really kind of been that journey of what it has looked like throughout different seasons and stages of my life to love Jesus and to follow Him. I’m so grateful, but when I was in middle school, we were super plugged into our church, and I just immediately got plugged into a small group and going to church and really kind of having my people at church and loving it and mission trips. I feel like mission trips where we would go to Mexico every summer and we thought we were doing something good for other people, but ultimately looking back, I see how God was just getting a hold of my heart and so grateful for that.

(06:00):

And then just journey through high school and boys, that was always a struggle, wanting to be liked by a boy, wanting to like a boy. But when I was 10 was when my mom brought me to this purity conference. It’s called A Garden Enclosed. I remember hearing for the first time that God wanted me to save sex until marriage and to save myself for my future husband. I didn’t even know exactly what that meant, but I knew that I wanted God’s best for my life. I remember at that point really having that goal of I want to live my life for God and I want to honor Him and I want to save myself for my husband one day whenever that is. And what’s so sweet was that was that at age seven and 10 were very significant moments with God and it kind of just led me through.

(06:48):

But I still had struggles with wanting to be liked by boys and stuff like that, but it was just really special when I was 19, and I felt like God was calling me to New Mexico and to be a part of their missions internship there. It’s so funny because my whole—even through high school—I wanted to be a missionary, and I always thought I was going to be a missionary in Africa or Asia. Literally missions moved me from Monterey, California to Albuquerque, New Mexico. Levi and I met right away, but I had made a decision to not date that whole year just to focus on the Lord and not have any distractions. And so we met halfway through that year and looking back, it’s just so special because God truly gave us the gift of a foundation of friendship.

(07:40):

And so where my whole life, even from kindergarten on, I’ve always wanted to be liked by a boy and need to have that relationship with a boy. And here I am, I meet the man I’m supposed to marry, but there’s the decision I had made to not date. So we literally were forced to be friends and looking back, we’re so grateful for that. But then we started dating right after my internship and got married. My parents were Catholic. I was actually baptized as a baby in the Catholic church, but they gave both gave their lives to Christ when I was five, I think. And so that was kind of a legacy for me to walk in. Since then, I mean, my parents aren’t married anymore either, but they laid out a good foundation for me and now so grateful.

Dave (08:28):

So here you are and I’d love to hear how you end up in Montana. I know that you had sort of a youth pastor, maybe teaching pastor job in Southern California, but then you get this call. So tell us that little story.

Ann (08:42):

And you said it was kind of a cush job.

Levi (08:44):

Yes. Meaning didn’t have a lot of responsibilities outside of communicating a message, which is in and of itself a challenge, of course. Anybody who’s ever had to preach, it’s hard work. It takes time if you’re going to do it well and do the study.

Jennie (08:59):

Levi’s always put his heart and soul in messages. So even when we were leading youth group in New Mexico together, he would pour time and effort, energy and prayer into these messages for these students. Looking back, even seeing the love and the care and the effort and energy going into messages back then, that’s just kind of been a thing through his whole life.

Levi (09:19):

It’s hard work. But I didn’t have any of the other responsibilities that make ministry more challenging—dealing with teams, dealing with the burden of finance, HR, all the things that really bring headaches and complexities to ministry. And yet we kind of always deep down knew that one day that we had the desire—kind of entrepreneurial mission. Like we said, we both got our start in missions and that missionary spirit that is at the core of church planting. You guys are church planters, you understand that. And so we kind of felt like the time was going to come when we would probably feel that call. We weren’t in a rush or a hurry. We were always under good leaders and so we knew the time would come and God would show us and we’d be given the go ahead to go do that.

(10:06):

Well, it came sooner than expected because the senior pastor at our church left. When that happened, the board looked to us to start doing the teaching and in that season, we were fine with it. The church was maybe 2000 people, so it was a good-sized church. It felt small compared to the church I grew up in specifically, but in America that is a big church and I was okay. Yeah, I’m excited. Actually, I was excited to teach in the main sanctuary as opposed to just the student ministry. I was nervous it wouldn’t work. So I just sort of gave the same student messages I would give and lo and behold, it worked. It connected. People like, “That’s great. Truth is truth, right? It reached them.” But then the board said, “Hey, this is going well. The church is growing and responding well to your gift.

(10:54):

We’d like to make this permanent and make this the arrangement that you’ll be the teaching pastor and someone else will make the decisions.” That was when we felt pause because it was fine as a temporary arrangement, but to be in a situation where we had no leadership say and we just were there to show up, give a message and then shut up, we didn’t feel as comfortable with that because we’d have to basically prostitute a teaching gift to the exclusion of any other abilities we have, not to say anything about the kind of idea of the authority of the pulpit should be matched with vision and leadership say so. I think the communication of God’s Word should set the pace for the vision and the execution of the church. And so to have someone else doing that, it just didn’t sit right with our spirit.

(11:39):

And so we began the journey of praying about what God might have next for us as opposed to just staying there but not really believing that that was what God called us to do because it was a good paycheck. We had a great life. We lived a mile from the beach, had season passes to Disneyland and it’s Southern California. Who doesn’t want to live there, right?

Jennie (11:59):

When you say cush, that was kind of—

Levi (12:00):

That’s why we called it a cush job. We could have very much stayed on autopilot there and given a message once a week and basically just—but we wouldn’t have felt right. And we knew that if God called us to something else, to say no to that would be to miss an opportunity, even though it seemed like the path less taken. And for us, that ultimately led us to Montana, which didn’t feel like suffering because I grew up in the ski towns of Colorado and I loved that, but it just wasn’t the metropolitan area that we always kind of deep down suspected we would end up in Los Angeles or New York City or Chicago or something. It was mountain town, small little area and yet it was what God kind of put into our hearts.

Dave (12:40):

And so you started Fresh Life and I’m guessing you didn’t start with a thousand people, probably sort of small and it starts to grow. Tell us a little bit—

Levi (12:48):

Yeah, 14 people came.

Dave (12:50):

14?

Levi (12:51):

14. We met above a bar in an upper room.

Ann (12:54):

Did you have kids at the time?

Levi (12:56):

We had one and Jenny was pregnant.

Jennie (12:58):

I didn’t know I was pregnant until we moved to Montana.

Levi:

Right when we got here, we found out.

Ann (13:02):

Wow!

Jennie (13:03):

But it’s interesting because today there are church planning organizations that help people. Okay, so you want to plan a church in Chicago. We’re going to help you. Here’s what you do. Here’s finances. There’s an organization that can come behind you and support you. We didn’t have such a thing.

Levi (13:21):

All of our friends were old who had planted churches, so we would ask them what they did and they would say, “Well, we started duplicating tape cassettes.” It was like, “That’s going to help us.”

Jennie (13:31):

Seriously.

Levi (13:31):

Literally, all our friends were 50s and 60s, so their frame of reference was three decades prior, which is all principles are true. I mean, meaning people and connection and all that.

Jennie:

Starting up Bible study in your home.

Levi:

So literally we were taking out ads in the newspaper. We just didn’t know what to do. But the cool thing was God. It was kind of like that old commercial, you asked for it, you got it. We felt like you asked for an adventure, you got adventure, baby. You wanted to use faith, here you go. And you wanted to be a leader. Well, here’s a chance to lead. And it was a beautiful chance for us to develop into who God wanted us to be.

Dave (14:08):

I’m almost positive that our listeners have no idea how important they are to our program.

Ann (14:15):

I think you’re right.

Dave (14:17):

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Ann (14:27):

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Dave (14:36):

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Ann (15:05):

Join us.

Dave (15:10):

Most of our listeners are married. They’ve got families, blended families, you name it. I’m guessing it could have been somewhat difficult on your marriage at that time, starting a new thing and small and new thing. Talk about that a little bit.

Ann:

Stressful, pregnant.

Dave:

What was it like for your marriage?

Levi (15:26):

Honestly, I mean, I’ll just speak for you. I thought that that was one challenge that really wasn’t too hard for us. We bonded together. We were really in it together, us against the world.

Jennie (15:36):

Yeah, it wasn’t like Levi felt this is what God’s calling us to do. And then I was like, “Okay,” and the reluctantly going. It was like, “No. Yeah, this is what God’s calling us to do.” I feel like, well, we had been married three years, and so I mean, we were newly married, and then Alivia was 15 months old, and then I was unknowingly pregnant with Lenya.

Ann (15:57):

And how old were you guys at the time?

Levi (15:59):

Early 20s.

Jennie (16:00):

25, I think.

Levi (16:02):

Yeah.

Jennie (16:02):

Yeah.

Levi (16:02):

But again, like I said, we’ve been in what we were doing for a long time. Like I said, preaching at 14. We both had planned and led mission trips.

Ann (16:11):

You were made to do this.

Levi (16:13):

Yeah, honestly. And it hasn’t felt like we were thrust into anything that God hadn’t prepared us for.

Ann:

Right.

Jennie (16:19):

It was definitely hard. I think the bigger step of moving to Montana wasn’t as hard as just the daily. I think that even in my life, I feel like that is definitely more of a struggle. It’s like, oh yeah, the big step of faith, that’s actually easier to trust God in because it’s a big thing and he’ll take care of it versus the daily leading and in marriage.

Levi (16:44):

I remember one of the biggest challenges I remember was we failed to turn a form in soon enough after our second daughter’s birth. And so the health insurance rejected her entire first year on being on our health insurance. And so her birth and all the subsequent things, and then she had RSV, so it was hospitalized. We ended up having to pay out of pocket for all that. We had the funds to live early on very simply, and so the unexpected medical bills, that presented stress that was unique to that season of our lives. I remember looking back going, that really was challenging to trust God through.

Ann (17:19):

And so your church started to grow quickly, rapidly. I mean, God was really moving and your family started to grow too. Take us to that point when you have four kids.

Levi (17:31):

Oh, goodness gracious. Like rabbits, cold winters, got to stay warm. That’s how we had all those kids. How else are you going to stay warm, right? Well, the church grew and soon we had, and I know you guys have story, similar trajectory of just growth and new cities and opportunities. We had multiple campuses and then multiple kids. You had four daughters and then a little boy came way, way, way, way later. But it was very much like every day a new thing and it was a beautiful—we’ve always said the church plant journey was like skiing in front of an avalanche and God’s Holy Spirit was in it and people are getting saved and touched and lives are being impacted and that’s been kind of the fun, beautiful thing watching all the kids. Before COVID, we had just opened our 13th location, which was in a prison, in the state prison in Montana, which we had a population every week gathering to watch.

(18:22):

And yeah, such a fun blur looking back on it all.

Dave (18:26):

And obviously we have a devastating moment coming in your marriage and in your life. But before we talk about that, talk about calling as a couple, because you’ve talked about your call. How do you know? How do you sense what God wants you to do?

Levi (18:43):

Well, I think that asking of the question is where the journey begins. It’s one of those paths that you don’t find until you start trying to walk it. I think where we begin in scripture is always with the general will of God. God’s will is that none should perish. So am I saved? God’s will is that I’m sanctified and sexually pure, that I’m thankful and rejoicing always. So when we start to do those sorts of things, I think the more specific tangential areas of this school, that brand of toothpaste, those things sort of—God, as you’re walking in the general will, puts in your heart the desires that he wants you to walk in. And so I think it was Augustine who said, love God and do whatever you want. And there is some truth and some freedom to that. God’s call is whatever you do to the glory as you walk with Him in relationship.

(19:30):

And Colossians says, “The peace of God will rule in your hearts to which you’re called and be thankful.” So I think there’s a sense in which you really can say, “Look, I’m saved. I’m not in gross sin. I’m serving, tithing, giving, all these things that I’m supposed to be doing, and now I get to do whatever I want. Is my desire to take this job? Great, take it. Do I desire that sport and school? Amazing. Go for it.” I think there’s a freedom in it where you view God’s will more as a launchpad than a lockdown.

Jennie (19:58):

That’s good. I think also in the marriage where both the husband and the wife are following hard after God individually, because I think when we’re hungry for God on our own and then we’re together asking God to lead us in what He has for us and the daily things too, it’s easier because we’re both listening for God’s voice and we’re both wanting to be strong in our relationship with Him individually, that it makes it easier and it takes the pressure off of each other to try to like, “Well, Levi, you’re leading me, so you have to make all the decisions.” But it’s like, “No, I’m also hearing from God and there is such a peace right now in this decision.” And honestly, there’s such beauty in that when we’re both following Jesus and loving Him and then letting Him lead us together.

Ann (20:47):

As I listen to you guys, what I hear and what I see are lives that are just surrendered. God, here we are. We’ll do anything and go anywhere for you because we want to make Your name known. I think that’s the key. Maybe you’re listening and your spouse isn’t on the same page spiritually, but you still can go before the Father who hears every single prayer as you call out to Him. He’s like, “I hear you. I hear your passion. I want to answer you.” Even if we go before the Father and we go before Jesus and “Lord, I want to live the life that you’ve called me to,” He’s not going to say, “Uh-uh, I’m not going to do that.” He’s like, “I’m all about that. I want you to live because I’ve created you and I’ve put gifts in you and strengths in you to bring glory to my name and it will bring you joy.” As I look at you two, that’s what you’ve done.

(21:42):

You’ve surrendered, you’ve heard the call, and you’re just kind of walking this path of what He’s placed before you because He’s put so many gifts into you.

Dave (21:51):

I’d also sense that it’s a joint calling that He calls the two of you. I know that when we got married, I knew that my call would be our call. It isn’t God calling me or calling Ann. We’re married. We’re one. He’s got to call us together. Obviously, we’ve walked a similar path in terms of planting churches, but I think that’s true for every couple. When you’re married, it isn’t a separate, it’s a calling as a partnership for kingdom impact, true?

Levi (22:21):

Yeah, and that’s true regardless of how it actually works out mechanically. I think if someone listening, if their husband is on the road or whatever, it’s like you’re still a part of it even though you might be behind the scenes. Someone asked John Glenn what it was like to be the man who orbited the earth for the first time and he said, “Well, I got to actually be there, but there was 400,000 people in NASA who put me out there.” So I think maybe in our roles, we get to serve more publicly, you’re on the radio together, we lead as a church planting couple together, but for the couple who maybe the mom stays home or whatever, you still are a part of what God’s called your husband or your wife to do, even if you serve in a way that’s unseen. As Paul says, the hand needs the eye, the eye needs the foot, et cetera.

Jennie (23:07):

I think knowing that it changes too, because for us, there’s a season where I was literally home all the time with our kids and homeschooling and all that stuff, and now it just looks a little bit different in the season. But knowing that it’s not like just because it’s one way, it’s going to always be that way, but being sensitive to the Spirit leading. Levi also was so amazing in leading in that way too, of giving me more of pushing me because I’m more reluctant leader, I guess. And so he’s more like, “No, I want you to say something or I want you to choose this or I want…” And so that has also been super helpful for me as being more of a, “No, actually I like being in the background and I don’t want to do anything like that.” So that’s been helpful just in even our relationship too.

Dave (23:56):

And I also think when you think about calling, especially as we’re talking about a married couple, you think God’s call will not involve pain. It will not involve loss. And as we step into the rest of your story, we’re going to find out sometimes it doesn’t go the way we think and it’s going to be really, really hard.

What a great day with Levi and Jennie.

Ann (24:21):

Man, this whole topic is something we don’t hear very often. I think it’s so good. Their book is called Through the Eyes of a Lion: Facing Impossible Pain, Finding Incredible Power.

Dave (24:32):

And you can get your copy by clicking the link in the show notes at FamilyLifeToday.com and we’ll be back with them again tomorrow.

Ann (24:45):

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